It's like coming true, Sean. Like that to me was a freaking wake up call. I couldn't believe what
was going on. Therefore, I really took this strong approach to questioning everything.
A lot of people have put properties in their self-managed super fund. You have to pay an
unrealized capital gains tax above the 3 million. You would now have to pay a tax. Now, how do you
pay the tax? Where are you coming up with that money? Out of your pocket? Or, which most people
don't have that. Most Australians don't have $100,000 sitting around in their bank balance,
right? This is how ludicrous this is. You would have to sell the property to then pay the tax.
But guess what? Because you sold the property, you'd have to pay capital gains tax as well.
I could definitely see them being linked together with a digital ID and the central bank digital
currency. I mean, I think what's interesting is this is all laid out. This is not even a secret
anymore. It's that the government can track everything you do. So you go to the petrol
station, you go to buy fuel. Beep, beep.
Welcome back to G'day Bitcoin. Joining us today is Matthew Fraser, a sharp entrepreneur
and Bitcoin advocate who takes a no-nonsense approach to wealth sovereignty and technology.
His philosophy? Super simple. Allocate to Bitcoin, sit back, watch what it does, because
in his view, we're heading towards the dematerialization of all assets into Bitcoin.
With a business track record of over $70 million in turnover, Fraser has deep roots in Australia's
entrepreneurial scene, including a decade-long friendship with the great Adam Hudson. He's been
at the forefront of the crypto collective, speaking out on the rise of digital IDs,
the threat of CBDCs and the tax agenda under Australia's Labor government, particularly
around self-managed super funds and the controversial unrealized capital gains tax
proposal. He even launched a petition, which I absolutely love, to protect tax-free super funds
for Bitcoin and other assets.
Never one to limit options.
Fraser is also exploring international strategies for sovereignty,
including Plan B passports in the UAE,
ensuring freedom of movement and financial flexibility
in an era of tightening regulations.
Matthew, mate, welcome to the show.
How are you doing today?
Good.
What an introduction.
Unbelievable.
Thank you so much for having me.
You're a pretty incredible guy.
Very inspiring, mate.
And, you know, that recent podcast that you and Adam Hudson did, you talked a little bit about your journey and how long you've known each other for and sort of dove into that.
It's a real pleasure and honor to be able to be talking with you and get your message out today.
I think we align on a lot of things.
And I think probably what we align on the most at the moment is CBDCs, digital IDs and what the Australian Labor government is doing.
It just feels like there's this blatant attack on wealth accumulation in this country.
Like, holistically, what are your thoughts at the moment with the path that it looks like this Labor government is just pushing through this?
To me, I'd say it's a tyrannical agenda.
Well, if anyone's seen or read 1984, Orwellian dystopian world, it's like coming true, Sean.
I think the big wake-up call for me, though, if we just go back a step, was actually COVID.
Like, that to me was a freaking wake-up call.
I couldn't believe what was going on.
And I knew politicians and I'm thinking, what are you doing, right?
And it was so blatantly obvious that it was the biggest con that we had ever seen in the
history of mankind.
That's where I stood on it.
Now, I'm very open about this, Sean.
I didn't get the jab.
None of my family did.
In fact, we were prepared to just become hermits and just stay in the house.
You know, there were people out there, Sean, that were saying, we want to go to the pub
or we want to go to the shops.
We're going to get the jab.
No, no freaking way.
there was no way that I was doing that anyway you could see it was it was just all a big a big show
and and so my point is that was the wake-up call for me and it was around that time that I sort of
discovered Bitcoin but it also coincided with with my business as well so I guess from there it's then
if we move on to sort of in recent years you know I've become more awakened to politics and I think
thing, Sean, is that most people, including my dad, for example, when as you're growing up,
you just think that the people in power have good intentions. And when I say just even politicians
have good intentions for the country, even your doctor, you think your doctor has good intentions
for you. And we just saw through that, that that perhaps wasn't the case. There was a lot of,
I guess, pressure on doctors, even if they knew the truth, they couldn't come out with the truth.
So therefore, I really took this strong approach to questioning everything, which is kind of very
aligned now into the Bitcoin ethos, which is question everything, which is then, of course,
you go down the rabbit hole of what is money, the monetary system. It is very eye-opening.
Now, if we bring that right to what's happening today under the tyrannical Labor government,
it's a disgrace what is going on. When they started to talk about unrealized capital gains
tax on superannuation. That's when I really hit the roof, because now it's attacking people's
wealth. And you can imagine for a couple of what, 30 odd years now, people have been focusing on
building their retirement savings in superannuation only to come out to this period now. And the
government saying, actually, there's a $4.2 trillion honeypot there. We need some of that
money. In fact, we're going to take some of it off you. Anyway, so my philosophy, Sean, is regardless
of someone's wealth status, I don't believe the government should steal it. Agreed. And with this,
what I find so hard, and I don't know if you've had an opportunity to chat with Jeff Wilson,
if you haven't, I'll happily connect you to from Wilson Asset Management. I had him on the show
and we dove into it. It just makes absolutely no sense. I don't believe any other OECD
country has implemented an unrealized capital gains tax. I guess if you'd be able to take a
moment with what is this proposed tax with Division 296 and like why is it so bad? Why is
not a realized capital gains tax, which we're all used to, but an unrealized capital gains tax,
how do they differ and why is it so much worse? Well, if I just forget about super for a second,
we just talk traditional assets. Generally speaking, under the taxation system that we
operating within Australia, you only get taxed on a sale of an asset. So when something is a,
let's use property as an example. You sell a property and if there's an investment property
that has a gain, you bought it for 500, you sell it for a million, you've now got a gain of $500,000.
Now there's a tax that you've got to pay on the 500,000. Now, then of course, you've got some
different rules with capital gains discounts and what have you, depending on how long you've held
the asset for. But the point is that you only pay the tax when you sell the asset, which I think for
most people, I guess, you know, I'm kind of become more against taxes in general. But for most people,
they kind of stomach it. They're like, okay, we've sold the asset and we pay the tax. Under the
unrealized capital gains tax in the same scenario of the property, if you're, let's say you had a
property portfolio of over this $3 million, which is the current cap, even on that million dollar
property, that $500,000 gain that you've had in that particular year, let's say, would now be taxed
even if you did not sell the property, right? And so when you relate this now back into superannuation,
if you've got a lot of people have SMSFs, right? Self-managed super funds. And quite often in
Australia, you know, Australia is heavily geared up on property. They love property, right? I'm
actually turning away from property, okay? Now, I had my blinkers on for many, many years, John,
so don't get me wrong. So people have been indoctrinated into the property market,
that it is the be all and end all. A lot of people have put properties in their self-managed super
fund. Now, if you're accumulating properties, and you may have even heard stories about farmers who
have these huge wads of land in an SMSF, now they're most likely well over $3 million. And so
what the government is now saying is if your SMSF now is it goes over $3 million, you have to pay
an unrealized capital gains tax above the 3 million.
Now, it's a little bit more complicated than that,
but just to keep it simple.
And so therefore, if you have accumulation of properties,
which a lot of Australians do in an SMSF,
you would now have to pay a tax.
Now, how do you pay the tax on?
You're either gonna have to come up with the money
out of your own pocket,
and it could be in the vicinity of,
let's say the bill for this year is $100,000, right?
On a capital gain above 3 million.
Where are you coming up with that money?
out of your pocket, or, which most people don't have that, most Australians don't have $100,000
sitting around in their bank balance, right? Most, if it's tied up in property, that's where
the assets are, the wealth is. They would then have to sell the asset. This is how ludicrous
this is. You would have to sell the property to then pay the tax. But guess what? Because you
sold the property, you'd have to pay capital gains tax as well. It's just absolutely ludicrous.
And I think that's why people like, you know, even Paul Keating, former Prime Minister of Australia, former Treasurer of Australia, one of the architects for the superannuation system.
Now, I'm not saying I even believe in the superannuation system anymore, but he was one of the architects, a former Senator Bill Kelty, or at least Minister, I think he was.
Now, he was also an architect of the superannuation.
They're both, and they're both Labor stalwarts, Sean.
They're opposing Labor's unrealised capital gains tax.
So it is an absolute insidious tax. Now let's turn this into Bitcoin. Let's say that you've
accumulated Bitcoin in your SMSF. Now I have converted all of my shitty industry super fund
money getting like seven or 8%. I've converted all that under an SMSF into Bitcoin, which in itself,
which is congratulations to you, right? Because it is really the own, it's the life raft I talk
about for most Australians right now. And the window is closing on that too. So if you've now
got over $3 million in your Bitcoin. Now, you would now have Bitcoin that you would have to sell
to pay this unrealized capital gains tax, even if you didn't want to sell it, right? Absolutely
outrageous. So I think people need to wake up to it. I'm surprised there's not much in the street.
I did start that petition, as you said, but I was actually calling for, let's get rid of all taxes.
So no tax when you put the money in, no tax when you take the money out. And I know there's some
different rules around that, depending on whether it's accumulation phase or pension phase. But just
in general, no taxes whatsoever. So if the government truly does want people to save for
their retirement, right, and I'm 46 years old now, most people who get into their 40s, mid 40s to 50,
you then start thinking about retirement, right? When you're in 30s and 20s, you don't even think
about it. I would say let's get rid of all taxes. And yeah, sure, put some money aside for your
retirement, but let's not penalize people or tax them, one, for even putting the money in there.
And secondly, if they've done very, very well. I want to make this other point, Sean, is that
I've been absolutely, which I love, don't forget, on social media. I love getting attacked on social
media. I was like, give it to me, guys. Let's go. These socialists and commies that are out there
in the internet world attacking people like myself because we're opposed to the theft of our
retirement savings, right? And that's because these people have basically got no life. They look at
other people like yourself or myself who might have over $3 million in their super fund, you're
too rich, right? They've put this imaginary cap on how much someone can possibly earn. And the thing
that they make the mistake on, because they're not, they're stupid, is they think that if you've
got over 3 million, you must have a very high paying job and you've taken, you know, your 10%,
11% out of your wage to put into super, right? And the only reason, the only way you can get to
over 3 million is you've got a really high paying job. But what if people like you and me, Sean,
actually had the balls and the courage and the conviction in a particular asset like Bitcoin,
and we allocated to Bitcoin? And let's just say that grew over time because it's compounding at
a 50 plus percent CAGA at the moment, right? Shouldn't we reap the rewards of that because
we took the risk, we had the conviction, rather than people who didn't. So those people don't
understand that. They don't understand that you can buy an asset and it could grow to over $3
million and you could be taxed. They just think you've got a high paying job and how dare you?
You see the discrepancies? If you've still got your Bitcoin on exchange or you're looking to
take your Bitcoin security to the next level, I've partnered with The Bitcoin Way. They offer
live help for setting up cold storage, running your own node, keeping your Bitcoin private,
planning for the future, using multi-sig and so much more.
They never touch your keys.
They will not touch your coins.
Instead, they'll show you how to buy and keep them safe.
If you want to make your Bitcoin setup safer,
you can book a free 30-minute call and have a chat with them.
Safe Dina Moose, the author of The Bitcoin Standard,
Natalie Brunel, Preston Pish and so many more,
recommend the professional IT cybersecurity team.
A couple of outstanding things here.
You can see they've been featured in Forbes, Bitcoin Magazine,
Bitcoin Prague, Zero Hedge, Simply Bitcoin,
the Bitcoin Safety, the Bitcoin Standard podcast
for Safety and Moose, Bitcoin News,
obviously G'day Bitcoin for a long time.
They're the world experts in helping people become self-sovereign.
It's not just about protecting your Bitcoin stash.
Yes, they will help you do that in a very easy to understand,
step-by-step process.
But from there, they can help you secure your data.
They are your personal cybersecurity IT experts And then step number three is getting a second passport a plan B residency The team very cheap very affordable
for people that are looking to take their sovereignty
to the next level.
You can find out more about their services.
When you first log in to their website as well,
they have got a free three-minute quiz
to allow you to check if you are doing your cybersecurity,
you're set up correctly.
I urge everyone to jump onto thebitcoinway.com.
I have put a link into the description for everyone.
Could not recommend them enough.
I've used them personally before I ever partnered with them
for the channel, friends and family.
They asked me to help them out.
I'm like, go to the world experts.
That is the Bitcoin way.
So reach out to the Bitcoin way today.
I think one of the other insidious things
with like $3 million unrealized capital gains,
well, number one, it's not tied to inflation,
but to be a self-funded retiree now it's estimated that it's going to cost three million dollars
so that's the number people need to achieve so is that why they've come in at the three million
dollars because they don't want people to have personal agency personal freedom etc but then
also like you're saying by taking that risk and people like oh you just got lucky or something
yeah like lucky that i didn't believe the media lucky that i read like every single bitcoin book
lucky that I put thousands and thousands of hours, years of my life into studying this asset class.
And it wasn't just even studying Bitcoin. It was the 10 to 12 years before finding Bitcoin of trying
to break free of the matrix, trying to be able to create wealth in my own life, and then realizing
after that trial and error and all those failures, I'm not getting compensated for all the failed
businesses I've had, everyone that I've had to pay off to be able to scrape by, to be able
able to fix my own fuck-ups. But as soon as you get something right, they just want to take it.
And for the socialists or the communists to be like, you don't deserve that,
it makes absolutely no sense. The people that have that money, let's say they didn't make it
from investing and it was from a high-paid job. The reason they're getting paid a high wage is
because they're providing a high level of value or service to the marketplace. Don't we want to
reward those people and don't want we want them to be self-funded to be spending their money
on things of value into the community and things like that it's just it's just all the fast but i
want to just double click into the self-managed super funds you're an advocate of them i'm an
advocate for them i'll put your links below the links to my website where you can connect with
either of our self-managed super fund partners but if we stay in the traditional superannuation
system well number one you can't buy bitcoin that's why i went down the self-managed super
fund i called up the industry super fund said hey can you guys allocate just a little bit to bitcoin
they're like no we can't do that and so i jumped on google i'm like what super fund in australia
will um allocate to bitcoin it's like no super fund in australia can allocate to bitcoin i'm like
how can i buy bitcoin with my superannuation it's like you can't buy with your superannuation but if
you were to set up a self-managed super fund then you can buy and then you can self-cust you i was
like okay how do i do that and like set it up you know within the day and i did the initial process
obviously it's better to do it as quick as possible because it can take a long time with the
ato and and the bank sometimes if there's holdups um for example and i think that's why we've got
channel partners to be able to make it a little bit easier for people to be able to go through it
but you take these risks and you do it like you want to choose something where you're taking
self-responsibility for it, knowing that if it goes wrong, that's on me. If it goes right,
it's on me. But if it goes wrong, the ATO is like, ah, that's not on me. It goes right. Ah,
you're zoosome. You're like, come on guys, give us a break. Life's already hard enough. You're
debasing the currency at 11% a year at the moment, roughly 63% over the last five years.
It's absolutely crazy. And then I think like as you pair these dystopian sort of tax laws,
along with digital IDs and then see these sees I think we could go down a slippery path straight
away so I want to sort of soft pivot towards digital IDs and then we'll like weave all
this back together towards then but I know you've talked a little bit about him you know
Anthony Albanese with his under 16 social media bill we need to be able to protect kids
it's always about be able to protect kids because it pulls on the heartstrings they're
fucking pretty clever these people sinister but clever and then we see Keir Starmer running
with it as well.
And so that people aren't going to work illegally.
They're already fucking working illegally.
And they get paid in cash.
But I guess CBDCs, I mean, digital IDs, then you pair it with the CBDC.
It does remove cash out of the economy.
So what do you sort of think the agenda behind the digital IDs?
And are they linked with CBDCs?
Or could you see them being linked with CBDCs?
And then what happens?
Sean, I could definitely see them being linked together with a digital ID
and the central bank digital currency.
I think that's, I mean, I think what's interesting is this is all laid out under the WEF's 2030 agenda.
This is not even a secret anymore.
I'm nothing to be happy.
And my new catchphrase is, I will own nothing except for Bitcoin and be happy.
I love it.
Because I'm actually dematerializing everything anyway.
I'm dematerializing all my physical assets, which we can go into that later as to why I'm doing that.
We will.
But, and the thing is, it's a big joke right now because everyone can see straight through what Keir Starmer's trying to do,
which is we're going to bring in a digital ID. And the point he made was to stop illegal immigrants
from working and essentially taking jobs from everyday Brits, right? And you think,
God, he's a good guy. He's looking after the Brits, right? The UK has one of the strongest
navies in the world. You think they couldn't just go and park some destroys and frigates and what
have you in the channel and just say, guess what? No more immigrants. But what they've done
is they've deliberately allowed that problem to take place.
They could have easily have stopped the boats, right?
They could have got old Tony Abbott over there
and he would have sorted it out.
Like that was his catchphrase
in the 2013 Australian election was stop the boats.
And as soon as he got elected, you know what he did?
He stopped the boats.
He just sent the destroyers up there
and they just turned them all back, right?
And so the illegal trafficking stopped pretty much overnight.
This is destroying Britain deliberately.
I think it's by design.
It's create the problem.
and now we've got the solution.
And they're trying to run this.
I think it was Switzerland, Sean,
where they're trying to also bring in another digital ID.
And they just had a vote on it.
It's been through something like three times
and it hasn't got passed by the public.
And just recently, I think it was like 50.6% approved of it, right?
Like, oh, look, they approve of it.
So I think we're good to go now.
And I think if people really realize,
because I mean, we talk about it right now saying,
oh, it's terrible.
I actually sat down with someone before Keir Starmer was talking about it, and it was a parent at the school.
And I said, you know, they're talking, this is to Bob, right?
Bob, the other parent there.
I said, you know, they're talking about bringing in a digital ID into Australia.
And this was probably around when Albanese was talking about this under 16s, you know, protect the children social ID thing.
And he said, no joke, he said, I think it's a good thing.
And I was just like, really?
He says, yeah, well, you know, I've got nothing to hide.
You know, I'm happy if they want to see everything that I'm doing.
And I said, well, do you also realize that it's going to, I believe,
is going to be forming part of your social credit score, right?
Now, for people that don't understand what the social credit score is,
it means that the government can track everything you do.
So you go to the petrol station, you go to buy fuel.
Beep, beep, sorry, declined.
You've used too much fuel for the month.
Your carbon credit is too much.
Go to the checkout for Coles and buying some meat or something.
Beep, beep, sorry, declined.
You've overstepped your allowance for meat this month, right?
Electricity, beep, beep, sorry, declined.
And it's not even just purchasing things.
There's things like, hey, we did a retina scan of you as you were driving down the road
and we saw you holding a mobile phone or something.
Boom, instantly driver license canceled.
And now you can't drive for like a year, right?
You can't even get into a car.
I mean, it just goes on and on and on.
And if people love that type of idea of complete government control oversight, then maybe move somewhere else where they've got it.
I often talk about, Sean, let's create our own sovereign state within Australia, right?
Where we can just have our own Bitcoin standard.
We can just be free people.
On the flip side, I live very close to Byron Bay, home of the commies and the socialists.
There's like total socialism down there.
And I often joke and say, we should just sanction off Byron Bay and let them have it, right? They can fight amongst themselves and have all the commie shit they want down there, right? We don't want it out here. The proper people don't want it.
So look, I think it's a major, major issue
and people really need to wake up to what's happening.
And I'll be shocked if it actually gets passed eventually in the UK
because what they're talking about is bringing it in
by the end of the term of government.
So Keir Starmer, I think in the UK, they have about a five-year term.
So they've got about roughly another four years to go to roll this out
and let's just see how it does roll out
and if there's going to be more marches in the street.
Yeah, it would be interesting.
What I've loved to see is the pushback in the last week.
I think the figures I saw today was like 2.4 or 2.5 million people have petitioned against it.
So the awareness, like in such a short period of time, like a matter of days, that's gotten out there.
So I think that's pretty exciting to see that people are actually paying attention.
But when it comes to Australia, that conversation is not there for the majority of people, I think.
Australians in general are starting to wake up with a couple of things that's happening like just
this week, Monday, twice within 24 hours, I got totally debanked from our company bank accounts
trying to buy Bitcoin. So we can go into that as well. But there's just like all these little
touch points and people are now, I think, really in the last six to 12 months feeling the effects
of inflation. A lot of the rhetoric is still other greedy grocers or whatever. But when you start to
talk to people, they're like, oh, it's so expensive. And you have a conversation. You're
like, you do realize they're not just jacking up the prices for no reason. It's because the
government printed so much more currency in response to the COVID pandemic or scandemic,
whatever you want to call it. And they're like, oh, is that how inflation works? Yes,
that's exactly how inflation works. The government's directly responsible for it.
And then you're like, you do understand that the Australian dollar since 1966, I believe,
has lost 93% of its purchasing power.
Whoa.
And the last six years,
it's lost more than 50% of its purchasing power.
Whoa.
What can I do?
Ladies and gentlemen,
this is exactly what you can do.
You can read the books, the big print.
Yeah.
You start there and start to understand it.
But I think now Australians
are really starting to feel that pain.
Their pay may go up with a little bit
with inflation or something,
but not enough for real inflation.
I get the inflation numbers and figures
from Jim Sharma's, which is so made up, is celebrating the other day. And they're starting
to realize that the math is not mapping anymore. So I guess that brings us directly into Bitcoin.
And how does Bitcoin protect someone with all of these things? In a self-managed super fund,
how does Bitcoin protect someone's retirement? In their personal funds, when they hold their
own keys, you have to hold your own Bitcoin keys, ladies and gentlemen. There's no option. It can't
be on the exchange. It can't be on the ETF. You have to take 100% self-custody.
with that. But then how does it also open up like freedom of movement, like plan B citizenships,
et cetera? How does it save you even if they bring out digital IDs and CBDs? If you've got
a relationship with a butcher or something, it's this peer-to-peer electronic money.
How does Bitcoin come in and actually make everything better? Like how's Bitcoin fix this?
Well, first of all, I want to say on this whole self-custody thing, Sean,
I've been a big fan of your channel for so long that I actually signed up with the Bitcoin way,
the trusted cybersecurity partners.
And I know that you're a big fan of them
and I signed up through you.
So thank you so much for introducing me
to the Bitcoin way.
And I think that everyone should do that.
I know you probably have a link
in your description below
and people should really take advantage of that
because it really is absolutely
the most important thing you could possibly do.
When you get the node
and you've got your own sovereign bank,
your world starts to change
and you do start to realize that,
hey, the Bitcoin is in my possession
and no one else can seize it.
It's really, really powerful.
Look, I talk to so many people,
particularly in my own online community,
which has now grown to like over 1,400 people,
mainly Australians.
It actually started because I was a bit,
what do I want to do with my life?
I wanted to continue talking about Bitcoin.
I'm just going to create this community
and it's just completely gone bananas.
I'll link it below for everyone.
It's free.
Thanks, Sean.
By the way.
You can come in there.
Yeah, it's absolutely free to join.
And what I do in there is I've got just information about Bitcoin, of course, but in particular, I've got a step-by-step guide of actually how to move your funds from your industry super or retail super into an SMSF and allocate to Bitcoin.
My dad has bought Bitcoin.
I want to say that.
He's 74.
He's got his own Bitcoin stack.
But both of my sisters have now created an SMSF and allocated to Bitcoin.
because they've seen obviously the purchasing power
of their own money going down.
Their super is absolutely struggling.
I spoke to a friend of mine the other day,
he's nearly 50 years old.
I said, dude, how much money have you got in super right now?
180 grand.
I was like, oh my God.
I said can I say the F word I said I literally said Yeah of course Fuck You fucked Yeah Proper I wanted to just say that to him in a way of like dude you need to wake up
Because I said, unless you want to retire on the pension, then fine.
Like don't do anything.
Like do nothing then if you want to retire on the pension.
Do you know that the Australian industry super funds, they've got this website, right?
And it tells you how much you should expect to live on when you retire.
At the moment, because the thing is, Sean, when we were indoctrinated into super, most people think that when they just go to work, they go to work, they finish at 65 or whatever, and they're just going to have this amazing life.
That's the time I can sort of travel the world and buy the caravan and all this, right?
That's not happening, right?
when you do the numbers, but the industry, the superannuation industry website tells you that
even on the best case for the average Australian, you will be able to retire at 65 and you'll be
able to go on one international holiday once every seven years, right? That's what they classify as
great. By the time you get to, what is that early 17s, you've been on one. So by the time you get to
80, you may have been on two international holidays, right? It is a disgrace. Even at the
lower end, when you're on a pension, it actually says, how many haircuts do you expect to get?
You can't have any haircuts. You cannot afford a haircut. They're like, you're going to have to
cut your own hair, right? So this is the reality and the practical side of what does it mean to
have minimal amount of money in retirement? It's going to mean, A, you probably can't retire.
you've probably got to keep working.
Mark Buros is now famous.
I saw a clip of him.
He's like, look, most Australians are going to have to work
until they're 80 or 90.
Because if they think they're retiring at 65,
their money's just not going to last
because they're living older as well, right?
That is the other factor.
So you're going to basically live older
and you're going to be poor for most of it, right?
And that one I told you about at the beginning of,
you know, holiday every seven, every one to seven,
one holiday every seven years,
that's if you own your own house, right?
So if you're renting, you're double fucked.
So I encourage people to look at allocating to Bitcoin as a hedge against the currency debasement, the money printing, right?
So that they can stack a pile.
And in retirement, they can then say, hey, you know what?
At least this has grown at a CAGA right now, roughly, Sean.
If you listen to Michael Saylor, at least 29% over the next 20 years.
And then after that, probably down to 21%.
If you can withstand the volatility, the great thing about allocating in an SMSF is that you can't touch it anyway.
So you either leave it in your shithouse 7% to 8%, at best case, 10% average, right?
Which is not going to deliver you a good retirement or one that you probably think you're going to get.
Or you allocate to Bitcoin.
Now, people should also know they don't have to allocate.
Let's say you're on the fence.
You're like, I don't know, Sean.
I know Sean talks it up a lot and he's got his super and Bitcoin, but I don't have the conviction like Sean has.
No problem.
You might have $180,000 sitting in super like my friend.
You could just pull that $80,000.
You just put $80,000 of your super into an SMSF and have two things happening.
What you're going to hear, though, from financial advisors who most likely are broke themselves,
themselves. They're providing advice on finances and retirement. They're living paycheck to paycheck
short, right? But if you put $80,000 into Bitcoin, I believe that will grow substantially far greater
than even your $100,000 left in your industry fund and will set you up for retirement. So people
have got options is what I want to say. Yeah, I think that's a great option. I think one caveat
it is yes, Bitcoin is volatile and the volatility is coming out of the markets with the big hedge
funds, Wall Street and everything like that. We're not getting these big 36% drawdowns that
we could get on any random Tuesday. I want them to come back. I'm hoping for more dips,
but it sort of feels like they're going away. And Bitcoin only moves like nine to 11 days per year.
So it's sort of like sideways or down and then it'll make its moves. And today is almost one
of those moves. I think you could almost count it as one of those one day out of 11 this year.
But keeping a traditional industry super fund, like you can talk to Matt's partners, you can talk
to my partners, you can talk to anyone else that provides self-managed super fund setup. Just find
someone that understands allocating to Bitcoin specifically, that's putting a bit of effort so
you don't get talked out of that. So a big lot of feedback that I've gotten. I've talked to people
about setting up a self-managed super fund to buy on Bitcoin,
the financial advisor says, no, you shouldn't do that.
By keeping your traditional one that you have at the moment
and then your self-managed super fund,
with a self-managed super fund,
it's whatever you choose to put in there or add on top of it.
So like insurance and things that doesn't necessarily come with it,
your super fund, industry super fund that you've had for 5, 10, 15, 20, 30 years
might already have great life insurance and things like that
or other things attached to it,
which may not provide you cash flow or money, but which may be beneficial.
You don't want to just shut that down on a whim because you get all excited about Bitcoin.
Like take it slow.
Talk to somebody that understands what's going on because there may be a benefit of even leaving
five grand, 10 grand or leaving that hundred grand in there and just rolling a little bit
out.
But over to you, brother.
Well, Sean, that's a really good point that you've just raised there.
So I want to bring up two points now.
is one is I actually do know someone very close to me who did close down their industry or retail
super fund. And then within a month, her husband got diagnosed with brain cancer. And so because
he closed his super down, that came with some insurances. So they missed out on $300,000 to $500,000,
which would have really helped them. So Sean's point of perhaps leaving that open. Now,
the other option of course for people is you can shut that down and what what had happened Sean is
they knew the insurance had gone but when they opened up their SMSF it was like you know and
he's only very young I think it's like 30 32 or something right 30 odd years old well I will worry
about the insurance later we'll get we'll get to that later okay so I want to just say the most
important thing out of this conversation is definitely seek advice from someone who knows
the setup who can give you the right advice because we are both not financial advisors
and and make sure it's set up properly so you don't have something like that that happens to you
and you can be looked after if and when and of course that's why you have insurance right it's
the unexpected and of course this was totally unexpected just completely came out of the blue
um so the other point i want to make too is though you also at the same token have to go
with someone who you can trust and and this is so so important because we've just saw in recent
we've just seen recently, Sean, that even financial advisors can steer you in the wrong direction,
allocating your super to funds. For example, the two that just collapsed in Australia recently,
where 12,000 people, it was over like a billion dollars, evaporated into thin air. Okay. Absolute
tragic set of circumstance for people. There was even stories about guys who, you know, they're 65,
They're literally retiring next week.
They go to their fund account, gone, right?
This guy had like over a million dollars
and they're like ready for a decent retirement.
So you've got to really have your wits about you
and just, I guess, you know,
maybe not necessarily listen to the financial advisor,
like, you know, what is the ulterior motive here?
And it turned out the ulterior motive was
that we're getting kickbacks, right?
Bitcoin doesn't provide kickbacks.
No, Bitcoin provides personally,
Like if you buy Bitcoin, you hold on to it for a long enough time,
it's going to kick back a whole lot more life and time to you.
That's the kickback that Bitcoin.
But if you or I recommend it to someone, of course, right,
it's not like the Bitcoin treasury is sending us some Bitcoin
because we sold someone to Bitcoin.
Yeah, that's right.
And like I spent now $2,350 or more this year handing this book out
and a couple of other Bitcoin books to people.
I'm like, I believe in this so much.
I spent my own money to be able to give it to you.
If you read it within a week, I'll give you another $50 in Bitcoin just for reading.
They're like, why?
I'm like, so that you understand Bitcoin, you get Bitcoin.
They're like, what's in it for you?
I'm like, nothing.
And they're like, no, what's in it for you?
I'm like, the peace, the satisfaction that my friends and family and my community are
not going to struggle.
They're not going to be broke.
They're not going to be subject to the tyranny.
That's what's in it for me.
They're like, no, like if I buy, is it going to pump your Bitcoin bag?
It's like over a $2 trillion market cap.
Like, come on, guys.
Like, you know, like you buying a little bit, even if it's tens of millions of dollars,
it's not going to do anything to my bag or your bag or anything like that.
Like we're seeing, you know, people, one whale sold $12 billion over like a 30-day period,
hardly moved the price.
Michael Saylor will buy billions of dollars, I think $23 billion or whatever it was on
the weekend.
Price doesn't move or whatever.
and then it's just those 11 days where there's just no supply
and it's just bang to the upside.
But there's really like the ulterior motive is it's nicer being around people
that have time, energy, the capacity to be able to think
and that comes down to having a bit of wealth behind you to whatever extent
and that may be somebody starting out that's living paycheck to paycheck.
They've got a month of savings that they can live off if something goes wrong
and then it goes to like five weeks and six weeks
and then it extends out to a quarter and then six months and then a year and then you get two
years of runway or whatever and then you just realize that you've got the power to be able to
say like no I don't want to do that fuck you like I quit or whatever you're having a bad day or you
can't be coerced into anything which I think is pretty powerful but when you keep going deeper
down the bitcoin rabbit hole and you start to see like digital ids and the tyranny central bank
digital currencies, just even the attack of freedom of speech. That's what I believe in most
of all is I might not agree with something somebody says, but I will respect them because
they believe in their beliefs so much. I may not agree with their beliefs in the slightest or
whatever, or I may agree with some things or another, but I respect them. The marches in
Australia, both sides, I respect it. We live in a free country, supposedly. They should be able to
do that it's just like the small minority of people in the front lines that cause the issues
on the front like on the left or the right I think the majority of people are just wanting to get
their emotions heard and the anger and the pain and everything like that all for it but when you're
like this group can speak that group can't speak you're you're racist or you're right wing or left
wing or whatever it is and they just try shut down one side of the conversation but not not both sides
you're like, this is too much. What's going on? And you see all those things, digital IDs,
CBDCs that we're mentioning, cost of living, the money printing that's getting harder and harder,
just the wealth taxes. So then a lot of Bitcoiners start talking about plan B passports. And I've had
Tony Yazbek on, I've got a plan B passport for somewhere. As well, it's not a tax haven,
it's just sort of the next step if things were to really go wrong dramatically. But I love this
country. It's amazing. Like I walk upstairs, we're looking out at the Great Barrier Reef. I don't
want to leave that. Like I love it, but it's good to know, dude, so special. It's good to know that
I do have that option. And something you said earlier is you're dematerializing your life.
Like you've made a lot of money, serial entrepreneur, you've got all the cars, the real
estate, commercial, residential, et cetera. But now you're in this process of dematerializing
your wealth and you're looking at seriously looking to options for a plan B passport.
How did I, I guess, first question,
what the hell is dematerializing your life mean?
And then how's that time with the plan B passport?
I've coined the phrase dematerializing.
Other people are starting to catch onto it now.
I love it.
And so what, I guess there's a couple of parts to this.
One is that I think in Australia, Sean,
we have this thing where you want to build wealth,
you know, through business or what have you.
You buy property and then if you,
You know, I've done quite well in business.
So you're like, oh, I'm going to go buy some cars.
And one car leads to the next car.
And then I've got, you know, like 10 cars, basically.
And then you get to that and you think, actually, this is actually a bit of a pain.
This is a real pain for me because now I've got all these insurances and I've got like
10 lots of like servicing.
So now it becomes time.
And although it's fun to have these things, eventually you just want to get a bit sick
of it.
And it's not just me.
I just spoke to a guy the other day, multi, multi, multi.
This guy's got like a million dollars in watches, you know, like sitting in the cabinet, right?
Four Harley Davidson bikes, okay?
I was talking to this guy the other day.
He's like, what you said the other day really resonated with me because I think I want to
dematerialize as well, right?
So this has become like a bit of a thing now that I've found and people are gravitating
to me because I'm talking about it openly.
So I'm getting rid of the cars.
The cars are all gone, by the way, except for my two cars that I use daily cars.
the car collection's gone my first commercial property's gone i've got two more commercial
properties to go which i've got one settling in the 24th another one settling 30 days after that
this in october i've then got another residential property go right so and there's that and then
i've still got the house that i live in but most of those big things will start going and i'm putting
the majority of that obviously got to pay off some mortgages and things like that but majority of
that is then going to go back into into bitcoin right now i do a couple of things though not just like Bitcoin as in the pure Bitcoin but I also mine Bitcoin into pure Bitcoin So I do a few different things to continually have my flow coming in
And I absolutely love Bitcoin mining as well.
We have to talk about KYC free Bitcoin.
Let's come back to that.
It's almost a whole other episode.
Let me wrap up.
The last bit we'll touch on the KYC briefly, but keep going.
I'm dematerializing to put more money into Bitcoin.
And secondly, too, it's actually not,
even if I think about the properties,
it's the control that the government has
over the properties as well, right?
So when we talk about unrealized capital gains tax,
if I just circle back to that for a second,
there was a wake-up call from me,
I'm like, shit, if they're going to come after super
and that passes, why would they just not come after properties
or just any other legal entity structure,
trust, companies, et cetera, right?
There'll be no reason for them to say, oh, well, we're just going to unrealize capital gains, all this other stuff now, because we're money hungry now.
We've got no money of our own, right?
Because we're spending money like drunken sailors.
So I was like, you know, get rid of that.
In residential property right now, if you personally hold residential property, you are considered evil, right?
The commies and the socialists hate it, right?
Because particularly if you've got investment properties, okay?
So the government right now has either-
Greedy landlords.
rental cap, really landlords that have rental caps. Or if I don't want to have someone come in
with like 10 dogs, I have to let them come in. I don't have the right now to say you can't come in
with animals, right? Whether I like animals or not. So, and I do, I do love animals, but I don't
have the right over my own property, right? And I don't like that kind of control. So that's another
reason to get out of it. And the better asset to allocate to for all the attributes that you and I
both know about Sean is Bitcoin, right? So I'm just dumping it. It also ties in with the plan B.
So if I get to the point and I'm not 110% going, but I'm certainly, I'm meeting with visa agents.
I'm looking at, you know, I'm talking to tax lawyers or I'm doing all the steps,
but I'm leaving a sort of a caveat there. It's like, I don't have to go if I don't want to,
right? Because of course you've got to bring your family along on this journey too.
So I will get to the point where I'll have the plan B passport
and all my assets will be dematerialized
and then I can just go pretty much whenever I want.
That's kind of where we're headed to.
On that note, I just want to say to people,
when people get, like you and I, we get orange-pilled.
My wife wasn't orange-pilled at the same time as me.
My wife is not also plan B-pilled the same time as me.
So although I've got the higher conviction in the beginning,
it takes time.
I think people have to bring their partner along the journey as well.
Because when I said to Paula one day, maybe I think we should allocate our super into Bitcoin,
that wasn't the first day of me discovering Bitcoin.
That was a journey to get to that point.
In fact, there were people I'd met before discovering this who had told me that they had allocated their super to Bitcoin.
And I remember thinking, these guys are crazy.
This is what I was thinking.
I'm like, man, you should be diversifying.
This is what I had in my head.
You don't diversify.
But, of course, once you read the books, you do the homework,
just like you talk about Sean, you then understand why.
Yeah.
And I think if people, say, start with the big print by Lawrence Lippard,
they follow it up with Parallel by Brian Zemans
and then maybe like the Bitcoin Standard,
that's, I would say, 50 hours of reading material there.
I think that would give someone like 150 to 200 hours
of concentrated knowledge that's been dispensed
and then if you can put in a couple of like key podcasts like um the video by joe what's the
problem etc it takes a thousand hours i think before you start to get to this like really
orange pill 100 hours lights go off i think you can do that now with the big print third and a
half hour read you've got that 100 hours of knowledge and then you get to 200 but once you
get to a thousand it's just being very selective with what you're doing because it comes back to
this conversation of like signal verse noise there is so much information and stuff out there now
or you may start with the bitcoin standard but i've handed that book to so many people matthew
and they like give it back to me like this and like it's too much man i'm like oh like i'll go
to beers for bitcoin or whatever and i've found the most success with the big print um it's had
the biggest impact orange peeling my wife which took like many years later as well yeah let me
Let's throw another book at you, Sean.
Can I throw another one in there for the audience?
Brian DeMint's Bitcoin Evangelism.
Well, parallels his second book.
I know, but I think the Bitcoin Evangelism is a bit more palatable
rather than sometimes the Bitcoin standard, right?
Because he kind of tells it in a story format in a way of how he discovered it.
So I think that is also a good one for audiences as well.
Yeah, maybe just not as academic.
I think if you're like academically trained or academically minded,
or you're like really deep into the financial system already,
but willing to see a different view, the Bitcoin standard.
And I think the Bitcoin standard is an essential reading book.
I just don't think it's the first book.
I'd put it sort of like three to five on the reading list.
As a reader, just out of curiosity,
have you read Eric Kaysen's Crypto Sovereignty?
Oh, geez, you know what?
I have a stack of books like literally behind my back.
I went book crazy and I started, I've got to get this book.
I went through all of Michael Saylor's Hope website
and any book that he had on there, I was like, just buy, buy, buy, buy, buy.
And I just haven't got to the stack.
You know what I mean?
Like there's such a huge stack there.
But I've got them.
I've definitely read the Bitcoin Standard, right,
which is essential reading for anybody.
But I don't know about that one.
Yeah.
It's like I tell people I need to read at least five Bitcoin books first
because Eric Kaysen is just an amazing individual,
crypto anarchist phenomenal but for a new person it'd scare them away but i think you'd love it
it's intense um it's real but it's highly enjoyable so i just want to spend like a couple
of minutes talking about kyc free bitcoin like literally like three to five i think we are going
to have to do a whole podcast strictly on it because it's such a big um topic but you are
an advocate uh for mining mining bitcoin i want you to talk about two things like how do you get
KYC free Bitcoin, but also what are the costs?
Because you can't, like if you just put $100,000 into Bitcoin,
then it's $100,000 of Bitcoin.
If you put $100,000 into miners, it's going to spit Bitcoin out over time.
But like really you need to be able to pay those miners off as well.
And then they need to be upgraded in a few years and stuff.
So there are costs.
Yeah, Sean, people should not tune out now.
They need to stay tuned into this.
this is going to be just gold dropping, just bombs everywhere in the next two minutes, right?
Because people are going to be thinking, how the fuck do I get more Bitcoin? And the thing is,
what people want is they want sovereignty and they want privacy when they're getting Bitcoin
particularly. It just turns out that when you buy a Bitcoin mining machine, the banks don't
have any scrutiny on it. AUSTRAC doesn't have any scrutiny on it. ATO doesn't have any scrutiny on it.
You are literally buying computers.
That's what you're buying.
And the big issue that we kind of haven't touched on yet is trying to get funds from your bank into, let's say, an exchange, right?
Which is a not, but you've just had, you've just been debanked, as you said before, right?
Twice.
This week.
It's shocking.
We'll have to talk about that later.
But if you can transfer like a hundred grand over to a Bitcoin mining place, and I use the mining store based out of Melbourne, right?
They're an Australian company.
they're the best in the business. I can just transfer $100,000 to the mining store.
They allocate it to Bitcoin mining machines and it's done. I don't have any blockages. No one's
debanking me. And there's no reporting on it. There's no KYC. So people have to understand that
when you go to like a bank, when you go set up an exchange, mostly, particularly in Australia,
you'll have to do a KYC. KYC is know your customer. You have to give up all your ID.
They know who you are. Right now, some people might be happy with that. But if you're just
someone who wants to get non-KYC Bitcoin mining is it. The second thing to think about is it's also
virgin Bitcoin, right? It hasn't been through 10,000 other hands through the blockchain, okay?
So when you're receiving the Bitcoin, it's like the first bit, okay? So it's not, I don't know how
you would describe it, Sean. It's not been stamped many, many times with other people's fingerprints,
right? You're receiving the Bitcoin. And you're also getting Bitcoin cheaper than what you would
get it through an exchange. Because of course, the exchange is the businesses. They need to put a
a margin and a premium on the purchase themselves, right?
So you're getting it direct.
That's just a few of the attributes of the reason I love.
And of course, I just love the fact that I'm a part of the network, right?
The Bitcoin mining is a part of the network.
I'm supporting the network.
Now, as far as stacking goes, yes, there are some costs you've got to think about.
You've got to obviously buy the machines.
You've got to also pay for electricity ongoing.
Now, I don't really care though.
because of the reasons of buying it.
Virgin, non-KYC, and stacking it in my own sovereign wallet.
So there's some of the things, Sean, right, without going too, too deep.
Yeah, I think we need to do a whole other podcast, Matthew, on it.
But for everyone, I've linked Matthew's YouTube channel below.
Like you absolutely must subscribe.
Highly recommended, highly endorsed.
And then Matt goes into it a lot, and with Adam Hudson,
you went into it a bit deeper as well.
I love that episode with you too.
I loved it how I saw the episode with you and him on his channel.
And then there's you and him.
Yeah.
We should do a swapsie.
You come on,
come on the crypto collective.
We'll we'll do that.
It won't be straight after this one today though,
but it's been a hectic day.
It's crazy.
It's been a hectic week with the banks and everything,
but we'll save that for another time,
but I'm just going to hand over the microphone.
The floor is yours.
take a moment or two to whatever's top of mind, whatever you're the most passionate about or could
be the most impactful for someone new to Bitcoin or new on their wealth acquiring journey or that's
been here for a long time. Whatever it is, whatever message, burning desire you want to get across,
it's all yours. Sean, well, thank you so much. There's so much I could really say. The first
thing I think is that people shouldn't look up to me as the be on end or as the voice of Bitcoin.
What I find is that I'm just on the journey just like everybody else, right?
I might know a little bit more than some people.
And what I also love about Bitcoin is I'm learning about Bitcoin every single day.
There's something new that comes up that I'm thinking, I didn't know I could lend against Bitcoin.
I didn't know I could do this with Bitcoin.
And I think that's what's so powerful.
So I think people should just come in and just think, if they're thinking, oh, I don't know about Bitcoin.
We've all started at the beginning.
I was actually someone, Sean, who was opposed to Bitcoin, like avidly opposed to Bitcoin in the last decade because I didn't understand it.
I hadn't done the research. I hadn't put in the work.
So I think people just need to go on their own journey and also understand that we are still early in the cycle of Bitcoin.
Bitcoin is going to be running, being mined, let's say, if we go back to mining, up until the year 2140.
So there is a long runway of Bitcoin.
And I think in 10 years time, in five years time, people will look back to the people that bought in 2025 and say, wow, you guys, you were pioneers.
How did you have the foresight to buy Bitcoin in 2025?
So I think there's never a late time to allocate.
I also want to say that I really do think that the window is closing for people who want to allocate in Australia.
It's very, very difficult right now because the banks are basically against it.
Now, you can still do it, right?
There are options.
That's why they should join and listen to people like yourself, Sean, because you've got some insight into different things.
My community, I've got a lot of insight into how do we move money from a bank to exchanges?
What are the things that we can do to make sure it gets across, right?
There's many different sort of options that are behind the scenes, I guess.
It can be a little bit more complicated.
That's why you have to have a step-by-step.
But people can do it, and they really just need to take the first step.
I always say to people, Sean, just start with like $100.
Don't overcomplicate this, right?
Because I think a lot of people come in thinking,
oh, I've got, you know, he's talking about putting all my superannuation in there.
Oh, it's too complicated.
No, start with setting up an exchange.
I advocate for CoinStash.
Personally, I think they're the number one exchange in Australia.
They're certainly for SMSF they are.
So you set up a CoinStash account, you send over $100 and you just start there.
You learn the processes, the systems, and then you'll head off into the stratosphere after that,
certainly with your knowledge and understanding. And you'll probably end up in a position just like
me where you just start selling everything around the house, right? If it's not cars and properties,
it's going to be the exercise bike and the jet ski that you don't drive anymore.
I think that's a good place to be able to end it there. But I'm going to put
the link to Matthew's free community in the description below, as well as his YouTube,
social medias and stuff. And I'm definitely, if you're interested in KYC Free Bitcoin,
check out some of the specific videos that Matthew has done on mining Bitcoin, because it is
something that I'm very interested in and I want to learn more about as well. I absolutely appreciate
your time. It's fascinating. I love the signal that you're getting out there and tuning into
your podcast. Thanks, Sean. Mate, I absolutely think you're a legend in this space. It's been
an absolute honor to be on your channel.
And I look forward to seeing you in person,
maybe in November at the CryptoCon.
I will not be traveling for Bitcoin this year.
No, not this year.
It's just I've traveled.
Maybe we can meet up in person some other time.
Yeah, maybe at Christmas actually,
but we'll talk after we get off here.
For everyone out there,
please do something nice for yourself today
for somebody else out there.
Be blessed.
Peace.