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Hello, everybody. My name is Daniel Prince, and I'm the host of the Once Bitten podcast.

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This is a podcast focused on Bitcoin. It's my mission to interview as many people as I can

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around the different aspects of Bitcoin and help people understand exactly what Bitcoin could mean

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for them and for their families and for their future. I hope you enjoy the show. Thank you so

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much for listening. Hello everybody and welcome to this episode of the Once Bitten podcast.

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Joining me today is Anuja from Travel with Bitcoin. She fell down the rabbit hole and

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started her own company combining her two passions, traveling and Bitcoin. She goes

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into the whole story so stick around for the whole episode. It's a brilliant journey and just

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for those that are interested get over to travelwithbitcoin.com have a look around you can

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book some tours you can also look at travel hosts this is cool and in the travel hosts you have

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BitDriver so anybody heading to El Salvador can get straight in touch before you leave with BitDriver

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and they're going to help you out with your whole itinerary where to go where not to go when to get

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picked up at the airport take it to your airbnb or hotel or whatever all in bitcoin like this is

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the kind of services that are now being offered and i think it's really important that we showcase

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them and share them uh so go to the website travelwithbitcoin.com and i hope you find

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something there that resonates with you and reach out to anuja if there's anywhere else you'd like

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to go because she's always open to ideas. Now, before we get into the show, thank you as always

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to the show sponsors, long lasting sponsors, Relai, R-E-L-A-I.ch forward slash Bitten. Download

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they have a whole private arm as well so relay r-e-l-a-i dot c-h forward slash bitten now if you

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through the tutorials. Make sure you know what you're doing. Write down your seed words. Get in

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control of your Bitcoin. Anuja, who's joining us on this podcast today, she's also part of Club

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Orange. Yes, shocked to know, I am sure, that somebody who loves travel would use the best

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app in Bitcoin to find other Bitcoiners when she's on her travels. She actually works within

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the team now after seeing an ad posted by Mateo, and she's working closely with a lot of the event

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organizers all around the world where she is going to be curating little trips side trips but we get

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into all of that in the interview but club orange is the shill go check it out there's a link in the

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show notes you can go and download the link and join 20 000 bitcoiners around the world today

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looking to connect then get to a conference ireland prague or btc hell all 10 off using the

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code bitter enjoy this one with Anuja all right Anuja welcome to the show thank you Daniel I'm so

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excited to be here glad to have you here and we got connected through Club Orange which was Orange

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Pilap because you joined the the team there with with Mateo and then your name came up on my

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interview with Brendan when he was talking about your trip to Africa and everything that he's doing

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over there with the orphanage and the Bitcoin Circle economy. If nobody's listened to that

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episode about Brendan and his work in Uganda, please go back and listen to it. It's so uplifting.

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Brilliant story. But let's get the listeners up to speed with who you are, what you were doing

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pre-Bitcoin? What was kind of just Anuja bumping along in Fiat Normie land? What did that look like?

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Okay. All right. So pre-Bitcoin, which to be honest, Daniel, isn't that long ago.

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I would still consider myself a bit new in the Bitcoin world. So prior to Bitcoin,

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I was at a corporate job. I was there for about seven years. So I am, this was back when I was in

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Canada. So originally I'm Indian, parents immigrated to Canada when I was super young. So I was raised

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there, you know, went to school, university, found my first job at Microsoft, which was like a dream

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come true for sure. Nothing to do with like coding or anything. I actually suck at like anything

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related to programming, but it was more on the sales side. I'm like definitely a people person.

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I want to be customer facing. I want to build relationships. Like those are things that really

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excite me. And so I found my way into sales and absolutely loved it. Started off in kind of more

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of the technical aspect. So implementing software and SaaS services for our clients and then went

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into pre-sales and that was my career evolution trajectory as you may call um and then COVID

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happened and my husband and I realized that you know there has to be more in this world

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than being in front of our screens and working our jobs and I think it got to a point that we

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were both very comfortable with our lives which is totally fine but we realized that if we just

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stay put for a few more years we're gonna have a really hard time leaving Canada and seeing what

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else is out there and the two the one of the main things that both my husband and I really connected

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on when we first started dating was traveling and our love for like seeing the world and exploring

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so we worked on a plan to take a sabbatical and we saved up made up this crazy plan and this idea

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that we wanted to do this. And it just kept pushing. We just kept pushing it back because

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it's a pretty big thing to do. And it, you know, impacts all aspects of your life, right? Like

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career, you have to quit your job, got to sell your home, got to sell your car, you're away from

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your family, it affects your health, your just everything. And so we pushed it far enough. And

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then one day my husband's like, that's it. We're booking a one-way flight and that's our timeline.

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and that's what we're going to work towards.

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And I think one of us needed to do that.

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So we did that and this was August of 2023,

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a year after we got married.

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And then since then, we've been on the road

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and that's when I would say my journey

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into Bitcoin also started.

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So pre-Bitcoin, Anuja was corporate,

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took this time off to travel the world.

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My husband really wanted to see

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how Bitcoin was being adopted, grassroots level.

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And so that's how I got into Bitcoin because I saw it happening. I'm a very much like if I see it in front of me, if I talk to people about it, definitely not like read books, podcasts, you know, do scroll on X that just didn't work for me.

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But yeah, I'll stop rambling. That's kind of the story of pre Bitcoin and Ultra.

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wow uh right i get a question because what you you did the thing right uh especially as

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an indian family going to live in canada you did the schooling you did the university

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you got the degrees you got the dream job parents are very happy and proud

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then oh my god yeah we're leaving we're selling everything and i'm resigning like how did that go

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okay so I'm not gonna lie I was super scared to tell my parents even though I'm like a grown

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30 year old woman with her own life you know I was terrified because of you know you don't want

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to disappoint them right like they gave up everything that they had you know almost 30

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years ago now or 25 years ago let's say couldn't even speak the language really left everything

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that everyone and everything that they have known moved to this foreign land to give me and my

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brother a better education of course a better life for them as well but they've made a lot of

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sacrifices right like all my grandparents do and families do so I just didn't want to disappoint

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them but honestly I remember breaking the news to them I took them on this like beautiful walk

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out in the nature got them all calm and then I dropped the news right and they were actually very

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supportive you know one of the things that always like it sticks around is you know we're just so

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happy that you can do the things that at this age in your life that we could have never even thought

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about doing or we never had the option to do and so very supportive they definitely questioned us

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quite quite a bit in terms of like what are your plans after what are you going to do after

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they're still questioning us

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because it's been two and a half years

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and we're still kind of on the road

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but similar to my husband's parents

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my husband name is Sintosh even his parents are super supportive so thankfully both our families kind of get it and yeah they been they been okay with it so far that amazing you know that

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they it's the difficult conversations that uh stop people actually taking action on this because I

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know a lot of plebs listening to this that they're stuck in their fiat job maybe they've stacked for

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cycle or two and they're eyeing the exit door they just sit there dreaming of leaving their cubicle

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and you know bitcoin's just got to get to xyz number and i'll be able to throw it all in and

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go sail off into the wind and everything will be fine and uh there's no magic time moment or number

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like there just isn't and i totally agree with that and i would love your perspective too because

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I know you and your I'm assuming your wife at the time you guys were married already okay so you

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left at 22 that's pretty okay for you to leave and what were your plans at that time was it more

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to travel to go somewhere else what were you guys planning on doing 22 wow you're going back a long

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time now the late 90s uh that was that was a job opportunity for me uh in in Singapore so I've been

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extended a few job opportunities in Singapore which uh I ended up well consulting Claire and

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saying well how would this work if I took this job you know long distance relationships never

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going to work and I just don't want to you know take it she's like well I'll come with you okay

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well that was easy let's go love that didn't even need to convince her ready yeah and that turned it

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and it was supposed to be like a two-year contract but like everything you get there you make friends

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you make a network your career starts cementing you become better and more efficient at your job

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and you're more well respected.

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And there's just way more opportunities

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outside of London where everybody wanted to be

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and it was dog eat dog.

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And so, yeah, it became very easy for us to stick around

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and that turned into 15 years living there

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and four kids.

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So, yeah.

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Oh my God.

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So you were in Singapore for 15 years?

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Yes.

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Wow.

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Well, I've never been to Singapore,

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but I've always heard phenomenal things about it.

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So that must have been incredible.

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it was an incredible time as well because the city like the actual cbd the central business

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district was a quarter of the size it is now like you saw some incredible growth yeah so all right

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so you're you're now you've been doing the thing right the kind of nomad digital nomad like

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four-hour work week kind of life trying to figure something out uh i guess you had an idea you'd

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have to make some kind of income along the way. What did you try? Okay, so I would say for the

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first year, our mind was pretty set that this is a sabbatical. So we did go with the intention of,

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you know, traveling and seeing what is out there in the world. So I'll be honest, for me, it was

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all about like the travel aspect. And my husband at that time was probably eight years. No, at that

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time it was like five to six years deep into his like big quinn rabbit hole right and it's like the

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cup like a typical story you hear where you know the husband is going like super deep and technical

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obsessed and the wife's kind of just like can you shut up like I don't want to hear about it

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like because you know what it's not even that I didn't like okay I am a tech like I'm an engineer

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I was in technology like I I did understand it but I just didn't see the craze around it at that

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time. You know, I just, I still saw it as like, it's an investment. It's a good way for us to make

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more money. And that was because most of my circle at work or my friends, that's how it was perceived.

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Right. Oh my gosh. There's this really funny story where my husband was crazy enough at one point

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because he was sort of sick of doom scrolling on X when it came to Bitcoin. He said, you know what?

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I've had so many conversations, but they're all virtual or remote. And he's like, I want to have

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conversations with real people what do real people think about bitcoin and i'm like okay where

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is this going so he decided he was gonna get a whiteboard and write down like ask me anything

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about bitcoin and just go to streets we were living in calgary at this point so west part of

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canada um go around to different streets and just hold the sign to see how people react and honestly

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I was like, you are kind of crazy for doing this. And I remember at one point he was on the same

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street where I used to work and I would take like my clients up for lunch and things like that. And

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I'm just like literally praying. I'm like, please do not be on my street today. Cause then I have to

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explain to my, either my coworkers or my clients, who this person is, why he's holding the sign,

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you know, make sure they know he's not trying to scam them. But yeah, he was, he was that obsessed.

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So that helps kind of paint a picture of like the extremes that we were in at that point.

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So for him, the sabbatical was, of course, on the travel side, but he was really interested to see Bitcoin adoption outside of the West.

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And both of us had decided that we wanted to go to Africa because it was a continent that we both haven't touched and we just really don't know too much about it.

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but he had made some friends online. Like Brendan is definitely a friend that they connected online

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on Twitter. And he's like, I got to go meet my friend. And so we're like, all right, we're going

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to do this. We are going to start our travels from Egypt and we're going to make all make our way down

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to South Africa. And we stayed mostly on the east side. So we covered about 10 countries,

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but we did it by bus because we're like, we're already getting adventurous. Might as well

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continue being more adventurous and that's how I learned how gigantic Africa really is

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and the existing map like the marketer projection is like completely off like it is huge like

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going from one country to another I think we would be on the bus for like 16 plus hours

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it was insane um so as we're going through our travels um the first thing that hit me

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was when we were in Egypt we spent about two months in Egypt and when we first landed there

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Daniel um we went to the bank we got you know we had we had USD we got Egyptian pounds right

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and then we met some locals there and they're like no don't go to the bank because I will give

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you more Egyptian pounds for your US dollars. And to me, that was the first time I've experienced

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like a black market rate for a currency, where you're not just watching it on TV and seeing

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what's happening. Like these people are literally telling you this in front of you. And then you

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just you're hearing stories of like, how many of their savings just have been slashed, you know,

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and over a couple of months, and the whole concept of like purchasing power and, you know,

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good money versus bad money and like all of that it just kind of hit me all at once

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and made me want to look into the history of money and it kind of actually made me curious

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to learn more like why is this happening in Egypt and how much longer until it happens

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in Canada or in parts of Europe where maybe we don't see it as much we don't feel it as much

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right um so that was my first little like shit like this is this is bad um and then we

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continued traveling and we went to east africa and then in uganda and you know in kenya i saw like

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literally like street vendors you know on the side accepting bitcoin and that kind of made me

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realize all right like how are these guys here accepting this you know currency what does this

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mean um why are they doing this and so learning the whole concept of like circular economies and

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now I went from you know thinking bitcoin is just like this sort of investment or a way to make

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money to actually seeing it as money so kind of the concept of like store of value to medium of

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strange and honestly the more I spoke to people the more it made me want to learn about it so that

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that was kind of like my orange pill journey that like I kind of took the orange pill myself with

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some help from my husband but and I think this goes for a lot of people that are sort of new

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in this space like many times we'll try to like like overwhelm them with information and go read

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this listen to this go read this book and sometimes it's just as simple as like helping them see it

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you know helping them have a conversation with a real business owner or someone that has gone

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through issues and problems and why they're accepting bitcoin or how they see bitcoin

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i think those real conversations give you a perspective that i just really don't think

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you'll find on the internet at least that's my opinion but okay so i know i didn't answer a

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question about how we started making money or how we were going to like make money on the road.

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But that was through my journey into like Bitcoin, right? So once I was on board, I was like, yeah,

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I want to go see more communities. I want to talk to more people. I want to find businesses

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that I can pay in Bitcoin that will give me an experience because we're still traveling. We want

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to do all the hiking and the safaris and the whitewater rafting and whatever that, you know,

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Africa has to offer. We want to do it, but we want to find businesses that we can pay in Bitcoin with,

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which obviously is difficult, right? Like we're going niche of a niche here. And yeah, there's

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BTC maps. There's all of that. But again, it's open source. Some of it is not verified or some

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of it just doesn't exist. So we're reliant on word of mouth a lot. We, you know, message someone

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like we let Brendan know that okay we going to Rwanda Who do you know in Rwanda Like that in the Bitcoin space that we can connect with that might know a business that we could pay in Bitcoin with right So it was quite a lot of like

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shuffling around with people that we knew.

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And so now this is about 14 months later,

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we are in South Africa

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and we wanted to end our trip with,

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I don't know if you've,

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have you ever heard of Vipashna?

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No.

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Okay.

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it's like it's a it's a meditation technique or it's like a meditation theme but ultimately it's

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a 10-day silent meditation with like no phone you can't you you were gonna do this

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you yeah we did you didn't talk about bitcoin for 10 days you and your husband oh my god

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okay so it was funny because in our heads we're like how bad can it be like

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10 days of no talking and this will be a perfect way to end our trip we can reflect and really like

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you know think through everything that we went through and we saw and we experienced

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and we go there and like second day in and I am literally freaking out because it was so

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hard like I feel like that not talking was okay you eat very basic meals wake up super early and

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all of that but it was the eight hours of sitting down and actually learning how to meditate

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that you know can I ask you a question are you being led through that like do you have to

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sit completely still are you able to move like you know it's very hard for me to envision

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no no you can move and like look nothing is mandatory right like the whole concept of this

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is because you wanted to come and do this and their teachers are there to help you guide you

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and their goal is that you finish the 10 days right so there are teachers there that kind of

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guide you through every day so every day you learn kind of a new technique or have to

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evolve a technique that they've taught the day before they talk you through it and it's just

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like a constant like I don't know I don't even know how to explain it but it's not like you're

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just sitting there silenced the entire time they are talking and they're helping you so you kind of

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Can you talk back? Are you able to like clarify or ask a question?

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Like no words leave your body for 10 days.

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So they have office hours.

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So technically between lunch from like 12 to 1, you can go ask questions.

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But you can't be there and be like, hey, what's up?

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Like, no, it's like, what is your question?

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This is the answer. Get out.

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Like you're not meant.

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the whole point of this is so if you when you stop talking your brain can actually be silent

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so you can meditate so that was super interesting and I've never felt this before which is why

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I know it sounds crazy trust me but like I this is why I would recommend that people go because I

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think it was on my third day or fourth day where my brain actually went quiet and I thought something

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was wrong with me because I'm like my you know um it's a call my like my mind is not running you

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know like things are not just popping up it's actually quiet and that was such an amazing

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feeling and since I've left I've not felt like that like honestly I haven't felt that before

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or since I've left I haven't felt it again you know but anyway so that during that 10 day of a

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lot of reflection. That's where the idea of travel with Bitcoin was born, okay, ultimately.

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So we're like, hey, we were crazy enough to do this. We know there are other crazy people that

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will want to travel with Bitcoin, that will look for experiences that are worth spending Bitcoin on.

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So why don't we build something that can make it easier for these travelers, right? So initially,

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was supposed to be just a marketplace where I wanted to put together like all businesses that

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accepted Bitcoin that are tourism related globally. I really wanted to highlight the community leaders

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so all the circular economies and the amazing work that they're doing on the ground. So if you are

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going to let's say you know El Salvador or Guatemala you can actually connect with the

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community host and they can take you around and show you around the merchants and what's going on

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in their community um so it started off as a marketplace and the whole way i was going to

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monetize it and this has not happened by the way i just i evolved or i changed very quickly

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um but the the way we were thinking about this we're like well shit we gotta monetize this like

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we gotta make money um and so we're like okay let's focus on the value first let's like get

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everyone like you know let's get our hosts together our communities together let's you know

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So the way we would charge or monetize for this, and even at that time, I took some inspiration

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from at that point, it was Orange Pill App, but like the membership model, right?

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Where it's like, okay, so I want to make it so exclusive that if you're a business, you

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want to be part of this network where you get to access other businesses so you can

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like converse and share ideas and learn from each other.

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We would do like monthly meetups, you would do monthly webinars and things like that and

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give value back to this community.

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And then I would eventually charge for it if you wanted to be part of the network.

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But then I quickly changed that because we were going to attend Africa Bitcoin Conference in Nairobi.

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And I was like, you know what?

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I like bringing people together, right?

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Like I like doing travel things.

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I like bringing people together.

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I'm a people person.

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I'm like, why don't I do a tour the day before the conference?

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because people are coming from all different parts of the world.

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And Nairobi is the only city where you can actually do a safari in the city

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because in all other places, you have to travel at least five, six hours

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to go to the national park and do a safari.

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So Nairobi actually has a national park within its city, which is super cool.

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So I was like, all right, I'm going to do, you know, safari,

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some amazing local food, and then we're going to go see Afrobit,

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which is one of the largest slums in Africa which is in Nairobi and they have over 40 small businesses

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that except I think even 60 now something like that that except Bitcoin which is really really

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amazing to see so that was kind of the day that I had planned and then I ended up getting like a full

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safari vehicle of people that wanted to do this and I was like shit this is travel with Bitcoin

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because they get to experience something and none of them have been to a safari before so

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seeing them experience it was really fantastic um and I was like okay well this is something like

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these people just paid me in bitcoin my first I remember the first time I got stats and I was like

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shit this feels good um and then so that was when my head was like just going with ideas because I'm

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like there's so many conferences that happen and we had planned to attend a bunch the year after

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so I'm like I'm just going to plan a bunch of tours and events around these conferences

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and this is what I'm going to do. So that's how, yeah, that was a very, very long answer. So I hope,

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yeah, that answer. No, that's awesome. So yeah, you mentioned orange pill app and it reminds me

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of what you told that that story that you told about your, your husband going out with the

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whiteboard standing on the street corner, like, you know, orange pill app fixes this, right? You

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The rebrand to Club Orange.

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So for all of the lonely Bitcoiners out there

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that are in the same position as your husband

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who are just sick and tired of...

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It's, look, Twitter, X, whatever you want to call it,

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now Nostra, they're great for hanging out

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and getting into conversations

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or dunking on PhD economists or whatever else.

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But at some stage, you get sick and tired of doing that

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and you just want to go hang with real people.

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Exactly. And I also have found that when I was doing some of these tours, doing conferences, that people don't just want to talk about Bitcoin either.

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Like they want to hang out with like-minded people. Like I want to hang out with you, but I don't want to just talk to you about Bitcoin.

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Sorry, I'm going to cough. So I'm just going to put myself.

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Yep.

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Quick water break, listeners. No problem.

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and I'm just just uh yeah get some water okay I won't even edit that that's far too much work

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yeah um sorry I guess I was I'm too chatty so I gotta in between um but yeah exactly we were

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saying like you know I want to hang out with people like in the bitcoin space but I don't

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always want to talk about bitcoin either like for example the fact that I don't know how you guys

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left and started this whole life and you know raised amazing kids traveled did I think homeschooling

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as well a little bit right like just even the whole concept of that like I'm so interested by

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it because that's something I would like to do or I'm like open to exploring and doing but I feel

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like if I were to share that with my I'll say non-bitcoiner friends just to make it easier

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I just feel like they'll have a hard time understanding that where you know a lot of

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people I've met in this space they get it they understand it without me having to justify it or

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explain it and that's why I love this space and love meeting people in this space which is why

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you should go on Club Orange and make some new friends 100% have you been back to Calgary much

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or at all over the last couple of years so not Calgary but we have our family is in Toronto

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um so we go back often to see them we went we were just there for all of december and a little

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bit of january we usually try to go there during december during holidays and spend time with our

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family and friends well the reason i ask uh your friends your family your old peer group your colleagues yeah that that a difficult you have changed so much in the last two years and this is something

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bitcoin has struggled with because you go through this metamorphosis in your metamorphosis in your

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at the soul level really like everything about you changes and you people people say bitcoin

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holds up a mirror to you it shows who you really are and it helps you become the person that you

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were supposed to be uh that might sound all a little bit cliche or woo woo to those listening

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for the first time or it hasn't happened to yet but believe me it is real so how how how have you

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found those interactions and those conversations um not easy um and you know what that that is such

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00:32:12,278 --> 00:32:20,338
a good point because when I do speak with my friends and my extended family I almost don't

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share a lot you know I almost stop myself from you know sharing what our plans are and sharing

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why we're doing this because to your point like I don't know if they will get it you know I don't

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know if they'll understand it and I've also gotten to a point where you know I don't have to explain

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myself to the people that are kind of like in my outer circle but if you're close to me then even

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if you don't understand it you're going to support me and I think that's where I am with most of my

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friends and family they're like okay they're on this journey you know they've definitely seen me

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change in some ways I'm still who I am but the way I think about life and how I want to live as

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you know how I want to like grow family and you know where I want to have a family all of that

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00:33:10,478 --> 00:33:16,338
it has changed um and they're honestly kind of they're very happy about it they're like listen

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like you went through this whole journey and this is who you are you have more clarity on what you

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want and I think that's a that's a big part about leaving something that you are so used to like you

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know you're constantly on this like autopilot of like living your life which is fine that's totally

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fine nothing wrong with that but I think once you take yourself away from that into a completely

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different environment you definitely get more clarity on like okay what it is that you want in

356
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your life how you how you want your mornings to be and your evenings to be how you want to spend

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your time and your weekends um so all of those things that I try to share back with my friends

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as well when I see them um sometimes I think it's like a little cringe but I'm like this

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this is what would you say if you look back at the old Anuja what would you say would be

360
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the the big that what's the one thing you've changed your mind on the most you think that you

361
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if you look back you think how on earth was was I ever gaslit into believing that or why would I

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think that that was the way you know society was supposed to work or is there any one thing

363
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so many things but the one big thing and honestly I still struggle with it a lot

364
00:34:38,398 --> 00:34:50,258
So I would love your input on this as well, Daniel, is, you know, prior to leaving, you know, doing the sabbatical, I found that my identity was very much tied to work.

365
00:34:50,638 --> 00:34:56,898
You know, I got a lot of validation from work. Obviously, there is like the financial component to it.

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You know, you're you're you are who you're top like the five people that you are constantly around.

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and four out of those five were work people for me and so I just felt like everything that I had

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to do or thought about or did was somehow tied back to work and so I will like I remember the

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day I quit my job like I cried so much because I did love my job but I know that I had to do this

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you know and then when we were traveling we would be in some of the most beautiful places

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and actually doing things that I wanted to do.

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But I still felt this like, I don't know what the right word is,

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but because when you tie your self-worth to work,

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and then now that work is taken away, you're like, what am I doing?

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What is my value?

376
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You know, I'm not being productive.

377
00:35:50,718 --> 00:35:56,018
So the aspect of productivity has not completely changed.

378
00:35:56,459 --> 00:35:59,098
And this is so timely because I was having the same conversation

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with Santos yesterday I was like I love that to me productivity isn't just about you know how many

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sales call that I make or how many emails I finish or you know the typical things that you have to do

381
00:36:12,718 --> 00:36:22,358
yeah my KPIs exactly well I'm under my quota or all of that um but now productivity I'm not saying

382
00:36:22,358 --> 00:36:26,738
there is still some aspect of that because you know there's there's all these amazing ideas we're

383
00:36:26,738 --> 00:36:33,038
working on I'm working on some awesome stuff with Mateo so I want to do you know and help you know

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00:36:33,038 --> 00:36:36,578
get people together in the space ultimately that those are the things I'm working on but

385
00:36:36,578 --> 00:36:41,878
you know productivity for me is very different now it's like shit I didn't touch my phone before

386
00:36:41,878 --> 00:36:50,318
9 a.m today or for this whole week well like I actually turned my phone off at 9 p.m and did

387
00:36:50,318 --> 00:36:56,498
something else and was not on a device like those are all things that I find I find more like as

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productive now than how I used to like value myself before and I think that's been a really

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big change and I still kind of struggle with it so I think it's like a process you have to go through

390
00:37:08,398 --> 00:37:13,878
um but yeah what are what are your thoughts on that well I was just uh I just picked up a copy

391
00:37:13,878 --> 00:37:23,598
of my book and I was trying to find where I wrote about this um oh yeah because uh the identity you

392
00:37:23,598 --> 00:37:34,478
know the identity crisis basically oh yes exactly you suffer that yeah I remember it took about two

393
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or three weeks before it really set in because I'd had up until that point like an 18-year career

394
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so a two or three week break your your monkey mind just thinks you're on a holiday right with

395
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the family and we were in a different country and it was a swimming pool and there was a beach

396
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nearby so all is fine but then like your little monkey wakes up one day like 14 to 18 days later

397
00:38:01,598 --> 00:38:07,378
and starts clashing the symbols like what the fuck who am i like you know what are you doing

398
00:38:07,378 --> 00:38:14,738
exactly that is such a good way of putting it and that's that's how it went for me as well

399
00:38:14,738 --> 00:38:20,838
and for you I mean you have like 18 years like that's like your mind is so used to doing

400
00:38:20,838 --> 00:38:26,978
what you were doing those 18 years right so how how did you overcome it like what was your

401
00:38:26,978 --> 00:38:35,558
so then then you have that um you have those those moments where it gets amplified well you

402
00:38:35,558 --> 00:38:41,698
meet new people and the first the first question is and then you realize how society is shaped is

403
00:38:41,698 --> 00:38:45,978
oh so what do you do and then it's like oh let's discuss our labels you're like oh

404
00:38:45,978 --> 00:38:55,578
i don't know what to say oh my god i like i'm so glad you're saying this because yeah like i

405
00:38:55,578 --> 00:39:00,118
remember that year we were traveling people asked what we would what we're doing and i'm just like

406
00:39:00,118 --> 00:39:08,058
fuck i'm not doing shit i'm just traveling which again like you know you worked hard to take

407
00:39:08,058 --> 00:39:15,238
to you know i'm not gonna say retire but you know to take time for it right you worked hard for it

408
00:39:15,238 --> 00:39:21,439
you planned for it you chose it so why do we feel so freaking guilty of sharing that like we don't

409
00:39:21,439 --> 00:39:30,158
do something like we do what we want to do i don't know it's it's it's so i mean this that's

410
00:39:30,158 --> 00:39:35,738
the success story the success story is i just quit my job because i'm in a position where i can

411
00:39:35,738 --> 00:39:41,178
to travel with my family this is going to be at least a year maybe two i couldn't deliver that

412
00:39:41,178 --> 00:39:46,198
for whatever reason because i was so conditioned to delivering you know i'm a foreign exchange

413
00:39:46,198 --> 00:39:51,439
broker i you know work in singapore and blah blah blah blah blah blah because there was so much

414
00:39:51,439 --> 00:39:56,858
but then when you realize as well another thing uh once you've stepped away from it and i think

415
00:39:56,858 --> 00:40:03,939
that took a little bit longer it's like oh shit i was just playing a game the whole time i was being

416
00:40:03,939 --> 00:40:10,338
someone else I would wear six or seven different masks a day I would have a mask for my boss a mask

417
00:40:10,338 --> 00:40:15,298
for my each one of my colleagues a mask for my each one of my customers during like the period

418
00:40:15,298 --> 00:40:20,578
of work hours then you go out and you've got to go to the cocktail parties or maybe there's a dinner

419
00:40:20,578 --> 00:40:26,098
or maybe there's a networking event or you've got to go to some corporate maybe there's a golf day

420
00:40:26,098 --> 00:40:32,878
or something and it's so exhausting because you're never you and it was now all of a sudden you're

421
00:40:32,878 --> 00:40:42,479
away from all of that and you rediscover you and at the same time I was around my wife and the four

422
00:40:42,479 --> 00:40:48,919
kids all day long so nobody was used to that as well and so now I'm I've got to share in the

423
00:40:48,919 --> 00:40:56,078
parenting decisions which you know that didn't happen before and you you have contrasting styles

424
00:40:56,078 --> 00:41:03,258
obviously the kids weren't used to having me around and uh everybody was going through their

425
00:41:03,258 --> 00:41:10,778
own coping stage because they're not going to school anymore uh claire's not running them

426
00:41:10,778 --> 00:41:16,378
around and doing all of that kind of crap and dealing with um the the housework and the running

427
00:41:16,378 --> 00:41:22,778
of the house and that that's been taken off her table work was taken off my table you know that

428
00:41:22,778 --> 00:41:23,878
And there were six of us.

429
00:41:24,538 --> 00:41:26,118
And everyone's got an extra personality.

430
00:41:27,378 --> 00:41:27,598
Yeah.

431
00:41:29,218 --> 00:41:33,278
So is this when you guys left Singapore to travel then?

432
00:41:33,558 --> 00:41:33,818
Yeah.

433
00:41:34,398 --> 00:41:34,658
Okay.

434
00:41:34,919 --> 00:41:37,038
And you guys traveled for how long as a family?

435
00:41:38,098 --> 00:41:39,919
Almost three years.

436
00:41:39,944 --> 00:41:46,224
it was about two and a half years in total wow that's inspiring man with four kids

437
00:41:46,224 --> 00:41:54,264
and they were aged eight six and the twins were three when we set off oh my god oh we have twins

438
00:41:54,264 --> 00:42:00,504
oh cute okay so did you guys was it more like hey we're gonna be in this one place for like

439
00:42:00,504 --> 00:42:08,324
three months kind of a situation or how did you plan out your we started we we fell into the

440
00:42:08,324 --> 00:42:17,664
sharing economy into home swapping and uh we we have uh hang on my camera my camera might

441
00:42:17,664 --> 00:42:24,784
switch off a second but i'm still here okay uh so we had a um we had a property that we bought

442
00:42:24,784 --> 00:42:30,484
uh in kosumumi on the it's a small thai island and bought that 20 years ago

443
00:42:30,484 --> 00:42:37,824
right so we had the house it was up for rental it was part of a rental pool and whatever else

444
00:42:37,824 --> 00:42:43,444
it was working good enough and so i just put it on a home swapping site and that's when people

445
00:42:43,444 --> 00:42:48,924
started approaching us from all over the world and we're like oh my goodness we've just driven our

446
00:42:48,924 --> 00:42:56,764
cost of travel like the cost of accommodation has just gone down to zero uh this is crazy so we just

447
00:42:56,764 --> 00:43:03,904
started putting together the requests and each time we got a request we would okay where is that

448
00:43:03,904 --> 00:43:10,544
fine we can fly into there we're still six hours from where we need to be so let's find a home swap

449
00:43:10,544 --> 00:43:15,304
in that area so we'll spend a week there then a week at that home swap and then we would just

450
00:43:15,304 --> 00:43:23,084
sometimes we would be in one place for a week other times for two weeks uh country wise we

451
00:43:23,084 --> 00:43:27,164
went to australia for three months new zealand for three months and we were just hitting home

452
00:43:27,164 --> 00:43:33,964
swaps wherever we could get them uh america and the us uh sorry the us and canada for three months

453
00:43:33,964 --> 00:43:40,864
uh europe yeah yeah that's that's a lot of change though like the fact they're changing homes every

454
00:43:40,864 --> 00:43:48,604
two weeks oh it was exhausting it was great fun yeah i mean we don't have kids it was just me him

455
00:43:48,604 --> 00:43:54,644
and two backpacks and even then i was like every two weeks i'm like this is a lot of work so yeah

456
00:43:54,644 --> 00:44:13,344
I can't imagine. Honestly, like that is phenomenal. It's very inspiring. I love meeting and seeing families that do this because it gives me like that motivation that, you know, hopefully, you know, we do want to have kids and have a family that we don't have to stop doing what we're doing.

457
00:44:13,344 --> 00:44:19,984
they can continue and you know you of course you can you tell me if this is right or wrong but i

458
00:44:19,984 --> 00:44:25,204
feel like when you travel kids learn so much they adapt to so many situations and things

459
00:44:25,204 --> 00:44:30,764
languages and right they play they get to play with all these kids from different parts of the

460
00:44:30,764 --> 00:44:38,244
world and i just i can't comprehend how much growth you know they go through in those years

461
00:44:38,244 --> 00:44:44,184
versus like staying in that one place like you just learn and you learn differently i guess right

462
00:44:44,184 --> 00:44:51,284
yeah so that's called world schooling is what uh that would get labeled uh so you would have

463
00:44:51,284 --> 00:44:59,504
world schooling or unschooling would come under that um homeschooling is more you you would

464
00:44:59,504 --> 00:45:06,824
probably be stricter about following a curriculum or something whereas if you just completely fully

465
00:45:06,824 --> 00:45:13,084
unschool or world school it's like whatever happens during the day is our teaching and that's

466
00:45:13,084 --> 00:45:19,704
our learning and you just embrace the experience and you can obviously you can set things up like

467
00:45:19,704 --> 00:45:27,864
we would do goodness knows how many museum visits or park visits or historical monument visits and

468
00:45:27,864 --> 00:45:36,364
that was the lesson for the day and that was just how we did it yeah and yeah but the the difference

469
00:45:36,364 --> 00:45:43,784
that you see in the kids is not that they're going to retain the knowledge any better but it just

470
00:45:43,784 --> 00:45:51,364
completely blows open their minds and their intellectual curiosity they want to learn

471
00:45:51,364 --> 00:45:58,764
whereas in a school setting or even if more of a stricter home school setting if you bring in

472
00:45:58,764 --> 00:46:05,964
textbooks to the kitchen table expect minds to close down like it's not gonna happen

473
00:46:05,964 --> 00:46:12,284
that's just not the way humans are built to learn i mean the traditional what like the traditional

474
00:46:12,284 --> 00:46:19,124
school system it was meant to at the at the time of i don't know when it was you know the the whole

475
00:46:19,124 --> 00:46:26,164
concept of school and getting people to be like machines in uh industries really right like i'm

476
00:46:26,164 --> 00:46:30,344
saying the concept wrong but you understand what i mean that was what school was supposed to be and

477
00:46:30,344 --> 00:46:35,304
now we're not so it's like the school systems have to evolve and i think a lot of them are

478
00:46:35,304 --> 00:46:43,004
trying but I can't imagine how hard it is with AI and just like technology and the digital world like

479
00:46:43,004 --> 00:46:51,724
man being a kid right now is where it's an interesting time for sure it's

480
00:46:51,724 --> 00:47:02,004
putting kids in these institutions I mean it's yeah it's really bad like people people uh you

481
00:47:02,004 --> 00:47:06,204
know they scratch their heads oh mental mental health this mental health that you know it's going

482
00:47:06,204 --> 00:47:13,424
through the roof um it's like yeah are you surprised like really have you seen what kids

483
00:47:13,424 --> 00:47:18,084
go through i mean we all went through these uh education systems and you're piling pressure

484
00:47:18,084 --> 00:47:26,564
on children to perform and i still love the sir ken robinson quote um when and he was talking

485
00:47:26,564 --> 00:47:36,644
about like the rise of adhd and add and uh the questionable um process of diagnosing the child

486
00:47:36,644 --> 00:47:44,164
and then you know giving them the medication to come like it's right it's a dark dark area to go

487
00:47:44,164 --> 00:47:50,684
talking about uh and he said don't be you can't you can't expect to sit an eight-year-old down

488
00:47:50,684 --> 00:48:00,504
in a classroom filled with forced socialization with 29 other people and forced to do low-grade

489
00:48:00,504 --> 00:48:06,044
clerical work for seven hours a day and not expect them to fidget like you know it's just

490
00:48:06,044 --> 00:48:13,524
insanity yeah and you made a good point like there is all this pressure for them to perform

491
00:48:13,524 --> 00:48:19,964
in school and now i'm just thinking about it for kids there's that pressure but now there's this

492
00:48:19,964 --> 00:48:27,284
pressure to also perform somehow on the social media side too right like we didn't have that

493
00:48:27,284 --> 00:48:33,064
growing up right like yeah I'm sure it was different for you too but like I only got a

494
00:48:33,064 --> 00:48:39,024
flip phone in grade 12 I was almost in university like just social media just wasn't something I was

495
00:48:39,024 --> 00:48:45,944
worried about or you know how I looked on social media or what to post or who's saying what about

496
00:48:45,944 --> 00:48:54,304
like it just wasn't a thing it was so freeing so it is and that's a scary part for me because

497
00:48:54,304 --> 00:48:59,824
you know sometimes I have trouble putting my phone down so then I'm like if I do have kids like

498
00:48:59,824 --> 00:49:05,084
that would be tough because you have to be a role model and you have to also be practical

499
00:49:05,084 --> 00:49:10,044
and realistic right so yes you know you're going to be on your phone they're going to see you on

500
00:49:10,044 --> 00:49:15,824
your phone but yeah I don't know it's it's a struggle I don't know how you guys do it with

501
00:49:15,824 --> 00:49:22,124
four kids but whatever you're doing it's a struggle it's it's a struggle it really is

502
00:49:22,124 --> 00:49:28,564
because they're addictive we know this right that's what we tell the kids all the time like

503
00:49:28,564 --> 00:49:37,544
you are being controlled by your phones as I as am I and as as your parents but we we understand

504
00:49:37,544 --> 00:49:42,104
that this is happening and listen to Jack Cruz

505
00:49:42,104 --> 00:49:58,456
and listen to the Daylight Computer guys Tristan and Jan and they tell you how these things are designed to but they won listen i even got the then if you follow zarusty on uh on twitter uh who does he he tests all the electromagnetic fields of all

506
00:49:58,456 --> 00:50:03,336
of these devices that the kids are wearing and he shows videos i even bought the i even bought the

507
00:50:03,336 --> 00:50:09,276
thing to show them with their own like eyes he's like right look how much emf non-native emf this

508
00:50:09,276 --> 00:50:13,996
is pumping into your body like the airpods and all this kind of stuff it's just relentless

509
00:50:13,996 --> 00:50:18,536
yeah i should probably stop using my airpods then definitely

510
00:50:18,536 --> 00:50:23,996
okay like well so what am i supposed to do if i'm in a cool working space

511
00:50:23,996 --> 00:50:29,636
right yeah like either i have to listen to people chat around me or have some music

512
00:50:29,636 --> 00:50:37,936
so are there alternatives you gotta go air tubes so why are your phones are better

513
00:50:37,936 --> 00:50:43,416
um but you're still running copper wire straight into your ears so this these are air tubes

514
00:50:43,416 --> 00:50:50,156
uh so the last part the last little bit there there's just an air tube so the sound just travels

515
00:50:50,156 --> 00:50:54,516
straight through the air tube straight into the bud and you just sit there with them in and you

516
00:50:54,516 --> 00:51:01,276
can tune out or tune into your calls so i'll send you the link afterwards you know thank you so much

517
00:51:01,276 --> 00:51:06,276
this just makes me think like we as humans are so funny we create all these gadgets and shit to make

518
00:51:06,276 --> 00:51:10,196
our life efficient and then we realize it's freaking ruining us so we're like let's create

519
00:51:10,196 --> 00:51:20,556
alternatives to fix these things and yeah that's uh that's yeah you know oh yeah sorry i was gonna

520
00:51:20,556 --> 00:51:25,836
say and this is the thing about bitcoin and bitcoiners uh and you said it earlier you might

521
00:51:25,836 --> 00:51:32,796
want to like hanging out with bitcoin is freaking amazing but you might not just want to talk about

522
00:51:32,796 --> 00:51:39,236
monetary history every minute of every every day you might want to get into the other little

523
00:51:39,236 --> 00:51:45,216
random topics that you've been learning about because because bitcoin has set you free uh to

524
00:51:45,216 --> 00:51:49,716
a certain extent it's not set everybody completely free but i guarantee you it's freed up most

525
00:51:49,716 --> 00:51:58,216
people's uh certain time and certain time intellectually stimulated again and you just

526
00:51:58,216 --> 00:52:02,876
can't stop learning and then when you brush up against these people whether that's still on

527
00:52:02,876 --> 00:52:06,936
social media or if you get to a meetup or if you get to a conference and you start meeting people

528
00:52:06,936 --> 00:52:13,656
in real life and they're talking about one of these little gadgets or the blue light blockers or

529
00:52:13,656 --> 00:52:21,156
uh goodness knows what else there's so many different areas of interest art yeah the big

530
00:52:21,156 --> 00:52:26,156
bitcoin art magazine that's just dropped like you know i didn't think i'd ever be reading an art

531
00:52:26,156 --> 00:52:31,196
magazine but now because it's a bitcoin magazine i've read it cover to cover it's absolutely

532
00:52:31,196 --> 00:52:39,616
incredible it's such wow i print brilliant piece of work um put together by just a bunch of plebs

533
00:52:39,616 --> 00:52:48,496
for their love of each other's work and respect and the time and effort that's gone into it

534
00:52:48,496 --> 00:52:56,456
i didn't think i'd be discussing art artwork well okay you know what this makes me think so

535
00:52:56,456 --> 00:53:01,056
let me get your thoughts on this because one of the things that i want to do with child with

536
00:53:01,056 --> 00:53:10,336
Bitcoin this year is try to focus more on like intimate type retreats where it really is about,

537
00:53:10,336 --> 00:53:17,456
you know, taking a break from your fast paced, you know, digital life that you're typically in

538
00:53:17,456 --> 00:53:23,736
and getting away from all of that in like a beautiful space. I haven't figured out exactly

539
00:53:23,736 --> 00:53:29,036
where or which countries, but you're going to be with like-minded people because it is still in the

540
00:53:29,036 --> 00:53:34,396
Bitcoin space, but we're doing things like yoga and breath work and, you know, things that really

541
00:53:34,396 --> 00:53:38,696
calm our nervous system down, just like learning things that maybe we sometimes don't prioritize

542
00:53:38,696 --> 00:53:46,056
when it comes to wellness. And again, I haven't thought exactly about the format of it, but I have

543
00:53:46,056 --> 00:53:52,356
a good friend who just finished his breath work certification, also in the Bitcoin space, and

544
00:53:52,356 --> 00:53:57,576
he's going to be going to the Vegas conference and so am I. So we're like, why don't we try to do

545
00:53:57,576 --> 00:54:04,216
a beautiful retreat somewhere you know near the canyons or something like that and see if people

546
00:54:04,216 --> 00:54:09,256
would be down to attend something like this and especially after the craziness and chaos of like

547
00:54:09,256 --> 00:54:15,776
Vegas and the conference people might just be down to do that what is breath work could you explain

548
00:54:15,776 --> 00:54:23,016
what that is so okay I haven't been certified he has so I can't explain on behalf of him but

549
00:54:23,016 --> 00:54:31,356
it's really just apparently we have forgot we have forgotten how to breathe properly we do a

550
00:54:31,356 --> 00:54:38,156
lot of like shallow breathing we're not inhaling like as deep as we should be and exhaling for as

551
00:54:38,156 --> 00:54:43,536
long as we should be there's all these like concepts and techniques of like how to breathe

552
00:54:43,536 --> 00:54:50,036
properly and all of these things if done on a consistent basis are supposed to be really good

553
00:54:50,036 --> 00:54:57,996
at decreasing like you know any diseases and you know diseases related to your brain or your heart

554
00:54:57,996 --> 00:55:05,176
and things like that again I don't know all the scientific kind of things behind it but that's why

555
00:55:05,176 --> 00:55:11,756
I would have because he's certified in it but that's the idea right it's like learning about

556
00:55:11,756 --> 00:55:18,676
concepts that we're very fast to neglect because we're like breathing I do that every day like I'm

557
00:55:18,676 --> 00:55:25,136
sure I know how to breathe. But yeah, that's really the idea. It's like disconnect, you know,

558
00:55:25,456 --> 00:55:31,336
take time, reflect, learn something that you might not learn otherwise, and spend time with people

559
00:55:31,336 --> 00:55:35,876
and not just talk about Bitcoin, but spend time with people that share, you know, the same values

560
00:55:35,876 --> 00:55:43,536
as you in a beautiful place. That would 100% get filled out, I'm sure. Okay, cool. So I'm going to

561
00:55:43,536 --> 00:55:49,016
put you down at first if i was coming if i was coming to the conference i would hit you up it

562
00:55:49,016 --> 00:55:55,916
sounds very very interesting and already does kind of resonate and make sense that uh yeah if you were

563
00:55:55,916 --> 00:56:03,316
to be breathing properly in air quotes um surely that just means you're getting more and a better

564
00:56:03,316 --> 00:56:11,836
volume of oxygen into your body and your cells and voila like you know that that should be that's

565
00:56:11,836 --> 00:56:16,576
not to my wife and i have fallen down like the sauna rabbit hole at the moment and i'm sure my

566
00:56:16,576 --> 00:56:21,896
nordic friends are like yeah whatever dude like you know we do that all the time like yes exactly

567
00:56:21,896 --> 00:56:30,656
but yeah the benefits of sauna are supposed to be really great as well right yeah and is that

568
00:56:30,656 --> 00:56:37,816
is that like an everyday thing or we've been doing it weekly but it just makes sense you just sweat

569
00:56:37,816 --> 00:56:43,616
out a lot of crap there's a reason your body sweats and uh yeah get rid of all of those uh

570
00:56:43,616 --> 00:56:53,476
toxic impurities right huh there's so well i mean i feel like it's a it's a natural sun

571
00:56:53,476 --> 00:56:59,436
so i don't think i have to go but yeah it could be well yeah it definitely works in

572
00:56:59,436 --> 00:57:04,396
the colder countries but and and then you look across uh all of the different continents and

573
00:57:04,396 --> 00:57:09,436
the different for millennia the different things that people have been doing and like if you look

574
00:57:09,436 --> 00:57:14,616
at uh traditional chinese medicine or that's literally just crushing up herbs and roots and

575
00:57:14,616 --> 00:57:20,316
making teas well okay we forgot to do that and yeah acupuncture people are going to tell you

576
00:57:20,316 --> 00:57:26,776
acupuncture is just a load of pseudoscience and we're like i don't know man it seems you look at

577
00:57:26,776 --> 00:57:34,476
a map of an acupuncture of uh of the body and the points and you know i've definitely uh felt

578
00:57:34,476 --> 00:57:40,696
um positive results from from acupuncture and then you have pressure and then you have meditation

579
00:57:40,696 --> 00:57:46,136
and then you have yoga and then you have all of this kind of stuff like that stood the test of

580
00:57:46,136 --> 00:57:51,696
time these aren't these aren't fads that were you know like being kicked around in the 90s

581
00:57:51,696 --> 00:57:54,396
Like this is something that's been going on.

582
00:57:54,396 --> 00:58:06,347
I mean sometimes some things will be a little bit trendy just because they like oh this is a new thing to do But you right Like it not something that has just come up now It been around for years There science There you know obviously proof that things work

583
00:58:06,607 --> 00:58:08,307
And this actually makes me think, right?

584
00:58:08,367 --> 00:58:14,287
Like, we're almost just like going back in time in some ways because we've come so far.

585
00:58:14,407 --> 00:58:20,507
And now we're like, wait, are we forgetting all these things that our ancestors knew that

586
00:58:20,507 --> 00:58:26,327
we're like natural organic or you know things related to our mind and body that like we don't

587
00:58:26,327 --> 00:58:33,047
do anymore like i mean for for god's sakes we get ai to like write our texts and emails like we're

588
00:58:33,047 --> 00:58:38,847
like not even thinking hard anymore which is scary to think like if this keeps progressing

589
00:58:38,847 --> 00:58:46,987
like we're just gonna get stupider and stupider i know we're gonna get efficient yes i i understand

590
00:58:46,987 --> 00:58:52,307
all that but I don't know there's definitely a dark side to this which I don't like to think

591
00:58:52,307 --> 00:58:58,587
about too much but yeah yeah you'd like to think that people are saving time to then pick up books

592
00:58:58,587 --> 00:59:06,767
or better themselves in some way that's the positive way to use this these tools or are they

593
00:59:06,767 --> 00:59:13,367
just using it whilst they're sat eating their Doritos on the sofa watching the rerun of some

594
00:59:13,367 --> 00:59:19,867
box set that they've already seen before exactly which is really tough not to do because it's so

595
00:59:19,867 --> 00:59:25,267
readily available and you're like well now I have something a tool that's making my day job much

596
00:59:25,267 --> 00:59:31,847
more easier and faster you know do I want to spend my time you know learning something or am I like

597
00:59:31,847 --> 00:59:37,447
screw it and then you just get into this really bad habit and pattern so

598
00:59:37,447 --> 00:59:49,067
rolling tick tock yeah all right let's let's end this on the the idea then that um you're gonna be

599
00:59:49,067 --> 00:59:57,387
uh is the idea follow the conference scene to a certain extent and put on side events or

600
00:59:57,387 --> 01:00:00,727
trips and do you want anyone in particular

601
01:00:00,727 --> 01:00:10,527
so um case because last year we had planned on going to a lot of conferences doing the tours

602
01:00:10,527 --> 01:00:16,367
combined with the conferences made a lot of sense but this year we are planning not to travel as

603
01:00:16,367 --> 01:00:22,787
much and so there's a couple of things that I want to do ultimately the vision is bringing people

604
01:00:22,787 --> 01:00:29,347
together in real life right and giving them and creating a space where they feel relaxed and calm

605
01:00:29,347 --> 01:00:34,487
to connect and actually make genuine friends, not surface lover friends. And I think that's the one

606
01:00:34,487 --> 01:00:40,487
big thing I found in the tours that I have done is like seeing people meet for the first time,

607
01:00:40,727 --> 01:00:45,447
connecting, and then hanging, they hang out or they talk or they become friends after. And I

608
01:00:45,447 --> 01:00:50,927
think that's amazing. That's what I want to do while giving them a new experience. So there's a

609
01:00:50,927 --> 01:00:54,627
couple of things that I'll be focused on. So one is the retreats that I spoke about.

610
01:00:54,627 --> 01:01:02,427
um that one does surround conferences a little bit but I I'm hoping not to do too much hopping

611
01:01:02,427 --> 01:01:08,307
around so I'll probably do I'm probably going to plan to do one or two retreats um and then

612
01:01:08,307 --> 01:01:17,887
I would like to do um like take over being the partner for specific conferences for their

613
01:01:17,887 --> 01:01:25,187
satellite events so now that we're seeing because there's so many conferences and they're typically

614
01:01:25,187 --> 01:01:30,087
happening in new cities and countries the conference organizers obviously want the guests

615
01:01:30,087 --> 01:01:36,047
to get a gist of you know their culture and music and food and so they want to put a lot of amazing

616
01:01:36,047 --> 01:01:45,087
side events together so if I am able to help them set that up that would be another kind of

617
01:01:45,087 --> 01:01:52,547
stream that I would be working on. And my last one, which I haven't acted on yet,

618
01:01:52,547 --> 01:02:00,127
and would love your thoughts, is Bitcoin company offsites. There's a lot of Bitcoin businesses and

619
01:02:00,127 --> 01:02:06,267
companies. And most of the workers are remote and in different parts of the world. And you got to

620
01:02:06,267 --> 01:02:11,507
come together at least once or twice a year, right? And typically, right now, that's usually given to

621
01:02:11,507 --> 01:02:16,567
just someone random on their team. So here's the budget, go plan and come back to us with ideas.

622
01:02:16,827 --> 01:02:22,427
But I would like to put together a few packages of what's available, give them some cool ideas of

623
01:02:22,427 --> 01:02:26,847
places or countries they've never thought about. So they can actually genuinely see how Bitcoin is

624
01:02:26,847 --> 01:02:31,447
being adopted in different parts of the world, you know, get a cool experience for their team,

625
01:02:31,447 --> 01:02:35,247
but also make sure there's enough time for them to do their strategy and their meetings and all

626
01:02:35,247 --> 01:02:42,747
of the team things that you need to do so it sounds like a lot but those are the three buckets

627
01:02:42,747 --> 01:02:50,407
that I'd like to focus on and just evolve based on where the demand is what people really need

628
01:02:50,407 --> 01:02:57,627
where they need help um yeah that's that's it and really ultimately even across all three the

629
01:02:57,627 --> 01:03:03,467
vision is bringing people together like that is the one thing that I'm holding on to so which is

630
01:03:03,467 --> 01:03:10,087
what obviously attracted you to Club Orange and what Mateo has built and did you want yeah the role

631
01:03:10,087 --> 01:03:18,427
there exactly and so Club Orange so the role there it was actually my husband who saw the application

632
01:03:18,427 --> 01:03:23,327
that Mateo had put out and this is when we're back in Canada and he's like hey look at this

633
01:03:23,327 --> 01:03:29,207
and I read the application and I'm like director of events cool name I'm like all right you know

634
01:03:29,207 --> 01:03:34,907
Orange Pearl app, Club Orange, I already know the app. I didn't know Mateo at that point, but I loved

635
01:03:34,907 --> 01:03:40,027
the role because it was about helping grow the events platform. It was about working with conference

636
01:03:40,027 --> 01:03:44,487
organizers. It was about bringing Bitcoiners together in real life. I'm like, this connects

637
01:03:44,487 --> 01:03:49,007
with what I'm doing already. And I think that's also what resonated with Mateo when we first met

638
01:03:49,007 --> 01:03:54,827
is what I'm already planning on doing. And there's just a lot of synergy. So yeah, I get to do what I

639
01:03:54,827 --> 01:04:00,427
love with Mateo and through Club Orange I also get to meet some awesome conference organizers

640
01:04:00,427 --> 01:04:06,387
that then also become you know potentially leads for the travel side that I'm working on so

641
01:04:06,387 --> 01:04:13,467
a lot of great work and collaboration there um yeah I'm very excited for everything that

642
01:04:13,467 --> 01:04:22,167
Club Orange is building we have over 700 events on the app we have over I think in general there's

643
01:04:22,167 --> 01:04:28,547
like over 70 conferences that are happening this year which is crazy to think about so many side

644
01:04:28,547 --> 01:04:35,067
events and meetups and we're genuinely seeing that people are putting in effort to meet in person

645
01:04:35,067 --> 01:04:40,027
they want to meet in person right like you're already seeing and that's only going to increase

646
01:04:40,027 --> 01:04:46,947
so that's what we're going to be building for 100 and now you'll be able to even buy the tickets

647
01:04:46,947 --> 01:04:49,707
via the app directly in Bitcoin

648
01:04:49,707 --> 01:04:52,987
from your own in-app wallet as well.

649
01:04:53,147 --> 01:04:55,407
It's just becoming stronger and stronger

650
01:04:55,407 --> 01:04:57,467
and more and more people are joining.

651
01:04:58,667 --> 01:05:00,747
And literally like your one-stop shop, right?

652
01:05:00,847 --> 01:05:03,527
Like we don't, we want to create such an experience

653
01:05:03,527 --> 01:05:06,267
that our members don't have to leave the app

654
01:05:06,267 --> 01:05:07,567
to do anything, right?

655
01:05:07,567 --> 01:05:10,267
So you want to find a merchant nearby,

656
01:05:10,887 --> 01:05:11,927
you want to get a coffee,

657
01:05:12,387 --> 01:05:14,247
you want to see who's there, events,

658
01:05:14,247 --> 01:05:20,267
buy your tickets send someone's that uh sats whatever it is that you need to do create invoices

659
01:05:20,267 --> 01:05:27,247
even now as well for something that you may you may be selling as a small business so in terms of

660
01:05:27,247 --> 01:05:32,047
the feature list it's it's never ending even i can't keep up sometimes i have to be like mateo

661
01:05:32,047 --> 01:05:40,627
like when did you roll this out you know it's been incredible yeah it's they build yeah they

662
01:05:40,627 --> 01:05:46,767
build and as soon as they found like the vibe coding my goodness the the building just never

663
01:05:46,767 --> 01:05:55,707
stopped we went from just having a dm having chat messages to having uh phone messages to having

664
01:05:55,707 --> 01:06:05,607
uh now full-on face calls and then tap to zap the face zaps and then voice messages like it just

665
01:06:05,607 --> 01:06:18,339
It growing really quickly See this is a good example of using AI efficiently because we using AI to help with the future rollouts

666
01:06:18,339 --> 01:06:21,039
but it's only making the app better

667
01:06:21,039 --> 01:06:23,879
and making people connect better.

668
01:06:24,219 --> 01:06:27,639
So that's a good example of how it should be used.

669
01:06:28,119 --> 01:06:29,339
So I love it.

670
01:06:29,639 --> 01:06:30,019
All right.

671
01:06:30,199 --> 01:06:31,739
So final question.

672
01:06:32,299 --> 01:06:35,099
If you had one last orange pill left to give to somebody,

673
01:06:35,099 --> 01:06:44,019
who would you give it to and why oh wow if i had one last orange pill to give to somebody

674
01:06:44,019 --> 01:06:49,839
and who would i give it to oh my god i don't know that's a

675
01:06:49,839 --> 01:06:58,119
i feel like most of the people daniel in my life that i care about i have spoken to them

676
01:06:58,119 --> 01:07:03,999
about this to one extent or another so it's hard to say who

677
01:07:03,999 --> 01:07:15,039
I really don't know how to answer that that's a tough one um well you know what I'll say this

678
01:07:15,039 --> 01:07:23,379
and I'll knock on wood if and whenever you know I have a kid they would be the last one that I would

679
01:07:23,379 --> 01:07:31,579
gladly and happily pass that orange bill down too well i hope that happens as well that would be

680
01:07:31,579 --> 01:07:40,039
uh amazing we need we need more bitcoin families more bitcoin kids yeah it's uh it's great to see

681
01:07:40,039 --> 01:07:45,819
it's actually that's one of the things having done the podcast for for so many years having seen

682
01:07:45,819 --> 01:07:53,359
so many of the people that i would see on twitter back in the day now having you know little kids

683
01:07:53,359 --> 01:07:57,419
around them or you see them in the conferences and they bring their kids with them he's like wow

684
01:07:57,419 --> 01:08:02,819
this is crazy I mean Katie the Russian perfect example when I met Katie uh in some of the chat

685
01:08:02,819 --> 01:08:08,339
rooms and and Twitter and whatever else she she was well she was still single at the time like

686
01:08:08,339 --> 01:08:13,519
now she's married she's got she's growing the family like crazy sharing the experience come

687
01:08:13,519 --> 01:08:18,539
on the podcast a couple of times talked about home birthing and all of that uh yeah it's just

688
01:08:18,539 --> 01:08:27,519
great to see these these families uh build in front of your eyes yes exactly i love that well

689
01:08:27,519 --> 01:08:33,479
it was so nice to come with you um i had a great time so thank you so much for having me daniel

690
01:08:33,479 --> 01:08:40,879
thank you for coming on but please where can people find you and your work and if they want

691
01:08:40,879 --> 01:08:45,639
to come on one of the trips what's the best way to reach out or if they want to add value in any

692
01:08:45,639 --> 01:08:52,399
way if they've got any ideas they want to share yeah i'm always open to collaborating love working

693
01:08:52,399 --> 01:09:01,019
with people so you can find me on x it's travel with bitcoin my website travel with bitcoin and i

694
01:09:01,019 --> 01:09:04,499
won't put my email because they're probably gonna forget my first name but best would be website or

695
01:09:04,499 --> 01:09:10,339
x and all my contact information is up there and it is pretty easy to remember travel with bitcoin

696
01:09:10,339 --> 01:09:20,299
But funny enough, based on all the research that Mateo did about rebranding, one of the things was like, don't make the name too obvious.

697
01:09:20,599 --> 01:09:22,199
And I'm just like, oh, shit.

698
01:09:23,859 --> 01:09:25,619
Literally as obvious as it gets.

699
01:09:25,899 --> 01:09:28,839
But no, I'm not worried about rebranding or anything like that.

700
01:09:29,139 --> 01:09:34,059
But it was just funny because he went really deep into his research.

701
01:09:34,219 --> 01:09:34,759
He did.

702
01:09:34,979 --> 01:09:36,099
He talked about it on the pod.

703
01:09:36,319 --> 01:09:37,939
So is it travelwithbitcoin.com?

704
01:09:39,099 --> 01:09:39,419
Correct.

705
01:09:39,419 --> 01:09:39,759
Yeah.

706
01:09:39,759 --> 01:09:46,199
that was available wow okay i'm so glad as soon as we did the meditation retreat the first thing

707
01:09:46,199 --> 01:09:49,719
no no joke the first thing we entered our airbnb we bought the domain

708
01:09:49,719 --> 01:09:55,299
that's the first thing we did it was available at that time so i'm thankful we did that

709
01:09:55,299 --> 01:10:01,679
well uh and another yeah you should get if you've not chatted with hondre already from uh

710
01:10:01,679 --> 01:10:09,159
airbtc that'd be a great uh collaboration you know what i have messaged them and we have spoken

711
01:10:09,159 --> 01:10:16,219
at conferences but at that time um the the ideation was still an idea it wasn't really

712
01:10:16,219 --> 01:10:21,539
executed so that's a good reminder i will go and do that yeah and i think and of course you're on

713
01:10:21,539 --> 01:10:28,919
club orange so that's just under your name yes that is just you can find me on yeah anujra and

714
01:10:28,919 --> 01:10:36,139
you will see yeah thanks perfect well thank you for coming on and hopefully we'll get to meet at

715
01:10:36,139 --> 01:10:42,799
some point in real life throughout the year if not next year but it will happen and uh well i'll

716
01:10:42,799 --> 01:10:46,879
chat again with you soon on one of the orange pill app update calls and find out what mateo

717
01:10:46,879 --> 01:10:54,459
shipped in the last three weeks i know right like another five things yeah okay cool thanks daniel

718
01:10:54,459 --> 01:10:56,239
have a good one you too take care

719
01:10:56,239 --> 01:11:03,399
well thank you everybody for listening like i said at the beginning of the show here if you've

720
01:11:03,399 --> 01:11:11,459
been inspired by what Anuja has built, TravelWithBitcoin.com is the place for you to go and check out.

721
01:11:11,639 --> 01:11:18,619
They have tours up there available. Obviously, we talked about the ones today that are featured,

722
01:11:18,619 --> 01:11:24,599
you know, the one through Africa. They have Experience Lugano as well. I'm just looking at

723
01:11:24,599 --> 01:11:31,599
the site right now. Experience Goa and Experience Colombia. So if you're heading to any of these

724
01:11:31,599 --> 01:11:39,599
places then reach out reach out to anuja or if you are running a tourist business reach out to anuja

725
01:11:39,599 --> 01:11:44,779
and say hey like we will accept bitcoin we want to accept bitcoin get us on your site let's get

726
01:11:44,779 --> 01:11:50,559
connected and let's just keep building this out together so uh thank you to anuja i'm really

727
01:11:50,559 --> 01:11:58,379
not long in the bitcoin space but already building already adding value to the network and this is

728
01:11:58,379 --> 01:12:04,659
like I've said a hundred times, maybe more, number of people go up. That's what we're talking about

729
01:12:04,659 --> 01:12:12,219
with Bitcoin because that metric doesn't go down. The number of people is going up all the time.

730
01:12:12,619 --> 01:12:17,499
New ideas are coming all the time. New passion is coming all the time. New skill set is coming

731
01:12:17,499 --> 01:12:22,519
all the time. New value add is coming all the time and it will just keep compounding and then

732
01:12:22,519 --> 01:12:30,539
the ripple effects of those actions of those people will just forever grow forever grow and

733
01:12:30,539 --> 01:12:36,979
it's just incredible to be a part of this and help people like Anuja get their voices heard get their

734
01:12:36,979 --> 01:12:44,359
projects out there in front of your eyes and ears and now the steps that you need to take are

735
01:12:44,359 --> 01:12:50,179
reach out or be inspired to go start your own thing really appreciate everybody really appreciate

736
01:12:50,179 --> 01:12:51,579
excuse me, everybody listening.

737
01:12:52,199 --> 01:12:55,219
Looking forward to releasing a couple more shows.

738
01:12:55,339 --> 01:12:57,739
We're getting very close to number 600.

739
01:12:58,379 --> 01:13:00,419
That's been a wild ride when I think back

740
01:13:00,419 --> 01:13:03,159
to when we started this in January 2020.

741
01:13:03,519 --> 01:13:05,079
So thank you everybody for listening.

742
01:13:05,759 --> 01:13:08,859
If you're new to the show, sorry, but not sorry.

743
01:13:08,939 --> 01:13:09,839
You got a huge backlog,

744
01:13:09,839 --> 01:13:13,939
but I'm sure you'll find some incredible content in there.

745
01:13:14,219 --> 01:13:15,799
All the guests have been amazing.

746
01:13:15,799 --> 01:13:18,439
finally another shout out

747
01:13:18,439 --> 01:13:18,779
relay

748
01:13:18,779 --> 01:13:19,839
r-e-l-a-i

749
01:13:19,839 --> 01:13:20,559
dot c-h

750
01:13:20,559 --> 01:13:21,079
forward slash

751
01:13:21,079 --> 01:13:21,339
bitten

752
01:13:21,339 --> 01:13:22,739
thank you for the support

753
01:13:22,739 --> 01:13:23,419
over this

754
01:13:23,419 --> 01:13:24,299
last

755
01:13:24,299 --> 01:13:25,659
five years

756
01:13:25,659 --> 01:13:26,519
pretty much

757
01:13:26,519 --> 01:13:28,479
been there the whole time

758
01:13:28,479 --> 01:13:29,439
five and a half years

759
01:13:29,439 --> 01:13:30,079
I think even

760
01:13:30,079 --> 01:13:31,659
Julian and the team

761
01:13:31,659 --> 01:13:32,099
over there

762
01:13:32,099 --> 01:13:33,519
I've watched them grow

763
01:13:33,519 --> 01:13:34,019
from

764
01:13:34,019 --> 01:13:35,559
a two or three man team

765
01:13:35,559 --> 01:13:36,499
into what they are

766
01:13:36,499 --> 01:13:36,979
today

767
01:13:36,979 --> 01:13:38,619
fully licensed

768
01:13:38,619 --> 01:13:39,759
with the Mika license

769
01:13:39,759 --> 01:13:40,419
here in Europe

770
01:13:40,419 --> 01:13:40,939
serving

771
01:13:40,939 --> 01:13:42,579
many different countries

772
01:13:42,579 --> 01:13:44,119
many different individuals

773
01:13:44,119 --> 01:13:44,899
and businesses

774
01:13:44,899 --> 01:13:48,379
helping them acquire Bitcoin

775
01:13:48,379 --> 01:13:51,419
and helping them with Bitcoin education as well.

776
01:13:51,559 --> 01:13:53,919
So get over to relay.ch forward slash Bitten.

777
01:13:54,279 --> 01:13:56,799
Download the Relay app and start stacking.

778
01:13:56,939 --> 01:13:57,819
Use the code Bitten.

779
01:13:58,359 --> 01:14:01,539
And Bitbox as well have been alongside this podcast

780
01:14:01,539 --> 01:14:03,339
almost as long as Relay.

781
01:14:03,659 --> 01:14:06,299
I really appreciate the work Douglas and the team are doing over there.

782
01:14:06,379 --> 01:14:07,719
Please self-custody your Bitcoin.

783
01:14:08,199 --> 01:14:08,939
Go check them out.

784
01:14:09,039 --> 01:14:11,279
Bitbox.swiss forward slash Bitten.

785
01:14:11,699 --> 01:14:14,079
Use that code Bitten for 5% discount.

786
01:14:14,079 --> 01:14:16,299
and I'll catch you guys on the next show.