1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:08,440 Welcome to the Bitcoin Playbook, where we discuss proven strategies for using Bitcoin 2 00:00:08,440 --> 00:00:13,420 in your business. I'm your host, Josh Friedemann, and this week, Trey Sellers and John Gordon 3 00:00:13,420 --> 00:00:17,180 are joining me for another Roundup episode. Today, we're going to be talking about the 4 00:00:17,180 --> 00:00:22,400 recently signed into law Genius Act, the UK potentially selling $7 billion of Bitcoin 5 00:00:22,400 --> 00:00:26,340 and Trump Media purchasing $2 billion. Here are John and Trey. 6 00:00:26,340 --> 00:00:33,280 Guys, welcome back to another Roundup episode. The biggest news in the last couple of weeks probably is Trump signing into law the Genius Act. 7 00:00:33,660 --> 00:00:46,000 This is something that allegedly keeps CBDCs from becoming a thing and also provides just a lot of regulatory clarity for people, institutions, Wall Street, etc., who are wanting to get into Bitcoin. 8 00:00:46,160 --> 00:00:51,540 So let's have a little bit of discussion on this. Trey, first of all, any thoughts on the Genius Act? 9 00:00:51,540 --> 00:01:03,160 I think there's been a lot of discussion around whether or not stable coins can act as a entry point for Bitcoin and Bitcoin adoption. 10 00:01:03,580 --> 00:01:06,020 I think that's probably true to some degree. 11 00:01:06,820 --> 00:01:13,680 And it remains to be seen exactly what the implementation details of all of this will actually be, though. 12 00:01:13,680 --> 00:01:20,040 So, you know, when I think about stable coins in the way that they have been used in the 13 00:01:20,040 --> 00:01:26,560 past, it very much is like cash, with the exception that, you know, it's issued from 14 00:01:26,560 --> 00:01:29,360 Tether, typically speaking, maybe USDC. 15 00:01:30,140 --> 00:01:35,820 But it can be frozen and it can be censored. 16 00:01:36,200 --> 00:01:42,220 It just kind of typically hasn't been because Tether has been a little bit at arm's length 17 00:01:42,220 --> 00:01:49,240 from the law, a lot of this is meant to bring them into the fold and make a legal framework 18 00:01:49,240 --> 00:01:58,180 that allows for a stablecoin industry to flourish and allows for the banks to come into some 19 00:01:58,180 --> 00:02:04,220 stablecoin issuance as well in a way that doesn't compete with their business and the deposits that 20 00:02:04,220 --> 00:02:09,820 they have. There's a few kind of surface level benefits to using a stablecoin, which is that 21 00:02:09,820 --> 00:02:15,400 generally they run on more public infrastructure. There is some censorship 22 00:02:15,400 --> 00:02:21,900 properties available to the companies that run these like Tether. They can kind of freeze funds. 23 00:02:22,340 --> 00:02:27,660 And then of course, the US Treasury, because they are backed typically by treasury bills, 24 00:02:28,440 --> 00:02:33,760 cash like instruments that are short duration in order to maintain that peg that they've got 25 00:02:33,760 --> 00:02:39,720 and be able to fulfill any redemption requests, that does put a choke point for those companies. 26 00:02:39,820 --> 00:02:45,680 such that if the United States government went to tether or went to circle with USDC and said, 27 00:02:45,780 --> 00:02:50,660 hey, we don't like what you're doing. We're going to freeze these assets that you have, 28 00:02:50,720 --> 00:02:54,580 these treasuries that you're holding and reserve for the stable coins. There is that choke point 29 00:02:54,580 --> 00:03:02,560 there. So, you know, it's kind of, it kind of is meant to be cash, like dollar cash, like, 30 00:03:02,840 --> 00:03:09,620 but the actual implementation of that gets a little bit hairy when you it's digital in nature, 31 00:03:09,620 --> 00:03:15,380 because it can be censored in a way that physical cash actually can't. 32 00:03:15,380 --> 00:03:20,400 But it obviously has the benefit of being able to travel across the internet in a way 33 00:03:20,400 --> 00:03:21,620 that physical cash can't. 34 00:03:21,860 --> 00:03:29,920 So there is a lot of use case here for dollar exposure that can flood across borders, that 35 00:03:29,920 --> 00:03:34,800 can broaden the dollar network and make it bigger and more liquid. 36 00:03:34,800 --> 00:03:50,620 And then I think a secondary effect of this, which a lot of these lawmakers seem to be harping on, is that it can provide an additional boost to demand for U.S. treasuries at a time when they absolutely are needed. 37 00:03:50,620 --> 00:04:20,120 Now, the one caveat that I would say to that is that, again, these are typically short duration treasuries, right? They are bills. They need to be bills because these are, in effect, kind of like demand deposits where, you know, if you were to back tether with long duration assets like 30 year bonds, now all of a sudden you're introducing interest rate risk. 38 00:04:20,120 --> 00:04:27,660 and the balance sheet or the underlying assets become a lot more volatile. 39 00:04:27,900 --> 00:04:31,500 Like, look what happened when Powell raised rates a few years ago. 40 00:04:32,020 --> 00:04:36,040 Long duration bonds just tanked like 25% in very short order. 41 00:04:36,340 --> 00:04:41,900 That puts a lot of pressure on Tether's ability or Circle's ability to actually meet redemption 42 00:04:41,900 --> 00:04:50,040 requests when people want to exchange their USDT or USDC for actual real dollars in the fiat 43 00:04:50,040 --> 00:04:57,040 financial system. So while it boosts bill demand, that's great, but it doesn't actually solve the 44 00:04:57,040 --> 00:05:00,620 problem in my view, and maybe I'm not thinking about this the right way, but it doesn't actually 45 00:05:00,620 --> 00:05:05,780 solve the problem that the US government has, which is how do you create demand for long duration 46 00:05:05,780 --> 00:05:11,040 debt? How do you create demand for 10-year bonds and 30-year bonds? This does not really address 47 00:05:11,040 --> 00:05:15,900 that because you need to back it with short duration assets. I hadn't really actually 48 00:05:15,900 --> 00:05:20,520 thought of that. And I guess part of it is that I haven't really seen what Tether's buying when 49 00:05:20,520 --> 00:05:26,940 it comes to their treasuries. Is it basically, if nation states don't step in, there's really not 50 00:05:26,940 --> 00:05:32,240 going to be a lot of relief for the United States? Is that the thought there? Yeah. I mean, Tether's 51 00:05:32,240 --> 00:05:37,440 one of the largest buyers of treasuries in the world. And it's also the most profitable business 52 00:05:37,440 --> 00:05:44,080 per employee, I believe, in the world. They made $13 billion in operating profit last year in 2024 53 00:05:44,080 --> 00:05:50,220 and have a significant Bitcoin stack, gold stack, as well as the treasuries. Why is there such a big 54 00:05:50,220 --> 00:05:55,500 use case for stable coins globally is because the dollar still serves as the global reserve currency 55 00:05:55,500 --> 00:06:00,460 and people around the world have challenges in opening up USD-denominated bank accounts, 56 00:06:00,460 --> 00:06:07,420 depending on where you are and where you live. To be able to access dollars that Tether is able 57 00:06:07,420 --> 00:06:13,600 to take in that interest rate from those short-term bills, as Trey is saying, those T-bills, 58 00:06:14,020 --> 00:06:19,180 and that interest is not passed on to the user or individual, right? Because the value they're 59 00:06:19,180 --> 00:06:25,280 getting is access to immediate dollars, which likely are more stable than their currency, 60 00:06:25,280 --> 00:06:30,180 but is not more stable and not also solving the problem of the debt that the US has. 61 00:06:30,880 --> 00:06:36,440 And if I understand it correctly, John, I think that by design, the Genius Act does, 62 00:06:36,440 --> 00:06:43,040 it prevents the stablecoin issuers from providing yield on those stablecoin balances, 63 00:06:43,800 --> 00:06:49,980 which in my mind is just a way to placate the banks to say, hey, these are not like directly 64 00:06:49,980 --> 00:06:57,040 competitive with your business of, you know, bringing in deposits, paying a small amount of 65 00:06:57,040 --> 00:07:01,000 yield on those things so you can attract those deposits and then lending long or whatever, 66 00:07:01,000 --> 00:07:08,800 If that's what banks are worried about, which I imagine it is because they need to attract 67 00:07:08,800 --> 00:07:13,420 deposits in, this prevents them from competing on that front. 68 00:07:13,960 --> 00:07:14,440 That's correct. 69 00:07:14,600 --> 00:07:18,320 Yeah, they're not allowed to pass on some of that interest to users like you may have 70 00:07:18,320 --> 00:07:20,800 seen in traditional bank accounts in the US. 71 00:07:22,200 --> 00:07:27,740 So the stablecoin markets that is about $250 billion today is projected to grow significantly. 72 00:07:27,740 --> 00:07:32,820 So I think this bill is very much a regulatory capture kind of bill and trying to establish 73 00:07:32,820 --> 00:07:36,560 and we've seen circles since going public recently. 74 00:07:36,720 --> 00:07:37,860 Their stock price has gone up. 75 00:07:37,980 --> 00:07:43,160 I mean, the US company is wanting to get sort of a cut of the pie there in a growing market 76 00:07:43,160 --> 00:07:48,040 that is potentially very profitable because you don't pass on that interest to users in 77 00:07:48,040 --> 00:07:49,240 many ways. 78 00:07:49,420 --> 00:07:54,120 So I think there hasn't been a huge demand or need for stable coins in the US because 79 00:07:54,120 --> 00:07:57,700 we have Zelle, we have PayPal or Venmo or whatever else you want to use. 80 00:07:57,740 --> 00:08:01,700 or just your JPMorgan Chase account for sending dollars along. 81 00:08:03,360 --> 00:08:10,380 So I think it definitely remains to be seen how useful or impactful this would actually be in the U.S., 82 00:08:10,380 --> 00:08:11,680 maybe more globally. 83 00:08:11,920 --> 00:08:18,060 It enables U.S. companies to get more involved, whereas Tether is not domiciled in the U.S., 84 00:08:18,060 --> 00:08:20,160 headquarters in El Salvador and elsewhere, 85 00:08:20,900 --> 00:08:26,140 and have been getting closer to kind of the D.C. and policymakers. 86 00:08:26,140 --> 00:08:29,600 So certainly seeing a place for them here. 87 00:08:29,820 --> 00:08:34,940 And you're seeing, I think, that censorship, the lack of censorship resistant is very telling. 88 00:08:35,240 --> 00:08:42,060 And while we did get an anti-CBDC act, the centralized or privatized stablecoins can very 89 00:08:42,060 --> 00:08:48,720 much become CBDC-like in terms of the ability to turn off your access to money. 90 00:08:49,320 --> 00:08:55,000 And that's why as Bitcoiners, I think we realize, and our stablecoin are sats, right? 91 00:08:55,000 --> 00:08:58,400 We have 21 million Bitcoin that will ever exist. 92 00:08:58,860 --> 00:09:02,660 And there's going to be more and more issuers of stable coins, which this provides clarity 93 00:09:02,660 --> 00:09:02,900 for. 94 00:09:02,980 --> 00:09:06,200 Yes, there's a framework for it to sort of make it legal where it may have been a gray 95 00:09:06,200 --> 00:09:06,760 area before. 96 00:09:07,080 --> 00:09:13,020 So you may have JP Morgan coin or Citibank coin or all these different stable coins coming 97 00:09:13,020 --> 00:09:13,360 out. 98 00:09:13,860 --> 00:09:19,800 But ultimately, as a Bitcoiner, I don't see a lot of utility or value there, at least 99 00:09:19,800 --> 00:09:20,300 to start. 100 00:09:20,300 --> 00:09:25,560 I mean, we'll see if businesses, if you can shrink some of the merchant fees and other 101 00:09:25,560 --> 00:09:29,200 things that we know come with, say, credit card payments, maybe there'll be more adoption. 102 00:09:29,960 --> 00:09:35,640 But at least for now in the US, I think we won't necessarily see the immediate impacts 103 00:09:35,640 --> 00:09:41,900 from this act in the short term, but certainly a lot of jockeying and positioning for slots 104 00:09:41,900 --> 00:09:48,180 two, three, four, five, maybe in the pecking order of the stablecoin market and being able 105 00:09:48,180 --> 00:09:53,860 to capture more of that global demand. Well, I wouldn't expect that stable coins 106 00:09:53,860 --> 00:09:59,980 would compete with credit card networks because you're talking about two different fundamentally 107 00:09:59,980 --> 00:10:08,340 different things, right? It's credit versus actual cash. So it might be more going after 108 00:10:08,340 --> 00:10:15,320 the cash market, cash payments market or debit cards. That's more of an appropriate competitive 109 00:10:15,320 --> 00:10:21,620 thing there. One other thing that has kind of crossed my mind, there is historical corollary 110 00:10:21,620 --> 00:10:32,420 that might be important here, which is back in the 70s, the US financial system was facing a lot of 111 00:10:32,420 --> 00:10:37,860 headwinds and interest rates were skyrocketing. And essentially, that means like, hey, we need to 112 00:10:37,860 --> 00:10:44,840 find some source of demand for debt. And the petrodollar system was put in place with Saudi 113 00:10:44,840 --> 00:10:54,040 Arabia and the Middle East to basically implement a way to create some like entrenched dollar 114 00:10:54,040 --> 00:10:56,300 demand, entrenched treasury demand. 115 00:10:56,580 --> 00:11:04,780 And that worked very, very well and has really enabled the current dollar system to proliferate 116 00:11:04,780 --> 00:11:10,120 and expand in the way that it has such that it's so much more widely accepted and so much 117 00:11:10,120 --> 00:11:12,900 deep, so much deeper in terms of liquidity. 118 00:11:12,900 --> 00:11:36,208 And rather than saying OK well the Genius Act and stablecoin adoption as I was saying it doesn inherently create demand directly from the fact that these stablecoin issuers would need to be holding short duration assets there or historically have been doing that 119 00:11:36,208 --> 00:11:46,508 But the broadening of the US dollar network, especially in a global and digital environment and world that we live in, 120 00:11:46,988 --> 00:11:55,528 does have secondary ramifications that does drive incremental treasury demand and all the way out the yield curve. 121 00:11:55,528 --> 00:12:08,468 So I think like that's a historic corollary in that we might be moving away from the traditional petrodollar and more toward a crypto dollar. 122 00:12:09,128 --> 00:12:17,048 Or perhaps you have these now it's like dual mechanisms for USD support, which is the petrodollar plus the crypto dollar. 123 00:12:17,048 --> 00:12:25,908 Today's episode of business Bitcoinization is proudly brought to you by Veles Commerce, where the future of business technology meets Bitcoin. 124 00:12:25,908 --> 00:12:33,648 As we journey through the era of Bitcoin and its transformational impact on businesses, there's one name that stands out, Veles Commerce. 125 00:12:33,968 --> 00:12:40,028 Whether you're looking to build a cutting edge website, a seamless mobile app or custom software, Veles is your go to team. 126 00:12:40,168 --> 00:12:46,928 They've been diving deep into the world of Bitcoin since 2014, making them one of the most experienced groups for integrating Bitcoin and Lightning payments. 127 00:12:47,048 --> 00:12:48,808 into a variety of digital platforms. 128 00:12:49,188 --> 00:12:50,648 But here's what truly sets them apart. 129 00:12:50,888 --> 00:12:52,548 Veles Commerce doesn't just build. 130 00:12:52,828 --> 00:12:56,788 They bring a wealth of knowledge to ensure your project success from day one. 131 00:12:56,928 --> 00:12:59,188 Their team understands the nuances of Bitcoin, 132 00:12:59,368 --> 00:13:02,128 ensuring that your business stays ahead of the curve. 133 00:13:02,568 --> 00:13:05,048 And for all business Bitcoinization listeners out there, 134 00:13:05,228 --> 00:13:09,708 Veles Commerce is offering a free consultation to kickstart your project the right way. 135 00:13:09,708 --> 00:13:14,148 So if you're ready to future-proof your business in the coming age of hyper-Bitcoinization, 136 00:13:14,148 --> 00:13:19,728 head over to velluscommerce.com or reach out on Twitter at Vellus Commerce. Let's make sure your 137 00:13:19,728 --> 00:13:27,148 business thrives in the Bitcoin era. So you mentioned earlier the fact that Tether, for 138 00:13:27,148 --> 00:13:33,288 instance, they have a bunch of T-bills that are backing their stable coins. What happens, I guess, 139 00:13:33,388 --> 00:13:40,748 with the crypto dollar? Is there less long-term debt that's tied to the dollar system? Or I guess 140 00:13:40,748 --> 00:13:45,388 like, would you move towards more of an emphasis on the short term debt? If we had more of a 141 00:13:45,388 --> 00:13:51,408 crypto dollar, less of a petrodollar? Well, it's, it's, it's still a problem for the US government 142 00:13:51,408 --> 00:13:57,508 that so much of the maturity, so much of the debt that's outstanding has been rolled toward the 143 00:13:57,508 --> 00:14:06,188 short end of the curve. Eventually, like as rates rise, they have to, they have to renew that debt 144 00:14:06,188 --> 00:14:13,048 refinance that debt at greater and greater yields. Now, if they're able to get yields low for an 145 00:14:13,048 --> 00:14:17,788 extended period of time like they have in the past, like Trump is trying to do, at that point, 146 00:14:17,788 --> 00:14:28,708 they would be very smart to refinance that debt out the curve to 10-year, 30-year debt so that 147 00:14:28,708 --> 00:14:37,988 more of the debt that the U.S. holds and owes is locked in at a lower rate over time. 148 00:14:37,988 --> 00:14:42,068 And that can buy them more time to kind of kick the can down the road and allow for the 149 00:14:42,068 --> 00:14:43,628 fiat system to continue. 150 00:14:45,068 --> 00:14:46,888 But, you know, that's real. 151 00:14:47,108 --> 00:14:52,468 And it's really the driving force for why Trump is harping on the Fed so much. 152 00:14:53,008 --> 00:14:54,348 And it's not just Trump, right? 153 00:14:54,388 --> 00:14:55,328 You're seeing percent. 154 00:14:55,328 --> 00:15:00,748 You're seeing like all these people come out of the woodwork and say, Chair Powell needs to go. 155 00:15:01,288 --> 00:15:04,848 Rates need to go down to 1% or half a percent or something like this. 156 00:15:05,148 --> 00:15:13,968 And the reasons that they're citing are very explicitly that the debt is too big and we need to be able to service it. 157 00:15:13,968 --> 00:15:30,648 And so if they were to lower rates down there and still were continuing to issue bills instead of longer term refinancing into longer, longer duration, you know, notes and bonds like that would be a massive strategic error. 158 00:15:30,768 --> 00:15:31,748 Why wouldn't you do that? 159 00:15:31,748 --> 00:15:38,188 I guess the only thing that might prevent you is if nobody wants to actually buy those 10-year 160 00:15:38,188 --> 00:15:46,488 yields and 10-year bonds or 30-year bonds, perhaps that you're just not able to roll that much debt 161 00:15:46,488 --> 00:15:50,628 out the curve. I guess that's possible. Yeah. I mean, would that lead to a scenario where the 162 00:15:50,628 --> 00:15:56,248 United States holds all of this long-term debt and then is issuing a bunch of T-bills to stable 163 00:15:56,248 --> 00:16:01,268 coin providers? I'm trying to think like what that would even look like. Yeah. I mean, right now, 164 00:16:01,268 --> 00:16:04,728 Well, and Trey's emphasizing the right point, which is the crux of the matter, 165 00:16:04,868 --> 00:16:08,888 that the 10-year, 30-year yields have been sort of stubbornly high. And even if you 166 00:16:08,888 --> 00:16:13,568 and the Fed funds rate lowered on the short term, you still potentially have market forces 167 00:16:13,568 --> 00:16:18,188 keeping those rates elevated if you don't have sort of this fundamental demand for the 168 00:16:18,188 --> 00:16:25,488 longer duration 10-year, 30-year bonds to drive down yields. And the US has $9 trillion worth of 169 00:16:25,488 --> 00:16:30,968 debt that's rolling over this year. And that's where every point that has to be rolled over at 170 00:16:30,968 --> 00:16:37,388 these relatively higher, more elevated interest rates, that's extremely expensive for the US and 171 00:16:37,388 --> 00:16:41,948 just adds to the debt burden down the road. And we're adding what a trillion dollars in interest 172 00:16:41,948 --> 00:16:47,028 expense, paying a trillion dollars a year, adding a trillion dollars in interest expense, 173 00:16:47,148 --> 00:16:50,688 adding a trillion dollars a year. I think it was every 100 days. Maybe now it's even faster with 174 00:16:50,688 --> 00:16:56,448 the passing of the big, beautiful bill. So yeah, the problem's not going away. And I think all the 175 00:16:56,448 --> 00:17:01,228 harping, and ultimately where we're driving towards, where the Fed isn't really independent, 176 00:17:01,408 --> 00:17:05,168 maybe there's this, they feel like they just might merge the Fed and Treasury completely, 177 00:17:05,308 --> 00:17:11,288 where there's been very much in cahoots always, but essentially monetizing the debt, 178 00:17:11,648 --> 00:17:15,608 having full yield curve control, kind of like what Japan has done for the last few decades. 179 00:17:15,608 --> 00:17:23,008 And we're seeing some of that unravel now as well with having debt to GDP ratios in the 250% 180 00:17:23,008 --> 00:17:29,248 range, whereas we're now in maybe the 120% range, which is still very elevated and above, 181 00:17:29,508 --> 00:17:34,408 you know, we're around where we were maybe in World War II before coming around to Bretton 182 00:17:34,408 --> 00:17:34,628 Woods. 183 00:17:34,628 --> 00:17:40,548 So, yeah, I think coming back to the Genius Act and stable coins, there will be some demand 184 00:17:40,548 --> 00:17:45,068 for the treasuries, but will it be enough to make up this difference? 185 00:17:45,288 --> 00:17:46,308 You know, I don't think so. 186 00:17:46,308 --> 00:17:58,708 So another interesting thing that was not really passed into law, but thanks to Trump's executive order, we now have, I guess, well, nothing set in stone. 187 00:17:58,948 --> 00:18:04,308 But theoretically, people will have access to purchasing Bitcoin through their 401ks. 188 00:18:05,748 --> 00:18:10,788 Trey, you've been talking about how some people already have access to this type of thing. 189 00:18:10,868 --> 00:18:13,068 But I'd be interested to know kind of what your thoughts are. 190 00:18:13,108 --> 00:18:16,148 Do you feel like money is going to be rushing into Bitcoin now? 191 00:18:16,308 --> 00:18:24,608 Do you feel like people who have been wanting to buy Bitcoin but haven't been able to because their money, their retirement's captured in 401ks? 192 00:18:24,788 --> 00:18:29,748 Or do you feel like if people wanted to buy Bitcoin, most of them have at least some level of exposure by now? 193 00:18:30,328 --> 00:18:37,488 Well, the way that 401ks work typically is that you have a plan that is provided by your employer. 194 00:18:37,488 --> 00:18:46,428 And typically that plan has a certain set of investments that are pre-selected for you as a menu that you can choose from. 195 00:18:46,428 --> 00:19:03,388 And most of the time, it's a range of equity index funds, bond index funds, target date portfolios that mix equities and bonds according to your age and your projected retirement date. 196 00:19:03,388 --> 00:19:07,868 They may have some commodity-type funds that are broad-based. 197 00:19:09,028 --> 00:19:13,688 And it's very vanilla, and it's very limited in scope. 198 00:19:14,028 --> 00:19:21,788 There are solutions out there that companies like Fidelity provide as a 401k provider where 199 00:19:21,788 --> 00:19:29,388 you can essentially move the assets that you've got within your 401k out of that selection 200 00:19:29,388 --> 00:19:36,148 boxed mechanism that is the default for people and into a more self-directed environment where 201 00:19:36,148 --> 00:19:41,668 you can choose from basically anything that Fidelity provides. So you can right now, if you 202 00:19:41,668 --> 00:19:47,268 have that available to you, it's called brokerage link, by the way, if you're able to, and that's 203 00:19:47,268 --> 00:19:51,228 what it's called in Fidelity. I don't know if there are other providers that do it. You can move 204 00:19:51,228 --> 00:19:58,808 assets away from that traditional menu. You can buy things like the Bitcoin ETFs or strategy or, 205 00:19:58,808 --> 00:20:06,388 basically any of the equities that Fidelity offers on an individual basis, and you can manage it that 206 00:20:06,388 --> 00:20:11,508 way. And it's still part of your 401k. It's just more self-directed as opposed to choosing from 207 00:20:11,508 --> 00:20:19,168 this menu. I think what this is all referring to is that menu, that sitting there right alongside 208 00:20:19,168 --> 00:20:27,208 the S&P 500 fund and the International Equity Fund and the International Bond Fund and the 209 00:20:27,208 --> 00:20:35,088 long duration bond fund and the target date fund, whether you're retiring in 2045 or 2050 or 2055, 210 00:20:35,448 --> 00:20:42,848 right next to that at the bottom is going to be cryptocurrency fund. And you'll be able to choose 211 00:20:42,848 --> 00:20:49,088 some portion of your 401k to be allocated in that direction. 212 00:20:50,468 --> 00:20:54,528 Who knows, it probably will be limited to a certain portion of that, like they probably 213 00:20:54,528 --> 00:21:00,708 won't allow you in that, you know, pre pre selected menu to put 100% in there. And it's 214 00:21:00,708 --> 00:21:07,768 probably I imagine going to be a fund that will, you know, as a guarantee, underperform Bitcoin, 215 00:21:07,768 --> 00:21:12,508 because it will include Ethereum and all this other garbage that's in there. But it will be 216 00:21:12,508 --> 00:21:19,108 there for people to select. And maybe they choose 5% that they put in there. But what that's going 217 00:21:19,108 --> 00:21:25,408 to do is that, you know, it's going to create this flow of automatic funds, automatic investments 218 00:21:25,408 --> 00:21:31,548 that flow in the direction of Bitcoin and the other cryptos that are included in that option. 219 00:21:32,108 --> 00:21:38,708 Who knows, maybe there will be just a Bitcoin only selection. That would be nice. But that's 220 00:21:38,708 --> 00:21:45,408 like passive new money that comes in every other week as people get their paychecks. It's something 221 00:21:45,408 --> 00:21:51,348 that people typically just set up and forget about it, perhaps for years and years. And there's $9 222 00:21:51,348 --> 00:21:59,068 trillion apparently out there in 401ks that do not have access in that limited menu to be able 223 00:21:59,068 --> 00:22:04,088 to buy Bitcoin. So if that becomes one of those line items, some portion of that is going to start 224 00:22:04,088 --> 00:22:09,468 getting directed into it. They would be like kind of an immediate switch from, hey, I'm, you know, 225 00:22:09,468 --> 00:22:17,108 50-50 equities and bonds, and I'm going to go to 45-45-10 or something like that. 226 00:22:17,688 --> 00:22:24,788 And then any future flows that are coming in from the new contributions into 401ks would 227 00:22:24,788 --> 00:22:29,728 also flow in that 45-45-10 type of framework there. 228 00:22:29,968 --> 00:22:34,088 So it just creates this passive demand for Bitcoin, regardless of price, regardless of 229 00:22:34,088 --> 00:22:34,968 what's going on in the market. 230 00:22:35,128 --> 00:22:37,668 It's just things that people tend to just set and forget. 231 00:22:38,668 --> 00:22:39,188 Yeah. 232 00:22:39,468 --> 00:22:45,408 John, I know you work with a lot of businesses. It's probably worth at least bringing it up to 233 00:22:45,408 --> 00:22:50,028 the business owners about this opportunity, because for a lot of business owners who want to 234 00:22:50,028 --> 00:22:56,568 help give their employees access to Bitcoin, sometimes you can give bonuses and things like 235 00:22:56,568 --> 00:23:13,495 that But the 401k is just a bedrock for a lot of people financial future This is probably something worth bringing up to clients as you have conversations with them Yeah absolutely I think taking away any additional steps or hurdles where Trey said you know in an employer plan there usually a way to do this 236 00:23:13,495 --> 00:23:18,356 But you'd have to be a little more savvy, know what you're doing and really want to get more Bitcoin exposure. 237 00:23:18,596 --> 00:23:26,555 So any way that people can get even some allocation to Bitcoin through their 401k here in a much easier fashion in the set it and forget it way. 238 00:23:26,555 --> 00:23:33,035 I think is a great value add. Business owners that I'm working with tend to be smaller employers for 239 00:23:33,035 --> 00:23:37,696 now. So maybe they do have a bit more self-directed vehicles, but they're certainly in the Bitcoin 240 00:23:37,696 --> 00:23:41,876 merchants want to get their employees as much Bitcoin exposure as they can, 241 00:23:42,015 --> 00:23:47,196 specifically in tax advantaged ways. So I think this 401k is huge. We're launching at Sound HSA. 242 00:23:47,775 --> 00:23:51,416 I think we'll fit that bill as well to have a health savings account where you can save in 243 00:23:51,416 --> 00:23:59,775 Bitcoin. So Trump making this executive action, I think seeing where that flows into some of the 244 00:23:59,775 --> 00:24:03,876 big banks that enable these accounts with the biggest employers, that's where it's going to 245 00:24:03,876 --> 00:24:09,836 make the big impact, right? The McDonald's and Boeings of the world and the big Fortune 500 246 00:24:09,836 --> 00:24:13,876 companies that have massive payrolls where everyone is flowing through these programs 247 00:24:13,876 --> 00:24:19,836 and may and probably are not orange-pilled yet or really thinking about Bitcoin and that even they 248 00:24:19,836 --> 00:24:25,755 can say, oh, I can get 10%, even as Trey said, and start to get more people, more Americans 249 00:24:25,755 --> 00:24:29,176 getting exposure to Bitcoin is, in my mind, a huge win. 250 00:24:29,755 --> 00:24:34,216 Because in the scenario that we just described of really monetizing the debt, what happens? 251 00:24:34,355 --> 00:24:36,515 The currency gets debased, gets devalued. 252 00:24:36,876 --> 00:24:38,456 Everything continues to get more expensive. 253 00:24:38,656 --> 00:24:44,015 Inflation runs hot again, like we saw in the valleys and then another peak later in 254 00:24:44,015 --> 00:24:45,836 the 70s in that corollary. 255 00:24:46,716 --> 00:24:50,456 So the more people that have exposure to at least the Bitcoin price action, it's still 256 00:24:50,456 --> 00:24:52,196 going to sort of be pay for Bitcoin in this way. 257 00:24:52,376 --> 00:24:56,336 You know, we hope there's actual, you know, keys further down that are being held. 258 00:24:57,916 --> 00:25:02,156 But it's a stepping stone and a starting point for at least to see and help people on their 259 00:25:02,156 --> 00:25:02,775 Bitcoin journey. 260 00:25:03,676 --> 00:25:07,035 And think about the secondary effects of this as well, right? 261 00:25:07,035 --> 00:25:11,116 The direct effect is more people are buying Bitcoin via their 401k. 262 00:25:11,116 --> 00:25:24,136 The secondary effect is all of the people that work within that infrastructure of providing the 401ks, answering questions about it, whether people call in and say, hey, how does my 401k work or whatever? 263 00:25:24,596 --> 00:25:37,816 All of those people now have to have some level of awareness or education about Bitcoin in order to answer questions, in order to help the people who are asking questions about it. 264 00:25:37,816 --> 00:25:45,355 and inevitably some portion of those people are also going to say well great i now have some bitcoin 265 00:25:45,355 --> 00:25:51,116 education and understanding sounds like something i might want to get some exposure to myself right 266 00:25:51,116 --> 00:25:55,795 and then they go out and buy bitcoin and then the people who are buying bitcoin in their 401k 267 00:25:55,795 --> 00:26:02,035 over time will tend to you know overperform the people who don't right or outperform the people 268 00:26:02,035 --> 00:26:06,836 who don't and they're going to look at that and be like oh well you know maybe i won't just buy 269 00:26:06,836 --> 00:26:12,336 this in my 401k, maybe I'll buy some outside in my IRA and in my, you know, with my regular 270 00:26:12,336 --> 00:26:17,836 paycheck and my regular brokerage account and in, um, you know, and some portion of those people are 271 00:26:17,836 --> 00:26:21,795 going to buy it and put it into cold storage. Right. So like there's this waterfall effect 272 00:26:21,795 --> 00:26:27,916 that happens and there's this educational broadening that happens anytime we get some 273 00:26:27,916 --> 00:26:33,096 of these new developments, it's all positive rising tide lifts all boats. We should definitely 274 00:26:33,096 --> 00:26:40,116 be applauding this. All of the particulars of how exactly all that plays out is, you know, 275 00:26:40,196 --> 00:26:45,976 who knows, right? But the downstream impacts of these types of things is just to further solidify 276 00:26:45,976 --> 00:26:53,716 the access points, the education, and the adoption levels that people have available to them. And 277 00:26:53,716 --> 00:26:57,775 it's only bullish over the long term. If you were hit by a bus right now, 278 00:26:57,896 --> 00:27:02,656 could your family access your Bitcoin? When's the right time to stop hot link and use Bitcoin 279 00:27:02,656 --> 00:27:08,156 to impact your family's lives, not just yours? What if Bitcoin doesn't reach the value you expect 280 00:27:08,156 --> 00:27:13,736 or it takes longer to reach that value? Do you have a plan? Do you have the proper trust structure 281 00:27:13,736 --> 00:27:19,456 to avoid probate, maintain your privacy, and minimize taxes? Do you want to avoid taxes to 282 00:27:19,456 --> 00:27:24,176 stack more sats or leverage your stack without selling? Should you add Bitcoin to your business's 283 00:27:24,176 --> 00:27:29,076 balance sheet? Are you truly confident in your self-custody setup? If any of those questions 284 00:27:29,076 --> 00:27:33,996 made you stop and think, you probably realized that simply buying and holding Bitcoin is not a 285 00:27:33,996 --> 00:27:38,896 complete financial plan. That's where strong wealth comes in. Orange-pilled advisors blending 286 00:27:38,896 --> 00:27:43,836 traditional financial planning with deep Bitcoin expertise, giving you the best of both worlds, 287 00:27:43,936 --> 00:27:47,755 so you can sleep peacefully knowing you're making the right moves for your family no matter what 288 00:27:47,755 --> 00:27:54,436 happens. Schedule a free call at strongwealth.net. That's strongwealth.net. Strong wealth. Wealth 289 00:27:54,436 --> 00:28:01,416 management for Bitcoiners by Bitcoiners. So Bitcoiners will remember maybe late 2023 or 290 00:28:01,416 --> 00:28:08,956 sometime in 2024, the German government sold approximately 50,000 Bitcoin. And at this point 291 00:28:08,956 --> 00:28:14,216 in time, it's a massive loss. They would have made a whole bunch of money or their purchasing 292 00:28:14,216 --> 00:28:19,355 power would be significantly greater if they had just held on to it. People have mocked them and I 293 00:28:19,355 --> 00:28:26,816 believe deservedly. However, the UK is looking to sell even more Bitcoin now, potentially bailing 294 00:28:26,816 --> 00:28:34,316 out Germany from the greatest nation state fumble of all time. I'd love to hear your reflections on 295 00:28:34,316 --> 00:28:43,775 UK and the potentially $7 billion sale of Bitcoin. Yeah, I can't remember who'd give proper 296 00:28:43,775 --> 00:28:48,816 accreditation on Bitcoin actually what I saw, but it's Bitcoin on the brink of bailing out. 297 00:28:48,816 --> 00:28:56,055 British Chancellor, sort of a play on the 2009 initial block that Satoshi put in. 298 00:28:56,976 --> 00:28:58,355 I think that was Adam Back. 299 00:28:58,355 --> 00:29:00,116 Okay, yeah, thank you. 300 00:29:00,216 --> 00:29:06,595 So Adam Back tweeted that out, and I think very fitting for this, because it's hard for 301 00:29:06,595 --> 00:29:11,616 politicians to now look at Bitcoin than if they've seized it, and it has increased in 302 00:29:11,616 --> 00:29:16,316 purchasing power to help bail them out and pay for whatever programs they want to pay 303 00:29:16,316 --> 00:29:20,576 for using those profits, sort of taking profits on the Bitcoin they have instead of holding 304 00:29:20,576 --> 00:29:25,295 it in the long term in the strategic position from a sovereign wealth perspective that we 305 00:29:25,295 --> 00:29:28,396 saw Germany already lose out on at least another 2x. 306 00:29:28,996 --> 00:29:34,775 We have the US here with a FOIA request recently, and the US Marshall is holding about 29,000 307 00:29:34,775 --> 00:29:37,116 Bitcoin when there's an expected 200,000 Bitcoin. 308 00:29:37,775 --> 00:29:40,275 Some of that might be held by other agencies and so on. 309 00:29:40,275 --> 00:29:41,855 So that still remains to be seen. 310 00:29:41,855 --> 00:29:47,576 But from the UK perspective, it would be a significant sale, but again, something that 311 00:29:47,576 --> 00:29:49,775 I think the market would absorb. 312 00:29:50,035 --> 00:29:54,176 Maybe you'd see a short-term dip, and it would just be sort of their loss with Brexit. 313 00:29:54,336 --> 00:29:58,696 You get out of the EU, and now if you're selling your Bitcoin, man, it wouldn't feel great 314 00:29:58,696 --> 00:30:01,015 to be in Britain right now. 315 00:30:01,176 --> 00:30:03,216 So rough. 316 00:30:03,476 --> 00:30:07,095 But that's, I think, decisions that whoever's kind of holding those keys and at the top 317 00:30:07,095 --> 00:30:10,755 of some of these political structures are going to find it expedient for them to sell 318 00:30:10,755 --> 00:30:16,255 Bitcoin right now to maybe support them in the very short term. But as we know, in the long term, 319 00:30:16,255 --> 00:30:25,336 it's going to not look great in retrospect. I love it. I want individuals and companies 320 00:30:25,336 --> 00:30:33,376 and private people to own Bitcoin and governments to not own Bitcoin. They will. You can't stop them. 321 00:30:33,696 --> 00:30:39,316 It's fine. But I think we should celebrate any time a government makes the dumb mistake of 322 00:30:39,316 --> 00:30:44,736 selling Bitcoin at the inflection point of adoption that we're at, right? Like it should 323 00:30:44,736 --> 00:30:53,795 be celebrated 100%. I also think, you know, we've seen what happened with Germany selling their 324 00:30:53,795 --> 00:30:59,376 Bitcoin. The price kind of tanked a little bit. We're a little bit later in this bull market. 325 00:30:59,936 --> 00:31:07,316 And it feels like nothing can really push the price down at this point. So if they do come 326 00:31:07,316 --> 00:31:13,496 through and sell 70,000 or 60,000 Bitcoin. It's going to be very interesting to see what happens 327 00:31:13,496 --> 00:31:20,436 with the price and how easily the market is able to absorb it. What we didn't have when Germany was 328 00:31:20,436 --> 00:31:27,376 selling it was strategy and all these other Bitcoin treasury companies and all the other 329 00:31:27,376 --> 00:31:34,116 like corporate adoption that we've seen since then, just there as a steady bid underneath the market, 330 00:31:34,116 --> 00:31:42,816 scooping up as much Bitcoin as they possibly can. So it's very likely that this $7 billion worth of 331 00:31:42,816 --> 00:31:50,616 Bitcoin, the 60,000 Bitcoin could be absorbed fairly harmlessly in the market from a price 332 00:31:50,616 --> 00:31:57,076 standpoint. And then now you've eliminated yet another overhang of potential supply that's out 333 00:31:57,076 --> 00:32:03,275 there that would, you know, otherwise be something that the market might be worried about coming on 334 00:32:03,275 --> 00:32:05,696 and taking the price at some point in the future. 335 00:32:06,015 --> 00:32:17,476 So that could create some kind of reflexivity or kickoff point for the price to move on its next leg drastically higher. 336 00:32:17,676 --> 00:32:17,976 We'll see. 337 00:32:18,775 --> 00:32:26,436 Yeah. As much as if a nation state is going to hold Bitcoin, I would rather it be the United States than any other country. 338 00:32:26,855 --> 00:32:28,595 That said, I do agree with you, Trey. 339 00:32:28,595 --> 00:32:37,256 And I would like for the United States to have the most Bitcoin because its citizens and private entities own that Bitcoin. 340 00:32:37,416 --> 00:32:41,535 I feel like that would make us a very powerful and more independent country. 341 00:32:41,896 --> 00:32:43,015 I don't know how it's all going to shake out. 342 00:32:43,116 --> 00:32:49,656 And I know that if the United States wants a lot of Bitcoin, the government will be able to purchase it because they can print as much money as they'd like. 343 00:32:49,996 --> 00:32:56,156 But I think it'd be super cool to have a country that has the most Bitcoin because its private citizens own it. 344 00:32:56,156 --> 00:33:00,196 And as we know, Bitcoin has the potential of separating money and state. 345 00:33:00,855 --> 00:33:06,335 And you're right that River just put out a great report that 40% of Bitcoin is held by 346 00:33:06,335 --> 00:33:08,795 Americans, according to their estimates. 347 00:33:09,835 --> 00:33:14,116 So to see further distribution out of the hands of from seizures in other nation states 348 00:33:14,116 --> 00:33:20,956 into real economic activity and people paying for goods and services in Bitcoin and really 349 00:33:20,956 --> 00:33:22,416 having a proper cost of capital. 350 00:33:22,416 --> 00:33:27,116 So that's a really great, could be a great movement here. 351 00:33:27,616 --> 00:33:30,555 So yeah, many nation states are mining, as we know. 352 00:33:30,656 --> 00:33:35,136 I think the other report out of the Bitcoin Policy Institute Summit would recommend people 353 00:33:35,136 --> 00:33:35,775 to check that out. 354 00:33:35,855 --> 00:33:40,176 It was about one in six or one in seven countries has some exposure to Bitcoin, whether it's 355 00:33:40,176 --> 00:33:47,456 mining it on their own or having legal tender laws or just having some that they've sort 356 00:33:47,456 --> 00:33:47,936 of seized. 357 00:33:47,936 --> 00:33:54,176 And so, yeah, I think seeing that sees Bitcoin distributed into the market, absolutely net win. 358 00:33:54,476 --> 00:33:59,496 And we'll see that Bitcoin continues to be money for everyone. 359 00:34:00,256 --> 00:34:01,795 Anyone can opt into this network. 360 00:34:03,116 --> 00:34:06,775 So certainly the game theory plays out when you can just print your currency and buy it. 361 00:34:06,816 --> 00:34:10,736 That's the speculative attack that Pierre Richard wrote about over a decade ago. 362 00:34:10,856 --> 00:34:16,536 We're certainly seeing it play out to some extent and probably will continue to heat up if the U.S. now. 363 00:34:16,536 --> 00:34:26,315 And the last story, next story we want to talk about and Trump media buying some Bitcoin, but maybe front running as a nation state buying some Bitcoin. 364 00:34:27,315 --> 00:34:43,923 Yeah I mean that that the next topic and it probably be the topic that we finish on today But you know there at the beginning of the week there always a flurry of Bitcoin buying announcements by various companies And the biggest one this week has been Trump Media with their billion purchase 365 00:34:44,663 --> 00:34:45,963 And I think that is a perennial question. 366 00:34:46,183 --> 00:34:52,283 Like, is Trump Media, are the Trumps front-running the U.S. government, or do they just really like Bitcoin? 367 00:34:52,483 --> 00:34:54,663 And there's probably a little bit of both. 368 00:34:54,663 --> 00:35:12,203 But it definitely leads to, especially if the United States government buys significantly in the next year or two, then it does raise a lot of eyebrows and certainly doesn't help, I guess, the political positioning of Bitcoin when it comes to right-left politics. 369 00:35:14,663 --> 00:35:15,623 $2 billion. 370 00:35:17,243 --> 00:35:18,963 That's a pretty big purchase. 371 00:35:18,963 --> 00:35:36,163 I think that it's funny that they find this approach, which is kind of brazenly in the face of all of this other stuff that they've been doing to be politically expedient or they just don't care. 372 00:35:36,783 --> 00:35:38,523 I do. I do agree with you. 373 00:35:38,523 --> 00:35:44,463 I think it's it's pretty interesting that that they're not worried about the political ramifications of that. 374 00:35:44,463 --> 00:35:49,223 or maybe they are bullish on Bitcoin 375 00:35:49,223 --> 00:35:53,243 and are not too worried about the strategic Bitcoin reserve 376 00:35:53,243 --> 00:35:54,843 actually ever amounting to anything. 377 00:35:55,603 --> 00:35:57,523 And so they think there's not actually going to be any backlash 378 00:35:57,523 --> 00:36:01,383 because the US government won't buy any Bitcoin anytime soon. 379 00:36:01,943 --> 00:36:04,143 So I don't know, maybe it's a combination 380 00:36:04,143 --> 00:36:08,323 of that kind of political calculus that they're doing there. 381 00:36:08,323 --> 00:36:11,743 I'm certainly not very bullish on the SBR. 382 00:36:11,743 --> 00:36:32,123 I feel like it's already been pretty long in the tooth. All of these other efforts around Big Beautiful Bill and the de minimis exemption and all this other stuff was kind of stripped out of there. 383 00:36:32,123 --> 00:36:41,263 The Stablecoin Genius Act and some of the other things, clarity and what have you, are being passed. 384 00:36:41,803 --> 00:36:52,863 But it's not like that is no way in my mind representing some kind of big momentum toward the U.S. government coming in and buying Bitcoin. 385 00:36:53,703 --> 00:37:01,143 I feel like with that executive order, they had all the firepower they needed to at least buy something. 386 00:37:01,143 --> 00:37:03,223 and they haven't done so. 387 00:37:03,323 --> 00:37:08,743 And there's plenty of neutral, you know, budget neutral ways that they could have done some 388 00:37:08,743 --> 00:37:09,203 of that. 389 00:37:09,963 --> 00:37:17,783 So and then I just I just think like actually passing the Bitcoin Act, actually passing 390 00:37:17,783 --> 00:37:24,143 something through the legislature that would put the U.S. government in a position to legally 391 00:37:24,143 --> 00:37:28,423 buy Bitcoin as a reserve asset is just so beyond the pale. 392 00:37:28,523 --> 00:37:30,163 I just don't I just don't see it happening. 393 00:37:30,163 --> 00:37:38,123 call me a bear but uh i i call it more realistic than anything i think these days it's more uh 394 00:37:38,123 --> 00:37:43,123 variations of of bulls i don't see a whole lot of bears out there these days and there are a couple 395 00:37:43,123 --> 00:37:47,743 people saying that they think you know we've topped out but a lot of those were before are 396 00:37:47,743 --> 00:37:52,303 the most recent high so there's a lot a lot of bulls out there the question is just how high 397 00:37:52,303 --> 00:37:57,723 i don't think we need it either by the way yeah i don't think the price needs it to move higher i 398 00:37:57,723 --> 00:38:02,123 I don't think adoption needs it to continue to expand. 399 00:38:02,763 --> 00:38:07,863 You know, private corporations and private individuals are finding enough value in Bitcoin 400 00:38:07,863 --> 00:38:12,523 without having Daddy Trump and the US federal government coming in and buying it. 401 00:38:12,523 --> 00:38:18,103 And as we were just discussing, it's probably better that they own less and private individuals 402 00:38:18,103 --> 00:38:19,743 have the opportunity to own more. 403 00:38:20,083 --> 00:38:21,903 So it's going up either way. 404 00:38:21,903 --> 00:38:28,263 like you just have to decide as an individual or as a company, whether or not you want to have a 405 00:38:28,263 --> 00:38:33,983 good strong piece of that going up and that adoption, or you want to wait a little bit 406 00:38:33,983 --> 00:38:40,143 longer and have a much smaller piece. And, you know, so. John, any thoughts? 407 00:38:40,863 --> 00:38:46,683 Yeah, no, I agree with all that. And, you know, the thing I'll add, though, is that Lummis did say 408 00:38:46,683 --> 00:38:51,683 at the BPI summit that for whatever reason, the order of operations was what we've seen 409 00:38:51,683 --> 00:38:57,963 around the stable coins getting past kind of those acts being the focus first and then moving to SBR. 410 00:38:58,143 --> 00:39:05,383 So she did say the timeline would be probably early next year that they're really able to tackle this now heading into a recess and whatnot, 411 00:39:05,663 --> 00:39:07,064 but still before midterms. 412 00:39:07,064 --> 00:39:11,584 So, you know, I think that I think around now they needed to deliver some kind of report, 413 00:39:11,763 --> 00:39:16,183 at least that the executive order put out on those different budget neutral ways that we could be buying Bitcoin, 414 00:39:16,343 --> 00:39:19,163 whether it's revaluing some of the gold or. 415 00:39:19,564 --> 00:39:20,683 I think that's tomorrow, right? 416 00:39:20,823 --> 00:39:21,163 Yeah. 417 00:39:21,163 --> 00:39:22,163 Is the deadline for that? 418 00:39:22,163 --> 00:39:23,423 Yeah, something this week. 419 00:39:23,423 --> 00:39:24,423 So it could change. 420 00:39:24,423 --> 00:39:30,044 I think the BitBond's proposal by Andrew Hohns is awesome, to help pay down some of the debt 421 00:39:30,044 --> 00:39:34,483 over time by getting more exposure to Bitcoin. 422 00:39:34,483 --> 00:39:37,703 But I agree, we don't need it to happen. 423 00:39:37,703 --> 00:39:42,723 But I think other countries, or at least bigger companies, should probably be acting on an 424 00:39:42,723 --> 00:39:44,163 assumption that it does happen. 425 00:39:44,163 --> 00:39:48,883 Because if it does, then that's just going to make price go even higher. 426 00:39:48,883 --> 00:39:57,823 And if it's sitting in a place that we can actually audit, unlike Fort Knox that we were supposed to get audited here, that hasn't happened if the gold is actually there. 427 00:39:58,343 --> 00:40:05,523 The verification of Bitcoin, cryptographic proof, I mean, all of it lends itself to being a perfect reserve asset. 428 00:40:06,823 --> 00:40:10,544 So it's a pretty tight window, John, that you're talking about, right? 429 00:40:10,544 --> 00:40:19,623 Like, yeah, just now past Genius Act, if this is the order of operations, midterms are in November of next year. 430 00:40:20,383 --> 00:40:26,463 Like a year from now. Congress is in full blown reelection mode. 431 00:40:26,463 --> 00:40:27,823 Yeah, for sure. 432 00:40:28,044 --> 00:40:29,823 And so, like, I don't know. 433 00:40:29,963 --> 00:40:38,483 I mean, you could probably look up what the historical bill passing rate is leading into a midterm election. 434 00:40:38,483 --> 00:40:41,044 But my guess is that it would be pretty low. 435 00:40:41,243 --> 00:40:51,723 And especially something as controversial or perhaps inflammatory as the Bitcoin Act would be just feels like a very low probability. 436 00:40:52,023 --> 00:40:55,703 So it feels like the window is when they come back from recess. 437 00:40:55,703 --> 00:41:00,084 I don't know when that is, up through maybe the end of spring. 438 00:41:01,243 --> 00:41:08,123 I think it's important to look at whether or not the U.S. government is telegraphing things, though. 439 00:41:08,283 --> 00:41:09,603 And maybe it's not the government. 440 00:41:09,803 --> 00:41:16,383 But, you know, for instance, on Sunday, Trump posted this best Bitcoin explanation ever video. 441 00:41:16,544 --> 00:41:16,903 Very true. 442 00:41:17,044 --> 00:41:20,703 And so those are the types of things that if they're... 443 00:41:20,703 --> 00:41:25,203 But then Trump media went and bought $2 billion worth of Bitcoin that they announced today. 444 00:41:25,203 --> 00:41:26,903 So maybe it was related to that. 445 00:41:27,743 --> 00:41:29,123 Yeah, it definitely could be. 446 00:41:29,203 --> 00:41:30,883 And it's really hard to know for sure. 447 00:41:31,183 --> 00:41:39,084 That said, I would expect if the United States government is going to try to pass something like the strategic Bitcoin reserve bill, 448 00:41:39,084 --> 00:41:44,064 where the government can actually purchase the Bitcoin in a way besides the executive order, 449 00:41:44,443 --> 00:41:46,263 then there would be some preparation. 450 00:41:46,544 --> 00:41:51,003 So it's not just like this weird for the average American, like what in the world did we just do? 451 00:41:51,223 --> 00:41:53,603 You know, there's there's some some preparation in place. 452 00:41:53,823 --> 00:41:54,623 So I don't know. 453 00:41:54,623 --> 00:41:56,383 I think probably that's a good point. 454 00:41:56,803 --> 00:42:02,183 They were preparing people for the Trump media buy more than trying to prepare U.S. citizens to buy Bitcoin. 455 00:42:02,564 --> 00:42:03,723 It's just interesting to think about. 456 00:42:04,143 --> 00:42:13,723 I could go either way, but it sounds like, Trey, you think the SBR is not going to happen in a massive way. 457 00:42:13,783 --> 00:42:15,143 At least the United States buying Bitcoin. 458 00:42:15,763 --> 00:42:17,283 And John, it sounds like you're a little more positive. 459 00:42:17,403 --> 00:42:17,863 I'm short the SBR. 460 00:42:18,203 --> 00:42:18,983 I'm short the SBR. 461 00:42:20,623 --> 00:42:21,403 I'm a bear. 462 00:42:22,203 --> 00:42:23,203 Put it on record. 463 00:42:23,803 --> 00:42:24,363 I think. 464 00:42:24,363 --> 00:42:24,923 John, how about you? 465 00:42:25,044 --> 00:42:27,044 I think this window is very tight. 466 00:42:27,703 --> 00:42:31,703 And heading into midterms, who knows what's going to happen there? 467 00:42:31,703 --> 00:42:41,323 But it's certainly a decent chance that the Republicans lose the House or the Senate as part of that. 468 00:42:41,463 --> 00:42:42,443 That could turn over. 469 00:42:42,663 --> 00:42:47,103 And if that happens, good luck passing anything, let alone something like this. 470 00:42:48,023 --> 00:42:50,803 Yeah, I think there's still a window. 471 00:42:50,963 --> 00:42:51,363 It is tight. 472 00:42:51,443 --> 00:42:52,203 I think it could happen. 473 00:42:52,203 --> 00:42:58,983 I think the first stage is just being clear from top down how much Bitcoin the U.S. actually holds to start. 474 00:42:59,143 --> 00:43:00,323 Is it 200,000 Bitcoin? 475 00:43:00,623 --> 00:43:05,743 And then would they want to get to a level where the Bitcoin Act gets to 1 million Bitcoin that the country is buying? 476 00:43:06,343 --> 00:43:09,703 Maybe there's somewhere in between that at least maybe it's half a million Bitcoin. 477 00:43:09,903 --> 00:43:14,903 And now you at least as a U.S. have more than strategies holding right over at 600,000 Bitcoin. 478 00:43:15,643 --> 00:43:17,603 So they're almost at 3% of supply. 479 00:43:17,603 --> 00:43:25,463 Can we get to 5%? The supply is still a pretty ambitious target. But I mean, man, it just feels 480 00:43:25,463 --> 00:43:30,564 like there's so much sort of waste and money just sitting around that no one really knows where it 481 00:43:30,564 --> 00:43:34,403 is or what's being put to use. So there's certainly budget neutral ways of doing it. 482 00:43:35,564 --> 00:43:40,643 But I agree. It kind of has to happen really quick and continue to be the focus. And they got 483 00:43:40,643 --> 00:43:44,323 Crypto Week as a focus. It seemed like there was almost going to be a little mini uprising, 484 00:43:44,323 --> 00:43:45,203 and then there wasn't. 485 00:43:45,363 --> 00:43:50,584 So if there's other omnibus bills and they're able to sneak some language in there, 486 00:43:50,683 --> 00:43:54,023 or not sneak, but just have, usually things are snuck in. 487 00:43:54,183 --> 00:43:59,663 But if it's not snuck in, I think most Americans maybe won't really realize. 488 00:43:59,663 --> 00:44:03,483 But I do think it still would be in the best interest of Americans. 489 00:44:03,663 --> 00:44:06,243 Is it better than individuals buying and putting Bitcoin in cold storage? 490 00:44:06,403 --> 00:44:06,643 No. 491 00:44:07,603 --> 00:44:13,564 But it still, I think, puts us in a position where the dollar has less likelihood of collapsing 492 00:44:13,564 --> 00:44:15,044 in the very near term. 493 00:44:15,803 --> 00:44:16,523 So, yeah. 494 00:44:16,943 --> 00:44:18,223 Yeah, I mean, so I would say 495 00:44:18,223 --> 00:44:21,383 that if the Republicans have four years, 496 00:44:21,603 --> 00:44:24,603 then I think there's probably a better chance 497 00:44:24,603 --> 00:44:26,603 than not that the U.S. purchases Bitcoin. 498 00:44:26,843 --> 00:44:28,383 But to your point, Trey, 499 00:44:28,643 --> 00:44:30,003 politics is politics 500 00:44:30,003 --> 00:44:31,943 and who's in office matters. 501 00:44:32,363 --> 00:44:34,463 And if Congress goes to the Democrats 502 00:44:34,463 --> 00:44:36,963 and we have four years of Trump against, 503 00:44:37,143 --> 00:44:38,243 you know, two years of Trump 504 00:44:38,243 --> 00:44:38,903 against the Democrats, 505 00:44:39,084 --> 00:44:40,483 then I just don't see anything like that happening. 506 00:44:40,763 --> 00:44:42,423 And that said, yeah, go ahead. 507 00:44:42,503 --> 00:44:43,044 One last thing, 508 00:44:43,044 --> 00:44:44,003 and then you can close it out. 509 00:44:45,263 --> 00:44:47,584 I actually hate this line of thinking 510 00:44:47,584 --> 00:44:49,783 because it's very like doomerish and whatnot. 511 00:44:50,023 --> 00:44:51,223 But like some people speculate, 512 00:44:51,423 --> 00:44:53,783 oh, strategy's got 600,000 Bitcoin. 513 00:44:54,084 --> 00:44:56,383 There's, you know, BlackRock has X amount. 514 00:44:56,683 --> 00:44:59,903 There's all this Bitcoin that is within the US jurisdiction. 515 00:45:00,663 --> 00:45:04,183 And if the US government decides it wants to, 516 00:45:04,183 --> 00:45:07,203 it can just come in and commandeer that like 6102. 517 00:45:07,383 --> 00:45:08,523 It's all held at Coinbase. 518 00:45:08,603 --> 00:45:09,743 We know exactly where it is. 519 00:45:09,903 --> 00:45:10,423 You know what I mean? 520 00:45:10,763 --> 00:45:12,203 And so you could just take that in. 521 00:45:13,044 --> 00:45:28,843 I tend to dismiss those types of Doomer takes because I think they're overly reactionary and don't pay enough respect to the actual rule of law that we have in the U.S., which which I think is, you know, still for the most part in decent order. 522 00:45:28,843 --> 00:45:57,923 That said, think back to 2020, think back to COVID and think back to some of the executive orders and some of the things that were being floated in terms of commandeering private industry to develop PPE, to point it in certain directions, to address the COVID quote unquote crisis in a way that would, you know, tell the American people, hey, we're doing something about this. 523 00:45:57,923 --> 00:46:00,123 like we're addressing this. 524 00:46:00,123 --> 00:46:04,564 Those types of crisis, 525 00:46:04,591 --> 00:46:10,591 Those types of crises create opportunities for the government to do things that they otherwise wouldn't be able to do. 526 00:46:10,931 --> 00:46:27,291 And in an event where there's some type of like run on the dollar, so to speak, or run on treasuries, and they need these assets for themselves and they don't already have it, maybe they are able to pull something like that off. 527 00:46:27,291 --> 00:46:34,871 and for better or worse the people in the federal government think about themselves as kind of all 528 00:46:34,871 --> 00:46:40,111 powerful to some degree so maybe they don't think hey we need to buy this bitcoin and have it to 529 00:46:40,111 --> 00:46:44,331 protect ourselves against china getting it or russia getting it because we already have it 530 00:46:44,331 --> 00:46:50,271 within our jurisdiction if there's ever an emergency we could just 6102 that stuff well 531 00:46:50,271 --> 00:46:55,751 hopefully that's enough to get a sailor to take it take strategies bitcoin into cold storage that 532 00:46:55,751 --> 00:47:00,791 said, yeah, we need to go and wrap up for today. So maybe John, then we'll go to Trey. Where'd you 533 00:47:00,791 --> 00:47:04,531 like people to go to keep up with you and your work, reach out, find out more about what you're 534 00:47:04,531 --> 00:47:09,131 doing, et cetera, et cetera. Yeah. You can follow me on X or Noster at the Bitcoin Yogi, 535 00:47:09,491 --> 00:47:14,371 or check out soundhsa.com or satoshihelp.com to learn more what I'm doing at the intersection 536 00:47:14,371 --> 00:47:21,611 of Bitcoin and healthcare. Yeah. And you can find me on X at TS underscore HODL and check out my 537 00:47:21,611 --> 00:47:26,891 newsletter on financial independence and Bitcoin. It is firebtc.substack.com. 538 00:47:27,591 --> 00:47:30,151 Great. Thank you guys for your time. We'll talk again in a couple of weeks. 539 00:47:30,311 --> 00:47:31,071 Thanks guys. Enjoyed it. 540 00:47:31,351 --> 00:47:31,631 Thanks. 541 00:47:31,891 --> 00:47:35,511 Well, friends, it's a wrap. Thanks so much for listening to this episode of the Bitcoin 542 00:47:35,511 --> 00:47:39,831 Playbook. If you want to reach out to either me or John or Trey, you can find those links 543 00:47:39,831 --> 00:47:46,031 down in the show notes. Be sure to check out FireBTC as well as soundhsa.com. As always, 544 00:47:46,031 --> 00:47:50,071 keep building, keep growing. And until next time, keep living and leading well. 545 00:47:51,611 --> 00:48:21,591 Thank you.