1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:12,760 welcome to the healthy bit podcast and with me hayley and my co-host henry herbert we are going 2 00:00:12,760 --> 00:00:19,580 to be talking about how to buy good meat so you are in for some fantastic information from henry 3 00:00:19,580 --> 00:00:23,460 because he used to be a butcher didn't you henry so tell us a little bit about this birth 4 00:00:23,460 --> 00:00:29,760 yeah well good hey hayley how you doing yeah i guess one of those i sometimes feel a bit like 5 00:00:29,760 --> 00:00:34,700 a swiss army knife i don't know whether it's a or jack of all trade master of none one or the other 6 00:00:34,700 --> 00:00:41,520 but um yeah in a in a previous life i ran a butcher shop and um um i was working as a chef 7 00:00:41,520 --> 00:00:46,860 and my where we have our bakery in chipping sodbury there's a beautiful butcher shop that's 8 00:00:46,860 --> 00:00:53,400 been there for i think over 150 years it's got a real history and uh and i as a child used to go 9 00:00:53,400 --> 00:00:57,980 in I actually used to go with my dad to market and buy the cows so I kind of grew up around this 10 00:00:57,980 --> 00:01:02,580 butcher shop and there was a point maybe about 15 years ago though it's probably still happening now 11 00:01:02,580 --> 00:01:07,000 where butcher shops were shutting faster than pubs so you know everyone you know everyone's 12 00:01:07,000 --> 00:01:10,280 starting to buy all their meat from the supermarket and we're kind of losing that kind of high street 13 00:01:10,280 --> 00:01:16,160 and the poor butcher shop was you know collateral damage in the in that moment and um and I always 14 00:01:16,160 --> 00:01:21,480 kind of vowed that uh it'd be really sad if Chipping Sobri lost its butchers and so I was 15 00:01:21,480 --> 00:01:27,040 working as a chef i'd recently married i have a great time and then we went traveling and whilst 16 00:01:27,040 --> 00:01:31,480 i was away traveling my dad sent me a message saying um actually the butcher shop's up for sale 17 00:01:31,480 --> 00:01:36,520 sadly the old butcher had died and uh and his son didn't want to take it on or wanted to have a 18 00:01:36,520 --> 00:01:42,780 career change and no one wants to buy it so he said you know do you fancy putting him you said 19 00:01:42,780 --> 00:01:45,860 that you always thought it'd be a shame of the butcher shop shut so hey can you come run it for 20 00:01:45,860 --> 00:01:50,240 just for you know for a few months um whilst you're looking for a job and i was like well i haven't got 21 00:01:50,240 --> 00:01:54,320 a job you know i'm traveling so you know it could be um could be a bit of fun and i actually just 22 00:01:54,320 --> 00:01:57,420 thought it'd be really easy so i was like yeah fine i'll run a butcher shop you know why not i 23 00:01:57,420 --> 00:02:02,800 like you know like animals like cooking cooking cooking meat etc how hard can it be turns out 24 00:02:02,800 --> 00:02:10,340 really really hard um but my my goodness what an education yeah so me and my wife ran uh this uh 25 00:02:10,340 --> 00:02:15,180 village bushery shop for uh three years and uh it's actually it's still running now so we we 26 00:02:15,180 --> 00:02:19,380 managed to find another bush to take it on and it's still going so actually i kind of feel like i 27 00:02:19,380 --> 00:02:22,760 I was a bit of a custodian of it for a brief period. 28 00:02:23,000 --> 00:02:24,480 And then I kind of moved back into the bakery. 29 00:02:25,020 --> 00:02:31,120 But yeah, I guess it was a real learning curve for me in terms of how to spot good quality meat. 30 00:02:31,320 --> 00:02:34,200 And I'm personally quite a big meat eater. 31 00:02:34,860 --> 00:02:36,120 I do like it. 32 00:02:36,180 --> 00:02:37,640 My wife would probably be vegetarian. 33 00:02:38,480 --> 00:02:39,880 She definitely loves her veggies. 34 00:02:40,260 --> 00:02:42,400 And so there's always a little bit of conflict. 35 00:02:42,740 --> 00:02:48,680 But I think, yeah, running a butcher shop, it gives you that kind of peek behind the curtain of like how the meat industry works. 36 00:02:48,680 --> 00:02:53,680 and you know the good sides the bad sides and also you know how to spot good quality meat and then 37 00:02:53,680 --> 00:02:58,780 also when you've got whole animals actually there's the kind of the expensive cuts the ones 38 00:02:58,780 --> 00:03:03,200 that you've all heard of but then there's actually there's the more unusual stuff actually um you can 39 00:03:03,200 --> 00:03:07,320 you know get get some you know they're cooked well you can have some really delicious meals 40 00:03:07,320 --> 00:03:11,080 and actually get a bit more bang for your buck so so i guess today's just a bit of a actually it's 41 00:03:11,080 --> 00:03:15,420 a request from a message that we had sent in so this does show that if you you know if you want 42 00:03:15,420 --> 00:03:20,320 us to talk about something please do let us know um yeah so this is just a bit of a discussion about 43 00:03:20,320 --> 00:03:24,960 all things meat how to spot it and how to you know get the most out of it because meat is expensive 44 00:03:24,960 --> 00:03:30,640 and um and rightly so but but we don't want to be you know wasting our money so yeah so you've 45 00:03:30,640 --> 00:03:35,540 mentioned a couple of times there henry that you've learned a lot about how to spot good meat 46 00:03:35,540 --> 00:03:43,000 good quality meat yes so for novices and for non-butchers if you're going into your perhaps 47 00:03:43,000 --> 00:03:49,660 your local butchery or if you've got one in your village something like that yeah you walk in they 48 00:03:49,660 --> 00:03:53,740 look really attractive I always think in terms of they've got lovely meat counters you've got like 49 00:03:53,740 --> 00:03:59,220 other bits in the shop how do you know what you're looking for and how do you know um that what you're 50 00:03:59,220 --> 00:04:04,560 being served is is generally good meat unless you get to know the butcher as you because they might 51 00:04:04,560 --> 00:04:09,320 tell you the background about where it's come from well well actually that's probably my first 52 00:04:09,320 --> 00:04:13,400 point would be would be to get to know your butcher is actually you know it's probably a bit 53 00:04:13,400 --> 00:04:17,400 like i would think a butcher is a bit like your hairdresser or your barber that you know it's quite 54 00:04:17,400 --> 00:04:21,920 a personal service so when you go in and you want you know whether it's i want this i've seen a 55 00:04:21,920 --> 00:04:26,980 recipe and i want this specific cut and i'm not quite sure what it is or you know i've got 10 56 00:04:26,980 --> 00:04:30,720 people coming in for dinner or you know whether it's you know you're doing christmas and actually 57 00:04:30,720 --> 00:04:35,320 you're trusting them to kind of make a fairly impactful decision a bit like when you get a 58 00:04:35,320 --> 00:04:39,620 haircut you know if you don't trust the person who's got those scissors you might end up with a 59 00:04:39,620 --> 00:04:44,040 you know a dodgy mullet or something you know we've probably all got a story where we've ended 60 00:04:44,040 --> 00:04:49,320 up with a dodgy haircut and um and so actually getting to know your your butcher is i think it's 61 00:04:49,320 --> 00:04:53,420 it's critical because you'll build up that relationship and you know it's a you know meat 62 00:04:53,420 --> 00:04:57,500 is expensive and so you know you ask you know spending decent money so actually it's worth 63 00:04:57,500 --> 00:05:01,920 putting that effort in um but of course you know if you just walk into a butcher shop and you don't 64 00:05:01,920 --> 00:05:04,680 know who, you know, you're new in a town and you've, you know, you think, oh, that looks 65 00:05:04,680 --> 00:05:08,440 attractive. Let's go in. How do you know that, you know, what you're buying is good quality? 66 00:05:08,740 --> 00:05:12,360 Because there's always that allure that you can just go to the supermarket and you know that it's 67 00:05:12,360 --> 00:05:16,120 probably going to be a bit cheaper and you're not going to have, you know, the friction of having to, 68 00:05:16,180 --> 00:05:20,220 you know, talk to someone or, you know, quite often it's quite intimidating, isn't it? When 69 00:05:20,220 --> 00:05:24,500 they're there with their steel and their knife and they're kind of doing that kind of sharpening 70 00:05:24,500 --> 00:05:29,760 sound and feel a little intimidating. And so the supermarket feels kind of safe and it feels kind 71 00:05:29,760 --> 00:05:31,660 of easy and you just pop it in your basket. And, 72 00:05:31,920 --> 00:05:44,500 But actually, you know, the advantage of using a good butcher or a good farm shop is that you can actually ask some questions to kind of validate that what you're getting is good quality. 73 00:05:44,620 --> 00:05:55,860 So a few things that I would always ask is when it comes to butchery, particularly when it comes to beef, and often beef is, you know, more expensive. 74 00:05:56,100 --> 00:05:59,400 So you want to make sure that if you're buying a steak, you're getting a good steak, etc. 75 00:05:59,400 --> 00:06:01,300 So there's something called carcass butchery. 76 00:06:01,300 --> 00:06:07,600 now when you when you when you buy a cow at the abattoir it'll be chopped into four pieces so it'll 77 00:06:07,600 --> 00:06:12,500 be the fore quarter and the hind quarter and this is just because carrying a whole cow unless you're 78 00:06:12,500 --> 00:06:18,200 the world's strongest man it's very difficult but like a quarter of a cow weighs about 70 to 80 kilos 79 00:06:18,200 --> 00:06:23,440 and that's just about manageable for someone to carry on their shoulder you know from the fridge 80 00:06:23,440 --> 00:06:28,720 to the block so the cow comes in four quarters now uh in a in a good butcher they'll be buying 81 00:06:28,720 --> 00:06:33,580 in a whole carcass so they'll get four quarters two fronts and two backs and um and they'll be 82 00:06:33,580 --> 00:06:40,040 hanging it on the bone so they'll they'll buy it probably maybe 10 to two weeks old so it's already 83 00:06:40,040 --> 00:06:44,440 aged a little bit of the abattoir and it'll come to them and then they will they'll age it for 84 00:06:44,440 --> 00:06:49,560 probably another week and then on to two to three weeks more for your yeah you're kind of your prime 85 00:06:49,560 --> 00:06:55,380 cuts so your ribeyes your sirloins your steaks where you want a bit more kind of a mature flavor 86 00:06:55,380 --> 00:07:00,000 whereas you're kind of stewing steaks but you're the stuff that you'd be using for mints actually 87 00:07:00,000 --> 00:07:05,240 you don't need to age it more than kind of three weeks is fine so if you're doing carcass butchery 88 00:07:05,240 --> 00:07:09,920 that requires a skilled butcher because to take a whole cow that's probably costs well actually 89 00:07:09,920 --> 00:07:13,800 these days a whole carcass is probably about two thousand pounds so you're buying an incredibly 90 00:07:13,800 --> 00:07:18,120 expensive thing and now you're going to chop it up and sell it you need to make sure that you're 91 00:07:18,120 --> 00:07:22,320 doing it properly so if you're if you're a supermarket it's much easier to buy it in what 92 00:07:22,320 --> 00:07:27,400 they call them primals so at the abattoir they will quickly chop it down and then they will 93 00:07:27,400 --> 00:07:32,400 vac pack them in the in the large joints so you'll have your sirloins your top sides your silver sides 94 00:07:32,400 --> 00:07:36,960 your chuck you know your different cuts and they'll vac pack these downs and then you can buy them and 95 00:07:36,960 --> 00:07:42,640 it's known as boxed meat so as a butcher you know if you're very busy and you don't have enough 96 00:07:42,640 --> 00:07:48,040 skilled resource it's very tempting to buy boxed meat in because you just literally you get out the 97 00:07:48,040 --> 00:07:53,340 box you'll have a sirloin off the bone you take it out the plastic you just pat off the the kind of 98 00:07:53,340 --> 00:07:58,500 um the liquid that's been swimming around in the in the fat pack bag and then you can slice it up 99 00:07:58,500 --> 00:08:03,960 put it out on the counter and you walk in as um you know a mrs megan's to come buy your uh joe 100 00:08:03,960 --> 00:08:08,860 blocks to buy your your steak and you're you're you're trusting that they're that they've bought 101 00:08:08,860 --> 00:08:13,020 or that they've done this properly and actually they're kind of doing what the supermarkets are 102 00:08:13,020 --> 00:08:21,160 doing um uh and it's just it's easier so as a telltale sign if you can see large bits of meat 103 00:08:21,160 --> 00:08:25,960 on the bone that's normally a good sign that they're um they're doing carcass butchery and 104 00:08:25,960 --> 00:08:30,560 you'll see what large bits of meat look like it you know it's enormous you know 75 kilos of meat 105 00:08:30,560 --> 00:08:34,680 it's like the size of a human if that's hanging somewhere or on the block then you know that 106 00:08:34,680 --> 00:08:39,760 they're buying whole carcass cows and they're doing it properly if their prep is all out the 107 00:08:39,760 --> 00:08:43,980 back and actually it's just a lovely display at the front the question i was asked is have you got 108 00:08:43,980 --> 00:08:48,540 any bones i want to make some stock or i want to give my dog a bone because if you're doing carcass 109 00:08:48,540 --> 00:08:52,900 butchery you end up with a lot of bones and as a butcher you have to pay to get the bones taken 110 00:08:52,900 --> 00:08:57,740 away so that's just a really like low friction question you can just go and say hey i want to 111 00:08:57,740 --> 00:09:01,140 make some stock for my bone broth because i want some good collagen because i want to have lovely 112 00:09:01,140 --> 00:09:05,760 skin and nice hair as we've talked about um and if they go oh sorry we haven't got any bones 113 00:09:05,760 --> 00:09:11,240 then that that for me that's a red flag of like why haven't you got any bones surely there's a 114 00:09:11,240 --> 00:09:15,560 bone which is if you haven't got any bones that means that you're probably buying in box meat 115 00:09:15,560 --> 00:09:21,020 which means if your prices are significantly higher than the supermarket what value am i 116 00:09:21,020 --> 00:09:24,620 getting you know because i might as well just go to this now when it comes to you might be asking 117 00:09:24,620 --> 00:09:28,720 well what's what's the big deal you know if you're just buying a sirloin steak why does it matter 118 00:09:28,720 --> 00:09:33,040 whether it's come off the carcass and you know the butchers prepped it for you or whether they've 119 00:09:33,040 --> 00:09:37,320 bought it in box if it's more convenient you know why why does that make a difference the main thing 120 00:09:37,320 --> 00:09:43,520 is is that when when you have large pieces of meat if you eat it if you were to slaughter a cow and 121 00:09:43,520 --> 00:09:47,920 then eat it straight away it'd be incredibly fresh and it would be tough and chewy and would have a 122 00:09:47,920 --> 00:09:54,500 an insipid flavor and beef's one of these great proteins that it actually improves with aging now 123 00:09:54,500 --> 00:10:00,480 you can take it too far and i believe there's a restaurant in um sweden that ages for like 200 124 00:10:00,480 --> 00:10:13,928 and they like wrap the whole thing in tallow and whatever And apparently you need a very tiny slither because it so intense most people don need that like that that too far but actually kind of like uh you see it on 125 00:10:13,928 --> 00:10:22,248 on labels you know 28 day aged or 30 day age or 45 day age and that aging process is um uh um the 126 00:10:22,248 --> 00:10:27,208 the proteins are kind of breaking down and it's becoming more more tender now you can do that 127 00:10:27,208 --> 00:10:33,548 dry aging or wet aging. And dry aging is essentially where you're doing it on the bone 128 00:10:33,548 --> 00:10:38,908 and you're allowing moisture to come out of the beef. I would think of that as like, 129 00:10:39,068 --> 00:10:43,448 say you've made a gravy and it's tasting a little insipid. One of the ways that you can make it more 130 00:10:43,448 --> 00:10:48,168 flavorsome is you can reduce it. So you boil it away and you remove some of that liquid and you're 131 00:10:48,168 --> 00:10:54,188 intensifying the flavor. And then you end up with a more aromatic, more intense flavor. It's the same 132 00:10:54,188 --> 00:11:00,068 with the beef if you allow it to dry age moisture is coming out and so you end up with a more tender 133 00:11:00,068 --> 00:11:04,828 piece of meat but also something that has more flavor now this is that the crux of it is that 134 00:11:04,828 --> 00:11:10,748 moisture is money so if you're you know if you're a big if you're a big supermarket or a big you 135 00:11:10,748 --> 00:11:16,228 know producer of meat and you know every gram that you're losing off the weight is profit off the 136 00:11:16,228 --> 00:11:21,508 bottom line well you're not that keen on that you want to keep as much liquid inside the meat as 137 00:11:21,508 --> 00:11:26,368 possible so they came up with this genius thing which is wet aging where they essentially they 138 00:11:26,368 --> 00:11:32,288 vac pack it so you you take the meat off the bone you then vac pack it it's very hard to vac pack 139 00:11:32,288 --> 00:11:37,228 with the bones in because the bones are pointy and they blow the bag and then you end up with 140 00:11:37,228 --> 00:11:42,408 airflow and then that can spoil it so they take it off the bone as quickly as possible so within 141 00:11:42,408 --> 00:11:47,008 you know probably four or five days it's butchered down done at the abattoir they'll then vac pack it 142 00:11:47,008 --> 00:11:48,988 and now it can age in the bag. 143 00:11:49,208 --> 00:11:51,488 Now, the great thing with that is that it's maturing. 144 00:11:51,768 --> 00:11:55,688 So in theory, after 30 days, it'll be more tender, 145 00:11:56,028 --> 00:11:57,448 but it hasn't lost much weight. 146 00:11:57,888 --> 00:12:01,748 So when you sell it, you're buying a 200-gram steak, 147 00:12:01,908 --> 00:12:04,028 a dry-aged one, a wet-aged one, they're way the same. 148 00:12:04,188 --> 00:12:06,968 But when you come to cooking it, all that moisture has got to come out 149 00:12:06,968 --> 00:12:09,048 and you don't get that kind of intense flavor. 150 00:12:10,748 --> 00:12:13,568 And that's why the meat shrinks, I assume, is it? 151 00:12:13,568 --> 00:12:13,848 Yeah. 152 00:12:13,848 --> 00:12:19,408 yeah yeah and it's probably most visible with bacon bacon's where you get because you can 153 00:12:19,408 --> 00:12:24,248 if you buy cheap bacon you put it in the pan the first thing happens is a load of white water comes 154 00:12:24,248 --> 00:12:29,248 out and and then it has to like dry out and then it starts to caramelize whereas when you buy good 155 00:12:29,248 --> 00:12:34,628 quality bacon no water comes out and it just caramelizes straight away and um and that's 156 00:12:34,628 --> 00:12:40,968 because it's been the way that they've cured it one is dry one is wet and um water is money if you 157 00:12:40,968 --> 00:12:45,108 can put more what if you can keep more water in your meat you're going to make more money and uh 158 00:12:45,108 --> 00:12:51,648 and unfortunately our food industry is entirely or not entirely is the majority of it is profit 159 00:12:51,648 --> 00:12:59,768 driven so i assume henry do do they sometimes inject these meats with extra water to basically 160 00:12:59,768 --> 00:13:07,568 well i think i might have mentioned at christmas the um the con of the self-basting turkey that's 161 00:13:07,568 --> 00:13:13,648 probably the most blatant one I've seen where they are advertising that they've added water. 162 00:13:13,888 --> 00:13:18,188 But I guess, yeah, with like bacon, yeah, it's, you know, if you make it at home and you just rub 163 00:13:18,188 --> 00:13:22,408 it with salt and a bit of sugar and a bit of black pepper, maybe a few bit of thyme, bit of rosemary, 164 00:13:22,528 --> 00:13:26,468 et cetera, lots of liquid will come out of your bacon. And, you know, after seven days, you then 165 00:13:26,468 --> 00:13:31,228 wash it off, leave it to dry, air dry for a few days in your fridge. Then you come to slice it and 166 00:13:31,228 --> 00:13:35,728 cook it, you're going to get delicious bacon. But of course, if you submerge it into a brine, 167 00:13:35,728 --> 00:13:42,048 it cures much quicker and also water goes in but actually on really cheap bacon they slice it and 168 00:13:42,048 --> 00:13:47,008 cure it is in slices so they're not even curing as a whole thing which might take a week or so 169 00:13:47,008 --> 00:13:52,068 they're curing it individually in slices which takes probably you know 20 minutes so they're 170 00:13:52,068 --> 00:13:55,848 literally just sliding it through and it's incredibly quick because obviously time is money 171 00:13:55,848 --> 00:14:01,608 and also the more surface area the more it can absorb that liquid so you know it's a cured product 172 00:14:01,608 --> 00:14:07,148 but actually when you cook it it shrinks you know and you end up you know it's crap anyway and i 173 00:14:07,148 --> 00:14:12,788 think it's it's a total false economy so you're getting a poor quality product and also a load of 174 00:14:12,788 --> 00:14:17,128 water that you've paid for even if the price per kilo looks cheaper you've got to be careful and 175 00:14:17,128 --> 00:14:22,888 it's other things added in as well has it to preserve the shelf life within the plastic that 176 00:14:22,888 --> 00:14:27,888 it's in so there's other disadvantages to doing it that way and like like you say you could just 177 00:14:27,888 --> 00:14:33,328 ask your book so going to the butcher you could two simple questions yeah have you got any bones 178 00:14:33,328 --> 00:14:39,568 and also maybe how old is the or how many days has it matured and that would give you a bit of an 179 00:14:39,568 --> 00:14:45,888 idea as to yeah and you could just ask the great thing with beef if they're buying if they're buying 180 00:14:45,888 --> 00:14:51,188 it on the carcass all carcasses will have a tag saying which farm it comes from so you can ask 181 00:14:51,188 --> 00:14:55,808 that question it's quite easy like so i guess it's probably a good thing of legislation is that i think 182 00:14:55,808 --> 00:14:59,868 it was maybe i don't know exactly but after the whole horse meat scandal you know there was a bit 183 00:14:59,868 --> 00:15:03,888 more kind of like rigorous traceability to make sure that people weren't being scammed you know 184 00:15:03,888 --> 00:15:08,248 removing corruption from the from the industry so it's actually it's fairly easy as a customer just 185 00:15:08,248 --> 00:15:12,268 to ask and actually a lot of butchers will you know if they're buying good quality meat they'll 186 00:15:12,268 --> 00:15:18,128 write it up on the board being like this cow this week is from you know x farm 25 miles away because 187 00:15:18,128 --> 00:15:24,348 it's like like when i was a butcher when i was buying you know animals from the abattoir i wouldn't 188 00:15:24,348 --> 00:15:28,688 always know the farm personally but like it's not difficult to find that information out and then 189 00:15:28,688 --> 00:15:33,268 just write it up because I was interested and I was passionate about the meat and I was buying 190 00:15:33,268 --> 00:15:38,188 good quality animals and so I therefore wanted to share it with my customer and I kind of you know 191 00:15:38,188 --> 00:15:42,748 and so why would I lie about that you know it's kind of but that's you know um and not all butchers 192 00:15:42,748 --> 00:15:47,088 will do that I guess you know I was probably you know kind of young and enthusiastic and I guess 193 00:15:47,088 --> 00:15:50,828 maybe some were a bit more kind of old school and stuck in their ways but but generally speaking you 194 00:15:50,828 --> 00:15:53,908 know if you chat to someone who's passionate about it you can normally tell whether they're 195 00:15:53,908 --> 00:15:58,908 going to tell me crap you know like if they're bsing you you know you normally know and um so 196 00:15:58,908 --> 00:16:04,708 for me they would be some telltale signs like if if you know if there's no bones and you know 197 00:16:04,708 --> 00:16:08,028 they're not they're not hanging and they don't know where it's come from you know chances are 198 00:16:08,028 --> 00:16:13,948 it's coming from argentina or ireland or you know it's it's imported because it's cheaper and and 199 00:16:13,948 --> 00:16:18,268 therefore you might as well just buy it from the supermarket because you know the quality is not 200 00:16:18,268 --> 00:16:23,388 going to be a huge difference the one thing i would say and i don't want to completely beef about um 201 00:16:23,388 --> 00:16:25,348 or bad mouth supermarket meat, 202 00:16:25,848 --> 00:16:27,668 particularly when it comes to beef and lamb, 203 00:16:28,328 --> 00:16:30,828 if it's British, okay, so there's, 204 00:16:30,988 --> 00:16:32,268 particularly on the internet and, you know, 205 00:16:32,328 --> 00:16:34,168 fancy restaurants, you'll hear a lot about grass fed. 206 00:16:34,288 --> 00:16:37,768 Now, grass fed is, for me, ultimately the best, 207 00:16:37,888 --> 00:16:40,408 you know, like a cow is a ruminant and it's, 208 00:16:40,408 --> 00:16:44,208 you know, it was built to, you know, to eat grass 209 00:16:44,208 --> 00:16:45,368 and that's its natural diet. 210 00:16:45,788 --> 00:16:48,248 And so when you see all the kind of, 211 00:16:48,248 --> 00:16:51,928 the horror stories of, you know, 212 00:16:51,928 --> 00:16:57,408 big american farms where they're on basically in on standing on concrete and they're just eating 213 00:16:57,408 --> 00:17:02,368 corn and soybeans and stuff and it's not their natural diet there there's no they're not moving 214 00:17:02,368 --> 00:17:07,208 around they're not on grass you know they're on concrete that is a very different product we don't 215 00:17:07,208 --> 00:17:13,188 have that in the uk most pretty much all beef in the from the uk will be grass-fed they may finish 216 00:17:13,188 --> 00:17:17,708 it for the last kind of 10 to 20 percent of its life on grain just to bulk it up because they want 217 00:17:17,708 --> 00:17:22,988 to get a bit more extra weight so they get more money but actually for 80 of its life it's been 218 00:17:22,988 --> 00:17:28,108 on grass and we've got we're you know it's rained for 41 days straight in the uk we've got great 219 00:17:28,108 --> 00:17:32,668 grass so like so actually if you're in the supermarket and you're buying beef and it's 220 00:17:32,668 --> 00:17:37,768 british even if it's not the best it's still going to be better than what you you're buying 221 00:17:37,768 --> 00:17:41,688 from like america so like though i think there's a lot of like freak out that like you know um 222 00:17:41,688 --> 00:17:47,248 around supermarket meat that it's all awful actually it's not for things like chicken and 223 00:17:47,248 --> 00:17:53,068 pork you know a lot of kind of budget chicken and pork probably is not great because it will be barn 224 00:17:53,068 --> 00:17:57,388 reared or you know won't have had access to access to outdoor space it you know it's probably had 225 00:17:57,388 --> 00:18:02,368 lots of antibiotics and you know all sorts of stuff um whereas sheep again you don't really 226 00:18:02,368 --> 00:18:07,328 tend to get factory farm sheep they tend to you know they're pretty good at just eating scrub land 227 00:18:07,328 --> 00:18:11,608 up in the hills and stuff and that's where most of them live so even cheap lamb from you know from 228 00:18:11,608 --> 00:18:17,088 the supermarket um though actually no lambs are cheap it's all really expensive but it'll be pretty 229 00:18:17,088 --> 00:18:21,668 good um but it's more around kind of like how it's been finished when when you're getting it 230 00:18:21,668 --> 00:18:25,308 from the abattoir some of that might go to mcdonald's some of that might go to the supermarket 231 00:18:25,308 --> 00:18:29,508 some of it might go to the butchers but then if the butcher is treating it differently they're 232 00:18:29,508 --> 00:18:34,488 dry aging it they're you know they're um they're chopping it on site you're going to get a better 233 00:18:34,488 --> 00:18:39,568 quality finish and then also the of course the much more premium cows and stuff tend to go to 234 00:18:39,568 --> 00:18:45,248 the restaurants or um or the high-end super high-end um butchers because that's where they 235 00:18:45,248 --> 00:18:52,328 attract the most value yeah yeah okay so so that's with the the kind of beefy products how about like 236 00:18:52,328 --> 00:18:59,348 bacon sausages in terms of in in the supermarkets and i know you can buy them in supermarkets 237 00:18:59,348 --> 00:19:05,168 obviously like say probably quite cheap meat and they're usually full of nitrates and i know 238 00:19:05,168 --> 00:19:13,428 some supermarkets actually do have nitrate free bacon yes how and i think before when if you look 239 00:19:13,428 --> 00:19:18,448 at sometimes when you buy it from the butchers if you turn it over occasionally it does say it's 240 00:19:18,448 --> 00:19:26,508 still got nitrates in is that yes in every case or what role does so so i guess sausages are you 241 00:19:26,508 --> 00:19:30,788 know i mean there's there's a saying i'm going to get it wrong but it's like you know don't don't 242 00:19:30,788 --> 00:19:34,788 look don't look what's in the sausage because obviously you know it's it there's an assumption 243 00:19:34,788 --> 00:19:39,468 that it's all the crap so i guess the thing the thing with sausages is that in in the uk we have 244 00:19:39,468 --> 00:19:44,108 minimum meat content there's there's a there's a limit of how little meat you can put in which 245 00:19:44,108 --> 00:19:49,568 you know you can look at that as kind of reassuring or not reassuring it's quite low i think it's like 246 00:19:49,568 --> 00:19:55,648 66 or something you it doesn't so a sausage doesn't actually have to be it's not 100 meat 247 00:19:55,648 --> 00:20:01,228 um it can be quite a lot of other stuff and that other stuff tends to be cheap filler so bread so 248 00:20:01,228 --> 00:20:07,188 rusks uh which is what they're called it's basically it's a dried breadcrumb um it doesn't 249 00:20:07,188 --> 00:20:09,308 have yeast in it so it doesn't ferment. 250 00:20:09,308 --> 00:20:21,716 But it kind of adds cheap filler Whereas in the continent in France it illegal They not allowed to put cereals into sausages and that why their sausages tend to be meatier and a bit coarser so they they 251 00:20:21,716 --> 00:20:26,616 they tend to you don't have like hot dogs you have more kind of like you know sausage with 252 00:20:26,616 --> 00:20:31,456 cassoulet or like um you know that they tend to be kind of um like slow cooked because they're a 253 00:20:31,456 --> 00:20:35,696 bit kind of coarser and chunkier and they tend to be a little drier because actually the bread 254 00:20:35,696 --> 00:20:40,136 crumbs act as little sponges and it kind of absorbs the moisture so you end up with that 255 00:20:40,136 --> 00:20:46,775 kind of squeaky kind of banger but of course uh you know a cheap a cheap budget sausage will put 256 00:20:46,775 --> 00:20:50,855 the absolute minimum meat they can get away with because they're trying to keep it as cheap as 257 00:20:50,855 --> 00:20:54,636 possible so when you're eating a cheap sausage it can quite often feel quite bready because it's 258 00:20:54,636 --> 00:21:01,216 actually probably 40 percent bread so you're almost getting your your your your roll inside 259 00:21:01,216 --> 00:21:07,255 the sausage whereas um when we used to make our sausages um i was quite snooty about it and it 260 00:21:07,255 --> 00:21:08,936 started off by putting no rusk in, 261 00:21:09,236 --> 00:21:11,616 but actually the British customers liked 262 00:21:11,616 --> 00:21:13,976 that little squeaky, kind of slightly juicy sausage. 263 00:21:14,396 --> 00:21:16,676 So we ended up doing about 10%. 264 00:21:16,676 --> 00:21:19,095 So we were 90% meat, 10% rusk. 265 00:21:19,355 --> 00:21:21,156 And for me, that felt like a good level, 266 00:21:21,255 --> 00:21:22,595 like it was still premium. 267 00:21:22,595 --> 00:21:24,275 It had a lot of meat in it, 268 00:21:24,555 --> 00:21:25,956 but it was a little bit juicy, 269 00:21:26,116 --> 00:21:27,595 but not, you know, it wasn't too bready. 270 00:21:28,335 --> 00:21:30,055 So depending on the butchers, you know, 271 00:21:30,156 --> 00:21:31,696 will depend on how they're doing. 272 00:21:32,636 --> 00:21:36,676 I guess the temptation of adding preservatives 273 00:21:36,676 --> 00:21:41,976 to sausages will be if you're a butcher and you're you know you've only got two staff say 274 00:21:41,976 --> 00:21:46,295 you might only make sausages once a week so you need those sausages to last and look presentable 275 00:21:46,295 --> 00:21:52,196 for you know five six days and then not go off in people's fridges so the temptation is that you 276 00:21:52,196 --> 00:21:56,495 just put just a little bit of preservative and it just you know just keeps them keep some shiny 277 00:21:56,495 --> 00:22:01,515 stops them from you know and i think that is always going to be the case and most butcher 278 00:22:01,515 --> 00:22:06,255 shops that i've been to you ask them pretty much i would say all of them put some form of nitrate 279 00:22:06,255 --> 00:22:10,876 in or you know some kind of preserving but just just to stop them looking sweaty and same with 280 00:22:10,876 --> 00:22:16,015 bacon it's like you know British consumer is so dialed into pink bacon when they cook it that if 281 00:22:16,015 --> 00:22:19,936 you don't have nitrates and it goes gray straight away they think it's gone off and um so it's 282 00:22:19,936 --> 00:22:25,436 almost like an education piece like the nitrate particularly in dry cure bacon all it's doing is 283 00:22:25,436 --> 00:22:30,696 meaning that when you cook it it stays pink and actually it's not doing a huge amount else maybe 284 00:22:30,696 --> 00:22:35,255 in the kind of the cheaper wet cured stuff maybe there's another benefit that I I'm not an expert 285 00:22:35,255 --> 00:22:40,976 but particularly when it comes to you know dry aging or try dry curing and then if you're then 286 00:22:40,976 --> 00:22:45,936 smoking it as well the nitrate really is is not doing a huge amount apart from it stays pink 287 00:22:45,936 --> 00:22:53,196 and having worked in it run a butcher shop for three years if you if your public won't buy it 288 00:22:53,196 --> 00:22:57,095 because they think it's gone off it's it's a terrible business model so you're like you're 289 00:22:57,095 --> 00:23:00,515 in this kind of rock and hard place of like well i might think that nitrates are irrelevant 290 00:23:00,515 --> 00:23:06,835 but if my consumer won't buy them well now i've lost my business so like it's it's you know it's 291 00:23:06,835 --> 00:23:12,316 it's hard i guess isn't it with the with the nitrate you say like it's a bit like um apricots 292 00:23:12,316 --> 00:23:16,616 they shouldn't really be that orangey color they should be brown yeah you buy dried ones 293 00:23:16,616 --> 00:23:21,916 so so actually everyone thinks when they buy a packet of dried apricots they should be still 294 00:23:21,916 --> 00:23:28,775 that orangey color yes so in terms of the nitrate is it an organic product that they use what do they 295 00:23:28,775 --> 00:23:34,456 actually like what is the nitrate bit well it's it's um the stuff that we used to use it came in 296 00:23:34,456 --> 00:23:39,055 the bucket it was called saltpeter um and it was quite hard to get hold of because i think it's uh 297 00:23:39,055 --> 00:23:45,575 it can be used to make explosives uh in the wrong hands i never made an explosive i don't know yet 298 00:23:45,575 --> 00:23:53,416 um so much about a bag of fertilizer and some uh nitrates i believe i um i could do some i could do 299 00:23:53,416 --> 00:23:58,736 some googling but or ask chat gpt but i think it comes from like cave walls or something i don't 300 00:23:58,736 --> 00:24:03,456 know i think it's like it's a it's a mineral like it's it's essentially it's a salt it's a natural 301 00:24:03,456 --> 00:24:09,275 salt but it's it's quite it's strong and like so you only need tiny tiny amounts so so if we were 302 00:24:09,275 --> 00:24:14,275 curing bacon we would put say we put a kilo of salt on it'd probably have less than one percent 303 00:24:14,275 --> 00:24:19,816 nitrate to that kilo of salt so it's a very small amount and uh but but i but i know that i remember 304 00:24:19,816 --> 00:24:24,075 you mentioned when we did the ultra processed food episode that you said that nitrates was a 305 00:24:24,075 --> 00:24:29,055 bit of a kind of red flag for you and i i've since been looking and obviously it's in quite a lot of 306 00:24:29,055 --> 00:24:34,816 cured meats isn't it it's it's probably you know the amount i was putting in i don't know i you 307 00:24:34,816 --> 00:24:39,055 know i haven't made bacon for a few years um and probably if i made it at home i wouldn't bother 308 00:24:39,055 --> 00:24:46,636 because it's quite hard to buy it i just use um um it's the sulfate as well sulfites sulfate sulfites 309 00:24:46,636 --> 00:25:04,095 It's that too, isn't it? It's those elements. So, yeah. So in terms of the bacon side, because, you know, the World Health Organization, since I think 2015, have said that bacon and sausages are a carcinogen, a grade one or the highest form. 310 00:25:04,095 --> 00:25:15,456 But I guess, does that depend, do you think, on how that's actually being produced and how it's been stored and what's happened to that particular meat might have an impact on it? 311 00:25:15,456 --> 00:25:20,535 I think like, so we, we, so we used to make our own ham. We used to, you know, we used to, 312 00:25:20,535 --> 00:25:25,736 you know, I was a big believer in that we should make everything from scratch. And, um, and you, 313 00:25:25,876 --> 00:25:32,896 you know, we, the, the, the, um, the, the, the kind of the sundries wholesalers that we would buy 314 00:25:32,896 --> 00:25:36,355 spices from and pepper and salt and stuff, you know, you're getting your dry stores, 315 00:25:36,676 --> 00:25:40,156 they would have these kinds of pre-mixes that would then, you know, so you could buy like 316 00:25:40,156 --> 00:25:44,335 lincuture sausage flavor, you could buy salami mix, you know, you could buy these kinds of pre-mixed 317 00:25:44,335 --> 00:25:48,976 things that were just convenient and they just said you know add 100 grams to a kilo of whatever 318 00:25:48,976 --> 00:25:53,795 and it'll make a certain product and obviously lots of butchers aren't chefs you know then then 319 00:25:53,795 --> 00:25:58,916 they they wouldn't trust themselves to like get that korma chicken flavor whatever they're doing 320 00:25:58,916 --> 00:26:04,495 you know sticky sauce on they just pre-buy it in and so a lot of those things are probably red flags 321 00:26:04,495 --> 00:26:09,116 so if you go into a butcher shop and you see lots of chicken and sloppy sauces that that they're not 322 00:26:09,116 --> 00:26:13,376 they're almost certainly not homemade and they're probably absolutely riddled with all sorts of 323 00:26:13,376 --> 00:26:18,075 sulfates and nitrates and you know preservatives because they're kind of designed to keep the meat 324 00:26:18,075 --> 00:26:24,075 looking nice in the counter so you so i but but then you just you know just buy a chicken and 325 00:26:24,075 --> 00:26:27,676 then make the sauce yourself you know like it's not it's not that difficult i think that's you 326 00:26:27,676 --> 00:26:32,956 know if there's anything that i want to preach on this podcast is that it's better just to do it 327 00:26:32,956 --> 00:26:36,835 yourself because then you're in control so like go to the butcher and buy the good chicken and also 328 00:26:36,835 --> 00:26:40,995 the the good chicken that they're using is going to be in that sloppy sauce it's just that the 329 00:26:40,995 --> 00:26:46,656 coating on the sloppy sauce is probably not great and um yeah and yes if it is a home what 330 00:26:46,656 --> 00:26:51,676 for the is there things to watch for the chicken as well so like um a chicken i mean 331 00:26:51,676 --> 00:27:00,495 is it a tricky one so so chicken's a tricky one because i i pretty much would only buy organic 332 00:27:00,495 --> 00:27:05,995 chicken but actually it's really hard to buy organic chicken in a butcher shop um because 333 00:27:05,995 --> 00:27:11,795 organic chicken is super expensive i mean like probably you know a two kilo organic chicken in 334 00:27:11,795 --> 00:27:17,476 a butcher shop is probably going to cost you you know pushing 30 quid whereas you know you can get 335 00:27:17,476 --> 00:27:22,456 a barn chicken from audi probably for eight quid you know that's that's a lot of money and so i'd 336 00:27:22,456 --> 00:27:26,896 just rather have beef because like i know that with beef you're kind of a bit more you're a bit 337 00:27:26,896 --> 00:27:31,456 safe like you you know that it's grass-fed you know that it's kind of it's not you know been 338 00:27:31,456 --> 00:27:34,976 pumped full of hormones and this kind of stuff whereas chicken feels like you know if you get 339 00:27:34,976 --> 00:27:40,255 the wrong one um it's going to be quite cheap so i i guess you just have to you know ask them where 340 00:27:40,255 --> 00:27:45,376 are they from like are they you know is it free range because a lot a lot of butchers you i see 341 00:27:45,376 --> 00:27:49,575 you know they'll sell amazing beef the lamb will be great the pork they might you know they might 342 00:27:49,575 --> 00:27:54,795 be a heritage pork might be like an old spot or a british lop or you know whatever you know they 343 00:27:54,795 --> 00:27:59,116 might have a kind of heritage breed to it nice bit of fat on it and then the chicken quite often 344 00:27:59,116 --> 00:28:04,355 it's just barn reared because it's um and it's because people see chicken as cheap and you know 345 00:28:04,355 --> 00:28:06,936 It's like they want to buy a pack of chicken breast probably for a tenner. 346 00:28:07,555 --> 00:28:09,896 You know, they want to get five big chicken breasts for a tenner 347 00:28:09,896 --> 00:28:11,355 and not really think too much about it. 348 00:28:11,376 --> 00:28:13,436 And maybe they feel, I'm buying it for my local butchers, 349 00:28:13,535 --> 00:28:15,015 therefore it's going to be high quality. 350 00:28:15,515 --> 00:28:19,816 And actually, it's probably the same quality that you'd get from the supermarket. 351 00:28:20,555 --> 00:28:25,116 So actually, the chicken is the one thing that, yes, you be careful with the chicken, 352 00:28:25,316 --> 00:28:28,136 but the other meat, especially the beef, is probably... 353 00:28:28,136 --> 00:28:29,916 It's so cheap to produce chicken. 354 00:28:30,376 --> 00:28:32,275 Well, no, it's not so cheap to produce chicken, 355 00:28:32,275 --> 00:28:37,355 but you know you can produce chicken incredibly quickly um and i like we we quite often go on 356 00:28:37,355 --> 00:28:41,795 holiday in france and they'll have their poulet fume which is i think it's like farmyard chicken 357 00:28:41,795 --> 00:28:45,676 and you know essentially it's like a you know these chickens are like they're quite leggy they've got 358 00:28:45,676 --> 00:28:50,535 small breasts they've got big legs and they're quite often sold with the head on and um and you 359 00:28:50,535 --> 00:28:55,616 know this chicken will have been racing around the farmyard and they've got real flavor but us 360 00:28:55,616 --> 00:28:59,416 brits we're just like we don't want to do with them because we're like it's tough like they're 361 00:28:59,416 --> 00:29:03,876 chewy the breasts were sinewy you know like but of course the french cook them you know they do 362 00:29:03,876 --> 00:29:08,876 cocavan you know they they um they cook it for a long sloped time because they know it's you know 363 00:29:08,876 --> 00:29:13,476 this this animal's done a lot of moving and it's not just this kind of super tender thing that you 364 00:29:13,476 --> 00:29:18,616 know that the kids are going to just you know slip down easily and um and you know that's that's where 365 00:29:18,616 --> 00:29:24,376 the you know us the british consumer is used to a kind of a fat chicken that's not done much 366 00:29:24,376 --> 00:29:29,855 movement and is incredibly tender and um and to produce that chicken you kind of you know they're 367 00:29:29,855 --> 00:29:34,136 not caged but they're just you know they're they're in barns they're warm they're fed incredibly 368 00:29:34,136 --> 00:29:37,755 quickly until you know they put on loads of weight and then they're killed pretty quickly you know 369 00:29:37,755 --> 00:29:42,876 it's uh the cycle of a chicken is very very short i think i'll get the days wrong but it's around 370 00:29:42,876 --> 00:29:48,936 about 40 days from like start to finish if you quick i've got a nice butcher shop and they sell 371 00:29:48,936 --> 00:29:52,956 a hundred day chicken and it's more like the french one you're like it's only a hundred days 372 00:29:52,956 --> 00:29:58,815 I mean, that's like a third of a year, you know, whereas you think like a cow minimum, it's like 18 months, two years, you know. 373 00:29:59,116 --> 00:30:03,815 So is that something to ask the butcher then? Like how many days were the chickens alive? 374 00:30:03,995 --> 00:30:13,595 Yeah, it'd be a good one. That might put them on the spot slightly because my experience is most, you know, unless they are really passionate about chicken, most of them. 375 00:30:13,595 --> 00:30:15,555 they'll be like 376 00:30:15,555 --> 00:30:16,995 a lot of butcher's chicken 377 00:30:16,995 --> 00:30:17,936 comes from a company 378 00:30:17,936 --> 00:30:18,515 called Bannam 379 00:30:18,515 --> 00:30:29,623 and they based in Norfolk and I pretty sure they based in Norfolk and they just like they the chicken you see in like I spot the boxes and all the butchers 380 00:30:29,723 --> 00:30:32,343 You go in there, they're like, oh, Bannam chicken, Bannam chicken, Bannam chicken. 381 00:30:32,903 --> 00:30:36,603 And they're just, you know, they're a good, you know, they're a fine chicken. 382 00:30:36,943 --> 00:30:39,503 They're probably, the butchers are probably getting the better quality 383 00:30:39,503 --> 00:30:42,083 than the supermarkets, you know, so they're probably paying a bit of a premium 384 00:30:42,083 --> 00:30:43,383 for the slightly nicer birds. 385 00:30:43,503 --> 00:30:44,583 But they've all come out. 386 00:30:44,903 --> 00:30:46,523 They've all come out the same sausage machine. 387 00:30:46,523 --> 00:30:53,283 yeah so chicken's a tricky one yeah so i'm interested in henry so if you go what do you 388 00:30:53,283 --> 00:30:57,523 tend to order from the butchers do you avoid buying chicken then do you not have as many 389 00:30:57,523 --> 00:31:03,843 yeah i wouldn't i wouldn't buy chicken often from the butcher i mean i would buy occasionally but 390 00:31:03,843 --> 00:31:09,823 not not not too often for me yeah i'd go beef i actually think that uh like minced beef is great 391 00:31:09,823 --> 00:31:15,343 because the nice thing with minced beef is that it um it tends to be you know four quarter stuff 392 00:31:15,343 --> 00:31:20,423 which is just slightly more hardworking muscles, but it's a bit cheaper. It's got more flavor. 393 00:31:20,843 --> 00:31:25,423 The temptation is to go for the really lean stuff, but actually I always ask for a bit of extra fat 394 00:31:25,423 --> 00:31:31,883 because one is it's a bit more flavor. Like when you cook it, it kind of self-lubricates and it's 395 00:31:31,883 --> 00:31:41,923 a bit juicier. But also I'm not afraid of fat. I like a bit of fat in my life. So whether 10 to 396 00:31:41,923 --> 00:31:46,103 20 and particularly if you're making burgers you know a high percentage of fat makes them really 397 00:31:46,103 --> 00:31:52,263 super juicy and um but but also you're getting all that kind of sinew and all that kind of 398 00:31:52,263 --> 00:31:56,403 connective tissue which is all packed full of collagen so it's all good stuff and then because 399 00:31:56,403 --> 00:31:59,903 it's mince it's all broken down so you don't it's not doesn't get stuck in your teeth for chewing it 400 00:31:59,903 --> 00:32:03,563 because it's gone through the mincer so actually it's a really good way to get a kind of you know 401 00:32:03,563 --> 00:32:07,423 mixture of different different proteins different muscle meats bits of sinew bit of connective 402 00:32:07,423 --> 00:32:12,443 tissue, a bit of fat, you know, all mixed in together. And then it's very easy to eat. So you 403 00:32:12,443 --> 00:32:15,883 can make meatballs, you can make, you know, burgers, you make bolognese, all that kind of 404 00:32:15,883 --> 00:32:20,543 stuff. So for me, that's like, you know, probably the one I use the most, you know, it's super 405 00:32:20,543 --> 00:32:24,083 universal. I mean, obviously, Sunday roast, you know, it's nice to have a piece of topside or a 406 00:32:24,083 --> 00:32:29,123 bit of sirloin, but you know, it does cost more money. I used to say things like, you know, 407 00:32:29,143 --> 00:32:34,563 kind of like brisket or ox cheek or opstail were kind of like the cheaper cuts. But sadly, in 408 00:32:34,563 --> 00:32:38,843 recently is they've become quite fashionable so actually even they're quite expensive it's it's um 409 00:32:38,843 --> 00:32:46,963 it's it's hard to find a cheap um a uh a cheap cut probably you know liver is probably still 410 00:32:46,963 --> 00:32:52,923 pretty cheap actually oxart if you can if you can tolerate it and you probably have to prep it 411 00:32:52,923 --> 00:32:58,963 yourself but you can buy a whole oxart for about a fiver and uh in terms of weight they're probably 412 00:32:58,963 --> 00:33:03,943 two kilos now you'll you'll get quite a lot of trim so you need to you know and it's it's quite 413 00:33:03,943 --> 00:33:08,543 gruesome because you've got all of the kind of um the valves and the vents and the you know all the 414 00:33:08,543 --> 00:33:15,523 aortas yeah all those things um so you trim all that off but then you slice it thin into little 415 00:33:15,523 --> 00:33:22,623 steaks and um you'll probably get let's say you know two weeks worth of you know a steak a day 416 00:33:22,623 --> 00:33:28,063 kind of thing and um and you just got to cook it quickly and quite pink rest it it's quite useful 417 00:33:28,063 --> 00:33:33,163 if you if you're frying in a pan to deglaze it with a little bit of sherry vinegar or some red 418 00:33:33,163 --> 00:33:37,803 wine vinegar and some butter and the sherry vinegar just it just it's quite a strong flavor 419 00:33:37,803 --> 00:33:43,263 and so that acidity just helps kind of like mellow the kind of ironiness of it because obviously the 420 00:33:43,263 --> 00:33:47,503 you know it's at the heart's done a lot of pumping it's got quite a kind of irony bloody taste but 421 00:33:47,503 --> 00:33:53,223 actually super delicious and and that is very cheap but but you know i'm not i'm not saying 422 00:33:53,223 --> 00:33:57,603 that everyone's going to run out and start buying there's not going to be a run on auction but but 423 00:33:57,603 --> 00:34:02,863 for me of all of the kind of like kind of cheaper cuts the offals that one's the easiest i i don't 424 00:34:02,863 --> 00:34:08,943 mind liver but you know i've eaten spleen a few times but you know it's not it's not a family 425 00:34:08,943 --> 00:34:14,283 favorite but yeah oxal is quite an easy one yeah my kids would probably prefer when i bought phillips 426 00:34:14,283 --> 00:34:20,643 steak home you know yeah that's it and i i remember on a previous on our christmas podcast you you 427 00:34:20,643 --> 00:34:27,123 gave a great top tip to actually get the turkey legs instead of just the the turkey crown that 428 00:34:27,123 --> 00:34:33,443 was such a good top tip so so if people want to keep their prices down because they want they want 429 00:34:33,443 --> 00:34:37,243 to they want to go to the butchers they want to try and get the better quality meat and you know 430 00:34:37,243 --> 00:34:41,403 they don't want to be fooled by what could be going on at butchers if like you say if the meat 431 00:34:41,403 --> 00:34:47,563 generally comes from the same place unless it is a sort of grass-fed kind of beef what kind of yeah 432 00:34:47,563 --> 00:34:52,783 is there like a a kind of shopping list that you'd go right you could you could go in and ask for this 433 00:34:52,783 --> 00:34:59,743 and this would actually be a good balance between price and good quality meat what what would the 434 00:34:59,743 --> 00:35:05,523 average family go and order well so you know if you're in if you're into you know if you're looking 435 00:35:05,523 --> 00:35:10,183 for steaks um obviously you know your ribeyes your sirloins your fillets you know they're going to be 436 00:35:10,183 --> 00:35:14,983 the most expensive things you can buy because that's the prime cuts and that's where the butcher 437 00:35:14,983 --> 00:35:19,783 makes all their money on um so there are cheaper steaks you can buy so obviously rumps tend to be 438 00:35:19,783 --> 00:35:24,283 bit cheaper a little bit chewier but um but things like skirt steak is a great one or bavette 439 00:35:24,283 --> 00:35:29,143 is the french name it comes from this part here and it's kind of got this kind of long kind of 440 00:35:29,143 --> 00:35:33,963 kind of like strands of protein with the muscle but you as long as you cut against the grain 441 00:35:33,963 --> 00:35:39,043 it's incredibly tender and that'll be you know possibly a third of the price of fillet so it'll 442 00:35:39,043 --> 00:35:44,623 be more priced like like mince mince mince beef so you know kind of 10 pound a kilo or so so that 443 00:35:44,623 --> 00:35:48,583 is a great you know for if you're doing steak sandwiches or steak and chips you know that is a 444 00:35:48,583 --> 00:35:53,743 really good one if you if you can get it hanger steak or anglais is the french name the british 445 00:35:53,743 --> 00:35:57,563 name is known as gut steak which is not very appealing so we'll go with the american or the 446 00:35:57,563 --> 00:36:03,983 french and that is actually an internal it hangs off the the diaphragm diagram diaphragm of the 447 00:36:03,983 --> 00:36:07,783 cow so actually it's classified as offal and so when they pull out all of sorry we're getting 448 00:36:07,783 --> 00:36:12,623 really gruesome here when they when they when they pull out all of the kind of the liver and the 449 00:36:12,623 --> 00:36:17,703 kidneys and all that not kidneys all the um the kind of awfully bits the intestines it's a piece 450 00:36:17,703 --> 00:36:22,183 of muscle that kind of hangs off the diaphragm that holds it all together and so it's classified 451 00:36:22,183 --> 00:36:29,183 as offal um and there's only one per cow and is absolutely delicious you know um so i quite often 452 00:36:29,183 --> 00:36:33,843 order that from the butcher but you they tend to that'd be the kind of thing that if they're not 453 00:36:33,843 --> 00:36:39,703 selling it they could get it in for you and so they would get it from the abattoir it doesn't 454 00:36:39,703 --> 00:36:44,283 get hung because it's it's it's a steak that's kind of it's not on a bone so you can't really 455 00:36:44,283 --> 00:36:50,023 hang it um but actually it's got great flavor and it tends to be pretty cheap they might make you 456 00:36:50,023 --> 00:36:53,243 prep it yourself so you might have to get your knives out and trim off all the fat and sinew 457 00:36:53,243 --> 00:36:57,303 and stuff but that that you know is one of my favorite steaks it's got so much flavor i think 458 00:36:57,303 --> 00:37:01,123 the french used to call it the butcher steak because it was like the one that they didn't 459 00:37:01,123 --> 00:37:04,543 sell they kept it for themselves because it was like the little secret so that's a really good 460 00:37:04,543 --> 00:37:09,263 one but again any kind of you know any you know i think i think mince is great you know actually 461 00:37:09,263 --> 00:37:13,503 long live mince and and um you know when you see supermarket mince and it's in the packet it's all 462 00:37:13,503 --> 00:37:18,503 perfect you open it up and it goes brown really quickly that's because it's they pump the bag 463 00:37:18,503 --> 00:37:24,223 the trays with oxygen so they don't know they pump them with co2 so they don't oxidize sorry 464 00:37:24,223 --> 00:37:29,043 other way around and so they look fresher for longer but actually that mince isn't fresh quite 465 00:37:29,043 --> 00:37:33,223 often in a butcher shop you know they'll quite often mince it for you because there's no point 466 00:37:33,223 --> 00:37:38,643 mincing kilos and kilos and kilos of mince because it will you know it doesn't last very long so 467 00:37:38,643 --> 00:37:42,803 actually you can quite often see them you know take that piece of meat put it into the mincer and 468 00:37:42,803 --> 00:37:46,343 straight into the bag and so you know you're getting good quality fresh meat you know there's 469 00:37:46,343 --> 00:37:49,743 no you know they're not putting all the crap and it hasn't been hanging around for weeks and weeks 470 00:37:49,743 --> 00:37:54,643 in a fridge or in a freezer etc so yeah so i think mince is great i just i buy in bulk and then just 471 00:37:54,643 --> 00:38:01,363 portion into you know half half a culot like um 200 gram bags and then we just you know it's an 472 00:38:01,363 --> 00:38:05,463 easy one to whip it out and then you can cook a quick meal with it so i think yeah i think mince 473 00:38:05,463 --> 00:38:09,183 is a good it's a good shout and then that's good because i think we're made to think that mince 474 00:38:09,183 --> 00:38:14,423 isn't such a healthy option for me aren't we but it's interesting how these things kind of 475 00:38:14,423 --> 00:38:20,663 yeah back around and yeah yeah yeah that's that's that's great i think yeah that's amazing 476 00:38:20,663 --> 00:38:24,683 information i think my stomach has rumbled basically throughout that yeah i haven't 477 00:38:24,683 --> 00:38:30,603 this is a subject i i could go for hours like and i think we can do more and see that we've 478 00:38:30,603 --> 00:38:35,443 talked quite on time but um yeah it's a passionate one of mine i think you know the things i always 479 00:38:35,443 --> 00:38:39,323 live by is you know if you can support your local butcher do because once they're gone they're gone 480 00:38:39,323 --> 00:38:45,323 you know that it's such a it's such a um probably unattractive business model that um not many are 481 00:38:45,323 --> 00:38:50,283 opening though there has been a few opening in kind of bougie parts of town but uh but yeah if 482 00:38:50,283 --> 00:38:55,263 you've got a butcher do support them and uh and also like maybe meat for a treat you know like 483 00:38:55,263 --> 00:39:01,403 if meat is expensive and you you know but you want to you know like try and eat good quality but just 484 00:39:01,403 --> 00:39:04,983 eat it a little bit less you know i mean that would be you know that would be my advice you 485 00:39:04,983 --> 00:39:09,123 know rather than kind of you know just buying kind of cheap chicken or cheap pork actually you know 486 00:39:09,123 --> 00:39:14,043 kind of hold out and have something decent because it does taste nicer and i think you'll you'll enjoy 487 00:39:14,043 --> 00:39:18,143 it more well i think if you think it goes back to the old-fashioned days that's what they used to do 488 00:39:18,143 --> 00:39:22,923 didn't they they used to have good quality beef on a sunday um and they used to kind of try and 489 00:39:22,923 --> 00:39:29,003 save the best meat for that that particular day or maybe a couple times a week but yeah make it 490 00:39:29,003 --> 00:39:33,943 last don't they and um yeah and i think if you do it like that it's um it's a healthier way to get 491 00:39:33,943 --> 00:39:38,483 your protein um and to get your iron levels as well because if you think about it you can get 492 00:39:38,483 --> 00:39:45,323 your iron and failing that you just need to befriend a local butcher or someone who can 493 00:39:45,323 --> 00:39:50,763 butcher up a cow i.e me and um and then go in and buy a whole cow and then uh get yourself a chest 494 00:39:50,763 --> 00:39:55,163 freezer that's probably the cheapest way to do it but uh yeah yeah they're about two thousand 495 00:39:55,163 --> 00:40:00,943 quid and and yeah about 400 kilos so you know you you get you get a lot of meat it'll last you a year 496 00:40:00,943 --> 00:40:06,423 yeah i think i think we should get people's uh feedback see how they got on with their local 497 00:40:06,423 --> 00:40:12,143 visit and um what meat they bought and what things so maybe on another episode henry you 498 00:40:12,143 --> 00:40:16,843 can talk about um some nice recipes to do with some of those more unusual cups that 499 00:40:16,843 --> 00:40:21,803 some of us like myself have never heard of yeah yeah totally yeah no i'd happily happily do that 500 00:40:21,803 --> 00:40:25,563 yeah let's well let's let's do a part two oh great chat to you as always hayley 501 00:40:30,943 --> 00:40:31,443 you