1 00:00:00,160 --> 00:00:04,920 It's really the tool that I 2 00:00:04,960 --> 00:00:06,424 of my own bitcoin journey. 3 00:00:06,472 --> 00:00:11,112 If a business owner, you know, 4 00:00:11,176 --> 00:00:13,336 up can be a lot to ask for them. 5 00:00:13,408 --> 00:00:17,000 It can be kind of a heavy lift 6 00:00:17,080 --> 00:00:20,744 trying to cook their fried 7 00:00:20,792 --> 00:00:22,200 fish for their sushi for the day. 8 00:00:22,240 --> 00:00:25,512 Whatever your core product 9 00:00:25,536 --> 00:00:27,608 you are already having to be 10 00:00:27,664 --> 00:00:30,728 I think it's just a lot less 11 00:00:30,824 --> 00:00:34,692 And when I think about, you 12 00:00:34,716 --> 00:00:37,572 Francisco, I wish that I had 13 00:00:37,596 --> 00:00:40,320 stomp around town and tell 14 00:00:44,620 --> 00:00:48,804 Welcome to the Business 15 00:00:48,852 --> 00:00:52,260 to helping you enrich your 16 00:00:52,300 --> 00:00:55,652 bitcoin, the hardest money on 17 00:00:55,796 --> 00:00:58,756 I'm your host Josh Friedeman 18 00:00:58,788 --> 00:01:01,412 who's the co founder of 19 00:01:01,436 --> 00:01:04,302 helps businesses passively buy bitcoin. 20 00:01:04,366 --> 00:01:07,150 We're going to get to our 21 00:01:07,190 --> 00:01:07,770 this. 22 00:01:25,273 --> 00:01:26,913 Stephen, welcome to the podcast. 23 00:01:26,993 --> 00:01:28,453 Hey, thanks for having me, Josh. 24 00:01:28,793 --> 00:01:31,281 So I like to start off every 25 00:01:31,297 --> 00:01:33,745 that help us to get to know 26 00:01:33,769 --> 00:01:35,073 us some insight for our own lives. 27 00:01:35,113 --> 00:01:36,093 Are you ready for these? 28 00:01:36,553 --> 00:01:37,693 Let's do it. 29 00:01:37,993 --> 00:01:39,521 Question number one is this. 30 00:01:39,577 --> 00:01:42,133 When and how did you first 31 00:01:43,593 --> 00:01:50,369 I first heard about Bitcoin in 32 00:01:50,401 --> 00:01:51,397 very smart. 33 00:01:51,585 --> 00:01:55,341 I thought I was too busy in my 34 00:01:55,397 --> 00:01:57,433 so kind of shrugged it off. 35 00:01:57,733 --> 00:02:02,029 And then two years later 36 00:02:02,101 --> 00:02:05,885 were still talking about it 37 00:02:05,909 --> 00:02:08,633 I thought, okay, maybe there's 38 00:02:09,013 --> 00:02:12,045 It hasn't faded into obscurity 39 00:02:12,069 --> 00:02:14,637 it a couple years ago, so 40 00:02:14,685 --> 00:02:19,069 And I bought my first small 41 00:02:19,221 --> 00:02:23,213 And once you have a little 42 00:02:23,253 --> 00:02:25,273 more and learn more becomes greater. 43 00:02:25,353 --> 00:02:29,573 And thus began my tumble down 44 00:02:30,113 --> 00:02:33,977 So a quick follow up question 45 00:02:34,025 --> 00:02:36,585 I didn't buy Bitcoin until 2021. 46 00:02:36,689 --> 00:02:40,345 I did have a conversation with 47 00:02:40,369 --> 00:02:45,337 in on the end of a 48 00:02:45,385 --> 00:02:46,457 and just didn't pay attention. 49 00:02:46,505 --> 00:02:47,529 Like a lot of people. 50 00:02:47,681 --> 00:02:55,859 But I've wondered if I would 51 00:02:56,051 --> 00:02:59,891 to stick with it that long 52 00:02:59,907 --> 00:03:00,195 back then. 53 00:03:00,219 --> 00:03:04,211 I feel like when I came in 54 00:03:04,267 --> 00:03:06,787 bitcoin was going and to have 55 00:03:06,875 --> 00:03:09,251 2013, it seems like it 56 00:03:09,307 --> 00:03:09,903 story. 57 00:03:10,523 --> 00:03:12,003 Was it like that along the way? 58 00:03:12,043 --> 00:03:14,243 Did you ever question like, 59 00:03:14,363 --> 00:03:15,795 Is it what I thought it was? 60 00:03:15,899 --> 00:03:17,939 Did you have some of those 61 00:03:17,971 --> 00:03:21,323 confident once you kind of 62 00:03:21,903 --> 00:03:25,575 Oh, I wish I could say that I 63 00:03:25,599 --> 00:03:28,963 the insights, figured it out, 64 00:03:29,743 --> 00:03:33,043 it was very much a journey of 65 00:03:33,663 --> 00:03:38,615 I did read the white paper as 66 00:03:38,639 --> 00:03:42,759 went to, but the educational 67 00:03:42,831 --> 00:03:45,671 not as well built out Back then. 68 00:03:45,727 --> 00:03:50,677 There were not excellent 69 00:03:50,805 --> 00:03:54,869 and so forth that were helping 70 00:03:54,941 --> 00:03:56,313 through various lenses. 71 00:03:56,973 --> 00:04:00,869 And so a lot of it was just 72 00:04:00,981 --> 00:04:04,113 and in chat groups and trying 73 00:04:04,893 --> 00:04:05,397 I. 74 00:04:05,485 --> 00:04:07,621 And the price volatility was 75 00:04:07,677 --> 00:04:10,965 It's still volatile today by 76 00:04:10,989 --> 00:04:12,753 even more so back then. 77 00:04:13,053 --> 00:04:17,605 And, and one thing that your 78 00:04:17,629 --> 00:04:21,349 it's not just hard to kind of 79 00:04:21,381 --> 00:04:24,645 like when it crashes, maybe 80 00:04:24,669 --> 00:04:29,221 bitcoin, but, but in 81 00:04:29,277 --> 00:04:30,181 ups too. 82 00:04:30,317 --> 00:04:33,957 I was looking back at text 83 00:04:33,965 --> 00:04:38,181 other day and, and the message 84 00:04:38,237 --> 00:04:43,669 or 16 was $533, sell, sell, 85 00:04:43,701 --> 00:04:46,417 mark encourage. 86 00:04:46,465 --> 00:04:47,825 Like clearly this is the top. 87 00:04:47,929 --> 00:04:50,213 Clearly you've got to take 88 00:04:51,033 --> 00:04:55,665 And, and so I think the 89 00:04:55,689 --> 00:04:59,665 it sounds easy to just kind of 90 00:04:59,689 --> 00:05:03,233 it and think long term, but 91 00:05:03,273 --> 00:05:04,653 practice to do that. 92 00:05:05,753 --> 00:05:08,369 Feel lucky too that I was 93 00:05:08,441 --> 00:05:14,049 in Austrian economics and, and 94 00:05:14,121 --> 00:05:17,453 strong where I otherwise would 95 00:05:17,813 --> 00:05:18,557 Yep. 96 00:05:18,685 --> 00:05:19,693 Question number two. 97 00:05:19,733 --> 00:05:23,165 What's an insight or fact 98 00:05:23,269 --> 00:05:24,193 understood? 99 00:05:27,093 --> 00:05:31,677 This is going to sound funny, 100 00:05:31,725 --> 00:05:36,205 The most obvious fact, but 101 00:05:36,229 --> 00:05:38,109 million bitcoin maximum. 102 00:05:38,301 --> 00:05:41,917 And I'm sure a lot of people 103 00:05:41,965 --> 00:05:42,365 space. 104 00:05:42,469 --> 00:05:45,673 And so you're going like 105 00:05:45,713 --> 00:05:46,809 Everybody knows that one. 106 00:05:46,881 --> 00:05:51,737 But I think there's this funny 107 00:05:51,785 --> 00:05:55,705 where even a lot of the people 108 00:05:55,769 --> 00:05:59,545 that and they kind of nod 109 00:05:59,569 --> 00:06:00,249 get it. 110 00:06:00,401 --> 00:06:04,809 I, I don't think it's often 111 00:06:04,921 --> 00:06:08,473 You know, I don't think we 112 00:06:08,513 --> 00:06:12,905 appreciate it because we're 113 00:06:12,929 --> 00:06:13,065 day. 114 00:06:13,089 --> 00:06:17,141 In all of our lives, we've 115 00:06:17,197 --> 00:06:17,797 scarce. 116 00:06:17,925 --> 00:06:22,373 You know, the dollars and fiat 117 00:06:22,453 --> 00:06:25,285 They can authorize more shares 118 00:06:25,429 --> 00:06:28,165 They can always make another 119 00:06:28,229 --> 00:06:31,525 They can always make another 120 00:06:31,549 --> 00:06:36,533 know, and, and so there's a 121 00:06:36,693 --> 00:06:40,293 just one more of something, 122 00:06:40,453 --> 00:06:43,141 and something that is very 123 00:06:43,237 --> 00:06:49,025 And even if the price spikes 124 00:06:49,049 --> 00:06:52,545 know, you can't go out and 125 00:06:52,609 --> 00:06:55,057 The mining only happens at a 126 00:06:55,225 --> 00:06:58,417 And I just still think that's 127 00:06:58,505 --> 00:06:59,377 off guard. 128 00:06:59,505 --> 00:07:01,921 I entirely agree with that. 129 00:07:01,977 --> 00:07:04,513 I think there's two things 130 00:07:04,553 --> 00:07:07,185 But it's easy to say there's 131 00:07:07,209 --> 00:07:07,825 understand. 132 00:07:08,009 --> 00:07:08,657 Infinity. 133 00:07:08,705 --> 00:07:13,169 And I remember as a kid trying 134 00:07:13,281 --> 00:07:17,425 thinking that I grasped it 135 00:07:17,449 --> 00:07:18,385 thought had gotten away from me. 136 00:07:18,409 --> 00:07:19,893 I couldn't truly grasp what 137 00:07:19,913 --> 00:07:21,485 Was infinity and scarcity. 138 00:07:21,549 --> 00:07:25,997 And we've never seen true 139 00:07:26,005 --> 00:07:28,445 the physical world other than 140 00:07:28,469 --> 00:07:31,517 But that's not even a set for 141 00:07:31,605 --> 00:07:34,541 So infinity and scarcity are 142 00:07:34,597 --> 00:07:35,549 comprehending. 143 00:07:35,741 --> 00:07:39,245 And I don't think we've gotten 144 00:07:39,269 --> 00:07:41,613 we've truly felt that scarcity. 145 00:07:41,773 --> 00:07:45,277 But when it happens someday 146 00:07:45,325 --> 00:07:45,853 I think. 147 00:07:45,973 --> 00:07:46,733 I agree. 148 00:07:46,853 --> 00:07:47,833 Well said. 149 00:07:48,693 --> 00:07:52,461 So question number three is, 150 00:07:52,517 --> 00:07:53,993 recommend to other people? 151 00:07:55,253 --> 00:07:59,341 The bitcoin resource that was 152 00:07:59,397 --> 00:08:01,873 actually the Satoshi Nakamoto Institute. 153 00:08:02,613 --> 00:08:08,397 It's a website that was kind 154 00:08:08,445 --> 00:08:13,517 Goldstein Pierre Rochard, with 155 00:08:13,605 --> 00:08:14,953 support from the community. 156 00:08:15,813 --> 00:08:21,249 But it's and they've been 157 00:08:21,321 --> 00:08:23,293 2015, maybe 14. 158 00:08:23,593 --> 00:08:28,897 But they I think were the 159 00:08:28,945 --> 00:08:33,313 lens in a rigorous way, in a 160 00:08:33,393 --> 00:08:37,025 And in my personal journey, 161 00:08:37,049 --> 00:08:43,121 off for me where, you know, 162 00:08:43,177 --> 00:08:47,601 just a new computer science 163 00:08:47,697 --> 00:08:53,421 technology kind of nebulous 164 00:08:53,517 --> 00:08:58,733 a candidate for sound money 165 00:08:58,773 --> 00:09:00,797 need to be successful as sound money? 166 00:09:00,885 --> 00:09:04,845 And if it indeed has those 167 00:09:04,909 --> 00:09:05,753 look like? 168 00:09:06,373 --> 00:09:10,925 Is hoarding Bitcoin and saving 169 00:09:10,949 --> 00:09:13,033 is it not using it? 170 00:09:13,573 --> 00:09:17,265 I think that's such an 171 00:09:17,389 --> 00:09:18,489 that type of material. 172 00:09:18,601 --> 00:09:21,593 Question number four, beyond 173 00:09:21,633 --> 00:09:24,613 or idea that's been helpful to 174 00:09:27,313 --> 00:09:28,293 This is. 175 00:09:29,233 --> 00:09:31,173 I got a kind of a fun one for this. 176 00:09:31,633 --> 00:09:35,049 It's definitely bitcoin 177 00:09:35,121 --> 00:09:35,497 journey. 178 00:09:35,545 --> 00:09:43,721 But meetups, so actually just 179 00:09:43,737 --> 00:09:45,385 in Phoenix, Arizona, for example. 180 00:09:45,449 --> 00:09:48,057 And I launched a bitcoin 181 00:09:48,105 --> 00:09:50,833 back in 2018 or 19. 182 00:09:51,293 --> 00:09:57,173 And being in the same room as 183 00:09:57,333 --> 00:10:03,333 and hungry to learn about, in 184 00:10:03,413 --> 00:10:09,621 someone's interest is, whether 185 00:10:09,677 --> 00:10:13,093 group they're involved in, I 186 00:10:13,213 --> 00:10:19,285 upside and fixed downside to 187 00:10:19,309 --> 00:10:20,433 your local area. 188 00:10:20,953 --> 00:10:26,433 Much opportunity, whether it's 189 00:10:26,513 --> 00:10:28,257 developing personal relationships. 190 00:10:28,305 --> 00:10:31,425 If I connect enough dots, I 191 00:10:31,449 --> 00:10:34,533 my decision to attend my first meetup. 192 00:10:35,033 --> 00:10:35,537 And. 193 00:10:35,625 --> 00:10:38,945 And so yeah, would encourage 194 00:10:38,969 --> 00:10:41,793 you're in like a major 195 00:10:41,833 --> 00:10:45,053 there's a high quality local 196 00:10:45,433 --> 00:10:45,793 So. 197 00:10:45,833 --> 00:10:46,957 So go scope it out. 198 00:10:47,065 --> 00:10:49,429 Yep, I strongly echo that sentiment. 199 00:10:49,541 --> 00:10:54,949 It was probably eight, nine 200 00:10:54,981 --> 00:10:55,477 in Bitcoin. 201 00:10:55,525 --> 00:10:58,117 I said, hey, I'm going to 202 00:10:58,285 --> 00:11:00,565 And then I found out there 203 00:11:00,589 --> 00:11:01,493 And since then it's been great. 204 00:11:01,533 --> 00:11:05,157 We have monthly meetups and 205 00:11:05,165 --> 00:11:07,621 as who shows up, but there's a 206 00:11:07,757 --> 00:11:10,821 And then just this last month 207 00:11:10,917 --> 00:11:14,195 So we'll do like the second 208 00:11:14,259 --> 00:11:16,435 and then we're going to start 209 00:11:16,459 --> 00:11:17,347 month for lunch. 210 00:11:17,475 --> 00:11:20,099 And it's really interesting 211 00:11:20,131 --> 00:11:20,483 to the group. 212 00:11:20,523 --> 00:11:21,619 When you get together during lunch. 213 00:11:21,651 --> 00:11:23,827 The conversations you have 214 00:11:23,915 --> 00:11:25,875 then than in the evening meetup. 215 00:11:25,939 --> 00:11:28,979 So definitely recommend 216 00:11:29,011 --> 00:11:30,211 meetup if you can. 217 00:11:30,347 --> 00:11:33,827 So question number five is 218 00:11:33,875 --> 00:11:34,083 question. 219 00:11:34,123 --> 00:11:36,339 And it's this as a general 220 00:11:36,371 --> 00:11:38,783 Is it better to ask why or why not? 221 00:11:41,123 --> 00:11:42,107 Why not? 222 00:11:42,275 --> 00:11:44,023 Default bias for action. 223 00:11:44,483 --> 00:11:45,787 Go do things. 224 00:11:45,955 --> 00:11:53,371 We often are our own kind of 225 00:11:53,427 --> 00:11:58,663 that if people just kind of 226 00:11:59,363 --> 00:12:02,363 a little bit slanted towards 227 00:12:02,403 --> 00:12:03,103 permission. 228 00:12:03,443 --> 00:12:05,383 But context is everything. 229 00:12:05,763 --> 00:12:10,315 But I think, yeah, just going 230 00:12:10,339 --> 00:12:11,623 is, is to shape. 231 00:12:11,703 --> 00:12:14,775 And if you don't like 232 00:12:14,839 --> 00:12:17,575 in an industry, in your 233 00:12:17,599 --> 00:12:21,043 household, like you can affect 234 00:14:29,357 --> 00:14:32,341 Well, Steven, we're here today 235 00:14:32,389 --> 00:14:33,173 orchestra. 236 00:14:33,285 --> 00:14:37,989 I saw you post this on Twitter 237 00:14:38,013 --> 00:14:39,205 excited to learn more. 238 00:14:39,341 --> 00:14:41,333 Could you just share with us a 239 00:14:41,365 --> 00:14:44,419 We'll get into some other 240 00:14:44,533 --> 00:14:47,655 You're involved in local 241 00:14:47,711 --> 00:14:49,703 but you've entered into this 242 00:14:49,735 --> 00:14:52,427 I'd love to hear a little bit 243 00:14:53,087 --> 00:14:57,623 Absolutely excited to chat 244 00:14:57,655 --> 00:14:58,227 it. 245 00:14:59,167 --> 00:15:02,663 The company was actually 246 00:15:02,775 --> 00:15:06,855 Joao Almeida, so he was 247 00:15:06,911 --> 00:15:09,747 Opennode, the lightning 248 00:15:11,647 --> 00:15:16,059 He began working on this 249 00:15:16,223 --> 00:15:19,411 We met in the context of that 250 00:15:19,459 --> 00:15:20,367 in the company. 251 00:15:21,387 --> 00:15:23,939 Well actually so Joao and I 252 00:15:23,963 --> 00:15:28,419 We first met in 2018 at one of 253 00:15:28,443 --> 00:15:30,611 both attended, which was in 254 00:15:30,739 --> 00:15:33,087 And so we kept in touch ever since. 255 00:15:34,027 --> 00:15:36,647 Loved seeing his journey at Opennode. 256 00:15:37,067 --> 00:15:41,235 And so then when I saw him 257 00:15:41,331 --> 00:15:43,007 in the context of that company. 258 00:15:43,387 --> 00:15:47,683 And after I invested into the 259 00:15:47,715 --> 00:15:51,023 texting each other like every 260 00:15:51,175 --> 00:15:55,679 talking about go to market 261 00:15:55,703 --> 00:15:58,303 types of businesses we could 262 00:15:58,335 --> 00:15:58,907 it. 263 00:15:59,607 --> 00:16:01,919 And so it happened very organically. 264 00:16:01,983 --> 00:16:04,703 We just kind of realized one 265 00:16:04,735 --> 00:16:06,079 up and build this thing together. 266 00:16:06,183 --> 00:16:08,747 And so we're excited to be 267 00:16:09,127 --> 00:16:14,687 Orchestra is software, and we 268 00:16:14,727 --> 00:16:17,431 be the easiest way for small 269 00:16:17,439 --> 00:16:20,827 the US to get started saving 270 00:16:21,647 --> 00:16:26,167 So, you know, my personal 271 00:16:26,247 --> 00:16:31,063 And that means listing prices 272 00:16:31,135 --> 00:16:33,351 savings, all of the functions 273 00:16:33,519 --> 00:16:34,279 But. 274 00:16:34,463 --> 00:16:37,255 But I feel that, you know, 275 00:16:37,311 --> 00:16:39,047 And right now we're in the 276 00:16:39,127 --> 00:16:42,151 And that doesn't mean never 277 00:16:42,199 --> 00:16:43,239 Tech is awesome. 278 00:16:43,303 --> 00:16:44,439 It's important to build. 279 00:16:44,543 --> 00:16:49,587 And when businesses adopt it, 280 00:16:49,627 --> 00:16:50,887 early adopters. 281 00:16:51,227 --> 00:16:56,403 But I think that the use case 282 00:16:56,475 --> 00:17:00,127 given bitcoin's volatility and 283 00:17:00,507 --> 00:17:04,707 And by that I mean we're so 284 00:17:04,787 --> 00:17:08,051 that someone walks into your 285 00:17:08,099 --> 00:17:10,287 bitcoin and wanting to spend it. 286 00:17:10,587 --> 00:17:12,727 Someday we will get there, absolutely. 287 00:17:13,227 --> 00:17:16,195 But right now, whether it's 288 00:17:16,251 --> 00:17:19,971 or a physical storefront, the 289 00:17:19,979 --> 00:17:24,191 show up to your business 290 00:17:24,239 --> 00:17:26,367 bitcoin and wanting to spend. 291 00:17:26,527 --> 00:17:29,855 And so we're really trying to 292 00:17:29,991 --> 00:17:34,223 of how much exposure they have 293 00:17:34,335 --> 00:17:38,127 for them to convert some of 294 00:17:38,167 --> 00:17:38,879 bitcoin. 295 00:17:39,023 --> 00:17:43,439 So rather than any changes to 296 00:17:43,463 --> 00:17:47,919 they use, rather than the 297 00:17:47,943 --> 00:17:51,167 to understand wallets and seed 298 00:17:51,207 --> 00:17:54,987 with that, we've just written 299 00:17:55,027 --> 00:17:58,571 the payment system they 300 00:17:58,619 --> 00:17:59,755 that they already use. 301 00:17:59,891 --> 00:18:03,611 And then they just tell us 302 00:18:03,659 --> 00:18:06,859 of their revenues they would 303 00:18:06,923 --> 00:18:09,323 into bitcoin for savings. 304 00:18:09,515 --> 00:18:12,443 So today, the integrations 305 00:18:12,515 --> 00:18:12,907 so far. 306 00:18:12,947 --> 00:18:15,211 We're going to keep adding 307 00:18:15,219 --> 00:18:16,447 lot of the big ones. 308 00:18:16,947 --> 00:18:22,791 Paypal, Stripe, Shopify, 309 00:18:22,799 --> 00:18:26,791 one of the big ones in the 310 00:18:26,799 --> 00:18:27,831 handful of others. 311 00:18:27,999 --> 00:18:32,023 And so if there are businesses 312 00:18:32,095 --> 00:18:36,759 solutions for their point of 313 00:18:36,783 --> 00:18:41,559 Orchestra IO, our website, 314 00:18:41,583 --> 00:18:45,479 they already have, and then we 315 00:18:45,503 --> 00:18:47,847 they can choose whatever 316 00:18:47,887 --> 00:18:48,707 their business. 317 00:18:49,087 --> 00:18:53,395 And we see, especially if the 318 00:18:53,411 --> 00:18:56,367 new to bitcoin, they'll often 319 00:18:56,907 --> 00:19:01,091 But then, you know, maybe they 320 00:19:01,139 --> 00:19:04,291 working and they experience a 321 00:19:04,339 --> 00:19:08,247 And then we've seen them dial 322 00:19:08,587 --> 00:19:12,339 So, you know, it's early days, 323 00:19:12,363 --> 00:19:16,979 be, to be able to really just 324 00:19:17,043 --> 00:19:19,607 the stuff that they've worked 325 00:19:19,937 --> 00:19:20,633 Yep. 326 00:19:20,745 --> 00:19:21,561 I love the idea. 327 00:19:21,609 --> 00:19:22,537 It's very simple. 328 00:19:22,617 --> 00:19:25,721 And I think that for a lot of 329 00:19:25,769 --> 00:19:29,437 just to kind of ratchet it up 330 00:19:30,577 --> 00:19:34,681 I'm curious to know what, what 331 00:19:34,769 --> 00:19:36,313 Do you find a lot of people 332 00:19:36,345 --> 00:19:40,169 I know very early days for the 333 00:19:40,233 --> 00:19:43,849 who are maybe already 334 00:19:43,873 --> 00:19:45,401 a feature like this in their business? 335 00:19:45,569 --> 00:19:49,897 Or is this a lot of outbound 336 00:19:50,017 --> 00:19:51,277 here's something you can do 337 00:19:51,377 --> 00:19:53,137 If you want a little bit of a 338 00:19:53,997 --> 00:19:55,377 Yeah, great question. 339 00:19:55,677 --> 00:19:59,381 So so far, most of the 340 00:19:59,469 --> 00:20:03,093 are owned by people who are 341 00:20:03,125 --> 00:20:07,877 with bitcoin, and they're the 342 00:20:07,917 --> 00:20:12,869 willing to go through the 343 00:20:12,893 --> 00:20:14,997 is just an easier way for them 344 00:20:15,037 --> 00:20:18,885 They don't have to log into an 345 00:20:18,941 --> 00:20:23,633 look at numbers and figure out 346 00:20:23,705 --> 00:20:27,521 have an automatic buy set up, 347 00:20:27,609 --> 00:20:30,769 And if their revenues 348 00:20:30,793 --> 00:20:34,257 and not as high the next 349 00:20:34,297 --> 00:20:38,209 revenue like what we do could 350 00:20:38,313 --> 00:20:41,457 So we see some where it's just 351 00:20:41,497 --> 00:20:45,553 that it's built into the 352 00:20:45,625 --> 00:20:47,077 for them to adopt. 353 00:20:47,657 --> 00:20:54,129 But over time we absolutely 354 00:20:54,153 --> 00:20:58,189 of the, the business owners 355 00:20:58,333 --> 00:21:02,205 Financial literacy education 356 00:21:02,261 --> 00:21:06,701 to a business is a huge part 357 00:21:06,749 --> 00:21:09,737 to be to, to be bringing to 358 00:21:10,117 --> 00:21:14,749 You know, there are over 34 359 00:21:14,813 --> 00:21:15,741 in the U.S. 360 00:21:15,909 --> 00:21:18,797 and I think at some point, you 361 00:21:18,837 --> 00:21:21,229 single one will hold some bitcoin. 362 00:21:21,293 --> 00:21:24,093 As crazy as that probably 363 00:21:24,165 --> 00:21:28,347 I don't think It'll 364 00:21:28,387 --> 00:21:32,607 each business's holdings, but 365 00:21:34,067 --> 00:21:38,011 We're just really trying to 366 00:21:38,099 --> 00:21:40,795 for those small and medium 367 00:21:40,811 --> 00:21:41,963 them where they're at. 368 00:21:42,115 --> 00:21:45,227 And if they learn more and 369 00:21:45,267 --> 00:21:51,947 bitcoin, they want to protect 370 00:21:51,987 --> 00:21:52,699 private keys. 371 00:21:52,763 --> 00:21:56,283 We absolutely encourage that, 372 00:21:56,315 --> 00:22:00,279 for them to withdraw to 373 00:22:00,303 --> 00:22:01,031 would like. 374 00:22:01,199 --> 00:22:04,679 So we want to make it as easy 375 00:22:04,703 --> 00:22:07,559 never want to kind of limit 376 00:22:07,583 --> 00:22:08,667 bitcoin journey. 377 00:22:10,047 --> 00:22:14,087 So I have a follow up question 378 00:22:14,127 --> 00:22:17,975 you just talked about where 379 00:22:18,031 --> 00:22:20,039 You've been in bitcoin for 380 00:22:20,183 --> 00:22:23,719 I'm curious to know, are 381 00:22:23,743 --> 00:22:25,383 be at this point in time? 382 00:22:25,535 --> 00:22:28,871 Or maybe a better way to ask 383 00:22:28,919 --> 00:22:32,339 and what has moved slower than 384 00:22:32,403 --> 00:22:33,219 adoption and. 385 00:22:33,243 --> 00:22:40,835 Growth in terms of adoption, 386 00:22:40,891 --> 00:22:43,487 far along as I thought that we 387 00:22:43,787 --> 00:22:48,707 And I don't really know what 388 00:22:48,787 --> 00:22:49,411 too useful. 389 00:22:49,459 --> 00:22:52,547 Like there has been a lot of 390 00:22:52,627 --> 00:22:57,283 Operation Chokepoint 2.0 for 391 00:22:57,435 --> 00:23:01,527 I think, making a lot of big 392 00:23:01,667 --> 00:23:06,707 hesitant to build solutions 393 00:23:07,687 --> 00:23:12,655 And then there's also just 394 00:23:12,671 --> 00:23:14,447 and blockchain projects. 395 00:23:14,527 --> 00:23:17,839 And so the top of funnel for 396 00:23:17,863 --> 00:23:19,147 bitcoin has been. 397 00:23:20,327 --> 00:23:23,871 It's been difficult to kind of 398 00:23:23,959 --> 00:23:27,039 from all of the thousands of 399 00:23:27,063 --> 00:23:27,759 might be special. 400 00:23:27,863 --> 00:23:33,017 And so I think in some of 401 00:23:33,057 --> 00:23:35,001 ahead as I thought that we 402 00:23:35,169 --> 00:23:38,409 Maybe the price isn't as high 403 00:23:38,433 --> 00:23:38,761 now. 404 00:23:38,849 --> 00:23:44,025 The when is always difficult 405 00:23:44,121 --> 00:23:45,977 by where we are right now. 406 00:23:46,017 --> 00:23:49,849 In this moment, in terms of 407 00:23:49,873 --> 00:23:55,737 lot of the fear that some 408 00:23:55,777 --> 00:23:59,193 involved in this is being removed. 409 00:23:59,385 --> 00:24:04,381 And the ETFs have come to 410 00:24:04,429 --> 00:24:08,701 this asset psychologically for 411 00:24:08,749 --> 00:24:10,093 large capital allocators. 412 00:24:10,205 --> 00:24:15,549 And it's by almost any metric 413 00:24:15,573 --> 00:24:19,309 the history of the public 414 00:24:19,333 --> 00:24:21,057 BlackRock's specifically. 415 00:24:21,797 --> 00:24:25,325 So I think we are about to 416 00:24:25,341 --> 00:24:26,093 exciting. 417 00:24:26,285 --> 00:24:27,697 So back to orchestra. 418 00:24:28,277 --> 00:24:31,837 I'm sort of curious to know, 419 00:24:31,917 --> 00:24:34,553 transaction or is there a 420 00:24:34,585 --> 00:24:36,537 like end of day, how does that work? 421 00:24:36,577 --> 00:24:41,593 And then also is there a way 422 00:24:41,625 --> 00:24:44,117 or is it always a percentage 423 00:24:44,817 --> 00:24:48,809 Yeah, we do allow just ad hoc 424 00:24:48,833 --> 00:24:51,193 a, you know, a smash Buy 425 00:24:51,265 --> 00:24:54,409 And at any time, if you're a 426 00:24:54,433 --> 00:24:58,777 can log in, click buy, acquire 427 00:24:58,817 --> 00:24:59,597 desires. 428 00:25:00,497 --> 00:25:04,793 We but yeah, our core product 429 00:25:04,825 --> 00:25:05,757 of revenues. 430 00:25:06,317 --> 00:25:10,417 So our software links up to 431 00:25:11,197 --> 00:25:16,309 We basically keep track of all 432 00:25:16,413 --> 00:25:19,977 what you have set as the 433 00:25:20,557 --> 00:25:24,197 And so then we're keeping tabs 434 00:25:24,237 --> 00:25:27,765 You can adjust that percentage 435 00:25:27,821 --> 00:25:29,637 owner, three options for settlement. 436 00:25:29,717 --> 00:25:32,661 So you can choose from daily, 437 00:25:32,789 --> 00:25:37,189 And so, you know, we'll kind 438 00:25:37,333 --> 00:25:38,977 that should be be purchased. 439 00:25:39,137 --> 00:25:43,409 But then in terms of the 440 00:25:43,433 --> 00:25:47,477 kind of on those schedules 441 00:25:48,777 --> 00:25:53,169 I'm sure there's probably a 442 00:25:53,193 --> 00:25:56,197 mentioned that you were first 443 00:25:56,697 --> 00:26:00,289 Is there something about the 444 00:26:00,313 --> 00:26:04,705 the focus of it that made it 445 00:26:04,761 --> 00:26:07,793 I don't know how frequently an 446 00:26:07,825 --> 00:26:09,473 a company they've invested, 447 00:26:09,625 --> 00:26:11,937 But I'm curious to know, is 448 00:26:11,977 --> 00:26:16,017 than the fact that the co 449 00:26:16,137 --> 00:26:19,665 and you were talking a lot, 450 00:26:19,721 --> 00:26:22,689 Was there something else about 451 00:26:22,713 --> 00:26:25,557 just feel natural because of a 452 00:26:26,137 --> 00:26:27,517 I love that question. 453 00:26:30,457 --> 00:26:35,489 I think it's because this was 454 00:26:35,553 --> 00:26:39,777 and then I think I quickly 455 00:26:39,817 --> 00:26:43,097 why I wanted to become more 456 00:26:43,397 --> 00:26:49,037 is it's really the tool that I 457 00:26:49,077 --> 00:26:50,817 of my own bitcoin journey. 458 00:26:51,557 --> 00:26:56,897 Back in 2013 and 14, I was 459 00:26:57,317 --> 00:27:00,337 and I was really excited about bitcoin. 460 00:27:00,677 --> 00:27:03,389 And I'm sure a lot of people 461 00:27:03,413 --> 00:27:06,925 You want to tell the people in 462 00:27:06,981 --> 00:27:08,461 it can benefit from them. 463 00:27:08,629 --> 00:27:12,449 And I would just go around my 464 00:27:12,573 --> 00:27:13,913 everywhere about this. 465 00:27:13,985 --> 00:27:17,817 I went to a certain doctor on 466 00:27:17,857 --> 00:27:19,257 because he took bitcoin as payment. 467 00:27:19,337 --> 00:27:22,889 I ate at this sushi spot 468 00:27:22,913 --> 00:27:24,317 took bitcoin as payment. 469 00:27:25,057 --> 00:27:28,169 I would shop on overstock.com 470 00:27:28,353 --> 00:27:33,481 And at the time I kind of 471 00:27:33,609 --> 00:27:38,505 growth of the bitcoin network 472 00:27:38,681 --> 00:27:39,353 But. 473 00:27:39,505 --> 00:27:44,665 But reflecting on it later, if 474 00:27:44,721 --> 00:27:48,905 new to this, then the ramp up 475 00:27:48,961 --> 00:27:52,569 It can be kind of a heavy lift 476 00:27:52,633 --> 00:27:57,129 trying to, you know, cook 477 00:27:57,153 --> 00:27:59,097 their fresh fish for their 478 00:27:59,137 --> 00:28:02,409 Whatever your core product 479 00:28:02,433 --> 00:28:04,777 you are already having to be 480 00:28:04,897 --> 00:28:09,797 And so to have to go and 481 00:28:09,937 --> 00:28:13,693 you know, how to not lose 482 00:28:13,805 --> 00:28:17,133 And then if it's not just you 483 00:28:17,165 --> 00:28:19,613 your staff so that they can 484 00:28:19,645 --> 00:28:22,989 If you are not there for 485 00:28:23,013 --> 00:28:23,737 a lot. 486 00:28:24,357 --> 00:28:27,405 And then even if they 487 00:28:27,541 --> 00:28:31,389 then it's not too often that 488 00:28:31,413 --> 00:28:34,317 in the door and want to pay in 489 00:28:34,357 --> 00:28:35,165 once a month. 490 00:28:35,301 --> 00:28:40,743 And so the ROI just 491 00:28:40,815 --> 00:28:41,639 observation. 492 00:28:41,783 --> 00:28:46,183 And so I think that something 493 00:28:46,255 --> 00:28:51,607 can do it in a way that is 494 00:28:51,767 --> 00:28:54,551 You don't have to ask your 495 00:28:54,599 --> 00:28:56,311 They still swipe their credit card. 496 00:28:56,439 --> 00:29:00,071 You don't have to train your 497 00:29:00,119 --> 00:29:03,107 more about this other way to pay. 498 00:29:04,447 --> 00:29:09,553 I think it's just a lot less 499 00:29:09,625 --> 00:29:13,601 When I think about, you know, 500 00:29:13,649 --> 00:29:16,225 I wish that I had had 501 00:29:16,241 --> 00:29:18,769 around town and tell business 502 00:29:18,953 --> 00:29:19,797 Yeah. 503 00:29:20,217 --> 00:29:25,457 So staying on the investing 504 00:29:25,497 --> 00:29:28,145 how you think about investing 505 00:29:28,201 --> 00:29:31,601 I know you're invested in some 506 00:29:31,769 --> 00:29:34,465 Is the goal to support great projects? 507 00:29:34,561 --> 00:29:35,585 I know you want to make money. 508 00:29:35,641 --> 00:29:38,045 Is it always like, hey, can 509 00:29:38,171 --> 00:29:39,753 What are some of your thoughts there? 510 00:29:39,905 --> 00:29:44,009 Just as far as being an 511 00:29:44,033 --> 00:29:46,921 are already interested in 512 00:29:46,969 --> 00:29:47,557 there. 513 00:29:48,817 --> 00:29:49,597 Yeah. 514 00:29:50,017 --> 00:29:53,577 Investing into startup and 515 00:29:53,697 --> 00:29:56,757 of my journey in recent years. 516 00:29:57,377 --> 00:30:01,929 I've done a little over 75 517 00:30:01,953 --> 00:30:04,437 seed stage companies with my 518 00:30:05,217 --> 00:30:10,293 I'm also a venture partner at 519 00:30:10,325 --> 00:30:12,057 named Trammell Venture Partners. 520 00:30:13,517 --> 00:30:17,221 And their focus is exclusively 521 00:30:17,269 --> 00:30:18,657 bitcoin native companies. 522 00:30:19,277 --> 00:30:24,469 And my personal framework for 523 00:30:24,613 --> 00:30:28,137 and startups and companies are 524 00:30:28,477 --> 00:30:32,517 And so by default, if there is 525 00:30:32,557 --> 00:30:36,533 if I get paid, if there's a 526 00:30:36,565 --> 00:30:38,327 into bitcoin for me. 527 00:30:40,147 --> 00:30:43,979 And then startups are kind of 528 00:30:44,003 --> 00:30:44,571 something. 529 00:30:44,739 --> 00:30:48,683 And yes, it would be fantastic 530 00:30:48,795 --> 00:30:50,955 because that is kind of 531 00:30:51,011 --> 00:30:55,403 It certainly is to me and I 532 00:30:55,475 --> 00:30:56,587 to more of the world. 533 00:30:56,707 --> 00:31:01,387 I think VC firms will be 534 00:31:01,427 --> 00:31:05,755 returns against bitcoin in the 535 00:31:05,891 --> 00:31:09,859 explain to invest investors 536 00:31:09,923 --> 00:31:14,499 the S&P 500 today, Bitcoin 537 00:31:14,523 --> 00:31:15,647 new hurdle rate. 538 00:31:16,667 --> 00:31:21,167 But yeah, it's still so early 539 00:31:21,707 --> 00:31:27,539 so great potentially that that 540 00:31:27,563 --> 00:31:29,527 investing against and outperforming. 541 00:31:30,587 --> 00:31:33,843 Most of the startups that I've 542 00:31:33,875 --> 00:31:34,563 bitcoin. 543 00:31:34,675 --> 00:31:37,789 Most have made money in 544 00:31:37,813 --> 00:31:38,813 bitcoin terms. 545 00:31:38,965 --> 00:31:43,597 There are a handful that have 546 00:31:43,637 --> 00:31:47,037 bulk of my startup investing 547 00:31:47,077 --> 00:31:47,517 years. 548 00:31:47,637 --> 00:31:52,937 And in terms of the ramp up 549 00:31:53,317 --> 00:31:56,057 you tend to see a lot of 550 00:31:56,437 --> 00:31:58,541 Three to ten. 551 00:31:58,709 --> 00:32:02,217 And so we shall see how things go. 552 00:32:03,557 --> 00:32:06,525 But yeah, it's exciting to be 553 00:32:06,581 --> 00:32:09,561 And that intersection of 554 00:32:09,609 --> 00:32:10,841 is really such a sweet spot. 555 00:32:10,889 --> 00:32:14,409 And I think that's still 556 00:32:14,433 --> 00:32:18,393 know, the Silicon Valley VC 557 00:32:18,425 --> 00:32:23,609 and blockchain and in my view 558 00:32:23,633 --> 00:32:25,397 on what makes bitcoin unique yet. 559 00:32:26,017 --> 00:32:29,449 Then the last thing is, if 560 00:32:29,473 --> 00:32:32,889 what you said about bitcoin 561 00:32:32,913 --> 00:32:35,273 in their area, maybe because 562 00:32:35,305 --> 00:32:36,425 area or whatever else. 563 00:32:36,521 --> 00:32:39,049 Do you have any 564 00:32:39,073 --> 00:32:41,017 an effective bitcoin meetup? 565 00:32:41,677 --> 00:32:43,989 Yeah, do it. 566 00:32:44,013 --> 00:32:46,417 I mean, this goes back to like 567 00:32:47,117 --> 00:32:51,381 I, when I moved to Southern 568 00:32:51,429 --> 00:32:54,933 county and there were already 569 00:32:55,005 --> 00:32:56,693 some great bitcoin meetups, frankly. 570 00:32:56,725 --> 00:32:59,957 Like there was a Los Angeles 571 00:32:59,997 --> 00:33:03,493 back and forth on does Orange 572 00:33:03,525 --> 00:33:05,177 or would that be redundant? 573 00:33:05,517 --> 00:33:09,157 And, and I just, you know, you 574 00:33:09,237 --> 00:33:14,113 you like type a few sent and 575 00:33:14,185 --> 00:33:16,557 That takes like 30 minutes of 576 00:33:17,017 --> 00:33:18,385 Maybe nobody shows up. 577 00:33:18,441 --> 00:33:21,793 Maybe one person shows up, but 578 00:33:21,945 --> 00:33:23,201 That's a starting point. 579 00:33:23,289 --> 00:33:27,009 And even if one person shows 580 00:33:27,033 --> 00:33:29,361 going to be really excited and 581 00:33:29,409 --> 00:33:32,673 about bitcoin and it'll be a 582 00:33:32,745 --> 00:33:34,449 you know, you'll grow from there. 583 00:33:34,553 --> 00:33:39,793 Make an account on, on X, 584 00:33:39,905 --> 00:33:44,437 Nostr is kind of earlier in, 585 00:33:44,477 --> 00:33:46,677 in your small town being on 586 00:33:46,717 --> 00:33:53,737 But certainly make an account 587 00:33:54,637 --> 00:33:58,405 and I think just 588 00:33:58,501 --> 00:34:00,181 of it not working out. 589 00:34:00,269 --> 00:34:04,597 The absolute worst thing that 590 00:34:04,677 --> 00:34:08,837 in a restaurant for an hour 591 00:34:08,877 --> 00:34:12,535 and then you go home and 592 00:34:12,671 --> 00:34:15,831 And normally it's not going to 593 00:34:15,879 --> 00:34:18,199 It's going to be like a 594 00:34:18,223 --> 00:34:22,647 up and some are new and some 595 00:34:22,687 --> 00:34:25,415 develop into who knows what. 596 00:34:25,471 --> 00:34:28,199 The upside on those human 597 00:34:28,263 --> 00:34:31,879 And it's still so early in 598 00:34:31,903 --> 00:34:35,367 you'll be reflecting on like 599 00:34:35,407 --> 00:34:37,751 group because it led to xyz. 600 00:34:37,879 --> 00:34:38,747 Absolutely. 601 00:34:39,217 --> 00:34:42,297 So if you would share with us 602 00:34:42,377 --> 00:34:43,401 specifically about orchestra. 603 00:34:43,449 --> 00:34:44,761 Could be anything else as well. 604 00:34:44,849 --> 00:34:47,929 And then where people can go 605 00:34:47,953 --> 00:34:52,105 try or refer other people to 606 00:34:52,161 --> 00:34:55,369 of friends who own businesses 607 00:34:55,393 --> 00:34:56,957 a little bit of bitcoin exposure. 608 00:34:57,537 --> 00:34:58,713 Yeah, absolutely. 609 00:34:58,825 --> 00:35:01,241 We're, you know, orchestra is public. 610 00:35:01,409 --> 00:35:07,337 Any company within the US we 611 00:35:07,377 --> 00:35:08,377 excited to do so. 612 00:35:08,417 --> 00:35:10,509 We spell the name of the 613 00:35:10,673 --> 00:35:15,893 So for listeners, O R Q E S T 614 00:35:16,045 --> 00:35:18,337 You can go on there, you can 615 00:35:19,517 --> 00:35:26,773 The platform is $20 a month or 616 00:35:26,925 --> 00:35:30,485 the fees on the buys and sells 617 00:35:30,541 --> 00:35:30,997 places. 618 00:35:31,077 --> 00:35:34,405 And we also have bookkeeping 619 00:35:34,461 --> 00:35:38,165 because some of the accounting 620 00:35:38,221 --> 00:35:39,493 of a nightmare. 621 00:35:39,605 --> 00:35:43,713 So we see that as a way that 622 00:35:43,825 --> 00:35:45,197 that are dealing with this. 623 00:35:45,737 --> 00:35:48,129 But we'd be really excited to 624 00:35:48,153 --> 00:35:53,361 We want to make sure that the 625 00:35:53,369 --> 00:35:57,569 are delivering way more in 626 00:35:57,593 --> 00:36:01,921 are paying us for the product 627 00:36:02,049 --> 00:36:06,817 So no loss if the platform is 628 00:36:06,857 --> 00:36:09,837 We just cherish any feedback 629 00:36:10,357 --> 00:36:15,149 And I'd say we're also just a 630 00:36:15,333 --> 00:36:18,621 We love bitcoin and we're 631 00:36:18,709 --> 00:36:23,597 to go and push bitcoin on any 632 00:36:23,637 --> 00:36:24,817 the right answer. 633 00:36:25,237 --> 00:36:28,381 We don't want anyone to go all 634 00:36:28,429 --> 00:36:29,777 for their circumstance. 635 00:36:30,197 --> 00:36:36,877 We just want to build tools to 636 00:36:36,917 --> 00:36:40,552 system has been slanted 637 00:36:40,704 --> 00:36:44,664 When, when we print trillions 638 00:36:44,720 --> 00:36:48,248 banks and the primary banks 639 00:36:48,272 --> 00:36:51,112 that money and often it 640 00:36:51,184 --> 00:36:54,728 in a way that is good for 641 00:36:54,792 --> 00:36:56,808 They end up getting the short 642 00:36:56,952 --> 00:37:00,344 And so, you know, we think 643 00:37:00,400 --> 00:37:02,488 field in, in a really powerful way. 644 00:37:02,592 --> 00:37:06,904 And, and we're excited to, to 645 00:37:06,960 --> 00:37:10,249 and and get to partner with 646 00:37:10,273 --> 00:37:10,745 process. 647 00:37:10,881 --> 00:37:13,721 So we'd love to have anyone 648 00:37:13,729 --> 00:37:15,017 try the product and feel free. 649 00:37:15,057 --> 00:37:18,889 My DMs are open on X as well, 650 00:37:18,953 --> 00:37:21,769 Happy to answer any questions 651 00:37:21,913 --> 00:37:22,217 Great. 652 00:37:22,257 --> 00:37:23,849 Well Steven, thank you so much 653 00:37:23,873 --> 00:37:24,877 It's been a pleasure. 654 00:37:25,217 --> 00:37:25,849 Appreciate it. 655 00:37:25,873 --> 00:37:26,457 Josh. 656 00:37:26,617 --> 00:37:27,593 Well friends, it's a wrap. 657 00:37:27,625 --> 00:37:31,097 Thanks so much for listening 658 00:37:31,177 --> 00:37:31,609 show. 659 00:37:31,713 --> 00:37:33,939 If you want to reach out to 660 00:37:33,963 --> 00:37:35,731 those links down in the show notes. 661 00:37:35,779 --> 00:37:38,419 And if you or someone you know 662 00:37:38,443 --> 00:37:40,979 their business's balance 663 00:37:41,043 --> 00:37:43,955 As always, keep building, keep 664 00:37:44,011 --> 00:37:45,507 living and leading. 665 00:37:45,587 --> 00:37:53,091 Well, thanks to those who have 666 00:37:53,139 --> 00:37:57,155 in the last week, including 667 00:37:57,251 --> 00:38:00,003 His boost was about last 668 00:38:00,035 --> 00:38:03,227 where we talked about Deep 669 00:38:03,347 --> 00:38:07,803 AI on open protocols and he 670 00:38:07,915 --> 00:38:13,147 bullish on an open source AI 671 00:38:13,227 --> 00:38:14,747 Ezeki, I feel the same way. 672 00:38:14,787 --> 00:38:17,899 Thank you for the boost, thank 673 00:38:17,923 --> 00:38:20,363 if anyone else would like to 674 00:38:20,395 --> 00:38:21,147 on Fountain. 675 00:38:21,227 --> 00:38:24,251 Neither stream sats as they 676 00:38:24,259 --> 00:38:27,419 include a comment with that 677 00:38:27,443 --> 00:38:27,507 show.