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Hello, everybody. My name is Daniel Prince, and I'm the host of the Once Bitten podcast.

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This is a podcast focused on Bitcoin. It's my mission to interview as many people as I can

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around the different aspects of Bitcoin and help people understand exactly what Bitcoin

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could mean for them and for their families and for their future. I hope you enjoy the show.

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Thank you so much for listening.

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looking into for many years as you will find out in this conversation and for

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whatever reason he's carried on down the rabbit hole and made connections and

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networked his way in there and now works for the company and helping them to

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understand what Bitcoin is why it is very important to their future business

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plans and you as a pleb I mean look it's it's like I say it's very early days

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still many plebs are not going to spend their bitcoin many of you could buy for two dollars and

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ten cents this podcast without any of the intros and without any of the ad reads without any of the

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ad uh outros at the end uh if you wanted or you can listen to it for free still 99.9 percent

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listen to it for free and they have to listen to me droning on at the beginning and shilling

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companies such as Relay and Bitbox who have been incredible sponsors for the show and built

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incredible products as well for the Bitcoin space. So if you want to stack sets, if you're new to the

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game here and we are welcoming new people into Bitcoin every single day, do not ever lose sight

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of that metric every single day more people join bitcoin than leave let that sink in all right the

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dollar price is something completely different that's all the shiny bells and whistles that's

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what people get excited about but the number go up is the amount of people being drawn to bitcoin

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joining the network goes up every single day some will come and find this podcast some will find

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others some will find books some will find videos some wherever it takes them whatever is their

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portal to entry into the bitcoin space new people are coming every day and if you want to stack some

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sats and if you're based in europe relay are a company that have been around for a very long

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time they're based in switzerland it's spelt r-e-l-a-i dot c-h and you can use forward slash

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bitten or use the code bitten when you download the app and you're going to save on commission

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You can stack directly into your own self-custodial wallet within the app,

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and you can get help from their private team.

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If you're a high-net-worth individual or if you're helping others come into the Bitcoin space

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and they've got a large amount that they want to put in,

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or maybe it's a business that wants to start accepting Bitcoin on their balance sheet,

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it's all there for you.

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One-stop shop, relay, R-E-L-A-I, .ch, forward slash, bitten.

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self custody of your bitcoin is something that we really need to focus on as a

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community i don't know if that's the right word as a bunch of plebs who are trying to help other

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people down a rabbit hole behind us you have to help them understand the importance of self custody

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it's a softly but surely approach but eventually people are going to understand that if they've got

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Bitcoin on an exchange it's not their Bitcoin it's the exchange is Bitcoin so you need a hardware

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wallet bitbox.swiss forward slash bitten hit the link in the show notes or just type that into a

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URL into a browser excuse me bitbox.swiss forward slash bitten use the code bitten at checkout go

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and check out the bitbox02 and a bitbox nova they are both Bitcoin only hardware wallets so you can

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then start taking complete control of your bitcoin that means you are the only one that has access

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to that bitcoin you are the only one that can move that bitcoin ever again but please make sure you

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make a backup use a pen and paper do not use a digital backup do not take a picture of the seed

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phrase if this is all kind of gobbledygook language to you right now don't worry it's not that hard to

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understand you've just got to start get across to bitbox.swiss all the explainers are there or go

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and check out btc sessions and his excellent educational resources uh orange pill app you

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might have heard people talking about orange pill app in the past there has been a rebrand it is now

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called club orange get to the app store look at club orange hit the link in the show notes

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get over there and find there's almost 20 000 bitcoiners on there now around the world ready

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to connect with you you can find your nearest meetup you can find your nearest plebs you can

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find your nearest conference you can even buy direct conference tickets load up your wallet

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within the app and buy direct conference tickets if you want to get to a conference we've got btc

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prague coming up in june btc helsinki at the end of the towards the end of the year in september

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and BTC Dublin, which is coming up in May.

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You can use the code BITTON to get 10% discount on all of those tickets.

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I've run out of music. Enjoy this one with John.

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All right, John, lovely to have you on the show. How are you doing, mate?

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I'm doing great. It's really good to be here, Daniel. Long time in coming.

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Has been a long time coming. Definitely has been.

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I've been watching your, I think I first picked up on you talking about private jets back in 21, maybe.

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And then we started that little private little telegram group trying to get Bitcoin pilots from around the world into a little group.

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And forgive the pun, but never really took off.

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but and here you are just like a wee or two ago dropping fire on twitter announcing something big

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which we'll get into but uh before i do lauren has a question for you um so yeah i heard that

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you made like a private jet company i think that's what you said except bitcoin and my question is

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how do you make businesses want to accept bitcoin because i know a lot of them are very skeptical

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about it so yeah that's a really good question um well one of the ways that i

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uh went about it was describing bitcoiners and how you know

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you have this new kind of a new group of people who are growing in wealth and growing in influence

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and um just by signaling that you want to accept their money uh you're kind of tapping into a whole

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group of loyal customers. And so just from a purely capitalistic incentive base, like it's a,

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it just makes sense. It's also for the private jet company. It was,

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it's very value aligned. I think, I think it just makes sense. The connection between,

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you know, sovereign money and private travel with Bitcoin, we're trying to

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increase the amount of our personal freedom. And so for a private jet client, they're really,

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they're valuing their time so much that they want to,

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you know,

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spend a lot more to save time.

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And,

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and so,

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you know,

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there's some value aligned incentives there as well.

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But I think in when I spent,

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I spent a lot of time in Costa Rica with Paul,

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Paul in the jungle,

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Paul Keating.

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And he is incredible with this, just with the most basic vendors getting them to accept Bitcoin.

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He's almost like single-handedly spurred the Bitcoin circular economy there in Bitcoin jungle, along with some other really great diehard guys down there.

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and uh you know he's he's just great about showing the utility of it showing how easy it is

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um uh that you can you can get this bitcoin and no one else has to know about it no one else has

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to get in the middle of it and it's digital and it's there in your wallet you know

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thank you any follow-up questions

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um

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and don't think by the way that we're going to start flying privately

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all over what i was going to say

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become useful um

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i don i don think so all right okay all right yeah well thank you thank you for answering my question Absolutely Anytime If you have any more that you want to come back with later on

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if you think of anything, let me know.

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Okay.

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Thank you.

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All right.

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Anyways.

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Bye.

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Have a good podcast.

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Thanks, Lauren.

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Right.

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So, John, let's wind it back.

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What were you doing pre-Bitcoin?

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Oh, man.

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Pre-Bitcoin, I have to apologize, I have a little bit of a cold as well, but hopefully the audio is fine.

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Pre-Bitcoin, I was, I mean, pre-pre-Bitcoin, I was a mechanic, like welding trucks together in the suburbs of Chicago.

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and I got to the point where I was like coming into work and talking to these blue collar guys and

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on a Monday morning and you know they they've got this like grit about them and

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they kind of hate their life and the one guy that I was working with every Monday that I would come

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in. He's like, is it Friday yet? And so I kind of saw that the trajectory of that line of work

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as like, man, the whole 30 years, the whole next 30, 40 years of my life, I can kind of see it all

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playing out. And I'm like, that's not for me. I want to do something else. And I talked to a friend

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who was doing real estate and he was doing really well. And he said that I would do really well. So

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I came, moved into Chicago with like a few grand from, uh, from a tax return, uh, as a runway and

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lived in a friend's den and just started hustling in real estate, trying to sell rental apartments

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or rent apartments. And so yeah, for five years leading up to around COVID times, I was, uh,

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I was a real estate broker and I started to make more money doing that than any, than, you know,

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anything else prior. And so that was really exciting for me, uh, to be able to, you know,

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work really hard in a month and earn what I could make in like three months as a mechanic.

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and just kind of be in an environment where there wasn't really a ceiling.

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That was really cool.

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But around COVID times, the lockdowns started happening

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and it started to interfere with my real estate business.

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And at the same time, I was going down the Bitcoin rabbit hole pretty hard.

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I had read The Creature from Jekyll Island.

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I'd read The Bitcoin Standard.

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And those two books are sort of the key ones that catapulted me.

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Why did you pick them up?

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What was the driving force behind that?

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I had been interested in libertarian type ideas and Austrian economics for a while before that.

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And I was listening to, I had learned about Bitcoin in like 2016, pretty further on.

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I just never bought any, I never like got into it.

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And well, I bought a little bit in 2016, but it wasn't much.

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And, you know, watched it go up, go up and down through the market.

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um and so i'd listened to some of these podcasts and i i know i knew about trace mayor he had come on

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the um the i think it was anarchist uh jeff i forget his forget his name jeff something

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uh jeff berwick yeah yeah he the dollar vigilante yeah yeah yeah i was listening to him

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pretty regularly uh and jack spirko the survival podcast he didn't talk about bitcoin very much

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but that was more like prepper libertarian style and jeff had uh trace mayor on uh quite a few times

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and so i started listening to trace's podcast but trace's podcast he always had very technical guys

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And at that time, most of the educational stuff around Bitcoin was pretty technical.

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And if you didn't understand the basics of computers, which I was just a regular blue-collar guy, a surfer from California, coming out and just trying to make a living.

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And I didn't know barely how computers worked.

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um and so they you know i i knew that it was important and i knew that it was going to be big

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in the future um and so i want i start i was listening to it even though i could understand

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only like 60 of what these guys were saying um and i'm glad that i did because eventually he had

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Safedine on and that's how I got

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I started reading the Bitcoin

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Standard and I was

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listening to that while I was reading

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The Creature from Jekyll Island

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and so

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it

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you know

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The Creature from Jekyll Island

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just opened my eyes to the existing

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system. It just

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showed how the sausage was made right

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where you're

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like oh my gosh this is a complete

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scam and we're living

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in the thick of it.

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And it made me so hopeless almost to be like,

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how do we even get out of this?

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And with the Bitcoin standard,

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it showed the history of how we even got into this mess

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and then how Bitcoin is a real legitimate answer

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and a solution for what we're facing here.

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So then with COVID happening and the lockdowns,

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it just showed a complete overreach of government power in my estimation.

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and I saw things that I anticipated happening

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maybe 5-10 years down the road

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and that made me really convicted

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that this is all going to happen a lot faster than I thought

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so I better learn as much as I can about this Bitcoin thing

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because it's going to be really important

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in the years ahead.

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yeah so covid yeah that's another one that went down the rabbit hole very very quickly

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uh i remember it i remember it well i started the podcast in january 2020

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and i remember thinking i wonder if these guys i'd been reading and listening to i wonder if

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they'd ever you know come on some guy's pod and then before you know it we're locked down in march

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and everybody's diaries were blown open.

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It was just the moment, apparently,

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to just launch a new Bitcoin podcast

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because people were hungry.

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Even the diehards at that point

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still would have been able to list the days.

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I remember I would be waiting two days

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between podcast releases.

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You'd have the Rabbit Hole Recap

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or you'd have Valis

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or you'd have Brady still had his Citizen Bitcoin going at that time

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or Stefan's show.

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There was only like a handful out there.

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And, you know, you couldn't, you would download one and listen to it

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and then you'd have two days of waiting around.

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You're like, right, I've listened to everything else.

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Like, where's the next one?

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And, yeah, I, you know, just remember going fully down the rabbit hole

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with the guests that were coming on because it was helping,

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really helping me shape out my knowledge uh and at that point i'd been studying for a couple of

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years but there was so much information coming and and i remember class of 2020 and class of 2021

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were just woof they were they were in the rabbit hole covered in lube like they were down there

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quick yeah i was one of them i was i was pretty deep and yeah it's starting i started my podcast

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you know it didn't take it as further as far as you did um later 2020 in the fall

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and that was one of the very one of the mechanisms to just you know sit down with

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These guys that I was reading, I was listening to them on your podcast and many other guys.

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And, you know, everyone was just so, like, open and wanting to, like, contribute word out.

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And I'm so blown away.

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It was, yeah, that really catapulted my learning and understanding of where everything was going.

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And then once I started meeting, meeting up with people in person,

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that was a whole other layer of it.

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Yeah.

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So was that the conferences that you started going to or there was a local meetup?

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Yeah, the first

222
00:20:43,386 --> 00:20:57,912
well I first went to the OC Bitcoiners meetup I grew up in Orange County and came back to visit family and Thanksgiving and met up with Brian Harrington and a bunch of the local Bitcoiners

223
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in the OC Bitcoin network.

224
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And they'd been,

225
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they'd really grown the meetup

226
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to be like 20, 30 people every week.

227
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And it's a pretty dynamic community.

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And I was really impressed

229
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because,

230
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you know a lot of the learning a lot of the experience for bitcoiners is online and just

231
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interacting with people on x or back then twitter and uh podcasts or zoom calls and stuff like that

232
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but when you're in the flesh uh talking to a real person and describing the things that you're seeing

233
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in the world and they're actually agreeing with you and not being not looking at you like you're

234
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crazy. Um, it's, uh, you know, it's a really powerful thing to have that,

235
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to, to be in that kind of value aligned environment, um, and have, uh, a little bit

236
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of a reassurance in that, in that respect. Then after, um, after that, I started, uh,

237
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Because I was so impacted by that experience, once I moved to Miami to get out of the Chicago crazy lockdowns in 2021, I started the Miami Bitcoiners meetup.

238
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And that was really cool because at that time, there weren't even any meetups happening, let alone Bitcoin meetups, just none of the meetups were happening because of COVID.

239
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and even some of the Bitcoin meetups had stopped meeting.

240
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So I was like, what the hell?

241
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Why are we doing this?

242
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We should be meeting up in person.

243
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And the first one that I threw, like 20 people showed up

244
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and some of them came not because it was a Bitcoin meetup,

245
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just because it was the only meetup that was happening

246
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in the entire city.

247
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uh and yeah and then from there we did the some some of the guys that helped me with the meetup

248
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we threw the pleb party in bitcoin at bitcoin 2021 that was in miami and that was the first

249
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conference that i went to or that was the first big conference that i went to i went to uh the

250
00:23:23,712 --> 00:23:30,712
first bitcoin conference that i went to was the bitcoin and guns conference that was the like 3d

251
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printed guns in uh in austin that's pretty unique so people now are going to accuse me of trying to

252
00:23:40,412 --> 00:23:46,472
shield club orange at this stage uh because uh you know i've been part of that journey with mateo

253
00:23:46,472 --> 00:23:52,132
from the very beginning uh just in an advisory role and just you know meet once a month and

254
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throw shit against the wall with a handful of other Bitcoiners that are willing to give up their

255
00:23:56,872 --> 00:24:02,672
time and help a crazy guy build out a social app for Bitcoiners. But the reason I'm so happy to be

256
00:24:02,672 --> 00:24:09,712
a part of that is because I, like you, felt exactly the same. Because we were all locked down so hard

257
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and I'd been doing the podcast for 18 months or whatever, and I just hadn't met a real Bitcoiner.

258
00:24:17,412 --> 00:24:23,672
I'd met two, but I hadn't had that immersive experience.

259
00:24:23,932 --> 00:24:28,732
And the first time I really felt that was Miami 22, where I ran into you.

260
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And it's tough to put into words.

261
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So for people listening that hear me shill, like the idea of getting to your local meetup or getting to a conference, like make it this year, 2026 is this year.

262
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Stop being the lonely Bitcoiner.

263
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That's playing the victim card at this point.

264
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You know, six years ago, you've had you'd have had an excuse.

265
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There weren't there weren't that many people.

266
00:24:53,192 --> 00:24:54,692
Now, there's no excuse.

267
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You can download Club Orange.

268
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There's 19 and a half thousand people on the app who are willing to meet you for a beer or a coffee or a meal or even put you up if you're traveling through.

269
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This is like so, you know, you felt what I felt and what so many other people have felt that have been nice.

270
00:25:12,852 --> 00:25:18,992
a visceral kind of feeling. It's like no other feeling you've ever experienced before when you're

271
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around that kind of energy. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. And it's, to me, it's not just a feeling. It's

272
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actually, that's what Bitcoin is. Like, that's the social layer of Bitcoin, which is us, are

273
00:25:36,312 --> 00:25:44,712
the individuals who love and value Bitcoin and actually like pay attention to it and are

274
00:25:44,712 --> 00:25:49,732
sharing about it. And then our relationships with each other.

275
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And, you know, there's, there's that, there's also just like the fact that it's a,

276
00:25:57,452 --> 00:26:05,952
it's a digital asset and we're, we're pricing it and there's the economic part of it for sure. But

277
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yeah you uh i think if you're attracted to this thing you you're wanting to build more freedom

278
00:26:13,292 --> 00:26:20,312
in your life and uh what other one of the best ways to do that is to connect with others who

279
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are doing the same and that's what i've found to be um really really helpful in my journey for sure

280
00:26:30,012 --> 00:26:38,472
so coming out of COVID then uh was real estate still your thing were you like trying to resurrect

281
00:26:38,472 --> 00:26:50,732
that career um I was definitely interested in it I still I still am um I I owned a rental property

282
00:26:50,732 --> 00:26:51,692
as well in Chicago.

283
00:26:53,812 --> 00:27:03,332
And so from an investment standpoint, you know, and just the, especially coming from

284
00:27:03,332 --> 00:27:10,752
learning more and digging into like Citadel theory and that kind of thing, you know, I

285
00:27:10,752 --> 00:27:16,252
think real estate is a huge part of our lives.

286
00:27:16,252 --> 00:27:18,012
It's going to be going to be for a while.

287
00:27:18,012 --> 00:27:22,452
but I wanted to

288
00:27:22,452 --> 00:27:25,912
since I was coming out of Chicago

289
00:27:25,912 --> 00:27:27,352
out of the market

290
00:27:27,352 --> 00:27:29,292
I was licensed in Illinois

291
00:27:29,292 --> 00:27:34,332
I didn't practice after that

292
00:27:34,332 --> 00:27:37,252
but

293
00:27:37,252 --> 00:27:40,452
I was doing the podcast

294
00:27:40,452 --> 00:27:42,152
and then I got connected with Swan

295
00:27:42,152 --> 00:27:44,992
I started talking to Corey

296
00:27:44,992 --> 00:27:48,832
and that's when I started working with Swan

297
00:27:48,832 --> 00:27:54,012
to run a lot of their VIP events

298
00:27:54,012 --> 00:27:57,512
and kind of building their social layer

299
00:27:57,512 --> 00:28:01,192
for the Swan private clients

300
00:28:01,192 --> 00:28:04,692
and helping with the Pacific Bitcoin events.

301
00:28:06,832 --> 00:28:09,292
Yeah, that was an incredible experience as well.

302
00:28:09,292 --> 00:28:19,812
and yeah it's crazy that it's been like you know almost i guess six years since since that

303
00:28:19,812 --> 00:28:25,852
since 2020 that's wild a lot's happened since then so why have you drawn to like that the

304
00:28:25,852 --> 00:28:32,592
private jet side of things and when did that start happening so it's actually kind of funny

305
00:28:32,592 --> 00:28:36,072
I was at a Bitcoin, I was at Bitcoin 2022.

306
00:28:37,172 --> 00:28:38,492
I think it was.

307
00:28:38,792 --> 00:28:39,772
And that's when we met.

308
00:28:41,172 --> 00:28:52,232
And afterwards, after the conference or at a certain point during the conference, I was at a.

309
00:28:53,452 --> 00:29:02,572
The SOS Lux, my friend who's a lawyer, invited me to hang out on the on the rooftop at the not the SOS Lux.

310
00:29:02,592 --> 00:29:05,792
Desiless, Miami, South Beach.

311
00:29:06,452 --> 00:29:17,872
And while I was there, I met this guy who talked about how he was flying around in his jet looking at different universities to buy.

312
00:29:18,672 --> 00:29:22,012
And he wanted to, he was really interested in it.

313
00:29:22,012 --> 00:29:38,512
He had such a cool experience in college that he felt was being kind of ruined with the cultural decay and what the college education has become.

314
00:29:38,512 --> 00:29:55,672
And so he was really interested in trying to recreate a more positive, I guess, freedom-focused values-oriented college experience.

315
00:29:55,672 --> 00:30:14,652
And I was like, well, that's really interesting because, you know, we're really into education and, you know, personal sovereignties are really a big part of what we're focused on as far as like a lot of the Bitcoiners that we're connected with.

316
00:30:14,652 --> 00:30:27,992
And so we had some meetings and I introduced him to Robert and who's also really interested in like sovereign education and stuff.

317
00:30:27,992 --> 00:30:46,432
And we were exploring a way to create some sort of like sovereign university and maybe try it out for a few months at a particular university location.

318
00:30:46,432 --> 00:30:57,592
but he was also very uh proud obviously of his jet he had a learjet 35a and you know he showed

319
00:30:57,592 --> 00:31:03,232
his pictures and um was talking about how great it is that he can you know it's like his time machine

320
00:31:03,232 --> 00:31:21,158
and i was like yeah i imagine it you know amazing to be able to fly anywhere that you want at any time And we had I mentioned a there was a Bitcoin meetup happening in

321
00:31:21,158 --> 00:31:29,478
Austin pretty soon after the conference. And so I mentioned that to him and I also gave him

322
00:31:29,478 --> 00:31:39,538
the sovereign individual, the book, and he read it and he was just kind of really impressed by it.

323
00:31:39,538 --> 00:31:40,898
and amazed.

324
00:31:41,098 --> 00:31:43,698
And he's like, wow, I see all of this happening.

325
00:31:44,138 --> 00:31:48,118
This is really powerful.

326
00:31:49,458 --> 00:31:51,418
So yeah, we just developed a friendship.

327
00:31:52,878 --> 00:31:56,778
And he wanted to go to the Bitcoin meetup in Austin.

328
00:31:57,178 --> 00:31:58,058
It was a BitDevs.

329
00:31:58,558 --> 00:32:01,698
And so him and a few friends of mine and I,

330
00:32:02,198 --> 00:32:07,538
we flew together in his jet to Austin for the meetup and stayed.

331
00:32:07,538 --> 00:32:09,178
And then we all flew back to Miami.

332
00:32:09,538 --> 00:32:12,138
commercial, obviously, than a couple of days later.

333
00:32:14,958 --> 00:32:21,778
And so he was wanting to, he was newer to jet ownership,

334
00:32:22,338 --> 00:32:27,398
but he had been in the industry for quite a few years.

335
00:32:28,378 --> 00:32:34,658
And he was trying to create a jet share program

336
00:32:34,658 --> 00:32:39,938
that would take older jets

337
00:32:39,938 --> 00:32:42,458
because at the end of their life cycle,

338
00:32:42,638 --> 00:32:46,358
they lose almost all of their value, market value,

339
00:32:46,538 --> 00:32:49,018
but you can buy them and you can refurbish them.

340
00:32:49,738 --> 00:32:52,718
And oftentimes, because of the way

341
00:32:52,718 --> 00:32:55,238
that planes are maintained over their lifetime,

342
00:32:55,998 --> 00:32:59,938
they have pretty much all new parts

343
00:32:59,938 --> 00:33:04,258
and all new equipment throughout the,

344
00:33:04,658 --> 00:33:06,838
because of their maintenance cycles.

345
00:33:08,058 --> 00:33:10,258
And so many of them, many of the older planes

346
00:33:10,258 --> 00:33:12,798
are still able to be flown and able to be refurbished.

347
00:33:13,938 --> 00:33:15,138
They're perfectly fine.

348
00:33:15,218 --> 00:33:15,778
They're just older.

349
00:33:17,858 --> 00:33:20,238
So he was creating a jet share program

350
00:33:20,238 --> 00:33:25,478
where people could buy into a jet

351
00:33:25,478 --> 00:33:29,998
and share the maintenance costs and things like this.

352
00:33:30,978 --> 00:33:34,318
And, you know, he's wanting to open it up to Bitcoiners

353
00:33:34,318 --> 00:33:38,318
And so, you know, that was something that we were talking about and we were exploring.

354
00:33:39,558 --> 00:33:48,678
But it never, you know, after that, I started working with Swan and that was like my main focus, you know.

355
00:33:49,138 --> 00:33:54,598
And even for him, he had another company that he was running.

356
00:33:56,258 --> 00:34:02,038
And so he put the jet refurbishment business kind of on the back burner.

357
00:34:02,038 --> 00:34:13,498
so that that kind of sparked my curiosity though because it just to me

358
00:34:13,498 --> 00:34:24,459
even though the price point is so extraordinary and for you know for me I'm not I'm not going to

359
00:34:24,459 --> 00:34:31,058
be flying private regularly you know it's just not in my wheelhouse I have some questions about

360
00:34:31,058 --> 00:34:35,618
though, which I'm sure like a lot of the plebs would love to hear because not many of us have

361
00:34:35,618 --> 00:34:41,098
ever flown on a private jet, whereas you have. So what is that experience like? I mean, obviously

362
00:34:41,098 --> 00:34:47,459
it's a lot more common in America because you've got a huge country there and there's a lot of

363
00:34:47,459 --> 00:34:53,738
wealth that's been accumulated and you know, you have business and corporate as well, right? So

364
00:34:53,738 --> 00:35:00,358
it's a bit more common than most countries perhaps, but you know,

365
00:35:01,058 --> 00:35:06,419
And because you're flying within the country, you don't have to do the passport control or all this kind of stuff.

366
00:35:07,158 --> 00:35:08,378
So what's the experience like?

367
00:35:08,398 --> 00:35:16,498
You just turn up at the small ancillary airport, I'm guessing, rather than one of the big ones.

368
00:35:17,778 --> 00:35:20,838
It's hard for me to paint a picture, really, in my mind.

369
00:35:21,878 --> 00:35:22,118
Yeah.

370
00:35:22,118 --> 00:35:31,158
I mean, it depends a little bit because you can fly out of an international airport.

371
00:35:31,578 --> 00:35:41,018
Sometimes it will, but oftentimes it's preferable to fly out of smaller executive airports.

372
00:35:42,238 --> 00:35:50,158
And for example, in Miami, we flew out of a smaller airport in Fort Lauderdale.

373
00:35:50,158 --> 00:35:57,878
because fuel costs are a lot cheaper there than they are in Miami International.

374
00:35:57,878 --> 00:36:01,878
So there's little things like that that your operator and your broker

375
00:36:02,419 --> 00:36:12,058
will just inform you of to let you know how you can save money here and there.

376
00:36:12,058 --> 00:36:23,618
but at in Fort Lauderdale we just drove we took an uber to the airport and the uber drove straight

377
00:36:23,618 --> 00:36:31,758
up to the plane and we were and you know shook hands with the pilot gave him our bags

378
00:36:31,758 --> 00:36:37,678
You know, met our friend and got in the plane.

379
00:36:39,618 --> 00:36:39,638
Wow.

380
00:36:39,978 --> 00:36:43,278
It's pretty, it can be like that.

381
00:36:43,718 --> 00:36:51,818
Sometimes there's, you're going through an FBO, which is fixed base operator.

382
00:36:51,818 --> 00:37:02,038
uh those are going to be the the that's the company that is managing the flights that are

383
00:37:02,038 --> 00:37:06,698
that are coming in and and the people who are getting on the flights and just kind of organizing

384
00:37:06,698 --> 00:37:14,798
everything at the airport so oftentimes you'll pull up to the fbo which is just like a building

385
00:37:14,798 --> 00:37:20,758
in front of the airport and you'll go through that uh that fbo check in with them and then

386
00:37:20,758 --> 00:37:22,858
go on to the plane.

387
00:37:24,278 --> 00:37:27,018
So it's pretty, you know,

388
00:37:27,358 --> 00:37:31,658
that was the experience when I took an empty lake to Chicago.

389
00:37:32,098 --> 00:37:35,518
I was actually for this, the company that I'm working with right now,

390
00:37:35,818 --> 00:37:36,518
Quantum Jets.

391
00:37:39,678 --> 00:37:43,838
It was a couple of years ago. I was just in,

392
00:37:43,838 --> 00:37:52,558
And I was just working at home and I called him to catch up.

393
00:37:53,258 --> 00:37:55,338
And he's like, oh, what are you doing tonight?

394
00:37:56,598 --> 00:37:57,818
Do you want to go to Chicago?

395
00:37:58,678 --> 00:38:00,518
And I was like, yeah, sure.

396
00:38:01,278 --> 00:38:02,318
He's like, we've got a jet.

397
00:38:02,318 --> 00:38:05,978
We've got a Lear 60 that's flying out and no one's on it.

398
00:38:06,038 --> 00:38:07,678
So if you want to go.

399
00:38:09,018 --> 00:38:10,498
I'm like, yeah, sure, I'll go.

400
00:38:11,598 --> 00:38:12,419
Can I bring a friend?

401
00:38:12,419 --> 00:38:14,678
and I asked if I could bring my friend Blake.

402
00:38:14,678 --> 00:38:20,738
We got a pizza and some wine and went to the jet and flew to Chicago.

403
00:38:23,038 --> 00:38:24,698
It was a pretty great experience.

404
00:38:25,598 --> 00:38:26,178
That's amazing.

405
00:38:27,238 --> 00:38:30,178
Yeah, and so that's what's called an empty leg,

406
00:38:30,298 --> 00:38:33,598
where sometimes because of the jet's repositioning,

407
00:38:34,338 --> 00:38:36,738
it'll have a charter flight.

408
00:38:37,618 --> 00:38:41,118
Say in Chicago, it has to pick someone up,

409
00:38:41,118 --> 00:38:44,638
but it's located in Orange County.

410
00:38:45,038 --> 00:38:47,538
So it needs to be repositioned to Chicago

411
00:38:47,538 --> 00:38:51,218
and no one's on the flight except the pilots.

412
00:38:51,439 --> 00:38:53,658
So that's an empty leg.

413
00:38:53,858 --> 00:38:59,419
And that's just to dip a little into the app.

414
00:38:59,518 --> 00:39:01,858
That's one of the things that we feature in the app

415
00:39:01,858 --> 00:39:04,018
is just a marketplace for those empty legs.

416
00:39:05,018 --> 00:39:08,818
A lot of times operators will price those.

417
00:39:08,818 --> 00:39:17,678
and if they're priced then our app will pull them automatically and list them in our in app and say

418
00:39:17,678 --> 00:39:24,318
you know here's a flight that's going from here to here for this price and if you want to book it

419
00:39:24,318 --> 00:39:31,618
you can book it but there are a lot of other ones that just kind of they're not priced you have to

420
00:39:31,618 --> 00:39:35,698
kind of check with the operator and see what they're willing to take and so that's where

421
00:39:35,698 --> 00:39:42,378
having an actual relationship with someone like me or in the in the brook in the brokerage helps

422
00:39:42,378 --> 00:39:47,398
because then you get a little more access to those all right so let's talk about the company

423
00:39:47,398 --> 00:40:03,419
sure sure yeah um yeah so quantum uh i i came i met the ceo of quantum through swan because

424
00:40:03,419 --> 00:40:14,718
uh jan pritzker cto of swan is michael oglenick's brother-in-law believe it or not so they're uh

425
00:40:14,718 --> 00:40:22,818
connected by marriage and there are even a couple other swans that got to fly private um

426
00:40:22,818 --> 00:40:32,718
one one of the guys after pacific bitcoin had to go had to fly he was flying back to

427
00:40:32,718 --> 00:40:43,258
london and from la and quantum had an empty leg going from la to london on a big jet

428
00:40:43,258 --> 00:40:55,178
on what kind of plane it was uh it was a heavy jet it was a g it was either a g5 or g550

429
00:40:55,178 --> 00:41:03,598
i don't know i don't remember which um but he was on the plane like all by himself

430
00:41:03,598 --> 00:41:09,598
you're kidding and that that's a big jet that can hold like 14 to 15 people

431
00:41:09,598 --> 00:41:15,158
um and it just can that do that flight in one stint or is it going to stop and refuel

432
00:41:15,158 --> 00:41:20,578
uh the g5 can go all the way you're kidding wow yeah

433
00:41:20,578 --> 00:41:29,058
yeah um that's i think it had just flown um

434
00:41:29,058 --> 00:41:39,898
it had just flown a famous artist as well so that was kind of cool you know it's it's

435
00:41:39,944 --> 00:41:55,044
So I met up with Michael because he was immediately interested in accepting Bitcoin on the app.

436
00:41:55,044 --> 00:41:57,724
He told me about this app that they were developing.

437
00:41:57,724 --> 00:42:01,344
and we

438
00:42:01,344 --> 00:42:05,204
and he also

439
00:42:05,204 --> 00:42:07,664
we were trying to get him to

440
00:42:07,664 --> 00:42:10,204
do some sort of collaboration

441
00:42:10,204 --> 00:42:12,084
with Pacific Bitcoin as well

442
00:42:12,084 --> 00:42:14,624
we thought it would be cool to have

443
00:42:14,624 --> 00:42:17,024
a jet on location

444
00:42:17,024 --> 00:42:18,484
at Pacific Bitcoin

445
00:42:18,484 --> 00:42:19,944
and

446
00:42:19,944 --> 00:42:22,904
so we were just exploring

447
00:42:22,904 --> 00:42:24,824
to see what might make sense

448
00:42:24,824 --> 00:42:26,744
and

449
00:42:26,744 --> 00:42:33,104
after we established a relationship,

450
00:42:33,484 --> 00:42:36,664
but for Swan, just the engineering capacity

451
00:42:36,664 --> 00:42:39,584
and the focus on payments just wasn't really there.

452
00:42:39,824 --> 00:42:43,804
So we didn't really connect the dots for them at that point.

453
00:42:45,004 --> 00:42:50,564
But over this past year, I came back to San Diego

454
00:42:50,564 --> 00:42:51,924
after a year of travel.

455
00:42:51,924 --> 00:42:58,424
and I was just wanting to get back into work

456
00:42:58,424 --> 00:43:03,384
and get back and try getting into the private aviation industry.

457
00:43:03,384 --> 00:43:08,124
And so Michael kind of opened up Quantum

458
00:43:08,124 --> 00:43:14,784
and their app had been, at that point, was fully developed

459
00:43:14,784 --> 00:43:21,864
and able to be launched and downloaded and everything.

460
00:43:21,924 --> 00:43:49,024
And so we started working on it. And getting Bitcoin payments on the app was, for me, one of the bigger priorities because I know, I guess not everyone wants to spend their Bitcoin, but we want to open up the accessibility for this money.

461
00:43:49,024 --> 00:44:04,624
And to me, it functions as money. Yeah, it's savings technology. And yeah, I know a sailor is not spending any of it, supposedly, but it should be able to be used.

462
00:44:04,624 --> 00:44:19,624
And whether it's Bitcoin or whether it's stable coins or a bag of ETH that you don't want to tell anyone about that you have, you can burn it on private jets now.

463
00:44:24,764 --> 00:44:28,884
So what's the name of the app so people can download it if they want to?

464
00:44:28,884 --> 00:44:48,044
Yeah, it's Quantum Jets. The reason I joined up with them is just really because they're really more established in the industry. They've been in the industry for over 25 years.

465
00:44:48,044 --> 00:44:55,984
they've served you know royal families heads of state global business leaders uh some of the

466
00:44:55,984 --> 00:45:06,104
most high profile clients and they really have just an excellent reputation which is really

467
00:45:06,104 --> 00:45:16,764
difficult in that industry because what's crazy about it and what i learned was like it's not uh

468
00:45:16,764 --> 00:45:24,484
like licensed at all. Like anyone can go and just say they're a, say they're a private aviation

469
00:45:24,484 --> 00:45:34,004
broker. And so when it comes to actually getting into the industry and getting trusted advice,

470
00:45:34,004 --> 00:45:45,344
you really have to rely on solid relationships. Um, and up until recently, many of the,

471
00:45:45,344 --> 00:45:55,364
many of the requests and just the way that things worked had been very antiquated to where you'd,

472
00:45:55,364 --> 00:46:01,924
a lot of it is just on the phone, on phone calls back and forth, sometimes fax machines for,

473
00:46:01,924 --> 00:46:11,664
for, uh, contracts for a lot of the operators. And so quantum is really trying to take the industry

474
00:46:11,664 --> 00:46:18,324
to modern day times, update it and make it a lot more accessible for people who have the means

475
00:46:18,324 --> 00:46:29,124
and want to elevate that part of their life. So quantum jets and with Bitcoin now,

476
00:46:29,844 --> 00:46:36,804
you're able to make payment and everything, or you can use credit card as well. If you're using

477
00:46:36,804 --> 00:46:45,664
fiat and everything is handled in app which is really unique cool so for for the plane owners

478
00:46:45,664 --> 00:46:50,724
then because this is something obviously again very few people have ever experienced it's not

479
00:46:50,724 --> 00:46:55,724
as if they're on these planes the whole time right and from my understanding if you've got

480
00:46:55,724 --> 00:47:00,344
one of those planes just sitting around idle doing nothing for weeks on end that's about the worst

481
00:47:00,344 --> 00:47:08,424
thing you can do with a plane it's got to be used and uh used a lot uh and you know obviously checked

482
00:47:08,424 --> 00:47:15,344
after every flight and uh anything um that needs changing or whatever you got to be on top of it

483
00:47:15,344 --> 00:47:21,324
so that is why they put these into a pool of planes like yours and this is what you're kind

484
00:47:21,324 --> 00:47:27,724
of managing for so the plane owners become your clients and then you're finding rides or riders

485
00:47:27,724 --> 00:47:29,964
to go in and use the plane?

486
00:47:32,024 --> 00:47:32,584
Yeah, absolutely.

487
00:47:32,804 --> 00:47:37,824
Well, so Quantum, we have our brokerage side,

488
00:47:38,164 --> 00:47:39,664
which is sales and charters.

489
00:47:40,464 --> 00:47:42,124
And on that side of things,

490
00:47:42,124 --> 00:47:48,764
we will work with operators who are managing jets for owners.

491
00:47:49,084 --> 00:47:54,024
Or operators can be just the owners themselves,

492
00:47:54,584 --> 00:47:57,664
or pilots will be the operators.

493
00:47:57,724 --> 00:48:03,124
or there'll be a management company that will maintain the jet

494
00:48:03,124 --> 00:48:04,884
and take care of it for the owners.

495
00:48:05,724 --> 00:48:10,344
Similar to property owners and property management, right?

496
00:48:12,744 --> 00:48:16,784
But what's unique about Quantum is we actually have the brokerage side

497
00:48:16,784 --> 00:48:20,024
and we also manage a fleet ourselves out of Chino.

498
00:48:20,744 --> 00:48:25,084
So we have a couple heavy jets out of Chino.

499
00:48:25,084 --> 00:48:33,064
and so we have our own fleet that we handle as well.

500
00:48:35,564 --> 00:48:47,924
So for the owners, we're able to manage them,

501
00:48:48,724 --> 00:48:54,504
but we have access to thousands of jets around the world

502
00:48:54,504 --> 00:48:56,264
because of the brokerage side.

503
00:48:57,064 --> 00:49:00,704
And that's how it's all sort of networked together.

504
00:49:01,244 --> 00:49:05,604
A lot of the, there are certain operators

505
00:49:05,604 --> 00:49:06,944
that we won't work with.

506
00:49:07,324 --> 00:49:09,364
And there's a list that grows

507
00:49:09,364 --> 00:49:14,324
because safety issues are like paramount in this industry.

508
00:49:14,464 --> 00:49:17,444
And if you're not going to, you know,

509
00:49:17,624 --> 00:49:23,244
you really have to vet the people you're working with a lot more.

510
00:49:24,504 --> 00:49:28,404
Because it's not like you're just getting on,

511
00:49:28,984 --> 00:49:32,424
it's not like you're just going on Expedia, you know,

512
00:49:32,424 --> 00:49:38,104
and booking a flight commercially where you're trusting all of these,

513
00:49:38,104 --> 00:49:44,084
all of the aviation standards in the commercial space.

514
00:49:44,084 --> 00:49:57,284
so um yeah we that's one uh one way to describe it so as a use case i'm trying to think of a use

515
00:49:57,284 --> 00:50:01,744
case for bitcoiners now let's say you got a bunch of bitcoiners in the u.s six to eight guys

516
00:50:01,744 --> 00:50:08,704
gals whatever and they want to get across to uh a conference or something that's going on

517
00:50:08,704 --> 00:50:14,504
the other side of the country. Is this cost viable for them if they pitch in and pay in Bitcoin?

518
00:50:15,504 --> 00:50:21,964
Is that the kind of target audience you think is going to be attracted to the use of Bitcoin first?

519
00:50:24,004 --> 00:50:28,844
Yeah, I think so. I think that is where, and I'm wanting to,

520
00:50:28,844 --> 00:50:32,904
that's where I think it could work

521
00:50:32,904 --> 00:50:35,484
for now

522
00:50:35,484 --> 00:50:36,804
you know

523
00:50:36,804 --> 00:50:41,384
there are people who fly private

524
00:50:41,384 --> 00:50:45,344
regularly and I've spoken with them

525
00:50:45,344 --> 00:50:46,924
and they're Bitcoiners

526
00:50:46,924 --> 00:50:50,144
so for those people

527
00:50:50,144 --> 00:50:53,904
we want to open up this avenue for them

528
00:50:53,904 --> 00:50:55,964
if they want to use their Bitcoin

529
00:50:55,964 --> 00:51:06,964
um but i think for for people who are just kind of getting to the point where this is something

530
00:51:06,964 --> 00:51:15,164
that's viable for them it's it's not uh it's just so much more than you know a first class ticket

531
00:51:15,164 --> 00:51:21,984
a first class commercial ticket that uh in order for it to make sense it's got to be

532
00:51:21,984 --> 00:51:24,384
some sort of experience around it, I think.

533
00:51:25,824 --> 00:51:34,824
So one example that I could see happening is for, say, our upcoming

534
00:51:35,724 --> 00:51:47,993
2026 Bitcoin conference in Vegas by Bitcoin If uh there a group of people in New York that want to

535
00:51:47,993 --> 00:51:50,973
want to fly private to,

536
00:51:50,973 --> 00:51:51,613
uh,

537
00:51:51,993 --> 00:51:53,753
to Vegas for the conference,

538
00:51:53,753 --> 00:51:55,453
then,

539
00:51:55,453 --> 00:51:57,713
you know,

540
00:51:57,813 --> 00:52:01,313
14 people coming together to book a heavy jet,

541
00:52:01,313 --> 00:52:02,533
uh,

542
00:52:02,693 --> 00:52:04,033
would be,

543
00:52:04,033 --> 00:52:04,833
uh,

544
00:52:04,873 --> 00:52:07,733
it would be much more manageable for each of them.

545
00:52:07,793 --> 00:52:10,813
They're just paying for the seat in that, in that sense,

546
00:52:10,813 --> 00:52:12,693
or coming from Miami.

547
00:52:12,693 --> 00:52:18,093
So for these like group events where there's more of a,

548
00:52:18,713 --> 00:52:20,413
there's more people coming and,

549
00:52:20,513 --> 00:52:23,773
and they're actually people who want to fly together as well.

550
00:52:23,873 --> 00:52:26,153
Cause that's the other thing, you know,

551
00:52:26,653 --> 00:52:30,993
people fly private to get away from people oftentimes.

552
00:52:30,993 --> 00:52:46,953
So it's like getting on a jet with a bunch of people who you don't know, it's not really like, why would I pay a premium just for like a bigger seat or something like that if I could just fly commercial?

553
00:52:46,953 --> 00:53:15,793
But if you're going and I think if we're building an experience around Bitcoiners coming together and getting together at the FBO, we have a reception there with some drinks and build a little camaraderie around a group and have that group get together.

554
00:53:15,793 --> 00:53:20,553
and they're all people who are interested in getting to know each other

555
00:53:20,553 --> 00:53:23,473
and whether it's for networking purposes

556
00:53:23,473 --> 00:53:27,793
or just expanding their community,

557
00:53:28,673 --> 00:53:33,633
then they're flying together to Vegas

558
00:53:33,633 --> 00:53:42,893
and that is unlocking a whole new experience of the festival

559
00:53:42,893 --> 00:53:48,753
and of that whole week.

560
00:53:48,753 --> 00:53:57,913
Because then you're going with this group of like-minded people

561
00:53:57,913 --> 00:54:02,833
and they'll probably stick together through the conference

562
00:54:02,833 --> 00:54:05,473
and experience it together.

563
00:54:06,173 --> 00:54:07,833
So that's one way that I could see it happening.

564
00:54:07,833 --> 00:54:21,033
um it's also companies uh like 99 of a large majority of private travel is executive travel

565
00:54:21,033 --> 00:54:33,593
so uh for corporations that uh need it as a utility um i think that that's that's where

566
00:54:33,593 --> 00:54:42,313
it would make sense as well very cool mate so have you had any people reaching out yet have you got

567
00:54:42,313 --> 00:54:48,593
any use cases or is this like hot off the press right now yeah it's very hot off the press and

568
00:54:48,593 --> 00:54:56,733
even the app we haven't marketed it very much at all um because it's been very new and most of it

569
00:54:56,733 --> 00:54:58,953
has been for our existing clients.

570
00:55:00,973 --> 00:55:03,353
But yeah, just through my tweet,

571
00:55:03,513 --> 00:55:05,713
like a little walk and talk tweet saying,

572
00:55:05,833 --> 00:55:08,473
hey, we're accepting Bitcoin on the private Jets app.

573
00:55:10,913 --> 00:55:13,973
I got, we did get a few downloads

574
00:55:13,973 --> 00:55:16,133
and a few people interacting with it

575
00:55:16,133 --> 00:55:18,173
and asking questions about it.

576
00:55:20,173 --> 00:55:24,813
And a few people looking at empty legs

577
00:55:24,813 --> 00:55:25,733
and stuff like that.

578
00:55:25,733 --> 00:55:42,093
So yeah, this is something that's new. We take a very long-term view of it. And that's my understanding of it as well. I believe in Bitcoin as the future of money.

579
00:55:42,093 --> 00:55:58,353
And Bitcoiners, I believe, who are stacking and networking in this world are going to be some of the most powerful, influential, and wealthy individuals in the world.

580
00:55:58,353 --> 00:56:12,773
and so this is almost like they're my people and I want to you know open up this avenue for us

581
00:56:12,773 --> 00:56:19,793
for and for the community when when they're ready you know it's a something that is there

582
00:56:19,793 --> 00:56:29,273
people are utilizing it um every day and eventually people uh you know the plebs

583
00:56:29,273 --> 00:56:35,793
will will be there as well and that's whether it's you know five or ten years

584
00:56:35,793 --> 00:56:45,453
from now who knows but maybe sooner it's coming it always surprises us right exactly so

585
00:56:45,453 --> 00:56:48,393
So is the company stacking Bitcoin as well?

586
00:56:50,633 --> 00:56:59,293
The owners are, but we're, yeah, right now the Bitcoin that's paid in the app is transferred.

587
00:56:59,713 --> 00:57:05,493
It's going to be just like straight to USD because of business operating costs.

588
00:57:05,493 --> 00:57:09,913
but as we get more volume

589
00:57:09,913 --> 00:57:12,693
I think it would be a pretty easy case

590
00:57:12,693 --> 00:57:14,393
to take a percentage of that

591
00:57:14,393 --> 00:57:17,073
and put it into Bitcoin and start stacking it

592
00:57:17,073 --> 00:57:19,653
yeah

593
00:57:19,653 --> 00:57:21,713
I bet

594
00:57:21,713 --> 00:57:26,033
maybe if I could get him to sit down with Saylor

595
00:57:26,033 --> 00:57:28,293
I bet he would probably convince them

596
00:57:28,293 --> 00:57:33,573
what you should do is start a Bitcoin treasury company

597
00:57:33,573 --> 00:57:42,453
well yeah just stack some profits into bitcoin that's uh that's all you need to do right and uh

598
00:57:42,453 --> 00:57:49,713
well so you mentioned costa rica uh i'd love to get your take on on what's going on there i've got

599
00:57:49,713 --> 00:57:54,873
a friend there at the moment who's absolutely loving it and uh english guy there with his

600
00:57:54,873 --> 00:58:01,613
family already looking at land to purchase and build because of he just loves the vibe there

601
00:58:01,613 --> 00:58:03,713
He's met some incredible people down there.

602
00:58:04,353 --> 00:58:05,993
You said you spent some time with Paul.

603
00:58:06,133 --> 00:58:08,713
I'm guessing it was at Primal House.

604
00:58:10,473 --> 00:58:11,033
Yeah.

605
00:58:11,373 --> 00:58:16,853
Yeah, I was at the Primal House for like a month in the spring.

606
00:58:17,393 --> 00:58:20,113
Do you want to shill Primal House and Costa Rica

607
00:58:20,113 --> 00:58:23,273
and everything that you experienced for those people listening?

608
00:58:24,793 --> 00:58:28,613
Just so listeners are aware that these places are being built

609
00:58:28,613 --> 00:58:29,433
around the world.

610
00:58:29,433 --> 00:58:35,433
you know, the Bitcoin circle economies, as they're called in air quotes, are being built out.

611
00:58:35,733 --> 00:58:38,373
And this is a great example in Costa Rica.

612
00:58:40,253 --> 00:58:42,173
Yeah, yeah, absolutely.

613
00:58:44,453 --> 00:58:55,093
So, well, Costa Rica, for me, holds a special place in my heart.

614
00:58:55,093 --> 00:59:00,653
I went there when I was pretty young and I just fell in love with it.

615
00:59:01,273 --> 00:59:05,593
The people, the jungle, the vibrance of it, the waves.

616
00:59:06,673 --> 00:59:10,333
It's just a beautiful and amazing place.

617
00:59:10,333 --> 00:59:31,773
And Paul, since Paul is working with Primal, the Primal app, and they are really creating something beautiful in Bitcoin jungle where you can live off of your Bitcoin.

618
00:59:31,773 --> 00:59:49,593
You can go to the marketplace, you can go to the gas station, especially with the Primal app, you can live off of a social media app, which is pretty cool.

619
00:59:49,593 --> 01:00:00,633
and one of the I guess one of the great things that I experience when I'm down there is just the

620
01:00:00,633 --> 01:00:07,273
hyper connection to nature you know in civilized world we are you know we're in our houses here

621
01:00:07,273 --> 01:00:14,933
we're in our we're getting into our cars and going to the grocery store and we go we go into our

622
01:00:14,933 --> 01:00:24,473
job we go to the gym a lot of times our our like experience of of life is is just so like insulated

623
01:00:24,473 --> 01:00:32,973
from actual like natural forces and actual like the wind and the waves and and you know the elements

624
01:00:32,973 --> 01:00:40,113
um and so what i love about the jungle and this part of costa rica especially is just

625
01:00:40,113 --> 01:00:41,813
you're kind of

626
01:00:41,813 --> 01:00:44,573
immersed in it whether you like it or not

627
01:00:44,573 --> 01:00:46,153
and

628
01:00:46,153 --> 01:00:47,113
you have

629
01:00:47,113 --> 01:00:51,373
it's a

630
01:00:51,373 --> 01:00:53,973
you really get the chance to reconnect

631
01:00:53,973 --> 01:00:56,133
to nature and to

632
01:00:56,133 --> 01:00:58,273
your real

633
01:00:58,273 --> 01:00:59,393
primal existence

634
01:00:59,393 --> 01:01:00,013
you know

635
01:01:00,013 --> 01:01:01,613
and

636
01:01:01,613 --> 01:01:04,333
and

637
01:01:04,333 --> 01:01:06,633
that's something

638
01:01:06,633 --> 01:01:08,613
I love about Costa Rica

639
01:01:08,613 --> 01:01:26,013
And when you're there as well, connected with the community, that's a whole other aspect of it that's just, you know, invaluable.

640
01:01:26,013 --> 01:01:43,841
And that what when Paul and I actually took a trip to Argentina as well in 2024 with Mikael Marriota And Miquel is an Argentinian

641
01:01:45,321 --> 01:01:53,521
And that was a whole trip to explore the Citadel concept in Argentina.

642
01:01:54,741 --> 01:01:58,661
And yeah, like you said, there are communities and people around the world

643
01:01:58,661 --> 01:02:01,261
who are getting together and just building things,

644
01:02:01,261 --> 01:02:06,981
getting group houses, getting lands together.

645
01:02:08,041 --> 01:02:16,021
And so that was sort of an experiment of this concept of living life together

646
01:02:16,021 --> 01:02:24,621
and traveling to explore and potentially find a place to buy together

647
01:02:24,621 --> 01:02:30,801
or just to continue nomading together.

648
01:02:31,261 --> 01:02:38,141
you know, in different parts of the world. And, you know, in the Bitcoin world,

649
01:02:38,701 --> 01:02:46,101
what I found is that we are hyper-focused on building our own personal freedom and personal

650
01:02:46,101 --> 01:02:53,261
sovereignty. And that's an important aspect of it. That's an important step in the process

651
01:02:53,261 --> 01:02:58,981
to build your own resiliency and to build your own self-reliance.

652
01:03:00,601 --> 01:03:06,301
But as you pursue that path for yourself,

653
01:03:06,301 --> 01:03:13,761
you start to realize that there's only so much self-reliance

654
01:03:13,761 --> 01:03:15,541
that you can build for yourself.

655
01:03:16,001 --> 01:03:19,641
And there's only so much sovereignty that you can have

656
01:03:19,641 --> 01:03:22,041
as one single individual.

657
01:03:22,041 --> 01:03:39,781
And in order to really amplify the freedom and advantages that you get with Bitcoin, it really takes connecting with a network, connecting with a community.

658
01:03:39,781 --> 01:03:52,081
And once that happens, once you're able to build these interdependent relationships, then you can rely on each other's strengths to do so much more than you could do alone.

659
01:03:53,301 --> 01:04:08,661
And that was one of the really cool learning lessons that we found on that particular trip in Argentina, where we're kind of documenting this process as well, where we're like, well, we want to expand our freedom.

660
01:04:08,661 --> 01:04:25,361
We don't want to rely on the government for everything. We don't want to rely on them for protection. We don't trust them to tell us what the right way to eat is. We don't trust them with our health. We don't trust them with our money.

661
01:04:25,361 --> 01:04:28,921
and so

662
01:04:28,921 --> 01:04:32,961
instead of relying on the government

663
01:04:32,961 --> 01:04:37,181
how about we try to create communities where we can

664
01:04:37,181 --> 01:04:39,421
interact and rely on one another

665
01:04:39,421 --> 01:04:45,181
in ways that's going to reduce our

666
01:04:45,181 --> 01:04:49,041
reliance on government. So that's one of the cool things that I see happening

667
01:04:49,041 --> 01:04:53,261
in Costa Rica and in Argentina and many other places where

668
01:04:53,261 --> 01:04:58,501
groups of Bitcoiners are just coming together and building community centers,

669
01:04:59,261 --> 01:05:03,341
building farms.

670
01:05:03,341 --> 01:05:11,441
And I mean, one of the best things about Costa Rica is the farmer's market

671
01:05:11,441 --> 01:05:17,441
where you're getting like really fresh food and, you know,

672
01:05:17,481 --> 01:05:23,141
everything you need coming from the people who are growing it, you know.

673
01:05:23,261 --> 01:05:34,481
and yeah, so it's, it's happening and we're, uh, I want, I would love to, you know, for people to

674
01:05:34,481 --> 01:05:40,121
go and experience it themselves to see with their own eyes, um, you know, just what life can be like,

675
01:05:40,121 --> 01:05:49,921
uh, cause I know, I know what it's like to be, uh, just in your own world, um, in the,

676
01:05:49,921 --> 01:05:59,361
in the fiat realm so to speak and uh have all your friends and community uh just kind of

677
01:05:59,361 --> 01:06:09,601
i guess be mpcs and not not really care about this kind of stuff um so i yeah i definitely

678
01:06:09,601 --> 01:06:15,221
encourage people to go and experience it for themselves and 12 to 14 bitcoiners to get together

679
01:06:15,221 --> 01:06:21,821
get a G5, fly down to Costa Rica, hit the Bitcoin circle economy down there for a few months and

680
01:06:21,821 --> 01:06:27,901
just see what it's all about. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. And then we can keep going to

681
01:06:27,901 --> 01:06:38,181
Argentina. Yeah, exactly. To all the other ones. Mikael, my partner for the Argentina trip,

682
01:06:38,181 --> 01:06:40,281
he's actually renting a house

683
01:06:40,281 --> 01:06:41,121
in Cordoba

684
01:06:41,121 --> 01:06:44,061
I think starting now

685
01:06:44,061 --> 01:06:45,081
starting pretty soon

686
01:06:45,081 --> 01:06:48,281
and he's just making it a

687
01:06:48,281 --> 01:06:50,441
co-working, co-living space

688
01:06:50,441 --> 01:06:51,521
where people can come

689
01:06:51,521 --> 01:06:54,241
and rent a room for a week

690
01:06:54,241 --> 01:06:56,221
or a month or however

691
01:06:56,221 --> 01:06:58,361
long they want and to make

692
01:06:58,361 --> 01:06:59,401
it kind of that ongoing

693
01:06:59,401 --> 01:07:01,701
retreat experience

694
01:07:01,701 --> 01:07:04,421
and that's a really cool

695
01:07:04,421 --> 01:07:04,741
thing

696
01:07:04,741 --> 01:07:06,941
I have

697
01:07:06,941 --> 01:07:15,321
it's uh sovereign friends and oh cool sovereign friends in argentina then we got bitcoin jungle

698
01:07:15,321 --> 01:07:20,661
in costa rica we have the free madeira uh project going on over there where they've got the sovereign

699
01:07:20,661 --> 01:07:26,541
engineering cohort which is run by gg and pablo where people can go and live in madeira that

700
01:07:26,541 --> 01:07:30,661
obviously you you can rent with bitcoin as well you just go through andre who set the whole thing

701
01:07:30,661 --> 01:07:38,121
up and you can rent from him. He knows people you can rent cars from with Bitcoin. And you can plug

702
01:07:38,121 --> 01:07:44,121
into the sovereign engineering cohort and just hack away with Gigi and friend. And, you know,

703
01:07:44,161 --> 01:07:51,441
it's, it's amazing. It's absolutely amazing that these places are starting to appear and crop up.

704
01:07:51,441 --> 01:07:57,441
And this is the whole idea of the MeshTadel as well, having citadels and mesh networks around

705
01:07:57,441 --> 01:08:07,481
the world and now that you can get there via your own private uh travel uh with with the plane

706
01:08:07,481 --> 01:08:16,441
is i mean that is a really nice cherry on top at this stage like yeah maybe uh a little early for

707
01:08:16,441 --> 01:08:23,321
the the bitcoiners out there might be listening thinking yeah sounds great i'm not ready to spend

708
01:08:23,321 --> 01:08:29,741
that amount of money yet on on private channel uh travel but uh it's definitely the way things are

709
01:08:29,741 --> 01:08:41,621
going yeah yeah absolutely uh you know and that's that's what's the current uh elite elites do that's

710
01:08:41,621 --> 01:08:52,921
what they have you know it's we think that uh we can be a little uh i guess limited in our in our

711
01:08:52,921 --> 01:08:59,121
understanding of how the world works sometimes um where we think that people that everyone has to

712
01:08:59,121 --> 01:09:09,021
experience what we experience um everyone has to be guided like cattle into a tsa line and

713
01:09:09,021 --> 01:09:19,061
and violated uh every time they want to go somewhere yep um but for a certain group of

714
01:09:19,061 --> 01:09:26,841
people who sit at the top of the kentolin effect you know they don't have to do that no they they're

715
01:09:26,841 --> 01:09:38,121
privileged and and they have the ability to to have complete autonomy um and i think that that

716
01:09:38,121 --> 01:09:46,561
is at the core what we're trying to do or what we're trying we we're trying to rise up you know

717
01:09:46,561 --> 01:09:52,661
of the matrix, out of these systems of control and exploitation.

718
01:09:56,501 --> 01:10:09,101
And these networks and these communities are seed forms of what's to come, I think.

719
01:10:09,101 --> 01:10:16,201
And I really see that playing out well.

720
01:10:17,981 --> 01:10:25,941
And yeah, like private jet travel is a tool.

721
01:10:26,421 --> 01:10:32,221
And it's a tool that's going to be used for the sovereign individual going forward.

722
01:10:33,501 --> 01:10:38,161
And so it's there for us when we need it.

723
01:10:39,101 --> 01:10:44,761
Um, there's some, there are some details as well.

724
01:10:44,761 --> 01:10:53,341
Like if you're flying in a private charter, um, there's a lot, there's a little more, uh,

725
01:10:53,341 --> 01:11:01,541
transparency with, uh, as far as like having a manifest, uh, of who's on board and everything

726
01:11:01,541 --> 01:11:03,741
and going through security and stuff like that.

727
01:11:04,041 --> 01:11:09,081
Um, and so that's one level of private travel, but then there's a whole other level above

728
01:11:09,081 --> 01:11:16,021
that which is ownership when when you own your own jet you have a lot more freedom obviously with

729
01:11:16,021 --> 01:11:27,241
what you can do on your own jet when you're flying on it um so yeah we uh the the mesh del

730
01:11:27,241 --> 01:11:34,101
is uh is definitely gonna be a thing and if we can connect it if we can connect communities

731
01:11:34,101 --> 01:11:47,509
around the world with private flights I think it could be a very powerful very powerful thing Yeah A hundred percent I see it I see the future I see the vision

732
01:11:47,769 --> 01:11:50,269
Right. Before we shut this one down,

733
01:11:50,429 --> 01:11:53,609
I always ask the same last question. And that is,

734
01:11:53,709 --> 01:11:56,729
if you had one last orange pill left to give to somebody,

735
01:11:56,909 --> 01:11:58,809
who would you give it to and why?

736
01:11:58,809 --> 01:12:12,169
man

737
01:12:12,169 --> 01:12:20,449
I think I would give it to my friend Michael

738
01:12:20,449 --> 01:12:22,969
which

739
01:12:22,969 --> 01:12:26,329
it's more of a personal

740
01:12:26,329 --> 01:12:27,589
thing for me

741
01:12:27,589 --> 01:12:36,249
It's like this friend and mentor of mine that I've had for the past six years.

742
01:12:36,649 --> 01:12:50,709
He's an ultra-successful entrepreneur who has an e-commerce company that he's built to be extraordinarily successful.

743
01:12:50,709 --> 01:12:57,549
and Bitcoin was just always this kind of blind spot for him.

744
01:12:57,889 --> 01:12:59,689
He got it at a certain point,

745
01:12:59,789 --> 01:13:03,329
but then he started getting more into crypto and ETH

746
01:13:03,329 --> 01:13:04,549
and stuff like this.

747
01:13:05,589 --> 01:13:07,889
So yeah, I would give it to Michael.

748
01:13:08,989 --> 01:13:12,809
I think that everyone else will come to it

749
01:13:12,809 --> 01:13:15,249
on their own terms.

750
01:13:15,249 --> 01:13:20,269
but uh yeah you're always we're always like

751
01:13:20,269 --> 01:13:27,729
trying once when we understand something a certain way we want to try to get other people to

752
01:13:27,729 --> 01:13:33,049
understand it the same way you know and i get that i get that struggle

753
01:13:33,049 --> 01:13:39,489
so how can people reach how can people reach out to you and what's the best way to uh

754
01:13:39,489 --> 01:13:44,369
interact if there's any way that they feel they can add value if they want to use a service

755
01:13:44,369 --> 01:13:56,289
yeah so find me on x my name john chenot j-o-n-c-h-e-n-o-t and you can email me at

756
01:13:56,289 --> 01:14:02,929
john j-o-n at quantum jets um download the quantum jets app use code bitten

757
01:14:02,929 --> 01:14:13,849
nice and and yeah let me know give me feedback on what you think of the app as well

758
01:14:13,849 --> 01:14:16,589
I'd love to hear back from you

759
01:14:16,589 --> 01:14:19,749
and check out

760
01:14:19,749 --> 01:14:22,009
also citadel3.com

761
01:14:22,009 --> 01:14:23,509
is my website

762
01:14:23,509 --> 01:14:26,569
where I'm hosting

763
01:14:26,569 --> 01:14:28,209
I have a little teaser

764
01:14:28,209 --> 01:14:29,869
of a film that I'm working on

765
01:14:29,869 --> 01:14:31,309
from our

766
01:14:31,309 --> 01:14:32,829
Argentina trip

767
01:14:32,829 --> 01:14:33,829
that's

768
01:14:33,829 --> 01:14:36,609
slowly coming together

769
01:14:36,609 --> 01:14:37,289
we've got

770
01:14:37,289 --> 01:14:41,129
the filmmaking process

771
01:14:41,129 --> 01:14:43,269
is crazy

772
01:14:43,269 --> 01:14:50,529
um but but we've we've got a teaser there that kind of shows the experience and some highlights

773
01:14:50,529 --> 01:14:59,249
and uh kind of what the what the theme is and what citadel 3 is all about um so you can find a lot of

774
01:14:59,249 --> 01:15:06,789
information there sign up for uh you know for updates and stuff there at the website and yeah

775
01:15:06,789 --> 01:15:12,269
i look forward to hear more from your audience excellent well john thanks for coming on mate and

776
01:15:12,269 --> 01:15:14,369
thanks for everything that you've done in the past for Bitcoin,

777
01:15:14,549 --> 01:15:17,249
continue to do and will continue to do for the future.

778
01:15:17,389 --> 01:15:18,569
I don't think you're going anywhere.

779
01:15:19,089 --> 01:15:22,529
And other than, I mean, reaching for the skies,

780
01:15:22,629 --> 01:15:24,469
another pun fully intended there.

781
01:15:25,169 --> 01:15:28,389
And hopefully, yeah, we'll just follow you along on your journey.

782
01:15:28,529 --> 01:15:32,049
And if there's any way that I can help or get you connected,

783
01:15:32,829 --> 01:15:40,229
I'm not sure whether this is like an area of interest for people over here in

784
01:15:40,229 --> 01:15:45,729
Europe yet with private jets? I really don't know. It's not a world I've ever been exposed to.

785
01:15:47,509 --> 01:15:53,789
Yeah. Well, it definitely is. I guess the app, one thing I should add is the app right now is

786
01:15:53,789 --> 01:16:03,229
just for the US. So I think you do have a lot of US listeners as well, but for custom charters,

787
01:16:03,229 --> 01:16:07,269
we can arrange for global charters.

788
01:16:07,469 --> 01:16:11,529
So that's something we can do on a personal basis.

789
01:16:12,529 --> 01:16:19,869
But yeah, it'll be interesting to see what comes of it.

790
01:16:20,829 --> 01:16:21,269
100%.

791
01:16:21,269 --> 01:16:22,769
All right, John, thanks for coming on.

792
01:16:22,949 --> 01:16:23,569
Great to have you.

793
01:16:23,869 --> 01:16:24,269
Absolutely.

794
01:16:24,689 --> 01:16:25,609
Thanks for having me, man.

795
01:16:27,209 --> 01:16:28,569
Well, there you go, guys.

796
01:16:28,649 --> 01:16:29,849
Thank you so much for listening.

797
01:16:29,849 --> 01:16:34,589
Thank you, John, for coming on the show and sharing everything that you've been up to there.

798
01:16:34,909 --> 01:16:36,309
Exciting times.

799
01:16:37,229 --> 01:16:41,509
Who listening is now going to go and get themselves?

800
01:16:42,489 --> 01:16:49,789
I would love to hear the story of a bunch of Bitcoiners on the east or west coast of the US

801
01:16:49,789 --> 01:16:52,949
that are trying to get to a conference that just go, you know what?

802
01:16:53,929 --> 01:16:55,829
YOLO, let's spend some Bitcoin.

803
01:16:55,829 --> 01:17:03,089
let's make the absolute freaking best experience we could even think about doing get a bunch of

804
01:17:03,089 --> 01:17:08,729
our friends together and just do this the right way that'd be a cool thing to hear uh you know

805
01:17:08,729 --> 01:17:15,589
i'm not saying go do it i'm just saying that would be a cool thing to to hear because look

806
01:17:15,589 --> 01:17:22,489
the parallel economy right is being built and whether that is selling homemade jams

807
01:17:22,489 --> 01:17:25,429
that you've made in your kitchen

808
01:17:25,429 --> 01:17:26,849
at Bitcoin conferences

809
01:17:26,849 --> 01:17:28,329
shout out to

810
01:17:28,329 --> 01:17:29,389
you know who you are

811
01:17:29,389 --> 01:17:29,909
mom

812
01:17:29,909 --> 01:17:31,769
and your excellent preserves

813
01:17:31,769 --> 01:17:33,229
two

814
01:17:33,229 --> 01:17:36,709
advising private jet companies

815
01:17:36,709 --> 01:17:38,329
on how to attract

816
01:17:38,329 --> 01:17:41,769
the next wave of

817
01:17:41,769 --> 01:17:43,549
wealth

818
01:17:43,549 --> 01:17:44,929
that has been

819
01:17:44,929 --> 01:17:46,569
accrued and built

820
01:17:46,569 --> 01:17:48,109
over the last 16 years

821
01:17:48,109 --> 01:17:50,289
that are going to be looking

822
01:17:50,289 --> 01:17:51,589
for these kind of services

823
01:17:51,589 --> 01:18:00,209
we've got everything covered in between too like so it's here it's been built and it continues to

824
01:18:00,209 --> 01:18:06,309
be built we we have other marketplaces like plebeian or plebeian.market or we have dave

825
01:18:06,309 --> 01:18:11,469
bennett none your business over there he's shilling the circle p he's doing absolutely

826
01:18:11,469 --> 01:18:19,229
everything he can in his power to give power to small merchants people that are making the

827
01:18:19,229 --> 01:18:23,729
chocolate bars you've got the Oshigai you've got Leather Mint who's now doing

828
01:18:23,729 --> 01:18:27,989
all of the beautiful leather bound Bitcoin standard books but he was making

829
01:18:27,989 --> 01:18:32,429
beautiful leather wallets as well you got Soap Miner the dude that's making

830
01:18:32,429 --> 01:18:37,689
soap like I said we over here in the UK we've we go to these conferences we've

831
01:18:37,689 --> 01:18:41,869
bought teas we've bought coffees we've bought soaps we've bought candles like

832
01:18:41,869 --> 01:18:52,329
beeswax candles we've bought uh lem uh marmalade lemonade with beer uh absolutely so many things

833
01:18:52,329 --> 01:19:00,229
with bitcoin it doesn't end it doesn't suddenly get switched off it only grows and it grows

834
01:19:00,229 --> 01:19:07,149
organically and it grows quickly or i should say gradually then suddenly and if you've not read

835
01:19:07,149 --> 01:19:09,329
that book by a friend of the show

836
01:19:09,329 --> 01:19:10,809
Parker Lewis then you should

837
01:19:10,809 --> 01:19:13,229
go and check it out if you want

838
01:19:13,229 --> 01:19:14,989
to go back and listen we've gone through

839
01:19:14,989 --> 01:19:17,229
I think three of the chapters

840
01:19:17,229 --> 01:19:19,049
now you can just find Parker on

841
01:19:19,049 --> 01:19:21,129
that on just search

842
01:19:21,129 --> 01:19:22,969
on fountain and there's another one

843
01:19:22,969 --> 01:19:24,409
fountain app

844
01:19:24,409 --> 01:19:27,229
if you've

845
01:19:27,229 --> 01:19:29,289
listened to this whole episode

846
01:19:29,289 --> 01:19:30,849
on Spotify or Apple

847
01:19:30,849 --> 01:19:32,909
or Google or Podbean

848
01:19:32,909 --> 01:19:35,029
or Podcast Addict or wherever it is

849
01:19:35,029 --> 01:19:37,069
that you've been listening to

850
01:19:37,069 --> 01:19:45,689
podcasts over the years move just move your energy to fountain app because that is an app

851
01:19:45,689 --> 01:19:54,049
enabled with NOSTA enabled with lightning payments and zaps and you can be part of that whole

852
01:19:54,049 --> 01:19:59,749
network that whole parallel economy and support a company that is building bitcoin tools

853
01:19:59,749 --> 01:20:06,029
do you have a NOSTA account yet have you spun up a NOSTA account go do it you have nothing to lose

854
01:20:06,029 --> 01:20:07,309
It doesn't cost you anything.

855
01:20:07,829 --> 01:20:09,189
And you might say, oh yeah, it costs my time

856
01:20:09,189 --> 01:20:11,109
and I don't have time to get into and learn about it.

857
01:20:11,189 --> 01:20:12,549
Well, you better fucking hurry up

858
01:20:12,549 --> 01:20:13,649
and learn about what's going on.

859
01:20:14,429 --> 01:20:16,489
Because the parallel economy is being built

860
01:20:16,489 --> 01:20:17,689
and it is happening.

861
01:20:18,089 --> 01:20:20,389
And if we're not going to keep championing it

862
01:20:20,389 --> 01:20:21,669
and using it,

863
01:20:21,869 --> 01:20:24,929
then we're just going to end up trapped

864
01:20:24,929 --> 01:20:27,609
in this hell that we find ourselves in

865
01:20:27,609 --> 01:20:29,789
for another lifetime.

866
01:20:30,569 --> 01:20:32,709
And that's not what I think

867
01:20:32,709 --> 01:20:35,249
the listeners of this show are here to do.

868
01:20:35,249 --> 01:20:40,189
you're here to champion the bitcoiners you probably might even be at the point now where

869
01:20:40,189 --> 01:20:44,149
you want to start your own thing and i don't know what that is it could be writing it could be

870
01:20:44,149 --> 01:20:50,169
singing could be dancing could be making videos could be artwork could be making a podcast doesn't

871
01:20:50,169 --> 01:20:56,929
matter go do it or if you are looking for support download club orange and find your nearest

872
01:20:56,929 --> 01:21:01,649
bitcoiners so you can go find that support because i guarantee if you walk into your local bitcoin

873
01:21:01,649 --> 01:21:07,429
meetup, which you might not have known has even existed for the last two years, and you walk in

874
01:21:07,429 --> 01:21:12,149
and there's five dudes sitting there and you float an idea out there, you could have something

875
01:21:12,149 --> 01:21:21,449
working within weeks. So get on Club Orange. Go find your people. It's so simple. Download the app.

876
01:21:21,609 --> 01:21:25,489
Hit the link in the show notes. Come join us. There's almost 20,000 people around the world

877
01:21:25,489 --> 01:21:30,069
looking to connect with you. Thank you, John, for coming on the show. Thank you, everybody,

878
01:21:30,069 --> 01:21:35,669
for listening. I look forward to the next one. Stack safe and see you at one of the conferences

879
01:21:35,669 --> 01:21:38,169
this year. Check the links in the show notes.