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Welcome to Local Bitcoiners, a podcast about Bitcoin meetups.

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In this episode, Reid and Rev talk about their meetups, AI, and the Mesh to Dell.

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Welcome back to Local Bitcoiners.

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Rev Hodel here.

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I'm here with my co-host, Reid.

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And we don't have a guest tonight, so we're just going to talk Bitcoin meetups and see

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where we go. But we like to start the beginning of the podcast off kind of going over some stories

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from the meetups that we've attended recently or talk about our most recent meetup or show the

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upcoming meetup. And so since the last recording, I have been to several meetups. But the coolest

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one in the most recent one that I was at was in Grand Rapids. The Grand Rapids meetup has

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switched from their founder's location for their social meetup to this brewery.

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I believe it's called Two Guys Brewery.

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And it's a pretty cool place.

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There was good food, pretty good turnout.

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And I finally had something other than a Bitcoin mining space heater to show up with

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to share with the group.

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And that was my Bitcoin-assisted maple syrup.

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I use Bitcoin miners to help me make this maple syrup.

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I produce here at the homestead.

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And so I had that with me.

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I did have a miner with me as well

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and sold the miner, sold some of the syrup.

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And I was also able to buy some cookies

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and cupcakes and stuff.

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There was a woman there selling some baked goods,

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which was cool.

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And it's really fun when you go to these social meetups

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at the bar or whatever.

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And people are kind of busting out stuff out of their bag

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and there's this exchange is happening.

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And you don't necessarily draw a lot of attention from other people in the place, but it just feels cool like, hey, we're in this place and we're taking it over and we're doing our own thing here.

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And so a lot of the discussion in that meetup was around AI.

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I think AI has really taken a big, prominent part of the discussion in the Bitcoin culture and community lately with OpenClaw and these advancements with Clawed and Vibe coding and everything.

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So we just couldn't help ourselves but spend a lot of the time talking about that.

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But tomorrow I am going to be going to the Chicago BitDevs meetup.

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And I'm sure that we will not talk about AI nearly as much because that's focused more on the technical developments of Bitcoin Core and everything like that.

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But Reid, how was your meetup experiences since we've last talked?

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Yeah, so I have been to no meetups since we last talked, which I think was just about a couple weeks ago.

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I love hearing, you know, it's incredible that you have so many meetups that are taking place so close to you.

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Yeah, I don't know.

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I like hearing the stories and I'm always so impressed with the, you know, these communities of people that come together and actually have goods to bring and share and sell.

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And, you know, using Bitcoin as money is like the thing.

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I feel like that's like, you know, if you're going to go around promoting Bitcoin as something,

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we should be promoting it as money.

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And I mean, that's what you're supposed to use money for.

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So I don't know.

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I love to hear it.

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And I think we've gotten some other pretty good feedback hearing about your halls you

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always walk away with from all these meetups.

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So yeah, so I haven't been to a meetup since, but our meetup's coming up this weekend.

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And so Western Mass, this is our, we meeting at our normal spot at Peppa's Pizza in East Longmeadow.

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It'll be Sunday, March 15th.

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And we, I'm still getting prepared for it a little bit, but I did, I picked our two.

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I usually cover one technical topic and one Bitcoin history topic.

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Those two things got a little bit blended this time because at our last meetup, it wasn't something I really was super looking forward to talk about.

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But last meetup, we talked a lot about BIP-110.

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That was like on everybody's mind.

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And I got a bunch of people asking questions about it beforehand.

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So we talked about BIP-110.

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So this month, we're doing a history of Taproot.

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And there was a couple of points I want to make.

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Like the reason why I wanted to cover a history of Taproot, especially in the wake of talking about BIP-110, like I sort of want like a lot of the people there, you know, they weren't around when Taproot or don't remember or weren't plugged in or weren't paying close enough attention when Taproot got activated.

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But it was it was two years between when it got a BIP number and when it got activated.

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And that was for like, it was like the least controversial like soft fork for Bitcoin.

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In fact, it had 99.7% of miners signaling.

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99.7.

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So this talk of like, oh, we need 55% miners, like this is nothing compared to how overwhelmingly supported Taproot was.

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and you know when before it got activated or leading up to its activation some of the points

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that I remember we were promised things like more private and more efficient lightning channel opens

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we were promised more private and and more economical multi-sig transactions those are

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things that I think are starting to come around now but this is years and years and years after

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the fact um and so what did we actually get like we got a whole bunch of slop like added to the

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blockchain and so the whole point the the underlying point i want to make with the covering taproot

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is just can we just be humble like can we all just admit that we don't actually know what's

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going to happen like after we decide all together to change bitcoin even we're all positive it's all

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going to be rainbows and sunshine and all this great stuff like can we just like take a step back

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and realize we don't actually know what's going to happen and it just takes a while for all that to

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to work itself out so I don't know I'm looking forward to it I think it's going to be a good

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discussion I think a lot of people in my meetup at least aren't going to know a lot of those things

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so um then there'll be some other stuff we cover too some new stuff that I haven't actually prepped

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for yet but um i think it's gonna be a good i think it's gonna be a good meetup i'm looking

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forward to it yeah with the taproot stuff man i feel like um it just takes time for people to

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to write the code and maybe well and you know this vibe coding stuff it's not safe to i wouldn't

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consider it be safe to like be using for this sensitive stuff like money and long you know

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Bitcoin transactions and lightning splicing and all that stuff.

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But I mean, Async did get that channel splicing integrated.

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And that's been a lot better.

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That's upgraded my experience using Phoenix.

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And I think that the, you know, I'm not an expert,

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but I think that the Frost multi-sig stuff was enabled by Taproot

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and the Miniscript stuff as well, right?

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I'm not sure because Taproot has TapScript

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and I'm not a technical enough guy to know

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if the difference is between TapScript and Miniscript.

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I think Miniscript might have been around,

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but I'm not positive about that.

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I guess the point is,

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regardless of exactly what has been taken advantage of

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via the Taproot soft fork,

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it takes some time for people to develop the the tool and then it also takes time for people to

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find it and start using it and for it to gain you know traction and so it's very easy for all

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that work to get overshadowed when um somebody well this well Casey Rodemore you know had this

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this ordinal's idea and it it was very quickly um there was a lot of excitement around it and so

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people started using it a lot and it overshadowed all this other stuff that taproot enabled and makes

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it seem like taproot was a bad idea but i think if we're patient we're going to find that all of

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the fruits of taproot will be continuously it what it has to offer is going to continuously show up

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there's a lot more that it can do that we haven't even explored yet.

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Yeah, no, I totally agree.

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Yeah, and I'm not trying to be a Taproot bear here.

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I'm mostly just trying to point out that for a software

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that had such an overwhelming support,

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like the biggest debate during Taproot was like the activation method.

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And it was like, you know, how bold can we be?

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Like no one disagrees with this.

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So, you know, what type of activation method can we actually go with here?

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And so, you know, we touch on that a little bit.

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But, you know, the point is, is that anytime you make a change to Bitcoin, like everything changes coming out the other side.

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Like that's one of the big things about Bitcoin that is such an improvement over like this fiat system that we're in today is that the fiat system, they just change the rules all the time.

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you know as soon as something starts going against the you know let's call them the elite or the

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powerful or whatever they just change the rules you know and so anytime you can just change the

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rules willy-nilly you know the whole economy has to shift after the rule change like everything

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about the way that money works has to change after the money changes and so with bitcoin it's always

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been like, don't change the money. Just leave it alone. And please don't take it like I'm saying,

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we shouldn't, you know, maintain Bitcoin. Obviously, it should be maintained. And there

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are changes that are going to need to be made. But I'm just saying like the underlying properties,

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I think we should be as conservative as we can with how this thing goes. And so yeah,

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so I guess that's the those are some of the key takeaways that I'm that I'm going for at this

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meetup. We'll see. I mean, it's a Socratic seminar, so, you know, we'll be, I'm sure we'll

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be fielding a lot of questions. We had some really good interaction and debate at the last meetup,

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and I'm hoping that continues into this one. So, oh, and actually, you know what? So the other,

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I, I, that's our Bitcoin history topic. We're also going to talk about Spark a little bit,

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which I don't know, I am sort of getting a little bit more excited for now.

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I remember when it got sort of like announced a little bit like oh hey this is going to become

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a thing but it's always different when you start to see it get implemented you know and it kind of

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hit my radar again when you know it got integrated into CakeWallet recently and so you know got to

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listen to Seth for Privacy talking about that a little bit I actually didn't even realize that

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it was already in while at Astoshi. That's pretty cool. And then I saw the Daniel on Noster. He

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vibe coded or something. He came up with a really quick lightning wallet like PWA that you can just

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spin up almost instantly. And it gets you a wallet that you can use for whatever temporary or

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whatever. And that uses Spark. So I don't know. It seems like it could be kind of interesting.

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I actually haven't dug into it too much yet, but interested to learn.

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Yeah, the more options we have for how we can use our Bitcoin, the better.

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You know, it's everywhere, trade-offs, trade-offs, trade-offs.

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But if there's the more choices you have and the more trade-offs you can make

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to tailor your usage of Bitcoin to exactly what you need,

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the better off you're going to be.

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it's it's really just about take being taking thoughtful and slow steps towards

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integrating new things into your stack um i'm not very quick to

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like this mini bits e-cash wallet that i've been using for no stir um i started off man i would

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use like i would have like 5k sats in there and i'm like this is all i they rugged me they're

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only going to get my 5k sats and i'll get to play around with this this and that was at the time i

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was really looking for a nostril wallet connect um wallet and that seemed to be one of the easier

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ones to use um and it's been good but then i'm glad i didn't like lean into it so hard because

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here comes zeus a few like a month or two ago with their nostril wallet connecting and i'm like

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well, now I finally have a good reason to start to play with Zeus

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so I can get off Phoenix.

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And then Zeus Wallet can be a wallet that I use for my transactions at the meetups

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and I can use it for my Noster stuff.

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And so I'm excited to just try Zeus.

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But obviously when I start to switch over to Zeus,

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I'm certainly not going to just immediately close my nice fat Phoenix Wallet channel.

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I want to keep that available as well.

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And so as time goes on, even existing wallets, they get better and better.

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I mean, Cake adding Lightning, I mean, it's crazy to me that Cake hasn't had Lightning all this time.

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So it's a successional process, you know.

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Yeah, I feel like Bitcoin wallets, it all gets so personal, in my opinion,

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because everybody uses Bitcoin differently.

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You know, like if you're a merchant

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and so let's say you're receiving a lot of stats,

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well, it's hard to use Lightning

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when you're receiving a lot,

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like if you're receiving more Bitcoin than you're spending

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because, you know, you got to keep opening up more liquidity,

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you know, or dumping like the stats somewhere.

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Like you can't just accumulate in a Lightning wallet forever.

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And so, you know, and people who use Noster,

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like that's got its own whole set of things, right?

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Like Phoenix doesn't work for that, you know?

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And so there's all kinds of different, like weird,

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like intricacies that you just,

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it just feels very personal,

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like how you decide what your final implementation is.

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And of course it's changing constantly

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because new stuff keeps coming out.

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But that's why we go to the meetups, right?

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We go to the meetups to find out

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what other people are doing.

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and as new wallets come out and new features come out,

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we like to talk about them because, hey,

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maybe it's going to work for somebody else

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or maybe it's going to work for you.

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So yeah, looking forward to the meetup this weekend.

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So I sort of want to take this opportunity to pivot a little bit

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because this is the first meetup coming up

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that I am starting to use AI to help me prepare for the meetups.

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and I'm not going to lie so far it has not been faster it has been slower

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I think the final product is it's probably an improvement like my slides and stuff I think look

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a lot nicer but I'm also sort of figuring out the flow you know like I tried one thing it wasn't

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really working and so we switched I switched to something else that was like a little bit easier

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But so I do feel optimistic about using AI to help me prepare.

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But I've been sort of coming at like, especially over the last few weeks, like I've, you know, I'm not going to lie.

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And you can go check my nostril notes to confirm this.

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Like I've been a little bit of an AI bear.

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I'm not going to lie.

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Like I've been like, I don't know if I'm like buying the hype.

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and and for me it wasn't i i totally get the fact that it's like an extremely powerful tool

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i'm not saying it's not gonna change the world i'm not saying it's not gonna have a huge impact

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i'm saying for like the plebs for the pioneers or whatever like for those of us who are just like

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right you know we're not build like we're not developers you know we're not running software

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companies. We're just hanging out and running Bitcoin meetups and doing what we do here.

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This stuff is expensive. You know, you listen to the stories and everyone's like, wow, my

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thing is so cool. I've got it tracking all the prediction markets and pulling all this

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data together for me and going through backlogs of podcasts. And yeah, and it's, oh yeah,

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it's costing me like a thousand dollars a month, but it's so cool. It's like, whoa, whoa, whoa,

215
00:17:47,040 --> 00:17:53,840
pump the brakes. How much did you say? Like, are you really getting? And so this is my thinking was,

216
00:17:53,840 --> 00:17:58,860
are you really getting a thousand dollars a month worth of value out of this thing? Or is it just

217
00:17:58,860 --> 00:18:04,120
like, you know, pretty cool? Because, you know, I don't know if I'm buying like pretty, it's pretty

218
00:18:04,120 --> 00:18:07,960
cool. I don't know if that's quite enough. Like maybe I think that you're going to have to get a

219
00:18:07,960 --> 00:18:17,700
better than pretty cool. But I eventually sort of caved. And really what I did was I wanted to

220
00:18:18,260 --> 00:18:27,760
wade in very slowly, mostly financially slowly. So I did get like a Claude.ai, like the Anthropic.

221
00:18:28,300 --> 00:18:33,920
It's 20 bucks a month, which wasn't, you know, it didn't seem like crazily expensive

222
00:18:33,920 --> 00:18:36,340
compared to some of the other ones.

223
00:18:37,180 --> 00:18:39,180
And I was able to do some pretty cool stuff.

224
00:18:39,680 --> 00:18:41,260
Again, pretty cool.

225
00:18:42,160 --> 00:18:46,360
Not anything, it's not like it's going to make me a bunch of money or something.

226
00:18:46,460 --> 00:18:47,220
It was just pretty cool.

227
00:18:47,920 --> 00:18:49,700
Did a project with one of my book clubs,

228
00:18:50,320 --> 00:18:52,960
doing like pulling stuff, pulling data out of the government,

229
00:18:54,420 --> 00:18:56,600
stockpiles, wherever they have all this stuff.

230
00:18:58,300 --> 00:19:00,440
We were reading the fourth turning.

231
00:19:00,440 --> 00:19:13,060
And so I ended up pulling all this government data on and doing this whole little, I guess, presentation type of thing on how the generations have shaped like politics going back to like 1900.

232
00:19:13,960 --> 00:19:15,220
So that was pretty cool.

233
00:19:15,480 --> 00:19:16,880
A kind of little fun little project.

234
00:19:17,940 --> 00:19:19,660
But, you know, it took a bunch of time.

235
00:19:19,660 --> 00:19:28,400
but that kind of turned me on to how good it was at like doing html and doing like this front-end

236
00:19:28,400 --> 00:19:33,160
design work which is kind of what gave me the idea to start using them for my bitcoin slides

237
00:19:33,160 --> 00:19:39,220
i was like you know this thing is pretty good i can just kind of give it hey can you go do a

238
00:19:39,220 --> 00:19:45,040
little bit of research for me and put together a chart of like how all this stuff actually works and

239
00:19:45,040 --> 00:19:52,820
pull some data. So like for my Taproot slides, you know, I had it pull like it's using,

240
00:19:53,540 --> 00:19:58,900
like I wanted to know how did the fees change over time and how did the block data change over time?

241
00:19:59,060 --> 00:20:05,060
So it's got charts in there of like bar charts and stuff of how it changed like before and after

242
00:20:05,060 --> 00:20:10,540
Taproot. Like I didn't have to go and dig up all that data and I didn't have to go put it in,

243
00:20:10,540 --> 00:20:13,160
I don't know, Excel or however I would put it together.

244
00:20:13,560 --> 00:20:15,080
And it looks a lot nicer than I could do.

245
00:20:15,980 --> 00:20:21,160
So that's how I sort of started wading in to the AI stuff.

246
00:20:23,220 --> 00:20:26,700
Yeah, there's like this permaculture principle

247
00:20:26,700 --> 00:20:29,640
that I think kind of rings true here.

248
00:20:30,140 --> 00:20:33,200
And a lot of what we've talked about so far already is like,

249
00:20:33,740 --> 00:20:36,160
and it's called slow and small solutions.

250
00:20:36,160 --> 00:20:58,100
And so with Bitcoin, when we want to fork, do soft forks and do all this stuff, it's better to just start small, make small changes and take a long time thinking about it and talking about it before we decide to implement it or each individual, each miner or whatever decides to adopt it.

251
00:20:58,100 --> 00:21:13,602
And then when new Bitcoin wallets come out and new feature new like eCash and all this stuff it like start using eCash a little bit and learn about it and work with it small and slow And this AI stuff you can see the example of the people

252
00:21:13,602 --> 00:21:19,902
who have gone big and fast and they ended up spending thousands of dollars

253
00:21:19,902 --> 00:21:25,282
because they didn't necessarily realize that this little Claude bot

254
00:21:25,282 --> 00:21:31,162
could gobble up so many tokens on such simple tasks if you're not careful.

255
00:21:31,642 --> 00:21:38,602
and so small and slow solutions seems to be like in this ever-changing and fast-paced

256
00:21:38,602 --> 00:21:45,542
development world now it's it's good to step back and just observe it for a while think about how

257
00:21:45,542 --> 00:21:51,662
you want to step in and step in slowly I think there is this feeling especially when it comes

258
00:21:51,662 --> 00:21:57,102
to the AI stuff if I don't learn about this now and don't do everything I can I'm going to get

259
00:21:57,102 --> 00:22:03,122
left behind. But at the same time, like I've been kind of chilling back waiting because I feel like

260
00:22:03,122 --> 00:22:09,762
to the point of the money and everything, like I'm not going to have to spend the tokens in the

261
00:22:09,762 --> 00:22:13,982
learning process. I'll let other people make those mistakes and I'll learn from them. And then I'll

262
00:22:13,982 --> 00:22:19,562
jump in once there's some more best practices around how to use these tools in order to do it

263
00:22:19,562 --> 00:22:27,102
efficiently. Yeah. So, you know, efficiency. So that's what I started to learn right away

264
00:22:27,102 --> 00:22:33,522
was I don't exact. Oh, I know it was on that do pulling the government data and stuff like that.

265
00:22:33,602 --> 00:22:38,702
That was like one of the first things I tried to like use the claw thing for or not claw. Sorry.

266
00:22:38,842 --> 00:22:43,902
That's different thing. The like just the clawed AI just like on the website or whatever, you know,

267
00:22:43,902 --> 00:22:46,322
not an agent running around doing stuff for me yet.

268
00:22:48,262 --> 00:22:53,302
And so it was all of a sudden absolutely ripping through my usage.

269
00:22:53,582 --> 00:22:57,002
Like there's a little usage meter, like to tell you like how much you use.

270
00:22:57,402 --> 00:22:59,562
I'm like, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa.

271
00:22:59,982 --> 00:23:02,062
Like maybe I need to start thinking about how,

272
00:23:02,222 --> 00:23:05,742
because I like ran out like in the first session or whatever.

273
00:23:06,042 --> 00:23:10,162
And so I was like, okay, well, I guess I'm taking a four hour break

274
00:23:10,162 --> 00:23:12,722
while my like usage thing resets.

275
00:23:12,722 --> 00:23:15,082
which wasn't the worst thing in the world.

276
00:23:15,242 --> 00:23:17,422
I mean, get a four-hour break from a project,

277
00:23:17,602 --> 00:23:18,722
that's, you know, it's okay.

278
00:23:20,842 --> 00:23:24,042
So then I started paying way closer attention.

279
00:23:24,582 --> 00:23:26,722
And in fact, when the next session started up,

280
00:23:26,722 --> 00:23:30,482
I decided to start asking the AI about token usage.

281
00:23:31,122 --> 00:23:32,642
I'm like, what happened?

282
00:23:33,422 --> 00:23:34,762
You know, can you like explain to me,

283
00:23:34,782 --> 00:23:35,922
like how do I limit this

284
00:23:35,922 --> 00:23:38,262
so I don't blow through my tokens like so quickly?

285
00:23:39,182 --> 00:23:41,142
And so then everything kind of came

286
00:23:41,142 --> 00:23:42,342
and then I started getting,

287
00:23:42,342 --> 00:23:46,602
okay, there are some like best practices here for like how to use this like a little bit more

288
00:23:46,602 --> 00:23:54,082
efficiently. And it's like, hey, how about instead of you going and pulling all of this data and

289
00:23:54,082 --> 00:23:59,962
trying to compile it yourself, how about you just write me a Python script and I'll run it on my

290
00:23:59,962 --> 00:24:04,242
computer and I'll just give you the output. And then that way you don't have to comb through all

291
00:24:04,242 --> 00:24:09,562
this stuff. You just write me a script, I'll run it and I'll give you the output. And then that

292
00:24:09,562 --> 00:24:12,042
was really, we started saving a lot.

293
00:24:12,982 --> 00:24:14,242
When all I just had to do,

294
00:24:14,362 --> 00:24:15,762
and I didn't know how to do all this stuff,

295
00:24:15,842 --> 00:24:18,522
I'm just like, how do you run a Python script?

296
00:24:18,662 --> 00:24:19,942
And they're like, oh, you just do this.

297
00:24:20,422 --> 00:24:22,922
And I'm like, oh, well, I didn't know that before

298
00:24:22,922 --> 00:24:24,162
and now I know.

299
00:24:24,722 --> 00:24:26,982
And so now I can, yes,

300
00:24:27,122 --> 00:24:30,142
now I can effectively copy and paste into the terminal.

301
00:24:30,922 --> 00:24:32,122
It's not the end of the world.

302
00:24:32,542 --> 00:24:33,142
Who knew?

303
00:24:37,602 --> 00:24:39,122
So it's like a fast track.

304
00:24:39,562 --> 00:24:50,042
Yeah, you can even ask it to help explain to you how to use it better for what you're doing.

305
00:24:51,002 --> 00:24:54,482
And asking those questions probably doesn't cost very many tokens.

306
00:24:55,382 --> 00:24:55,602
Right.

307
00:24:55,602 --> 00:25:03,122
And so spending a little bit more time just getting to know the system will save you in the long run.

308
00:25:03,482 --> 00:25:04,782
I'm taking notes, man.

309
00:25:05,282 --> 00:25:08,562
I'm surely going to do something with it here in the future.

310
00:25:08,562 --> 00:25:12,122
but don't quite know exactly what yet.

311
00:25:12,702 --> 00:25:16,902
I just, this vibe coding stuff is so cool to me

312
00:25:16,902 --> 00:25:20,382
because when Noster first came out

313
00:25:20,382 --> 00:25:23,182
and I started to think about what the implications were

314
00:25:23,182 --> 00:25:24,782
of like anyone can run a relay

315
00:25:24,782 --> 00:25:28,062
and all these clients are open source

316
00:25:28,062 --> 00:25:33,442
and so effectively you can like create these closed ecosystems

317
00:25:33,442 --> 00:25:36,462
of the siloed into particular relays

318
00:25:36,462 --> 00:25:38,882
that maybe a local community are running or whatever,

319
00:25:39,162 --> 00:25:44,102
and then fork the client so that you can adjust it

320
00:25:44,102 --> 00:25:47,042
to match whatever you would need for that local community.

321
00:25:48,422 --> 00:25:50,822
And I was thinking that was going to take years.

322
00:25:50,942 --> 00:25:52,122
I mean, it's been a few years,

323
00:25:52,282 --> 00:25:56,542
but it seems like now there's all these very specialized clients

324
00:25:56,542 --> 00:25:59,182
coming up for these very niche uses,

325
00:25:59,662 --> 00:26:04,722
and people are vibe coding all these really very particular Noster apps.

326
00:26:04,722 --> 00:26:06,862
and here we are.

327
00:26:06,962 --> 00:26:09,502
It's like you're going to be able to use,

328
00:26:10,182 --> 00:26:13,762
you're going to have a Noster app to do anything you want

329
00:26:13,762 --> 00:26:18,302
and the development process is quick now.

330
00:26:21,362 --> 00:26:24,642
So I had, this is, I do want to,

331
00:26:25,162 --> 00:26:28,122
maybe I'll just, I'll skip to it now

332
00:26:28,122 --> 00:26:29,902
because that was kind of a good segue, right?

333
00:26:30,582 --> 00:26:34,642
So Noster is one of the things that was immediately on my mind.

334
00:26:34,722 --> 00:26:47,302
That this is obviously, if I'm going to do some sort of vibe coded project, like it's going to be on Oster because it's the thing that you can just plug into, you know, like it's going to be, all this stuff is all open source.

335
00:26:47,702 --> 00:26:52,822
So there's a million repos out there to learn from, and you could just plug into the protocol.

336
00:26:52,922 --> 00:26:54,442
You don't need permission, right?

337
00:26:54,522 --> 00:26:58,442
There's no, you know, you just hit the relays and you're good to go.

338
00:26:58,442 --> 00:27:05,362
um and so you know you you know you're bringing up special building specialized communities and

339
00:27:05,362 --> 00:27:09,922
stuff like that and so this idea that you know i had talked to actually i had mentioned it to you

340
00:27:09,922 --> 00:27:16,462
a little bit because um you know i started to learn more about these circular economies and

341
00:27:16,462 --> 00:27:21,282
stuff that you're running and you know we're starting to be in a lot more of the same telegram

342
00:27:21,282 --> 00:27:26,242
groups and you know i get to watch you drop these messages into the chats all the time about

343
00:27:26,242 --> 00:27:30,762
hey I'm coming here I'm going there here's the stuff I'm going to bring you know let me know if

344
00:27:30,762 --> 00:27:42,202
you're interested and you know I have sold stuff as well like one of like early on in in I mean it

345
00:27:42,202 --> 00:27:49,322
wasn't that early on like back in let's say like 2021 I got a laser engraver and just started

346
00:27:49,322 --> 00:27:55,962
making stuff with Bitcoin on it you know it wasn't I wouldn't call it art necessarily it's just it's

347
00:27:55,962 --> 00:28:00,802
fun stuff that people thought was kind of cool. And it was a cool way for me to like bring in some

348
00:28:00,802 --> 00:28:06,322
sets. Um, you know, and then I was certain, I was able to pay for the whole laser engraver that I

349
00:28:06,322 --> 00:28:12,802
bought, which was pretty neat. Um, and got to learn a whole new skill and that was fun. Um,

350
00:28:12,922 --> 00:28:19,222
and so I have also like, I bring stuff to my meetups to sell and that's like tailed off a

351
00:28:19,222 --> 00:28:22,922
little bit because I sort of sold stuff to everybody who comes like all the regulars.

352
00:28:22,922 --> 00:28:30,822
but yeah so you know as we started talking I started thinking more about well it sure would

353
00:28:30,822 --> 00:28:37,202
be nice if rather than dropping you know random things into the group chats if we just had a place

354
00:28:37,202 --> 00:28:43,362
for our meetup that people could just post stuff that hey I have all this stuff if you want me to

355
00:28:43,362 --> 00:28:48,302
bring it to the meetup I'll just bring it you know like you know nothing big this doesn't have

356
00:28:48,302 --> 00:28:54,582
to be like a big online sales platform or something like that. Just like, Hey, I have this stuff for

357
00:28:54,582 --> 00:28:58,162
sale. And if you want it, just let me know. I'll bring it to the meetup. We don't have to do

358
00:28:58,162 --> 00:29:01,942
payments over the app. We don't have to do shipping. We don't have, it's not like Facebook

359
00:29:01,942 --> 00:29:07,782
marketplace, right? Where you have to like organize like a meetup time and figure out if it's going to

360
00:29:07,782 --> 00:29:13,322
be some sketchy person coming to your house, or if you're going to go meet them somewhere else, or

361
00:29:13,322 --> 00:29:15,742
lots of scammers in the chat

362
00:29:15,742 --> 00:29:16,682
that you have no idea

363
00:29:16,682 --> 00:29:18,662
like where they're coming from

364
00:29:18,662 --> 00:29:19,102
or whatever.

365
00:29:21,382 --> 00:29:22,642
If it's your meetup group,

366
00:29:23,002 --> 00:29:24,282
you're all going to be

367
00:29:24,282 --> 00:29:25,182
in the same place anyway.

368
00:29:25,542 --> 00:29:26,922
You already all know each other.

369
00:29:27,802 --> 00:29:29,142
And so like how hard is it

370
00:29:29,142 --> 00:29:30,242
to just go like I have

371
00:29:30,242 --> 00:29:31,322
a couple of things in my office

372
00:29:31,322 --> 00:29:31,942
that it's like,

373
00:29:32,302 --> 00:29:34,142
you know, I'm not going to sell this

374
00:29:34,142 --> 00:29:35,302
on Facebook Marketplace,

375
00:29:35,842 --> 00:29:37,122
but I can bring it to the meetup.

376
00:29:37,302 --> 00:29:38,142
If somebody wants this,

377
00:29:38,262 --> 00:29:39,022
I would, yeah,

378
00:29:39,322 --> 00:29:40,562
like five, ten bucks.

379
00:29:40,622 --> 00:29:41,002
Who cares?

380
00:29:41,642 --> 00:29:42,942
Sure, I'll bring it to the meetup.

381
00:29:43,322 --> 00:29:45,542
I'm certainly not going to take the time to do that otherwise.

382
00:29:45,762 --> 00:29:48,142
So if anybody's interested, just let me know.

383
00:29:49,302 --> 00:29:50,602
And so that was kind of the idea.

384
00:29:51,162 --> 00:29:58,442
Like, could I make a Nostra app that was a marketplace that was private and local?

385
00:29:59,362 --> 00:30:04,282
And so, you know, I started messing around with Shakespeare, Shakespeare.diy,

386
00:30:04,482 --> 00:30:08,862
because that is like, I guess, the place you go to Vibecode Nostra apps.

387
00:30:08,862 --> 00:30:16,402
and I knew about Flotilla, which is for private groups.

388
00:30:16,922 --> 00:30:21,242
And I said, I want a private group experience like Flotilla,

389
00:30:21,562 --> 00:30:22,562
but for a marketplace.

390
00:30:23,402 --> 00:30:25,782
And started kind of hacking around with it a little bit.

391
00:30:27,962 --> 00:30:33,742
And I quickly found out it is much more costly to use that kind of stuff

392
00:30:33,742 --> 00:30:38,382
than it is to use the $20 a month Anthropic subscription.

393
00:30:38,862 --> 00:30:42,302
So it was a fun experience.

394
00:30:43,122 --> 00:30:46,342
I have what I would consider to be like a working,

395
00:30:46,802 --> 00:30:49,882
like minimum viable product, like a working MVP,

396
00:30:50,082 --> 00:30:50,782
which is pretty cool.

397
00:30:51,482 --> 00:30:54,222
I'm going to show it to some of the guys at the meetup this weekend

398
00:30:54,222 --> 00:30:55,922
and like see if we can get it to work.

399
00:30:56,082 --> 00:31:00,422
But the idea is you just, all it is is it's a PWA.

400
00:31:00,742 --> 00:31:01,862
You open it on your phone.

401
00:31:02,682 --> 00:31:05,882
I'll bring, I can, you scan a QR code from my phone

402
00:31:05,882 --> 00:31:08,962
that gives you access to my relay at my house.

403
00:31:09,462 --> 00:31:10,802
It never hits the internet.

404
00:31:11,102 --> 00:31:12,422
It never goes anywhere public.

405
00:31:12,842 --> 00:31:15,362
It's a truly private little marketplace.

406
00:31:17,082 --> 00:31:20,142
So yeah, so that's what I've been

407
00:31:20,142 --> 00:31:21,922
sort of working on most recently.

408
00:31:23,382 --> 00:31:25,882
I'm kind of planning on taking a little bit of a break.

409
00:31:27,102 --> 00:31:29,622
Full transparency, this app,

410
00:31:30,022 --> 00:31:32,202
like going back and forth with the Shakespeare thing

411
00:31:32,202 --> 00:31:35,102
for, I don't know, a few solid sessions.

412
00:31:35,102 --> 00:31:37,742
like ran me up like 120 bucks.

413
00:31:39,082 --> 00:31:41,902
So, you know, full disclosure, right?

414
00:31:41,982 --> 00:31:43,942
It's not super cheap,

415
00:31:44,262 --> 00:31:45,262
but at the same time,

416
00:31:45,302 --> 00:31:46,422
it's like how much would it cost

417
00:31:46,422 --> 00:31:48,382
if this was a couple of years ago, right?

418
00:31:48,782 --> 00:31:50,322
How much would it have cost me

419
00:31:50,322 --> 00:31:51,722
to go hire a developer

420
00:31:51,722 --> 00:31:54,022
to make me this custom app?

421
00:31:54,742 --> 00:31:55,742
It would have been insane.

422
00:31:55,862 --> 00:31:56,522
Like, I don't know how much,

423
00:31:56,662 --> 00:31:57,862
like thousands of dollars.

424
00:31:58,982 --> 00:32:01,182
So, I don't know.

425
00:32:01,262 --> 00:32:02,602
It lowers the barrier of entry

426
00:32:02,602 --> 00:32:04,362
to just try new ideas.

427
00:32:04,362 --> 00:32:20,842
And I think that's one of the things that really makes Bitcoiners drawn to this is it's like, this is an opportunity to turn your ideas into reality at like probably a tenth of the cost of what it was before AI.

428
00:32:21,622 --> 00:32:23,402
So, you know, it's not free.

429
00:32:23,662 --> 00:32:29,222
It's not like ridiculously cheap, but it's way cheaper than it would be otherwise.

430
00:32:29,222 --> 00:32:36,582
so that's I don't know it that probably doesn't fully encapsulate like my my AI sort of journey

431
00:32:36,582 --> 00:32:40,682
I've been on but like all this stuff I'm talking about this was only over the last couple weeks

432
00:32:40,682 --> 00:32:46,402
so you know the learning curve like the AI really it helps the learning curve itself

433
00:32:46,402 --> 00:32:51,982
because as soon as you get confused you just say okay pause for a second I have no idea what you're

434
00:32:51,982 --> 00:32:57,882
doing please explain and then they'll explain it and then it'll start making more sense and if it

435
00:32:57,882 --> 00:32:59,382
Doesn't you just keep asking it questions?

436
00:33:00,102 --> 00:33:00,762
So I don't know.

437
00:33:00,882 --> 00:33:02,882
It's been kind of a cool experience.

438
00:33:03,982 --> 00:33:06,622
I guess I would say, you know, I don't regret it at all.

439
00:33:07,482 --> 00:33:10,822
It did probably cost more money than I was planning on spending.

440
00:33:13,122 --> 00:33:14,342
But, you know, I don't know.

441
00:33:14,462 --> 00:33:16,082
I feel like I learned some valuable lessons

442
00:33:16,082 --> 00:33:20,302
and hopefully was able to bring some new ideas into the world.

443
00:33:21,122 --> 00:33:25,182
And, you know, I do think it will help me with my meetup in the longer term,

444
00:33:25,182 --> 00:33:27,982
especially if it can help me make my slides every month.

445
00:33:29,882 --> 00:33:34,022
But it just takes all of that, the wheeling and dealing

446
00:33:34,022 --> 00:33:39,502
a layer deeper into the truly private realm.

447
00:33:41,582 --> 00:33:43,342
Because, you know, I am saying like,

448
00:33:43,402 --> 00:33:45,682
hey, I'm selling all this stuff on Telegram

449
00:33:45,682 --> 00:33:49,322
and on Signal and on Noster.

450
00:33:50,982 --> 00:33:54,202
But really who I'm talking to are people

451
00:33:54,202 --> 00:33:56,382
that I personally know for the most part.

452
00:33:56,622 --> 00:33:59,382
I just know that they're going to get this message

453
00:33:59,382 --> 00:34:01,062
when I put it in this place.

454
00:34:01,422 --> 00:34:03,022
But you know who else gets to see it?

455
00:34:03,122 --> 00:34:04,042
Everybody, right?

456
00:34:04,522 --> 00:34:09,342
And so everybody knows what level of economic activity I am doing.

457
00:34:09,502 --> 00:34:12,882
And in these group chats, they're certainly not locked down

458
00:34:12,882 --> 00:34:16,262
to just the communities locally.

459
00:34:16,262 --> 00:34:18,362
There's people that find their way in there from here, there,

460
00:34:18,402 --> 00:34:19,082
and everywhere else.

461
00:34:19,242 --> 00:34:21,342
And you don't necessarily know who these people are,

462
00:34:21,422 --> 00:34:23,802
what their intentions are, what assumptions they're going to make.

463
00:34:24,202 --> 00:34:28,302
about you when you start to post this economic activity.

464
00:34:28,822 --> 00:34:32,722
Somebody might assume that I'm selling tens of thousands of dollars of merchandise

465
00:34:32,722 --> 00:34:36,282
because of the frequency in which I'm constantly posting all this stuff.

466
00:34:36,582 --> 00:34:38,862
In reality, it's very much less than that, right?

467
00:34:40,442 --> 00:34:47,782
But if I can take that a layer deeper and present these offerings directly to the people,

468
00:34:48,062 --> 00:34:52,282
and at the same time, they can find a way that...

469
00:34:52,282 --> 00:34:56,282
I think, you know, there's some, we talk about it on the last several episodes every time.

470
00:34:56,362 --> 00:35:00,762
It's like people are sometimes uncomfortable about attending a meetup in the first place

471
00:35:00,762 --> 00:35:01,902
because of OPSEC, right?

472
00:35:01,962 --> 00:35:06,202
So then if you expand that out to now, I'm going to not only attend the meetup, but try

473
00:35:06,202 --> 00:35:08,662
and market some good or service that I have.

474
00:35:09,962 --> 00:35:13,922
It might be uncomfortable to put yourself out there to everybody that way.

475
00:35:14,722 --> 00:35:19,902
And so having it into this more private space might allow for more of this, for more of these

476
00:35:19,902 --> 00:35:24,582
economic circular economy juices to flow in that particular local environment.

477
00:35:26,702 --> 00:35:33,762
Yeah. And, and I, I think I just want to try it out. Like, I think if it's, if it's a good idea,

478
00:35:33,962 --> 00:35:39,362
I think people will like it and people will use it. And, you know, I certainly will start letting

479
00:35:39,362 --> 00:35:44,042
a lot more people, like if it takes off at my meetup, it's going to take off in other places

480
00:35:44,042 --> 00:35:47,582
too. You know, and if it doesn't take off at my meetup, that doesn't mean it won't work somewhere

481
00:35:47,582 --> 00:35:54,882
else. But I still think that that's okay. Like I, you know, there's actually, you know,

482
00:35:55,222 --> 00:36:03,462
I think I gave you some misinformation early in the episode because I told you that I hadn't been

483
00:36:03,462 --> 00:36:08,782
to a Bitcoin meetup since the last time we talked, but I forgot I was down in Charlotte

484
00:36:08,782 --> 00:36:14,902
this past week and ended up hanging out with it. It wasn't like on the meetup.com schedule, but

485
00:36:14,902 --> 00:36:17,862
I ended up hanging out with a bunch of the guys from that meetup.

486
00:36:17,982 --> 00:36:19,282
So I feel like that counts.

487
00:36:20,642 --> 00:36:26,542
And while we were there, lo and behold, number one topic we talked about, AI stuff.

488
00:36:27,662 --> 00:36:32,262
And so I brought this point up with them as we were talking about it.

489
00:36:32,462 --> 00:36:35,842
And the more I thought about it after I said it, the more I think that it's true.

490
00:36:35,842 --> 00:36:47,242
It's just like one of the, like I said before, one of the reasons why Bitcoiners are like drawn to this AI thing is because it's like, you know, empowering.

491
00:36:47,562 --> 00:36:50,682
Right. And it gives you the ability to like bring your ideas into the world.

492
00:36:51,342 --> 00:36:58,982
But I think it might even be more than that, because as Bitcoiners, we all know cypherpunks write code.

493
00:37:00,042 --> 00:37:05,222
And there's so many Bitcoiners out there who, like me, can't write code.

494
00:37:05,842 --> 00:37:11,882
And now we kind of can, you know, and so it's not exactly the same.

495
00:37:11,882 --> 00:37:19,322
Like I'm not like a cryptographer and I'm certainly not going to be working on real important critical infrastructure stuff.

496
00:37:19,802 --> 00:37:24,302
But I have a mechanism now to bring freedom tech into the world.

497
00:37:24,622 --> 00:37:29,402
Right. Like these private marketplaces, like maybe it's not going to change the world.

498
00:37:29,402 --> 00:37:50,002
That's okay. But, you know, it brings another aspect of privacy and freedom, like two small groups of individuals. And I think overall, you know, it's all open source. It's all on my GitHub. Like anybody can go take a look at the code. And I can't tell you personally, like the cloud doesn't think there's bugs in it.

499
00:37:50,002 --> 00:37:56,042
so far, you know, but I can't tell you that, but somebody else, you can go audit it,

500
00:37:56,402 --> 00:38:00,502
I guess, you know, maybe your AI could tell you if there's bugs in it. I don't know.

501
00:38:01,862 --> 00:38:07,162
So, you know, I don't know. I think that's what, it's one of the things that I think is what drew

502
00:38:07,162 --> 00:38:14,762
me in, you know, is it's like, Hey, this is an opportunity to participate in the Bitcoin community,

503
00:38:14,902 --> 00:38:19,402
the Bitcoin culture in a different way than I've really ever been able to in the past. So

504
00:38:19,402 --> 00:38:20,602
So I don't know.

505
00:38:20,622 --> 00:38:21,382
I think it's pretty cool.

506
00:38:22,582 --> 00:38:32,862
It's so profound, man, that, you know, all of a sudden, right at everyone's, all the pioneers' fingertips, we've all got ideas.

507
00:38:32,982 --> 00:38:39,242
We all wish, oh, if only this kind of thing existed, I could do so much more.

508
00:38:40,182 --> 00:38:42,562
And now you can do that thing.

509
00:38:42,562 --> 00:38:50,722
And not only can you do that thing, but you can tailor it specifically to your local use case or to whatever use case you want.

510
00:38:51,282 --> 00:38:58,022
And because in the past it was so expensive, right, to develop these very custom applications or whatever.

511
00:38:58,622 --> 00:39:00,002
And it took a lot of time.

512
00:39:01,082 --> 00:39:10,342
And so you weren't going to spend the time or money or effort to do it unless you were going to be sure you were going to get some kind of return or some kind of adoption or some kind of something, right?

513
00:39:10,342 --> 00:39:15,602
but now you can just kind of play and say, all right, here, check this marketplace out.

514
00:39:15,882 --> 00:39:19,662
It might be like Taproot, dude, where you like unleash this thing on your local community

515
00:39:19,662 --> 00:39:22,422
and they start using it in ways which you never expected.

516
00:39:23,082 --> 00:39:25,862
And you're like, holy shit, more to this than I even realized.

517
00:39:25,982 --> 00:39:31,222
And let's keep iterating on this and make it into a tool that's even more powerful for us.

518
00:39:31,222 --> 00:39:37,002
And before you know it, you guys got like the thing that's perfect for your group

519
00:39:37,002 --> 00:39:40,222
to do what you need to do and empower each other.

520
00:39:40,542 --> 00:39:41,922
For when the shit hits the fan,

521
00:39:42,062 --> 00:39:43,602
it's like, we don't give a fuck, dude.

522
00:39:43,722 --> 00:39:44,502
We're fine.

523
00:39:44,602 --> 00:39:45,702
We've got these tools.

524
00:39:46,122 --> 00:39:47,662
Nobody knows how we're communicating,

525
00:39:47,802 --> 00:39:48,682
how we're doing our stuff.

526
00:39:48,942 --> 00:39:51,042
We are operating in a parallel system

527
00:39:51,042 --> 00:39:52,002
to the existing system.

528
00:39:52,102 --> 00:39:53,102
And as it crumbles down,

529
00:39:53,642 --> 00:39:54,722
we're left standing

530
00:39:54,722 --> 00:39:57,382
because we've already built the next thing.

531
00:39:58,422 --> 00:40:00,482
We're operating in the first turning, right?

532
00:40:00,942 --> 00:40:02,842
To kind of quote the bugle.

533
00:40:03,922 --> 00:40:06,762
You know, everyone's still running into the fourth turning.

534
00:40:07,002 --> 00:40:11,122
And the pioneers have already started realizing that, hey, we're in the first turning now.

535
00:40:11,222 --> 00:40:11,962
Let's go.

536
00:40:12,842 --> 00:40:13,542
Let's go.

537
00:40:14,882 --> 00:40:25,382
So I actually had something that I wanted to ask you about because so you, you know, right when we started talking about doing this podcast,

538
00:40:25,382 --> 00:40:31,362
one of the first groups that you invited me into was called the Mesh to Dell.

539
00:40:31,362 --> 00:40:41,082
and I will be completely honest with you I very much thought it was like a mesh network group

540
00:40:41,082 --> 00:40:45,482
like maybe it was like a ham radio thing you know what I mean like it was just like a radio

541
00:40:45,482 --> 00:40:50,962
like that's what the mesh was was from mesh networks but now that I've been hanging out

542
00:40:50,962 --> 00:40:54,802
in this group for a little while it does not seem like that's what this is all about

543
00:40:54,802 --> 00:40:57,502
So I don't know.

544
00:40:57,862 --> 00:41:01,582
Why don't you explain a little bit about what is the Meshadel?

545
00:41:01,802 --> 00:41:04,302
What is the concept and what is that group all about?

546
00:41:05,682 --> 00:41:13,362
Well, essentially, the idea of the Meshadel is a distributed citadel.

547
00:41:14,142 --> 00:41:23,942
Because back in the COVID time, I think this meme of the citadel,

548
00:41:23,942 --> 00:41:30,642
Like the Bitcoiners are going to be so wealthy and so powerful that they're going to create these citadels, these fortresses all over the place.

549
00:41:31,302 --> 00:41:37,302
And they'll be, we'll be able to wall it off and keep all the shit coiners out and keep all the fiat out, keep everything out.

550
00:41:37,322 --> 00:41:38,482
And we'll just do our own thing.

551
00:41:40,002 --> 00:41:44,162
And so I heard a podcast back then.

552
00:41:45,762 --> 00:41:52,282
I don't know if I heard it the first time on, you know, I can't remember where exactly I heard it the first time.

553
00:41:52,282 --> 00:41:55,122
But there's a guy, Soul Exporter, him and his son,

554
00:41:56,042 --> 00:41:57,922
started a game theory, this idea.

555
00:41:58,182 --> 00:41:59,682
They're like, okay, so if we have a Citadel

556
00:41:59,682 --> 00:42:01,582
and we got all these Bitcoiners,

557
00:42:01,642 --> 00:42:02,942
these wealthy Bitcoiners in the place,

558
00:42:03,582 --> 00:42:06,422
what's going to really happen here?

559
00:42:06,842 --> 00:42:18,404
How do we actually protect ourselves from the whole world wanting to come and take us over And they came to the conclusion that it effectively impossible And a better solution would be to instead of having a big

560
00:42:18,404 --> 00:42:25,224
fortress on the top of the hill, to have an invisible network of people all cooperating

561
00:42:25,224 --> 00:42:31,884
together to build their sovereignty and to operate in sort of an invisible layer to the existing

562
00:42:31,884 --> 00:42:38,304
society. And so this is what the Mesh Jadel concept is. It's a distributed mesh citadel

563
00:42:38,304 --> 00:42:43,724
where all of these people who are trying to produce their own stuff, be as sovereign as

564
00:42:43,724 --> 00:42:49,944
possible, can cooperate together and do so in ways in which is invisible to the existing system.

565
00:42:50,924 --> 00:42:54,744
So therefore, it's very hard to attack. It's distributed and hard to see.

566
00:42:56,104 --> 00:43:00,664
And so this Mesh Jadel group is kind of a group of people who are interested in trying to explore

567
00:43:00,664 --> 00:43:02,804
and accomplish this goal.

568
00:43:04,704 --> 00:43:06,744
Yeah, I think, yeah, it's such a good point too

569
00:43:06,744 --> 00:43:10,164
because I remember the Citadel,

570
00:43:10,344 --> 00:43:13,244
like when everybody was obsessed with trying to,

571
00:43:13,244 --> 00:43:16,664
they were all dreaming of their future Citadels, right?

572
00:43:16,744 --> 00:43:19,244
Where, I don't know, we're going to own an island

573
00:43:19,244 --> 00:43:20,304
or something like that.

574
00:43:20,584 --> 00:43:22,724
And all the Bitcoiners are going to go there.

575
00:43:23,024 --> 00:43:29,704
But all of the current power structures

576
00:43:29,704 --> 00:43:41,224
and systems and violent war systems, they're all designed to attack and destroy those networks.

577
00:43:42,624 --> 00:43:48,904
And so that's how we ended up in this world with all the centralized power is because the only way

578
00:43:48,904 --> 00:43:55,504
you can protect yourself in a world like that is to centralize everything as much as you possibly

579
00:43:55,504 --> 00:44:03,344
can to stockpile as much defense technology as you possibly can into this one concentrated area.

580
00:44:05,004 --> 00:44:13,184
And I think as Bitcoiners, we see the downfalls of centralization, you know, maybe better than

581
00:44:13,184 --> 00:44:21,944
any other group. And so, yeah, I really like this idea. And this is the first time I had heard of

582
00:44:21,944 --> 00:44:29,364
this. So I, you know, this is an amazing concept. I'm not sure how this hasn't gotten more traction.

583
00:44:29,844 --> 00:44:34,284
I mean, maybe I'm just out of the loop. Maybe, maybe I'm the problem. But I mean, it really does

584
00:44:34,284 --> 00:44:40,004
sound like this is the way to go. Like if we're gonna, if we really want to form these communities

585
00:44:40,004 --> 00:44:47,884
that can't be disrupted by the current power structures, well, we can't just copy their power

586
00:44:47,884 --> 00:44:52,904
infrastructures. Like, I just don't think that's going to work. I think we have to opt out just

587
00:44:52,904 --> 00:45:00,184
like we do in Bitcoin, you know, opt out, take away their power, become, you know, become as

588
00:45:00,184 --> 00:45:06,284
distributed as possible. Yeah. If you, if you get these Bitcoiners and this is kind of one of the

589
00:45:06,284 --> 00:45:11,724
criticisms I have of like large Bitcoin meetups is that once it gets to be, you know, a hundred

590
00:45:11,724 --> 00:45:20,424
people, it's impossible to really know who's all right and who's there for malevolent purposes.

591
00:45:22,324 --> 00:45:27,984
And so if instead you get to the meetup, the meetup gets to be 100 people and you're like,

592
00:45:28,084 --> 00:45:34,904
whoa, whoa, whoa, hold on. This is cool, but like this is out of control. Let's just start

593
00:45:34,904 --> 00:45:39,904
instead of having a meetup once a month or whatever, let's have one a week and kind of

594
00:45:39,904 --> 00:45:46,304
try and distribute the attendance a little bit more or have instead of having one in the city,

595
00:45:46,404 --> 00:45:52,984
let's have two in the city or three or four and decentralizing as you because this freedom tech

596
00:45:52,984 --> 00:45:59,164
allows us like maybe through this marketplace app that you've developed, right? It doesn't

597
00:45:59,164 --> 00:46:05,384
require us to all go to the same place at the same time at the same frequency. We can be everywhere

598
00:46:05,384 --> 00:46:10,344
all at once and coordinate our activity through the Freedom Tech.

599
00:46:11,404 --> 00:46:15,484
And that makes it very hard to disrupt because everybody's going,

600
00:46:15,604 --> 00:46:18,404
like I'm going all over the place, going to all these different things.

601
00:46:18,504 --> 00:46:20,904
If one meetup closes down, another one pops up over here.

602
00:46:22,124 --> 00:46:25,504
Instead of having one big fire that you call the fire department

603
00:46:25,504 --> 00:46:28,644
to come put out, you got thousands of fires everywhere

604
00:46:28,644 --> 00:46:32,164
and there's not enough firemen to put the water on it.

605
00:46:32,284 --> 00:46:34,044
It's impossible to stop all those fires.

606
00:46:34,044 --> 00:46:42,124
and um and it's especially effective because when it's small it's it's hard to detect anything going

607
00:46:42,124 --> 00:46:47,324
on to begin with in the first place it's like nobody can hardly even notice because the trickle

608
00:46:47,324 --> 00:46:53,244
of this this economic activity this informational activity this exchange or whatever is just like

609
00:46:53,244 --> 00:46:59,484
happening all at once everywhere at all the same time right in front of everyone's faces you know

610
00:46:59,484 --> 00:47:07,484
and what we're doing is not illegal like the cartels and all these these like mobster guys

611
00:47:07,484 --> 00:47:11,244
they i think this kind of these kinds of systems operate in a similar fashion

612
00:47:11,244 --> 00:47:18,084
what we're trying to do i call it like a soft fork of society or a soft fork of the existing system

613
00:47:18,084 --> 00:47:23,644
like we're doing everything within the rules of the system and we actually have even tighter rules

614
00:47:23,644 --> 00:47:26,584
around how we're cooperating

615
00:47:26,584 --> 00:47:29,424
and we're relying on much more on reputation

616
00:47:29,424 --> 00:47:31,544
and social capital and all of this kind of stuff

617
00:47:31,544 --> 00:47:34,624
in order to ensure that we don't have to,

618
00:47:34,624 --> 00:47:36,004
when there's a thing that happens,

619
00:47:36,344 --> 00:47:39,124
we don't have to go out to the actual legal system.

620
00:47:39,444 --> 00:47:41,184
We can work it out amongst ourselves.

621
00:47:42,924 --> 00:47:46,204
And once you have this stuff in place,

622
00:47:47,224 --> 00:47:50,724
if the system that you have is the fallback,

623
00:47:50,844 --> 00:47:51,904
like the great thing is that

624
00:47:51,904 --> 00:47:53,504
we have a great opportunity here

625
00:47:53,644 --> 00:47:57,184
because if this shit that we're trying to do fails completely,

626
00:47:57,624 --> 00:47:58,004
guess what?

627
00:47:58,364 --> 00:47:59,704
The fiat system still exists,

628
00:48:00,024 --> 00:48:01,204
and we still just fucking,

629
00:48:01,364 --> 00:48:04,704
we just ride that down into the burning flames of hell.

630
00:48:05,224 --> 00:48:05,484
You know?

631
00:48:06,584 --> 00:48:07,384
It's okay.

632
00:48:07,684 --> 00:48:09,324
I can always jump right back out

633
00:48:09,324 --> 00:48:11,804
and just, like, you know, use my real name,

634
00:48:11,904 --> 00:48:13,504
stop operating under a NIM, whatever,

635
00:48:13,884 --> 00:48:15,024
and just participate fully.

636
00:48:15,024 --> 00:48:15,964
Become a normie again?

637
00:48:16,224 --> 00:48:17,224
Yeah, just go back to fiat.

638
00:48:17,224 --> 00:48:20,124
If it failed, we'll just go back to fiat world.

639
00:48:20,464 --> 00:48:20,564
Yeah.

640
00:48:20,804 --> 00:48:22,384
When in history has that been the choice

641
00:48:22,384 --> 00:48:24,704
where you can like develop this new system

642
00:48:24,704 --> 00:48:27,224
right underneath all of it while it's happening.

643
00:48:27,944 --> 00:48:29,264
And then if it doesn't work out,

644
00:48:29,324 --> 00:48:32,044
you still can just like without any penalty,

645
00:48:32,244 --> 00:48:34,664
go right back into it, the old system.

646
00:48:35,544 --> 00:48:36,984
And so it creates a lot of flexibility

647
00:48:36,984 --> 00:48:41,704
and opportunity to play and explore and build.

648
00:48:43,204 --> 00:48:46,004
Yeah, dude, there was so much good stuff in there.

649
00:48:46,264 --> 00:48:47,744
You know, one of the first things you said

650
00:48:47,744 --> 00:48:49,964
that really started to get my gears turning a little bit

651
00:48:49,964 --> 00:48:53,144
is it's so funny that you should say that

652
00:48:53,144 --> 00:48:55,064
about how the larger meetups,

653
00:48:55,604 --> 00:48:58,424
they're not like, it's not the same as the smaller ones.

654
00:48:58,424 --> 00:49:00,584
Because I've been to some of the bigger ones,

655
00:49:00,744 --> 00:49:03,084
you know, like let's say 50 to 100 people

656
00:49:03,084 --> 00:49:06,184
is like a big meetup and conferences, right?

657
00:49:06,404 --> 00:49:07,884
Conferences are way bigger.

658
00:49:08,344 --> 00:49:10,224
You know, even small conferences are way bigger

659
00:49:10,224 --> 00:49:11,704
than like 100 people.

660
00:49:13,364 --> 00:49:14,704
It's totally different.

661
00:49:16,084 --> 00:49:18,544
And from my experience,

662
00:49:18,544 --> 00:49:23,104
like meeting other Bitcoin meetup organizers, you know, and I know we're early in this show,

663
00:49:23,204 --> 00:49:27,224
but we both know a lot of different meetup organizers from all over the country, all

664
00:49:27,224 --> 00:49:27,744
over the world.

665
00:49:28,824 --> 00:49:35,464
Like, I don't, I don't even know if I could put an estimate to it, but I've got to think

666
00:49:35,464 --> 00:49:42,364
like the overwhelming majority of Bitcoin meetups are like, what, like six to 15 people.

667
00:49:43,664 --> 00:49:47,784
Like almost all of them just happen to be that size.

668
00:49:48,544 --> 00:50:06,344
And I've never really thought about it. I always just kind of thought about it. Oh, that just means we're early. Like, oh, these groups are so small. It just means that we're early. But I wonder if it just means that that's just the right size. And like, as they get bigger than that, like other ones pop up, like just naturally without even forcing it.

669
00:50:06,344 --> 00:50:14,304
I don't know. It's a good question, but it is kind of an interesting coincidence. And when you put it

670
00:50:14,304 --> 00:50:19,444
in those terms, it almost makes me start thinking, I wonder if there's more to it than just

671
00:50:19,444 --> 00:50:25,944
like, oh, you know, it's so early because we can't get the word out and we're not good at advertising

672
00:50:25,944 --> 00:50:30,684
and all these other things that I think a lot of meetup organizers, we like, I know I do.

673
00:50:30,884 --> 00:50:35,404
Like, I sort of feel like this responsibility, like I have to grow this group. Like, I can't

674
00:50:35,404 --> 00:50:40,844
believe more people aren't coming like we have to do more outreach we have to do more you know

675
00:50:40,844 --> 00:50:47,144
getting involved with the community or doing more advertising or whatever it is but and and maybe

676
00:50:47,144 --> 00:50:51,564
some of that we do need to do that maybe we do have a responsibility to like educate our communities

677
00:50:51,564 --> 00:50:59,484
and and make sure that they understand bitcoin but maybe it's not our job to grow our meetups from

678
00:50:59,484 --> 00:51:04,604
five people to 20 people to 50 people, you know, to a hundred people. Like I don't,

679
00:51:04,724 --> 00:51:10,464
maybe that's just not the goal. Um, so yeah, I mean, I don't know. That was one of the first,

680
00:51:10,584 --> 00:51:14,764
like, I know you covered a lot of different topics there, but that was one that I don't

681
00:51:14,764 --> 00:51:22,624
know. I had never really thought about it that way before. It, I think like, um, great meetup

682
00:51:22,624 --> 00:51:30,424
cultures tend to, um, a lot of the weight, a lot, basically the, the people and the person who's

683
00:51:30,424 --> 00:51:35,244
running it, organizing it, or the people who are running it and organizing it. And then like the

684
00:51:35,244 --> 00:51:39,084
inner group of like the regulars, there's like their homies, the type, the people who are get

685
00:51:39,084 --> 00:51:44,984
tight in with the people organizing it, a handful of people. Right. And I've noticed this, you know,

686
00:51:44,984 --> 00:51:52,524
where, um, if that person that's, that's pushing, doing that push to like create this community and

687
00:51:52,524 --> 00:52:02,324
everything drops off, the community falls apart. And so if you, once again, it's like,

688
00:52:02,444 --> 00:52:10,424
if there's a thousand fires, it's a lot harder to stop that, that blaze. And so if like one fire

689
00:52:10,424 --> 00:52:14,444
gets put out, whether, you know, because the person can't do it or anymore or whatever,

690
00:52:15,264 --> 00:52:22,224
if, if in an, in an area, there's several other meetups to go to now that it doesn't stop

691
00:52:22,224 --> 00:52:30,344
anything, you know? And the other thing is that people, as a leader, as a meetup organizer,

692
00:52:30,584 --> 00:52:35,884
you're essentially like a leader of your community. You don't have to take on that responsibility

693
00:52:35,884 --> 00:52:42,884
and to what level you choose to like take that role seriously or not is up to you. But like,

694
00:52:43,724 --> 00:52:47,944
ultimately people look up to you when you host the meetup and you run the meetup,

695
00:52:47,944 --> 00:52:49,284
They have respect for you.

696
00:52:50,544 --> 00:52:57,924
And so a lot of, if there's many people that are leaders like this,

697
00:52:58,184 --> 00:53:01,724
of these small groups of people, and once again, the mesh, right?

698
00:53:01,724 --> 00:53:04,744
If they're meshed together, if all these little meetups are connected,

699
00:53:05,884 --> 00:53:11,884
now you have this like, it's once again, another distributed system.

700
00:53:12,004 --> 00:53:12,564
It's an ecosystem.

701
00:53:12,964 --> 00:53:16,924
It's an ecology of all these different opportunities and bubbles

702
00:53:16,924 --> 00:53:18,024
to overlap, to intersect.

703
00:53:19,144 --> 00:53:23,344
And it's one thing to be the leader of 100 people

704
00:53:23,344 --> 00:53:26,904
versus being the leader of 15, right?

705
00:53:27,084 --> 00:53:29,044
The overhead on being the leader of 15

706
00:53:29,044 --> 00:53:30,224
is much less lower.

707
00:53:30,824 --> 00:53:33,004
Where like now you're doing a lot of work, right?

708
00:53:33,064 --> 00:53:35,604
To develop all this educational content,

709
00:53:35,724 --> 00:53:37,964
to use AI, to improve the level

710
00:53:37,964 --> 00:53:39,924
in which you can educate your local area.

711
00:53:41,424 --> 00:53:44,664
And imagine the pressure if that was

712
00:53:44,664 --> 00:53:48,164
instead of for 15 or 10 or five people or whatever,

713
00:53:48,524 --> 00:53:51,644
if it was 100, you know, that would become overwhelming

714
00:53:51,644 --> 00:53:54,124
and beyond what you could do in addition to,

715
00:53:54,464 --> 00:53:55,704
that would be your job, you know.

716
00:53:57,144 --> 00:54:00,044
It's not just a thing that you do in addition to everything else

717
00:54:00,044 --> 00:54:02,244
that you're doing, your day job, your family, and whatever.

718
00:54:03,084 --> 00:54:05,324
And so it just makes it much more accessible.

719
00:54:06,904 --> 00:54:09,484
Plus, it's so much less personal, right?

720
00:54:09,584 --> 00:54:12,544
Like, there's so many opportunities right now

721
00:54:12,544 --> 00:54:20,544
for people to learn and get educated in these gigantic groups, right?

722
00:54:20,704 --> 00:54:27,044
Like you can go watch a YouTube video that has a million views, you know,

723
00:54:27,264 --> 00:54:30,444
or like people with hundreds of thousands of subscribers.

724
00:54:31,824 --> 00:54:39,624
And, you know, we already have that not very personal like education sources.

725
00:54:39,624 --> 00:54:47,124
like you don't need to come to my meetup to get that um you can go to these conferences and watch

726
00:54:47,124 --> 00:54:53,944
you know i don't know like jimmy song talk to a whole room of you know 300 people like that one

727
00:54:53,944 --> 00:55:00,084
to many thing like that's we already have like that in spades like tons of that content what we

728
00:55:00,084 --> 00:55:06,144
don't have a lot of is this these close-knit personal groups and and that's what i mean like

729
00:55:06,144 --> 00:55:14,264
it was very early on, maybe not very, maybe like, um, about a year. So let's say 10 to 12 meetups

730
00:55:14,264 --> 00:55:23,144
into, um, my switch over to do an educational content that I realized I, this is this model

731
00:55:23,144 --> 00:55:30,244
where we pick one topic and I do this big presentation and talk on and on about this

732
00:55:30,244 --> 00:55:37,444
one subject, like this, I, you know, I don't think this is what people want. Like this just isn't,

733
00:55:37,444 --> 00:55:41,844
like there's so much better opportunity for me to use this small space that we have right here.

734
00:55:42,724 --> 00:55:50,224
And so switching to the Socratic seminar format is, it's been fantastic because it gives me breaks

735
00:55:50,224 --> 00:55:55,264
to pause and look around the room and say, you know, how about you? Like, what do you think?

736
00:55:55,264 --> 00:56:01,704
you know and people you know as they warm up they chime in on on all kinds of stuff and and i think

737
00:56:01,704 --> 00:56:08,584
that's what you don't get that from podcasts right you don't get that from youtube videos you know

738
00:56:08,584 --> 00:56:12,864
you don't get that from going to a bitcoin conference you know maybe inside discussions

739
00:56:12,864 --> 00:56:18,204
like here and there um like when you are in a bigger group of bitcoiners but there's something

740
00:56:18,204 --> 00:56:24,264
cool about having like that core group who's always there that you know are going to be there

741
00:56:24,264 --> 00:56:26,484
that you get to know really well.

742
00:56:27,344 --> 00:56:29,344
And you get to trust and rely on

743
00:56:29,344 --> 00:56:30,824
in a way that you just can't do

744
00:56:30,824 --> 00:56:31,864
in any of these other venues.

745
00:56:32,084 --> 00:56:33,984
So that's kind of what I mean.

746
00:56:34,144 --> 00:56:36,224
Like maybe Bitcoin meetups

747
00:56:36,224 --> 00:56:37,524
were never meant to grow

748
00:56:37,524 --> 00:56:40,844
beyond like 15 to 20 people, let's say.

749
00:56:42,164 --> 00:56:42,904
I don't know.

750
00:56:44,224 --> 00:56:47,064
The ideal size is yet to be discovered, I think.

751
00:56:47,064 --> 00:56:49,044
And maybe it'll change over time.

752
00:56:49,964 --> 00:56:50,704
But right now,

753
00:56:50,904 --> 00:56:52,764
the small size meetups are very powerful

754
00:56:52,764 --> 00:56:54,624
because like as we talked about,

755
00:56:54,744 --> 00:56:56,064
we've got now at our fingertips

756
00:56:56,064 --> 00:56:58,844
these AI vibe coding tools

757
00:56:58,844 --> 00:57:00,924
where we can develop freedom tech

758
00:57:00,924 --> 00:57:03,684
directly for that provides value

759
00:57:03,684 --> 00:57:06,104
very specifically to the few people,

760
00:57:06,304 --> 00:57:07,504
this small group of people

761
00:57:07,504 --> 00:57:09,104
that we're interacting with.

762
00:57:10,004 --> 00:57:11,164
And when those small groups of people

763
00:57:11,164 --> 00:57:12,184
start to go and interact

764
00:57:12,184 --> 00:57:13,464
with other small groups of people

765
00:57:13,464 --> 00:57:15,144
and we can share this,

766
00:57:15,504 --> 00:57:16,924
once I talk about it

767
00:57:16,924 --> 00:57:18,344
in terms of cultural capital, right?

768
00:57:18,744 --> 00:57:20,624
You're developing a lot of cultural capital

769
00:57:20,624 --> 00:57:22,444
amongst a small group

770
00:57:22,444 --> 00:57:24,684
and you figure out things with each other

771
00:57:24,684 --> 00:57:26,844
that are powerful and good.

772
00:57:27,424 --> 00:57:29,764
And then all it takes is one person to go from that meetup

773
00:57:29,764 --> 00:57:31,264
to the next meetup an hour away

774
00:57:31,264 --> 00:57:34,404
and be like, yo, over here, we got this cool shit going on.

775
00:57:34,944 --> 00:57:36,344
Have you guys heard about what we're doing?

776
00:57:36,424 --> 00:57:38,144
And then they say, no, we never thought about it.

777
00:57:38,624 --> 00:57:39,544
That's really awesome.

778
00:57:39,824 --> 00:57:41,104
We should start using it too.

779
00:57:41,604 --> 00:57:42,724
And then they say, by the way,

780
00:57:42,804 --> 00:57:45,504
we've got this cool thing that we've tailored to our stuff.

781
00:57:45,884 --> 00:57:47,824
And you say, oh, well, that's a little different

782
00:57:47,824 --> 00:57:49,964
than what we might need,

783
00:57:49,964 --> 00:57:52,104
but shit, I could just fork that.

784
00:57:52,444 --> 00:57:57,444
and clawed it up and tailor it right to our group.

785
00:57:57,444 --> 00:58:00,824
And you can imagine, dude, it's just like,

786
00:58:00,824 --> 00:58:03,284
this is not like an app that you're gonna go,

787
00:58:03,284 --> 00:58:04,444
that's on the Google Play Store

788
00:58:04,444 --> 00:58:08,364
that the NSA can shut down or some shit.

789
00:58:08,364 --> 00:58:11,204
It's just all these little tools that we're using

790
00:58:11,204 --> 00:58:12,484
and we're sharing with each other.

791
00:58:14,104 --> 00:58:15,744
And it just becomes, in my mind,

792
00:58:15,744 --> 00:58:20,284
just like a truly decentralized, unstoppable thing,

793
00:58:20,284 --> 00:58:21,324
much like Bitcoin.

794
00:58:22,444 --> 00:58:25,924
yeah, I don't know, man.

795
00:58:26,444 --> 00:58:27,364
First turning vibes.

796
00:58:28,624 --> 00:58:29,464
Feeling optimistic.

797
00:58:31,284 --> 00:58:32,504
Feeling like we're going to win.

798
00:58:33,504 --> 00:58:34,244
We'll see.

799
00:58:37,764 --> 00:58:40,104
Yeah, I mean, I came into Bitcoin, you know,

800
00:58:41,304 --> 00:58:43,524
because this homesteading stuff that I do,

801
00:58:43,764 --> 00:58:46,784
the reason why I started homesteading in the first place

802
00:58:46,784 --> 00:58:50,164
was because I felt like the world was very uncertain

803
00:58:50,164 --> 00:58:57,964
and that I needed to insulate myself from all the potential problems, right?

804
00:58:58,024 --> 00:59:00,264
So if the food system was going to have a problem,

805
00:59:00,384 --> 00:59:04,684
and I was realizing that I can't even buy the food at the quality that I want

806
00:59:04,684 --> 00:59:07,484
for any reasonable price, so the only choice is to make it myself,

807
00:59:07,944 --> 00:59:08,784
to grow it myself.

808
00:59:09,324 --> 00:59:11,944
And then that leads to like, what else do I need to do myself

809
00:59:11,944 --> 00:59:13,324
because this is all unreliable?

810
00:59:14,284 --> 00:59:18,964
And the only thing I couldn't do for myself was find money, like money, right?

811
00:59:19,024 --> 00:59:19,764
Having a good money.

812
00:59:20,164 --> 00:59:26,044
and when COVID happened and they started to airdrop the fucking stimmy checks and all this shit,

813
00:59:26,144 --> 00:59:27,584
I was like, it's over, dude.

814
00:59:27,764 --> 00:59:29,984
This system is fucked up.

815
00:59:30,124 --> 00:59:34,904
The government can't just give people free money because of a virus or something.

816
00:59:35,024 --> 00:59:36,544
This doesn't make any sense to me.

817
00:59:36,624 --> 00:59:37,944
I was like, this is going to cause inflation.

818
00:59:38,524 --> 00:59:43,204
As a business owner, I was just imagining like, okay, I got a free $1,500.

819
00:59:43,584 --> 00:59:44,484
You got a free $1,500.

820
00:59:44,864 --> 00:59:46,344
I know everyone got a free $1,500.

821
00:59:46,344 --> 00:59:50,424
I know everyone's got extra $1,500 to work with

822
00:59:50,424 --> 00:59:56,224
doesn't even have to have any market pricing dynamics

823
00:59:56,224 --> 00:59:58,724
to get me to realize that I could probably raise my price

824
00:59:58,724 --> 01:00:00,824
because I know everyone's just got free shit

825
01:00:00,824 --> 01:00:02,004
and they're going to spend it with me

826
01:00:02,004 --> 01:00:05,024
and so I immediately saw that the prices

827
01:00:05,024 --> 01:00:05,964
were going to go out of control

828
01:00:05,964 --> 01:00:09,444
and I was like how can I stop that bleeding

829
01:00:09,444 --> 01:00:10,704
like I got savings

830
01:00:10,704 --> 01:00:13,364
and everything's going to get more expensive overnight

831
01:00:13,364 --> 01:00:15,624
and I was

832
01:00:15,624 --> 01:00:18,484
I meditate every day after lunch

833
01:00:18,484 --> 01:00:20,284
I try to at least

834
01:00:20,284 --> 01:00:21,964
and for about 20 minutes

835
01:00:21,964 --> 01:00:23,464
and I was laying down on this meditation

836
01:00:23,464 --> 01:00:27,344
and this idea was like churning in my mind

837
01:00:27,344 --> 01:00:30,244
and I sat up from the meditation

838
01:00:30,244 --> 01:00:32,104
and something told me

839
01:00:32,104 --> 01:00:33,164
check the price of Bitcoin

840
01:00:33,164 --> 01:00:35,064
and I checked the price of Bitcoin

841
01:00:35,064 --> 01:00:37,324
and it was like 3k

842
01:00:37,324 --> 01:00:39,984
and it had just come down from like 12,000

843
01:00:39,984 --> 01:00:41,664
or 14,000 or whatever it was at

844
01:00:41,664 --> 01:00:46,524
and I was like well I'd heard about this before

845
01:00:46,524 --> 01:00:49,024
and at the time I didn't have two nickels to rub together

846
01:00:49,024 --> 01:00:50,724
to play around with it

847
01:00:50,724 --> 01:00:53,524
and it seems like now is a good opportunity

848
01:00:53,524 --> 01:00:54,784
to try and figure this shit out

849
01:00:54,784 --> 01:01:00,584
because this is a money that I don't know

850
01:01:00,584 --> 01:01:02,264
I didn't actually exactly know

851
01:01:02,264 --> 01:01:05,484
but I had this peripheral understanding

852
01:01:05,484 --> 01:01:07,904
that Bitcoin was this money that couldn't be fucked with right

853
01:01:07,904 --> 01:01:10,264
and as I learned more I was like

854
01:01:10,264 --> 01:01:12,084
this is exactly the solution that I need.

855
01:01:12,944 --> 01:01:15,104
Now I've got my sovereignty in my food,

856
01:01:15,204 --> 01:01:16,164
my sovereignty in my power,

857
01:01:16,244 --> 01:01:17,444
my solar panels and all this shit.

858
01:01:17,784 --> 01:01:18,364
I've got my wealth.

859
01:01:18,624 --> 01:01:20,224
I've got all this stuff.

860
01:01:20,864 --> 01:01:22,604
And now I've got money that I can just use

861
01:01:22,604 --> 01:01:24,264
outside of the existing system.

862
01:01:25,444 --> 01:01:29,724
And so basically from the time that I learned about Bitcoin

863
01:01:29,724 --> 01:01:34,124
to the time that it took me about six months

864
01:01:34,124 --> 01:01:36,524
before I had no money in my savings account anymore

865
01:01:36,524 --> 01:01:37,664
and I only had Bitcoin.

866
01:01:37,664 --> 01:01:40,284
Like I went all in immediately.

867
01:01:42,204 --> 01:01:47,964
It's a lot easier to go to take those kinds of rash moves when you don't have a lot.

868
01:01:48,444 --> 01:01:55,684
I think what Bitcoin really offered too is this idea that it's the renaissance of the subsistence lifestyle.

869
01:01:57,044 --> 01:02:00,344
Where the subsistence lifestyle used to be good.

870
01:02:01,224 --> 01:02:07,604
The homesteaders of the late, well, the early, I don't know, in the 1800s.

871
01:02:07,664 --> 01:02:14,564
When the movement West was going and these people didn't even have a lot of money, but they had a lot of sovereignty, right?

872
01:02:14,564 --> 01:02:18,584
They had a lot of skills. They knew how to take care of themselves. They knew how to cooperate with each other.

873
01:02:20,644 --> 01:02:30,724
This was giving me the same kind of feeling like, all right, now I don't necessarily, I don't need a lot of money to live because I'm producing a lot of my own shit.

874
01:02:30,724 --> 01:02:45,784
And so if I just use this Bitcoin thing now, the little bonus on the purchasing power of my savings is going to enable me to do so much more with a meager income than anything else that was ever available to me.

875
01:02:46,764 --> 01:02:48,564
And it's been working out like that, you know.

876
01:02:49,644 --> 01:02:53,884
Yeah, yeah, that was a good time for sure to go in.

877
01:02:54,844 --> 01:02:55,784
Yeah, it's funny.

878
01:02:55,784 --> 01:03:02,784
I feel like so many of us, I had some Bitcoin,

879
01:03:05,784 --> 01:03:07,784
not a lot, like before COVID.

880
01:03:09,784 --> 01:03:13,784
And I guess I had most, look,

881
01:03:14,784 --> 01:03:27,586
I had a small investment right And let just call it cryptocurrency right And okay a good chunk of that was Bitcoin But yeah like a good chunk of it was not Bitcoin And you know this

882
01:03:27,586 --> 01:03:33,286
whole thing was just in my mind, it was kind of like a gambling thing. But I also had this little

883
01:03:33,286 --> 01:03:38,626
thing in the back of my head. And it's why I always made sure the majority of my stack was Bitcoin

884
01:03:38,626 --> 01:03:41,346
was because I always had this feeling that,

885
01:03:42,346 --> 01:03:45,346
hey, if shit ever hits the fan,

886
01:03:45,926 --> 01:03:49,406
like if our whole system here starts to fall apart,

887
01:03:50,546 --> 01:03:53,246
this Bitcoin thing, this is what's going to be the thing

888
01:03:53,246 --> 01:03:54,846
that you are going to want to have.

889
01:03:55,526 --> 01:03:58,086
And so I want to make sure that I always have some of that.

890
01:03:58,966 --> 01:04:01,246
And I can go gamble with all this other stuff

891
01:04:01,246 --> 01:04:03,666
because I don't know what any of it is anyway.

892
01:04:04,906 --> 01:04:07,746
And then when COVID hit,

893
01:04:08,626 --> 01:04:12,306
And the entire economy looked like it was falling apart.

894
01:04:13,686 --> 01:04:16,126
And Bitcoin crashed with everything else.

895
01:04:16,606 --> 01:04:18,006
I was like, wait a minute.

896
01:04:18,806 --> 01:04:23,066
I thought this was supposed to be the thing that was going to shield me from this.

897
01:04:23,846 --> 01:04:25,386
And it was that.

898
01:04:25,726 --> 01:04:32,526
So I was, you know, beside myself contemplating what is going on.

899
01:04:32,886 --> 01:04:35,446
You know, my 401k crashed.

900
01:04:35,446 --> 01:04:42,886
my savings like there was very little savings you know and the savings i did have that was in this

901
01:04:42,886 --> 01:04:49,926
crypto stuff like it all crashed and so i was like very feeling lost and confused and

902
01:04:49,926 --> 01:04:56,166
the only thing i could think to do because i just like you i was watching the price of bitcoin as it

903
01:04:56,166 --> 01:05:02,986
was crashing harder and harder and harder and the only thing i could think to do i was like i you

904
01:05:02,986 --> 01:05:06,706
You know, I honestly, I have no idea what to do right now.

905
01:05:06,966 --> 01:05:09,366
The only thing I can think to do is buy more Bitcoin.

906
01:05:10,346 --> 01:05:11,526
That's all I can think of.

907
01:05:12,386 --> 01:05:16,386
And so right then, right in the heat of the dip, I bought a bunch of Bitcoin.

908
01:05:17,646 --> 01:05:21,126
And, you know, that was a smart move in hindsight.

909
01:05:22,026 --> 01:05:27,726
But really what I did was after that, I realized that this was the moment.

910
01:05:27,966 --> 01:05:31,826
I must figure out what the hell just happened.

911
01:05:31,826 --> 01:05:33,786
because I didn't understand anything.

912
01:05:34,386 --> 01:05:35,806
Like I wasn't like a gold guy.

913
01:05:36,046 --> 01:05:37,466
I wasn't like a sound money guy.

914
01:05:37,606 --> 01:05:38,866
Like a lot of the guys on my meetup,

915
01:05:38,986 --> 01:05:39,366
they were like,

916
01:05:39,786 --> 01:05:41,466
oh, you didn't know any of the sound money stuff?

917
01:05:41,826 --> 01:05:43,206
It's like, no, I didn't know any of that.

918
01:05:43,846 --> 01:05:47,646
I was very ignorant about money and investing.

919
01:05:48,266 --> 01:05:52,266
I had never bought a stock before Bitcoin.

920
01:05:53,026 --> 01:05:56,006
I bought Bitcoin before I had bought any stock.

921
01:05:56,006 --> 01:05:59,126
It just wasn't a thing that I knew anything about.

922
01:05:59,126 --> 01:06:08,426
and so um covid was like i must figure this out and so i actually didn't even start with bitcoin

923
01:06:08,426 --> 01:06:15,586
i started with figuring out how the dollar works and then i started figuring out how bitcoin worked

924
01:06:15,586 --> 01:06:28,326
and i also went hard down the rabbit hole in 2020 and um yeah i i would not say that maybe

925
01:06:28,326 --> 01:06:34,806
even ever I got to the point where I had like no dollars or whatever. But you know, I would say I

926
01:06:34,806 --> 01:06:42,686
took to the rabbit hole, so to speak. I honestly, I never really stopped. I still, like I just said

927
01:06:42,686 --> 01:06:47,066
in the opening, I'm about to go down this rabbit hole to go learn about Spark.

928
01:06:48,066 --> 01:06:55,726
Because this is big. It's just became what I do now is I'm so hooked. I'm so locked in to this,

929
01:06:55,726 --> 01:07:00,326
to this new thing that I don't know, I can't get enough.

930
01:07:01,726 --> 01:07:04,446
It's funny. I was talking with the Charlotte Bitcoin guys.

931
01:07:05,986 --> 01:07:10,386
And you sort of just made the same point to me that they made, which is,

932
01:07:12,186 --> 01:07:13,886
I think that my meetup,

933
01:07:14,386 --> 01:07:18,326
like we need to find a way to start distributing a little bit of the

934
01:07:18,326 --> 01:07:22,966
leadership, let's say, because I do take an extremely central role.

935
01:07:22,966 --> 01:07:31,346
and I don't know I think I'm just a psychopath like I put in yes I do I put in a lot of time

936
01:07:31,346 --> 01:07:36,266
into this stuff and I get very little very little quote-unquote like out the other side

937
01:07:36,266 --> 01:07:45,266
at least very little that's measurable right but I think I am gaining a lot in this like what you

938
01:07:45,266 --> 01:07:53,286
call cultural capital yeah and this comes down to the the number go up is one thing and a lot of

939
01:07:53,286 --> 01:07:59,066
people come to bitcoin for number grow up that was i mean very enticing to me in addition to this idea

940
01:07:59,066 --> 01:08:03,586
that i could have this money that couldn't be fucked with it's like oh wait you're gonna tell

941
01:08:03,586 --> 01:08:09,186
me i have like a lot of freedom in my my money and at the same time this shit's gonna also just

942
01:08:09,186 --> 01:08:12,586
like explode in purchasing power over time as well.

943
01:08:13,006 --> 01:08:15,926
Sounds like a really cool thing to get involved with.

944
01:08:16,466 --> 01:08:18,646
And people that get attached to the number go up,

945
01:08:19,206 --> 01:08:22,786
they probably just haven't gotten to the meetups yet

946
01:08:22,786 --> 01:08:25,006
and realize like once you go to the meetups

947
01:08:25,006 --> 01:08:27,026
and you start developing a community

948
01:08:27,026 --> 01:08:29,306
and a culture around your Bitcoin,

949
01:08:29,746 --> 01:08:30,906
around Bitcoin in general,

950
01:08:31,486 --> 01:08:35,406
the freedom go up is like immense as well.

951
01:08:35,946 --> 01:08:37,166
And this comes into the,

952
01:08:37,166 --> 01:08:41,426
But when you start like, okay, so you got the financial capital figured out, right?

953
01:08:41,546 --> 01:08:45,006
We all know Bitcoin is the financial capital that we all want.

954
01:08:45,406 --> 01:08:46,606
We don't want anything else.

955
01:08:47,026 --> 01:08:48,566
Gold, silver, whatever.

956
01:08:48,726 --> 01:08:49,226
Fuck that shit.

957
01:08:49,686 --> 01:08:53,886
Bitcoin allows us to really do a lot more than all that stuff.

958
01:08:55,206 --> 01:09:00,066
And so it's like, what forms of capital do you need to balance your capital portfolio

959
01:09:00,066 --> 01:09:01,826
when it comes to these nine forms of capital?

960
01:09:02,426 --> 01:09:04,886
Well, it's like you got to have social capital.

961
01:09:05,006 --> 01:09:05,826
You got to know people.

962
01:09:05,826 --> 01:09:06,846
You have to have a community.

963
01:09:07,166 --> 01:09:24,286
When you need to spend your Bitcoin, if you don't know anyone, what the fuck are you going to do? Sell it back on the exchange for dollars? You're fucked. What happens when the exchanges get locked down? When their exchange gets hacked and all your financial information gets leaked to everybody? This is terrible.

964
01:09:24,906 --> 01:09:28,046
And so you look for social capital.

965
01:09:28,146 --> 01:09:29,366
You find social capital at the meetup.

966
01:09:29,486 --> 01:09:30,666
You start to meet the people.

967
01:09:30,786 --> 01:09:31,686
You start to build a culture.

968
01:09:31,786 --> 01:09:32,766
You build cultural capital.

969
01:09:33,126 --> 01:09:35,006
You build experience by going to the meetups.

970
01:09:35,106 --> 01:09:38,806
You get to now have a great place to learn from everybody

971
01:09:38,806 --> 01:09:42,906
about how to use the tools and what tools people are using

972
01:09:42,906 --> 01:09:45,966
and what's good for your local area.

973
01:09:47,086 --> 01:09:50,446
And so by running a meetup, you get so much.

974
01:09:50,446 --> 01:09:51,606
You might not get a fight.

975
01:09:51,706 --> 01:09:52,786
You spend Bitcoin.

976
01:09:52,786 --> 01:10:00,366
You spend financial capital in order to do it, but you get so much more in return over time, especially lower your time preference, right?

977
01:10:00,426 --> 01:10:02,226
The meme, lower your time preference.

978
01:10:02,566 --> 01:10:06,026
Over the years, the first year, you might not get anything out of it.

979
01:10:06,346 --> 01:10:08,046
The second year, you start the ball rolling.

980
01:10:08,126 --> 01:10:11,786
The third year, the fourth year, now it's like turning into something magic, you know?

981
01:10:12,446 --> 01:10:15,306
And everybody's winning, you know?

982
01:10:16,906 --> 01:10:22,566
The meetups, I've just, as I've been doing this, I can't remember the first meetup I attended.

983
01:10:22,566 --> 01:10:25,386
It must have been in 2021 or something like that, right?

984
01:10:25,826 --> 01:10:28,966
So it's been four or so years, four or five years, I don't know,

985
01:10:29,006 --> 01:10:29,906
that I've been going to these meetups.

986
01:10:30,506 --> 01:10:32,926
And to watch the community and all the people,

987
01:10:33,626 --> 01:10:36,546
it's just like everyone is a complete badass, you know,

988
01:10:36,726 --> 01:10:37,826
doing amazing things.

989
01:10:38,446 --> 01:10:41,646
And I get to, like, interact with these people on a monthly basis

990
01:10:41,646 --> 01:10:45,226
all the time, and then in addition to that, more on the side.

991
01:10:46,826 --> 01:10:49,546
And it just becomes, like, you just realize, like, wow,

992
01:10:49,546 --> 01:10:53,686
these are powerful groups that are developing here.

993
01:10:54,826 --> 01:10:57,326
And once again, back to the very beginning of the podcast,

994
01:10:57,746 --> 01:11:00,706
like, oh, Taproot came out, we didn't get shit but ordinals.

995
01:11:01,166 --> 01:11:04,466
And it's like, yo, yo, just wait, just wait a little bit.

996
01:11:05,066 --> 01:11:08,106
And people are going to start to use Taproot to do amazing things.

997
01:11:08,406 --> 01:11:10,806
And the same thing is true, like, oh, I started this Bitcoin meetup

998
01:11:10,806 --> 01:11:13,086
and I've been running it for a year and I didn't get shit.

999
01:11:13,486 --> 01:11:15,086
And it's like, just wait, you know.

1000
01:11:15,086 --> 01:11:20,926
eventually as the connections get made and the interoperability between other meetups and stuff

1001
01:11:20,926 --> 01:11:32,586
start the connections start to form it becomes very powerful yeah man so speaking of uh of being

1002
01:11:32,586 --> 01:11:39,686
powerful and and being able to to communicate messages with your uh with your money what do

1003
01:11:39,686 --> 01:11:45,806
think good time to transition to boosts sure yeah we could read off the boost we got dude we've been

1004
01:11:45,806 --> 01:11:52,526
getting so much good support um we were joking at the when we started trying to do this podcast like

1005
01:11:52,526 --> 01:11:57,826
you know okay so it's just going to be uh the meetup organizers listening to this and learning

1006
01:11:57,826 --> 01:12:06,206
about meetups and the community on noster and everywhere else has has told us otherwise like

1007
01:12:06,206 --> 01:12:10,646
everyone's coming in with boosts. It's amazing. I really appreciate it all.

1008
01:12:11,166 --> 01:12:18,166
I very much assumed we would have tens of users or tens of listeners to every episode. And I have

1009
01:12:18,166 --> 01:12:25,566
been very much proven wrong. And so, yeah, I think I've said it before. It's the amount of

1010
01:12:25,566 --> 01:12:29,686
engagement we've been getting and the support we've been getting has been literally amazing.

1011
01:12:30,686 --> 01:12:35,666
It's kind of blown me away. Yeah. And the whole dream here is that

1012
01:12:35,666 --> 01:12:38,866
And I just want, I think we agree.

1013
01:12:39,126 --> 01:12:41,866
Like really what we want people to realize is like,

1014
01:12:42,446 --> 01:12:47,206
by interacting with this podcast, by boosting your meetup,

1015
01:12:47,306 --> 01:12:48,866
by sharing, just commenting in general,

1016
01:12:49,026 --> 01:12:52,386
and just letting people know that you got a meetup going on.

1017
01:12:53,066 --> 01:12:56,346
When people listen to the podcast, they hear the boosts,

1018
01:12:56,466 --> 01:12:57,566
they see the stuff on Noster.

1019
01:12:58,066 --> 01:13:01,786
It's just a continuous reminder that there is a meetup going on

1020
01:13:01,786 --> 01:13:02,586
somewhere close to you.

1021
01:13:02,586 --> 01:13:05,826
There's a lot of meetups everywhere, and meetup culture is really good.

1022
01:13:06,546 --> 01:13:10,026
And with that, we've got Otis Bittmeier.

1023
01:13:11,246 --> 01:13:15,206
He boosted 5,420 sats.

1024
01:13:15,826 --> 01:13:16,746
Thank you very much.

1025
01:13:17,006 --> 01:13:20,946
And he says, if I hadn't attended the Southwest Michigan meetup,

1026
01:13:21,346 --> 01:13:23,046
I may not have met Rev Hodel.

1027
01:13:23,766 --> 01:13:27,706
Today, Rev helped me solve a mining issue not even AI could figure out.

1028
01:13:28,046 --> 01:13:28,706
Back to AI.

1029
01:13:28,906 --> 01:13:30,466
So there's some things AI can't figure out.

1030
01:13:30,466 --> 01:13:36,026
And it turns out humans are still the purest form of signal and meetups are the greatest place to find them.

1031
01:13:36,626 --> 01:13:42,486
And this is from our last episode with Boomer, which was titled, what was it titled?

1032
01:13:43,286 --> 01:13:45,926
Meetups and podcasts are the signal.

1033
01:13:46,346 --> 01:13:49,526
Yeah, yeah. Meetups and podcasts were the, that was the topic. Yep.

1034
01:13:50,146 --> 01:13:52,926
Yeah. Meetups and podcasts are the signal. And here you go.

1035
01:13:52,926 --> 01:13:57,186
A connection that I made with Otis Bittmeier at the Southwest Michigan meetup.

1036
01:13:57,186 --> 01:14:03,986
Now he can call me for trouble that he's having with his mining issues and solve that.

1037
01:14:04,226 --> 01:14:07,886
And this isn't a question that he could find an answer to on AI.

1038
01:14:10,266 --> 01:14:18,746
And so, yeah, super high value going to the meetups because then you meet someone like you or I who can help you figure shit out when you get stuck.

1039
01:14:19,666 --> 01:14:21,886
Next is Lonely Pumpkins.

1040
01:14:21,886 --> 01:14:24,106
once again Lonely Pumpkins from last week

1041
01:14:24,106 --> 01:14:26,466
and Otis was also on the last

1042
01:14:26,466 --> 01:14:28,266
recording so thank you guys for

1043
01:14:28,266 --> 01:14:30,046
the continuous boosts

1044
01:14:30,046 --> 01:14:32,326
and Lonely Pumpkins has 5,000

1045
01:14:32,326 --> 01:14:33,126
stats and he says

1046
01:14:33,126 --> 01:14:35,406
keep the pod

1047
01:14:35,406 --> 01:14:38,086
high signal thanks for the shout out

1048
01:14:38,086 --> 01:14:38,426
gents

1049
01:14:38,426 --> 01:14:41,186
well thank you Lonely Pumpkins

1050
01:14:41,186 --> 01:14:43,326
keep doing what you're doing keep running that meetup

1051
01:14:43,326 --> 01:14:45,866
the Pennsylvania

1052
01:14:45,866 --> 01:14:47,866
I hope I can experience the

1053
01:14:47,866 --> 01:14:50,046
Pennsylvania meetup culture

1054
01:14:50,046 --> 01:14:54,166
someday. It really sounds like there's a lot of cool people hanging out over there.

1055
01:14:55,966 --> 01:15:04,346
Lonely Pumpkins, you know, maybe you guys need to do like a Noster. I don't know if Lonely

1056
01:15:04,346 --> 01:15:08,446
Pumpkins is super heavy on Noster or not, but it seems like when you do these Noster meetups,

1057
01:15:09,006 --> 01:15:15,046
people show up to them. There was... Are you talking like a corny chat or...

1058
01:15:15,046 --> 01:15:18,186
no no like in state college i think in pennsylvania

1059
01:15:18,186 --> 01:15:26,126
those man i'm i know seth was doing one i think it's called noster valley

1060
01:15:26,126 --> 01:15:33,906
it's like seth and pickle dan and a couple other guys from that area they do these they've done it

1061
01:15:33,906 --> 01:15:38,146
twice now i think they have this noster meetup and with content and everything but yeah put

1062
01:15:38,146 --> 01:15:43,126
noster meetups our bitcoin meetups and uh thanks again lonely pumpkins i won't go on any further

1063
01:15:43,126 --> 01:15:49,926
next we got business cat business cat also boosted last last episode business cat boosts

1064
01:15:49,926 --> 01:16:00,066
4,444 sets palindrome boost palindrome boost also pennsylvania right yep another pennsylvania homie

1065
01:16:00,066 --> 01:16:10,946
and he just says powerful boomer uh bicep flex emoji next we got wartime uh 3,333 sets

1066
01:16:10,946 --> 01:16:14,906
and he says, banger, firecracker, firecracker, pure signal.

1067
01:16:17,106 --> 01:16:21,206
Another one from wartime, he's got another 333,

1068
01:16:22,406 --> 01:16:28,826
or 3,333 salute, beers, cheers, emojis.

1069
01:16:29,466 --> 01:16:30,166
Then we've got Boomer.

1070
01:16:30,326 --> 01:16:30,626
Thank you, wartime.

1071
01:16:31,346 --> 01:16:32,366
Yes, thank you, wartime.

1072
01:16:33,046 --> 01:16:35,766
You know, and I know wartime.

1073
01:16:36,186 --> 01:16:37,086
I like wartime.

1074
01:16:37,086 --> 01:16:39,226
he's a good friend and so

1075
01:16:39,226 --> 01:16:41,206
I really do appreciate the support

1076
01:16:41,206 --> 01:16:41,626
wartime

1077
01:16:41,626 --> 01:16:45,386
so you say Boomer is next so Boomer

1078
01:16:45,386 --> 01:16:47,366
boosted his own podcast

1079
01:16:47,366 --> 01:16:48,526
that he was on

1080
01:16:48,526 --> 01:16:51,346
you know whenever I go on a podcast I tend to boost

1081
01:16:51,346 --> 01:16:52,326
it as well it's just

1082
01:16:52,326 --> 01:16:54,066
it's fun right

1083
01:16:54,066 --> 01:16:57,406
you just gotta keep the sats circulating around

1084
01:16:57,406 --> 01:16:59,386
confuse the IRS as much as possible

1085
01:16:59,386 --> 01:17:01,406
it's like what the fuck you paid yourself

1086
01:17:01,406 --> 01:17:03,486
to be on this show

1087
01:17:03,486 --> 01:17:05,166
like what's going on here guys

1088
01:17:05,166 --> 01:17:07,046
you paid yourself 10 cents

1089
01:17:07,046 --> 01:17:09,186
Why? This is a taxable event.

1090
01:17:11,986 --> 01:17:15,826
So, and thankfully, Boomer is in Canada, so he doesn't have to deal with the IRS.

1091
01:17:15,966 --> 01:17:17,266
Maybe it's much worse there. I don't know.

1092
01:17:18,986 --> 01:17:20,606
So Boomer's got a thousand sats.

1093
01:17:20,806 --> 01:17:24,726
And he says, it was an honor to talk to you guys about our new crew up here in Ottawa.

1094
01:17:26,046 --> 01:17:29,066
Or just, well, no, not new crew, about our crew.

1095
01:17:30,166 --> 01:17:33,226
And he says, meetups are truly the social layer to Bitcoin.

1096
01:17:33,226 --> 01:17:44,106
And I can't agree with that more because how can you get more social than hanging out with people every month that you know and at the place where you know, the drinks that you know, the food that you know.

1097
01:17:45,146 --> 01:17:51,126
And can't get much more social capital than people right in your backyard.

1098
01:17:52,186 --> 01:17:52,326
Yep.

1099
01:17:52,406 --> 01:17:53,006
Thanks again, Boomer.

1100
01:17:55,146 --> 01:17:56,606
We got Shadrack.

1101
01:17:57,026 --> 01:18:02,966
And Shadrack is putting, well, Shadrack with 939 sats.

1102
01:18:03,226 --> 01:18:07,886
he says, Bitcoin is backed by Bitcoiners in the first turning.

1103
01:18:08,446 --> 01:18:09,666
Blood, sweat, and spring.

1104
01:18:09,986 --> 01:18:10,566
Get to work.

1105
01:18:11,206 --> 01:18:12,246
40 HPW.

1106
01:18:14,306 --> 01:18:17,486
And so Shadrach is putting on a really sick event

1107
01:18:17,486 --> 01:18:21,506
in tandem with South by Southwest.

1108
01:18:22,086 --> 01:18:23,686
God, he's going to kill me because I can't remember

1109
01:18:23,686 --> 01:18:26,546
the fucking name of the thing that he's doing.

1110
01:18:27,146 --> 01:18:28,066
But it's this weekend.

1111
01:18:28,446 --> 01:18:29,966
I think it's starting on Thursday,

1112
01:18:29,966 --> 01:18:31,986
which at the time of this recording is tomorrow.

1113
01:18:31,986 --> 01:18:34,266
so actually maybe by the time this recording's out

1114
01:18:34,266 --> 01:18:35,866
this thing will already have happened, I'm sorry

1115
01:18:35,866 --> 01:18:38,446
but I will be on one of the panels

1116
01:18:38,446 --> 01:18:40,346
talking on this

1117
01:18:40,346 --> 01:18:42,706
South by Southwest live stream thing

1118
01:18:42,706 --> 01:18:44,706
it's super cool, they're doing a bunch of

1119
01:18:44,706 --> 01:18:46,366
they're doing live acts, they're doing

1120
01:18:46,366 --> 01:18:48,466
pre-recorded acts, everything's

1121
01:18:48,466 --> 01:18:50,766
live stream over Noster, it's all value for value

1122
01:18:50,766 --> 01:18:52,446
there's a bunch of panels

1123
01:18:52,446 --> 01:18:54,006
and stuff being involved in this

1124
01:18:54,006 --> 01:18:56,306
and so

1125
01:18:56,306 --> 01:18:58,206
Shadrach just continues to

1126
01:18:58,206 --> 01:18:59,926
make

1127
01:18:59,926 --> 01:19:01,666
he's one of these people that just

1128
01:19:01,986 --> 01:19:04,346
It's like, dude, Bitcoin number go up?

1129
01:19:04,466 --> 01:19:04,926
Well, guess what?

1130
01:19:04,986 --> 01:19:08,526
Freedom go up, and I'm just going to do whatever I'm free to do.

1131
01:19:08,786 --> 01:19:12,606
I'm going to build what I want, make the world I want to see.

1132
01:19:12,806 --> 01:19:13,706
So thank you, Shadrach.

1133
01:19:16,086 --> 01:19:21,206
Next up, we've got God's death, 237 sats.

1134
01:19:21,846 --> 01:19:23,026
He says, thank you, gentlemen.

1135
01:19:23,446 --> 01:19:24,586
Well, thank you, God's death.

1136
01:19:25,966 --> 01:19:28,706
God's death is another diehard podcast listener.

1137
01:19:30,726 --> 01:19:31,526
He's everywhere.

1138
01:19:31,526 --> 01:19:34,306
You can find him boosting on many of your favorite pods.

1139
01:19:38,166 --> 01:19:44,186
And finally, we have Jer with 100 sats, and he says,

1140
01:19:44,646 --> 01:19:47,346
three legends, so Jer must know Boomer.

1141
01:19:49,086 --> 01:19:49,826
Thanks, Jer.

1142
01:19:49,826 --> 01:19:50,126
I guess so.

1143
01:19:50,646 --> 01:19:51,646
I know Jer.

1144
01:19:51,746 --> 01:19:57,906
Jer is from the – I know him from the Rock Paper Bitcoin podcast community.

1145
01:19:57,906 --> 01:19:58,786
He's a candy guy, right?

1146
01:19:59,486 --> 01:20:00,946
I believe so.

1147
01:20:01,526 --> 01:20:03,106
I don't know for sure.

1148
01:20:03,126 --> 01:20:03,606
I know him from now, sir.

1149
01:20:04,406 --> 01:20:04,626
Yeah.

1150
01:20:05,666 --> 01:20:06,826
Jer, sorry if we doxed you.

1151
01:20:07,086 --> 01:20:07,426
I don't know.

1152
01:20:07,746 --> 01:20:09,066
Are you in Canada or not?

1153
01:20:09,106 --> 01:20:09,766
Let the world know.

1154
01:20:13,066 --> 01:20:16,226
And that's the boost for the last one.

1155
01:20:16,646 --> 01:20:17,446
So thanks, everybody.

1156
01:20:17,626 --> 01:20:18,366
It's really cool.

1157
01:20:18,826 --> 01:20:22,486
This, you know, just, I want everyone to just,

1158
01:20:23,486 --> 01:20:26,526
if you got a meetup, boost the information.

1159
01:20:26,946 --> 01:20:28,306
You don't got a hundred sats.

1160
01:20:28,306 --> 01:20:30,486
I think fountain, the minimum is a hundred sats

1161
01:20:30,486 --> 01:20:31,326
if you boost your fountain.

1162
01:20:31,526 --> 01:20:36,646
But Reid's got a node that all the boosts go directly to his node.

1163
01:20:36,766 --> 01:20:42,146
So if you send a message through a boost from another podcasting 2.0 app,

1164
01:20:42,406 --> 01:20:45,026
we will see that and we will be able to read that.

1165
01:20:45,786 --> 01:20:47,666
So don't just think you need to boost through Fountain

1166
01:20:47,666 --> 01:20:51,006
that we're like a Fountain-only podcast.

1167
01:20:52,006 --> 01:20:55,666
If you want to interact with us on Noster,

1168
01:20:55,806 --> 01:20:59,506
the local Bitcoiners Noster account,

1169
01:20:59,506 --> 01:21:01,766
share your meetup on there.

1170
01:21:03,146 --> 01:21:05,966
My goal and my hope is that

1171
01:21:05,966 --> 01:21:07,706
at the end of these podcasts,

1172
01:21:08,026 --> 01:21:10,646
we read off like more meetups than anyone can stand.

1173
01:21:10,966 --> 01:21:13,026
I want us to be reading off so many meetups

1174
01:21:13,026 --> 01:21:16,106
that you get tired of listening to me read off the meetups

1175
01:21:16,106 --> 01:21:18,006
and you turn the podcast off, okay?

1176
01:21:18,386 --> 01:21:20,306
So get your meetup out there.

1177
01:21:20,566 --> 01:21:22,486
Everyone needs to know that these meetups exist

1178
01:21:22,486 --> 01:21:24,266
and that this stuff is happening

1179
01:21:24,266 --> 01:21:27,546
and that this stuff is powerful, you know?

1180
01:21:27,546 --> 01:21:42,286
This is how we're going to hyper Bitcoin. Hyper Bitcoinization starts at your local economy and your local culture. Hyper Bitcoinize your own world first. And do that by boosting the podcast and sharing that, letting everyone else know.

1181
01:21:42,286 --> 01:21:46,346
we will amplify your signal to the best of our ability, right?

1182
01:21:46,486 --> 01:21:49,146
That's, and, and that's, that's why we want you to boost.

1183
01:21:49,406 --> 01:21:52,526
It's, we want you to boost to advertise your meetup.

1184
01:21:52,926 --> 01:21:53,886
That's what we want.

1185
01:21:54,126 --> 01:21:59,166
You know, um, like we said, we, our, our audiences is growing.

1186
01:21:59,606 --> 01:22:05,026
And so, you know, the more, um, boosts that we get, the more meetups that we can read

1187
01:22:05,026 --> 01:22:10,026
out, you know, the wider, the audience, our audience gets, you know, the more that, uh,

1188
01:22:10,026 --> 01:22:13,266
Rev will just completely put you to sleep.

1189
01:22:14,206 --> 01:22:17,886
Reading off, meetup after meetup after meetup after meetup.

1190
01:22:18,246 --> 01:22:19,366
That's what we're going for.

1191
01:22:22,886 --> 01:22:23,666
All right, Rev.

1192
01:22:24,106 --> 01:22:26,226
You got anything else before we wrap this one up?

1193
01:22:28,446 --> 01:22:29,126
I don't know.

1194
01:22:29,186 --> 01:22:31,386
I think the key takeaway from this discussion is that

1195
01:22:31,386 --> 01:22:34,946
even if your meetup is small, it's super powerful.

1196
01:22:35,566 --> 01:22:36,186
Give it time.

1197
01:22:36,766 --> 01:22:37,346
Let it mature.

1198
01:22:37,786 --> 01:22:39,326
Just like any good ecosystem,

1199
01:22:39,326 --> 01:22:41,846
It takes time for a fruit tree to bear fruit.

1200
01:22:42,366 --> 01:22:44,166
And you just got to be lower your time preference.

1201
01:22:44,566 --> 01:22:45,626
Let it let it grow.

1202
01:22:46,066 --> 01:22:47,966
And you will reap the rewards from this.

1203
01:22:48,526 --> 01:22:55,086
And not only does number go up, but freedom goes up, especially when you start to interact with your local Bitcoin culture and community.

1204
01:22:56,826 --> 01:22:58,966
Yeah, and and and use the tools.

1205
01:22:59,666 --> 01:23:01,826
Right. And and I don't just mean AI.

1206
01:23:01,826 --> 01:23:15,066
I know we did talk about that in this episode, but, you know, use whatever tools that you have at your disposal to maximize your ability to be a sovereign individual in this world that we have.

1207
01:23:16,526 --> 01:23:19,306
And one of those tools is your local meetup.

1208
01:23:20,486 --> 01:23:25,266
So, you know, go meet your community, you know, reach out.

1209
01:23:25,266 --> 01:23:27,566
if you have

1210
01:23:27,566 --> 01:23:29,346
one thing that I think we say

1211
01:23:29,346 --> 01:23:30,366
in the closing

1212
01:23:30,366 --> 01:23:32,966
credits so to speak

1213
01:23:32,966 --> 01:23:35,486
if you'd like to come on the pod

1214
01:23:35,486 --> 01:23:37,326
and talk about your meetup just reach out

1215
01:23:37,326 --> 01:23:38,826
our meetup

1216
01:23:38,826 --> 01:23:41,206
email address is right in the show notes

1217
01:23:41,206 --> 01:23:42,866
so if you want to come on

1218
01:23:42,866 --> 01:23:44,766
reach out we'll have you on

1219
01:23:44,766 --> 01:23:47,446
we'd love to talk to you about how your meetup's going

1220
01:23:47,446 --> 01:23:49,306
we'd love to let you get your

1221
01:23:49,306 --> 01:23:51,526
message out and hear all the cool stuff

1222
01:23:51,526 --> 01:23:52,286
you've been working on

1223
01:23:52,286 --> 01:23:55,186
alright so I think

1224
01:23:55,186 --> 01:24:01,206
we're ready to wrap it up. We'll talk to you next time. See you, Rev. Bye.

1225
01:24:25,186 --> 01:24:26,346
Thank you.