1 00:00:00,280 --> 00:00:03,289 It's like GoFundMe, you know, 2 00:00:03,337 --> 00:00:06,081 or whatever had that boycott 3 00:00:06,193 --> 00:00:08,605 GoFundMe was like, you know what? 4 00:00:08,945 --> 00:00:10,401 We're not all that money you sent. 5 00:00:10,433 --> 00:00:13,845 We're just going to give it to 6 00:00:14,385 --> 00:00:16,161 So it would be much. 7 00:00:16,273 --> 00:00:19,449 Wouldn't it be much more cool 8 00:00:19,497 --> 00:00:22,209 at bitcoin and then nobody's 9 00:00:22,297 --> 00:00:25,625 They got, you know, whoever 10 00:00:25,665 --> 00:00:27,285 and nobody can stop. 11 00:00:31,765 --> 00:00:35,565 Welcome to the Business 12 00:00:35,605 --> 00:00:39,125 to helping you enrich your 13 00:00:39,165 --> 00:00:42,389 bitcoin, the hardest money on 14 00:00:42,477 --> 00:00:45,109 I'm your host, Josh 15 00:00:45,157 --> 00:00:49,069 Mike Carson, who is an early 16 00:00:49,157 --> 00:00:52,277 He was also one of the first 17 00:00:52,381 --> 00:00:55,373 to purchase a physical item on 18 00:00:55,429 --> 00:00:59,717 And now he's created the 19 00:00:59,781 --> 00:01:03,519 create permissionless and 20 00:01:03,567 --> 00:01:06,315 We're going to get to our 21 00:01:23,498 --> 00:01:25,598 Mike, welcome to the podcast. 22 00:01:26,218 --> 00:01:26,642 Thanks. 23 00:01:26,690 --> 00:01:27,794 Thanks for having me. 24 00:01:27,946 --> 00:01:30,650 So I like to start off every 25 00:01:30,674 --> 00:01:33,090 that help us to get to know 26 00:01:33,114 --> 00:01:34,634 us some insight for our own lives. 27 00:01:34,666 --> 00:01:35,690 Are you ready for these? 28 00:01:35,834 --> 00:01:36,558 Yeah. 29 00:01:37,058 --> 00:01:38,402 Question number one is this. 30 00:01:38,450 --> 00:01:40,778 When and how did you first 31 00:01:40,858 --> 00:01:41,754 I read Hacker News. 32 00:01:41,786 --> 00:01:45,968 I've been on Hacker News for a 33 00:01:46,008 --> 00:01:48,984 posts about bitcoin, but I 34 00:01:49,056 --> 00:01:49,440 Attention. 35 00:01:49,504 --> 00:01:52,440 I wish I would have paid 36 00:01:52,464 --> 00:01:57,472 it like, they posted on Hacker 37 00:01:57,520 --> 00:02:01,344 So I ignored like the first 38 00:02:01,376 --> 00:02:04,040 But then there was a post 39 00:02:04,064 --> 00:02:04,536 I should look. 40 00:02:04,592 --> 00:02:05,600 This sounds interesting. 41 00:02:05,664 --> 00:02:06,792 So I looked into it. 42 00:02:06,880 --> 00:02:09,992 I looked in my email, like, I 43 00:02:10,040 --> 00:02:12,560 mention of bitcoin and I was 44 00:02:12,584 --> 00:02:15,280 like, I really want to get bitcoin. 45 00:02:15,424 --> 00:02:16,712 I think it could be big. 46 00:02:16,840 --> 00:02:18,108 It's currently. 47 00:02:18,848 --> 00:02:23,096 It was at $8 on Wednesday and 48 00:02:23,192 --> 00:02:24,628 So I missed the chance. 49 00:02:25,968 --> 00:02:30,120 But I remember looking into it 50 00:02:30,144 --> 00:02:34,952 but there were no exchanges 51 00:02:35,120 --> 00:02:39,760 So I remember I created an 52 00:02:39,864 --> 00:02:42,440 You had to Western Union some 53 00:02:42,504 --> 00:02:47,836 And it just seemed like such a 54 00:02:47,852 --> 00:02:49,128 I wish I would have. 55 00:02:50,708 --> 00:02:52,196 But then I got. 56 00:02:52,372 --> 00:02:55,608 I remember I had a little bit 57 00:02:57,228 --> 00:03:01,932 I'm a domain investor, so I 58 00:03:02,020 --> 00:03:04,928 Like, I remember, I think I 59 00:03:05,468 --> 00:03:08,180 And this is when Bitcoin was 60 00:03:08,324 --> 00:03:11,528 So it's a domain for like less 61 00:03:12,308 --> 00:03:15,036 But then I sold it because it 62 00:03:15,092 --> 00:03:16,648 It went from under 100 to. 63 00:03:17,168 --> 00:03:18,824 And like, I sold it at like 200. 64 00:03:18,856 --> 00:03:21,228 I was like, yeah, I doubled my 65 00:03:22,088 --> 00:03:27,760 But then after it went so 66 00:03:27,784 --> 00:03:29,376 like, this is okay. 67 00:03:29,432 --> 00:03:30,712 Something is going. 68 00:03:30,800 --> 00:03:31,584 Something's here. 69 00:03:31,656 --> 00:03:36,560 So I waited and like, I don't 70 00:03:36,584 --> 00:03:37,272 really got it. 71 00:03:37,360 --> 00:03:41,056 I got into Bitcoin in 2013, 72 00:03:41,112 --> 00:03:46,908 There's like a bear market, 73 00:03:47,598 --> 00:03:48,886 I had waited for. 74 00:03:48,942 --> 00:03:49,958 And like, I. 75 00:03:50,038 --> 00:03:50,870 I was like. 76 00:03:51,014 --> 00:03:53,182 Because it was in the news and 77 00:03:53,190 --> 00:03:57,142 to wait until it's like, kind 78 00:03:57,190 --> 00:03:59,278 and there's not a lot of stuff 79 00:03:59,318 --> 00:04:00,782 And then I got some more then. 80 00:04:00,830 --> 00:04:02,058 But yeah, so it's. 81 00:04:02,398 --> 00:04:05,018 I've been in, you know, I've 82 00:04:05,518 --> 00:04:07,538 Over 10 years, probably since. 83 00:04:07,878 --> 00:04:08,534 Seriously. 84 00:04:08,606 --> 00:04:10,974 Well, since 2013 around there. 85 00:04:11,086 --> 00:04:11,654 Yeah. 86 00:04:11,766 --> 00:04:16,750 Well, I think the anecdote of 87 00:04:16,774 --> 00:04:20,482 just been 8, I think that's 88 00:04:20,530 --> 00:04:24,898 now be getting interested in 89 00:04:24,938 --> 00:04:29,118 went from about 60 to 90 in 90 00:04:29,778 --> 00:04:32,026 Some people are going to think 91 00:04:32,122 --> 00:04:35,458 I think a lot of people who 92 00:04:35,498 --> 00:04:40,298 number of years would probably 93 00:04:40,378 --> 00:04:44,398 five or 10 years is still 94 00:04:44,938 --> 00:04:50,546 Obviously, getting in 2009 or 95 00:04:50,602 --> 00:04:51,518 going to be much, much better. 96 00:04:51,558 --> 00:04:54,278 But at the same time, I feel 97 00:04:54,278 --> 00:04:58,758 think you kind of touched on 98 00:04:58,798 --> 00:05:03,326 of what they were holding to 99 00:05:03,502 --> 00:05:04,710 2024. 100 00:05:04,854 --> 00:05:07,806 So it's just a different time. 101 00:05:07,902 --> 00:05:10,926 But it's certainly not too 102 00:05:11,022 --> 00:05:13,542 The thing is, it's a constant 103 00:05:13,670 --> 00:05:16,896 I keep learning more and more 104 00:05:16,912 --> 00:05:19,856 it's like talking about, are 105 00:05:19,912 --> 00:05:23,120 It's like, what are the 106 00:05:23,184 --> 00:05:29,688 You know, like, do you want 107 00:05:29,728 --> 00:05:32,528 by the government where they 108 00:05:32,608 --> 00:05:36,368 Is that what you want to, you 109 00:05:36,408 --> 00:05:38,752 save up and do you want your money? 110 00:05:38,840 --> 00:05:41,832 Do you want to hold your 111 00:05:41,880 --> 00:05:44,920 print a lot more and they have 112 00:05:44,944 --> 00:05:45,128 years? 113 00:05:45,168 --> 00:05:47,094 It's like, no, I don't, I 114 00:05:47,126 --> 00:05:51,358 And then, but then it's like, 115 00:05:51,478 --> 00:05:56,806 And you know, you just learn 116 00:05:56,862 --> 00:06:00,926 bitcoin is, I mean, what I 117 00:06:00,982 --> 00:06:02,670 I mean, there's a lot of 118 00:06:02,694 --> 00:06:04,542 like it's backed by math. 119 00:06:04,630 --> 00:06:05,822 You know, it's. 120 00:06:05,950 --> 00:06:11,070 It's not backed by the power 121 00:06:11,094 --> 00:06:14,350 you know, the military or, you 122 00:06:14,414 --> 00:06:19,266 It's like it's backed just 123 00:06:19,442 --> 00:06:20,858 So that may. 124 00:06:21,018 --> 00:06:24,306 You may have pre answered this 125 00:06:24,322 --> 00:06:27,450 is what's an insight or fact 126 00:06:27,514 --> 00:06:28,074 understood? 127 00:06:28,186 --> 00:06:30,162 Yeah, that's hard to narrow 128 00:06:30,210 --> 00:06:32,386 But I mean, it's the cool. 129 00:06:32,482 --> 00:06:33,370 Yeah, I mean, the. 130 00:06:33,434 --> 00:06:33,946 Well, I guess. 131 00:06:34,002 --> 00:06:35,738 Okay, here's one thing that I think. 132 00:06:35,858 --> 00:06:36,754 I think would be. 133 00:06:36,866 --> 00:06:42,562 Is really interesting thing 134 00:06:42,610 --> 00:06:45,834 knew is that it's not that 135 00:06:45,866 --> 00:06:48,494 I mean, it can be, you know, 136 00:06:48,526 --> 00:06:49,862 code and stuff like that. 137 00:06:49,990 --> 00:06:52,446 But like, if you just read the 138 00:06:52,502 --> 00:06:56,086 That's what struck me really 139 00:06:56,142 --> 00:06:59,326 like huge, complex research 140 00:06:59,382 --> 00:07:00,126 to know. 141 00:07:00,182 --> 00:07:04,006 It's like, it's actually like 142 00:07:04,022 --> 00:07:05,822 probably watch a YouTube video 143 00:07:05,870 --> 00:07:08,830 But the way that blocks are 144 00:07:08,854 --> 00:07:13,278 find the, you know, you just 145 00:07:13,358 --> 00:07:18,172 the first number of the first 146 00:07:18,220 --> 00:07:20,468 You know, it's like really 147 00:07:20,548 --> 00:07:22,100 That's how you mine a block 148 00:07:22,164 --> 00:07:25,788 And you get the block reward 149 00:07:25,948 --> 00:07:31,100 it's pretty much a simple math 150 00:07:31,164 --> 00:07:31,716 simple. 151 00:07:31,852 --> 00:07:35,532 But it solves this problem 152 00:07:35,660 --> 00:07:36,772 which is really cool. 153 00:07:36,820 --> 00:07:40,580 So it's backed by this simple 154 00:07:40,604 --> 00:07:41,868 problem that's never been 155 00:07:41,908 --> 00:07:42,852 So I guess my main. 156 00:07:42,980 --> 00:07:45,794 I guess if I was going to 157 00:07:45,826 --> 00:07:50,798 not as complicated as people 158 00:07:52,058 --> 00:07:55,698 The basic principles are 159 00:07:55,858 --> 00:07:56,898 Question number three. 160 00:07:56,938 --> 00:08:00,442 What's the bitcoin resource 161 00:08:00,530 --> 00:08:01,918 Yeah, that's a tricky one. 162 00:08:02,538 --> 00:08:05,290 I'm a fan of Andreas Antonopoulos. 163 00:08:05,474 --> 00:08:08,994 He's been around for a long 164 00:08:09,066 --> 00:08:09,678 on. 165 00:08:10,138 --> 00:08:12,242 He does a good job of 166 00:08:12,290 --> 00:08:14,758 His book Mastering Bitcoin is 167 00:08:15,058 --> 00:08:18,718 If you read that, you'll have 168 00:08:18,838 --> 00:08:20,958 And he's on Patreon now. 169 00:08:20,998 --> 00:08:26,254 You can, like, sign up and he 170 00:08:26,286 --> 00:08:27,030 answer stuff. 171 00:08:27,094 --> 00:08:32,022 And so I guess that that would 172 00:08:32,070 --> 00:08:32,390 Yeah. 173 00:08:32,454 --> 00:08:33,822 Question number four. 174 00:08:33,990 --> 00:08:37,630 Beyond Bitcoin, what's a 175 00:08:37,654 --> 00:08:39,526 helpful to you or your work recently? 176 00:08:39,662 --> 00:08:40,550 Yeah, that one. 177 00:08:40,614 --> 00:08:43,138 It would definitely have to be AI. 178 00:08:44,358 --> 00:08:47,188 I mean, AI has changed. 179 00:08:47,528 --> 00:08:49,992 I mean, for me, I was a little 180 00:08:50,040 --> 00:08:50,664 You know, I don't. 181 00:08:50,696 --> 00:08:52,024 I don't know what's a good. 182 00:08:52,216 --> 00:08:53,992 What's it really changing? 183 00:08:54,040 --> 00:08:54,456 What's it. 184 00:08:54,512 --> 00:08:55,520 You know, is it. 185 00:08:55,664 --> 00:08:56,688 Is it really. 186 00:08:56,848 --> 00:08:58,856 Is there just a lot of hype 187 00:08:58,912 --> 00:09:04,112 But then I started using it 188 00:09:04,160 --> 00:09:07,936 of difference from, like, I 189 00:09:08,112 --> 00:09:09,712 before my daughter was born. 190 00:09:09,800 --> 00:09:10,640 And, you know, is. 191 00:09:10,664 --> 00:09:11,952 It is completely different. 192 00:09:12,000 --> 00:09:13,366 It was so much slower. 193 00:09:13,552 --> 00:09:16,690 Like now with AI, it's so much faster. 194 00:09:16,754 --> 00:09:20,506 I can do so much more, so much 195 00:09:20,682 --> 00:09:21,890 It's really changed the. 196 00:09:21,954 --> 00:09:23,482 It's really changed it completely. 197 00:09:23,530 --> 00:09:26,762 Like, if I had to go back just 198 00:09:26,930 --> 00:09:28,998 it would be so horrible. 199 00:09:30,098 --> 00:09:31,570 I was talking to my friend. 200 00:09:31,714 --> 00:09:32,378 He. 201 00:09:32,538 --> 00:09:35,130 He's older and he, like, used 202 00:09:35,154 --> 00:09:35,874 they had to do, like. 203 00:09:35,906 --> 00:09:39,690 He had to type in numbers into 204 00:09:39,714 --> 00:09:42,466 a computer, it was just like a 205 00:09:42,482 --> 00:09:42,946 an. 206 00:09:43,082 --> 00:09:45,438 And he was like, if I had to 207 00:09:45,498 --> 00:09:45,782 myself. 208 00:09:45,830 --> 00:09:46,758 And it's like almost. 209 00:09:46,838 --> 00:09:47,054 It's. 210 00:09:47,086 --> 00:09:48,734 In some ways it's kind of similar. 211 00:09:48,806 --> 00:09:53,606 Like, if I had to go back and 212 00:09:53,662 --> 00:09:58,630 It's so much slower that it 213 00:09:58,654 --> 00:09:58,854 ways. 214 00:09:58,886 --> 00:10:01,030 And I think just going 215 00:10:01,134 --> 00:10:03,734 It might get more and More 216 00:10:03,846 --> 00:10:06,462 Because I was a little 217 00:10:06,510 --> 00:10:09,598 skeptical because I've used 218 00:10:09,638 --> 00:10:11,038 multiple things, not just programming. 219 00:10:11,078 --> 00:10:14,408 Like, I was putting together 220 00:10:15,348 --> 00:10:19,628 I have a 3D printer, and me 221 00:10:19,708 --> 00:10:22,844 like, wiring these circuits 222 00:10:22,916 --> 00:10:25,908 And I'm not an electrician or 223 00:10:26,028 --> 00:10:26,908 I didn't really know. 224 00:10:26,948 --> 00:10:30,444 I mean, there was a wiring 225 00:10:30,476 --> 00:10:33,444 I had some questions because 226 00:10:33,516 --> 00:10:34,128 three. 227 00:10:35,028 --> 00:10:39,280 And so I just put the wiring 228 00:10:39,304 --> 00:10:41,080 can see that it splits into 229 00:10:41,104 --> 00:10:41,464 What do I. 230 00:10:41,496 --> 00:10:42,568 Should I splice the wire? 231 00:10:42,608 --> 00:10:43,120 What should I do? 232 00:10:43,144 --> 00:10:45,696 And it was like, no, it's not 233 00:10:45,752 --> 00:10:47,592 You should probably get, like, 234 00:10:47,760 --> 00:10:51,080 And I didn't know what a 235 00:10:51,104 --> 00:10:54,192 Amazon for, like, a couple 236 00:10:54,320 --> 00:10:59,440 So it's like having an expert 237 00:10:59,464 --> 00:11:00,268 different things. 238 00:11:01,648 --> 00:11:03,368 So, yeah, I mean, I can 239 00:11:03,408 --> 00:11:04,864 Like, imagine when robot. 240 00:11:04,896 --> 00:11:07,688 Like the Tesla robot or 241 00:11:07,768 --> 00:11:08,416 capabilities. 242 00:11:08,512 --> 00:11:09,544 It's gonna be. 243 00:11:09,696 --> 00:11:10,708 Things are gon. 244 00:11:11,788 --> 00:11:15,108 Yeah, it'll be an interesting 245 00:11:15,188 --> 00:11:18,364 And I'm sure things will only 246 00:11:18,436 --> 00:11:23,684 But it is interesting to see 247 00:11:23,716 --> 00:11:29,020 last couple of years from AI 248 00:11:29,044 --> 00:11:30,476 using it for is very rudimentary. 249 00:11:30,532 --> 00:11:35,220 But now it's a great sounding 250 00:11:35,284 --> 00:11:40,648 or at least sparks for 251 00:11:40,688 --> 00:11:43,064 So I can definitely, you know, 252 00:11:43,096 --> 00:11:43,576 there. 253 00:11:43,712 --> 00:11:45,176 Now we have our final. 254 00:11:45,232 --> 00:11:47,760 What we call our arbitrary but 255 00:11:47,824 --> 00:11:48,640 And it's this. 256 00:11:48,744 --> 00:11:52,808 As a general life principle, 257 00:11:52,888 --> 00:11:53,592 Yeah, that's. 258 00:11:53,680 --> 00:11:54,760 That's a good question. 259 00:11:54,904 --> 00:11:55,760 Interesting question. 260 00:11:55,824 --> 00:11:56,328 Because they're. 261 00:11:56,368 --> 00:11:57,504 In some ways, they're similar. 262 00:11:57,576 --> 00:11:59,096 But I. 263 00:11:59,152 --> 00:12:07,166 I like the why not question 264 00:12:07,262 --> 00:12:13,150 like, you know, why things are 265 00:12:13,174 --> 00:12:13,898 to be. 266 00:12:14,758 --> 00:12:15,638 I try to. 267 00:12:15,758 --> 00:12:18,150 I really try to teach that to 268 00:12:18,214 --> 00:12:19,818 Like, actually, my. 269 00:12:20,678 --> 00:12:25,662 My son, I purposely didn't 270 00:12:25,710 --> 00:12:27,502 Like, I want it because I wanted. 271 00:12:27,630 --> 00:12:30,646 That's the whole reason and I 272 00:12:30,662 --> 00:12:34,526 want you to question, like, do 273 00:12:34,702 --> 00:12:39,614 say, you don't have to do it 274 00:12:39,646 --> 00:12:42,326 for yourself, basically think 275 00:12:42,462 --> 00:12:43,958 So yeah, I like that. 276 00:12:44,038 --> 00:12:44,658 Why? 277 00:12:45,038 --> 00:12:45,646 Why not? 278 00:12:45,702 --> 00:12:47,098 But why is good too. 279 00:12:48,278 --> 00:12:50,258 Yeah, they both have their 280 00:14:57,092 --> 00:15:00,708 Well, Mike, we're here today 281 00:15:00,740 --> 00:15:04,908 you're involved with, but 282 00:15:04,940 --> 00:15:09,904 I think when this is released, 283 00:15:10,068 --> 00:15:13,320 If my intel is correct, I'm 284 00:15:13,336 --> 00:15:17,616 us a little bit about the 285 00:15:17,664 --> 00:15:19,368 that you're looking to solve 286 00:15:19,480 --> 00:15:24,328 So I just to give a little bit 287 00:15:24,360 --> 00:15:26,440 called Parc IO in 2014. 288 00:15:26,536 --> 00:15:32,584 So 10 years ago that was into 289 00:15:32,728 --> 00:15:39,176 And I ended up managing like 290 00:15:39,224 --> 00:15:44,224 and did a lot of domain stuff 291 00:15:44,288 --> 00:15:47,412 domain stuff like DNS and stuff. 292 00:15:48,232 --> 00:15:51,612 And so I got to know a lot how 293 00:15:53,592 --> 00:15:57,680 And also at the same time I 294 00:15:57,736 --> 00:16:02,864 that domain names should 295 00:16:03,048 --> 00:16:04,368 they're a digital asset. 296 00:16:04,440 --> 00:16:09,930 And why do you need a third 297 00:16:09,986 --> 00:16:14,262 to use your name or why do you 298 00:16:14,562 --> 00:16:16,418 and the problems even get worse. 299 00:16:16,450 --> 00:16:17,674 It's not just like ownership. 300 00:16:17,738 --> 00:16:21,570 There's like, you know, 301 00:16:21,586 --> 00:16:24,706 the Internet has to rely on a 302 00:16:24,754 --> 00:16:28,866 So you have to like, basically 303 00:16:28,914 --> 00:16:29,266 keys. 304 00:16:29,314 --> 00:16:32,262 You know, it's, it's kind of ridiculous. 305 00:16:33,432 --> 00:16:35,104 And it's not just domain names though. 306 00:16:35,128 --> 00:16:37,064 It's like usernames, like 307 00:16:37,128 --> 00:16:40,808 Like they even, you know, not 308 00:16:40,840 --> 00:16:44,488 know, even the President of 309 00:16:44,560 --> 00:16:45,824 name taken away. 310 00:16:46,008 --> 00:16:48,000 A person should be able to own 311 00:16:48,056 --> 00:16:49,464 Like it's super important. 312 00:16:49,608 --> 00:16:54,480 If there's one thing as 313 00:16:54,536 --> 00:16:55,432 it's naming. 314 00:16:55,512 --> 00:16:58,856 You know, I looked at all the 315 00:16:58,904 --> 00:17:06,694 and ENS and handshake and 316 00:17:06,718 --> 00:17:11,662 error and stuff and working 317 00:17:11,702 --> 00:17:13,078 should be built on Bitcoin. 318 00:17:13,190 --> 00:17:17,922 Bitcoin's by far the strongest 319 00:17:19,062 --> 00:17:25,550 And it's in my opinion the 320 00:17:25,606 --> 00:17:30,520 I know there's problems with 321 00:17:30,576 --> 00:17:35,752 of miners and stuff, but it's, 322 00:17:35,872 --> 00:17:41,544 Ethereum, which is really hard 323 00:17:41,568 --> 00:17:42,772 the whole blockchain. 324 00:17:43,432 --> 00:17:46,592 Like a lot of people are 325 00:17:46,632 --> 00:17:48,440 party, like Infura and stuff 326 00:17:48,496 --> 00:17:51,752 So I wanted something, I 327 00:17:51,792 --> 00:17:53,932 in the security of Bitcoin. 328 00:17:55,182 --> 00:18:00,446 And so we spent a year and a 329 00:18:00,534 --> 00:18:03,518 protocol that's built on 330 00:18:03,550 --> 00:18:09,478 to Bitcoin and leaves a really 331 00:18:09,510 --> 00:18:11,602 small footprint on the blockchain. 332 00:18:12,702 --> 00:18:16,702 But it's a decentralized 333 00:18:16,782 --> 00:18:20,214 own their name and use it for 334 00:18:20,238 --> 00:18:21,402 have to ask permission. 335 00:18:22,402 --> 00:18:26,290 So yeah, we're launching that 336 00:18:26,346 --> 00:18:26,942 days. 337 00:18:27,562 --> 00:18:29,170 And yeah, I'm really excited 338 00:18:29,226 --> 00:18:34,250 So let's say you purchase and 339 00:18:34,386 --> 00:18:38,210 what would you, would it be 340 00:18:38,266 --> 00:18:43,066 buy or what are people buying 341 00:18:43,154 --> 00:18:44,634 where can they use it? 342 00:18:44,818 --> 00:18:47,022 Any name can go up for. 343 00:18:48,112 --> 00:18:51,624 There's an auction system, so 344 00:18:51,648 --> 00:18:51,856 out. 345 00:18:51,904 --> 00:18:56,600 Like some other protocols had 346 00:18:56,616 --> 00:18:58,848 just allowed anybody to 347 00:18:58,920 --> 00:19:02,352 So basically they all got 348 00:19:02,392 --> 00:19:06,384 Like you couldn't get a good 349 00:19:06,448 --> 00:19:08,012 had registered them all. 350 00:19:08,432 --> 00:19:12,368 But we, so we have an auction 351 00:19:12,440 --> 00:19:17,254 like if you want Josh or if 352 00:19:17,318 --> 00:19:23,678 like you know, Bitcoin or like 353 00:19:23,710 --> 00:19:29,942 it up for auction and there's 354 00:19:29,982 --> 00:19:34,282 rolls out the 10 auctions with 355 00:19:34,582 --> 00:19:39,158 They, every day they go into a 356 00:19:39,190 --> 00:19:43,444 a chance to bid during those 357 00:19:43,468 --> 00:19:47,272 bid with Bitcoin to get that 358 00:19:47,732 --> 00:19:51,428 whoever has the highest bid 359 00:19:51,460 --> 00:19:54,372 own it and yeah, to use it. 360 00:19:54,412 --> 00:19:58,316 I mean we've, we've, if you 361 00:19:58,324 --> 00:20:02,868 to spaces protocol.org and our 362 00:20:02,900 --> 00:20:07,740 have a way to configure it 363 00:20:07,756 --> 00:20:09,188 lot of different ways you 364 00:20:09,220 --> 00:20:13,296 I mean, you know, you could 365 00:20:13,344 --> 00:20:15,832 for that, or you could use it 366 00:20:15,912 --> 00:20:20,272 Like I think a really great 367 00:20:20,312 --> 00:20:22,792 Because right now everybody's 368 00:20:22,832 --> 00:20:26,232 my in pub or like my key or 369 00:20:26,312 --> 00:20:30,088 string, you know, Wouldn't it 370 00:20:30,120 --> 00:20:30,692 just. 371 00:20:30,992 --> 00:20:35,024 You could just find me at like 372 00:20:35,088 --> 00:20:39,526 And so I think that's really a 373 00:20:39,574 --> 00:20:44,630 I mean, there's other things 374 00:20:44,646 --> 00:20:49,494 could send Bitcoin to at Josh 375 00:20:49,518 --> 00:20:54,054 whatever and you know, sending 376 00:20:54,118 --> 00:20:55,262 But yeah, there's a lot of. 377 00:20:55,342 --> 00:21:00,174 Anything that ties a name to 378 00:21:00,198 --> 00:21:01,040 to memorize. 379 00:21:01,166 --> 00:21:03,292 You know, naming is like 380 00:21:03,372 --> 00:21:04,020 a long time. 381 00:21:04,076 --> 00:21:07,228 Like cities, instead of having 382 00:21:07,260 --> 00:21:10,860 geolocation coordinates, you 383 00:21:10,916 --> 00:21:11,108 name. 384 00:21:11,140 --> 00:21:15,412 And like, instead of like 385 00:21:15,532 --> 00:21:18,516 you know, whatever, you're 386 00:21:18,524 --> 00:21:21,644 name, a surname and like, so 387 00:21:21,708 --> 00:21:23,380 valuable and used all the time. 388 00:21:23,436 --> 00:21:25,684 Just like money and you shouldn't. 389 00:21:25,828 --> 00:21:27,832 Yeah, there shouldn't be a need. 390 00:21:28,452 --> 00:21:31,700 It's one way that's like 391 00:21:31,796 --> 00:21:35,272 People have controlled people 392 00:21:35,892 --> 00:21:36,948 affected things. 393 00:21:37,020 --> 00:21:37,632 Like. 394 00:21:38,652 --> 00:21:43,832 So, yeah, like people should 395 00:21:44,132 --> 00:21:44,716 So that's. 396 00:21:44,764 --> 00:21:45,580 Anyway, that's. 397 00:21:45,716 --> 00:21:48,472 I have really strong 398 00:21:49,692 --> 00:21:51,892 I think it's so valuable that 399 00:21:51,932 --> 00:21:54,516 And if it's not our protocol, 400 00:21:54,524 --> 00:21:56,436 be something else that does it eventually. 401 00:21:56,564 --> 00:21:57,700 So what would it look like? 402 00:21:57,796 --> 00:22:01,466 Let's just, you know, have 403 00:22:01,514 --> 00:22:02,938 let's say Josh. 404 00:22:03,090 --> 00:22:07,050 So I would, if it's not 405 00:22:07,066 --> 00:22:10,458 know, it's not technically 406 00:22:10,490 --> 00:22:15,302 auction, it would be live for 407 00:22:16,282 --> 00:22:17,322 name Josh. 408 00:22:17,442 --> 00:22:21,674 And then at the end, let's say 409 00:22:21,698 --> 00:22:27,594 of have that direct to 410 00:22:27,698 --> 00:22:28,218 Yeah. 411 00:22:28,330 --> 00:22:29,258 How exactly would that work? 412 00:22:29,290 --> 00:22:34,382 And then could it be kind of 413 00:22:34,802 --> 00:22:36,194 locations I want to send 414 00:22:36,218 --> 00:22:37,122 What would that look like? 415 00:22:37,202 --> 00:22:41,346 Yeah, I mean, right away, like 416 00:22:41,474 --> 00:22:44,450 Spaces client, our Space D 417 00:22:44,466 --> 00:22:46,834 bid in auctions and open 418 00:22:46,938 --> 00:22:50,074 Like right away I could send 419 00:22:50,138 --> 00:22:51,382 Like I could just send it. 420 00:22:51,522 --> 00:22:54,406 And so that's the first like 421 00:22:54,534 --> 00:22:57,134 We also released some open 422 00:22:57,158 --> 00:23:01,118 set it up with DNS and that's 423 00:23:01,150 --> 00:23:04,510 DNS to that wouldn't be stored 424 00:23:04,566 --> 00:23:06,682 It's stored in like a peer to 425 00:23:08,782 --> 00:23:10,974 The library that we have is 426 00:23:11,078 --> 00:23:12,470 It's in our GitHub repository. 427 00:23:12,526 --> 00:23:17,230 But yeah, so, and also an 428 00:23:17,246 --> 00:23:22,304 build it in a scalable way so 429 00:23:22,368 --> 00:23:23,532 on Bitcoin. 430 00:23:24,312 --> 00:23:26,532 But you can do subspaces. 431 00:23:27,232 --> 00:23:32,976 It's kind of like traditional 432 00:23:33,024 --> 00:23:33,720 and stuff. 433 00:23:33,856 --> 00:23:36,212 Well, you can get top level 434 00:23:36,592 --> 00:23:40,112 There's a limited number of 435 00:23:40,152 --> 00:23:44,624 like at Bitcoin and the syntax 436 00:23:44,728 --> 00:23:48,644 So it's like you could get at 437 00:23:48,708 --> 00:23:53,852 or at nostr or at Bitcoin and 438 00:23:53,892 --> 00:23:54,164 those. 439 00:23:54,228 --> 00:23:58,444 And each subspace we've 440 00:23:58,508 --> 00:23:59,260 decentralized. 441 00:23:59,316 --> 00:24:05,716 So not even you as the owner 442 00:24:05,764 --> 00:24:08,116 or do anything to the subspace itself. 443 00:24:08,204 --> 00:24:13,466 So if I had Mike at Bitcoin, 444 00:24:13,594 --> 00:24:16,306 It's completely mine and. 445 00:24:16,354 --> 00:24:16,810 But I. 446 00:24:16,866 --> 00:24:18,338 But so you can turn it into a business. 447 00:24:18,370 --> 00:24:22,146 You could sell like that and 448 00:24:22,194 --> 00:24:23,514 You could have millions under. 449 00:24:23,618 --> 00:24:26,338 At Bitcoin, millions of subspaces. 450 00:24:26,530 --> 00:24:30,622 And it doesn't the we did it 451 00:24:31,242 --> 00:24:33,394 it's all verifiable with a hash. 452 00:24:33,458 --> 00:24:36,578 Like so there's very minimal 453 00:24:36,610 --> 00:24:38,742 blockchain, but it's anchored 454 00:24:39,742 --> 00:24:41,002 So yeah. 455 00:24:41,422 --> 00:24:44,278 And who do you primarily see 456 00:24:44,310 --> 00:24:49,366 Would this mostly be 457 00:24:49,534 --> 00:24:53,078 something that larger 458 00:24:53,110 --> 00:24:53,566 of? 459 00:24:53,694 --> 00:24:57,142 And maybe in each case, how 460 00:24:57,262 --> 00:25:02,774 Well, I think I could see 461 00:25:02,798 --> 00:25:07,524 now online, it's all 462 00:25:07,718 --> 00:25:09,272 So I see. 463 00:25:09,392 --> 00:25:13,128 You know, even just if it was 464 00:25:13,160 --> 00:25:16,088 that as very valuable because 465 00:25:16,120 --> 00:25:16,384 want. 466 00:25:16,448 --> 00:25:20,252 Nobody can, nobody can 467 00:25:21,632 --> 00:25:27,168 But also like usernames, I 468 00:25:27,240 --> 00:25:28,648 like for social media. 469 00:25:28,720 --> 00:25:30,944 Like you could own a name and 470 00:25:30,968 --> 00:25:35,766 Like Noster, you know, if you 471 00:25:35,894 --> 00:25:37,702 publish content under that name. 472 00:25:37,742 --> 00:25:41,534 People can find you there and 473 00:25:41,638 --> 00:25:42,602 It's yours. 474 00:25:43,982 --> 00:25:45,270 So that's another use case. 475 00:25:45,326 --> 00:25:48,574 I mean the other one is like 476 00:25:48,758 --> 00:25:52,694 So that right now a lot of 477 00:25:52,878 --> 00:25:57,678 And there's even like a 478 00:25:57,750 --> 00:26:00,262 for human readable wallet addresses. 479 00:26:00,422 --> 00:26:02,488 But right now it's using DNS, which. 480 00:26:02,590 --> 00:26:04,132 So like a registrar. 481 00:26:04,212 --> 00:26:09,140 I mean, I know I worked in the 482 00:26:09,156 --> 00:26:10,892 it's like a registrar, a registry. 483 00:26:10,972 --> 00:26:11,684 Like I can. 484 00:26:11,748 --> 00:26:12,620 People can. 485 00:26:12,796 --> 00:26:14,588 A lot of people have access to 486 00:26:14,620 --> 00:26:20,036 So if you're accepting 487 00:26:20,084 --> 00:26:24,552 are taking a risk because if 488 00:26:24,852 --> 00:26:28,092 you know, an employee at a 489 00:26:28,212 --> 00:26:29,988 address or something, so. 490 00:26:30,020 --> 00:26:32,044 Or they could just take the 491 00:26:32,068 --> 00:26:32,324 taking. 492 00:26:32,388 --> 00:26:33,062 Money. 493 00:26:33,252 --> 00:26:36,626 It's like GoFundMe, you know, 494 00:26:36,674 --> 00:26:39,402 or whatever had that boycott 495 00:26:39,522 --> 00:26:41,942 GoFundMe was like, you know what? 496 00:26:42,242 --> 00:26:44,570 We're not all that money you 497 00:26:44,586 --> 00:26:47,746 to other charities and stuff is. 498 00:26:47,834 --> 00:26:51,738 So it would be much, wouldn't 499 00:26:51,770 --> 00:26:55,514 like send it to truckers at 500 00:26:55,618 --> 00:26:58,962 they got, you know, whoever 501 00:26:59,002 --> 00:27:01,872 and nobody can enter, nobody 502 00:27:02,172 --> 00:27:05,052 If someone wants to take 503 00:27:05,212 --> 00:27:11,364 what would you recommend them 504 00:27:11,428 --> 00:27:14,436 I guess in particular, if you 505 00:27:14,484 --> 00:27:16,924 could take advantage of as 506 00:27:17,108 --> 00:27:21,796 But what would be a strategic 507 00:27:21,924 --> 00:27:26,492 using the Spaces protocol in 508 00:27:26,572 --> 00:27:30,960 Well, I think first you want 509 00:27:31,016 --> 00:27:31,944 top level space. 510 00:27:32,008 --> 00:27:36,336 So I would go to 511 00:27:36,384 --> 00:27:37,120 software. 512 00:27:37,296 --> 00:27:41,424 We have a command line wallet 513 00:27:41,448 --> 00:27:42,732 and install the wallet. 514 00:27:43,112 --> 00:27:48,104 We're also going to have a GUI 515 00:27:48,288 --> 00:27:50,456 Maybe at release we'll have 516 00:27:50,544 --> 00:27:54,326 So it'll be much easier for 517 00:27:54,374 --> 00:27:54,926 command line. 518 00:27:54,974 --> 00:27:59,734 But yeah, get a wallet and 519 00:27:59,798 --> 00:28:00,630 Get a name. 520 00:28:00,766 --> 00:28:04,190 I think early on there's going 521 00:28:04,246 --> 00:28:10,526 So you probably be able to get 522 00:28:10,614 --> 00:28:13,242 later on if it becomes more popular. 523 00:28:14,582 --> 00:28:19,382 So I think getting a name 524 00:28:19,422 --> 00:28:22,310 per day, so there's only going 525 00:28:22,446 --> 00:28:24,002 So they're kind of rare. 526 00:28:25,062 --> 00:28:29,286 So anyway, getting a name I 527 00:28:29,334 --> 00:28:33,682 we're gonna, we're gonna have 528 00:28:34,222 --> 00:28:37,526 we'll do all the work so that 529 00:28:37,614 --> 00:28:41,702 So if you get a good top level 530 00:28:41,782 --> 00:28:44,886 bitcoin, crypto or something 531 00:28:44,894 --> 00:28:49,558 up so people could get like 532 00:28:49,590 --> 00:28:51,864 it so you could earn money 533 00:28:51,928 --> 00:28:55,972 And so I think that's another 534 00:28:57,032 --> 00:29:01,144 I would also love it if like 535 00:29:01,168 --> 00:29:05,680 know, integrating it into 536 00:29:05,696 --> 00:29:05,848 that. 537 00:29:05,880 --> 00:29:11,088 And we have people on our 538 00:29:11,120 --> 00:29:12,512 to help and who have been helping. 539 00:29:12,592 --> 00:29:15,752 So that's another good place 540 00:29:15,792 --> 00:29:18,282 You know, if you have any 541 00:29:18,282 --> 00:29:21,554 you go to spaces, 542 00:29:21,578 --> 00:29:22,922 telegram link in the top corner. 543 00:29:22,962 --> 00:29:24,938 You can click there and join 544 00:29:25,010 --> 00:29:26,602 This is going to be a slight pivot. 545 00:29:26,682 --> 00:29:30,290 But one of the interesting 546 00:29:30,306 --> 00:29:33,242 I was looking at your bio for 547 00:29:33,282 --> 00:29:35,546 early on in the Lightning Network. 548 00:29:35,594 --> 00:29:38,018 And so I think it'd be 549 00:29:38,050 --> 00:29:42,690 on being in so early on 550 00:29:42,786 --> 00:29:45,234 I don't think I was in Bitcoin 551 00:29:45,258 --> 00:29:46,502 about Bitcoin at the time. 552 00:29:46,882 --> 00:29:50,738 So I don't know how quickly 553 00:29:50,810 --> 00:29:51,970 Network bandwagon. 554 00:29:52,066 --> 00:29:55,074 What was it like being in, on 555 00:29:55,138 --> 00:29:58,914 days and are there any 556 00:29:58,978 --> 00:30:03,546 to spaces or is it too 557 00:30:03,594 --> 00:30:04,602 as analogies? 558 00:30:04,722 --> 00:30:05,642 No, I think it's good. 559 00:30:05,682 --> 00:30:10,242 I mean, yeah, Lightning, 560 00:30:10,402 --> 00:30:12,978 well, it had a lot of buzz and 561 00:30:13,050 --> 00:30:17,282 It was like another layer that 562 00:30:17,322 --> 00:30:17,634 and stuff. 563 00:30:17,658 --> 00:30:21,126 So it was really exciting, 564 00:30:21,214 --> 00:30:25,470 So you know, being a 565 00:30:25,526 --> 00:30:28,206 I, I wanted to try it out. 566 00:30:28,254 --> 00:30:32,854 So I, I mean I downloaded 567 00:30:32,878 --> 00:30:36,782 I, you know, was like on their 568 00:30:36,822 --> 00:30:39,814 they were really helpful and 569 00:30:39,838 --> 00:30:40,574 and stuff. 570 00:30:40,718 --> 00:30:42,230 So I mean it's, it's cool. 571 00:30:42,286 --> 00:30:44,286 I mean that's, you know, 572 00:30:44,334 --> 00:30:44,678 Bitcoin. 573 00:30:44,710 --> 00:30:49,022 It's like this hacker spirit 574 00:30:49,062 --> 00:30:52,242 building this, you know, we're 575 00:30:52,542 --> 00:30:54,982 So I think it's. 576 00:30:55,022 --> 00:30:55,966 Yeah, I think it's great. 577 00:30:56,014 --> 00:31:02,326 Just like jumping in, just 578 00:31:02,374 --> 00:31:04,854 figuring, you know, figuring 579 00:31:04,918 --> 00:31:06,926 And I think it's the same with Spaces. 580 00:31:06,974 --> 00:31:09,790 Like, you know, there's people 581 00:31:09,846 --> 00:31:12,798 like installing it and 582 00:31:12,830 --> 00:31:13,462 something new. 583 00:31:13,542 --> 00:31:18,048 So then I also saw that you 584 00:31:18,120 --> 00:31:21,880 to purchase a physical item on 585 00:31:22,056 --> 00:31:25,472 Can you go into detail as to 586 00:31:25,512 --> 00:31:25,936 purchased? 587 00:31:26,024 --> 00:31:30,752 I had, yeah, I had a node set 588 00:31:30,872 --> 00:31:36,360 And like you couldn't use 589 00:31:36,536 --> 00:31:38,536 I think the only thing you could. 590 00:31:38,664 --> 00:31:42,692 One server hosting company 591 00:31:44,182 --> 00:31:48,542 But then Blockstream set up a 592 00:31:48,582 --> 00:31:49,358 and stuff. 593 00:31:49,510 --> 00:31:52,558 And right when the store 594 00:31:52,590 --> 00:31:58,030 away and then I emailed them 595 00:31:58,086 --> 00:32:01,142 goods were being sold for 596 00:32:01,222 --> 00:32:04,494 So I just emailed them and 597 00:32:04,558 --> 00:32:06,806 And they said no, I was third. 598 00:32:06,974 --> 00:32:12,596 But so, and I, and I'm pretty 599 00:32:12,604 --> 00:32:13,404 don't know who was second. 600 00:32:13,468 --> 00:32:16,524 But yeah, I still have the 601 00:32:16,668 --> 00:32:17,348 That's cool. 602 00:32:17,460 --> 00:32:19,644 And one thing we didn't, I 603 00:32:19,708 --> 00:32:23,332 spaces is that the only way 604 00:32:23,372 --> 00:32:25,852 like from what I've checked 605 00:32:25,892 --> 00:32:31,712 Can you use dollars as well or 606 00:32:32,972 --> 00:32:33,332 with. 607 00:32:33,372 --> 00:32:37,672 Bitcoin if you're doing the 608 00:32:38,512 --> 00:32:40,528 if, and that's for top level spaces. 609 00:32:40,600 --> 00:32:43,592 Eventually we're going to set 610 00:32:43,672 --> 00:32:46,544 you know, people to sell their 611 00:32:46,648 --> 00:32:47,368 I don't know. 612 00:32:47,480 --> 00:32:50,784 I think at first it'll just be 613 00:32:50,808 --> 00:32:52,052 without a third party. 614 00:32:53,072 --> 00:32:58,400 But also subspaces like if you 615 00:32:58,416 --> 00:33:03,184 whatever and you decide to 616 00:33:03,208 --> 00:33:04,452 you could buy that for. 617 00:33:04,882 --> 00:33:08,754 So you could buy like Josh at 618 00:33:08,778 --> 00:33:10,386 credit card or something like that. 619 00:33:10,554 --> 00:33:13,362 Well, any final thoughts 620 00:33:13,482 --> 00:33:14,810 It's been, it's been interesting. 621 00:33:14,906 --> 00:33:18,402 It's one of those things where 622 00:33:18,482 --> 00:33:20,722 People are going to be getting 623 00:33:20,802 --> 00:33:23,722 There's always opportunities 624 00:33:23,762 --> 00:33:25,186 looking into it a little bit 625 00:33:25,234 --> 00:33:27,714 But any final thoughts before 626 00:33:27,738 --> 00:33:30,838 and where you'd like for 627 00:33:30,870 --> 00:33:31,722 conversation? 628 00:33:32,102 --> 00:33:38,206 Yeah, just check out 629 00:33:38,334 --> 00:33:42,782 on Twitter if you go to 630 00:33:42,822 --> 00:33:44,454 name to my Twitter. 631 00:33:44,638 --> 00:33:48,342 But yeah, but yeah, thanks for 632 00:33:48,422 --> 00:33:50,550 It's great to talk to you and thanks. 633 00:33:50,726 --> 00:33:51,062 Great. 634 00:33:51,102 --> 00:33:52,838 Well, Mike, thank you so much 635 00:33:52,870 --> 00:33:53,870 It's been a pleasure. 636 00:33:54,046 --> 00:33:55,438 Yeah, me too. 637 00:33:55,590 --> 00:33:56,518 Well, friends, it's a wrap. 638 00:33:56,550 --> 00:34:00,418 Thanks so much for listening 639 00:34:00,530 --> 00:34:00,994 Show. 640 00:34:01,098 --> 00:34:03,218 If you want to reach out to 641 00:34:03,250 --> 00:34:04,962 links down in the show notes. 642 00:34:05,042 --> 00:34:09,378 And be sure to check out 643 00:34:09,410 --> 00:34:12,962 building, keep growing, and 644 00:34:13,042 --> 00:34:13,570 leading. 645 00:34:13,666 --> 00:34:21,954 Well, thanks to no Waste, BTC 646 00:34:21,978 --> 00:34:23,178 the show on Fountain this week. 647 00:34:23,210 --> 00:34:25,778 If you would like to support 648 00:34:25,810 --> 00:34:29,342 on the Fountain app and either 649 00:34:29,382 --> 00:34:30,110 a boost. 650 00:34:30,246 --> 00:34:33,174 And if you include a note with 651 00:34:33,198 --> 00:34:34,182 it on the show.