Bitcoin Rails | Isabel Foxen Duke

What Happened to Bitcoin Treasury Companies? | DAVID BAILEY & BRANDON GREEN

Thu, 26 Mar 2026 14:51:46 GMT

This most recent bull market was inarguably defined by one dominant narrative: the rise of Bitcoin treasury companies and their dramatic retracement as crypto "DATs" flooded markets.

David Bailey, former CEO of Bitcoin Inc. (Bitcoin Magazine, Bitcoin Conference) — raised $760M for treasury company Nakamoto , which catapulted to a peak valuation of 33X MNAV before sliding down below MNAV after a seeming burst in treasury mania last year.

David joins me and newly appointed CEO of Bitcoin Inc. Brandon Green to share the history of one of the most influential companies in Bitcoin history (Bitcoin Inc.), how their treasury play changed everything, and what we can expect from Bitcoin treasury companies moving through 2026 and beyond.

In this episode, the three of us discuss:

The history of Bitcoin Inc., and the rise of Bitcoin Magazine and Bitcoin Conference empire.
The role of UTXOmgmt (VC and trading fund) in the team's strategy over time
How the fund’s entry into Metaplanet and their subsequent seeding of nearly a dozen Bitcoin Treasury companies since
The rise of Nakamoto and its subsequent 99% slide in price from ATHs
How David sees the Treasury thesis playing out from here… and projected winners and losers when/if these companies rebound.

This episode of Bitcoin Rails is powered by:

Best In Slot — the leading API for Ordinals and BRC20 data aggregation and indexing.
Spark — a statechains implementation advancing Bitcoin-powered payments.
Citrea — a leading Bitcoin rollup technology and BitVM alliance contributor.

Building a Financial System on Bitcoin | WILLEM SCHROE

Tue, 17 Mar 2026 13:48:40 GMT

“People in finance understand the financial system, but not money. People in Bitcoin understand money, but not the financial system.”

In a world where financial markets make up 70% of all money flow around the world — we have two choices: come up with technical solutions that enable these use-cases in a decentralized way, or simply accept that Bitcoin will be used in a custodial way whenever more complex use-cases are at play.

Botanix CEO Willem Schroe is staunchly rejecting the latter — and attempting to solve some of the toughest challenges faced by the L2 and scaling landscapes (e.g. the “honeypot problem” that nearly all other L2s will ultimately face if not addressed).

Willem and I break down the design space of Bitcoin L2s, why DeFi may be necessary for Bitcoin’s financial system to emerge, and how different technologies — like Spiderchains, BitVM, Lightning, and others — could eventually combine into a decentralized Bitcoin-native financial stack.

In this episode, we discuss:

- Why Bitcoin needs a financial system, not just payments (hint: without it, we'll end up like Gold)

- The role of DeFi and stablecoins in Bitcoin adoption

- The "honeypot problem" introduced by most Bitcoin bridges, and how implementing Spiderchains could be the solve

- Combining Spiderchains, BitVM, and other models into the ultimate Bitcoin scaling stack

This episode of Bitcoin Rails is powered by:

- Best In Slot (@bestinslotxyz) — the leading API for Ordinals and BRC20 data aggregation and indexing.

- Spark (@lightspark) — a statechains implementation advancing Bitcoin-powered payments.

- Citrea (@citrea_xyz) — a leading Bitcoin rollup technology and BitVM alliance contributor.

Internet Capital Markets on Bitcoin | BINARI

Tue, 10 Mar 2026 15:28:56 GMT

“BRC 2.0 is positioning Bitcoin as the prime asset issuance layer — the asset tokenization network for the most valuable assets on earth.”

Late last year, BRC20 maintainer team Best in Slot extended the protocol’s functionality to include EVM smart contracts at the indexing layer — making the world’s most valuable Bitcoin-native assets protocol “fully programmable.”

This upgrade, dubbed “BRC 2.0,” triggered a wave of interest in programmable metaprotocols across the Bitcoin ecosystem — expanding metaprotocol usecases beyond memecoins, into more sophisticated DeFi applications like RWAs and stablecoins.

In this episode, Best in Slot CEO Binari joins me for a full update on the protocol’s technical and social evolution post-BRC2.0 launch—spilling the tea on hard lessons learned in ecosystem building, right alongside his bull case for building “internet capital markets” on Bitcoin.

In this episode, we discuss:

The “internet capital markets” thesis for Bitcoin
The unique role of Chinese investment communities in pushing Bitcoin assets forward
How incentive structures for metaprotocols outperform those of L2s
How programmable asset development could potentially protect Bitcoin’s security budget as the block subsidy declines
Lessons from the protocol’s first pump-and-rug drama and how the community fought back with technical solutions that could push Bitcoin DeFi forward

This episode of Bitcoin Rails is powered by:

Best In Slot - the leading API for Ordinals and BRC20 data aggregation and indexing.
Spark - a statechains implementation advancing Bitcoin-powered payments.
Citrea - a leading Bitcoin rollup technology and BitVM alliance contributor.

BitVM3 & The Garbled Circuits Revolution | with BitVM creators Robin Linus & Liam Eagen

Thu, 26 Feb 2026 15:38:53 GMT

In 2023, Robin Linus introduced BitVM—aimed at enabling the verification of zero-knowledge proofs on Bitcoin for trust-minimized bridging.

Since then, BitVM has been implemented by teams like Citrea and others—bringing what was once considered an impossible goal to life and paving the way for production-ready ZK rollups on Bitcoin.

Cryptographer and SNARK researcher Liam Eagen (formerly Blockstream and Alpen Labs) has been a key collaborator from day one, spearheading major efficiency improvements to BitVM proof systems—including the development of garbled circuit schemes affectionately referred to as “BitVM3.”

In this episode of Bitcoin Rails, I sit down with Robin and Liam to discuss BitVM’s evolution following the integration of garbled circuits—an upgrade that improved efficiency by more than 1,000x over prior implementations.

In more detail, we discuss:

- The origins of BitVM and its early success (+ Liam’s initial skepticism and what changed his mind)

- Garbled circuits, the Glocks scheme, and the Argo improvement

- How these new schemes and the development of “Binohash” effect permissionless verification of BitVM proof systems

- Robin and Liam’s new venture @idealgroup with cryptographer @therealyingtong + their ultimate vision for actuating shielded CSV with “the ultimate BitVM bridge.”

This episode of Bitcoin Rails is powered by:

- Best In Slot - the leading API for Ordinals and BRC20 data aggregation and indexing.

- Spark - a statechains implementation advancing Bitcoin-powered payments.

- Citrea - a leading Bitcoin rollup technology and BitVM alliance contributor.

TIMESTAMPS:

00:00 Intro

03:40 Birth of BitVM and Individual Contributions

11:03 Liam’s Initial Skepticism

14:13 Joining Alpen Labs

16:22 Garbled Circuits: Explained

24:34 Jeremy Rubin’s Role

34:32 The Glocks Scheme

38:23 Leaving Alpen Labs

41:15 Founding the Company Together

42:50 Business Model, Vision and Funding

52:01 Babylon Collaboration and the BABE Protocol

57:01 Permissionless Verification Breakthrough

01:00:26 Bridge Architecture Components

01:02:31 Bitcoin Light Client Dependancy

01:15:32 Final Thoughts

History of Metaprotocols on Bitcoin | with Adam Krellenstein

Thu, 19 Feb 2026 16:28:58 GMT

Metaprotocols on Bitcoin have a long and complex history—stretching far before the launch of Ordinals, the most widely used metaprotocol in Bitcoin’s history.

Ordinals’ creator Casey Rodarmor credits much of his inspiration to these early projects—including Yoni Assia’s Colored Coins, Erik Voorhees Satoshi Dice, and of course, CounterParty (widely considered the first NFT protocol) developed by Evan Wagner and Adam Krellenstein.

While CounterParty was not originally intended for the use of on-chain art, its use for art developed a cult following—used by projects like RarePepes, which remain some of the most valuable NFTs on the market.

In this interview, I sit down with Krellenstein to review the full history of metaprotocols on Bitcoin—the complex history of the first NFT protocol in history—and why, after a long hiatus from Bitcoin, Krellenstein is back in action with metaprotocol Kontor …with the aim of giving all Layer 2s a run for their money.

In this episode, Adam and I cover:

- Why early Bitcoin metaprotocols (pre-Ethereum) didn’t take off for DeFi—and what's different today

- His personal experiences with Luke Dash jr and the early “spam wars” of 2014

- Why Adam left the Bitcoin space for 8+ years after the creation of Counterparty, and is making a dramatic return with Kontor this past year

- The rise of Pepes—and the pros and cons of frogs in pushing forward DeFi metaprotocols

- How Kontor is solving the 10-minute block time issue

- Why metaprotocols will ultimately outperform Layer 2s for Bitcoin DeFI 🌶️🌶️

This episode of Bitcoin Rails is powered by:

— Best In Slot - the leading API for Ordinals and BRC-20 data aggregation and indexing.

— Spark - a statechains implementation advancing Bitcoin-powered payments.

— Citrea - a leading Bitcoin rollup technology and BitVM alliance contributor.

The History of SegWit and Taproot | with Pieter Wuille

Wed, 11 Feb 2026 15:19:53 GMT

A primary maintainer of Bitcoin Core from 2011-2022, Pieter Wuille is arguably the most influential developer in Bitcoin’s history since Satoshi himself.

After receiving keys to the Bitcoin codebase from Gavin Andersen, who was tasked with maintaining the codebase by Satoshi Nakamoto, Pieter went on to implement some of Bitcoin’s most dramatic and influential upgrades—including but not limited to:

Implementation of Bitcoin’s Taproot and Segwit upgrades
Implementation of libsecp256k + Bitcoin’s unique encoding structure for the cryptography securing all Bitcoin public/private keys.
The first import/export feature for Bitcoin private keys into Bitcoin (now Bitcoin Core)
Development of hierarchical deterministic (HD) wallets, enabling backups via a single seedphrase and paving the way for seedphrases themselves
DER signatures, Miniscript, and so much more.

A truly special episode of Bitcoin Rails, this is a rare long-form interview with one of the most important historical figures in the arc of Bitcoin’s development.

Pieter and I walk through how Bitcoin consensus works in practice, the history of Bitcoin's most critical early developments, and the key role of his good friend, Greg Maxwell, nearly every step of the way.

This episode of Bitcoin Rails is powered by: — Best In Slot - the leading API for Ordinals and BRC-20 data aggregation and indexing. — Spark - a statechains implementation advancing Bitcoin-powered payments. — Citrea - a leading Bitcoin rollup technology and BitVM alliance contributor.

The Cultural Fork of Bitcoin | with TJ Miller

Wed, 28 Jan 2026 15:23:38 GMT

I was introduced to Silicon Valley's TJ Miller little over a year ago while he was brainstorming how we could potentially inscribe a 4-megger comedy video through MARA Slipstream.

A Bitcoiner since 2018, TJ saw the potential of Ordinals to orange-pill a whole new kind of Bitcoiner — the kind that may realistically be intimidated by (or straight up uninterested in) ivory-tower technical or economic topics.

"I talk about cultural adoption and how do we bring Bitcoin into the cultural forefront."

Letting me into "his world" for this interview, TJ and I recorded this chat straight from Stand Comedy Club before his Bitcoin-focused set during Chainlink New York blockchain week

In this episode, TJ and I jam about:

How TJ was orange-pilled by the Winklevoss twins (+ the Michigan twins of course!)
Why TJ's wife, Kate, is a hardcore Bitcoin maxi… despite TJ loving Ethereum and DOGE on the side
How comedy could orange pill the world
And as usual we end with… Brock Pierce. IYKYK.
For good measure, we also clear the air on Peter Todd [probably not] being Satoshi.

Unsurprisingly, we had an absolute blast and lots of laughs filming this episode. A nice little left turn from my usual technical schtick + some fun personal stories shared from both of our sides.

Bitcoin Rails is powered by:

— Best In Slot - the leading API for Ordinals and BRC-20 data aggregation and indexing.

— Spark - a statechains implementation advancing Bitcoin-powered payments.

— Citrea - a leading Bitcoin rollup technology and BitVM alliance contributor.

TIMESTAMPS 📌

00:00 Intro

04:46 Trading and Crypto Misconceptions

08:47 Bitcoin and Early Adopters

17:13 Ethereum and Blockchain Exploration

38:55 NFTs and Artistic Ventures

40:46 The First NFT Comedy Special

41:31 The FTX Collapse and Its Impact

47:28 Ordinals and Bitcoin Utility

51:41 The Ordinals Cultural Fork

53:20 Cultural Adoption of Bitcoin

01:09:06 Bitcoin Comedy and Community

The History of Bitcoin Sidechains | with Rootstock creator Sergio Lerner

Wed, 21 Jan 2026 17:30:19 GMT

The ultimate Bitcoin "scaling OG,” Sergio Lerner, has been working on Bitcoin bridges since 2012. Sergio was the first person on the Bitcoin Talk forum to propose the idea that “one chain could validate the consensus of another chain,” and architected the first functioning Bitcoin sidechain, Rootstock, shortly after the canonical Blockstream sidechains paper was published in 2014.

Lesser known is Lerner’s recent contributions to the development of BitVM—through his team’s Alliance-independent implementation, BitVMX. In addition to their unique BitVM implementation (optimizing for different tradeoffs compared to Robin Linus BitVM Alliance), the BitVMX team is quietly operating as the “fixer” service provider to many of the most interesting BitVM rollups set to launch in 2026.

In this episode, Lerner and I dive deep into the history of Bitcoin sidechains, why various projects of the past decade have succeeded or failed (and the legacies they left behind), and the trust-minimized future he sees through the development of BitVM/BitVMX.

This episode of Bitcoin Rails is powered by:

— Best In Slot — the leading API for Ordinals and BRC-20 data aggregation and indexing.

— Spark — a statechains implementation advancing Bitcoin-powered payments.

— Citrea — a leading Bitcoin rollup technology and BitVM alliance contributor.

📌 TIMESTAMPS

00:00 Intro

01:39 Early Bitcoin and Cryptography Background

03:55 Bitcoin’s Limits Back in 2012

05:26 The First Turing-Complete Cryptocurrency

06:27 Contributions to Bitcoin and Ethereum

16:52 Why Mining Centralization Is Bitcoin’s Biggest Risk

24:34 Rootstock vs. Original Sidechains Whitepaper

33:50 Federated Bridges and Their Trade-offs

40:49 First Rootstock Users

46:31 Merge Mining and Bitcoin Security

56:03 Fairgate, BitVM, and Garbled Circuits

01:06:37 Bridging Models and Business Constraints

Open Source Mining Revolution | with Bitaxe creator Skot

Wed, 14 Jan 2026 15:34:04 GMT

“The current mining landscape is dominated by proprietary, closed-source players who aren’t really serving the needs of the market. That creates an opportunity for open source mining to matter again.”

Bitaxe creator Skot dives into the state of modern Bitcoin mining, where a small handful of industry players control nearly every facet of mining hardware and ASIC production—in a tightly sealed, closed-source environment.

While Bitcoin software developers often champion a rigorously open-source ethos in building, Skot shares why the mining industry “isn’t like that” and how closed-source mining production creates unique centralization vectors—from limiting participation by “pleb” solo miners to exacerbating geopolitical risks on an industrial scale.

Thankfully, we’re starting to see a shift in demand and supply of open-source mining tools—including the recent development of “Bitaxes,” which have notably revived the solo miner community over the last year.

In this episode, Skot shares the full history of the open-source mining movement, including:

- How ASIC manufacturers like Bitmain and foundries like TSMC came to dominate the industry, and why competition at the silicon layer is so challenging

- The geopolitics of chip manufacturing and the near-monopoly of China & Taiwan in developing ASIC technology

- Why mining systems producers keep their technology so close to the vest, and who these closed-source systems most hurt in the process

- How advocates at the independent and corporate levels (think: Skot and Jack Dorsey) are challenging the status quo and leading the open-source mining revolution

Shout-outs in this episode to the Texas Energy and Mining Summit Bitcoin Park, and early Bitaxe supporters ZK shark and Ordinal Maxi Biz.

This episode of Bitcoin Rails is powered by:

- Best In Slot — the leading API for Ordinals and BRC-20 data aggregation and indexing.

- Spark — a statechains implementation advancing Bitcoin-powered payments.

- Citrea — a leading Bitcoin rollup technology and BitVM alliance contributor.

TIMESTAMPS 📌

00:00 Intro

01:27 Diving Into Bitaxe and Ordinals

04:02 The Open Source Nature of Bitaxe

05:43 Challenges in Chip Manufacturing

07:27 The Role of TSMC and Bitmain in Mining

15:26 The Evolution and Impact of Bitaxe

22:31 The First Bitaxe Manufacturer

31:28 Why Are People Buying Bitaxes?

35:47 A Different Way of Thinking About Bitcoin Mining

37:54 Decentralization and Home Mining

41:12 Ongoing Challenges in Chip Manufacturing

44:07 How Did Jack Dorsey Get Chips From TSMC?

49:03 How Bitcoin Mining Chips Interact With Software

01:04:51 The Role of Open Source in Bitcoin’s Future

Bitcoin Mining in the Age of AI | with MARA CEO Fred Thiel

Thu, 08 Jan 2026 14:30:00 GMT

In response to the AI-driven shock in global demand for computing power, large players in the Bitcoin mining industry have been forced to make significant strategic shifts to remain competitive.

MARA — the largest Bitcoin miner in the world by hashrate — is emerging as one of the more well-positioned beneficiaries of these changing tides, having transitioned from an “asset-light” strategy (via hosted mining at third-party facilities) to an “asset-heavy” approach (owning its own land, power, and infrastructure) just ahead of the AI compute wave in 2024/25.

I sat down with MARA CEO Fred Thiel to discuss how these shifting industry dynamics are playing out in practice — as well as his perspective on how key mining-related security and infrastructure issues may evolve in the coming months and years.

In this episode, we cover:

— How MARA scaled from near-zero hash rate in 2020 to the largest Bitcoin miner globally by the end of 2023

— Key differences between operating Bitcoin mining facilities versus AI data centers, and where the two models meaningfully intersect

— Why ownership of power generation —rather than reliance on PPAs— may represent a durable competitive edge for miners and AI data center operators over time

— Why Bitcoin may be entering its “IPO phase,” and why recent price corrections could reflect increasing market maturity rather than structural weakness

We also explore more technical and often under-discussed topics —such as heat reuse, open-source mining technologies, and the implications of US policy goals around Bitcoin mining.

This episode offers a grounded, operator-level view of where Bitcoin mining is headed, informed by one of the most consequential leaders in the public mining sector.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

This episode of Bitcoin Rails is powered by:

— Best In Slot — the leading API for Ordinals and BRC-20 data aggregation and indexing.

— Spark — a statechains implementation advancing Bitcoin-powered payments.

— Citrea — a leading Bitcoin rollup technology and BitVM alliance contributor.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

TIMESTAMPS 📌

00:00 Intro

01:09 From Marathon Patent Group to MARA

06:35 Why Owning Infrastructure is Key

07:46 First Public Companies Mining Bitcoin

09:54 Data Centers For AI vs Bitcoin Mining Facilities

14:07 How AI Data Centers Will Look Going Forward

15:37 How MARA is Diversifying From Bitcoin Mining

19:03 Private Cloud and Data Security

22:20 The Exaion Partnership

26:03 Future of Bitcoin and AI

40:22 Innovative Approaches to AI and Bitcoin Mining

42:06 Challenges and Opportunities in Power Generation

45:38 Strategic International Partnerships

50:43 The Future of Real World Assets

53:53 Bitcoin Mining in China

57:24 Why MARA Runs Their Own Software

01:00:19 Where is Bitcoin Mining Headed

01:04:17 Benefits of Running a Mining Pool

01:07:17 Heat Reuse in Mining

Ark Beyond Payments | ALEX BERGERON

Tue, 16 Dec 2025 14:45:42 GMT

If you’ve been following the “Bitcoin Season II” meta for some time, you’re likely already following Bitcoin tech critic Alex Bergeron—formerly comms at Blockstream and Layer-2 reporter for Bitcoin Magazine.

A notorious contrarian, he’s known for being difficult to impress—and for having a soft spot for the Ark Protocol, which he sees as uniquely suited for trustless Bitcoin scaling and DeFi usecases (e.g. lending) more broadly.

Alex made his relationship with the Ark protocol official earlier this year, joining the Arkade implementation team led by Ark Labs and Tiero.

Taking a notably different approach to both engineering and product design than competitor Second (see last week’s episode with Steven Roose for comparison), Alex shares why the payments use case is “only the beginning” for the Ark protocol, and why Ark Labs intends to lead the charge on the protocol’s potential for Bitcoin-native DeFi.

In this episode, Alex and I unpack:

- How Alex’s experiences at Blockstream and Bitcoin Magazine shaped his views on governance, communication, and prepared him for the new wave of political disruption we're seeing in Bitcoin today.

- Why the Payments use-case is only ONE application Ark Lab's Arkade implementation intends to support.

- The trade-offs of introducing programmability into Ark: why expressiveness introduces operator dependencies, and how Arkade approaches minimizing (but not eliminating) those trust assumptions.

- What Bitcoin-native capital markets could look like: synthetic exposure, structured products, and treasury-style use cases, designed to remain self-custodial once the technology matures.

For anyone trying to understand the differences between competing Ark protocol implementations—this episode is a must-watch. Highly recommend a side-by-side comparison with last week's episode with Steven Roose as well.

This episode of Bitcoin Rails is powered by:

- Best In Slot — the leading API for Ordinals and BRC-20 data aggregation and indexing.

- Spark — a statechains implementation advancing Bitcoin-powered payments.

- Citrea — a leading Bitcoin rollup technology and BitVM alliance contributor.

📌 Timestamps:

00:00 Intro

01:45 Alex’s Early Bitcoin Journey

02:59 Scaling Bitcoin and Community Involvement

08:11 Blockstream and the Block Size Wars

14:25 Transition to Bitcoin Magazine

21:10 Joining Arkade and Future Prospects

41:09 Key Difference Between Arkade and Second

43:59 Off-Chain Transactions and Operator Risks

46:11 Bitcoin Native Assets and Programmability

51:29 Synthetic Assets and Financial Products

56:01 Challenges and Opportunities in Bitcoin Programmability

01:04:38 Past and Future of Bitcoin Programmability

Optimizing Bitcoin for Medium of Exchange

Tue, 09 Dec 2025 16:27:37 GMT

“Payments are the north star. Bitcoin is money, so payments need to work.”

The Ark protocol is widely considered one of the most promising Layer-2 architectures in Bitcoin today—one of maybe two or three that are 'Maxi-approved' due to its unique (and rare) permissionless exit feature.

Former Blockchain engineer Steven Roose (& CEO of Ark implementation 2ndbtc has been working on Ark since nearly day one, after connecting with Ark's somewhat infamous creator, Burak, while working on Blockstream’s Liquid sidechain in 2022.

What began as an early company pushing the new protocol forward eventually evolved into two distinct implementations— 2ndbtc and Ark Labs—with notable cultural and technical differences between the projects.

In this episode of Bitcoin Rails, Steven and I got a chance to discuss the full history and evolution of this new leading protocol, including:

- How Ark was largely inspired by inefficiencies in Lightning (and how Lightning and Ark may complement one another today)

- How the Ark project, initially led by Burak, bifurcated into two distinct implementations (2ndbtc and Arkade), and the differences between them

- How the protocol has evolved to avoid dependence on soft forks (and how CTV activation could fix the biggest UX challenge in Ark’s current design)

- Steven’s personal insights working with Blockstream on Liquid and why Bitcoin sidechains have historically struggled to gain adoption

This episode is fairly technical, covering quite a bit of inside baseball on the early origins of the Ark protocol. I'll be hosting Alex Berge on the show's season finale next week for a more in-depth look at Arkade - and to balance the playing field. Stay tuned for Ark-mania on Bitcoin Rails.

This episode of Bitcoin Rails is powered by:

- Best In Slot — the leading API for Ordinals and BRC-20 data aggregation and indexing.

- Spark — a statechains implementation advancing Bitcoin-powered payments.

- Citrea — the leading Bitcoin rollup technology and BitVM alliance contributor.

📌 Timestamps:

00:00 Intro

01:06 Background on Ark Founders and Liquid

02:29 Liquid and Its Challenges

06:19 Why Liquid Didn’t Take Off

11:28 The Birth of Ark and Its Innovations

13:57 Original Ideas Behind Ark

17:27 Ark Technical TLDR

31:29 UX and the Future of Ark

36:55 The Hacker House That Started Ark for Steven

42:17 An Unexpected Crisis

46:12 Second: A New Beginning For Ark

59:05 Programmability vs Payments in Ark

Why You Can’t Stop SPAM on Bitcoin | with Peter Todd

Tue, 02 Dec 2025 14:00:01 GMT

"You cannot prevent arbitrary data from being published in Bitcoin transactions. Even at the consensus level… It’s mathematically impossible.”

Legendary Bitcoin contributor since 2009 and self-described "weirdo with a fine arts degree," Peter Todd joins me to unpack the endless wars over Bitcoin's "true purpose," his pioneering work putting "spam" on the blockchain, and why he believes attempts to filter transactions are just “silly.”

In this episode, we get deep into the history of using Bitcoin for data storage - which goes back, at least, to the development of Namecoin in 2011. Relatedly, we cover the history and long-fought governance battles around OP_RETURN, relay policy and our community's evolving definitions of "arbitrary data."

Suffice it to say, the Filter Wars of 2024/25 are not new… they are simply one battle in a decade+ war we unpack in detail in this context-rich episode of Bitcoin Rails.

In more detail, this episode covers:

- The development of Open Time Stamps + Bitcoin's use in validating election data and beyond.

- OPRETURN battles of the early days… and how its use has evolved over the past decade.

- Why Bitcoin Core "should not try to censor transactions" and the "performance art project" (Libre Relay) that shows why.

- Bitcoin as a "replicated database" and why blockchains may legitimately be useful outside of sound money.

- Why preventing arbitrary data on Bitcoin is "mathematically impossible" …and trying to stop it is only distracting us from "more important" efforts, like the Great Consensus Cleanup @darosior.

This episode of Bitcoin Rails is powered by:

- Best In Slot — the leading API for Ordinals and BRC-20 data aggregation and indexing.

- Spark — a statechains implementation advancing Bitcoin-powered payments.

- Citrea — the leading Bitcoin rollup technology and BitVM alliance contributor.

Timestamps:

00:00 Intro

01:19 Bitcoin Early Days

03:44 OpenTimestamps Project

12:22 Governance and Bitcoin Protocol Debates

26:36 The Blockchain Use Case Argument

35:46 Transaction Version Numbers and Standardization

38:30 Preventing Exploits and DDoS Attacks

40:10 Relay Policies and Economic Decisions

42:00 The Taproot Annex and OP_RETURN

45:07 Libre Relay

01:01:18 Future of Bitcoin and Soft Fork Proposals

Bitcoin's Cypherpunk Roots: Getting Security Through Privacy | With Obi Nwosu

Thu, 20 Nov 2025 16:00:01 GMT

“You can get security in two ways in this world: through power or through privacy.”

Obi Nwosu, co-founder of Fedi - the largest application layer built on top of e-cash protocol Fedimint - joins me on the show to discuss its role in protecting what he argues is the single most important feature of digital money: Privacy.

Self-custody alone, he argues, “is not enough” for protection against attacks by those with resources and physical power — e.g. governments or anyone able to execute force against you.

While the most privileged democratic societies have remained relatively safe from government seizure in recent history - this could change at any moment - as financial surveillance and resulting censorship of political expression is gaining steam.

Of course, for the world’s most vulnerable users of money — those living under the reign of authoritarian governments or other non-democratic principalities — censorship, seizure and political and financial oppression are regular threats rendering privacy critical for survival.

In this episode, Obi and I cover:

-Bitcoin’s cypherpunk roots and the vision of private e-cash mints on top of Bitcoin, nearly from day 1

-Why privacy and security go hand-in-hand - and why security without privacy is ultimately a lame duck

-Why e-cash protocols like Fedimint are likely the most practical privacy protocols in the Bitcoin scaling world right now

-How activists and civilians are using Fedi to escape financial and political oppression throughout the global south

A powerful interview for those who want to more deeply understand the true purpose of Bitcoin and its cypherpunk roots, it’s worth spending some time with this one.

This episode of Bitcoin Rails is powered by:

- Best In Slot — the leading API for Ordinals and BRC-20 data aggregation and indexing.

- Spark — a statechains implementation advancing Bitcoin-powered payments.

- Citrea — the leading Bitcoin rollup technology and BitVM alliance contributor.

📌 Timestamps

00:00 Intro

01:04 Background and Early Bitcoin Involvement

03:32 Challenges and Innovations in Bitcoin Privacy

06:10 The Importance of Privacy in a Free Society

28:03 Global Privacy Concerns and Future Outlook

40:46 Community Conversations and Functionalities

42:41 Diving Back into Technical Details

43:10 Real-World Applications and Challenges

44:39 Simplifying User Experience

47:20 Federation and Social Backup Mechanisms

01:11:25 Concluding Thoughts and Future Vision

How to Stake Bitcoin Natively | with David Tse

Thu, 13 Nov 2025 14:30:00 GMT

“99% of Bitcoin is held idle, not because of lack of interest, but because of lack of trust.”

Not long after Ordinals (and BRC20) revitalized the “Bitcoin DeFi” narrative, Babylon Labs seemingly leapt onto the scene with what felt like overnight success – locking several billion dollars of TVL in its “trustless Bitcoin staking” protocol.

With some of the most interesting advisors and contributors in the space (…seriously, what other projects can claim both Domo and Robin Linus as collaborators?), Babylon quickly became a “BTC-Fi” Goliath – converting both Bitcoin Season 2 types and formerly staunch ETH maxis alike.

In this episode, I sit down with creator David Tse to get the protocol's birth story - and learn how POS staking became the first truly trustless Bitcoin DeFi application in the world.

In this episode, we cover:

- Why smaller POS chains need better security… and how Bitcoin liquidity may be the answer to securing experimental chains in smaller ecosystems

- How David’s former experiences in the Cosmos ecosystem informed the core thesis of using Bitcoin to secure smaller chains

- A quick breakdown of Babylon’s staking architecture - and what exactly makes it “trustless”

- Babylon’s relationship with BitVM, and the team’s lesser known contributions to both BitVM2 and BitVM3 (Fun Fact: David Tse is Robin Linus's PhD advisor at Stanford 🧑‍🎓)

- Why Bitcoiners didn’t want to stake their Bitcoin for yield until now… and how the "trustlessness" thesis is already panning out (with 1 whale dropping a whopping 10K Bitcoin in the protocol just a few months back!)

Bitcoin Rails is powered by:

- Best In Slot — the leading API for Ordinals and BRC-20 data aggregation and indexing.

- Spark — a Statechains implementation advancing Bitcoin-powered payments.

- Citrea — the leading Bitcoin rollup technology and BitVM alliance contributor.

Timestamps

00:00 Intro

00:38 Bitcoin++ Insights

01:52 David’s Background and Information Theory

05:34 Journey into Bitcoin and Blockchain

07:34 Scaling Bitcoin with Prism Protocol

10:38 Babylon and Cosmos Ecosystem

13:51 Bitcoin Staking and Security Mechanisms

24:49 The Importance of Reputation in Crypto

25:51 Partners and Announcements Break

27:25 Profile of Babylon Stakers

29:17 The Grand Vision for Babylon

32:40 Garbled Circuits and Secret Revelation

44:05 Trustless Bitcoin Vaults and Future Prospects

Arbitrary Data Wars: The Rise of Node Power in Bitcoin | with Matt Hill

Thu, 06 Nov 2025 16:15:00 GMT

Matt Hill, CEO of Start9 — which is, as of this recording, the largest distributor of retail Bitcoin nodes (aka “pleb nodes”) — joins me to unpack the biggest underlying question of 2025: Who really holds power in enforcing (or disincentivizing) storage of arbitrary data on Bitcoin?

Unsurprisingly, Start9 has seen an epic leap in sales with the popularization of Knots as more and more “plebs” are choosing to run nodes for the first time — not only for the purpose of running Bitcoin in a sovereign manner, but for the purpose of expressing their political views about how the protocol should run.

As Core and Knots diverge on relay policy and proposals like “BIP 444” reignite the question of what belongs on-chain, this episode explores how Bitcoin’s technical infrastructure shapes and is shaped by culture, systemic power dynamics, and how the political apparatus of Bitcoin functionally operates.

Additionally, this is my first attempt to represent the “Knots” side of the argument on this show. Suffice it to say, get ready for some spicy takes all around— as Matt and I ourselves attempt to demonstrate productive communication from different sides of the political aisle.

In more detail, this episode explores:

1) Bitcoin’s role in the proliferation of “sovereign computing” and the special role of node runners in affecting Bitcoin governance

2) The 5 major “political parties” of Bitcoin: aka the core political players that ultimately influence both relay policy and consensus

3) Key history of the “arbitrary data wars” and how Luke Dash jr changed the conversation with his initial “bug fix” PR in the aftermath of the Ordinals boom

4) Views on different usecases for arbitrary data (e.g. BitVM vs Ordinals)

5) Matt’s spot on prediction of a “contentious soft fork” proposal (for context, we filmed this less than 2 weeks before the announcement of Luke’s divisive “BIP 444” proposal)

This episode of Bitcoin Rails is powered by:

- Best In Slot (@bestinslotxyz) — the leading API for Ordinals and BRC-20 data aggregation and indexing

- Spark (@lightspark) — a Statechains implementation leading the path toward institutional adoption of Bitcoin-powered payments

- Citrea (@citrea_xyz) — the leading Bitcoin rollup technology and contributor to the BitVM alliance

📌 Timestamps

00:00 Intro

01:16 Understanding Start9 and Its Political Implications

03:59 The Evolution of Computing Paradigms

08:01 Challenges and Solutions in Cloud Computing

35:49 The Role of Nodes in Bitcoin

37:36 Fork Scenarios and Consensus Rules

39:40 Economic Nodes and Fork Wars

44:36 Challenges with Bitcoin Nodes

01:09:33 The Birth of Knots as we Know it

01:10:23 Start9 and Open Source Software

01:12:44 Relay Policies and Arbitrary Data

01:19:50 Future of Bitcoin Governance

The Bull Case for Statechains & Why Big Tech Wants Self-Custody Too | with Kevin Hurley

Tue, 28 Oct 2025 15:00:00 GMT

It was about four years ago that Facebook’s famous effort at creating its own cryptocurrency and crypto-native payments system (Libra, then Diem) was effectively halted by an unending stream of regulatory scrutiny and compliance blocks.

Some leaders of the project went on to create crypto-projects of their own (e.g. SUI and Aptos), however, “Head of Facebook Financial” @davidmarcus, along with Diem wallet technical lead Kevin Hurley made the key bet that Bitcoin’s decentralized rails were the only in the crypto space likely to be undisrupted by regulatory roadblocks longterm.

They went on to create Lightspark - initially designed to make Lightning “usable” by enterprise payments companies - but ultimately came to the conclusion that Lightning alone was not going to scale to 8 Billion people globally.

After heavy research on scaling solutions for Bitcoin, they eventually developed a “statechains” layer-2 solution of their own Spark – which, since going live, has garnered attention from Ordinals degens to enterprise payments companies alike.

In this episode, Kevin Hurley and I get into:

— How the Libra/Diem regulatory blocks went down and why these concerns will likely only be addressed by a truly decentralized system like Bitcoin (+ self-custody on the wallets side)

— Why Lightspark started building on the Lightning Network (raising more than 2X field leader Lightning Labs), but developed serious concerns about its ability to scale

— What a multi-system Bitcoin scaling future might look like: with Lightning as the liquidity provider feeding self-custody friendly systems like Spark, Ark, e-cash systems, and more.

—What a multi-system Bitcoin scaling future might look like: with Lightning as the liquidity provider feeding self-custody friendly systems like Spark, Ark, e-cash systems, and more.

Bitcoin Rails is powered by:

— Best In Slot (@bestinslotxyz) – the leading API for Ordinals and BRC-20 data aggregation and indexing

— Spark (@lightspark) – a Statechains implementation leading the path toward institutional adoption of Bitcoin-powered payments

— Citrea (@citrea_xyz) – the leading Bitcoin rollup technology and contributor to the BitVM alliance

📌 Timestamps

00:00 Intro

00:26 How Lightspark came to life

03:41 Lessons from Libra and Diem

08:35 Universal Money Addresses and global payments

13:45 How traditional finance is approaching blockchain adoption

33:08 The core challenge of Lightning

37:53 Exploring alternatives: ARC and Statechains

40:18 How Statechains work and their benefits

56:43 The future of Lightning and Spark’s role

The Two Forces That Could Break Bitcoin: AI vs Quantum with MartinShkreli

Wed, 15 Oct 2025 14:30:00 GMT

A couple months ago, I co-hosted an X space with Layer Two Labs re: “Should Bitcoiners care about quantum computing?”

You can imagine our surprise when (in?)famous tech investor Martin Shkreli arrived to share that he’s been researching this very question for years… and dropped that he’s been personally considering raising funds to hire a team of mathematicians to hack Satoshi’s Coins.

In this episode, Martin and I explore the limits of Bitcoin’s security model and the two forces he believes could potentially challenge it: a computational path driven by advances in quantum hardware, and/or a mathematical path fueled by AI-assisted discovery.

This interview additionally shares takes on:

- Why hacking Bitcoin would be the "ultimate" mathematical achievement—and why hacking Satoshi’s coins should be considered a “bug bounty” for Bitcoin

- Why quantum may be more problematic for Bitcoin than for the traditional tech world (e.g. why quantum doesn’t likely threaten NVIDIA)

- The little known history of Bitcoin’s “overflow bug” (yup, Bitcoin *has* been hacked before… an exploit corrected by hard fork).

- And of course, why mathematicians do their deepest work in prison 😉

As always, this episode of Bitcoin Rails can be viewed on YouTube or Spotify via the link available in my bio—and is brought to you with the help of my incredible partners:

- Best In Slot – the leading API for Ordinals and BRC20 data aggregation and indexing

- Spark – a statechains implementation leading the path towards institutional adoption of Bitcoin-powered payments

- Citrea – the leading Bitcoin rollup technology and contributor to the BitVM alliance

📷 Timestamps

00:00 Intro

02:57 Quantum Supremacy and Google’s Breakthroughs

05:02 Bitcoin’s Cryptographic Vulnerabilities

08:24 Studying Math and Cryptography Behind Bars

20:04 Governance and the Culture of Bitcoin Development

26:29 The Future of Quantum and AI in Cryptography

37:42 Hardware Challenges and Fidelity in Quantum

47:57 Game Theory and the Quantum Race

01:04:08 Bitcoin Recovery and the Quantum Security Question

01:08:38 Mathematical Challenges in Breaking Cryptography

01:15:08 The Role of AI in Future Mathematical Breakthroughs

The Birth of BRC2.0: Bitcoin’s Programmable Asset Layer | with Best In Slot CEO, Binari

Tue, 07 Oct 2025 11:30:00 GMT

Programmable BRC20 tokens, dubbed “BRC2.0,” launched a few short weeks ago after more than a year of building and anticipation.

This effort was spearheaded by BRC20 lead-maintainer team Best In Slot, who joined the BRC20 core team after their development of open source Ordinals indexer “OPI,” and solidifying their title as a leading Ordinals infrastructure provider.

In this episode, I sat down with Best In Slot CEO, Binari, to hear the birth story of “BRC2.0,” and learn how the ground was laid for programmable native assets on Bitcoin within a few short months of BRC20's launch in 2023.

Having worked closely with this team and on this protocol via Layer 1 Foundation for almost two years now, this interview is particularly close to my heart.

A must-watch for any Ordinals-historians out there, I can’t wait to hear your thoughts on this little-known history of BRC20, and the future of “BRC2.0.”

Shouts out in this episode to Domo, UniSat wallet, Sats Names and other key figures in the development of Ordinals-based metaprotocols.

In this episode, we cover:

- How the idea of programmable BRC20 assets (and programmable native assets in general) was born shortly after the launch of BRC20 in late 2023

- Why Domo connected with the Best In Slot team early on in BRC20’s history, and advocated for their inclusion as core maintainers of the protocol next to marketplace UniSat wallet

- The truth about the BRC20 “indexer wars” and why “he who holds the users, holds the power”

- Why Best In Slot refused millions in venture funding despite being one of the most highly valued companies in the Ordinals space over the last three years

- How BRC2.0 will differentiate itself by focusing on institutional-grade financial use-cases… and not the low-hanging fruit of meme coins.

This episode is powered by:

- Best In Slot, the leading API for Ordinals and BRC20 data aggregation and indexing

- Spark, a statechains implementation leading the path towards institutional adoption of Bitcoin-powered payments

- Citrea, the leading Bitcoin Rollup technology and contributor to the BitVM alliance

📍 Timestamps

00:00 Intro

00:52 Bitcoin as a time machine & new way of thinking about time

02:32 Launching BRC 2.0 & building a minimum viable ecosystem

05:00 TLDR: What is BRC 2.0?

05:31 Ordinals & the return to Bitcoin building

08:00 First exposure to Ethereum at Burning Man

10:16 Indexing, NFTs, and DeFi vision for scale

11:57 India trip, Ordinals hype, and rediscovering Bitcoin

15:33 Canonical indexers & why they matter for protocols

21:03 Early BRC 20 experiments & hype cycle

40:02 BRC 2.0 mainnet launch

54:07 Future of Best in Slot & Bitcoin applications

ordinals #BRC20

The Developer That Brought Back Bitcoin's Forgotten Code | With Ethan Heilman

Fri, 26 Sep 2025 12:00:00 GMT

As interest in Bitcoin Layer 2s skyrockets, the inclusion of OP_CAT — an opcode enabling concatenation of elements in the Bitcoin stack — has become a key technical upgrade to watch for its potential in the development of trustless bridges.

OP_CAT co-author @ethan_Heilman and I sat down to discuss debate around this opcode — including why it’s controversial, the cultural environment shaping its future, and why some worry its broad expressivity could pose “unknown risks” to Bitcoin over time.

More recently, Ethan co-authored BIP 360 with @cryptoquick — another controversial proposal aimed at addressing Bitcoin’s quantum vulnerabilities.

Suffice it to say, there are few people with Ethan's experience in navigating Bitcoin politics and its shifting governance landscape as we move towards ossification over time.

In this episode, we cover:

- The origins of OP_CAT and why it was included and removed from early Bitcoin

- What makes OP_CAT so powerful (and why that worries some developers)

- Cultural shifts in Bitcoin governance as its developer community matures

- The ‘great covenants debate’ + OPCAT vs. CTV- The path to BIP 360 and why Bitcoin should be ‘quantum ready’

This episode is powered by:

- Best In Slot (@bestinslotxyz), the leading API for Ordinals and BRC20 data aggregation and indexing

- Spark (@lightspark), a statechains implementation leading the path towards institutional adoption of Bitcoin-powered payments

- Citrea (@citrea_xyz), the leading Bitcoin Rollup technology and contributor to the BitVM alliance

📍 Timestamps

00:00 – Intro

00:45 – Bitcoin Privacy and the OP_CAT Proposal

03:18 – Technical Challenges of Adding New Opcodes

07:37 – Politics and Culture of Bitcoin Upgrades

28:46 – Quantum Computing Meets Bitcoin

37:48 – How Governments View Quantum Risk

39:06 – Breaking Down BIP 360 for Developers

42:03 – Post-Quantum Signature Schemes Explained

45:18 – Trade-offs in Quantum Security for Bitcoin

53:16 – Community Reactions to BIP 360

01:00:23 – The Future of Bitcoin in a Post Quantum World

The Untold Story of the Lightning Network | with Tadge Dyja

Thu, 18 Sep 2025 15:30:00 GMT

Co-creator of the Lightning Network, inventor of DLCs, and author of Utreexo—Tadge Dryja is easily one of the most influential developers in Bitcoin’s history.

After co-authoring the Lightning Network paper in 2015—leading to the development of what is still easily the most well funded and widely adopted Bitcoin L2 in the world—Tadge continued with some of the most influential Bitcoin research in the world, including but not limited to:

Discreet Log Contracts or DLCs—the only tech currently usable for truly decentralized Bitcoin lending.

Utreexo—which compresses Bitcoin’s UTXO set, enabling syncing by devices as small as a mobile phone,

And most recently, his quantum-resistance focused proposal “Lifeboat,” which creates a path for quantum securing Bitcoin without the need for moving wallets or introducing new/experimental PQC into Bitcoin.

By far and away my favorite part of this episode was the incredible history of the development of Lightning and the characters involved. If you’re a Bitcoin history nerd, or generally want to understand some of the most influential technology in the space, this episode is not to be missed.

This episode is powered by:

-Best In Slot, the leading API for Ordinals and BRC20 data aggregation and indexing

-Spark, a statechains implementation leading the path towards institutional adoption of Bitcoin-powered payments

-Citrea, the leading Bitcoin Rollup technology and contributor to the BitVM alliance

📌 Timestamps

00:00 – Introduction

02:26 – Tad’s Early Bitcoin Journey

13:21 – Can We Do That on Bitcoin?

19:12 – Scaling Bitcoin: The Lightning Network Paper

23:01 – Founding Lightning Labs & Early Challenges

27:11 – Joining MIT’s Digital Currency Initiative

30:11 – DLCs, Stablecoins & the UTXO Model

36:31 – Leaving Lightning Labs & Node Implementations

50:45 – UTXO, Chain State & Data Pruning

59:43 – Exploring Accumulators and UTreeXO

01:08:39 – Quantum Security, the Lifeboat Proposal & Future Directions

Bitcoin’s Security & Quantum Risks—and the Future of Satoshi’s Coins | with Jameson Lopp

Thu, 11 Sep 2025 13:30:00 GMT

“Most people don’t think about security until it’s too late,” says the Casa co-founder and CSO.

One of the most prolific thought-leaders in Bitcoin security and privacy, there are few people who understand the nuances of Bitcoin security quite as deeply - not to mention the OPSEC practices required to protect against wrench attacks, for instance, which are rising globally as Bitcoin price increases.

More recently, Lopp has turned his attention to mitigating Bitcoin’s quantum vulnerabilities, including market risks associated with quantum-vulnerable Satoshi’s Coins + longer-term strategies for quantum-hardening of Bitcoin addresses long term.

In this special episode of Bitcoin Rails, we cover:

► Lopp’s experiences designing self-custody products at both BitGo and Casa

► The swatting attack he suffered in 2017, and the radical steps he’s taken to secure his home location since

► The ‘quantum computing’ challenge for Bitcoin and its impacts on Satoshi’s Coins

► How the network may respond to QCs in the face of ossification and why QC preparation may be the hardest governance test the network has ever faced

This episode is powered by:

▻ Best In Slot, the leading API for Ordinals and BRC20 data aggregation and indexing

▻ Spark, a statechains implementation leading the path towards institutional adoption of Bitcoin-powered payments

▻ Citrea, the leading Bitcoin Rollup technology and contributor to the BitVM alliance.

📌 Timestamps

00:00 – Intro: Quantum Computing Meets Bitcoin

00:19 – Jameson Lopp on the Bitcoin Rails

00:53 – The Quantum Threat to Bitcoin Security

06:32 – Lopp’s Path into Bitcoin & Security

12:58 – The Swatting Attack During the Block Size Wars

25:28 – Could Quantum Crack Satoshi’s Coins?

43:55 – Announcements & Sponsors Messages

45:30 – Building Bitcoin’s Quantum Resistance

47:00 – QBTC and the Push for Quantum-Resistant Bitcoin

48:43 – Why Changing Bitcoin Is So Hard

51:19 – Email Protocols, Ossification, and Bitcoin’s Future

01:01:53 – A Roadmap for Quantum Resistance

History of Drivechains & the Problem with Bitcoin Governance | with Paul Sztorc

Wed, 27 Aug 2025 14:00:00 GMT

We love gleefully controversial figures on this show—and Paul Sztorc is no exception.

One of the most outspoken and alternative thinkers in Bitcoin, Paul proposed BIP300/301—a softfork mechanizing the creation and removal of trustless Bitcoin sidechains, aka “Drivechains,” in late 2022.

While the proposal received diverse reception from prominent Bitcoiners “across the aisle,” it’s clear that activating such a significant change to Bitcoin—when Core itself can barely push through minor relay policy changes without blowback—will be an uphill battle at best.

Paul’s social and political experiences throughout this process reflect what he calls a key Bitcoin “derangement,” that is, a cultural and ideological challenge impeding Bitcoin’s effective development.

We discuss these “derangements” - along with how he and Layer Two Labs plan to handle them - in depth on the show.

This episode is powered by Best In Slot, the leading API for Ordinals and BRC20 data aggregation and indexing — as well as Citrea, a leading Bitcoin Rollup technology and contributor to the BitVM alliance.

📌 Timestamps

00:00 – Intro

01:39 – Libertarian Roots and Early Bitcoin Skepticism

17:45 – Peter Schiff’s Crisis Explanation

20:15 – The Silk Road Article That Convinced Paul

32:40 – The Birth of Truthcoin

38:08 – Challenges and Shifts in Blockchain Development

42:45 – Drivechain: Concept and Controversies

01:11:40 – Bitcoin Governance and BIP 300/301

01:46:56 – Layer Two Labs: Innovations and Privacy

01:51:49 – Governance Challenges in Bitcoin

01:59:29 – Future of Drivechain and Final Thoughts

02:07:57 – Ordinalization of Soft Forks

02:11:35 – Message to Core Devs and Final Thoughts

How Rare Pepes Took Over Bitcoin’s Meme Culture | with Rare Scrilla

Thu, 14 Aug 2025 14:16:58 GMT

There are few people on the planet more deeply entrenched in ‘Bitcoin Art’ than Rare Scrilla - and few people more influential in its culture and adoption.

A key figure in "Rare Pepe" culture, Scrilla pioneered the "Fake Rares" movement, igniting a significant surge in demand for Counterparty assets in late 2021 - nearly eight years after he began recording Bitcoin-inspired hip-hop, influenced by the Silk Road, in 2014.

Scrilla has written and recorded multiple Bitcoin-inspired albums, including Sound Money, which became the first original album inscribed on Bitcoin - as well as the first original song on Bitcoin, a sub-1K inscription.

From Counterparty, to Pepes, to Ordinals and beyond - Scrilla and I explore the unique history of Bitcoin art culture over the past decade - and the wildly underrated influence of Bitcoin on the development of “NFTs.”

----------------------------------

Arbitrary Data Wars: The next Block Size Wars? + Bitcoin’s Latest Identity Crisis | with Pete Rizzo

Thu, 07 Aug 2025 14:53:17 GMT

The Bitcoin Historian Pete Rizzo has been chronicling Bitcoin longer than almost anyone.

Former editor at CoinDesk and Bitcoin Magazine (and more recently the Bitcoin anchor Blockworks), Pete seems to be close to the helm of *the* top crypto media publication at any given time.

-------------------------------------------------------------------

In this episode of Bitcoin Rails, Pete and I sit down to unpack the cultural rifts surfacing in Bitcoin — primarily around the use of Bitcoin for storing "arbitrary data," as is common for developing metaprotocols and Bitcoin Layer 2s.

We dive deep into the heart of this rift — and why the use of Bitcoin for data availability is so triggering to some, while others see its expanded use as THE technical feature pushing Bitcoin forward.

We also discuss the origins of Bitcoin maximalism, the unresolved pain of scaling debates, and the growing tension between economic incentives, protocol change, and the shifting power of Bitcoin Core developers.

Is another fork wars potentially on the table? Who ACTUALLY runs Bitcoin? Are just some of the questions we debate in this episode.

-------------------------------------------------------------------

Bitcoin Lending | With Fred Krueger and Ben Sigman

Wed, 30 Jul 2025 19:08:03 GMT

Fred Krueger has always “followed the money” from Finance in the 80s, to software in the 90s, to the internet in 00s… and finally, to Bitcoin.A self-described “opportunist,” it was the networks-effects argument that ultimately set Fred on a heavy Bitcoin-focused path—and more recently opened his eyes to the possibility that “fast chains” too will disrupt the fiat system permanently.In this episode of Bitcoin Rails, I sat down with Fred and his Bitcoin experimentation partner Ben Sigman to discuss their contrarian takes on “what makes Bitcoin tick” and why Bitcoin lending and "fast chain" stables will fundamentally facelift Bitcoin’s long-term adoption.Is it possible that Stables could be a gateway drug for Bitcoin? While money maxis continue not-so-successfully to make fast Bitcoin payments a thing… perhaps the true path for Bitcoin adoption is in embracing the smooth, fast UX of stables on chains like Solana… and watching this techno-behavioral shift open the door to mainstream Bitcoin adoption.This episode is powered by Best In Slot (@bestinslotxyz), the leading API for Ordinals and BRC20 data aggregation and indexing—as well as Citrea (@citrea_xyz), a leading 'Bitcoin Rollup' technology and core contributor to the BitVM alliance.TIMESTAMPS:____00:55 Fred Krueger: an opportunist from Wall Street04:58 Meeting Brock Pierce in 2013, talking Bitcoin08:20 Fred’s 2016 Bitcoin Mixer09:45 Ben, the dark web, and Bitcoin11:08 Fading Bitcoin; longing EOS13:23 Tom Lee convinces Fred of $1 Million BTC17:55 There is no second best21:30 Bitcoin ETFs: When Fred blew up on Twitter23:13 What the bears didn’t get about the Bitcoin ETFs24:30 The “wall of money” coming for Bitcoin26:00 Fred’s next interest: Bitcoin Power Law29:40 Building a Bitcoin wallet and the reality of BTC adoption34:08 Ordinals, art, and experimentation on Bitcoin38:30 Domain names on Bitcoin41:07 Bitcoin mortgages: what maxis really want44:00 Will there be Bitcoin mortgages supported by the government?45:50 A new Bitcoin vault system for borrowing against BTC50:00 A two-sided lending marketplace for BTC53:10 Earning yield on stablecoins was the story of 202054:15 WTF is StupidCoin?56:30 Fred’s memecoins and Bitcoin maxi outrage59:10 Trump enters the memecoin game01:00:00 Coming to appreciate Solana01:01:35 Gambling is the “booster” for crypto01:03:30 Will BTC ever be a unit of account?01:04:30 Is Solana marketable to 8 billion people?01:05:30 Most people will use Solana for stablecoins01:06:50 Will there be a “tokenization of everything?”01:08:00 The first mass market will be crypto, not bitcoin01:10:00 Bitcoin will win - so will fast blockchains

Protecting Bitcoin From "MEVIL" | With Matt Corallo

Wed, 23 Jul 2025 19:34:44 GMT

After starting full-time in Bitcoin straight out of college (as a co-founder of Blockstream… NBD) Matt Corallo is one of the most long-standing and prolific Bitcoin contributors in the world, having worked on several of its most influential projects—including Lightning, Stratum V2, the original sidechains paper, and more.That being said, he’s arguably best-known in recent history for sounding the alarms about potential risk vectors for miner centralization—including the risks of “Miner Extractable Value,” aka “MEV” or “MEVIL” (not-so-affectionately).MEV, of course, is a subject that most Bitcoiners haven’t spent much time thinking about. Widely considered an “Ethereum problem,” most diehard maxis ignore the potential of “Ethereum-style” MEV on Bitcoin—despite rapid development of the technologies that could easily bring these risks to Bitcoin sooner rather than later (think: trustless bridges and “Bitcoin DeFi”).In this episode, Matt breaks down:-What MEV actually is—and how/why it could be coming to Bitcoin-How Bitcoin can protect itself against these risks—and may have a leg up relative to Ethereum-Matt’s work on Stratum V2 and the development of decentralized mining pool tech-The complex influence of Ocean Mining—and whether or not they're “succeeding”-Matt’s plea to enact the Blockchain Regulatory Certainty Act—and the future of Bitcoin development without itAs always, you can view this episode on YouTube or Spotify via the linktree in my bio. This episode is powered by Best In Slot (@bestinslotxyz), the leading API for Ordinals and BRC20 data aggregation and indexing—as well as Citrea (@citrea_xyz), a leading 'Bitcoin Rollup' technology and core contributor to the BitVM alliance. TIMESTAMPS:___01:25 Matt Corallo: Discovering Bitcoin in High School05:00 The Wizards Chat: The OG Idea Space for Bitcoin07:00 Contributing to Bitcoin Core08:15 Becoming 1 of 11 Blockstream “co-founders”13:10 Blockstream’s Goals: Helping Bitcoin Grow15:00 Researching Decentralized Bitcoin Sidechains18:30 How the Liquid Sidechain was born20:40 Lightning Network and payment channels explained26:00 Matt’s exit from Blockstream to Chaincode Labs28:15 Working with Chaincode Labs31:00 Moving to Spiral: Jack Dorsey’s Bitcoin Company33:15 Making Bitcoin the “best money”36:00 Building Lightning Development Kit (LDK)37:00 Matt’s Concerns w/ Mining Centralization39:20 Creating a Decentralized Mining Pool42:27 Stratum v2 vs Stratum v145:00 Will OCEAN see a competitor in decentralized mining?48:30 Matt’s optimism about solving miner centralization50:30 What is Miner Extractable Value (MEV) on Bitcoin?54:00 How MEV creates economies of scale for mining55:00 Flashbots attempt to solve MEV on Ethereum57:50 The downside: Ethereum is losing censorship resistance59:30 How MEV could crush pools like OCEAN01:01:20 What happens to mining when programmable Bitcoin arrives?01:04:10 A potential solution: MEVPool01:07:40 Weaknesses of this model01:09:30 Are Bitcoiners even aware of the MEV problem?01:12:45 The Blockchain Regulatory Certainty Act01:14:00 Who in crypto counts as a “money transmitter?”01:15:30 Changing the law for non-custodial entities

Orange Pilling Crypto With Cats and Wizards | With Udi Wertheimer

Tue, 15 Jul 2025 18:01:44 GMT

One of the most influential voices in “Bitcoin Season II,” Udi Wertheimer is one of the most controversial and, perhaps, most misunderstood figures in the Bitcoin community broadly. A self-identified “survivor” of Bitcoin maximalism, Udi’s critiques of Bitcoin-only tribalism – and the suppression of nuanced discussion that arises as a result – made him the perfect spokesperson for post-Ordinals Bitcoiners looking for someone to represent their “Bitcoin-first” rather than “Bitcoin-only” views.

Inspired by Ordinals, Udi and partner @ercwl founded @TaprootWizards – one of the most unique and enigmatic companies in Bitcoin – with a broad mandate to “onboard crypto users to Bitcoin… by any means necessary.”

From launching two of the most popular Ordinals collections in the world – to campaigning for progressive Bitcoin opcodes (i.e. CAT) – Udi and the Wizards relentlessly orange pill the most maxi-neglected low-hanging fruit… non-Bitcoin crypto users.

As always, you can view this episode on YouTube or Spotify via the linktree in my bio.

This episode is powered by Best In Slot (@bestinslotxyz), the leading API for Ordinals and BRC20 data aggregation and indexing—as well as Citrea (@citrea_xyz), a leading 'Bitcoin Rollup' technology and core contributor to the BitVM alliance.

Timestamps:

00:20 Udi: The Bitcoin Maxi “Cult Survivor”

03:10 Maxis cheering on Gary Gensler

06:30 Ordinals: Tokens arriving on Bitcoin

08:55 How NFTs helped encourage Bitcoin self-custody

11:40 Making Bitcoin cool again for crypto people

13:55 Why did Udi start the Taproot Wizards company?

16:00 The Wizards’ pitch to investors

18:50 “Successful fundraising” is an oxymoron

20:40 Why did Ryan Dell join the Wizards?

24:00 Taproot Wizards is not strictly an “L2” company

27:00 What went into the Taproot Wizards NFT launch

29:30 The NFT auction and inspiring Solana user participation

32:50 The importance of launching during the bear market

34:30 Every active crypto trader has Phantom wallet

37:10 Cultural differences between Bitcoin, crypto and different wallet users

40:45 Why Udi was impressed by Odin.fun

43:30 Udi is NOT a Runes fan

45:40 Don't be too defeatist about Runes’ failure

47:40 Championing OP_CAT and the Bitcoin Core power vacuum

49:40 Why Bitcoin Core has “failed”

51:35 Bitcoin Core’s weakness around OP-Return drama

55:00 How will Bitcoin devs get things done?

57:40 Udi’s OP_CAT political lobbying effort

01:00:20 Why Udi thinks CTV is unlikely to pass

01:03:40 Robin Linus wanted OP_CAT: What happened?

01:05:30 Were Taproot Wizards a blessing or a curse for OP_CAT?

Building Rollups on Bitcoin + the Battle for OP_Return | with Citrea

Thu, 03 Jul 2025 14:39:00 GMT

BITCOIN RAILS EPISODE #27: Building Rollups on Bitcoin + the Battle for ‘OP_Return’ | with @citrea_xyz founders @0x_orkun and @ekrembal_

The founders of Citrea were unlikely superstars in the Bitcoin ecosystem—a team of 24-year-olds, barely out of school, with most of their prior experience in the Ethereum ecosystem.

Yet they have rapidly emerged as one of the leading teams at the forefront of BitVM research, design, and implementation—and are the crowned BitVM play for Founders Fund (@peterthiel + @joeykrug ) amongst others noteworthy investors in the space.

Their work was more recently noticed by Bitcoin Core developer @darosior who cites Citrea’s use of nonstandard transactions to support its bridge architecture as inspiration for Core’s recent shift in relay policy—and the infamous “Op-ReTuRn DrAmA” that followed suit.

In this episode, we cover Citrea's development of what will likely be the first “proper rollup” on Bitcoin mainnet, as well as their account of "what happened” with Bitcoin Core, the OP_RETURN drama, and their take on @LukeDashjr's vendetta against Bitcoin for data availability.

Other show notes include:

- Why no one took them seriously in the early days of “BitVM” and how they gained respect from the industry

- The practical challenges of building BitVM bridges and the creative attitude that gets them through blocks

- Citrea’s wild fundraising success with Galaxy and Founders Fund

- Why bridge modularity is *not* the approach for Citrea despite peers moving in that direction

- The OP_Return debate and FUD about Bitcoin for DA

As always, you can view this episode on YouTube or Spotify via the linktree in my bio.

This episode is powered by Best In Slot (@bestinslotxyz), the leading API for Ordinals and BRC20 data aggregation and indexing—as well as Citrea (@citrea_xyz ), a leading 'Bitcoin Rollup' technology and core contributor to the BitVM alliance.

TIMESTAMPS:

0:25 Intro to the Citrea team: Orkun and Ekrem

5:40 Proof of Innocence: privacy product on Ethereum

7:30 Why privacy is critical for crypto

9:15 Discovering Ordinals inscriptions on Bitcoin

12:30 Ordinals safe - an OG Ordinals wallet

14:30 Thinking about ZK and rollups on Bitcoin

18:00 The massive discovery of BitVM

21:10 Implementing BitVM and creating a Bitcoin bridge

24:40 Dealing with doubters and “scamming” accusations

26:25 How did Citrea fundraise so well?

29:12 Galaxy’s special understanding of Citrea

31:00 Involvement of Founders Fund

33:37 What exactly is a “real” rollup?

36:55 Citrea and the BitVM Alliance

38:55 Biggest challenges building a BitVM bridge

41:15 Citrea vs Clementine

43:39 Why focus on a single Citrea ecosystem vs modularity?

46:39 Will the Ethereans defect to Bitcoin L2s?

50:40 Troubles with bridging: Dust adds up!

53:10 Time sensitivity and zero sat outputs

56:00 The case for expanding the OP_Return limit

01:01:40 Why we don’t *need* larger OP_Returns

01:03:00 The drama around OP_Return

01:06:21 Takeaways about Citrea and OP_Return Drama

01:09:42 Propaganda against Bitcoin metadata

01:12:55 Being Bearish is Easy

LISTEN / SUBSCRIBE TO THE PODCAST:

› YouTube: / @bitcoinrails

› X/Twitter: https://x.com/isabelfoxenduke

› Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/5uPrBxvD691TpTqjijudkO?si=571634b88d574911&nd=1&dlsi=eab3dc72a2704b06

CONNECT WITH ISABEL:

› Email: bitcoinrails@gmail.com

› LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/isabel-foxen-duke-87272423/

› X/Twitter: https://x.com/isabelfoxenduke

Bitcoin #Ordinals #BRC20 #Runes #BitVM #zkp

The Untold Story of CTV | With Jeremy Rubin

Thu, 26 Jun 2025 15:15:00 GMT

The introduction of covenants to Bitcoin has been a long-standing debate—one recently brought back into consideration with the memetically-driven advocacy of “OP_CAT” by the Taproot Wizards.

In previous history, the most likely contender for a covenants-enabling OP code was “CTV” (check template verify)—a simpler and more narrow way to enable covenants—that, while once considered radical, is now seen as the “conservative choice” relative to CAT.

Serious discussions about implementing CTV have re-emerged with vigor—with many speculating it will be the “likely winner” for a potential covenant soft fork, given its popularity “across the aisles” of Bitcoin Season 1 and 2 players.

This all being said—the full story of CTV has been almost 10 years in the making—with author Jeremy Rubin being put through the ringer of Bitcoin politics along the way.

In this episode, Jeremy and I explore:

-Jeremy’s early experiences with the judicial system after being accused of cybercrimes for web-based work as a student at MIT

-The history of covenants proposals on Bitcoin and their cultural responses in the “Bitcoin Scaling” community

-The development of OP_CTV and its distinctions from other covenants proposals

-His experience navigating the murky waters of Bitcoin governance—and ultimately, the brutal political realities of attempting to upgrade Bitcoin

As always, you can view this episode on YouTube or Spotify via the linktree in my bio—YouTube link in comments as well.

This episode is powered by Best In Slot (@bestinslotxyz), the leading API for Ordinals and BRC20 data aggregation and indexing—as well as Citrea (@citrea_xyz ), a leading 'Bitcoin Rollup' technology and core contributor to the BitVM alliance.

TIMESTAMPS:

01:00 Jeremy Rubin: Child Star Engineer and Libertarian

04:00 Jeremy’s first bitcoin purchase and hackathon

05:50 Subpoenaed by the State of New Jersey

10:30 Receiving support from MIT University

12:50 The first BTC airdrop at MIT!

16:20 Bitcoin VCs and the dawn of the scaling debate

18:40 ‘Scaling Bitcoin’ conference and creation of SegWit

23:50 What inspired CTV and covenants for Jeremy?

25:10 Reactive security wallet: protecting against hackers

27:30 Opposition to covenants and “being like Ethereum”

29:02 What types of covenants do people want?

35:00 Pitching “Bitcoin assets” to Ycombinator

37:00 Emulating covenants with pre-signed transactions

40:40 Why were sidechains not interested in covenants?

41:25 Liquid sidechain’s “major security event.”

43:30 What exactly does CTV do?

45:45 How is CTV different from other covenant proposals?

47:02 Campaigning for covenants - take 2

48:50 CTV is good for lightning!

49:46 How Taproot roadblocked Jeremy’s CTV campaign

55:00 Why does CTV need a supporting language?

57:20 Are there non-Bitcoin supporting languages?

01:00:00 Sapio: a complement to covenants

01:01:10 Did Sapio make CTV a less “conservative” change?

01:04:00 Jeremy’s political strategy for CTV

01:05:55 Marketing campaigns for Bitcoin softforks

01:09:00 Why was CTV so feared, despite Jeremy’s caution?

01:10:00 Andreas Antonopoulos’ influence on CTV FUD

01:12:20 Why Jeremy forfeited the CTV campaign

01:13:10 Re-engineering Sapio to be CTV independent

01:16:00 Reflecting on Bitcoin’s governance issues

01:19:20 Core devs unable to maintain an OP_Return change

01:20:04 How do we get Bitcoin devs to talk to the plebs?

01:24:15 Do devs just not want to be public-facing?

01:25:35 Forget grant programs: give devs seed funding

01:26:55 Where does Chaincode Labs stand out?

The Birth of BitVM and the Fight for "End Game" Money I with Robin Linus

Wed, 18 Jun 2025 20:58:23 GMT

In early 2024, independent developer Robin Linus published a paper outlining how one theoretically could verify zero-knowledge proofs on native Bitcoin for near-trustless scaling. A feat long considered impossible without a soft fork—the paper went viral, amassing over 3 million views and “nerd-sniping” some of the brightest developers and investors in the space.

Since then, a flood of builder effort has gone into actuating BitVM bridges—with many of the most highly valued “layer 2s” contributing to the effort (think: Citrea, Alpen Labs, Babylon and others)—despite broad criticisms that the technology is “clunky” and may be “impractical” for end users. While Linus notably refused venture investment—instead choosing to develop BitVM through the non-profit association ZeroSync—he’s worked closely with key teams to push the technology forward, resulting in optimizations like “BitVM2” and the more recent exploration of “Garbled Circuits,” which may be the key to making BitVM “practical” after all. In this episode, Robin and I discuss:- his process for developing BitVM and how he broke through what was otherwise considered an impossible constraint- why he’s refused venture-funding for his work on the project and the investor-related trauma that pushed him into “head to toe” Bitcoin Maximalism- why payments are the most “relevant” use-case to push forward for truly permissionless, decentralized money.- why Bitcoin has certainly not “already won,” and how we risk Bitcoin’s promise of permissionless-ness if trustless scaling is not solved. This episode additionally shares insight into the one-and-only Bitcoin Wizards IRC—a critical influence in Robin’s work—as well as key figures in the development of BitVM @supertestnet @jeremyrubin @liameagan and Peter Weille. -TIMESTAMPS01:05 How Robin Linus discovered Bitcoin06:05 Why payments are *necessary* for Bitcoin07:00 Can Bitcoin actually win as a medium of exchange?08:45 Robin’s experience with Ethereum09:55 Robin launched an Ethereum ICO in 2018???10:40 The drama that turned Robin into a Bitcoin maxi12:25 The Bitcoin Wizards Group Chat in 201815:00 Robin is the protégé of Pieter Wuille18:00 Why Robin is not convinced by lightning18:45 ZK was always the answer19:38 Starkware exploring STARKs on Bitcoin22:00 Using STARKs to “compress” Bitcoin23:30 Rethinking Bitcoin Script and what’s possible26:30 Hacking new opcodes into Bitcoin29:10 The “Hack a ZKP verifier into Bitcoin” groupchat31:25 Lamport signatures: enabling state on Bitcoin34:50 Optimistic verification and “trust minimized” Bitcoin systems37:20 Bridge operators in BitVM systems38:40 Is 1-of-n the “endgame” for Bitcoin?40:55 What softfork does Robin Linus want?43:20 The lifechanging BitVM whitepaper45:00 The dawn of BitVM focused companies46:20 Founding the BitVM Alliance49:20 Going to Stanford to learn more cryptography52:00 Why academics hate Bitcoin53:20 Convincing academics of POW over POS54:05 What is BitVM2? How it improves on BitVM156:55 Why AI Is Centralizing - like Fiat01:00:40 What are ZKCoins? Taproot Assets on Steroids01:03:00 Way cheaper than Taproot Assets01:05:00 How far will BitVM go without a softfork?01:05:50 BitVM3 Coming Soon??? Waiting for“Garbled Circuits”

History of ZKProofs | With Eli Ben Sasson

Tue, 10 Jun 2025 14:00:00 GMT

The History of Zero-Knowledge Proofs | with ZK “Godfather” Eli Ben Sasson

In 2013, computer science professor Eli Ben-Sasson presented his research on zero-knowledge proofs at a small Bitcoin conference outside of Standford University. The presentation immediately sparked interest from Bitcoin Core developer Greg Maxwell—leading Eli into over a decade of sustained work advancing ZK-based solutions for blockchain scalability and privacy.Today, zero-knowledge proofs are widely considered some of the most powerful and promising cryptographic primitives for scaling—with their full potential for Bitcoin simmering just beneath the surface of active development.This episode shares Eli’s early discussions of ZKPs for scaling, the use of proofs in privacy-enhancing technologies like Zcash, the explosion of ZKPs for Layer 2s on Ethereum… and his recent return to exploring ZKPs for Bitcoin.

This episode nods heavily to other contributors in the space—including Adam Back, Jeremy Rubin, Robin Linus, Ethan Heilman and others. Thanks in advance to Nathan Jeffay and the Starkware team for making this episode possible!

SHOW PARTNERS:

Best In Slot—leading aggregator for Bitcoin-native assets

https://bestinslot.xyz/

Citrea—Making truly decentralized "Bapps" (Bitcoin applications) possible through BitVM and Zero Knowledge Proofs https://citrea.xyz/

Unisat Wallet—for trading BRC20 and Alkanes assets

https://unisat.io/

TIMESTAMPS

___

00:51 Eli Ben-Sasson: Godfather of ZKPs02:15 Revealing Proof Research to Bitcoiners04:15 Meeting Greg Maxwell; Mike Hearn06:10 ZCash: Bringing ZK Based Privacy for Crypto07:05 SNARKs and STARKs Explained08:10 Would Satoshi Approve of Bitcoin STARKs?11:41 ZCash Privacy Versus Monero13:45 When did the ZKP era begin on Ethereum?16:34 What’s different about ZK STARKs?18:40 Vitalik and STARKs on Ethereum with Starkware21:10 Academics finally appreciating STARKs23:18 Healthy competition in the ZK industry24:20 What is Starknet?25:50 What is an L2, in Eli’s view?27:20 Focustree, an app on Starknet30:00 How Eli arrived at Bitcoin Season 234:45 When did ZK look realistic for Bitcoin?36:55 Eli first heard about OP_CAT39:30 Why Lightning isn’t good enough40:30 When did Starkware start focusing on OP_CAT?44:20 Runes bridge to Starknet!46:00 Expanding Starknet staking to BTC48:20 Why is OP_CAT “barely enough” for Bitcoin L2s?51:00 The real reason people oppose OP_CAT, per Eli53:00 The risks of *not* changing Bitcoin55:35 The weakness of Bitcoin’s lack of governance01:00:15 We will need to softfork for quantum!

Digital Property Rights & ZKPs | With Edan Yago

Thu, 22 May 2025 14:52:00 GMT

Edan Yago has been in the “Bitcoin DeFi” ecosystem since before that term was a thing. An early adopter of Rootstock, Yago developed the “largest DeFi ecosystem in Bitcoin” through DEX @sovryn before becoming obsessed with Zero Knowledge Proofs and the promise of BitVM for enabling more trustless rails into and out of Bitcoin. While Yago has most recently been working on the modular-style BitVM bridge @bitcoinOS - we got deep in this episode about the early days of Bitcoin DeFi - and Bitcoin in general - including: – Why the internet didn’t work for libertarians… until bitcoin came along. – Why the concept of “securities” is fundamentally flawed– Why Bitcoin’s taproot upgrade was the true unlock for Bitcoin Season 2– The under-appreciated role of Etheruem in “testnet-ing” Zero Knowledge Proofs– Why BOS decided NOT to build a rollup after all… and how they become the BitVM bridge for @cardano As always, this episode can be viewed on Spotify or YouTube—full episode in the comments or linktree in my bio. This episode is powered by Best In Slot—the leading API for Ordinals and BRC20 data aggregation and indexing.TIMESTAMPS: —01:08 Edan Yago, founder of BitcoinOS01:58 How Yago discovered the Bitcoin whitepaper03:20 What was so intriguing about Bitcoin?05:58 Yago’s childhood gold story08:00 Yago’s many Bitcoin ventures: from BTC gaming to BTC banking12:20 Did Yago invent “blockchain not Bitcoin”!?14:40 Using Bitcoin for remittances17:00 Getting debanked by JPMorgan19:30 Hot take: Bitcoin exchanges are a grift20:45 Yago’s complicated take on tokens22:50 “There are no such thing as securities”25:40 Our population is native to true free markets28:50 Wildcat banking: America’s most prosperous time30:35 Moving away from the regulated space33:13 The genius of decentralized stablecoins: Maker and Curve36:45 Yago launches Sovryn: Bitcoin DEX on Rootstock38:23 Sovryn’s success: earning dividends in BTC40:30 Rootstocks problems: security and user frictions42:50 How ZK Proofs changed everything45:10 Yago’s early research into trustless bridging46:45 The “holy shit” BitVM moment48:15 Explaining Taproot and Taptrees50:50 Verifying ZK Proofs on Bitcoin: What it meant52:00 Major L1s coming home to Bitcoin52:40 BitcoinOS: Bring everything home to Bitcoin55:45 Crypto doesn’t know what it’s trying to do56:50 Vitalik’s loss of patience and Ethereum’s mistake58:20 Why we have too many tokens and blockchains59:42 Why ZK trims away the redundant chains01:00:32 What is a “Bitcoin Operating System”?01:02:42 Graduating for “bridging” and “unchaining” crypto01:06:20 Even in a pile of dirt, you’ll find a diamond

The Problem With Bitcoin L2s | With Mike Casey

Thu, 15 May 2025 13:58:23 GMT

Michael Casey was brought on by MARA to address an often overlooked problem in the world of Bitcoin Layer 2s… they generally don’t contribute much to the security budget of Layer 1 Bitcoin. We often hear concerns about fees being either too high OR too low depending on how you look at it… too high if you’re optimizing for 8 billion people being able to use the network in a self-custodial way—but too low if your goal is maintaining network security as Bitcoin block rewards continue to halve over time. In this episode, we discuss:- Why MARA is funding a Bitcoin side-chain development proje- The power of merge mining in solving this “fee-scaling dilemma” - How Bitcoin was used for payments in a pre-Lightning world- Why L2s ultimately need to pay Bitcoin miners to sustain the network in the long runWe also cover some fun Bitcoin history—like the impacts of Bitcoin’s cultural shift from being “network-focused” to “asset-focused,” why BIP300 may have been a good idea after all, and the little known history of Paul Sztorc’s BitAssets.As always, this episode can be viewed on Spotify or YouTube—full episode in the comments or linktree in my bio. This episode is powered by Best In Slot—the leading API for Ordinals and BRC20 data aggregation and indexing.TIMESTAMPS00:25 Intro to Mike Casey01:08 Why did MARA launch Anduro sidechain?02:00 Anduro: a merged-mined Bitcoin sidechain03:50 Are we thinking about Bitcoin fees enough?08:00 Price is rising - where are the fees!?09:30 When Bitcoin truly becomes vulnerable11:18 Will nation state funded mining take over?15:30 Mike’s role before working at MARA18:20 Mike gets obsessed with Bitcoin’s price21:00 The GM director’s Bitcoin presentation22:44 Mike moving on from GM to MARA24:40 Anduro chains: Alice and Coordinate26:10 Coordinate: a fork of Bitcoin core29:15 Fairer fee market: dutch auction fee mechanism31:50 Coordinate is getting OP_CAT!33:00 Spending BTC is long dead34:00 How does Coordinate compare to Lightning?34:55 Taproot Assets are quantum vulnerable!41:50 Taproot: Schnnor signatures and MAST43:00 Can the BitVM L2s be quantum resistant?44:40 Mike doesn’t want OP_CAT46:29 Ethereum’s Rollup Problem47:30 What about BIP 300?49:30 What are Bit Assets?51:00 There’s no ignoring Ordinals as a miner53:40 Bitcoin had the first NFTs54:45 DEXs on Coordinate56:00 Let’s not see Ordinals die

Fee-Market Maximalism | With Rena Shah

Wed, 07 May 2025 15:20:22 GMT

Stacks was one of the first “Bitcoin L2s” (or “Bitcoin scalers” if you’ll call it that) that has stayed incredibly relevant in the Bitcoin Season 2 era. From conducting the first regulated token sale to becoming a face of the Ordinals ecosystem, Trustmachines COO Rena Shah guides us through the network’s history, and why she believes its positioned to keep both Bitcoin’s network and ethos alive.

In this episode, we discussed:

How Stacks pulled off the first regulated token sale
Stacks consensus, yield, and the Nakamoto upgrade
Stacks before and after the Ordinals boom
Why Bitcoin HODLers are NOT keeping Bitcoin alive
Why Rena doesn’t like the Strategic Bitcoin Reserve

This episode is powered by Best In Slot—the leading API for Ordinals and BRC20 data aggregation and indexing.TIMESTAMPS:

1:17 Stacks: an OG Bitcoin Layer

3:35 STX: The first regulated token sale

6:17 How STX proved itself to the SEC

9:55 Was STX needed to keep the Stacks ecosystem funded?

11:13 Stacks consensus explained

14:20 Stacks staking, mining, and “where the yield comes from”

15:25 Bitcoin finality with the Stacks Nakamoto upgrade

17:40 Stacks before the Ordinals era

19:35 What did Satoshi want from Bitcoin?

22:06 The crypto shift from “world computer” to “decentralized finance”

24:06 Bitcoin staking products with Stacks?

25:42 Stacks as the first ecosystem to embrace Ordinals

27:10 Rena’s inscriptions of her father’s voice notes

29:05 Stacks, XVerse, and bootstrapping Ordinals infrastructure

30:45 When did the Bitcoin L2 explosion start?

32:08 When did Stacks start calling itself a “Layer 2?”

33:29 What happens if there are so few L1 transactions?

35:50 Bitcoin fees should be higher!

37:39 Will Bitcoin become a medium of exchange?

40:10 Rena doesn’t like the Strategic Bitcoin Reserve

42:30 HODLers are not securing the Bitcoin network

44:00 Trust Machines: Building out the Bitcoin economy

45:36 From Blockstack to Stacks Foundation and Hiro

48:38 Who are the validators of the Stacks network?

51:52 Stacks has more devs than Bitcoin Core - with very few grants

55:42 Is crypto all collapsing back to Bitcoin?

57:00 Granite: Aave-style lending on Stacks

58:46 Aiming for a “trustless” Stacks layer with BitVM

› https://x.com/renapshah

LISTEN / SUBSCRIBE TO THE PODCAST:

› YouTube: / @bitcoinrails

› X/Twitter: https://x.com/isabelfoxenduke

› Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/5uPrBxvD691TpTqjijudkO?si=571634b88d574911

CONNECT WITH ISABEL:

› Email: bitcoinrails@gmail.com

› LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/isabel-foxen-duke-87272423/

› X/Twitter: https://x.com/isabelfoxenduke

Bitcoin #Ordinals #BRC20 #Runes #BitVM #zkp

The Great Covenants Debate | With Red and Janusz

Wed, 23 Apr 2025 17:09:28 GMT

If you’re following Ordinals, you’ve likely heard the term “OP_CAT,” a proposed Bitcoin opcode popularized by the Taproot Wizards In this episode, I brought on Janusz and Red from Bitcoin Layers to break down what OPCAT is, how it works, and what it makes possible for Bitcoin—hint hint: you’re gonna learn all about ‘covenants’ and their role in trustless bridging in this episode.Of course, this interview wouldn’t be complete without a breakdown of other covenant-enabling opcodes on the table—especially OP_CTV and OP_TXHASH.Fair warning: this episode goes deep into what an OP_CAT (or covenants) future for Bitcoin might look like… as well as the potential dark side of “doing nothing.”In this episode, we discuss:-The difference between CTV, TXHASH, and CAT-Why more expressivity isn’t always better-The Risks and Rewards of upgrading (+ the great script restoration debate)-Is the window for making changes to Bitcoin closing?-Why ossification won’t matter in a post-OPCAT worldThis episode is powered by Best In Slot—the leading API for Ordinals and BRC20 data aggregation and indexing.TIMESTAMPS: 0:00 Intro01:20 Janus and Red’s backgrounds03:30 What Ordinals revealed about degens and Bitcoin05:48 What the fuck is a covenant?06:38 Specific proposals that enable covenants: CTV, TXHash, OP_CAT07:55 Using covenants for bridging09:20 Are there limits to CTV?11:15 What is TXHash?13:20 What about OP_CAT?15:35 OP_CAT enables SNARKs17:30 Red’s analogy comparing the 3 proposals20:00 How many Opcodes should we introduce?21:15 Bitcoin’s Final Upgrade? Running out of time24:00 The consequences of not changing Bitcoin26:50 Bitcoin rollups will benefit Bitcoin security31:57 Do we need to break BTC’s 21m supply cap?35:00 Softforks can help more than just rollups38:00 Every Bitcoin L2 is trusted right now42:55 What does Bitcoin “scaling” mean?44:00 Lightning can actually be trustless46:20 Do all L2s need an L1 transaction to onboard?52:10 Money making as a BitVM operator- https://x.com/januszg_ - https://x.com/redvelvetzip - https://x.com/bitcoinlayers LISTEN / SUBSCRIBE TO THE PODCAST:› YouTube: / @bitcoinrails › X/Twitter: https://x.com/isabelfoxenduke › Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/5uPrBxvD691TpTqjijudkO?si=571634b88d574911 CONNECT WITH ISABEL:› Email: bitcoinrails@gmail.com › LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/isabel-foxen-duke-87272423/ › X/Twitter: https://x.com/isabelfoxenduke #Bitcoin #Ordinals #BRC20 #Runes #BitVM #zkp

Make Bitcoin Quantum Resistant | With Hunter Beast

Tue, 08 Apr 2025 14:00:00 GMT

Is Bitcoin going to break? Don’t roll your eyes: quantum computing may be a more realistic threat to Bitcoin than you think, and it may only be a few years away. Thankfully, Bitcoin dev Hunter Beast is preparing us in advance with the thoughtful BIP 360 – an effort to bring post quantum cryptography to Bitcoin.In this episode, we discussed:- How quantum computing threatens your Bitcoin wallet- The vulnerability of Satoshi’s one million BTC

- How to stay protected against quantum (for now!)- How banks and governments are preparing for quantum- BIP 360: Pay to Quantum Resistant Hash

This episode is powered by Best In Slot—the leading API for Ordinals and BRC20 data aggregation and indexing.

TIMESTAMPS:___

00:00 Intro02:05 What is quantum computing?

04:30 How could quantum threaten your Bitcoin wallet?

06:50 Addresses that are safe from quantum

09:13 Satoshi’s coins are in danger!

11:25 What happens if Satoshi’s coins are touched?

14:45 Do we softfork to shield Satoshi’s coins?

16:38 “Transitory inflation” for bitcoin after quantum

21:05 Why Taproot addresses are vulnerable

23:50 Do NOT reuse your Bitcoin addresses!

26:03 When will Quantum become a threat?

28:34 The long/short exposure attack; explained

31:45 Protection using private mempools

33:20 Why all the new Bitcoin L2s are in danger

37:45 Quantum is 5 to 10 years away, governments fear

40:34 Non-Bitcoin systems threatened by quantum

42:26 Centralized systems can adapt to quantum

43:50 Hunter’s BIP: Post quantum cryptography in Bitcoin

47:40 Hunter’s three new signature algorithms

53:48 Is new cryptography on Bitcoin risky?

56:33 Why not just stick to hash-based cryptography?

58:49 A 16X discount for quantum resistant addresses?

01:02:30 Creating quantum resistant multisig addresses

01:04:00 What is Frost?

01:06:50 The long process of approving a BIP

01:08:30 What developers think of Hunter’s BIP

01:10:00 Matt Corallo’s concerns with Hunter’s approach

01:11:00 Steps to implementing the BIP 360

01:17:00 Where to learn more about BIP 360

01:17:50 Who can push the button to change Bitcoin?

› https://x.com/cryptoquick

LISTEN / SUBSCRIBE TO THE PODCAST:

› YouTube: / @bitcoinrails

› X/Twitter: https://x.com/isabelfoxenduke

› Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/5uPrBxvD691TpTqjijudkO?si=571634b88d574911

CONNECT WITH ISABEL:

› Email: bitcoinrails@gmail.com

› LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/isabel-foxen-duke-87272423/

› X/Twitter: https://x.com/isabelfoxenduke

Bitcoin #Ordinals #BRC20 #Runes #BitVM #zkp

Cracking The Bitcoin Bridging Problem | With Alexei Zamayatin

Wed, 02 Apr 2025 14:00:00 GMT

Build on Bitcoin (BOB) co-founder Alexei Zamayatin is older than he looks folks: he’s been researching how to build “trustless” Bitcoin bridge architecture since 2018, long before it felt anything close to a mainstream conversation.

When Robin Linus came out with BitVM, he believed he found the answer to this impossible problem, and has since poured his efforts into BitVM2 and BOB – a “hybrid L2” between Bitcoin and Ethereum.In this episode, we discussed:- Alexei’s long history researching Bitcoin bridges

- The academic work on distributed systems

- How BitVM changed the game for Bitcoin

- The hybrid architecture of BOB

- How BOB merged interop, Babylon, and BitVM bridgingThis episode is powered by Best In Slot—the leading API for Ordinals and BRC20 data aggregation and indexing.

TIMESTAMPS:___1:50 How did BOB come to be?

4:28 How early was the “Bitcoin L2” conversation?

5:45 The problem with merged mining

11:40 Alexei’s growing interest in Bitcoin DeFi

13:17 Never a fan of lightning

15:00 The Blocksize Wars begin

17:00 Academic early research on “distributed systems.”

19:40 Bitcoin’s “dark age” after SegWit

20:30 Alexei’s super early work on “trustless” bridging

22:10 Alexei’s PHD: Trustless bridging is impossible

25:00 Pre BitVM bridging solutions

28:40 Alexei’s work on Polkadot and intro to ZKPs

32:50 Ethereum is hard to verify

34:35 Starting work on BOB

38:50 The Hybrid Consensus: Merged Mining and Ethereum Rollups

42:25 How BitVM derailed Alexei’s plans

47:00 Working with Robin Linus on a ZK bridge

49:35 SNARKs vs STARKs

50:35 The limitation of BitVM, how we’ve improved it

52:30 BitVM: Making challenging proofs permissionless

55:50 The challenge / response game of BitVM

59:55 BitVM2: Splitting programs to fit into Bitcoin blocks

01:03:00 Competition in the BitVM design space

01:05:00 Focusing on BOB, leaving BitVM to Fiamma

01:07:00 BOB is an “interoperable execution environment”01:09:00 Build in isolation; get liquidity fragmentation

01:10:30 Is BOB the most secure Bitcoin L2?

01:13:05 How BitVM makes Babylon staking more secure

01:17:50 “Trust minimization dick measuring”

› https://x.com/alexeiZamyatin

LISTEN / SUBSCRIBE TO THE PODCAST:

› YouTube: / @bitcoinrails

› X/Twitter: https://x.com/isabelfoxenduke

› Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/5uPrBxvD691TpTqjijudkO?si=571634b88d574911

CONNECT WITH ISABEL:

› Email: bitcoinrails@gmail.com

› LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/isabel-foxen-duke-87272423/

› X/Twitter: https://x.com/isabelfoxenduke

Bitcoin #Ordinals #BRC20 #Runes #BitVM #zkp

Domo's Perspective & the History of BRC20 | With Domo

Thu, 27 Mar 2025 13:00:00 GMT

A particularly special episode—@domodata sits down with me for his first video interview ever—to recount the unique history of the BRC20 protocol.The first Bitcoin-native token standard ever created, BRC20 came into existence almost overnight and quickly emerged as a multibillion dollar asset class in 2024.This episode covers the influences leading up to the birth of $ORDI, the roles of different players involved along the way, and how core maintainers are preparing for their next major update—affectionately dubbed “BRC 2.0” by Bitcoin educator @bobbodilyAdditionally, Domo shares his memory of key moments in BRC20 history—including:—the development of BRC20's canonical indexer and details of Domo's working relationship with @unisat_wallet—Ordi's listing on OKX and Binance (+ what he believes triggered listing decisions by those exchanges)—the creation of the Layer 1 Foundation and the responsibilities of its member organizations in maintaining the core protocol—why Domo has never accepted funding (including advisory fees) from either of his lead maintainer companies @unisat_wallet or @bestinslotxyzWe also go into depth about what sparked the “BRC20 indexer wars” and how stakeholders are ensuring the integrity of its consensus going forward.This episode includes special mentions of major influences in the evolution of BRC20—including @redphonecrypto @robertjfclarke @Bitcoin_Punks_ @satsnames @bestinslot @unisat and others.This episode can be viewed on YouTube or Spotify using the linktree in Isabel’s bio—YouTube episode is also in the comments.As always, thanks to the show's sponsor @bestinslotxyz for making this episode possible— in addition to being a core maintainer of BRC20, Best In Slot maintains the leading API for Ordinals and BRC20 data aggregation and indexing.TIMESTAMPS:01:04 Domo, Ethereum, and how he found Bitcoin05:04 Why Ordinals clicked for Domo07:58 Ordinals going from underground to mainstream11:13 Who helped Domo ideate around Ordinals? 16:21 How did Domo announce ORDI, the “first” BRC20?20:02 Why did BRC20 blow up so fast?22:25 How did UniSat get involved with BRC20?25:12 Catalysts for the BRC20/ fungibles boom26:35 When did BRC20 get good pricing data?29:00 Domo’s stresses during the ORDI blowup31:34 How involved was Domo with UniSat early on?35:00 Exchanges instantly deciding to list ORDI37:38 How did Best In Slot start indexing BRC20s?41:48 Centralization of indexers44:18 Coordinating indexers around Ordinals forks47:25 Relaunching the Layer 1 Foundation49:25 The relationship between Domo, UniSat, and Best In Slot51:02 Upgrading BRC20: Swap and Programmability Module54:55 How the programmability module came to be57:00 “Standard Maxiness” is hurting the industry59:00 Plugging BRC20 into everything else01:00:50 Do programmable metaprotocols solve interoperability?01:02:50 Metaprotocols and L2s: do they compete?01:05:00 Does BRC20 have an advantage over the metaprotocols?01:06:20 How should the community approach Bitcoin’s issues?01:08:50 Competition rising in the BItcoin space01:10:00 People are underestimating metaprotocols01:11:55 Single step transfer for BRC20

Alkanes Are Fueling Programmable Bitcoin | With Oyl Dynamics

Thu, 13 Mar 2025 14:00:00 GMT

Even after Ordinals, there’s a lot of infrastructure needed to make the Bitcoin economy work: wallets, indexers, interoperability, and programmable metaprotocols. Today's guests – Oyl Dynamics co-founders Alec Taggart and Ray Pulver – are building one software suite to tackle all of these problems, including the tools for anyone to spin up their own metaprotocol!In today’s episode, we discussed:The advantages of building on Bitcoin vs EthereumThe need for interoperability between Bitcoiin metaprotocolsHow Alkanes brings programmability to BitcoinWhether Wasm could overtake EVM in cryptoAirheads, $DIESEL, and marketing with an assetThis episode is powered by Best In Slot—the leading API for Ordinals and BRC20 data aggregation and indexing.00:30 What is Oyl Dynamics?02:30 Alec’s entry into Ordinals05:33 The need for Bitcoin wallets and indexing06:50 Indexing with Bitcoin vs Ethereum nodes09:10 Selling indexing tools to Bitcoin builders10:10:Metashrew: Spinning up any Bitcoin metaprotocol12:00 Ethereum vs Bitcoin wallets12:55 Unisat and OKX dominating the indexer13:55 The hardest asset should be easy to trade15:05 How BRC20s and Domo influence Oyl’s design16:00 Aggregating marketplace data for Runes, Ordinals, BRC20s18:00 Building a trustless AMM for Bitcoin18:40 From BRC20s, to Runes, to Programmable Runes22:20 What does “composable” mean?25:30 Alkanes: creating interoperability between all of the Protorunes29:55 The Oyl strategy: ultimate builder support33:10 Solving cross-metaprotocol interoperability35:00 The spectrum of programmability on Bitcoin36:00 Casey’s genius with Runes37:20 Where did the name “Alkanes” come from?39:00 Only BTC needed at Alkanes40:20 Using Ethereum as Bitcoin’s testnet42:00 Are there unique advantages of building on Bitcoin?43:00 What is special about Wasm?44:25 Will Wasm overwhelm EVM’s network effects?46:10 Is there any downside to building with Wasm?49:00 Wasm wasn’t ready when Ethereum launched50:25 Oyl’s Ordinal Collection: Airheads and Arthur Hayes54:38 Marketing tied to an asset you can trade55:30 Fundraising and Oyl’s $DIESEL EXP system01:00:20 How do people mine $DIESEL?› https://x.com/OylDynamics › https://x.com/oylwallet LISTEN / SUBSCRIBE TO THE PODCAST:› YouTube: / @bitcoinrails › X/Twitter: https://x.com/isabelfoxenduke › Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/5uPrBxvD691TpTqjijudkO?si=571634b88d574911 CONNECT WITH ISABEL:› Email: bitcoinrails@gmail.com › LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/isabel-foxen-duke-87272423/ › X/Twitter: https://x.com/isabelfoxenduke #Bitcoin #Ordinals #BRC20 #Runes #BitVM #zkp

The Future Of Bitcoin DeFi | With Dan Held And FarmerJoe

Thu, 06 Mar 2025 15:00:00 GMT

Bitcoin culture wasn’t always about eating red meat. The desire for L2s, DeFi, and experimentation are part of Bitcoin’s earliest roots, and those are the areas that the Asymmetric Bitcoin DeFi Venture Fund is investing in. In our chat at ETH Denver, creators Dan Held and FarmerJoe took me through the history. In this conversation, we discuss:

Being early to Bitcoin DeFi
Why Dan and FJ ONLY buy into projects with tokens
Why money isn’t Bitcoin’s only use case
Old vs new Bitcoin maximalism
Whether Bitcoin cycles will continue

This episode is powered by Best In Slot—the leading API for Ordinals and BRC20 data aggregation and indexing.

TIMESTAMPS__

00:54 When did Dan learn about “Bitcoin DeFi”?

02:49 Dan’s marketing role for TrustMachines

05:32 FarmerJoe’s entry to Bitcoin DeFi

09:32 FarmerJoe’s early entry to Ordinals

10:42 Tokens on Bitcoin were inevitable

13:00 Ethereum’s flawed NFTs

15:30 Dan’s excitement for Taproot Wizards

18:00 Joe’s angel investments in Bitcoin

20:30 The Asymmetric Bitcoin DeFi Venture Fund

22:40 Only investing in protocols through tokens

23:30 Do Bitcoin L2s need tokens?

24:50 Will Bitcoin L2 tokens be *on* Bitcoin?

27:30 Gatekeeping of Bitcoin L2s

29:45 Blockchains are countries

32:00 Money isn’t Bitcoin’s only use case

35:00 “Speculation is a core driver of adoption”

36:30 Do Bitcoiners really want DeFi?

38:50 Holding ETH erodes your value – not BTC

40:30 Discrete Log Contracts (DLCs) are sooo cool

41:50 Is the whole world collapsing back to Bitcoin?

42:45 Dan on maxis and the moralization of Bitcoin

44:55 Bringing crypto back to Bitcoin

46:55 We always wanted to scale Bitcoin in layers

50:30 Isabel defends the Bitcoin maxis

52:20 Bitcoin began as speculation and drugs

54:15 Four pillars of Asymmetrics investment focus

57:40 Arch - Asymmetric’s first investment

59:00 Will Bitcoin cycles continue?

01:00:50 Bitcoin will turn risk-off long-term

01:03:05 Bitcoin still has some risk element

01:04:18 Do halvings matter for cycles now?

>https://x.com/danheld

>https://x.com/FarmerJoe0x

>https://x.com/goasymmetric

LISTEN / SUBSCRIBE TO THE PODCAST:

› YouTube: / @bitcoinrails

› X/Twitter: https://x.com/isabelfoxenduke

› Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/5uPrBxvD691TpTqjijudkO?si=571634b88d574911

CONNECT WITH ISABEL:

› Email: bitcoinrails@gmail.com

› LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/isabel-foxen-duke-87272423/

› X/Twitter: https://x.com/isabelfoxenduke

Bitcoin #Ordinals #BRC20 #Runes #BitVM #zkp

Searching For "Real Yield" On Bitcoin | With Rich Rines

Tue, 25 Feb 2025 17:38:43 GMT

Even the most hardline BTC maxis are low-key starving for a way to earn yield on their BTC. CoreDao contributor Rich Rines says that Core Network provides a way for HODLers to do that – without needing to trust any bridge or custodian!

In this conversation, we discuss

How Core Network combines both Proof of Stake and Proof of Work

Whether CoreDao is a Bitcoin “L1” or “L2”

Why Core has proven so successful with a “fair launch” token

Whether utility tokens can make a comeback under the new administration

The most exciting use case being built in crypto

This episode is powered by Best In Slot—the leading API for Ordinals and BRC20 data aggregation and indexing.

TIMESTAMPS:

00:50 What is CoreDao?

01:50 Satoshi+: How Core Network is secured

02:55 What’s wrong with Merged Mining?

04:00 How CoreDao contributes to Bitcoin security

05:10 Is CoreDao a Bitcoin L1 or an L2?

06:27 Creating native staking yield for BTC

08:30 Yes, the staking is trustless

10:00 Why proof of stake doesn’t need slashing

11:10 There is no trustless slashing on Bitcoin today

12:50 How CoreDao hit product-market fit

14:30 What problems does CoreDao solve?

16:20 BTC is collateral - not currency

17:10 How did Core’s TVL grow so fast?

20:00 Converting normies to Core

21:35 Core’s “fair launch” token approach

24:50 Why bother with crypto tribalism?

26:00 The death of VC tokens, rise of fair launches

30:50 Could utility coins boom now that Trump is back?

33:20 Who will survive in this token market?

36:30 Market saturation and lack of flows

39:40 Bitcoin staking through ETFs?

41:35 Institutional vs retail staking with Core

43:30 Cool technology is not enough

46:15 Stacks and its staying power

47:10 Rich’s advice: play infinite games

48:55 Growing to scale and fee revenue

50:45 The biggest potential use case: lending/ borrowing

54:15 Rich isn’t bullish on OP_CAT happening soon…

56:30 …but is still cheering for Taproot Wizards

>https://x.com/richrines

LISTEN / SUBSCRIBE TO THE PODCAST:

› YouTube: / @bitcoinrails

› X/Twitter: https://x.com/isabelfoxenduke

› Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/5uPrBxvD691TpTqjijudkO?si=571634b88d574911

CONNECT WITH ISABEL:

› Email: bitcoinrails@gmail.com

› LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/isabel-foxen-duke-87272423/

› X/Twitter: https://x.com/isabelfoxenduke

Bitcoin #Ordinals #BRC20 #Runes #BitVM #zkp

The BULLISH Case For Runes | With Leonidas

Mon, 24 Feb 2025 18:40:24 GMT

In this extra-rich TWO HOUR episode of Bitcoin Rails, Ordinal Show host and $DOG token co-founder @LeonidasNFT told me about his journey between Bitcoin and Ethereum maximalism, and what led him to launch the most successful Rune on Bitcoin.

Unlike Beezy, Leo believes $DOG is a shining example of how Runes can make it, and says we ought to collectively migrate from BRC-20.

We discussed:

- Leo’s evolution between Bitcoin and Ethereum maximalism

- His history as an NFT “archaeologist”

- Leo’s distaste for BRC-20 culture and centralized capture

- How he made $DOG into the most successful “fair launch” Rune on Bitcoin

- Resisting the tyranny of centralized exchanges as Bitcoin scales

TIMESTAMPS

1:00 Intro to Leonidas

2:00 Making Bitcoin Fun Again

3:15 Leo’s journey between Bitcoin and Ethereum

5:30 Being an “NFT Researcher”

7:00 Ordinals creators finds “the oldest NFTs”

10:00 NFT “Archaeology” on Ethereum

12:50 Leo’s problems with art on Ethereum

18:50 Are “rare satoshis” market viable?

20:50 How Leo kickstarted Runestones

24:50 $DOG: The fair launch memecoin on Bitcoin

26:00 RSIC vs Runestones

28:00 Leo’s position on Runes post-halving

30:30 Are Bitcoin assets ready for their next bull market?

33:00 Runes are tracking the broader memecoin markets

36:40 Ordinals are NOT a Bitcoin leverage play

38:00 Bitcoin trading UX stinks on L1

39:30 Do “long lasting” memecoins on Bitcoin even matter?

41:50 Is Bitcoin money, or is it a memecoin?

46:00 Bitcoin becoming the world’s money

48:45 Costs and sniping with Runes and MEV

49:50 Trusted solutions for trading Runes and Ordinals

53:45 10-minute blocks are a BIG problem

56:30 Yes, NFTs need faster settlement too

57:40 Bitcoin tokens will have to migrate off of L1

59:20 Memecoin and NFT indexes on Fidelity?

01:00:30 Will CEXs simply outcompete the Bitcoin L2s?

01:03:00 We NEED DEXs to move forward

01:05:00 Runes are a modest improvement over BRC-20s

01:06:00 Leo doesn’t like UniSat’s BRC-20 standard

01:09:10 Is fragmentation an issue for Bitcoin tokens?

01:10:40 It’s time to migrate from BRC-20 to Runes

01:12:48 BRC-20 is owned by UniSat and Binance

01:17:10 We will figure out AMMs on Bitcoin L1

01:19:00 Getting $DOG listed on CEXs

01:21:00 $DOG isn’t bending the knee to big money

01:22:40 Binance is probably insider trading

01:25:30 Can we fight the insider rugpulls?

01:29:10 Do Bitcoin tokens need CEXs to ever take off?

01:33:50 CEXs won’t fix themselves

01:35:20 Leo talks cross-chain bridges for $DOG

01:38:00 Trust required with $DOG on Solana

01:42:40 Bitcoin L1 is always most secure

01:46:50 $DOG’s mission to invade Solana

01:51:25 Leo is diversifying away from JPegs

01:53:35 Leo’s message to the Bitcoin builders

- https://x.com/LeonidasNFT

LISTEN / SUBSCRIBE TO THE PODCAST:

› YouTube: / @bitcoinrails

› X/Twitter: https://x.com/isabelfoxenduke

› Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/5uPrBxvD691TpTqjijudkO?si=571634b88d574911

CONNECT WITH ISABEL:

› Email: bitcoinrails@gmail.com

› LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/isabel-foxen-duke-87272423/

› X/Twitter: https://x.com/isabelfoxenduke

Bitcoin #Ordinals #BRC20 #Runes #BitVM #zkp

Cut Bait On Runes – Save The Art! | With Beezy

Thu, 13 Feb 2025 15:00:00 GMT

With all the pain and cope in the Ordinals ecosystem lately, I needed *immediate* answers. That’s why I called up Beezy – former Galaxy researcher and walking Ordinals encyclopedia – to tell me why Ordinals needs a defibrillator to “kind of bring it back to life.”In this episode, we chat about:

Why Runes are on life support
How Runes were never optimized to be useful
Why we should ditch Runes and return to Ordinals
What made Ordinals special, and what to refocus on
The role of KOLs in the Ordinals space

This episode is powered by Best In Slot—the leading API for Ordinals and BRC20 data aggregation and indexing.

As always, YouTube + Spotify links in bio linktree.

TIMESTAMPS:-0:00 - Intro

1:20 - What went wrong with Ordinals??

5:40 - Poor Runes design decisions

8:55 - Runes wasn’t meant to be optimal

10:55 - Why did everyone drink the Runes Kool-Aid?

13:20 - Nobody expected BRC-20s; Everyone expected Runes

16:00 - Time for builders to start attacking Runes

19:00 - Can a CEX listing really revive Runes?

22:52 - The catalyst after BRC-20s: Node Monks and Puppets?

24:20 - Runes destroyed the show for Bitcoin tokens

26:10 - Memecoins and tokens are *not* Bitcoin’s strength

27:00 - Forget Runes: It’s time to refocus on Ordinals

31:20 - Reviving Ordinals: Pushing for cold-storage solutions

33:50 - Digital art frames

34:50 - More Ordinals wallet choices

37:20 - Should Ordinals return to focusing on art?

39:00 - “Living art” on Bitcoin

41:30 - Profile pics vs Fine art on Bitcoin

44:18 - Will the early inscriptions meta make a comeback?

46:30 - We need platforms for Bitcoin art

50:15 - How does Ordinals gain institutional adoption?

52:30 - What happened to Casa’s Ordinals support?

56:00 - Bitcoin NFT performance vs other chains

58:00 - Let’s get back to having fun with Ordinals

1:00:00 - What is the role of KOLs in Ordinals?

1:02:00 - There are no unbiased KOLs

1:03:20 - NFT media platforms should cover Ordinals more

1:06:00 - Less copium, less hopium

https://x.com/bitcoinbeezy

LISTEN / SUBSCRIBE TO THE PODCAST:

› YouTube: / @bitcoinrails

› X/Twitter:https://x.com/isabelfoxenduke

› Spotify:https://open.spotify.com/show/5uPrBxvD691TpTqjijudkO?si=571634b88d574911

CONNECT WITH ISABEL:

› Email: bitcoinrails@gmail.com

› LinkedIn:https://www.linkedin.com/in/isabel-foxen-duke-87272423/

› X/Twitter:https://x.com/isabelfoxenduke

Bitcoin #Ordinals #BRC20 #Runes #BitVM #zkp

Odin: The Hottest Runes Marketplace | With Bob Bodily (@BobBodily)

Thu, 06 Feb 2025 15:00:00 GMT

The last time Bob was on, he was publicly known as a humble Twitter scholar for Bitcoin L2s. Today, he’s unmasked himself as the founder of ODIN.FUN – the new hottest Runes marketplace launched just last week. Today, we discussed:

The journey that led him to build Odin
The importance of optimizing for speed above everything
The tech behind Odin and how it interacts with Bitcoin L1
The hypersonic pace of Odin’s growth
Why Bitcoin trading experiences may be preferential to Solana

This episode was powered by Best In Slot—the leading API for Ordinals and BRC20 data aggregation and indexing.

As always, YouTube + Spotify links in bio linktree.

0:00 - Opening stats about Odin's early success

0:18 - Introduction and discussion of intense launch period

1:00 - Origins of Odin and development timeline

2:01 - Discussion of what users want in crypto applications

3:18 - Lessons learned from Polymarket and user experience

4:54 - Why build on Bitcoin despite user chain indifference

6:24 - Bitcoin as king and strategy behind Odin

8:03 - Technical development history and early Ordinals work

9:19 - Lessons learned from L2 marketplaces

11:11 - Pivot to Odin and focus on speed

14:07 - Technical architecture and Valhalla layer explanation

16:55 - Demo of Odin's trading interface

20:29 - User experience and session key innovation

24:05 - How Bitcoin interacts with ICP through threshold signing

27:29 - Trading mechanics and liquidity pools

29:59 - Launch statistics and user growth

31:51 - Fee structure and referral program

34:32 - Community building and Be Life integration

36:01 - Impact on Runes ecosystem volume

40:40 - Vision for future and competing with Solana

42:56 - Criticism of Solana's MEV issues

45:28 - Innovation opportunities in token launching

47:56 - Closing thoughts on Bitcoin meme coins' future

LISTEN / SUBSCRIBE TO THE PODCAST:

› YouTube: / @bitcoinrails

› X/Twitter: https://x.com/isabelfoxenduke

› Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/5uPrBxvD691TpTqjijudkO?si=571634b88d574911

CONNECT WITH ISABEL:

› Email: bitcoinrails@gmail.com

› LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/isabel-foxen-duke-87272423/

› X/Twitter: https://x.com/isabelfoxenduke

Bitcoin #Ordinals #BRC20 #Runes #BitVM #zkp

How To Build A Bitcoin Career | With Rockstar Dev (@r0ckstardev)

Mon, 03 Feb 2025 19:14:06 GMT

Today I stepped away from the heavy technical talk to chat with Rockstar Dev – core contributor to BTCPay Server who – to talk about lightning, Bitcoin history, and forging a career in the Bitcoin industry.

Today, we covered:

SegWit2X and the Bitcoin Blocksize wars
The rise of the lightning network
VC raising for Strike (a lightning company) vs token projects
Why you shouldn’t shitcoin
The importance of having a good team in Bitcoin

- https://x.com/r0ckstardev

- https://x.com/BtcPayServer

EPISODE SPONSORS:

› This episode was powered by Best In Slot—the leading API for Ordinals and BRC20 data aggregation and indexing.

› https://bestinslot.xyz/ TIMESTAMPS:

0:00 Intro

2:10 The story of Rockstar Dev

3:50 Bitcoin enforces fiscal discipline

6:00 Everyone started as a Twitter pleb7:50 Bitpay tried to “change Bitcoin.”

9:55 Bitcoin Cash was made for payments

12:00 What was SegWit2X?

15:00 How small blockers won

19:10 What is BTCPay Server?

21:19 Lightning Network’s Rise

23:28 When Bitcoin Became Legal Tender

26:20 Bitcoin is deciding elections now

27:30 How did venture capital respond to lightning?

31:20 “Tokens are a zero-sum game”

33:00 The best investments are Bitcoin plays!

34:50 Don’t take the shitcoin money

37:30 Stay patient, keep searching for your team

39:50 MicroStrategy’s insane success

42:00 Advice to start a Bitcoin career

45:30 Plan B: Join a team you believe in

48:15 Does your team make you better?

49:50 Good teams move together

53:00 Lightning lets us settle our conflicts

LISTEN / SUBSCRIBE TO THE PODCAST:

› YouTube: / @bitcoinrails

› X/Twitter: https://x.com/isabelfoxenduke

› Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/5uPrBxvD691TpTqjijudkO?si=571634b88d574911

CONNECT WITH ISABEL:

› Email: bitcoinrails@gmail.com

› LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/isabel-foxen-duke-87272423/

› X/Twitter: https://x.com/isabelfoxenduke

Bitcoin #Ordinals #BRC20 #Runes #BitVM #zkp

DeFi On Bitcoin Metaprotocols | With Chad Masterson (@chadmasterxbt)

Thu, 23 Jan 2025 15:00:00 GMT

Despite unlocking Ordinals and BRC20, the real pathway to Bitcoin DeFi remains a mystery. Chad Masterson – co-founder of OP_NET – believes an all-new Bitcoin L1 metaprotocol is needed for the job, which he says will “change Bitcoin without changing Bitcoin’s code.” Today, we covered: - Chad’s bitcoin price target this cycle - Why Chad isn’t bullish on Bitcoin L2s yet - How OP_NET improves on Ordinals as a metaprotocol - Deploying smart contracts into Bitcoin L1 transactions - Why devs are foolish to keep building with Casey Rordarmor’s framework - https://x.com/chadmasterxbt - https://x.com/opnetbtc TIMESTAMPS: - 0:00 Trump: The Crypto President 2:05 Bitcoin will win “the most” 3:57 Bitcoin to $250k, Solana to $1000 5:08 Institutions and nation-states now run the market 7:58 Are Bitcoin native assets going to boom? 10:10 Bitcoin maxis will never adopt Ordinals 11:30 Why Chad isn’t bullish on Bitcoin L2s 13:40 Bitcoin L2 landscape is oversaturated 16:00 What is OPNET? A metaprotocol for Bitcoin programmability 18:10 “DeFi on Bitcoin is a generational trade” 21:51 Building on Ordinals wasn’t working 27:00 OPNET can do a lot more than Ordinals 28:55 Deploying smart contracts directly into Bitcoin L1 transactions 30:50 Any developer can build with OPNET 32:35 Prioritizing functionality over interoperability 36:40 The strongest principle of Ordinals adoption 38:00 The OP20 Standard: a smart contract and account-based standard 43:00 BRC20 is a “meta-meta protocol” 45:30 OPNET lets you do everything on Ethereum, on Bitcoin 47:05 Stop building within Casey’s framework! 50:00 No financial benefit for Bitcoin L1 builders 53:40 How will OPNET achieve integrations and adoptions? 55:15 OPNET infrastructure is built out 57:45 Abu Dhabi Blockchain Center supports OPNET! 1:00:50 “We’re trying to change Bitcoin without changing Bitcoin’s code” 1:03:25 3 basic options to scale Bitcoin 1:06:10 RWAs should live on Bitcoin EPISODE SPONSORS: › This episode was powered by Best In Slot—the leading API for Ordinals and BRC20 data aggregation and indexing. › https://bestinslot.xyz/ LISTEN / SUBSCRIBE TO THE PODCAST: › YouTube: / @bitcoinrails › X/Twitter: https://x.com/isabelfoxenduke › Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/5uPrBxvD691TpTqjijudkO?si=571634b88d574911 CONNECT WITH ISABEL: › Email: bitcoinrails@gmail.com › LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/isabel-foxen-duke-87272423/ › X/Twitter: https://x.com/isabelfoxenduke #Bitcoin #Ordinals #BRC20 #Runes #BitVM #zkp

The Case For Lightning Maximalism

Mon, 20 Jan 2025 16:00:00 GMT

After learning about all sorts of new Bitcoin L2s, Lisa Neigut (aka Nifty). my very first podcast guest, has returned in person to lecture me about why Lightning Network is still the best!

Lisa’s “lightning maximalism” is rooted in “payments maximalism.” If you purely intend to expand bitcoin’s utility as a payments tool, she argues that lighting – in conjunction with federated protocols and ecash mints like Fedi – can get the job done. Much to my surprise, those two worlds have been building roots together and creating synergies for some time, including through wallets like Aqua that make Liquid and lightning interoperable.

Nifty says that lightning is becoming the high-speed “connective tissue” between several Bitcoin L2s, with swap providers like Boltz. These trustless swaps are a special quality of lightning that Ethereum wishes it could have to keep its L2 ecosystem together.

Nifty is the founder of Bitcoin++, co-founder of Base58, and a former Lightning Network engineer at Blockstream. Listen to learn more about one of Bitcoin’s OG Layer 2s, and hear an expert’s defense for it despite all the recent FUD!

TIMESTAMPS:-

1:10 How did lightning network come to be?

3:07 Vitalik’s “Code is Law” Idea

6:29 What on earth is a “Layer 3?”

9:20 BTC works as a medium of exchange!

12:20 How lightning works

15:24 Where Lightning requires using L1

16:40 Lightning’s channel management problem

20:40 Phoenix Wallet lets you run a personal lightning node

22:40 The problem with permanent Bitcoin addresses

24:00 Nifty Fights the Lightning FUD

26:10 Maxis who don’t like lightning

26:50 Permissionless exit: Lightning’s best quality

29:50 Lightning’s last mile problem + What’s cool about ECash

32:20 Lightning and federations working together

35:30 Sovereignty is expensive

38:35 Coffee vendors running lightning invoices

39:25 Lightning as the connective tissue of L2s

42:20 Ecash mints are like virtual dollar bills

45:05 How do trustless swaps work?

48:15 Ethereum wishes it had lightning

49:50 Lightning + Fedi is perfect for payment maxis

51:50 Cashu requires trusting one person

54:15 Nifty’s move from Blockstream to Bitcoin education

58:00 Bitcoin++: where you can get ahead on what’s coming for Bitcoin

EPISODE SPONSORS:

› This episode was powered by Best In Slot—the leading API for Ordinals and BRC20 data aggregation and indexing.

› https://bestinslot.xyz/

LISTEN / SUBSCRIBE TO THE PODCAST:

› YouTube: / @bitcoinrails

› X/Twitter: https://x.com/isabelfoxenduke

› Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/5uPrBxvD691TpTqjijudkO?si=571634b88d574911

CONNECT WITH ISABEL:

› Email: bitcoinrails@gmail.com

› LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/isabel-foxen-duke-87272423/

› X/Twitter: https://x.com/isabelfoxenduke

Bitcoin #Ordinals #BRC20 #Runes #BitVM #zkp

We Don’t Even Need Bitcoin Bridges | With Arch’s Matt Mudano and Amine ElQaraoui (@ArchNtwrk)

Mon, 13 Jan 2025 18:00:00 GMT

I spend a lot of time talking about “bridging” to L2s on my podcast, so I recently spoke to Amino and Matt from Arch to talk about why it still isn’t time to stop building for Bitcoin DeFi right on Layer 1.

Arch uses an entirely new VM inspired by Solana, but tailor-made to Bitcoin needs, including UTXOs and PSBTs. Arch can operate much like a traditional L2 that “bridges” funds for users, but can also allow programmable transactions to execute at the L1 level using Arch smart contracts, giving users a “choose your own adventure” secuirty experience.

Unlike a lot of devs today, Matt and Amino are steering away from using zero-knowledge proofs in their design, which they realized weren’t adding much benefit.

Watch to learn about Arch’s unique multisig based security which my previous guest @januszg called “the best we can do” for trustworthy Bitcoin application layers.

https://x.com/ArchNtwrk

TIMESTAMPS:-

0:33 Arch Network’s roots w/ BTC Startup Lab

4:14 What is Alchemy? The need for a Bitcoin indexer

6:10 Not giving up on Bitcoin’s base layer

7:56 How Arch Works: A New VM for Bitcoin

12:26 Arch’s transition from ZKPs to PSBTs

14:52 Arch’s proof of stake system

17:08 What is Frost? Improving multisigs

20:00 Arch network’s 26 validators

22:11 Roast: peak multi-sig architecture

25:34 Arch’s growing pains: dev education

29:20 Why didn’t Arch take the EVM route?

34:05 Building a Bitcoin L2 from scratch

37:18 Users can choose their trust assumptions

38:28 Arch’s purely organic marketing

40:08 Nearing the conclusion of Bitcoin scaling

41:30 OP_CAT would make things easier for Arch

42:30 What will be the next connective tissue for Bitcoin DeFi?

EPISODE SPONSORS:

› This episode is powered by Best In Slot, the leading Bitcoin aggregator providing APIs, live price charts, and on-chain token data. Check them out here:

› https://bestinslot.xyz/

LISTEN / SUBSCRIBE TO THE PODCAST:

› YouTube: / @bitcoinrails

› X/Twitter: https://x.com/isabelfoxenduke

› Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/5uPrBxvD691TpTqjijudkO?si=571634b88d574911

CONNECT WITH ISABEL:

› Email: bitcoinrails@gmail.com

› LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/isabel-foxen-duke-87272423/

› X/Twitter: https://x.com/isabelfoxenduke

Bitcoin #Ordinals #BRC20 #Runes #BitVM #zkp

How Are Bitcoin Layer 2s Reviewed? | With Janus (@januszg_)

Thu, 09 Jan 2025 18:00:00 GMT

As a full-time researcher of Bitcoin Season 2, Bitcoin Layers co-founder Yah-Noosh (Janus) is becoming cynical: “It’s all a massive shitcoin casino.”

Janus sat down with me for an hour in person to discuss how his research group compares and rates the swell of Bitcoin L2s now entering the fray, ranging from lightning, to rollups, to federated sidechains. As emerging BitVM and ZK-based layers fight to gain traction while remaining decentralized, he later argued why such projects will inevitably launch tokens as a reality of doing business.

TIMESTAMPS:

01:59 How Janus entered the Bitcoin L2 conversation

04:36 Bitcoin L2 builders learned from Ethereum

07:52 What is a “rollup”?

08:47 Stacks doesn’t count as a rollup

09:40 What is a Bitcoin Layer 2?

12:00 Trusted sidechains are still useful

13:15 Advantage of rollups over lightning network

15:58 Lightning is one of few trustless L2s

17:10 Shielded CSV: a potential lighting alternative

18:40 Coupling shielded CSV with rollups

20:37 Rollups alone have limited scale

22:08 Non-payment use cases for Bitcoin

24:30 Shitcoin casinos are coming to rollups

27:09 ICP and Arch: how they work

29:50 Multisigs are “the best we can do” today

31:04 How Bitcoin Layers reviews Bitcoin L2s

35:40 Trust assumption of BOB network

37:12 The biggest multisig hack that ever happened

38:14 SolvBTC: bitcoin derivatives on derivatives

40:29 Will BitVM-based bridging really gain traction?

42:39 “It’s all a massive shitcoin casino”

44:42 The inside pump and dump game of Bitcoin Season 2

46:20 Are utility tokens necessary for Bitcoin L2s?

48:43 What is a rollup sequencer?

50:33 The need for decentralized sequencers

52:40 Decentralizing the sequencer using tokens!

55:38 All the Bitcoin L2s are gonna launch tokens

57:30 An option to bypass the token game

EPISODE SPONSORS:

› Best in Slot -- https://bestinslot.xyz/

LISTEN / SUBSCRIBE TO THE PODCAST:

› YouTube: / @bitcoinrails

› X/Twitter: https://x.com/isabelfoxenduke

› Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/5uPrBxvD691TpTqjijudkO?si=571634b88d574911

CONNECT WITH ISABEL:

› Email: bitcoinrails@gmail.com

› LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/isabel-foxen-duke-87272423/

› X/Twitter: https://x.com/isabelfoxenduke

Bitcoin #Ordinals #BRC20 #Runes #BitVM #zkp

Scaling Bitcoin w/ BitVM and ZKPs | Isabel Foxen Duke + David Seroy (@david_seroy)

Tue, 07 Jan 2025 22:42:19 GMT

I just had a mind-bending discussion with David Seroy - ecosystem lead at Alpen Labs (and fellow Bitcoin Season 2 podcast host) - about the genesis of zero-knowledge cryptography on Bitcoin. David began by unpacking the history of zero-knowledge proofs, what Ethereum has already done with them, and the potential they create for allowing “rollups” on Bitcoin - a promising solution for bringing scalability, privacy, and programmability to the original chain. David and the Alpen team are currently building Strata, a “trust-minimized” ZK-based rollup on Bitcoin. This is pretty technical stuff, but David did his best to explain words like “ZKPs” and “BitVM” for us in childspeak. If you can follow through to the end, consider yourself not a beginner anymore!

https://x.com/david_seroy
https://x.com/alpenlabs
https://x.com/Strata_BTC

TIMESTAMPS - 00:00 The “Bitcoin Season 2” Podcasters 01:50 The history of zero-knowledge proofs on Bitcoin 04:28 Privacy, SNARKs, and STARKs 06:25 What took so long to get ZKPs for Bitcoin? 08:10 Rollups VS Sidechains 09:30 Zero-knowledge proofs explained for dummies 12:00 How Ethereum laid the groundwork 13:45 Tradeoffs with trustlessness 14:55 Ethereum is still on training wheels 16:55 Bitcoin’s big unlock 19:48 BitVM: What Robin Linus figured out 21:55 BitVM2:ZK verification on L1 23:30: What is “optimistic” verification? 25:30 1-of-N: The new trust assumption for Bitcoin L2s 27:25 Making verification as efficient as possible 30:15 Normies won’t use BitVM2 bridging 32:29 Working around BitVM’s liquidity problem 35:00 The BitVM operator fee market 38:45 Rollups clear up Lightning Network’s issues 44:15 Why Alpen is not launching a token 50:00 “Tokens are f***ing brutal” 52:35 What Bitcoin maxi culture got wrong 54:55 OP_CAT making BitVM irrelevant 58:00 MEV concerns about OP_CAT are overblown 01:02:00 “Udi derangement syndrome” EPISODE SPONSORS: › Best in Slot -- https://bestinslot.xyz/ LISTEN / SUBSCRIBE TO THE PODCAST: › YouTube: / @bitcoinrails › X/Twitter: https://x.com/isabelfoxenduke CONNECT WITH ISABEL: › Email: bitcoinrails@gmail.com › LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/isabel-foxen-d… › X/Twitter: https://x.com/isabelfoxenduke#Bitcoin #Ordinals #BRC20 #Runes #BitVM #zkp

Ordinals 2nd Birthday! | Isabel Foxen Duke + Trevor Owens (@TO)

Mon, 16 Dec 2024 04:00:00 GMT

It’s now been two years since Bitcoin’s first inscription, so I caught up with Trevor Owens – Host of The Ordinal Show – to update me on what’s going on in the world of Bitcoin NFTs. While discussing his recent Pizza Pets Ordinals airdrop, Trevor recapped how Ordinals have evolved over the past two years into an NFT market that can rival Ethereum’s. In Trevor’s view, the Bitcoin bull market hasn’t even started yet. When it does, there will be an “exponential jump” of investors' interest …

OP_CAT is Good For Everyone | Isabel Foxen Duke + Bob Bodily (@BobBodily)

Thu, 12 Dec 2024 15:00:00 GMT

One of the most beloved educators of the "Bitcoin Renaissance," Bob and I chat about the possibilities - and limitations - of proposed L2 tech: —why the Lightning Network is not enough + proposed solutions for programmable Bitcoin—liquidity fragmention on Bitcoin metaprotocols + the need for interoperability—Bob & Isabel's shared history with ckBTC… and the underrated influence of ICP in the Bitcoin L2 space—who will realistically benefit from ZKP/BitVM style solutions (and who wil…

Welcome to the "Bitcoin L2 Era" | Isabel Foxen Duke + Lisa Neigut (NiftyNei)

Mon, 09 Dec 2024 15:00:00 GMT

Lisa Neigut is the founder of Bitcoin++, co-founder of Base58, and a former Lightning Network engineer at Blockstream. In this inaugural episode of Bitcoin Rails, Lisa and I chat about the explosion of so-called "Bitcoin Layer 2s" spawning across the industry, including what defines an “L2”, and what makes some L2s better than others. We talked about some of the different types of L2s including E-Cash mints and ZK layers, and how their trust assumptions compare to existing layered solutions l…