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The only thing more limited than Bitcoin is your time, and so Bitcoin gives it back to you.

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I look at Bitcoin as a primary business without me having an HR department when I get successful.

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The artists and creative types see Bitcoin quicker than the average person.

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I think it's because they think outside the box.

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There was the expedient and more profitable thing to do, and then there was the more honest thing to do.

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What has this allowed me? It has allowed me the freedom to not attend dumb meetings about dumb subjects.

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Once you have free time, then you can kind of explore who you are and what you want to be and the things that you get fulfillment from.

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You see, that's so important because that's never sold. This is never sold on Bitcoin this way.

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All right. Welcome to Episode 3 of the Bitcoin Boomers. We have Mr. Gary Cardone. Thank you so much for joining us, Gary.

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Thanks for being here. Thanks for asking.

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For those of you who aren't familiar with Gary, we're going to ask him to expand on this, but veteran of the energy markets, financial services.

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One thing I admire, it's actually very interesting, is those of you viewing, you can see some of Gary's art in the background.

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He does a phenomenal job.

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I don't know if I've ever expressed that, but I really appreciate it.

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I find it actually very interesting, Gary, that so many Bitcoiners have this other side.

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Like you have this artistic side.

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Our first guest, George Bodine, also an artist.

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Bob Murphy, who was our second guest, he's actually a singer.

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I love to write.

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I'm kind of a creative writer.

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um uh you know we have the the satoshi rakamoto band you know uh samson mao and uh knut svenholm

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and like these sort of guys that i i wonder if there's something there i don't know but but i

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think maybe maybe it's just that we have some well-rounded people well or maybe well or maybe

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bitcoin uh like i look at bitcoin as a primary business that has no human era exposure to

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I don't know why more people, as soon as I saw Bitcoin, I'm like, oh, wow, this is a private equity business without me having an HR department when I get successful.

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So what has this allowed me?

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It has allowed me the freedom to not attend dumb meetings about dumb subjects when the most primary meetings and most primary decisions are made by one or two people, even if the company's 4,000.

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and the 4,000 show up to meetings about nothing, just to stroke everyone's wokeness.

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It has given me time to get bored and then to go, hey, what am I? Who am I?

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What is, is there more?

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Look, I proved in my career that I can be in four industries,

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not like dedicate to one and get buried by one and it cycles.

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and it's really given me a lot of freedom to discover myself

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and do things that I was told were impossible to do for a guy like me.

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And to me, that's really living a great life,

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even though now, because I'm not so busy with dumb stuff,

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I'm having to find how much time I actually have.

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Into your comment there,

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I've said for a while that creatives, artists and creative types,

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see Bitcoin quicker than the average person. And I think it's because they think outside the box,

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you know, and that's why they're creative because they think outside the box. I'm like Gary, I saw

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it immediately when someone sat down and gave me half an hour of time, you know, so, but I think

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it's because I think outside the box, which I think most creative people do. I think that's an

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interesting observation. You know, I'm an engineer and kind of a math guy. So I have to admit, I

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missed it the first time, although I wasn't in 2017. So I think it would still be, you know,

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relatively early. Although I guess I would also say that I'm maybe unlike a lot of engineers in

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a lot of ways. Well, and that's why I said once it was explained to me, because the first time I

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said, oh, it was like online stocks. That was my whole explanation. So I said, I'm not interested,

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you know, so I don't consider that really getting information to make a decision on.

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But I think what Gary's saying is insightful, though, because just about freedom, like what does it give you, you know, kind of even helping you define who you are, right?

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You know, once you have free time, then you can kind of explore who you are and what you want to be and the things that you get fulfillment from and like all those sort of things.

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But because most people spend their life pursuing money.

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Yeah, I think that's the huge thing that we all talk about so much, but it's really important. I've noticed it too in my life is that it allows you to get off of the Fiat treadmill. And Fiat really is a treadmill. You know, you're always kind of figuring and it's like the treadmill is speeding up and you're getting older and more tired. We're all boomers.

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And so, you know, the notion that you've got this this compounding machine that you don't have a manager, as Gary points out, you don't have a management team to worry about.

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You don't have to go to meetings to talk about it.

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You can just sit back and watch it do its thing.

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Suddenly you've got your life back.

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And that's just incredibly valuable because your time is really, you know, I mean, the only thing more limited than Bitcoin is your time.

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And so Bitcoin gives it back to you.

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And I've observed that over the past five years.

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And it's really been fabulous.

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Well, if I could just add the cool thing to this is that you can decide what you do with your time.

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If you wanted to amplify your time into look, I think a lot of people chase success.

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And then when they get it, they have to chase something else, which seems to be relevance.

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And depending on the state of your ego, you can up or down amplify how much activity you do and where you place your energy.

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That's simply like I want to put my energy in really cool places that I enjoy.

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Now, the problem with this, I think for many, many, many people, they will not use Bitcoin like the way I'm using it because they're still thriving for some kind of dopamine or relevance hit.

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And that's cool. We need builders, right?

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Like if I was 40, I'd be building these SBRs and I'd be doing a lot of crazy shit.

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I wouldn't be building them the way they're building them, but I would be building them

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most certainly. But for me, you know, doing a piece of art like this for me is more valuable.

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And wow, what freedom. And by the way, I'm a 2020 Bitcoiner. So I don't think you're late,

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dude. I think you're so early. It's crazy. I sure hope that's right. Because I'm, you know,

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my average cost is 57 and I'm buying $90,000 Bitcoin and very happy to do it.

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I'm stunned. I'm still able to buy five, five digit Bitcoin stunned.

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And I think I'm going to have a chance to do it all year.

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Maybe, maybe not.

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Before the Lawrence, you know, it's, it's,

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it's given us more opportunities than anyone told me. Right.

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I mean, we all know it's going to do what it's going to do one day, but it's,

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I see this as a real gift, but it's a frustrating gift.

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That's where I'm frustrated at.

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Well, I get that.

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I get that.

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And, you know, I think also that, like Larry, you mentioned the fiat thing.

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It sucks on you.

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It tries to pull you back in.

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And, you know, I've had to resist that.

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So, like, Gary, you've said, you know,

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I would probably still fit into the builder category

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because I'm still creating companies and building money.

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But that's what I've done.

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I've spent my career designing laptops and servers

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and MP3 players and TVs.

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That's kind of where maybe most of my creative energy

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goes into that while you put it into painting as an example.

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Like I've just done the math, okay?

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And I'm cool building a business

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if it's going to give me a 500, 800% return over six years.

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I have yet to do that, exit six years.

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if I do get everything going I get attacked legally or whatever and doing the math quite

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frankly even if all I did was read books or there's a lot of things I could not do that would

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be not good but or do that would not be good but the math to me says spend less money on doing

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inefficient things like going to dumb meetings and having to push human beings to be motivated

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I can't motivate any human being except myself.

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So the math is like, wow, keep my costs down, pour everything into Bitcoin, and I will be able to exit one of the greatest returns in less than eight years.

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And that's my point about the exit.

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Whether I exit or not, I've never been able to build a big company and exit with certainty and have liquidity without a bunch of hooks.

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Right?

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Every company you've sold, man, you get hooks everywhere.

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and you know so this thing about like meetings um you may or may not know it's about my background

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gary but i i was at uh gateway we were fortune 200 company i was the chief technical officer there

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so i had a staff of about 5 000 people at one time you want to talk about meetings like shit just

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every freaking day you know the the and then we'd look you know i probably had maybe six or seven

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layers beneath me at that point. And then you look at the efficiency of the organization and say,

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how many minutes are we losing a day, man hours, because of these meetings and what meetings are

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working and trying to stop them is really difficult. Or to keep the spread, right? A meeting that

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should be three people is 13. And they sit there for an hour. And it's horrible. But what also

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happens is I was talking about kind of like fiat trying to suck you as a as a miner one of the

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things that I I made a decision in 2021 when all the a lot of the mining companies went public in

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that period and I didn't and probably to be to be completely transparent if you measure it in

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I made a bad decision. I made a very bad decision because guys like Fred Teal are sitting on tens

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of millions of dollars in cash and a whole bunch more in equity that I don't have that I didn't

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generate. But I would be subservient to that system. My freedom is more important to me.

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And by the way, my ability to even serve Bitcoin, I view myself as a citizen of Bitcoin.

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I can't serve Bitcoin and be the CEO of a public company.

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Those are mutually exclusive.

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But that fiat system sucks at you.

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Like it's tantalizing to want to go there.

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I agree, man.

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You got to decide what you're going to chase, though.

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You know, for me, money has never been a difficult thing,

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whether it's a million or 10 million or 100 million.

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And after some point, it really doesn't do anything for me.

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I have no real, oh, wow, I'm going to make another.

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Okay, well, what am I going to spend it on?

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I'm not controlled by remaining relevant.

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See, I think that's where I get back to, like, this is what people work their whole life for, right?

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It's to get some freedom to do what they want.

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yet very few people ever obtain it very few like less than a percent even the billionaires man i

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don't want it it comes with shit and i got i got a boat out here that i would i would literally pay

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somebody just to take away from because i don't want the headache on it it's noise it's a cool

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thing about you know going through becoming successful if you're just clear about what's

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happening, you realize, oh, wow, this stuff is not making me happy. It is not creating value for the

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world or for myself. What I think is really sage about what you're saying, though, is

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at no point when you were defining success to you, did you say it's $5 million or $100 million

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or whatever the number is.

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Success was expressed by your freedom,

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by your lifestyle that you aspire to.

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And I think that's one of the things is like,

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I'm actually slightly different,

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but I don't define my success in my life and my career

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by money either, I never have.

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I've measured it by more of the things I've produced.

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and, you know, output of my work is kind of how I've defined my success.

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I've been fortunate in that money has followed because of that.

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Not necessarily obscene wealth, but good enough.

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I'm very, very fortunate financially in my life

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and probably could have done better if I chased dollars.

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But that's my advice when I talk to younger people too,

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is like, you know, define, define success for you, but chasing a dollar figure is really dangerous.

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And it probably will not get you what you want. It's probably not going to be,

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give you the life fulfillment, you know, um, you know, pick, pick, pick a great partner. Like,

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you know, uh, like I've been married to the wrong person. I've been married to the right person.

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And like, like that's, that's like really important.

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You know, be happy in what you pursue.

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And, and then just like you said, Gary, I mean, I'm sure you have a list of these sort

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of things.

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Maybe it's not a list, but you have these things like, these are my minimum standards in life.

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And, and I'm not going to dip below that and, and I'll pay what I have to pay for that.

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Yeah, that, that, that's right.

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And one of those things was, you know, I decided a long time in my career, I would not become a prostitute.

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And there are different levels of prostitution along the corporate ladder.

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I don't know anybody that, right, the more you go into the fiat system.

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For instance, this last company that I was involved with, the fraud company in the payments industry,

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my partner was like, dude, you're really bitching on Visa and MasterCard.

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You know, we cannot have that much exposure.

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I'm like, sorry, but the truth is the truth.

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And you can't start.

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Well, I can't really say that because people aren't going to do business with me.

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And that that is another reason that I come back to Bitcoin.

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Bitcoin does not require me to prostitute myself at any level to anyone for any reason whatsoever.

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I can say I hate Lawrence Leppard.

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He's an idiot.

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He's a bad author and his skin color is wrong.

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I mean, I could just be obnoxious and nothing changes my position.

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Nobody can hurt me.

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That's impressive.

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When you have a loud mouth like me and actually a belief system that people like me should stand up and say, this is wrong, period.

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Okay.

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And anything else is prostitution in my opinion.

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That's right.

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I mean, I did observe in my career many, many times where, you know, there was the expedient and more profitable thing to do.

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And then there was the more honest thing to do.

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And, you know, and I was shocked at how early it appears.

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I think everybody in the fiat world probably is confronted with these decisions.

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And, you know, you just you have to start realizing.

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And I did. I was in the private equity firm world with some guys who were, you know, like typical private equity guys. Right.

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I mean, they knew how to cut corners and they were all about making as much money as possible, as fast as possible.

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And, you know, even if it involved, you know, some deception and so forth.

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And, you know, I tried to walk a thin line there as long as I could until I couldn't take it anymore.

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And then I got out because I just realized that to be really successful in that world, you know, you had to be willing to, you know, more or less lie, cheat and steal, particularly with respect to your investors.

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I mean, they were never giving their investors what they said they were giving them.

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They were just, you know, shaving them in every single way possible.

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And so, you know, you just, I mean, I thought at the end of the day, I'll probably end up comfortable, not as rich as some of these other guys.

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But I want to, you know, do it in a way that I know, you know, I did it in an ethical manner.

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And I don't know, you know, and I think it just came from my father who basically said, look, you know, you know, you got to look at yourself in the mirror and feel like you did it in the right way.

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And he also said, you know, that you just can't put a price.

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I think you probably did this, Gary.

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I know, Bob, you've done it since you left Gateway.

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And Gary, I think you did it as well.

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I mean, you can't put a dollar value on working for yourself.

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I mean, the notion of not having a boss, of not having an asshole, you know, that sets

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the ethical standards, it tells you what to do.

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That's priceless, even if you make less money.

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So, you know, I went out on my own at a certain point in time.

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And I never, you know, looking back, I never regret it.

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I think, you know, it's not unusual for young people, I think, to have to start out working for other people because you don't really know the system.

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You don't really know the game. You got to learn. You got to get into the whole system, no matter what you're doing.

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But I think pretty quickly over time, you can sort out what's real, what's not, who's good, who's not, where you want to be, where you don't.

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And I think it leads many, many people, it leads them to say, all right, I'm out of here.

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This is not what I this is not what I want to become.

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I don't care about that money, and I'm going to do it in a way that I think is sustainable and I feel comfortable with.

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I joined Gateway about three years before Gateway went public.

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And still, by those standards, I think it was maybe a $300 million or $400 million company at the time, but growing 100% a year.

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and so and the team that I was part of that eventually took gateway public was phenomenal

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every one of those guys is still a friend and high integrity hard working uh very bright

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and we went public and and became by external measurements very very successful but we never

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recaptured the magic of being pre-public. We lost it. There was a seminal moment when that happened

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and didn't realize until three, four years later that the magic was gone. Part of that was because

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I view it as a fiat infection, called an infection, an infection of the system because

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the pressure of working toward 90-day cycles. We always made great long-term decisions.

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And now the pressure of producing a report every 90 days that people on the outside would judge us by was ridiculous.

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And then like new hires, if we had a choice of hiring a new person, and I know you went to the Ivy League, Larry, for instance.

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But we got our success by, I'm from the University of Wisconsin.

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And we had guys from Iowa State and little community colleges all across the Midwest.

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That was the spirit of it.

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And we started hiring guys from Brown and Princeton and Duke and Kellogg School of Business and all this other stuff.

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And bright people, but not our culture.

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Like, changed the company.

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And we lost it.

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You know, 2004, we lost the company.

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And by the way, Bitcoiners, this is their Achilles heel.

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You guys study Bitcoin but you do not study the legacy markets They have weaknesses and the Achilles heel for fiat companies public companies is the quarterly earnings Stop spending money with the enemy You will see these companies retract

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and retrace so fast. Budweiser, Cracker Barrel, soon to be Audi, BMW, Mercedes. These guys are

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going to get crushed because of quarterly earnings and they're going to have to lie now.

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So if you stop spending money with Netflix, their quarterly earnings will go down.

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They will not be able to merge with other companies.

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They'll just say no to these people and buy Bitcoin with and buy Bitcoin, man.

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Don't spend money with Netflix, buy Bitcoin.

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Fifteen bucks at Bitcoin is worth a lot more a month than Netflix.

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You know, Bob, I learned something some time ago, and that was these industries are not or they are different, but they're only different in nomenclature.

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And it's a very common thread of them is five freaking consulting firms with a single playbook that they roll from industry to industry to industry.

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And it's literally an eight year cycles, eight to 12 year cycles.

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And you see the steel industry go through and the oil industry goes through it.

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Funny enough, the oil industry is still the best commodity market in the world, the least fucked with and controlled.

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It's hilarious how it's all turning out.

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that deregulation policy in the 90s and 80s is really taking bite across the world.

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What was so disillusioning to me was it was my first real exposure.

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Like you talked about these analysts.

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And so we were doing our road show and then we started doing our earnings calls

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and meeting with these analysts.

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Almost all fucking idiots.

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Like they don't know shit.

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and if you're out there working with a broker or somebody telling you who to invest in

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and they're reading these reports and making decisions they don't know jack shit um i was

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so disillusioned by it because i thought oh these must be really smart people um no they're not and

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And they're making ungodly sums of money for writing reports that have absolutely no value.

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They have no insight.

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They're just worms.

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Well, I mean, this just takes us back to the prostitution.

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Once you know there's problems, like I've had an investment banker before, I'm like, hey, why didn't you tell me this was a problem?

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Like a year ago.

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and oh well they weren't really ready to sell me anyway because they had already met their quota

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for the year okay so they roll me into the next year well the next year hits the recession i can't

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get out so anybody that's building companies whether you're public or private you're trying

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to go public or you're trying to liquidate and you've got a an investment banker in the middle

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of it assume he is a prostitute yeah i'm glad you're saying this because i i think one of the

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things, you know, I kind of sit at the junction point of the Bitcoin technical community and the

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Bitcoin business community. I think that's part of the role I play in this community.

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And the, I would say largely the technical side comes with the cypherpunk mentality.

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You have a lot of the libertarians, a lot of the anti-state kind of folks, and they're trying to

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they have this dichotomy that they haven't resolved yet,

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which is Bitcoin can't rule the world

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and not have financial institutions and nation states

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and corporations who are heavy users

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and heavy influencers of what happens with it.

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Those are, you know, you can either be this tiny little thing

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that's a niche and, you know, that's what Monero

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or something like that is, or you can be this monster monetary asset and system that disables

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the existing system, but only with those guys participating.

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And, you know, that's the camp I'm in.

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Like, hey, I want this thing to be successful at a global level, and I want in every boardroom,

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even though I hate the boardrooms. I want every boardroom for that to be a discussion

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every quarter. Like, how much Bitcoin do we have? Like, that should be part of all those discussions.

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And maybe the single most important discussion is how big is the balance sheet? How much Bitcoin

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do we have? Well, the good news is that, you know, I mean, even though they adopt it, use it,

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invest in it, believe in it, support it, they can't really alter it. And that's the key,

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right? I mean, the rules are the rules. And, you know, we're going to make TradFi bend to our rules,

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not the other way around. And to the degree they think they can alter it, and they decide to,

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you know, create paper Bitcoin, which they've been doing some more of that recently. If you

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see, if you look at the futures volumes, you know, they're going to get their asses handed

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to them when, you know, we ramp like we're doing this morning. So, you know, it has to be adopted

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at the institutional and the TradFi level.

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But the good news is that they have to adopt it on our terms, not vice versa.

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You know, we don't have to adopt their terms.

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That is true.

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And I don't want to take us down into a technical rabbit hole, but there are things that, you

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know, for instance, how the mempool works, how relay policies work, how blocks are constructed

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that the development community does have a say in.

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And they can either make it harder.

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they can't stop it they can't stop this but they can either say hey we're going to embrace this

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and bitcoin is for everybody and we're gonna we're gonna make sure life is easier um for these folks

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or we're gonna make it harder and that's part of the battle i fight with these guys is on the

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development side is like hey guys you're missing this like um the simplest example by the way i

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I don't want to take us into the brevetal is if, if,

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if you are a corporation based on a Bitcoin standard,

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then you need to have some mechanism to know that you can get access to the

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base layer at a reasonable cost at some point in the future.

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Like you, you, and right now, the way that the, the market works, which says,

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Hey, when you're ready to do your transaction, go,

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go see what's out there are there a hundred thousand transactions or a million transactions

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in the mempool and we'll tell you what the price is when you need it as opposed to you know and

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and we're working on solutions to that but we're fighting we're fighting the development community

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instead of them this is you know big issue for the wallet while while it's a wallet business hey

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when i want to move 10 million dollars of bitcoin or a thousand dollars of bitcoin what's my exit

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Well, yeah, and that's the one that's really critical.

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It's the key.

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And the only way I have been able to get around it, because I'm a commodities, like my whole business, everything I've ever done was built on supply and demand.

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I get comfortable that the market in 20 years will be the free market.

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Like if it's not intervening with them.

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If you intervene with it, I'm worried, oh, shit, I could pay a million dollars to get a million dollars of Bitcoin off into the system.

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Exactly. And the mentalities have to change.

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And Bitcoin's decentralization, which you mentioned earlier, is a little bit of a hampering point, just like it was in the marketing.

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It's also in the technical development.

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It's the least efficient method of doing anything, man.

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It is the least efficient.

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If we all trusted Lawrence was the angel of all angels and perfect, we would centralize it through Lawrence.

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Right.

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But nobody can be trusted that way.

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And that's why it works.

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Exactly.

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Yeah.

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Benevolent.

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I think a benevolent dictator is the ultimate form of organizational management.

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But it's not what we have.

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And there's a good reason that we don't have it.

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But we also have to figure out, and it's part of what I think my role is, especially trying to bang on the development community, is trying to get them ready because the past is not prologue.

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The Bitcoin that they perceive as being the way that it worked.

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Who was doing transactions?

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What was the nature of the transactions?

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how much urgency was tied to the transactions um like those sort of things are are very important

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and you know gary like you said you're a commodities guy well i view even more than bitcoin itself the

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ultimate commodity will be block space which means um how do you get access to a transaction in the

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future and part of the reason i'm a miner is i don't mean this in a bad way i get to decide i own

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a certain percentage of the hash rate, I get to decide. And, you know, I can use whatever method

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I want to make that decision. It's a powerful position. Well, and as the block reward goes down,

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the fees will become a larger and larger percentage. Today, Bob, you're so close to this,

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you would know. Of minor revenue today, what percentage of that is the reward and what

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00:30:39,618 --> 00:30:44,858
percentage of the fees today? I just ran these numbers for a paper I'm writing.

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all time it's uh 98.51 percent of all revenue was from the subsidy and currently it's way way over

362
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99 we're very very low right now is is subsidy so fees are 1.51 they're still quite small wow

363
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first year. Because Bitcoin isn't just for life, it's for generations. You know, maybe we should

384
00:32:51,638 --> 00:32:54,938
shift over into a little bit of what's going on in the market right now, what's going on with the

385
00:32:54,938 --> 00:32:59,838
Fed and stuff, which I'm happy to kind of take the lead on, because I think there's a lot happening

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00:32:59,838 --> 00:33:03,118
that maybe is subtle, or maybe not.

387
00:33:03,278 --> 00:33:07,198
But I think a lot of the community is probably pretty depressed

388
00:33:07,198 --> 00:33:08,558
with what's going on in the price.

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And I'm just completely sanguine, not worried.

390
00:33:13,558 --> 00:33:16,358
I mean, I'd almost like to see it go down so I could buy some more.

391
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But as you guys know, I wrote this book, The Big Print,

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and I do believe print is coming.

393
00:33:24,398 --> 00:33:27,358
In fact, they've already started it gradually.

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Paul himself, all said that they have to grow the balance sheet in order to support the bank

395
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reserves because they were getting too skinny. They were looking at a situation like the repo

396
00:33:35,538 --> 00:33:42,718
blowout of 2019, which was the precursor to the last big print. And they're saying growing their

397
00:33:42,718 --> 00:33:46,578
balance sheet, i.e. buying bonds, is not QE, but of course it really is. And they're just lying

398
00:33:46,578 --> 00:33:52,018
about that. They're just trying to rebrand it. And then this week you saw Caruso and then somebody

399
00:33:52,018 --> 00:33:55,678
over at the Bank of America come out saying that they think there might be some discussion this

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00:33:55,678 --> 00:34:01,398
week. And this is perhaps why we're saying that we're recording this on the Tuesday before Fed

401
00:34:01,398 --> 00:34:07,198
Day. Fed Day is tomorrow, Wednesday. And both of these guys came out. And it would be reasonable

402
00:34:07,198 --> 00:34:11,519
to think they might have gotten some leaked information suggesting that the Fed was going

403
00:34:11,519 --> 00:34:16,158
to kind of aim towards something like a $40 billion a month purchase of Treasury securities

404
00:34:16,158 --> 00:34:22,419
to keep these reserves. And they're going to call it reserve management, not QE. And I think that

405
00:34:22,419 --> 00:34:28,499
thought leaking into the market might be why we see silver going through 60 and Bitcoin

406
00:34:28,499 --> 00:34:37,058
catching a bid off of 90. It's now 93, almost 94 this morning. And so I've often maintained that

407
00:34:37,058 --> 00:34:41,298
it's just a matter of time until they have to start printing again. It's really just kind of

408
00:34:41,298 --> 00:34:47,479
a mathematical certainty. And I've got a chart that I'd like to share that I think shows that.

409
00:34:47,479 --> 00:34:52,338
But what this is, I use this in a presentation that we just made to our investors. It's a

410
00:34:52,338 --> 00:34:54,738
A chart done by a guy named Dan Oliver at Mermican Capital,

411
00:34:54,818 --> 00:34:56,238
a gold investor, a good friend of mine.

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00:34:56,578 --> 00:35:01,298
So what this is, is the exponential growth curve

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00:35:01,298 --> 00:35:03,959
is just kind of a compound interest growth curve.

414
00:35:04,058 --> 00:35:06,898
It shows what happens when you compound something at 7% over time.

415
00:35:06,898 --> 00:35:09,378
And the black line, that's the lighter gray line

416
00:35:09,378 --> 00:35:11,738
that kind of goes up smoothly in an arc.

417
00:35:12,118 --> 00:35:13,939
And the black line is the Fed balance sheet,

418
00:35:14,038 --> 00:35:15,838
which is a good proxy for the money supplier,

419
00:35:15,979 --> 00:35:17,919
the money, the reserves that they put into the system

420
00:35:17,919 --> 00:35:20,398
that the banks then lend against and create M2.

421
00:35:20,758 --> 00:35:22,078
And what you can see here that I think

422
00:35:22,078 --> 00:35:28,019
is fascinating is that every time the Fed balance sheet or the money in the system, because we've got

423
00:35:28,019 --> 00:35:33,618
debt growing more rapidly than we have underlying money supply, you know, or GDP, you get to these

424
00:35:33,618 --> 00:35:37,198
points at which there's not enough money in the system to service the interest rate and the debt.

425
00:35:37,738 --> 00:35:42,578
And so you can see what happened. The black line slipped below the growth curve in 2008. And bingo,

426
00:35:42,658 --> 00:35:47,218
you had the panic of 2008 and the GFC. And of course, they fixed that very quickly. And they

427
00:35:47,218 --> 00:35:51,118
had what I call the first big print. And they took the Fed balance sheet from $800 billion to

428
00:35:51,118 --> 00:35:55,419
$3 trillion. But then, of course, they realized that was a problem and there was some inflation

429
00:35:55,419 --> 00:35:59,939
and other issues. And so they came in and they started to tighten it again. And Yellen started

430
00:35:59,939 --> 00:36:06,038
the process and then Powell added to it. And that took you into 2019 when in the fall of 2019,

431
00:36:06,038 --> 00:36:10,858
the repo market blew out and went to 10% and they realized bank reserves were too low.

432
00:36:11,258 --> 00:36:14,439
And he did a pivot and he turned around and started printing money again.

433
00:36:15,098 --> 00:36:19,158
And then three months later, COVID hit and they really hit the money printer accelerator. And

434
00:36:19,158 --> 00:36:25,838
Up we went from a Fed balance sheet of $3 trillion to, I think at its peak, it was close to $9 trillion, maybe a little over $9 trillion.

435
00:36:26,198 --> 00:36:34,419
And of course, that led to the 9% inflation that wasn't transitory because Powell lied about that and brought us back down to now $6.5 trillion.

436
00:36:34,718 --> 00:36:39,919
Look at what's the most interesting thing about this chart to me is look at where the two lines are right now.

437
00:36:40,658 --> 00:36:46,638
We're back to the point at which the liabilities are below the parabolic growth curve.

438
00:36:46,638 --> 00:37:07,258
And the last two times that occurred, it led to a quote unquote big print. And so to me, you know, I that's why I say this this big print is imminent. I mean, it's it's going to happen. It's got to happen. And I think, you know, Luke Roman says six months. You know, Lynn is a little more little is a little more thoughtful about it. She says, well, we could just have a gradual print. And she may be right.

439
00:37:07,258 --> 00:37:12,758
But I tend to think that more likely what will happen is once the floodgates open, they're going to really open.

440
00:37:13,138 --> 00:37:19,479
You kind of see the indicators of all that going on because, you know, you've got Kevin Hassett is going to be probably appointed as Fed chairman.

441
00:37:19,638 --> 00:37:23,558
He's talked about much lower rates. You've got Powell attacking Fed governors.

442
00:37:23,758 --> 00:37:27,678
I mean, they threw out Bostick for insider trading. They threw out Krugler for the same thing.

443
00:37:27,738 --> 00:37:29,798
They're going after the woman who lied about her mortgages.

444
00:37:30,258 --> 00:37:32,959
You know, and he's basically trying to get control of the Fed board.

445
00:37:32,959 --> 00:37:40,598
And, you know, you've got the Treasury Secretary Bessent out there trolling, you know, the whole Fed board saying, what is what's the Federal Reserve?

446
00:37:40,718 --> 00:37:44,838
It's a it's universal basic income for Ph.D. economists.

447
00:37:44,999 --> 00:37:50,618
I thought that comment was hilarious. And, you know, he said he said they always get it wrong.

448
00:37:50,738 --> 00:37:56,618
If you know, if the Federal Reserve was the, you know, the FAA, nobody would fly in airplanes because these people don't know what the hell they're doing.

449
00:37:56,618 --> 00:38:02,539
and he's right. And so, you know, basically it's clear to me that, you know, with an election

450
00:38:02,539 --> 00:38:07,818
coming up next fall and, you know, Powell's term expiring in May, Hassett's going to get in there

451
00:38:07,818 --> 00:38:12,298
and they're going to run this thing hot. And, you know, the good news is the economy will probably

452
00:38:12,298 --> 00:38:16,818
hold together and the stock market might even go higher nominally. But the bad news is that's going

453
00:38:16,818 --> 00:38:22,578
to be massively inflationary. And gold has already smelled it, which is why gold took off, you know,

454
00:38:22,578 --> 00:38:27,638
starting in September and went from $2,600 to $4,400. Silver is smelling it. I mean, it's doubled

455
00:38:27,638 --> 00:38:33,578
in the last year, more than doubled, actually. And Bitcoin, you know, Bitcoin has been a little

456
00:38:33,578 --> 00:38:38,939
bit of a laggard and a little bit sensitive to this tighter liquidity. It's got a more sensitive

457
00:38:38,939 --> 00:38:46,019
liquidity-driven price to it. But my sense is that, you know, if you look historically,

458
00:38:46,118 --> 00:38:48,919
another chart, I'm not going to show it, but I've shown it plenty of times on my Twitter feed.

459
00:38:48,919 --> 00:38:54,919
What we see is that gold, because it's more widely distributed, tends to move first, and then Bitcoin follows.

460
00:38:55,898 --> 00:38:59,318
And so to me, gold has already sniffed out the monetary debasement.

461
00:38:59,439 --> 00:39:00,158
It's moved heavily.

462
00:39:00,698 --> 00:39:05,118
And what's going on right now is Bitcoin is in the process of starting to follow.

463
00:39:06,078 --> 00:39:07,398
And so I fully expect it.

464
00:39:07,398 --> 00:39:09,198
I said I've been wrong about it.

465
00:39:09,278 --> 00:39:12,618
Earlier this year, my prediction was end of the year, silver would be 50 or over.

466
00:39:12,678 --> 00:39:13,419
I'm right about that.

467
00:39:13,919 --> 00:39:15,479
I said gold would be 4,000 over.

468
00:39:15,559 --> 00:39:16,318
I've been right about that.

469
00:39:16,358 --> 00:39:17,618
I said Bitcoin would be 140.

470
00:39:17,618 --> 00:39:18,758
I've been wrong about that.

471
00:39:18,919 --> 00:39:26,258
But I think that 140, 150 is coming sometime pretty early next year as these Fed changes take place.

472
00:39:26,258 --> 00:39:31,039
So just some kind of context on what I see going on in the market right now.

473
00:39:31,098 --> 00:39:33,999
And I know a lot of people are very, very impatient.

474
00:39:33,999 --> 00:39:36,658
But I started buying this stuff in 2013 or 14.

475
00:39:36,778 --> 00:39:38,818
I almost actually kind of forgot about it for a while.

476
00:39:38,919 --> 00:39:39,539
I was like, oh, yeah.

477
00:39:39,959 --> 00:39:42,318
One day I opened up my wallet at Coinbase.

478
00:39:42,439 --> 00:39:43,178
I was like, holy shit.

479
00:39:43,919 --> 00:39:45,439
There's actually some real money here.

480
00:39:46,439 --> 00:39:48,858
I paid $300 or $400 for it and got up a few thousand.

481
00:39:48,919 --> 00:39:54,818
So, yeah, it's and so I think, you know, people just got to become more patient here.

482
00:39:55,019 --> 00:39:57,718
I mean, we we are winning. We're going to continue to win.

483
00:39:58,539 --> 00:40:02,658
The power law is in full effect. We're right. We're below the power law right now.

484
00:40:02,738 --> 00:40:07,059
This is a good time to be buying. If I had a lump sum distribution, I'd do it right now.

485
00:40:08,178 --> 00:40:11,118
You know, there will be there will become a time when it's less good to be buying.

486
00:40:11,198 --> 00:40:14,838
I mean, we will go to one and a half times standard deviation above the power law.

487
00:40:14,838 --> 00:40:18,158
And that might be 200 and it won't be quite as good a time to be buying.

488
00:40:18,158 --> 00:40:26,218
But, you know, I just think everybody needs to relax and realize that we are in the right place at the right time and we're lucky to be here.

489
00:40:26,439 --> 00:40:31,658
So that was kind of long winded, but I thought I'd give you my perspective on where we are now in the markets.

490
00:40:32,158 --> 00:40:33,118
Two things struck me.

491
00:40:33,118 --> 00:40:34,979
The first was that.

492
00:40:36,479 --> 00:40:40,838
As as you dipped below the curve.

493
00:40:42,278 --> 00:40:44,298
The violent reaction.

494
00:40:44,298 --> 00:40:54,778
like it and um so but but but maybe that's indicative of the fact that the fed is always

495
00:40:54,778 --> 00:41:00,479
just guessing right so when they see trouble they don't really know how much trouble they're in

496
00:41:00,479 --> 00:41:09,618
and so the reaction is violent because the ramifications of of going further the other

497
00:41:09,618 --> 00:41:15,718
side are so terrible in their mind. That's right. And I mean, yeah, one could argue, I mean,

498
00:41:15,778 --> 00:41:20,598
and this is why we've seen interest rates that ping pong between, you know, back in the Volcker

499
00:41:20,598 --> 00:41:25,878
days, 20% and 0%. And I mean, one could argue that, you know, you could almost AI the Fed and

500
00:41:25,878 --> 00:41:30,459
just set interest rates at three or 4% and leave them alone. And we'd have better economic outcomes

501
00:41:30,459 --> 00:41:46,777
because you get these crazy swings Yeah you get these crazy swings And the issue really becomes The Fed was originally created as a backstop to the banks And the issue is that in the system we got the leverage is ever growing and ever increasing at all levels of society

502
00:41:47,537 --> 00:41:54,197
And, you know, in a normally functioning society, we would have a corrective phase where all the leverage would get weeded out.

503
00:41:54,457 --> 00:41:56,597
You know, and frankly, that would be very painful.

504
00:41:57,137 --> 00:42:02,457
But that's what they that's what kind of happened in 1929 to, you know, 1935 or six.

505
00:42:02,457 --> 00:42:09,257
but we've decided we can't have that anymore. That's not one of the options. It's become an

506
00:42:09,257 --> 00:42:13,997
unacceptable thing for politicians because they know that if we go into another depression,

507
00:42:14,137 --> 00:42:20,937
we squeeze all the leverage out, there's going to be enormous pain. And so basically,

508
00:42:20,937 --> 00:42:28,117
the third Fed mandate has become printing, coming with fire hoses and printing as necessary to keep

509
00:42:28,117 --> 00:42:33,937
the system functioning. And sadly, as with anything else that compounds, Bob, as you know,

510
00:42:35,017 --> 00:42:41,157
the numbers just have to keep getting bigger and bigger and bigger. And ultimately, I mean,

511
00:42:41,197 --> 00:42:46,057
I think there's going to, as my book says, I mean, I ultimately think the fiat currencies are going

512
00:42:46,057 --> 00:42:52,377
to fail because people are just going to lose faith in them. I mean, most Bitcoiners have already

513
00:42:52,377 --> 00:42:57,137
lost faith in them, but we're still a minority. All gold people have certainly lost faith in them.

514
00:42:57,137 --> 00:43:03,017
and they're still a minority too. But our ranks are growing. I mean, a lot of things have happened

515
00:43:03,017 --> 00:43:06,317
in the last six months. One of the things I thought was most interesting was Morgan Stanley,

516
00:43:07,317 --> 00:43:12,617
who traditionally, I think they advised like $7 or $8 trillion of customer wealth. I mean,

517
00:43:12,617 --> 00:43:18,137
a lot of money. And they used to be 60% stocks, 40% bonds was kind of their model.

518
00:43:18,657 --> 00:43:26,857
And they revised it to 60% stocks, 20% bonds, 20% gold. I was like, what? I fell out of my chair

519
00:43:26,857 --> 00:43:30,997
when I read that. And then somebody on Twitter did the math and said, you know, if they took,

520
00:43:31,117 --> 00:43:34,857
if all their customers listened to them and put 20% of their money in gold, price of gold would

521
00:43:34,857 --> 00:43:40,977
double tomorrow. And that's probably close to correct. So, you know, I think this whole monetary

522
00:43:40,977 --> 00:43:48,517
debasement trade that gold, silver, and Bitcoin are reflecting, it's a big deal. And the other big

523
00:43:48,517 --> 00:43:52,637
deal about it is, you know, you've got this whole unit bias thing going on where everyone, I have

524
00:43:52,637 --> 00:43:56,617
all my friends like, well, yeah, I get gold, but I can't pay for you bought it for a thousand.

525
00:43:56,857 --> 00:44:19,457
Yeah, I get Bitcoin. I can't pay 100. You bought it for 10. And I'm just kind of like, well, yeah, except let's look at it the other way. Let's look at total available market. There's a trillion dollars of financial assets. There's, you know, 150 million of bonds, 150 million of equities. There's a bunch of cash. There's a bunch of real estate. All of this. And Bitcoin's 2 trillion and gold is 24 or 26, something like that.

526
00:44:19,457 --> 00:44:29,657
And actually of that gold, only about half of it is really actually easily saleable because half of it's around, you know, female necks in, you know, all over the world in the form of jewelry.

527
00:44:30,097 --> 00:44:38,437
And maybe 20% of it's actually in museums and antiquities that, you know, nobody's going to go run, you know, melting down the Pharaoh's mask to get the gold.

528
00:44:38,437 --> 00:44:52,517
So, yeah, I mean, and so my sense is, you know, this debasement trade, we were just this presentation I just gave to my investors, and that was the chart I took it from that presentation, is that, you know, we're in the second inning here.

529
00:44:52,737 --> 00:44:54,157
You know, we've got a ways to go.

530
00:44:54,977 --> 00:44:59,977
So, you know, and I've used this, I've said this in a lot of podcasts, but I'll re-say it just one more time.

531
00:44:59,977 --> 00:45:06,657
I mean, yeah, okay, so if the financial system, the fiat financial system, the dollar is Titanic,

532
00:45:06,837 --> 00:45:10,737
and you can argue whether it is or it's not, that's maybe a little bit extreme, but I think it could be.

533
00:45:11,897 --> 00:45:15,777
And silver and gold and Bitcoin are seats in the lifeboat.

534
00:45:16,017 --> 00:45:18,097
Yeah, you're right, I bought my seat cheaper.

535
00:45:18,217 --> 00:45:18,677
I was smart.

536
00:45:18,897 --> 00:45:20,877
I saw it five years ago, I bought a cheap seat.

537
00:45:21,477 --> 00:45:22,777
But you're still on that Titanic.

538
00:45:22,897 --> 00:45:25,557
I mean, I know a lot of people are very wealthy, have all their money in stocks.

539
00:45:26,237 --> 00:45:27,717
And I'm like, is that really what you want to do?

540
00:45:27,717 --> 00:45:32,177
I mean, yeah, the seats are more expensive now, but don't you want to at least buy one seat?

541
00:45:32,637 --> 00:45:40,437
You know, another perspective on that, Larry, I appreciate you sharing with us and with everybody, you know, your investor presentation.

542
00:45:40,537 --> 00:45:42,537
I'll share something that I do.

543
00:45:42,617 --> 00:45:53,017
I write a monthly newsletter for subscribers through Financial Advisor Magazine and goes to 400,000 wealth and financial advisors in North America.

544
00:45:53,017 --> 00:46:01,597
And I have a hypothesis, especially Gary and Larry as guys that are very familiar with commodity markets.

545
00:46:02,097 --> 00:46:04,757
You can tell me if you agree with this hypothesis.

546
00:46:04,977 --> 00:46:12,117
But my hypothesis is that the lower bound of a commodity, lower bound of the price of a commodity,

547
00:46:12,477 --> 00:46:17,377
is somewhat set by the cost of production of that commodity.

548
00:46:17,377 --> 00:46:28,817
And so certainly in short windows, market supply and demand issues can play with that a little bit, but nothing sustainable.

549
00:46:29,717 --> 00:46:43,077
So I, for years, have been tracking the average cost of Bitcoin production across the industry, and I found that it sets the lower bound pretty well for the price of Bitcoin.

550
00:46:43,077 --> 00:46:51,117
So in Q1 in my newsletter, I said that the cost of production was $75,000.

551
00:46:52,397 --> 00:47:05,577
And in April, Q1 of 2025, in Q1, at the end of Q1, I think it was like April 9th, we bottomed at $75,000 and bounced off of that.

552
00:47:05,577 --> 00:47:06,077
Right?

553
00:47:06,997 --> 00:47:12,577
And in September, I did my revised number, and I set it in the high 80s.

554
00:47:13,077 --> 00:47:17,777
And I said, average cost of production now is in the high 80s.

555
00:47:17,937 --> 00:47:23,757
And, you know, I was more optimistic, Larry, and maybe we'll still see a big number before the end of it.

556
00:47:23,777 --> 00:47:28,017
But I said, my bottom floor is in the high 80s.

557
00:47:28,017 --> 00:47:30,777
And obviously, we had like a week or so we went below that.

558
00:47:31,177 --> 00:47:35,537
But roughly that same number, we're bouncing off of the same number.

559
00:47:36,417 --> 00:47:43,037
So I think to your friends, like part of the reason I'm bringing this up is to your friends say, well, you know, you bought Bitcoin.

560
00:47:43,077 --> 00:47:45,597
when the cost of production was 10,000.

561
00:47:45,657 --> 00:47:49,237
Well, cost of production now is 90.

562
00:47:49,397 --> 00:47:50,537
We'll call it 90 for right now.

563
00:47:51,577 --> 00:47:54,577
So it's no different than anything else, right?

564
00:47:55,137 --> 00:47:57,797
What was the cost of production at the time that you bought it?

565
00:47:57,857 --> 00:48:00,957
It's not that the cost of production changed.

566
00:48:01,397 --> 00:48:05,357
Now, in a market like gold or in a commodity market like grains

567
00:48:05,357 --> 00:48:07,997
or something like that, the cost of production doesn't vary as much.

568
00:48:08,057 --> 00:48:12,037
But in Bitcoin, cost of production changes quite a bit in short windows.

569
00:48:12,037 --> 00:48:13,197
Bob, let me ask you a question.

570
00:48:13,737 --> 00:48:17,997
You're 75 and 90 for Q4.

571
00:48:18,937 --> 00:48:22,977
Does it take all the mining into account?

572
00:48:23,117 --> 00:48:27,557
Because there's a huge spread between the way you mine it and the way Fred Teal mines it.

573
00:48:27,637 --> 00:48:27,797
Right.

574
00:48:28,037 --> 00:48:29,697
Yeah, it's the industry average.

575
00:48:29,777 --> 00:48:31,637
So I can mine Bitcoin for 50.

576
00:48:32,617 --> 00:48:34,037
See, I think this is a problem.

577
00:48:34,177 --> 00:48:37,217
This is the problem with your math, if I may.

578
00:48:37,317 --> 00:48:38,057
Yeah, oh, it's okay.

579
00:48:39,037 --> 00:48:41,757
Because, you know, I hear this in the oil complex all the time.

580
00:48:41,757 --> 00:48:50,097
I heard some guy with 3000 listeners last night hoodwinking the audience that they see a hundred dollar crude oil again.

581
00:48:50,717 --> 00:48:55,017
And if that happens, the whole world follows parts like, yeah, no shit, Dave, hundred dollar crude oil.

582
00:48:56,497 --> 00:49:00,297
And you get a treasury 10 year at seven.

583
00:49:00,777 --> 00:49:02,457
OK, good. The whole world's falling apart.

584
00:49:02,577 --> 00:49:07,777
But you can't base a premise of super inflation in the future.

585
00:49:07,897 --> 00:49:09,557
See, I don't see inflation coming.

586
00:49:09,557 --> 00:49:15,937
I see a massive deflationary event the next 10 years, maybe five, maybe three.

587
00:49:16,157 --> 00:49:23,817
I think we're seeing it right now. You remove 12 million immigrants from this country, whether they go voluntarily or you remove them.

588
00:49:24,557 --> 00:49:27,497
I think there's four million houses that are going to be on the market.

589
00:49:28,497 --> 00:49:31,797
By the way, I use 12 million people, assuming four are living in a house.

590
00:49:31,797 --> 00:49:43,877
It's a staggering amount of homes, a staggering amount of rentals, a staggering amount of jobs that have been underpriced and taken from Americans.

591
00:49:44,097 --> 00:49:48,317
Great companies are going to be built in America if we get rid of the immigration issue.

592
00:49:49,317 --> 00:49:55,777
But people are going to have to understand, the retailers in particular, you're not going to be selling $80,000 automobiles.

593
00:49:56,117 --> 00:49:57,157
It's not happening.

594
00:49:57,157 --> 00:50:01,117
I think there could be two worlds.

595
00:50:01,117 --> 00:50:04,577
Fred Teal is not making money mining Bitcoin the way he's mining it.

596
00:50:04,997 --> 00:50:06,877
He's at $135,000.

597
00:50:07,497 --> 00:50:11,517
And then you have you sitting down here making a big old chunky margin.

598
00:50:12,357 --> 00:50:15,797
Crude oil producers in the United States produce for $45 a barrel.

599
00:50:15,917 --> 00:50:16,657
This was my point.

600
00:50:16,897 --> 00:50:18,097
And they're selling it for $65.

601
00:50:18,737 --> 00:50:22,397
And the word dry hole has been completely removed from Petit.

602
00:50:23,477 --> 00:50:24,777
There is no dry hole.

603
00:50:24,977 --> 00:50:26,637
This is now science, dude.

604
00:50:26,737 --> 00:50:28,137
It is not an art form.

605
00:50:28,257 --> 00:50:29,477
It is LiDAR.

606
00:50:29,477 --> 00:50:33,257
Oh, my God, look at the size of that fucking fuel. Let's go drill it fast.

607
00:50:34,117 --> 00:50:39,637
So we're not going to. I think all these prices come down, including electricity.

608
00:50:40,437 --> 00:50:45,797
You've just got the United States government took an 18 percent stake in the Westinghouse.

609
00:50:46,497 --> 00:50:51,317
This is to Lawrence's view of comments on QE.

610
00:50:51,817 --> 00:50:55,757
I think QE is on steroids right now under a different name.

611
00:50:56,437 --> 00:51:00,897
The U.S. government just told Westinghouse, dude, we're going to support the fuck out of you.

612
00:51:01,277 --> 00:51:02,197
And we're going to build a nuclear.

613
00:51:02,637 --> 00:51:04,157
It's the best tenant you could get.

614
00:51:04,897 --> 00:51:05,137
Okay.

615
00:51:05,177 --> 00:51:06,837
They did the same thing with Intel.

616
00:51:07,057 --> 00:51:08,037
10% stake.

617
00:51:08,337 --> 00:51:09,097
They're bragging now.

618
00:51:09,157 --> 00:51:09,517
Look at that.

619
00:51:09,597 --> 00:51:10,217
$40 billion.

620
00:51:10,697 --> 00:51:15,957
Hey, I'll give you some contracts and I'm going to take an investment in your company.

621
00:51:16,257 --> 00:51:18,377
The pure Bitcoiners will hate that.

622
00:51:18,757 --> 00:51:19,657
And I say, no, no, no.

623
00:51:19,717 --> 00:51:20,677
This is good.

624
00:51:21,397 --> 00:51:23,437
This is much better than QE.

625
00:51:23,437 --> 00:51:37,637
This isn't just handing money to people. This is taking an investment back for contracts. And I guarantee you those contracts are going to have to be lived up to if we're monitoring what we're entering into. Right.

626
00:51:37,637 --> 00:51:46,397
and all everyone that the United States government is competing with their sovereigns invest in their primary companies.

627
00:51:47,277 --> 00:52:00,457
So this has to happen and you're not going to fight the global polymarket gig that's going on now that we're going to do for the next 20 years and not support your biggest industries.

628
00:52:00,457 --> 00:52:05,217
It's just not going to happen when you can't when you can Europe can't.

629
00:52:05,517 --> 00:52:07,157
Well, yeah, they've completely blown it.

630
00:52:07,637 --> 00:52:09,237
You know, the Asians got it right, though.

631
00:52:09,317 --> 00:52:20,697
So the Asians got it right because if you go back to the 70s and the 80s, and I think you said something about this earlier, we can learn a lot from the roads we've already traveled, right?

632
00:52:20,697 --> 00:52:27,197
Well, why is there chip dominance, LCD production dominance, for instance, in Asia?

633
00:52:27,197 --> 00:52:39,237
It's because Japan, Taiwan, China, South Korea all recognized way back in the 80s that these were the industries that would dominate the future.

634
00:52:39,237 --> 00:52:45,757
and the governments worked in kind of public-private cooperations and funded these massive

635
00:52:45,757 --> 00:52:58,177
developments that became Samsung, TSMC, LG, Foxconn, like all of these powerhouses of technology.

636
00:52:58,597 --> 00:53:04,997
And they kicked our ass and even took companies like Intel. I mean, maybe we can save Intel

637
00:53:04,997 --> 00:53:12,077
through something like this but intel's dying and they were the king i mean they were the absolute

638
00:53:12,077 --> 00:53:19,077
king at that point um but but um you know if we're gonna if we're gonna win in ai if we're

639
00:53:19,077 --> 00:53:23,517
gonna win in energy if we're gonna win in bitcoin like these sort of things when i say we i mean the

640
00:53:23,517 --> 00:53:28,317
us it's gonna be a major player has to do this shit yeah where i was trying to get to though

641
00:53:28,317 --> 00:53:31,817
was the point on the mining is if there's two markets really, right?

642
00:53:32,217 --> 00:53:38,797
And that I think there's a lot of opportunity if the Bitcoin miners,

643
00:53:39,597 --> 00:53:43,397
or the Bitcoin miners without intervention are going to be forced to the source.

644
00:53:44,057 --> 00:53:46,417
Like I still maintain zero cost.

645
00:53:46,517 --> 00:53:48,177
And this is what my question to you is,

646
00:53:48,857 --> 00:53:55,877
if you're maintaining that the high price, the $75.90 is the floor,

647
00:53:55,877 --> 00:54:03,977
I actually challenge that because I think the floor is somewhere between remove all the threads of the world, the $137,000 cost.

648
00:54:04,217 --> 00:54:05,937
Those guys are not going to survive this.

649
00:54:06,277 --> 00:54:13,597
They're going to be replaced with miners in Alaska, in Russia, Saudi Arabia with zero input cost.

650
00:54:14,017 --> 00:54:18,397
As I said, that's been my hypothesis, but that's what I do.

651
00:54:18,657 --> 00:54:21,557
I mean, my company, we produce our own energy now.

652
00:54:21,637 --> 00:54:22,477
We own our own hydro.

653
00:54:22,477 --> 00:54:31,257
we use anaerobic digestion from cow manure we own our own gas wells and you know we you know we we

654
00:54:31,257 --> 00:54:35,237
can't get zero i mean because we have to run engines and we have maintenance on the engines

655
00:54:35,237 --> 00:54:40,777
and things like that but we can see cost of electricity down even under two cents per kilowatt

656
00:54:40,777 --> 00:54:48,377
hour so by building it ourselves and and managing that but you might even say i'm less a miner than

657
00:54:48,377 --> 00:54:53,337
I am an energy producer, you know, and I'm just a low cost energy producer is maybe another

658
00:54:53,337 --> 00:54:59,117
way to say it. You're just using Bitcoin as a sink for the energy that you're zero. You're

659
00:54:59,117 --> 00:55:04,537
getting nothing for right now. That's why I say your input cost is zero because without the Bitcoin,

660
00:55:04,897 --> 00:55:10,817
you don't exist. There is zero for the hydro. That is correct. Okay. So like that's new energy

661
00:55:10,817 --> 00:55:15,597
that's showing up to the market. It's not displacing the electric grid. It's not displacing

662
00:55:15,597 --> 00:55:20,697
ARCOT, but it's fucking competing with anybody buying energy at ARCOT.

663
00:55:21,097 --> 00:55:21,617
Absolutely.

664
00:55:22,257 --> 00:55:22,417
Yeah.

665
00:55:22,677 --> 00:55:29,457
To mine Bitcoin, you're going to get your head ripped off because this is what decentralization

666
00:55:29,457 --> 00:55:33,277
is going to work because decentralization isn't going to work at ARCOT.

667
00:55:33,457 --> 00:55:37,857
It's going to work because you have 10,000 mining guys going, dude, I have cheap energy.

668
00:55:37,917 --> 00:55:38,637
I have cheap energy.

669
00:55:39,637 --> 00:55:41,937
And it doesn't really matter where you are.

670
00:55:41,937 --> 00:55:45,057
You just might be sitting on some cheap energy because where you were born.

671
00:55:45,057 --> 00:55:47,797
my job is to go find those spots.

672
00:55:48,177 --> 00:55:49,517
Now, the only thing is...

673
00:55:50,377 --> 00:55:51,417
You see, that's so important

674
00:55:51,417 --> 00:55:52,517
because that's never sold.

675
00:55:52,657 --> 00:55:55,317
This is never sold by Bitcoin this way.

676
00:55:55,597 --> 00:55:58,777
Hey, we're a sinkhole for vacant energy.

677
00:56:00,057 --> 00:56:01,057
Unmonetized energy, dude.

678
00:56:01,077 --> 00:56:01,717
I'm a sinkhole.

679
00:56:01,917 --> 00:56:03,637
Yeah, no, it's one of the beautiful parts of it all.

680
00:56:03,697 --> 00:56:04,797
Most people don't understand it.

681
00:56:04,797 --> 00:56:07,357
I mean, look, a guy like Howard Hamm

682
00:56:07,357 --> 00:56:12,197
is going to spend 30 cents MMBTU,

683
00:56:12,197 --> 00:56:18,677
which is a unit of natural gas a month to store a $4.50 product.

684
00:56:19,877 --> 00:56:22,577
These energy markets, they kind of behave like this,

685
00:56:22,657 --> 00:56:24,577
where in the winter they're supposed to be really high,

686
00:56:24,677 --> 00:56:26,077
in the summer they're supposed to be low.

687
00:56:26,517 --> 00:56:32,597
So you then hide the gas in the summertime at $0.30 a decatherm or a MMBTU,

688
00:56:32,957 --> 00:56:35,377
and then you sell it into the winter,

689
00:56:35,557 --> 00:56:37,817
which then of course brings the winter prices down.

690
00:56:38,617 --> 00:56:39,917
But that's $1.50, man.

691
00:56:39,917 --> 00:56:44,217
You have to see $6, $1.50 and $4.50.

692
00:56:44,277 --> 00:56:57,797
You have to have $6 to make a margin on that when Howard Hamm could be spending, getting paid to stick his natural gas into Bitcoin and reserve it and go, dude, I'll let you guys know when I want to sell it.

693
00:56:58,677 --> 00:56:59,637
While it's making money.

694
00:56:59,797 --> 00:57:00,677
Oh, my God.

695
00:57:01,057 --> 00:57:04,417
And Howard Hamm gave that 30 cents a month to Columbia.

696
00:57:04,717 --> 00:57:06,037
It's not even the same company.

697
00:57:07,657 --> 00:57:09,637
So we know this is going to happen.

698
00:57:09,637 --> 00:57:15,097
This is, you're going to make, help make the markets much, much, much more efficient.

699
00:57:15,537 --> 00:57:15,657
Yeah.

700
00:57:15,797 --> 00:57:18,557
We, like I said, we, I think this is the future.

701
00:57:18,737 --> 00:57:23,597
It's the path we started pursuing in 2021 because I could see where this is going.

702
00:57:23,757 --> 00:57:27,937
Now, a lot of times, at least right now, it has to happen on a smaller scale.

703
00:57:28,317 --> 00:57:34,997
So it's, you know, we can find these opportunities for a megawatt or five megawatts or 10 megawatts, but not for 300 megawatts.

704
00:57:34,997 --> 00:57:42,897
And you almost have a moat, by the way, that's a reverse moat because the big public companies can't chase these opportunities.

705
00:57:43,497 --> 00:57:46,357
Yeah, you're exactly right. They are the immune.

706
00:57:46,357 --> 00:57:53,217
And, you know, I think the only the thing with the public mining companies, which I am, as you probably can gather, I am not a fan of.

707
00:57:53,297 --> 00:57:56,417
I think they've done a huge disservice to Bitcoin and the community.

708
00:57:56,417 --> 00:58:06,657
but they might get saved because they can get taken over by some of the AI guys who are willing

709
00:58:06,657 --> 00:58:11,457
to pay for their energy assets right now. If the demand for AI keeps going up, I think they can

710
00:58:11,457 --> 00:58:20,077
get bailed out, but I think they'll go away. Their future is either death or acquisition by

711
00:58:20,077 --> 00:58:25,317
another industry that will pay more for their asset right now. Abundant Minds is an Oregon-based

712
00:58:25,317 --> 00:58:29,797
husband and wife own Bitcoin mining company, making Bitcoin mining accessible to investors

713
00:58:29,797 --> 00:58:34,757
of all ages and experience levels. Their fully managed white glove service allows you to own

714
00:58:34,757 --> 00:58:39,257
all of your own equipment and earn steady Bitcoin denominated income without lifting a finger.

715
00:58:39,777 --> 00:58:44,417
Whether you're starting with 10,000 or 10 million, Abundant Mines is your one-stop shop.

716
00:58:44,737 --> 00:58:49,977
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717
00:58:49,977 --> 00:58:54,437
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718
00:58:54,437 --> 00:58:59,177
Bitcoin flows to you 24-7. Learn more at AbundantMinds.com.

719
00:59:24,437 --> 00:59:30,657
com slash btc sessions to sign up today and you can share your own personalized referral link to

720
00:59:30,657 --> 00:59:44,957
earn commissions so um maybe a different uh tack here and um is you know we haven't really talked

721
00:59:44,957 --> 00:59:51,017
about maybe some of the younger people like if you're a younger person and i'd love to get your

722
00:59:51,017 --> 00:59:56,197
advice, Gary? You're a younger person. You're that 30-year-old, 35-year-old professional. You're

723
00:59:56,197 --> 01:00:01,897
starting to, for the first time in your life, maybe make more money than you're consuming.

724
01:00:03,537 --> 01:00:12,617
What advice would you give to them? The world's pushing them toward 401ks and index funds and

725
01:00:12,617 --> 01:00:17,977
things like that. What would you tell them? Well, look, the first thing I would do is if you're 12,

726
01:00:17,977 --> 01:00:27,297
22, 42, you cannot spend more than you have. You have to fix that. Everyone on this call should be

727
01:00:27,297 --> 01:00:32,697
going, oh yeah, I'm good to go. You have to fix that whether Bitcoin's around or not.

728
01:00:33,597 --> 01:00:38,617
So when I was growing up, and this is going to be harsh to the young people, but nobody

729
01:00:38,617 --> 01:00:46,657
fucking guaranteed me the right to buy a house. They didn't guarantee me a salary that was going

730
01:00:46,657 --> 01:00:54,857
allow me to buy a Rolls Royce. I've never owned a Rolls Royce. I never will. Gosh, you know,

731
01:00:55,357 --> 01:01:00,037
the zip code I was growing in did not offer me the opportunities that I wanted to be. I needed

732
01:01:00,037 --> 01:01:07,337
to leave my zip code and go get a career and go build value. So the first thing I need to do is

733
01:01:07,337 --> 01:01:15,297
figure out who I am. Like, I don't, I need to invest in myself. That's where the real investment

734
01:01:15,297 --> 01:01:19,337
Come read a book, find out who you are, write yourself a note. Hey,

735
01:01:19,357 --> 01:01:22,357
I am not a prostitute. If you are a prostitute,

736
01:01:22,457 --> 01:01:24,317
get to know it early on, dude,

737
01:01:24,417 --> 01:01:26,797
embrace it and fucking become a trillionaire.

738
01:01:27,497 --> 01:01:30,417
But at least decide what you're doing.

739
01:01:30,537 --> 01:01:33,197
This is a huge mistake for somebody to start investing $500.

740
01:01:34,417 --> 01:01:38,777
You invest $500, not in Bitcoin, go invest $500 in some books, man.

741
01:01:39,737 --> 01:01:43,257
Okay. Follow Lawrence, follow Bob Burnett, follow whoever,

742
01:01:43,257 --> 01:01:51,277
pay them a dollar a week get a mentor man your your dad and mom did not teach you how to be

743
01:01:51,277 --> 01:01:59,257
successful so i i just think that that you know your your teachers are not successful people that

744
01:01:59,257 --> 01:02:06,117
they're not they did not teach you how to compete in the the world um and teachers are getting ready

745
01:02:06,117 --> 01:02:08,917
be replaced by robots that do a much better job.

746
01:02:10,057 --> 01:02:13,117
So to me, that's the first thing you do.

747
01:02:13,517 --> 01:02:17,057
The second thing you do is once you start asking yourself who the hell you're

748
01:02:17,057 --> 01:02:20,457
going to be when you grow up, you have to get a great platform.

749
01:02:21,057 --> 01:02:23,077
Don't worry about being your own guy.

750
01:02:23,517 --> 01:02:35,015
Go learn something from a master or do what I did and make every mistake imaginable I don know man You don have to make the mistakes I made

751
01:02:35,095 --> 01:02:37,815
I'll probably sell them to you for 10 bucks a month.

752
01:02:39,375 --> 01:02:41,515
You know, today, and the point I'm making about that,

753
01:02:41,555 --> 01:02:43,395
I actually give all my stuff away for free.

754
01:02:44,035 --> 01:02:45,695
The access to information,

755
01:02:45,695 --> 01:02:47,635
I am so sick and tired of hearing you guys say

756
01:02:47,635 --> 01:02:48,755
you don't have an opportunity.

757
01:02:48,875 --> 01:02:50,855
You have the greatest opportunity in the history of mankind.

758
01:02:51,835 --> 01:02:54,735
Your MBAs cost you zero today, okay?

759
01:02:54,995 --> 01:02:57,155
I can't get an MBA.

760
01:02:57,475 --> 01:02:58,995
Dude, you guys can get an MBA.

761
01:02:59,315 --> 01:03:01,515
Harvard's offering free classes right now.

762
01:03:02,595 --> 01:03:03,935
MIT is doing the same.

763
01:03:04,895 --> 01:03:09,675
And not to mention, you get to access Gary, Lawrence, Bob, anytime you want.

764
01:03:10,035 --> 01:03:11,935
And there are more and more people coming like us.

765
01:03:12,055 --> 01:03:13,815
This is the mistake the young people are making.

766
01:03:14,135 --> 01:03:17,175
Your egos are completely out of connection with reality.

767
01:03:17,535 --> 01:03:19,315
No, I think everything you say is right.

768
01:03:19,395 --> 01:03:21,175
I would emphasize a couple of points.

769
01:03:21,175 --> 01:03:23,895
Go buy The Richest Man in Babylon by Claussen.

770
01:03:23,895 --> 01:03:29,335
And it's a really simple book, but basically the message or don't buy it and just remember this.

771
01:03:29,835 --> 01:03:33,455
Pay yourself first. You know, 10 percent of everything you make has to go into savings.

772
01:03:33,875 --> 01:03:41,395
Then go buy yourself an HP 12C financial calculator and fiddle around with whatever kind of IRR you want to use.

773
01:03:41,595 --> 01:03:49,435
And, you know, the thing that young people have is an advantage that the four of us do not have is you've got years, decades, literally of compounding ahead of you.

774
01:03:49,875 --> 01:03:53,535
And so really small acorns grow into really big oak trees.

775
01:03:53,535 --> 01:04:05,455
And so, you know, if you're in your teens or your 20s, your 30s, and you start saving 10% of your income and you put it someplace that grows north of 7%, and of course, in Bitcoin recently, it's been growing at 30 or 40% a year.

776
01:04:05,935 --> 01:04:09,495
It's virtually impossible that you won't end up in your later years rich.

777
01:04:10,155 --> 01:04:11,595
It's literally impossible.

778
01:04:11,595 --> 01:04:19,475
And so, you know, to me, that's probably the one habit that's more important than anything else that you can adopt.

779
01:04:19,475 --> 01:04:24,555
and that is to live within your means and pay yourself first and then be learn how to be an

780
01:04:24,555 --> 01:04:30,175
investor and make your money make money for you so that eventually you won't have to work anymore

781
01:04:30,175 --> 01:04:35,935
and you'll have nothing but passive income and uh you know that's how you know gary did it that's

782
01:04:35,935 --> 01:04:39,715
how we all have done it that's how your brother did it with real estate everyone's done it i mean

783
01:04:39,715 --> 01:04:44,215
kiyosaki is a guy robert kiyosaki wrote rich dad poor dad has become a personal friend and he's a

784
01:04:44,215 --> 01:04:48,795
big supporter of my book and i'm grateful for that and he wrote the the ultimate book on how

785
01:04:48,795 --> 01:04:53,015
to do this. I mean, he grew up, you know, with a father who was an academic and was, didn't

786
01:04:53,015 --> 01:04:56,955
understand what to do. And then, but his neighbor was a very smart entrepreneur. And he went and

787
01:04:56,955 --> 01:05:02,175
said, Hey, you're rich. I want to be rich too. How do I do that? And so then he took the lesson

788
01:05:02,175 --> 01:05:05,915
and he wrote it all down in this book. It's that book. It's, it blew my mind when he told me this,

789
01:05:05,915 --> 01:05:11,615
they've sold 50 million copies of that book since 1993. So yeah. Right. And that's something

790
01:05:11,615 --> 01:05:18,035
best all time selling finance book in the history of the world. So, so I think young people,

791
01:05:18,035 --> 01:05:23,175
you know you got to get the basics right and you've got to understand the value of compound

792
01:05:23,175 --> 01:05:28,415
compounding i mean buffett and others have said like einstein even said it compound interest is

793
01:05:28,415 --> 01:05:33,155
one of the seven wonders of the world it really is kind of amazing the trick is how do you get out

794
01:05:33,155 --> 01:05:40,935
how do you get out i just like to use an analogy okay i need to escape friction and gravity okay

795
01:05:40,935 --> 01:05:46,175
and like this has always been my problem i always felt even in school like oh man there's so much

796
01:05:46,175 --> 01:05:51,875
gravity. Why don't you let me go and do my deal? So what does a rocket do? You know, when Elon,

797
01:05:52,295 --> 01:05:57,715
if these are actually real, they launch a rocket or maybe NASA is a better example.

798
01:05:58,755 --> 01:06:05,235
As soon as it hits outside of atmosphere into space, what does it do? The first thing it does,

799
01:06:05,295 --> 01:06:08,435
at least this is what we're told by these, because I've never seen one of these rockets

800
01:06:08,435 --> 01:06:12,355
actually do this, is they jettison all the material that got them there.

801
01:06:12,355 --> 01:06:19,895
people should question at 18 years old what baggage am I carrying into the world

802
01:06:19,895 --> 01:06:26,955
that I think is right but is actually I'm either just so clueless I've put some stuff in there

803
01:06:26,955 --> 01:06:33,435
which is to Lawrence's point he said hey pay yourself first you know what he really means is

804
01:06:33,435 --> 01:06:37,915
hey you're going to take all your income and pay yourself for what you spend your car on everything

805
01:06:37,915 --> 01:06:43,195
But then you need to invest 10% into yourself.

806
01:06:44,015 --> 01:06:45,515
Like, and he's saying, do that first.

807
01:06:45,615 --> 01:06:50,875
Like, that's an investment into the future, whether it's in Intel or Bitcoin or whatever.

808
01:06:51,495 --> 01:06:57,975
You can't go broke if you're investing money first and then spending it, right?

809
01:06:57,995 --> 01:06:59,715
This is a huge discipline.

810
01:06:59,855 --> 01:07:05,635
It sets you up at 18 to realize that at 26, you're like, it's no longer suffering.

811
01:07:05,635 --> 01:07:09,475
and you're going to look at your friends and go, wow, what's wrong with you guys?

812
01:07:10,195 --> 01:07:15,155
Your job should be to think about leaving your group of friends, not staying with them.

813
01:07:16,735 --> 01:07:22,155
Like, just go check it out, man. Anybody that stayed in their local area for too long, I mean,

814
01:07:22,875 --> 01:07:27,815
could they have done more? This is not true for every, every case, okay? But

815
01:07:27,815 --> 01:07:33,755
just getting rid of all the stuff that's in your baggage, and I have to do this as

816
01:07:33,755 --> 01:07:38,775
is someone that thinks he's a professional. I have to get rid of my thought process.

817
01:07:39,415 --> 01:07:45,235
Sometimes I have Bitcoin taught me that. Oh, wow. What do I not know about finance?

818
01:07:46,055 --> 01:07:49,615
And I have learned a lot that I thought I knew that I did not.

819
01:07:51,095 --> 01:07:56,535
So get yourself around a great coach, great teachers and great lessons. And you're not

820
01:07:56,535 --> 01:08:02,795
it's going to be very, very hard to, you know, destroy yourself and not do well.

821
01:08:02,795 --> 01:08:07,235
I just don't know anybody with a bunch of mentors and learnings that have done poorly.

822
01:08:07,615 --> 01:08:09,955
Somebody is, and we've got an internal chat going.

823
01:08:10,055 --> 01:08:12,775
Somebody asks, is it too late to start at 30, 35, 40?

824
01:08:12,855 --> 01:08:13,595
Absolutely not.

825
01:08:13,775 --> 01:08:17,235
Particularly when you consider the average lifespan now is 70, 80, 90 years old.

826
01:08:18,075 --> 01:08:20,935
You know, starting at 30, 40 years old, it's fine.

827
01:08:21,315 --> 01:08:25,775
You know, and, you know, if you can, if you're lucky, I mean, obviously saving 10% is kind of the minimum.

828
01:08:26,055 --> 01:08:28,495
You know, you get some bonuses, you do particularly well, you have a hit.

829
01:08:29,135 --> 01:08:30,135
Well, then you do a catch up.

830
01:08:30,135 --> 01:08:35,295
You know, you take that bonus instead of buying a Porsche, you put it into your savings account.

831
01:08:35,675 --> 01:08:38,895
You know, I mean, the fact is we can all live with a lot less.

832
01:08:39,135 --> 01:08:41,795
You know, we're very we're all in the West in the Western world.

833
01:08:42,175 --> 01:08:43,575
We all have food on the table.

834
01:08:43,675 --> 01:08:44,155
Thank God.

835
01:08:44,275 --> 01:08:49,275
And when you consider if you read about human history, you know, for millennia, that was a real issue.

836
01:08:49,735 --> 01:08:53,115
And, you know, and we can all do with without the latest gadget.

837
01:08:53,635 --> 01:08:56,815
And, you know, so savings is a is a key.

838
01:08:56,815 --> 01:09:06,115
In my view, it's a long-time preference item, and it's a key part of ensuring this mental and physical peace that we all seek to achieve.

839
01:09:07,455 --> 01:09:14,975
And then the beauty of it all, as you all know, is a Bitcoin broadcast is that here you've got this turbocharged form of savings.

840
01:09:15,735 --> 01:09:18,995
There's a great chart that shows what the ARR on Bitcoin is right now.

841
01:09:19,095 --> 01:09:20,195
It's in the mid-40s now.

842
01:09:20,415 --> 01:09:23,075
And over time, as it gets adopted, it is going down.

843
01:09:23,075 --> 01:09:29,175
But even 10, I think even when we hit a million dollars, the power law of 2030 theory, it's still in the 20 percent range.

844
01:09:29,255 --> 01:09:36,195
I mean, get that financial calculator, plug in 20 percent over a couple of decades and look at what happens.

845
01:09:36,315 --> 01:09:39,775
Oh, my God. I mean, it's just it's impossible not to end up rich.

846
01:09:40,575 --> 01:09:48,375
And so with that knowledge, you know, suddenly I think, you know, a lot of the fear that people have felt for so many years, it's beaten into all of us.

847
01:09:48,435 --> 01:09:50,335
I'm not going to make it. I'm going to run out of money.

848
01:09:50,335 --> 01:10:10,355
You know, the world's unfair. Everything sucks. You know, once you have this knowledge, your perspective changes. And, you know, is it simple? No. Is it doable? Yes. And once you do it, you know, then you can suddenly say, all right, you know, I've solved for that problem. Now, what do I want to do with my valuable time?

849
01:10:10,355 --> 01:10:17,755
Seems to me that a lot of young people live for the here and now rather than for the later.

850
01:10:18,655 --> 01:10:23,615
You know, I mean, I see him and maybe this make a hell of a lot more money than I do.

851
01:10:23,675 --> 01:10:30,515
I'm not sure. But we'll go out to go find dining and maybe we're spending three hundred dollars, four hundred dollars on dinner at a really nice restaurant.

852
01:10:30,795 --> 01:10:33,175
And I'll see all these people there in their 30s.

853
01:10:33,235 --> 01:10:35,415
Where in the hell are these kids getting this money at?

854
01:10:35,415 --> 01:10:44,195
I mean, I know I certainly did that. I know I drove the same car forever until it was like, I got to get a new car because I didn't want to like buy a new car.

855
01:10:44,315 --> 01:10:51,155
That's the one that blows me away. I see these young people driving these cars that are just insanely expensive. I'm like, what?

856
01:10:51,855 --> 01:11:02,935
Yeah. I mean, I'm going, where's the money coming from? So to me, they're obviously not. Maybe some of them, you know, are doing great, but they're all, all those people in that restaurant are not doing great.

857
01:11:02,935 --> 01:11:04,635
all those people I see with those cars.

858
01:11:04,995 --> 01:11:06,575
No, there's a lot of debt being used.

859
01:11:07,135 --> 01:11:09,155
Hey guys, I got a conflict with an investor call,

860
01:11:09,255 --> 01:11:11,015
but I super enjoyed talking to all of you.

861
01:11:11,055 --> 01:11:13,255
I'm just going to mute and sign off for a bit

862
01:11:13,255 --> 01:11:15,395
and we'll do it again soon.

863
01:11:15,635 --> 01:11:16,015
See you later.

864
01:11:16,175 --> 01:11:16,955
Thanks, guys.

865
01:11:17,395 --> 01:11:17,835
Okay, good.

866
01:11:18,035 --> 01:11:18,335
See you.

867
01:11:18,855 --> 01:11:20,855
I'm perplexed by that too, Gary.

868
01:11:21,935 --> 01:11:24,995
It blows me away

869
01:11:24,995 --> 01:11:28,255
because you know that this is just credit card debt piling on.

870
01:11:28,595 --> 01:11:31,615
That's the reality is it's too easy.

871
01:11:31,615 --> 01:11:41,275
and and cars cars just suck money like gary uh you said you'd never own a rolls um i won't either

872
01:11:41,275 --> 01:11:49,815
um no to be fair i own some nice cars but they're not like super extravagant and i haven't bought a

873
01:11:49,815 --> 01:11:56,655
new car for decades you know i'll buy one that's a couple years old in good shape and it might be

874
01:11:56,655 --> 01:12:01,595
a bmw or a mercedes or something like that but i'm at a stage in my life where i can i can handle

875
01:12:01,595 --> 01:12:08,715
that same thing i drove my last car mercedes for 20 something years yeah but but you know by the

876
01:12:08,715 --> 01:12:15,555
way nobody cares like nobody cares what car you drive and if they do who cares yeah fuck them right

877
01:12:15,555 --> 01:12:20,695
fuck them if you care what car i drive or what watch is on my hand like you you you guys in the

878
01:12:20,695 --> 01:12:29,435
audience letting your women make 500 and 700,000, $2 million investment decisions on a house. Like

879
01:12:29,435 --> 01:12:35,935
this is not an investment. So the worst investment you could possibly make in your life. And at 22

880
01:12:35,935 --> 01:12:44,635
to get talked into buying a house, like, dude, you're, you're buying into someone else's made

881
01:12:44,635 --> 01:12:52,755
up dream it's not even your dream it's someone else's made up bullshit story about a trap you on

882
01:12:52,755 --> 01:12:59,675
a zip code and on a mortgage a long-term rental rate you do not own that home gary i saw your uh

883
01:12:59,675 --> 01:13:06,475
your your video um of you in front of your house that you just sold doing the math on why you got

884
01:13:06,475 --> 01:13:11,235
rid of that house and that was pretty i mean people should find that that was pretty enlightening

885
01:13:11,235 --> 01:13:19,195
Yeah, I mean, listen, I own my primary home here when I bought it relative to Bitcoin.

886
01:13:19,315 --> 01:13:28,295
By the way, to Bob's point, I would assume a 12% interest rate, a 12% annualized return over 10 years.

887
01:13:28,435 --> 01:13:31,615
Every 10 years, it's 120% return.

888
01:13:32,235 --> 01:13:32,675
You know what?

889
01:13:32,715 --> 01:13:35,035
For Bitcoin, I don't need 40 and 30.

890
01:13:35,035 --> 01:13:40,435
this is double the side this is double the position of the real estate i do with my brother

891
01:13:40,435 --> 01:13:46,575
who is a fucking baller okay he has given me unbelievable returns on the real estate

892
01:13:46,575 --> 01:13:55,935
and i still get paid i don't know 50 60 grand a month and but that was at six or seven percent

893
01:13:55,935 --> 01:14:04,115
uh this is i'm just assuming 12 uh you will end up stupidly rich at 12 percent if you're

894
01:14:04,115 --> 01:14:10,475
discipline. Even at 32, somebody said, hey, is it too late to start? The only business I would

895
01:14:10,475 --> 01:14:17,615
consider starting is Bitcoin business, where you actually hold Bitcoin and you learn about Bitcoin

896
01:14:17,615 --> 01:14:24,175
and all your assets are in Bitcoin. And not every asset, you're going to have to live in this

897
01:14:24,175 --> 01:14:31,515
world for a while, but you don't consider buying homes and stupid cars. I own a Range Rover,

898
01:14:31,515 --> 01:14:39,215
cost me $230,000. You can't afford these vehicles right now. You're actually doing the world of

899
01:14:39,215 --> 01:14:46,095
service. If you pull back your demand, okay, stop consuming everything because you're now chasing

900
01:14:46,095 --> 01:14:51,535
me. I don't need anything else. You're no longer chasing rich people, dude. We're peaked out on

901
01:14:51,535 --> 01:14:56,795
consumption. We are now going to be peak investors. I guarantee we have peak consumption

902
01:14:56,795 --> 01:14:59,515
has been achieved four or five years ago.

903
01:15:00,615 --> 01:15:02,695
There is not a sheik on the planet

904
01:15:02,695 --> 01:15:04,095
that can handle another chick

905
01:15:04,095 --> 01:15:06,875
or villa or airplane or yacht.

906
01:15:08,435 --> 01:15:10,135
We're really at peak consumption.

907
01:15:10,275 --> 01:15:11,395
I really, really believe that.

908
01:15:12,175 --> 01:15:13,575
You people are getting ready to see

909
01:15:13,575 --> 01:15:15,595
a deflationary environment

910
01:15:15,595 --> 01:15:19,155
and an event that you should capture massively.

911
01:15:19,575 --> 01:15:21,315
Because like what I said to Bob,

912
01:15:21,535 --> 01:15:23,935
I don't think anybody's ever told that to Bob.

913
01:15:24,295 --> 01:15:25,755
Hey, Bob, you have a moat.

914
01:15:26,795 --> 01:15:34,375
Your moat is an inverted moat because Fred Teal at Marathon can't even go after the kind of money he's going after.

915
01:15:34,715 --> 01:15:35,715
It's too small, man.

916
01:15:36,715 --> 01:15:38,055
It won't even ring the bell.

917
01:15:38,135 --> 01:15:39,655
No one will even listen to Fred.

918
01:15:39,655 --> 01:15:41,955
They won't have an analyst call over that deal.

919
01:15:42,395 --> 01:15:46,635
But there'll be a thousand bobs that go, dude, I can get rich doing this.

920
01:15:47,395 --> 01:15:48,855
And listen to what the gap is.

921
01:15:49,395 --> 01:15:52,515
Fred's at $130,000 Bitcoin producing.

922
01:15:53,175 --> 01:15:54,495
And Bob, you said you were at what?

923
01:15:54,595 --> 01:15:54,835
About 50.

924
01:15:55,255 --> 01:15:56,295
We can do it about 50.

925
01:15:56,795 --> 01:16:00,715
dude, the spread there, who's going to win? That is a mode.

926
01:16:01,075 --> 01:16:05,315
So if you don't think that's a good business, I would immediately go, Hey, Bob, you got any jobs?

927
01:16:06,075 --> 01:16:08,855
Dude, if I'm 32 years old, Hey, can I come work for you?

928
01:16:09,455 --> 01:16:10,415
I'll get you coffee.

929
01:16:11,955 --> 01:16:15,895
I'll get you. No, I'll get your coffee. Let me hang around with you.

930
01:16:15,895 --> 01:16:19,595
Cause I'm going to bring zero value to you. I'm going to be a headache for you.

931
01:16:19,935 --> 01:16:21,735
You're going to have to take time to teach me.

932
01:16:22,395 --> 01:16:25,155
And if you don't take time to teach me, I'm going to become a liability.

933
01:16:25,155 --> 01:16:27,715
So let me get you some coffee and I'll just hang around.

934
01:16:27,795 --> 01:16:28,695
You won't even know I'm here.

935
01:16:29,695 --> 01:16:31,115
I'll clean up the trash cans.

936
01:16:31,335 --> 01:16:31,775
I would.

937
01:16:32,235 --> 01:16:34,515
And no one does that today.

938
01:16:34,735 --> 01:16:34,915
Why?

939
01:16:36,835 --> 01:16:38,915
You got no competition whatsoever.

940
01:16:40,455 --> 01:16:41,775
You don't need to go to school.

941
01:16:41,855 --> 01:16:44,655
You need to figure out how to knock on somebody's door and get their attention.

942
01:16:45,315 --> 01:16:48,775
You know, it's funny you say that, too, because like I think you guys are probably the same.

943
01:16:48,855 --> 01:16:51,055
My DMs are open on Twitter, for instance.

944
01:16:51,115 --> 01:16:52,035
I'm easy to find.

945
01:16:52,035 --> 01:17:02,155
And I would say maybe once a month or so, somebody will reach out and ask me a question or ask for advice or something like that.

946
01:17:02,435 --> 01:17:08,795
And I try to always respond and give a thoughtful response to it.

947
01:17:08,995 --> 01:17:12,135
Now, if it was 50 a day, I'd probably have an issue.

948
01:17:12,975 --> 01:17:15,335
But and I've had that in my life, too.

949
01:17:15,575 --> 01:17:20,895
As you said, mentors and coaches and people that took me under their wing taught me a lot.

950
01:17:20,895 --> 01:17:30,175
And most of the time, people are pretty flattered that you ask them, and they're happy to share that.

951
01:17:30,435 --> 01:17:35,395
Because, you know, I think there's a, for me, it's like a good karma, right, that just comes from it.

952
01:17:35,515 --> 01:17:36,975
I feel good helping somebody.

953
01:17:37,415 --> 01:17:38,415
And that's all I need.

954
01:17:38,475 --> 01:17:39,495
I don't need anything else.

955
01:17:39,755 --> 01:17:43,435
Just feel like I help somebody is good enough.

956
01:17:43,995 --> 01:17:44,195
Yeah.

957
01:17:44,475 --> 01:17:46,975
The truth is, you know, I'm not preaching to you.

958
01:17:47,035 --> 01:17:48,915
I'm preaching to the guy that needs it.

959
01:17:48,915 --> 01:17:54,455
his parents should be calling Bob up going, hey, Bob, instead of me sending my kids to a four-year

960
01:17:54,455 --> 01:18:00,475
program, then it costs me $250. How about if I pay you $50,000 to take this kid under his wing

961
01:18:00,475 --> 01:18:06,775
and mentor him? See, there has to be an exchange of both pieces of information, right? Otherwise,

962
01:18:06,775 --> 01:18:11,675
the guy's not even going to consume it properly. And you know what they are? They got to be willing

963
01:18:11,675 --> 01:18:19,475
to go throw on a pair of work boots and help us drag a trench for a gas line or load servers

964
01:18:19,475 --> 01:18:23,575
that weigh 80 pounds in 20 degree weather into a container.

965
01:18:24,515 --> 01:18:29,995
Like if you want to do, if you want to get involved, like you're going to have to do

966
01:18:29,995 --> 01:18:30,915
the dirty work.

967
01:18:31,655 --> 01:18:33,555
But by the way, I did the dirty work too.

968
01:18:33,555 --> 01:18:39,575
Even at my events, I've been on our sites and I've dug the trenches and ran the jackhammers

969
01:18:39,575 --> 01:18:43,795
and got on the cranes and did all this shit.

970
01:18:44,195 --> 01:18:44,935
Because I want to.

971
01:18:45,055 --> 01:18:47,355
Because if I don't do that,

972
01:18:47,435 --> 01:18:49,635
I don't know how my business operates.

973
01:18:50,395 --> 01:18:51,735
And that's what you have to do.

974
01:18:51,735 --> 01:18:54,075
You have to learn how to do all that sort of shit.

975
01:18:54,855 --> 01:18:57,815
And eventually, you'll either go like,

976
01:18:57,875 --> 01:18:58,815
hey, I think I got it.

977
01:18:59,255 --> 01:19:00,835
Maybe you'll go off on your own.

978
01:19:01,035 --> 01:19:03,675
Or maybe you say, hey, can I be a partner on a project?

979
01:19:03,675 --> 01:19:07,975
Can I, you know, and then you start out on your own.

980
01:19:07,975 --> 01:19:12,195
And whether that's in mining or whatever the hell, it doesn't really matter, right?

981
01:19:12,255 --> 01:19:15,995
If you want to go work in a restaurant, you got to do the same thing.

982
01:19:16,055 --> 01:19:23,155
You got to wash the dishes and cut the onions before you're the chef or own the restaurant, right?

983
01:19:23,155 --> 01:19:30,635
Yeah, the Bitcoin industry is a very interesting industry in that, I mean, people do have options.

984
01:19:30,735 --> 01:19:31,855
They go work for a restaurant.

985
01:19:31,855 --> 01:19:41,775
You could probably reach out to SpaceX, maybe reach out to the AI guys, but no one's going to respond to you.

986
01:19:42,215 --> 01:19:49,115
Unlike Bitcoin community, it's extremely, this is one of the things I was like, wow, everyone's willing to meet with me.

987
01:19:50,115 --> 01:19:51,955
Zero people in five years said no.

988
01:19:53,015 --> 01:19:55,135
That is unheard of.

989
01:19:55,135 --> 01:20:00,775
OK, if you've ever been in another industry, I mean, it takes months, years to get meetings with certain people.

990
01:20:02,635 --> 01:20:04,855
In two years, this will be done.

991
01:20:05,515 --> 01:20:08,655
There won't be any jobs in the Bitcoin industry for newbies.

992
01:20:09,755 --> 01:20:12,855
For people with no experience, we won't need you.

993
01:20:13,015 --> 01:20:18,595
There'll be so much experience around the hoop that you're going to be competing with MBAs by then.

994
01:20:18,595 --> 01:20:25,475
but if you're in and near the hoop right now you're going to be assumed to be an nba you're

995
01:20:25,475 --> 01:20:32,215
going to be called an og and uh don't bitch in two years when this is gone man like guys like me

996
01:20:32,215 --> 01:20:37,535
have been telling you like i know an opportunity when i see it and people should be going why is

997
01:20:37,535 --> 01:20:42,735
that guy like painting and only doing bitcoin and not even going to any of the big meetings

998
01:20:42,735 --> 01:20:46,975
like i've stopped going to the conventions and shit i'm like they're just selling shit

999
01:20:46,975 --> 01:20:51,415
I can meet with everybody and have a dinner that I need to.

1000
01:20:52,455 --> 01:20:56,355
And when I need to, this will not always be available, man.

1001
01:20:56,695 --> 01:20:58,295
Yeah, it's funny you say that.

1002
01:20:58,395 --> 01:20:59,875
Not funny, it's sage.

1003
01:21:00,275 --> 01:21:07,235
Because I was blessed to enter the personal computer industry in the 80s, early to mid-80s.

1004
01:21:07,615 --> 01:21:08,895
And that's exactly how it was.

1005
01:21:08,895 --> 01:21:13,835
And I had an engineering degree and I had something, at least something to offer.

1006
01:21:13,975 --> 01:21:16,075
But I didn't know jack shit about designing a computer.

1007
01:21:16,975 --> 01:21:23,215
Um, but I was able to get somebody to take a chance on me because frankly, there were no other people willing to enter the industry.

1008
01:21:23,855 --> 01:21:26,415
Um, they were, they were dying to attract people.

1009
01:21:26,775 --> 01:21:28,895
10 years later, that was all.

1010
01:21:28,895 --> 01:21:30,535
How many people tell you you were making a mistake?

1011
01:21:30,795 --> 01:21:35,195
Oh, all kinds of people told me I was making a mistake because I had other job offers.

1012
01:21:35,195 --> 01:21:37,115
I had other places I could have gone.

1013
01:21:37,695 --> 01:21:37,895
I don't know.

1014
01:21:37,895 --> 01:21:40,135
Something felt right to me about, about that.

1015
01:21:40,275 --> 01:21:44,755
And, uh, I, I saw, I saw something that was world changing too.

1016
01:21:44,815 --> 01:21:45,755
It wasn't a money thing.

1017
01:21:45,755 --> 01:21:50,315
it was like, this is where the future is. And I was right, right? You know, the personal computer

1018
01:21:50,315 --> 01:21:55,655
ended up being, in my opinion, one of the most important technological developments of all time.

1019
01:21:57,035 --> 01:22:06,555
But Bitcoin is maturing rapidly. And we're very close to, as you said, the cusp, where

1020
01:22:06,555 --> 01:22:15,355
the kids with big educations coming from prestigious schools, or even the guys that are

1021
01:22:15,355 --> 01:22:22,075
on Wall Street today or they're going to want to come work in Bitcoin soon. We're already seeing

1022
01:22:22,075 --> 01:22:34,075
some of them come. So this period of opportunity is just about over. It is a small window left.

1023
01:22:34,435 --> 01:22:40,755
Yeah, Bob, the same thing. Since I was e-commerce in the mid-90s, everybody told me I was an idiot.

1024
01:22:40,755 --> 01:22:46,115
first of all people wouldn't buy stuff on the internet and then people i had no idea who they

1025
01:22:46,115 --> 01:22:51,415
were i was getting emails every time i messed up telling me what i did here was an error here's how

1026
01:22:51,415 --> 01:22:56,035
to correct it and i still don't know who these people were but they were so helpful you know and

1027
01:22:56,035 --> 01:23:01,055
i think that is the way when something new is coming out like you said you both you know someone

1028
01:23:01,055 --> 01:23:06,135
contacts you a dm you answer them you know that's the way something is when it's new that's the way

1029
01:23:06,135 --> 01:23:07,855
podcasting was when it was new.

1030
01:23:08,235 --> 01:23:12,575
You know, I got into that one of the first 15 podcasters all helped each other.

1031
01:23:12,575 --> 01:23:14,175
It was like, you know, let me help you.

1032
01:23:14,175 --> 01:23:15,255
Let me tell you what to do.

1033
01:23:15,655 --> 01:23:19,935
But that stuff ends, you know, in every niche as it gets developed.

1034
01:23:19,993 --> 01:23:22,893
More and more people get into it, it's over and it goes and it goes away.

1035
01:23:23,313 --> 01:23:26,053
You know, and that's where we're at right now in Bitcoin for sure.

1036
01:23:26,173 --> 01:23:28,573
But I agree with you, Gary, that's going to disappear.

1037
01:23:29,133 --> 01:23:33,313
You know, there's a I think there's a very telling sign as to when you reach that point, too.

1038
01:23:33,593 --> 01:23:36,253
I'll tell you guys a story about the personal computer industry.

1039
01:23:37,093 --> 01:23:42,473
So in I think it would have been 86, I went to my very first personal computer conference.

1040
01:23:42,473 --> 01:23:47,153
It was called Comdex held in Vegas every year or maybe four or five thousand people there.

1041
01:23:47,153 --> 01:23:58,453
um a few years later same conference held in november every year 25 000 people in 1998

1042
01:23:58,453 --> 01:24:08,553
225 000 people showed up for one conference like an unimaginable number right um it took over all

1043
01:24:08,553 --> 01:24:13,973
of vegas it wasn't just like at the las vegas convention center every single casino that had a

1044
01:24:13,973 --> 01:24:24,493
showroom had a section for exhibitors. Six years later, the conference was dead. It was defunct.

1045
01:24:25,273 --> 01:24:33,413
So what happened? How does something go from being 225,000 people to nothing? It's not that

1046
01:24:33,413 --> 01:24:41,533
the personal computer became irrelevant. It just became ubiquitous. It had become part of everyday

1047
01:24:41,533 --> 01:24:49,653
life, it was no longer exciting, I guess, to a certain degree, right? And I know this sounds

1048
01:24:49,653 --> 01:24:54,993
kind of funny, given where we are at Bitcoin. At some point, that will happen. Like at this year

1049
01:24:54,993 --> 01:25:01,813
in Las Vegas, Bitcoin was like 25,000 people. It'll probably be bigger this year. It may even

1050
01:25:01,813 --> 01:25:08,593
be bigger the year after. I bet we'll see it reverse. And we're probably a handful of years

1051
01:25:08,593 --> 01:25:14,593
away from it going away now i think there will be a a spot for gary runs a conference called bit

1052
01:25:14,593 --> 01:25:20,533
block boom um but it's a focused conference what do you have normally like 400 people gary yeah

1053
01:25:20,533 --> 01:25:25,573
four to five hundred i think the biggest has been seven i think those kind of things will still exist

1054
01:25:25,573 --> 01:25:31,333
but just like they do in the computing industry you still have these pockets but they're the real

1055
01:25:31,333 --> 01:25:36,213
enthusiasts, the real diehards.

1056
01:25:36,653 --> 01:25:37,993
But everybody else moves on.

1057
01:25:38,113 --> 01:25:45,893
And these conferences, like the ones in Vegas, they cost a lot of money, spend a lot of time.

1058
01:25:45,953 --> 01:25:47,013
You really don't see anybody.

1059
01:25:47,673 --> 01:25:52,553
If you're going to go, go to ones like Gary's, the small ones, where you can actually network

1060
01:25:52,553 --> 01:25:53,793
and interface with people.

1061
01:25:53,793 --> 01:25:55,533
Yeah, I think you're right.

1062
01:25:55,633 --> 01:25:58,333
And the same thing happened in podcasting, for the most part.

1063
01:25:58,333 --> 01:26:03,253
You know, I'm going back to something I mentioned this a minute ago, but when they started, they got huge.

1064
01:26:03,793 --> 01:26:20,411
You know I had a podcasting conference which I had sold off and now it just a mediocre size compared to what it was at one time Cause everybody is knows what a podcast is or everybody that to be into it can get into it easily It not something you really have to go to a conference

1065
01:26:20,411 --> 01:26:22,671
all the way on the other side of the country to learn how to do.

1066
01:26:23,271 --> 01:26:24,651
The tools are so easy.

1067
01:26:25,791 --> 01:26:26,931
It's the same thing.

1068
01:26:28,371 --> 01:26:32,571
Gary, I think maybe this is a good point to kind of maybe wrap things up.

1069
01:26:32,631 --> 01:26:35,191
Do you have any final words you'd like to say?

1070
01:26:35,691 --> 01:26:38,111
When we started this, I talked about a little –

1071
01:26:38,111 --> 01:26:40,611
You know, I think a lot of people in Bitcoin are frustrated.

1072
01:26:43,511 --> 01:26:51,591
And I think I'm frustrated over what I have assumed to be true, but may not be.

1073
01:26:52,271 --> 01:27:01,291
And that is the four-year cycle that everyone relies upon that is this kind of, it's a flag in the sand, man, that everybody looks to.

1074
01:27:01,291 --> 01:27:04,031
I actually just need to challenge the community.

1075
01:27:04,031 --> 01:27:08,371
is there a possibility that this was made up post facto?

1076
01:27:09,511 --> 01:27:13,171
And that it's never really been a thing.

1077
01:27:14,091 --> 01:27:16,851
And that it suited a really cool story.

1078
01:27:17,791 --> 01:27:24,811
But it doesn't really make a lot of sense for the way Satoshi set up the issuance of Bitcoin,

1079
01:27:26,011 --> 01:27:28,371
front loading the volume into the market.

1080
01:27:28,831 --> 01:27:33,311
And then restricting what could be lifted or created out of the market.

1081
01:27:33,311 --> 01:27:46,031
I think this is a very, I understand how you could assume that this narrative makes sense, but in fact, it looks something very different for me.

1082
01:27:46,731 --> 01:27:53,271
Most certainly going forward, I don't see any relevance whatsoever to this so-called four-year cycle.

1083
01:27:54,431 --> 01:27:55,691
And so there's two challenges.

1084
01:27:55,691 --> 01:27:57,631
One, did it really ever exist?

1085
01:27:57,771 --> 01:28:03,151
And two, if you're betting on it in the future, I think that's why you're frustrated.

1086
01:28:03,311 --> 01:28:08,171
right now because you're like hey it didn't do what it was supposed to do and if it did it

1087
01:28:08,171 --> 01:28:14,091
poo-pooed all over itself like it did not do good dude it lost gas lost air boom it's at 92

1088
01:28:14,091 --> 01:28:20,691
you have i think you have to get your head wrapped around that four-year cycle is a narrative

1089
01:28:20,691 --> 01:28:28,091
just like santa claus it's a story man i agree with you i i think i don't think it ever existed

1090
01:28:28,091 --> 01:28:30,371
that would be my

1091
01:28:30,371 --> 01:28:33,071
belief just like Santa never existed

1092
01:28:33,071 --> 01:28:34,851
right I don't think it ever

1093
01:28:34,851 --> 01:28:35,491
existed

1094
01:28:35,491 --> 01:28:38,911
and you know I'm a

1095
01:28:38,911 --> 01:28:40,031
math guy like

1096
01:28:40,031 --> 01:28:42,891
even to the degree we saw

1097
01:28:42,891 --> 01:28:44,931
some reaction three

1098
01:28:44,931 --> 01:28:47,051
times is not

1099
01:28:47,051 --> 01:28:48,831
a relevant pattern I mean that's

1100
01:28:48,831 --> 01:28:50,311
not a pattern that's

1101
01:28:50,311 --> 01:28:52,211
irrelevant

1102
01:28:52,211 --> 01:28:55,131
you at least have to remove the first two cycles

1103
01:28:55,131 --> 01:28:57,031
come on there was no liquidity

1104
01:28:57,031 --> 01:29:02,151
there, man. So I agree. The only relevance of the having is to the guys in my business,

1105
01:29:02,151 --> 01:29:16,729
because as long as we are relying on the subsidy then you better be ready Right So why why do I produce Bitcoin produce Bitcoin Well part of it is I can make more money at it now but I also have to make sure that the

1106
01:29:16,729 --> 01:29:24,789
operation I've set up can survive the next having. If the price of Bitcoin doesn't go up,

1107
01:29:24,949 --> 01:29:30,549
I know the having's coming. So I go, well, I can survive. So beyond that, I don't think it's

1108
01:29:30,549 --> 01:29:38,409
relevant to anybody but just one thing though if you're a miner um you really just care about the

1109
01:29:38,409 --> 01:29:44,069
first four years you're not really like you can shut your mining down and do something else with

1110
01:29:44,069 --> 01:29:50,829
your time and your energy no because i i don't build that way gary i i build because my mentality

1111
01:29:50,829 --> 01:29:56,249
is not bitcoin mining my my mentality is energy production and so i'm building i just want to

1112
01:29:56,249 --> 01:29:57,109
I'll bring that back though.

1113
01:29:57,149 --> 01:29:58,269
See, it's a different driver.

1114
01:29:58,869 --> 01:30:00,889
That's why Bitcoin is going to be so cool

1115
01:30:00,889 --> 01:30:03,449
because you need to find energy producers

1116
01:30:03,449 --> 01:30:03,889
that are going,

1117
01:30:04,049 --> 01:30:06,249
hey, I want to produce into that sinkhole.

1118
01:30:06,709 --> 01:30:06,849
Yeah.

1119
01:30:07,909 --> 01:30:09,489
That's the way you're looking at this.

1120
01:30:09,569 --> 01:30:11,469
You're looking at it differently than a Bitcoin miner.

1121
01:30:11,689 --> 01:30:12,629
Bitcoin miner is going,

1122
01:30:12,769 --> 01:30:13,709
I produce corn.

1123
01:30:14,309 --> 01:30:15,949
All my inputs are fucked up.

1124
01:30:15,949 --> 01:30:17,749
I need to be able to sell corn

1125
01:30:17,749 --> 01:30:19,569
for more than I had all my inputs

1126
01:30:19,569 --> 01:30:23,329
while Bob Burnett's producing at 50 cents on the dollar.

1127
01:30:23,849 --> 01:30:25,989
And by the way, my $50,000...

1128
01:30:26,249 --> 01:30:34,729
That includes engine maintenance, cost of engine rebuilds, and a reserve to replace the servers on a four-year cycle.

1129
01:30:35,489 --> 01:30:40,369
So you're at $30,020.

1130
01:30:40,669 --> 01:30:42,289
Well, you can measure it how you wish.

1131
01:30:42,469 --> 01:30:45,409
I'm saying this is the money I have to put away, right?

1132
01:30:47,709 --> 01:30:51,329
By the way, those reserves are all in Bitcoin, too.

1133
01:30:51,329 --> 01:30:59,309
So if things go well, I don't need all the reserves, right?

1134
01:30:59,449 --> 01:31:00,269
Yeah, of course.

1135
01:31:00,449 --> 01:31:03,449
And then that's a big bonus on the backside.

1136
01:31:03,769 --> 01:31:09,089
But, you know, I need to be careful and make sure that I'm handling that right.

1137
01:31:09,589 --> 01:31:10,749
You're a smart man, Bob.

1138
01:31:12,269 --> 01:31:13,989
Well, I'm just doing my best.

1139
01:31:14,089 --> 01:31:19,129
I think just making hopefully logical decisions about how to construct the business.

1140
01:31:19,129 --> 01:31:32,129
But I see, like I said, I was very critical earlier, and I have been for years, of the public miners because I see very poorly run organizations with massive overheads.

1141
01:31:34,189 --> 01:31:37,969
They've done massive destruction to the ecosystem.

1142
01:31:37,969 --> 01:31:47,169
system um what they have done well is leverage a fiat system that was willing to pour massive

1143
01:31:47,169 --> 01:31:52,469
amounts of capital probably by stupid analysts that we talked about before who really didn't

1144
01:31:52,469 --> 01:31:57,889
know what the fuck they were doing and encourage people to put money into these organizations and

1145
01:31:57,889 --> 01:32:16,206
it caused caused an overbuild of hash rate um and it actually flushed out in in hard times like in the bear of 2022 and 2023 it flushed out some guys who were well pretty good business people who just didn have

1146
01:32:16,206 --> 01:32:23,046
the capital resources to sustain through the difficult period. So anyway, I have a lot of

1147
01:32:23,046 --> 01:32:30,826
angst toward them. But, you know, I said, it'll all flush out. I think the future, as you've said,

1148
01:32:31,486 --> 01:32:37,306
Gary, and it's, you know, the way my business is, is there will be tens of thousands of these. I

1149
01:32:37,306 --> 01:32:42,246
call them horse class sites. I have a name for it, which you're going to see half a megawatt,

1150
01:32:42,326 --> 01:32:46,826
one megawatt, three megawatt, five megawatt sites all over the world. Anywhere there's energy,

1151
01:32:46,826 --> 01:32:53,726
a lot of gas, a lot of oil, there's wind, there's cow manure, there's all kinds of things that we can

1152
01:32:53,726 --> 01:33:02,566
utilize. And that is, I think, the greatest hope for a decentralized mining network, by the way,

1153
01:33:02,626 --> 01:33:08,266
too. Oh, it's the only hope. See, if you didn't have that, you would never get there. You'd only

1154
01:33:08,266 --> 01:33:16,646
get to what we have with AI and Visa, MasterCard, and with social media. 72% of all three of those

1155
01:33:16,646 --> 01:33:21,326
industries are controlled by two companies. Whereas this will never happen the way we're,

1156
01:33:21,726 --> 01:33:29,546
see, this is very, very different because you can't EQT can only control EQT is a very large

1157
01:33:29,546 --> 01:33:37,706
player in Pennsylvania, in the Marcella shell. They can only control so many of these free units

1158
01:33:37,706 --> 01:33:45,386
of energy that are floating around. It's a very, it's like a puzzle, massive puzzle. And if the

1159
01:33:45,386 --> 01:33:46,946
Energy isn't in the right place.

1160
01:33:47,366 --> 01:33:48,666
It has no home.

1161
01:33:48,906 --> 01:33:49,026
Yeah.

1162
01:33:49,226 --> 01:33:50,666
And that's what Bob's looking for.

1163
01:33:51,046 --> 01:33:52,546
Well, I think it's a great time to wrap.

1164
01:33:52,886 --> 01:33:53,566
Thank you, guys.

1165
01:33:53,946 --> 01:33:54,546
Thank you, Gary.

1166
01:33:54,926 --> 01:33:55,926
Nice talking with you, Gary.

1167
01:33:56,666 --> 01:33:57,186
Thank you, man.

1168
01:33:57,706 --> 01:33:58,286
Hey, you.

1169
01:33:58,646 --> 01:34:03,326
Yes, you watching the Bitcoin price movements and the latest exciting news.

1170
01:34:03,786 --> 01:34:08,826
It's awesome to stay informed, but the real power of Bitcoin comes from taking control.

1171
01:34:09,266 --> 01:34:10,246
Don't just watch.

1172
01:34:10,246 --> 01:34:11,226
Take action.

1173
01:34:11,226 --> 01:34:20,966
Head over to btc sessions.ca slash learn for free step by step tutorials that guide you through every major skill you need to know.

1174
01:34:21,126 --> 01:34:25,406
Plus, full video playlists for deeper dives on any topic you like.

1175
01:34:25,826 --> 01:34:39,826
And if you're ready for the ultimate fast track, scroll to the bottom and check out BitcoinMentor.io for premium one on one experience with my team of Bitcoin experts to ensure you get it right the first time.

1176
01:34:39,826 --> 01:34:47,106
Don't wait. Secure your Bitcoin future today. Hit the link in the show notes or scan the QR code on the screen.