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Hi, Henry. Welcome to this episode of The Healthy Bit. We're going to talk about ultra-processed

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food today. And I know we're both very excited to dive into this topic. How are things going

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for you at this time of year with people asking you about ultra-processed food coming up to

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the festive period?

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Yeah. Hi, Hayley. Yeah, good to chat. Yeah, I guess UPFs, you know, they've become quite,

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I don't know if the word trendy is the right word,

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but they've certainly been in the zeitgeist.

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And for probably the last couple of years,

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it seems like they've been really heightened.

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There's always that kind of little kind of ripple effect that it,

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you know, you start reading stuff in the news and books come out

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and, you know, the BBC does a documentary on it

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and then it kind of disappears away and then another article comes back.

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And we find kind of working in the baking industry

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that it's something that we're really conscious of.

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And, you know, we can talk more about, you know,

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what they are and how they how they use etc but um uh it's yeah probably in the last like six

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months customers particularly when they come to visit the bakery or you know uh talking face to

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face uh start asking questions about you know kind of you know what are the ingredients that

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are going in why are you using certain things you know what does that mean why is it there

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and um and I guess for me it's about um yeah you know trying to remove as many as possible

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obviously baked goods are processed and by their very nature so you know it is a processed good

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some things are there because we have to put them in there and then other things actually um they're

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there for a justified reason but we might have an alternative so it's kind of like giving people

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options but we're definitely seeing more and more customers particularly i guess the ones that are

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kind of health conscious so like your kind of your retail shops you know where people are really

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looking at the label maybe the customers that are buying stuff to put on a cafe menu where you know

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as a customer, you know, you might be buying a, you know, a sandwich or I don't know, a burger or

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something, and you're not necessarily getting the full list of ingredients unless you ask for it.

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But obviously when you're in a restaurant, unless you've got an allergen, you're probably not going

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to ask. You're just going to, you know, order and eat it. And they're maybe, maybe less conscious,

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particularly if they're, you know, particularly places that are producing, you know, delicious

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burgers, but maybe have, you know, American plastic cheese and all the other sauces and

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whatnot that go into it so maybe they're less less fussed because maybe they feel like they're not

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you know trying to offer healthy food but it's definitely something that is becoming more

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kind of um yeah talked about and i guess for me i've been you know very aware of you know trying

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to you know when you cook from scratch it's actually really hard to put ultra-prested foods

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in your uh or whatever they are into your foods because you're kind of cooking from store

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ingredients and stuff. But I guess it's so easy just to kind of not read the back of the label.

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Whereas for me, I'm, you know, I'm always studying the back of the label and my kids are always like,

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dad, can you stop reading the back of the label, particularly when it's something that they want?

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But yeah, I don't know. I guess I'm just maybe just a little bit cynical and also just curious

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to be like, what's in it? You know, like, is this, is this stating what it should be? You know,

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it's got a nice, lovely packaging and it's got, you know, a picture of a, I don't know,

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like a sunflower or a heart on it or something.

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And actually, I just want to see, is this actually what it says it is?

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And normally, it's not.

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Yeah.

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And I think when, I don't know about you, Henry,

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but when obviously you have being a mum and also a mother to a daughter with an allergy,

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I think as a mum, I was wanting to give my daughter the best food anyway.

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So we very much always have tended to cook from scratch.

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But when you're out and about and you're trying to find a snack

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and something healthy for a child,

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if you're not near home or you know you're traveling or something like that it's really

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really difficult but having an allergy it makes you look more at the ingredient list I think I

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mentioned this before that I've actually used when she was young enough I used the nut allergy

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as an excuse not to give her some of the foods because I saw the amount of e-colors and everything

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that goes in it I just thought I don't want to give this to you anyway like I just feel terrible

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handing over this basically laboratory of chemicals to you.

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And like you said, we're completely bombarded with ultra-processed foods around us.

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And although the awareness is going up in terms of how we shouldn't be eating these types of food,

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it's almost becoming more impossible to find the healthier options because you go around.

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Yeah, totally.

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And you can cut out most of the aisles just by going, I'm just not going to go down those ones

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because I just need to head for the vegetables.

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Isn't there like a rule that you just walk around the outside

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is like the safe bit and then the inside bit, avoid them?

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I've definitely seen that meme on the internet.

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And yeah, you're totally right.

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It's an absolute minefield.

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And there's probably, you know, there's certain kind of UPFs that,

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well, I guess probably maybe it'd be quite good to define what a UPF is.

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And I'm not by no means an expert.

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I'm just a kind of, you know, I guess I know bits about that would happen

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in the or ingredients that will be used in the baking industry but obviously there's you know

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the world of food and technology and you know is um is is pretty vast and a lot of these products

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have been created like possibly with uh with good intentions or like you know that they were

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doing a specific job whether that's keeping something crispy or stopping something from

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staling or stopping something from going moldy or keeping something soft you know there's there's

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quite often a reason and quite often it comes down to like actually you know if you're like

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say take a loaf of bread you know if i've baked a loaf of bread and i've used really high quality

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ingredients and then and then you buy it but then on day two it's now only good for toast and then

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you end up chucking half away well then that feels like a waste so then you know you as a consumer

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and me as a producer we get together and chat and go like well hey how can we like solve this problem

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so we might be like oh well maybe you could freeze some of the bread or maybe you could

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you know you know have a bigger family and eat more if it'll buy some more or maybe i could add

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this little ingredient in and it will keep the bread a bit softer so that will last for three

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or four days before it goes for toast and you're like great I'm now saving money and it's so what

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starts off as like actually quite a kind of uh innocent and kind of sensible thing to be like

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yeah of course we should you know um do this little tweak to this loaf to now make it last longer

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um but suddenly you know there is those kind of unintended consequences and I guess suddenly it

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becomes bread's lasting six weeks and now you've got to put all these other things in there to like

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you know stop it going moldy or stop it mailing bad and whatnot and then before you know it you've

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got 42 ingredients and the rest and none of it's good for you and it probably is like why did it

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take us this long to figure out that maybe putting a load of um like non-natural ingredients have been

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you know um yeah you know made in ways probably actually if you saw the process you wouldn't be

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that um pleased to then put it in your body no and it's like the um i kind of really distinctly

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remember I think that's when I got into science and I distinctly remember studying it and food

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technology is obviously an area that I remember being quite popular at the time and talking about

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exactly what you said in terms of food technologists looking at how can we create food that is appealing

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to customers and it was all about consumer kind of selling to consumers and actually like you say

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making products that are the longevity of them but also looking for the best taste and flavour

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and smell and experience and hence why when you open up a pot of Pringles you get that crunch

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and it's that that's also triggering all different kind of sensations in your body and your brain to

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kind of want you to eat more including the products that they use very clever make you want

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I mean very clever marketing isn't it so there's the whole marketing side to it and how they were

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trying to develop all of those things to make it a really good customer experience but also now I

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don't know if you've noticed this but i feel like now that it's turned a bit of a corner in the sense

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that they're now looking to see you know quality of ingredients seems to be going down so it's like

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they're trying to create the same products let's take just for example say like a chocolate product

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you know the amount or percentage of cocoa or whatever they're using is probably declining

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because the cost or maybe they can't import it or access it i'm not sure the exact reasons but

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quality's going down speaking sorry speak from experience it'll definitely be cost that'll be

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the main driver because okay so at my bakery we used to make a brioche bun and uh it had i might

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have told this before but it had about 20 of the weight of flour was butter you know so it was like

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super indulgent it was like a proper classic brioche bun had egg yolks in it you know free

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range egg proper proper butter um you know quality flour and lots of milk again you know organic milk

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and it was a very premium product.

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But then as time went on,

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we had to keep putting the price up

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because the price of things like butter and eggs,

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you know, keep going up.

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And so we have to pass that cost onto the customer.

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And then the customer turns around and goes,

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I can't afford to keep,

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you keep putting the price up.

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I'm going to have to buy an alternative.

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So what we,

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so what we're forced with a situation of like,

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well, we either just go,

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no, this is the product we're selling,

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but you're working with customers

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who are a significant part of your business.

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You can't just like,

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say goodbye to them because you're like, you know, you've employed people to like produce

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this product for them. So you naturally come to a situation where you go, well, we could

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take some of the butter out. We'll just make it 10%, you know, and then you do some samples.

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It's like, yeah, it's fine. You know, by the time you've got the burger and the sauce,

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no one's going to notice and it's still a Brewer's. And then you fast for another five

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years and now you're down to 5% and you're like, well, it's not really a Brewer's anymore,

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but we've taken the eggs out. We've now put soy flour in because that kind of does the

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same thing and you know that kind of you know maybe we can make it vegan because that kind of

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fits that market and it's cheaper and uh and so you go on this kind of like sliding scale and it's

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all done with like good intentions because you know as a business we're just trying to like

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please our customer and they're also you know if our costs are going up their costs are going up

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and so we're all kind of like just making these little decisions and then you suddenly fast

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forward you're like we're now making a product that isn't we don't even call it brioche anymore

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um we've changed its name um it's now got two percent butter it's still a lovely product but

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it's like it's and and it and it still costs about the same as the original brioche because

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you know prices have gone up but we so we've managed to kind of maintain it so in some respects

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like you could look at that and go well it's kind of like a form of shrinkflation in some respects

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like it's um but it's like we've like downgraded the quality of the ingredient to make something

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that's then more affordable.

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Now you just,

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that small example for me is a bakery,

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but you do that as,

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you know, like a big chocolate manufacturer.

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Well, if you're trying to keep your chocolate bars

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at a competitive price

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and you don't want them to double in price

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because people are going to be outraged,

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well, you just,

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you either make them smaller

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or you find a way to make them cheaper.

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Well, mass produced stuff's already pretty cheap

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because it's on a,

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you know, it's on a continuous line

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and it's hard to make that too much more efficient.

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So then it's just downgrade the ingredients.

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So like put less cocoa in.

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chocolate's really expensive chocolate's been flying up this year it's it's ridiculous how

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how expensive chocolate is now so if you can put less in and you can substitute it with something

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cheaper great the consumer may not know and then you have to get even more clever by putting more

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of these funky ingredients because obviously if you've if you've got something like chocolate that

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you know it melts in your mouth it's got that lovely aroma it coats you know all that stuff

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now you've removed that you've got to recreate it but you've got to do it with synthetic stuff

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And that's when food becomes like an engineered laboratory, you know, incredibly clever people doing incredibly clever stuff to make it mimic what the original was like.

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And that's great, but it turns out it's probably not very good for you.

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No. And then that's the impact on the body, isn't it?

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because it's a bit like when people sort of substitute sort of sugar for the kind of sweeteners

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and things and anything in the body, it's, you know, we've got receptors in the body. So it's

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going to trick the body to think that you're getting certain food sources or food types or

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that experience in the brain and that kind of trickery that you just mentioned. And, but I think

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as you, as you said, sort of, I think how people define ultra processed food, I think is really

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variable across the population and I think whether that's down to just awareness or education or

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even just personal interest in health so some people are very health conscious and they're

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sort of really into it and it seems to be you're either really into it or you're really not bothered

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and some people are still on the not bothered pile and that to me is quite terrifying because

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it's around us all the time it's impossible not to pick and I don't feel like this but whenever I

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go to a shop I'm fascinated by what people put in there in their baskets and and it is hard if you

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want to go and buy something from from a shop because you're on the road or you're traveling

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and and there you are standing with you like one piece of fruit because that's the healthiest thing

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you found and you've probably had to probably go for a salad because that but it's still a bit

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processed because it's in a in a box and it's probably been added yeah other things added to it

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so it's not the best but then you're you're standing amongst people who are probably

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packing their trolleys and you it's like spot the healthy bit literally literally so it's trying to

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find the one thing that you think gosh they're they're um they're supermarket trolleys just

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rammed with you know refined white bread crisps uh chocolates everything fizzy pop

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and you think blimey and you just think your body cannot cope with that um and then we we wonder why

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you know the health and the population's health is is really suffering um and we all know don't

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we that you know ultra processed foods probably going to increase our risk of cardiovascular

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disease and you know the chances of having um possibly a stroke or coronary artery disease

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is is higher and it's something high like 40 to 66 percent increase if you do eat these kinds of

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foods alongside risks of cancer and having heart related issues and just basically having

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high blood pressure and even impacts on mental health and sleep and that sort of thing.

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But I don think the more microbiology impact is spoken about and that what interests me because it can impact on your tendons on your bone cells on your muscle cells People probably don think about that when they

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pop these things into their mouth. But it is, you know, and they wonder probably why their tendons

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have stiffened up, because our tendons, you know, rely on collagen. And these ultra processed foods

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can really impact on the kind of process that the tendon goes through in terms of the tendon

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cell turnover. And then what impact that has in terms of any kind of recovery. And if you're not

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exercising and, you know, what else is your diet like? And what else do you do? Do you even exercise?

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Some people might not. And they're having a high sort of level of ultra processed foods.

214
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So then they're going to get fatty infiltration into their muscles. And it's a whole cascade

215
00:15:18,924 --> 00:15:24,485
of chaos that's going on through their body. And then they wonder why, you know, we're seeing

216
00:15:24,485 --> 00:15:32,605
a generation that's getting weaker, because their fat level to protein and muscle combination is

217
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poor. So that kind of ratio between the two is significantly impacted on just by what we're

218
00:15:39,544 --> 00:15:45,485
putting into our mouth. And that really terrifies me actually as a concern for the population.

219
00:15:45,485 --> 00:15:54,025
when you um when you're in the shops and you're scouting around and looking in other people's

220
00:15:54,025 --> 00:16:00,944
trolleys noted um not judging just having a little look what have you got there um well

221
00:16:00,944 --> 00:16:07,924
I wouldn't have made that choice um the um yeah sorry less of that but um is there any like certain

222
00:16:07,924 --> 00:16:13,385
ones aside from all UPS is there certain ones that like are real red flags for you or ones that

223
00:16:13,385 --> 00:16:20,424
you like oh if i see that i just avoid it kind of thing yeah i think it's the all of them it is it

224
00:16:20,424 --> 00:16:25,444
is it's kind of one of all of them the one i actually i think the one out of all of them at

225
00:16:25,444 --> 00:16:31,605
the moment is the processed meats um because of the risk um you know the world health organization

226
00:16:31,605 --> 00:16:38,285
um have listed things like ham and other meat products as like a a grade i think grade one or

227
00:16:38,285 --> 00:16:41,444
the highest grade of carcinogenic level.

228
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So that really worries me.

229
00:16:44,225 --> 00:16:48,824
And the fact that we still give our children ham sandwiches is,

230
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to me, just is really worrying.

231
00:16:51,324 --> 00:16:53,304
So I ban.

232
00:16:53,585 --> 00:16:54,544
Is that the?

233
00:16:56,785 --> 00:16:59,264
Yeah, we've got the nitrate side of things,

234
00:16:59,264 --> 00:17:04,225
but it's kind of the impact on the bowel and how these processed,

235
00:17:04,225 --> 00:17:08,344
So processed meats can really increase your risk of bowel cancer.

236
00:17:08,685 --> 00:17:10,725
And it's linked with that very strongly.

237
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And also the fact that the World Health Organization and we know that these meats do put that, you know, they're just a carcinogen.

238
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You know, you'd be better to something else that you could eat is probably much healthier.

239
00:17:23,465 --> 00:17:29,545
So probably even processed cereals are probably a better choice than like your processed meats if you had to pick out.

240
00:17:29,545 --> 00:17:34,824
so i don't i don't cringe so much when people put cereals in their in their in their supermarket

241
00:17:34,824 --> 00:17:41,725
trolley but when i see packets of bacon and ham and and it's not it doesn't seem that people eat it

242
00:17:41,725 --> 00:17:47,324
in um moderation it's when you also go to pubs and places like that that you know you're getting

243
00:17:47,324 --> 00:17:53,124
served burgers and it's just loaded with all the all the other kind of processed meats that that

244
00:17:53,124 --> 00:17:59,305
worries me yeah i mean okay okay back in the day so because i so i i used to be a butcher

245
00:17:59,305 --> 00:18:04,624
Haley back in a few years ago. So, and we used to make our own hams and bacon and stuff.

246
00:18:04,624 --> 00:18:10,705
I actually won a, um, a, a buttery award for our, um, our smoked ham. Anyway, got a gold

247
00:18:10,705 --> 00:18:15,064
star. Anyway, and I guess it's kind of, it, cause cause obviously, you know, from my point

248
00:18:15,064 --> 00:18:19,465
of view and that's why I wanted to ask like, which ones trigger? Cause I, cause I, you know,

249
00:18:19,524 --> 00:18:24,844
I probably have other ones that trigger me and then maybe, maybe bacon doesn't like, I

250
00:18:24,844 --> 00:18:28,465
mean, I happen to love bacon and I probably eat too much of it, but I would always, I guess

251
00:18:28,465 --> 00:18:33,364
For me, I would always try and buy bacon from a butcher that makes it themselves.

252
00:18:33,905 --> 00:18:36,405
Now, obviously, I know it's got salt in it because you have to have salt

253
00:18:36,405 --> 00:18:40,824
and it'll probably have some kind of nitrate in it because if it stays pink,

254
00:18:40,945 --> 00:18:43,725
whereas if you don't put the nitrates in it, it doesn't stay pink.

255
00:18:43,884 --> 00:18:48,344
But most bacon that you see out there tends to have nitrate in it

256
00:18:48,344 --> 00:18:49,384
for keeping that pink color.

257
00:18:49,665 --> 00:18:53,324
But I guess, you know, in my mind, I would see that as like,

258
00:18:53,364 --> 00:18:56,405
well, if it's been dry cured and then it's been hung and it's been sliced,

259
00:18:56,405 --> 00:18:58,905
that's come from a good pig, that's probably better.

260
00:18:59,564 --> 00:19:02,104
Or in my mind, I wouldn't be thinking about getting bowel cancer.

261
00:19:02,465 --> 00:19:04,925
But totally, if I saw, you know, if I was picking up, you know,

262
00:19:05,005 --> 00:19:08,165
cheap Danish bacon, you know, that's been wet cured and it's, you know,

263
00:19:08,185 --> 00:19:11,824
it's just been, I don't know, like it's come from a pig that's been barn read

264
00:19:11,824 --> 00:19:12,784
or, you know, whatever.

265
00:19:12,884 --> 00:19:15,505
It's not had, you know, a good diet itself.

266
00:19:16,425 --> 00:19:17,945
I don't know, but maybe that's just coke.

267
00:19:18,124 --> 00:19:18,505
I don't know.

268
00:19:18,824 --> 00:19:19,405
I agree.

269
00:19:19,804 --> 00:19:22,205
Would you kind of see all bacon as being a bad or?

270
00:19:22,584 --> 00:19:24,264
No, so I'm like you, Henry.

271
00:19:24,264 --> 00:19:31,145
So I'm talking more about the very cheap meats that you find classically in the supermarket.

272
00:19:31,364 --> 00:19:36,745
So those kind of like wafer thin ham pieces that just don't resemble ham in any sense.

273
00:19:37,445 --> 00:19:41,304
So, you know, as much as I'm sort of health conscious, I'm not perfect.

274
00:19:41,665 --> 00:19:42,485
So if...

275
00:19:42,485 --> 00:19:42,725
Who is?

276
00:19:42,905 --> 00:19:43,745
Who is?

277
00:19:43,824 --> 00:19:45,024
But you try your hardest.

278
00:19:45,384 --> 00:19:49,764
And I think, and I always kind of relate it to the good old days, you know, like a grandma,

279
00:19:50,284 --> 00:19:52,824
you know, a 90 year old that's alive today.

280
00:19:52,824 --> 00:19:57,304
you know they they would go to the butchers and they'd get decent quality ham and i think if you're

281
00:19:57,304 --> 00:20:02,045
going to eat ham that's exactly what i would do because like you've got you know it's where you

282
00:20:02,045 --> 00:20:07,665
source that from so if my daughter wanted a ham sandwich you know i i'd say well look we're just

283
00:20:07,665 --> 00:20:12,524
not going to go to the supermarket and get it because it's ridiculously bad for you but i would

284
00:20:12,524 --> 00:20:16,624
say let's go and try and get the the best ham we can get from the butcher so i'm not against that

285
00:20:16,624 --> 00:20:22,145
in any sense. It's that really, it's that really awkward, the stuff that, you know,

286
00:20:22,245 --> 00:20:25,844
you cringe at too, Henry. Not your award-winning half.

287
00:20:25,864 --> 00:20:29,784
The cheapest stuff. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. The stuff that comes in a square, you know,

288
00:20:29,784 --> 00:20:36,104
and it's all nicely sliced up. You know that, you know, yes, it's pork and it's got salt in it,

289
00:20:36,165 --> 00:20:40,084
but it's probably got a load of other ingredients. And there'll also be a whole load of non-declarable

290
00:20:40,084 --> 00:20:44,564
ingredients as well, because they're classified as processing aids. So if you can read, you know,

291
00:20:44,564 --> 00:20:46,445
10 ingredients, there's probably another

292
00:20:46,445 --> 00:20:48,645
8 or 9 that have been added that you don't

293
00:20:48,645 --> 00:20:50,185
even know about and they'll be kind of

294
00:20:50,185 --> 00:20:52,725
enzyme based ingredients that will do something

295
00:20:52,725 --> 00:20:54,445
but they'll vanish

296
00:20:54,445 --> 00:20:56,384
during the processing part of the

297
00:20:56,384 --> 00:20:58,685
curing or the boiling

298
00:20:58,685 --> 00:21:00,604
whatever it is and then

299
00:21:00,604 --> 00:21:02,545
they do it out to declare it but there's no

300
00:21:02,545 --> 00:21:04,384
and there's almost no way of you checking

301
00:21:04,384 --> 00:21:06,584
as a consumer whether it's in there

302
00:21:06,584 --> 00:21:08,685
like the only way you find out is if you

303
00:21:08,685 --> 00:21:10,784
became a big buyer of

304
00:21:10,784 --> 00:21:12,645
that ham from the factory

305
00:21:12,645 --> 00:21:14,284
and then you could ask them for their

306
00:21:14,564 --> 00:21:18,165
in detailed spec sheets that would then have all of the non-declarable stuff on.

307
00:21:18,645 --> 00:21:20,064
But they wouldn't give that to you as a customer.

308
00:21:20,284 --> 00:21:25,185
Like you'd have to be buying tons and tons and have a, you know, a multi-year contract.

309
00:21:25,485 --> 00:21:26,225
And so you just don't know.

310
00:21:26,304 --> 00:21:28,284
So I guess you're probably right.

311
00:21:28,364 --> 00:21:31,124
The best thing to do is just don't eat it because if you can't,

312
00:21:31,604 --> 00:21:34,364
you've got no way of verifying all the stuff that's in it.

313
00:21:34,624 --> 00:21:35,304
Just don't eat it.

314
00:21:35,405 --> 00:21:36,344
It's probably the easiest thing.

315
00:21:36,645 --> 00:21:39,524
I was just going to say, so if you go to like a butcher,

316
00:21:39,524 --> 00:21:43,624
so someone like me, Henry, then who doesn't have to buy meat in as a butcher

317
00:21:43,624 --> 00:21:51,064
and has to cut it up so if I if um you know as a as a as a normal regular mum um wanting to go and

318
00:21:51,064 --> 00:21:56,884
get if you know someone is going to be a little bit very tiny in very small amounts if you did

319
00:21:56,884 --> 00:22:03,064
want to buy it is all ham very much the same when you go to butchers or is it is it very variable

320
00:22:03,064 --> 00:22:09,564
in terms of what you could be getting is is variable I mean depends on the butcher but a lot

321
00:22:09,564 --> 00:22:16,405
A lot of them will buy the ham in, so it's probably then made in a fairly big factory somewhere.

322
00:22:16,405 --> 00:22:22,425
You know, near us, near Bristol, there's a big meat processing plant.

323
00:22:22,645 --> 00:22:26,124
And if you live nearby it and the wind blows in the wrong direction, it smells pretty bad.

324
00:22:27,245 --> 00:22:28,384
Thankfully, I don't live next to it.

325
00:22:28,524 --> 00:22:31,764
But they process, I think, about 7,000 pigs a day.

326
00:22:32,405 --> 00:22:36,945
And they're making for, you know, Waitrose, Tesco, Sainsbury's, M&S.

327
00:22:37,005 --> 00:22:38,905
You know, they're making for all of these different supermarkets.

328
00:22:38,905 --> 00:22:44,965
but they'll also be producing for you know trade accounts so for for butchers and wholesale butchers

329
00:22:44,965 --> 00:22:50,505
etc and um so actually you know even if you go to your butcher and you see that you know nice ham

330
00:22:50,505 --> 00:22:55,505
ready to be sliced it might be the same ham that ends up in wait waitrose but it just hasn't been

331
00:22:55,505 --> 00:22:59,784
sliced and put in a packet so actually it's gone through the same thing so i think for me it's about

332
00:22:59,784 --> 00:23:04,685
building up a relationship and building up trust so you know if you if you've got a local butcher

333
00:23:04,685 --> 00:23:08,925
that you can chat to and then oh yeah we cure it ourselves well if you're interested you'd be like

334
00:23:08,925 --> 00:23:14,124
well what are you curing it in like you know and this is this is a lot of effort just to find out

335
00:23:14,124 --> 00:23:17,165
how your bacon's made you know and actually you probably get to the point where you're like well

336
00:23:17,165 --> 00:23:21,185
I'll just make my own bacon because you know if you're making it yourself you don't need to put

337
00:23:21,185 --> 00:23:26,104
nitrates in because you're not worried about it looking gray when it cooks because it's only you

338
00:23:26,104 --> 00:23:30,225
eating it not you're not trying to sell it to a consumer and that's probably how you know most

339
00:23:30,225 --> 00:23:35,024
most bacon would have been consumed. People would have had a, I don't know, a village pig,

340
00:23:35,284 --> 00:23:39,264
and then they would have cured it, and then they would have eaten it. That was kind of like the

341
00:23:39,264 --> 00:23:44,685
old way, but that's not the world that we live in at the moment. But I mean, that's extreme. I'm not

342
00:23:44,685 --> 00:23:49,104
suggesting that we all need to have a pig in the back garden and start curing our own. If I find

343
00:23:49,104 --> 00:23:54,044
myself retiring, I would quite like to have a couple of pigs and, you know, do a bit curing.

344
00:23:54,145 --> 00:24:00,205
But then that's a more organic way of doing it, isn't it? So then, to me, that's like,

345
00:24:00,225 --> 00:24:06,764
If you're going to have, like, I would almost love to have lived in the olden days when they did do it like that.

346
00:24:06,905 --> 00:24:11,384
Because I think, like, I can't, you just imagine the taste and the flavor, can't you?

347
00:24:11,465 --> 00:24:12,445
That it's just dumb.

348
00:24:13,304 --> 00:24:19,524
So, yeah, so if someone did that and they would live down the road, that's when I would eat a little bit of that.

349
00:24:19,705 --> 00:24:20,804
Yeah, fine, fine, fine.

350
00:24:20,864 --> 00:24:26,584
But yeah, it's the stuff that is not resembling any kind of meat in any form, which is my thing.

351
00:24:26,584 --> 00:24:26,764
No.

352
00:24:27,044 --> 00:24:27,985
Yeah, yeah, I don't like.

353
00:24:27,985 --> 00:24:30,784
I like the rule

354
00:24:30,784 --> 00:24:32,044
if you can't pronounce it

355
00:24:32,044 --> 00:24:32,925
it's probably

356
00:24:32,925 --> 00:24:35,784
and I don't mean that for like

357
00:24:35,784 --> 00:24:36,905
you know foreign food

358
00:24:36,905 --> 00:24:38,205
obviously there's lots of Greek dishes

359
00:24:38,205 --> 00:24:39,064
that I can't pronounce

360
00:24:39,064 --> 00:24:39,905
but I'd still eat them

361
00:24:39,905 --> 00:24:40,384
because they're delicious

362
00:24:40,384 --> 00:24:42,225
but you know if you're reading a label

363
00:24:42,225 --> 00:24:44,064
and it's got some long word

364
00:24:44,064 --> 00:24:44,524
and you're like

365
00:24:44,524 --> 00:24:46,544
I guess it's when you look at

366
00:24:46,544 --> 00:24:48,324
like face cream or shampoo

367
00:24:48,324 --> 00:24:49,784
like half the ingredients

368
00:24:49,784 --> 00:24:51,124
you're like I can't pronounce that

369
00:24:51,124 --> 00:24:51,604
because it's just

370
00:24:51,604 --> 00:24:53,165
it's lychotin or something

371
00:24:53,165 --> 00:24:55,485
and when you see those names

372
00:24:55,485 --> 00:24:56,425
in your food

373
00:24:56,425 --> 00:24:56,884
and you're like

374
00:24:56,884 --> 00:24:59,324
I think that's probably something to avoid.

375
00:24:59,584 --> 00:25:01,485
But it is tricky.

376
00:25:01,905 --> 00:25:06,124
I think ones that trigger me or I'm kind of hyper aware of.

377
00:25:06,205 --> 00:25:10,364
So for me, one of them is kind of veg oils sneaked in.

378
00:25:10,725 --> 00:25:15,165
Now, obviously, veg oils are in absolutely everything, whether that's erypsid oil or sunflower oil.

379
00:25:15,784 --> 00:25:18,905
I did that sad thing of finding out how they made it.

380
00:25:19,124 --> 00:25:23,145
Now, not the kind of cold pressed stuff that you get, you know, from your local farmer's market, whatever.

381
00:25:23,425 --> 00:25:25,705
The kind of the cheaper vegetable oils.

382
00:25:25,705 --> 00:25:28,024
and actually when you see how they're made

383
00:25:28,024 --> 00:25:29,925
it's a pretty grisly looking

384
00:25:29,925 --> 00:25:31,844
process, a lot of kind of

385
00:25:31,844 --> 00:25:34,064
chemical extraction and then

386
00:25:34,064 --> 00:25:35,985
lots of kind of oxidisation

387
00:25:35,985 --> 00:25:38,104
and then they flavour it or they

388
00:25:38,104 --> 00:25:40,024
remove the flavour because it's so bitter and

389
00:25:40,024 --> 00:25:42,124
disgusting and so there's a lot of processing

390
00:25:42,124 --> 00:25:43,445
to get to this kind of cheap

391
00:25:43,445 --> 00:25:46,084
fuel and then it's quite often sold

392
00:25:46,084 --> 00:25:48,084
with a nice little healthy heart

393
00:25:48,084 --> 00:25:49,604
on it or kind of lowering

394
00:25:49,604 --> 00:25:51,804
saturated fat, so whatever that might be

395
00:25:51,804 --> 00:25:53,445
and that sounds like a good thing

396
00:25:53,445 --> 00:25:55,245
and that

397
00:25:55,705 --> 00:25:59,364
For me, it's something that I try and avoid and not eat.

398
00:25:59,665 --> 00:26:03,405
But when you start checking ingredients, it's in absolutely everything.

399
00:26:03,405 --> 00:26:06,725
And the bit that I really hate is when, I don't know, for example,

400
00:26:06,784 --> 00:26:11,405
I picked up some tin mackerel the other day and it said in extra virgin olive oil.

401
00:26:11,524 --> 00:26:12,064
I was like, great.

402
00:26:12,344 --> 00:26:12,985
So I picked it up.

403
00:26:13,284 --> 00:26:16,284
Now, that was written nice and big and bold on the front from a reputable brand.

404
00:26:16,604 --> 00:26:23,485
And then I flipped it around and it was 10% extra virgin olive oil, 90% sunflower oil.

405
00:26:23,485 --> 00:26:28,505
and so you you you just have to double check and i was like actually i don't want that so then i

406
00:26:28,505 --> 00:26:34,104
bought the one that was in spring water and then added my own olive oil on top and um and all things

407
00:26:34,104 --> 00:26:38,945
like pestos you know like the kids quite often like you know pasta pesto actually they've grown

408
00:26:38,945 --> 00:26:41,905
out of that but we definitely went through a stage of you know it was kind of an easy supper

409
00:26:41,905 --> 00:26:46,505
and um you know sometimes we'd make it ourselves but occasionally you know you're caught short and

410
00:26:46,505 --> 00:26:50,725
you're like i'm just going to grab a jar and and then you read the ingredients and you're like well

411
00:26:50,725 --> 00:26:54,665
it's got you know three percent extra virgin olive oil and then the rest of it is bulked out

412
00:26:54,665 --> 00:26:59,064
with this cheaper well some people on internet would call it industrial sludge anyway that's

413
00:26:59,064 --> 00:27:04,384
maybe a bit um inflammatory but but like it is again it's back to that analogy of like how can

414
00:27:04,384 --> 00:27:09,165
we make this pesto and how can we keep it affordable olive oil is very expensive therefore

415
00:27:09,165 --> 00:27:13,445
we need to substitute it with a cheaper ingredient but still put a little bit of olive oil in so then

416
00:27:13,445 --> 00:27:17,844
we can name it and it's just that kind of slow degradation of the quality of the ingredients

417
00:27:17,844 --> 00:27:22,584
going in and i guess you know fats are an expensive product you know butter's expensive

418
00:27:22,584 --> 00:27:27,745
coconut oil's expensive extra virgin olive oil's expensive so if you're trying to like recreate

419
00:27:27,745 --> 00:27:33,485
those products then you know sunflower rolls incredibly cheap you know um rapeseed oil grows

420
00:27:33,485 --> 00:27:39,245
all over the uk you know it's it's a it's a it's a cheap commodity and therefore you can make cheap

421
00:27:39,245 --> 00:27:45,725
fat and you know so if you can market that as um as being good for you and as a kind of like oh

422
00:27:45,725 --> 00:27:47,725
it's healthier than butter kind of thing,

423
00:27:48,104 --> 00:27:49,864
then, you know, us as the

424
00:27:49,864 --> 00:27:51,584
consumers, we're like, well, who do you trust?

425
00:27:51,725 --> 00:27:53,685
You know, you just got to like, you try and, you know,

426
00:27:53,905 --> 00:27:55,844
I try not to be

427
00:27:55,844 --> 00:27:57,824
cynical, but you only have

428
00:27:57,824 --> 00:27:59,764
to kind of look around, but also how

429
00:27:59,764 --> 00:28:01,804
it makes you feel. Like, I know that if I

430
00:28:01,804 --> 00:28:03,784
eat a load of chips down at the

431
00:28:03,784 --> 00:28:04,564
fish and chip shop,

432
00:28:05,005 --> 00:28:07,584
I feel dreadful afterwards.

433
00:28:08,024 --> 00:28:10,005
And you're like, but when I cook them at home,

434
00:28:10,344 --> 00:28:11,604
and if I'm cooking chips at home,

435
00:28:11,884 --> 00:28:13,844
I'll either do them in, I quite often

436
00:28:13,844 --> 00:28:15,165
do them in coconut oil or

437
00:28:15,725 --> 00:28:21,084
beef tallow all dripping, you know, and I don't feel awful. I'm like, well, it's the same potato,

438
00:28:21,425 --> 00:28:27,665
you know, they've been deep fried by all accounts. But why does the one that's been deep fried in

439
00:28:27,665 --> 00:28:32,064
vegetable make me feel awful and kind of greasy, whereas, you know, the one cooked in a kind of

440
00:28:32,064 --> 00:28:38,544
a more natural fat doesn't. And so I guess I just benchmark it on that. But that for me has become

441
00:28:38,544 --> 00:28:43,524
a bit of a kind of a red flag when I see it. And it's in all products and it's, you know, it's in,

442
00:28:43,524 --> 00:28:47,124
you know, you know, crisp biscuits, you know, any kind of sandwich, mayonnaise.

443
00:28:47,124 --> 00:28:51,084
So like, I can't even buy sandwiches now because pretty much every sandwich has got, you know,

444
00:28:51,124 --> 00:28:52,465
a little slicker mayonnaise in it.

445
00:28:52,584 --> 00:28:54,104
And then it's like, there you go, veg oil.

446
00:28:54,425 --> 00:29:07,089
And obviously mayonnaise is made up of veg oil Do you feel the same about I remember when there was a big push for rapeseed oil and it was like you got to have rapeseed oil and don I forget what they were trying

447
00:29:07,089 --> 00:29:13,729
to tell you. I was part of that. When me and my brother were doing our TV show, this is

448
00:29:13,729 --> 00:29:18,449
Britain's answer to water oil. We were big champions in it because it was like, it's

449
00:29:18,449 --> 00:29:23,569
cheaper, it's got more flavour. Granted, we were talking more about the cold press stuff,

450
00:29:23,569 --> 00:29:26,689
not the kind of, you know, vegetable oil stuff.

451
00:29:27,589 --> 00:29:32,569
But I still, you know, I still, I just have olive oil now, personally.

452
00:29:33,569 --> 00:29:33,649
Yeah.

453
00:29:33,909 --> 00:29:38,749
So what is it that, because I can see you're really passionate about the oils there, Henry.

454
00:29:38,829 --> 00:29:39,749
It's really good to see.

455
00:29:39,909 --> 00:29:41,789
So what is it about the vegetable oil?

456
00:29:41,869 --> 00:29:45,409
Because this is probably where my knowledge is a bit more limited.

457
00:29:45,589 --> 00:29:49,369
So my understanding is that you should always try and have olive oil,

458
00:29:49,509 --> 00:29:51,229
the best olive oil you can have.

459
00:29:51,589 --> 00:29:51,849
Yeah.

460
00:29:51,849 --> 00:29:57,269
even if you have that one save that one for salads and um you know like you say you kind of

461
00:29:57,269 --> 00:30:02,629
dips or whatever you're making or using it for then if you're cooking if you can't afford to

462
00:30:02,629 --> 00:30:09,169
keep that with the um sort of high quality extra virgin olive oil to use um a basic olive oil if

463
00:30:09,169 --> 00:30:13,469
that's what you're cooking with but yeah like a pommage oil or something yeah yeah i can see that

464
00:30:13,469 --> 00:30:19,589
the vegetable oil what is it about do you know what it is about well i think yeah well i think

465
00:30:19,589 --> 00:30:31,869
Well, I think probably initially I probably saw it on the internet, someone flagged up like, do you know how they make, you know, one of those kind of like shock clickbaity, you know, shock horror things and there's a little video and then you watch, you know, oh God, that doesn't look great.

466
00:30:32,189 --> 00:30:35,049
And then I just started doing a bit of kind of research about it.

467
00:30:36,189 --> 00:30:41,509
And the, first of all, it's not an ingredient that we've eaten for a long time.

468
00:30:41,509 --> 00:30:47,109
So actually it's a fairly modern part of a modern fact for our diet.

469
00:30:47,109 --> 00:30:53,629
So, you know, for thousands of years, we've been eating, you know, animal fats or coconut fat or olive oil or, you know, butter, etc.

470
00:30:53,809 --> 00:31:00,069
But actually extracting a neutral oil out of a vegetable seed is actually quite difficult.

471
00:31:00,689 --> 00:31:08,429
It was initially created out of the kind of during the Industrial Revolution as a kind of an engine lubricant.

472
00:31:08,589 --> 00:31:09,689
So essentially it's engine oil.

473
00:31:10,249 --> 00:31:15,249
And so and then obviously during the First World War, I believe production was ramped up because we had, you know,

474
00:31:15,249 --> 00:31:18,209
were building all the tanks and the planes and all the, you know, all the stuff we needed.

475
00:31:18,329 --> 00:31:22,889
So they needed more engine lubricants. So then they started, you know, farming more of it.

476
00:31:22,889 --> 00:31:29,629
And then post the world wars, you had this, particularly in America, you had a flux of,

477
00:31:29,669 --> 00:31:35,689
you know, young men who had been at war and now they needed work. And so they, they turned the

478
00:31:35,689 --> 00:31:39,529
tank factories into tractors, you know, because that was a good thing to do. And then they started

479
00:31:39,529 --> 00:31:43,849
farming, you know, farming became a really big part of that kind of get America working again.

480
00:31:43,849 --> 00:32:01,869
And that makes sense. Like, I'm sure if I was, you know, in charge and you had thousands of men coming back looking for work, get them farming. You know, that was like an obvious thing to do. And, you know, wars are great for, wars aren't great, but wars are great for like progressing technology. So, you know, that kind of necessity to innovate becomes really real.

481
00:32:01,869 --> 00:32:07,009
and so suddenly you had you know a nation coming back they needed food they needed work

482
00:32:07,009 --> 00:32:11,269
and so it was like well so a lot of farming then became subsidized

483
00:32:11,269 --> 00:32:17,509
so this is a bit of a potted history but part of it was growing you know kind of corn and wheat and

484
00:32:17,509 --> 00:32:23,049
and um and uh and these you know uh seed oils essentially so like whether that's cotton oil or

485
00:32:23,049 --> 00:32:29,769
um sunflower or rapeseed you know and they you know so out of it corn you've got the high fructose

486
00:32:29,769 --> 00:32:35,369
corn syrup, you know, that, you know, if you look in, I guess it's less in the UK, but when you go

487
00:32:35,369 --> 00:32:39,569
to America and you read nothing has sugar and it's all just high fructose corn syrup, you know,

488
00:32:39,589 --> 00:32:43,109
that's their kind of cheap alternative because I guess they can grow a lot of corn out there

489
00:32:43,109 --> 00:32:49,829
because it's hotter. And then these oils that are produced in a factory, they have to go through

490
00:32:49,829 --> 00:32:54,669
lots of kind of treatment to, you know, lots of different chemicals are added, et cetera. And,

491
00:32:54,669 --> 00:33:00,369
And, you know, you then get this all out that's very stable and it kind of seems to work quite well.

492
00:33:00,489 --> 00:33:02,269
But also it was very cheap and plentiful.

493
00:33:02,669 --> 00:33:07,629
So then when you're, you know, and now around about this time, industrial food's starting to kind of take off.

494
00:33:07,629 --> 00:33:21,969
And we're all getting kind of quite smart about, you know, being clever with, you know, whether that's making, I don't know, Magnum ice creams or, you know, McDonald's or Snickers or whatever, you know, whatever the, you know, all these products are suddenly appearing in this kind of post-war boom.

495
00:33:21,969 --> 00:33:25,689
and, you know, this fat is right at the heart.

496
00:33:26,249 --> 00:33:29,389
And, you know, I'm not saying it's the only culprit,

497
00:33:29,589 --> 00:33:30,749
but I guess you kind of look around, you're like,

498
00:33:30,789 --> 00:33:32,209
well, this ingredient didn't exist.

499
00:33:32,269 --> 00:33:34,129
And now suddenly, you know, you see all the stats

500
00:33:34,129 --> 00:33:36,189
of people with, you know, diabetes or, you know,

501
00:33:36,229 --> 00:33:38,469
inflammatory diseases or heart, you know,

502
00:33:38,609 --> 00:33:40,289
coronary disease, you know, and probably loads of stuff

503
00:33:40,289 --> 00:33:40,729
that you see.

504
00:33:40,849 --> 00:33:42,829
And also just looking around, like, you know,

505
00:33:42,829 --> 00:33:45,189
being an observer of society, you know,

506
00:33:45,189 --> 00:33:47,649
not in a judgmental way, but just like, you know.

507
00:33:48,589 --> 00:33:51,489
And then also in our bakery, you know,

508
00:33:51,489 --> 00:33:58,509
loads of breads have fats in them and well, you know, using British rapes in oil is like,

509
00:33:58,609 --> 00:34:02,349
wow, that's a good thing to do because it's got, you know, and, you know, I was totally bought into

510
00:34:02,349 --> 00:34:07,089
that narrative and then, so I've been on a bit of a mission of kind of removing it from our bakery.

511
00:34:07,409 --> 00:34:13,549
So it's, you know, these things take time, you know, it's complicated and, you know,

512
00:34:13,609 --> 00:34:19,209
and replacing it with, you know, and this is, I guess, is where the tricky part is, is that,

513
00:34:19,209 --> 00:34:23,929
you know you need fat in your diet and i think i read a stat somewhere a few years ago that like

514
00:34:23,929 --> 00:34:28,829
i think it's like over 80 percent of the fats consumed in human diets around the world are

515
00:34:28,829 --> 00:34:34,469
coming from these seed oils so they're not you know so to suddenly say like get rid of them well

516
00:34:34,469 --> 00:34:39,829
there's gonna be a problem because people still need fat in their diet you know and um and if you

517
00:34:39,829 --> 00:34:45,149
can't suddenly replace it with a more natural alternative that's utopian so like i don't have

518
00:34:45,149 --> 00:34:49,489
a solution for that but i guess from a personal point of view i just try and avoid them i'm just

519
00:34:49,489 --> 00:34:54,509
like well that that's something that i can control and um so it does mean i don't eat crisps but um

520
00:34:54,509 --> 00:34:59,129
uh to be honest it's fine you get you get over it eventually yeah i don't we don't eat crisps but

521
00:34:59,129 --> 00:35:03,629
then i would i would i would be less triggered by like the nitrate thing so i'm always interested

522
00:35:03,629 --> 00:35:07,669
here like what triggers other people because that probably i probably do look i quite like

523
00:35:07,669 --> 00:35:13,069
tritzo and uh um like if i'm if i'm trapped okay so doing a bit of driving down the motorway and

524
00:35:13,069 --> 00:35:18,089
I'll be honest here if I stop off and I you know I need to get some fuel and I need to go to Llewyn

525
00:35:18,089 --> 00:35:21,989
and I'm a bit hungry because I've you know been on the road for ages you know the coffin there's

526
00:35:21,989 --> 00:35:26,209
like an M&S or a Waitrose and so I'll kind of have a little look around and I'll be like what's

527
00:35:26,209 --> 00:35:31,109
it's probably rubbish it's probably got loads of stuff in it and I might buy some fruit but I'm

528
00:35:31,109 --> 00:35:36,789
quite partial to those um like um little cigarillo things it's like chorizo with a bit of cheese and

529
00:35:36,789 --> 00:35:41,789
it's all rolled up okay but but probably like if you read the back of that you know and I know that

530
00:35:41,789 --> 00:35:48,449
it's like it's processed meat and it's cheap cheese and i would look at that and be like well

531
00:35:48,449 --> 00:35:53,889
it's only a few nitrates i haven't got any seed oils in it i think but um i'll try harder next

532
00:35:53,889 --> 00:35:59,669
time yeah i'm sure like doing it just very very rarely but um but you know there's some something

533
00:35:59,669 --> 00:36:05,629
like there i think your risk is to all these health conditions are increased just even if

534
00:36:05,629 --> 00:36:12,189
your diet is made up of about 10% of ultra processed food so we're not even talking about

535
00:36:12,189 --> 00:36:20,229
90 to 100% we're talking about even if you have if your diet across what you eat if 10% of it is

536
00:36:20,229 --> 00:36:24,929
it still increases your increases your risk significantly so that that's quite that's quite

537
00:36:24,929 --> 00:36:30,549
scary isn't it because you think it'd be more of a heavy consumption um but it it's actually like a

538
00:36:30,549 --> 00:36:35,609
sliding and incremental scale you know if you're going to even step onto that ladder you're still

539
00:36:35,609 --> 00:36:37,909
putting your body at risk and your health at risk.

540
00:36:38,469 --> 00:36:41,169
Yeah, I didn't know it was that low.

541
00:36:41,809 --> 00:36:45,209
I would have guessed maybe like 30% or something, but yeah, 10%.

542
00:36:45,209 --> 00:36:49,549
And, you know, if you kind of toss up what you actually eat in a day,

543
00:36:49,809 --> 00:36:54,049
that might be that one muffin that you picked up from, you know,

544
00:36:54,249 --> 00:36:56,709
a coffee chain that you just ate.

545
00:36:56,869 --> 00:36:59,649
You know, it doesn't have to be that much, does it?

546
00:36:59,669 --> 00:37:02,109
Because 10%, you know, it's probably half the muffin.

547
00:37:02,369 --> 00:37:03,509
Yeah, it is, isn't it?

548
00:37:04,329 --> 00:37:04,729
Yeah.

549
00:37:04,729 --> 00:37:10,929
know yeah so you kind of have to be to like avoid these things you have to be basically a saint and

550
00:37:10,929 --> 00:37:15,469
cook everything from scratch yeah and then make those and take them with you which we do actually

551
00:37:15,469 --> 00:37:20,309
try and do that like um we try and make stuff and freeze it and then you know and then defrost it

552
00:37:20,309 --> 00:37:25,809
and then you know and that's where if we are going to have a cake i'll have it as a homemade cake um

553
00:37:25,809 --> 00:37:31,989
and just sort of try and choose recipes carefully where you try and reduce the amount of sugar within

554
00:37:31,989 --> 00:37:37,189
the recipes or try and use more natural sauces or fruit and things like that and um you know

555
00:37:37,189 --> 00:37:41,089
there's ways of doing it isn't there like um somebody once said you could crush a banana

556
00:37:41,089 --> 00:37:47,209
into oats and make that as your sweet crumble top rather than like using sugar yeah yeah and i just

557
00:37:47,209 --> 00:37:51,449
thought that's a really lovely kind of way of doing yeah quite quite good way of doing it yeah

558
00:37:51,449 --> 00:37:56,829
totally totally yeah i think and i think i guess you know if you're cooking from scratch it's fairly

559
00:37:56,829 --> 00:37:57,949
easy to avoid these

560
00:37:57,949 --> 00:38:00,069
products.

561
00:38:00,509 --> 00:38:02,689
Probably the place where you want to be careful is if you

562
00:38:02,689 --> 00:38:03,989
like adding your

563
00:38:03,989 --> 00:38:06,749
srirachas or your

564
00:38:06,749 --> 00:38:09,029
different Asian sauces and stuff because quite often

565
00:38:09,029 --> 00:38:11,049
you've made a lovely stir fry

566
00:38:11,049 --> 00:38:12,969
and you've got fresh produce and you're cooking

567
00:38:12,969 --> 00:38:14,909
it and you've chopped it all on and now you're

568
00:38:14,909 --> 00:38:16,889
making it, adding a bit of

569
00:38:16,889 --> 00:38:18,929
flavour and actually that's probably where you need to be

570
00:38:18,929 --> 00:38:20,849
a bit careful because they're just

571
00:38:20,849 --> 00:38:22,149
those kind of default ones.

572
00:38:22,489 --> 00:38:24,409
I really like

573
00:38:24,409 --> 00:38:26,489
I don't eat it all the time but like

574
00:38:26,829 --> 00:38:31,209
lean pairings for example you know i'd be like that's quite tasty but actually probably

575
00:38:31,209 --> 00:38:37,289
you know i mean it probably is a upf to a certain extent you know if you look at the ingredients

576
00:38:37,289 --> 00:38:41,009
there'll probably be stabilizers or you know something in there that keeps it going i don't

577
00:38:41,009 --> 00:38:44,829
know i have to check yeah i think tabasco is fairly clean label i think you've told me on a

578
00:38:44,829 --> 00:38:50,409
previous episode not to use the lean pairings actually in me so um i'm sorry no i think i

579
00:38:50,409 --> 00:38:53,669
remember you saying because i think i said yeah i think it was like when we were talking about

580
00:38:53,669 --> 00:38:58,689
spaghetti bolognese or something or we've had this conversation and um and you said oh yeah no i think

581
00:38:58,689 --> 00:39:03,309
i think i was meaning more from a kind of an authentic point of view but it's fine you usually

582
00:39:03,309 --> 00:39:08,229
in parents yeah yeah because i mean what else could you could could you use so i mean so so

583
00:39:08,229 --> 00:39:15,549
looking at healthier choices then so in terms of what should we be filling our pantries cupboards

584
00:39:15,549 --> 00:39:21,389
everything with in terms of what what would you say are good products to use and here in real i

585
00:39:21,389 --> 00:39:28,189
assume olive oils on the top of your list yeah yeah so for so for for cooking yeah olive oil

586
00:39:28,189 --> 00:39:34,229
coconut oil and i'd always try and buy organic if i can and i know that like that then does push

587
00:39:34,229 --> 00:39:40,429
the price up but i i always think that you know um um knowing how farming works and i've been to

588
00:39:40,429 --> 00:39:43,829
quite you know i grew up on a farm i went to quite a lot of farms and when you you know when you know

589
00:39:43,829 --> 00:39:48,789
the chemicals that they're spraying onto those crops it ain't great quite a lot of them have got

590
00:39:48,789 --> 00:39:57,369
the word side in which is latin for death so uh you know you want you want you so if you if you

591
00:39:57,369 --> 00:40:04,089
can afford organic go organic and actually i think organic um uh coconut oil is not that expensive

592
00:40:04,089 --> 00:40:09,089
you can kind of buy in like a kind of kilo tub it does make everything taste a little bit coconutty

593
00:40:09,089 --> 00:40:13,809
um but if you're making like a curry or an asian food then it's probably fine i probably wouldn't

594
00:40:13,809 --> 00:40:18,649
roast my roast potatoes for christmas dinner and coconut fat because it'll give them a slightly kind

595
00:40:18,649 --> 00:40:24,309
of tropical vibe but um and then for kind of like seasons and stuff i mean salt i would always try

596
00:40:24,309 --> 00:40:32,549
and use um like a sea salt but like a crystal one i actually went to a talk from um the cornish sea

597
00:40:32,549 --> 00:40:37,589
salt and they were um they're a salt that we use in the bakery but they make a really beautiful

598
00:40:37,589 --> 00:40:42,849
beautiful salt and they were saying within within their salt they've got 82 different minerals so

599
00:40:42,849 --> 00:40:47,729
they've had it like all fully tested and because it's coming from an incredibly clear and clean

600
00:40:47,729 --> 00:40:52,129
part of the Cornish coast. And then, yeah, so actually, so they were saying like, you know,

601
00:40:52,169 --> 00:40:55,769
if you're, if you're doing lots of exercise and you get cramp, you can buy these really like kind

602
00:40:55,769 --> 00:41:00,609
of electrolyte discs that you put in and they tend to be like raspberry flavor and stuff.

603
00:41:00,849 --> 00:41:05,209
You read those ingredients full of crap. So he was saying, actually, you could just use,

604
00:41:05,989 --> 00:41:10,409
have salty water with our salt because it's got lots of minerals in. If you want, you can put a

605
00:41:10,409 --> 00:41:14,009
bit of, you know, a squeeze of lemon or something just to kind of make it taste a bit nicer.

606
00:41:14,009 --> 00:41:20,289
but actually so a good quality salt so no table salt no rock salt no kind of you know you you want

607
00:41:20,289 --> 00:41:26,189
it to be a nice natural sea salt and uh for me the cornish salt is a great one there's good ones up in

608
00:41:26,189 --> 00:41:32,089
um up in wales obviously there's molden which is very famous though actually molden only has 42

609
00:41:32,089 --> 00:41:37,209
i think was it 38 or 42 minerals because it comes from an estuary so it doesn't have quite the same

610
00:41:37,209 --> 00:41:41,869
kind of profile so anyway cornish he was saying it's quite good if you've got like mouth ulcers

611
00:41:41,869 --> 00:41:45,949
you can kind of rub the salt in and it helps like reduce the inflammation anyway and like clears it

612
00:41:45,949 --> 00:41:51,469
up so yeah good quality salt then things like spices so you know if you're making curries or

613
00:41:51,469 --> 00:41:56,429
stir fries or you know you know you want a bit of flavor just buying like whole spices and grinding

614
00:41:56,429 --> 00:42:01,949
yourself again try and buy good quality ones um but at least then you know what you're getting um

615
00:42:01,949 --> 00:42:06,829
i mean i'm yeah my kids do quite like a bit of asian food because we probably do have like um

616
00:42:06,829 --> 00:42:12,089
Yeah, kind of soy sauces and mirin and vinegars and stuff.

617
00:42:12,249 --> 00:42:12,549
I don't know.

618
00:42:12,629 --> 00:42:15,989
So maybe some of them might be, you might have to, you know, question.

619
00:42:16,369 --> 00:42:17,689
But I guess really bring a little bit in.

620
00:42:17,909 --> 00:42:21,209
But things like, you know, like a good organic apple cider vinegar.

621
00:42:21,689 --> 00:42:21,989
Great.

622
00:42:22,129 --> 00:42:24,289
You know, it's like a lot of it's British made.

623
00:42:24,389 --> 00:42:25,209
It's fairly cheap.

624
00:42:25,269 --> 00:42:29,829
You can buy it in most supermarkets, even like Aldi and Niddle sell organic apple cider vinegar.

625
00:42:30,489 --> 00:42:31,489
It's great for your gut.

626
00:42:31,489 --> 00:42:33,929
You know, it really brings things alive.

627
00:42:34,129 --> 00:42:36,709
So actually, you know, if you're just trying to, you know, you made a soup or a stew.

628
00:42:36,829 --> 00:42:40,649
something that just needs a bit of a bit of lifting a little splash of vinaigran really helps

629
00:42:40,649 --> 00:42:47,529
and uh you know so that's that good so so actually you know like salt salt and um acid

630
00:42:47,529 --> 00:42:53,029
and then all you need that now is a is something to heat it um and a good frying pan or a good oven

631
00:42:53,029 --> 00:42:57,409
or a good barbecue and actually you can make something quite delicious that's probably like

632
00:42:57,409 --> 00:43:01,949
the absolute bare essential though i also am partial to mustard so i'm a bit of a diesel mustard

633
00:43:01,949 --> 00:43:08,349
fan i don't know whether that counts as a upf but um i just try and buy a good quality one

634
00:43:08,349 --> 00:43:13,709
i think again yeah exactly i think it's where you source it from isn't it if you if you turn it

635
00:43:13,709 --> 00:43:19,449
around and it's got eight eight other ingredients then you might want to think again but if you turn

636
00:43:19,449 --> 00:43:24,609
one around it's a hundred percent you know i think you're looking at percentages and the quantities

637
00:43:24,609 --> 00:43:38,693
of what else and what other ingredients are in are in with the product um no no um you know product going to be exactly the same is it so it just trying to carefully select yeah i think it i guess having been

638
00:43:38,693 --> 00:43:44,993
like so i've been to america a few times and it is and it it i kind of go into the supermarket it's

639
00:43:44,993 --> 00:43:48,713
a bit of a voyeur just to like have a look at the ingredients and you kind of there's you know

640
00:43:48,713 --> 00:43:52,374
there's like similar brands that you kind of recognize and then you you know so you like pick

641
00:43:52,374 --> 00:43:57,733
up a you know i don't know a ketchup and you kind of i know the uk one's kind of got it's got some

642
00:43:57,733 --> 00:44:01,433
stabilizers and it's got some xanthan gum it's got you know a few bits in there just to kind of

643
00:44:01,433 --> 00:44:05,633
stop it splitting but then you look at the american one and it's got you know 20 ingredients and you're

644
00:44:05,633 --> 00:44:11,573
like whoa and and so i think i think in the uk we are quite lucky that a lot of our a lot there are

645
00:44:11,573 --> 00:44:17,173
a lot of upfs in the foods but we're not like inundated like you can still you know you probably

646
00:44:17,173 --> 00:44:23,073
can still buy dijon mustard that is just mustard seeds vinegar salt and maybe i don't know there

647
00:44:23,073 --> 00:44:28,493
might be a processing area or something but it's not like horrendous whereas you know yeah if you

648
00:44:28,493 --> 00:44:33,673
pick up an american mustard it would you know like just it's like a a packet of toothpaste you know

649
00:44:33,673 --> 00:44:37,773
the amount of ingredients in it and so i think they've probably got a bit of a harder which is

650
00:44:37,773 --> 00:44:42,573
probably why this whole kind of upf thing is really being flagged up by people in america

651
00:44:42,573 --> 00:44:47,673
because they're just that much further on the kind of,

652
00:44:47,893 --> 00:44:50,593
they've buggered around with their food way more.

653
00:44:50,854 --> 00:44:53,533
They're trying to make it cheaper and smarter and bigger

654
00:44:53,533 --> 00:44:54,473
and all that kind of stuff.

655
00:44:54,593 --> 00:44:57,113
And actually, so hopefully we can learn from them

656
00:44:57,113 --> 00:44:58,673
and not go that way.

657
00:44:58,893 --> 00:45:00,874
I think that thing that you nailed about price,

658
00:45:01,113 --> 00:45:03,653
trying to keep costs down.

659
00:45:03,933 --> 00:45:05,553
If we're trying to, manufacturers and producers

660
00:45:05,553 --> 00:45:07,794
are going to continue to produce food

661
00:45:07,794 --> 00:45:09,073
and try and keep it affordable,

662
00:45:09,613 --> 00:45:12,413
even if they're lovely people and have got great intentions.

663
00:45:12,573 --> 00:45:16,193
I think they'll naturally just end up degrading the quality of the ingredients.

664
00:45:16,713 --> 00:45:18,233
Yeah, that is pretty sad.

665
00:45:18,653 --> 00:45:20,933
And particularly when you see the impact it has on people.

666
00:45:21,814 --> 00:45:30,073
I mean, I know for me, if I eat a pizza from an unreptable takeaway place,

667
00:45:30,173 --> 00:45:33,273
I will feel awful for, you know, it really throws me.

668
00:45:33,354 --> 00:45:34,973
And I just think, and I don't want to start in a judgment way,

669
00:45:35,013 --> 00:45:36,894
but if that's what you're eating all the time,

670
00:45:37,033 --> 00:45:38,673
no wonder people are feeling dreadful.

671
00:45:38,673 --> 00:45:51,033
Yeah, I can't eat those pizzas that you've just mentioned because as a student when I was studying, I remember having a piece and it just made my heart race.

672
00:45:51,473 --> 00:45:58,613
And I'm a bit like MSG, so my body almost rejects anything where it's just like, what on earth is that?

673
00:45:58,613 --> 00:46:11,513
So I can tell what kind of awful preservatives or MSG or whatever's been added to it to try and give it flavor or an enhancer or whatever it's supposed to be trying to do.

674
00:46:12,073 --> 00:46:13,573
Because, yeah, it's just horrible.

675
00:46:13,993 --> 00:46:20,773
And you can, and it's salty and you just get that real desire to, you cannot drink enough water to kind of quench your thirst.

676
00:46:20,773 --> 00:46:24,993
like um i don't know if you've ever had that but um you know if you ever do have a piece of that

677
00:46:24,993 --> 00:46:29,993
sort of type of pizza you sometimes think gosh oh yeah i quench my thirst and i just think what is

678
00:46:29,993 --> 00:46:36,133
that doing to my brain no totally and also a lot of these you know we talked about um at the very

679
00:46:36,133 --> 00:46:39,913
beginning about you know these things were the course that you went on the way it was about

680
00:46:39,913 --> 00:46:44,513
making things crunchy or making things you know soft or you know that kind of the aroma you know

681
00:46:44,513 --> 00:46:48,193
most of it is designed to make you eat more.

682
00:46:48,573 --> 00:46:52,453
You know, they want you to like, you know, once you pop, you can't stop.

683
00:46:52,553 --> 00:46:53,613
You know, that, that, that, you know,

684
00:46:53,653 --> 00:46:57,153
they're telling you exactly what they're trying to make it, make you do.

685
00:46:57,593 --> 00:47:00,513
And, um, and whereas, whereas like real food,

686
00:47:00,633 --> 00:47:02,713
really hard to like overindulge.

687
00:47:02,794 --> 00:47:06,334
Like if you, if you made your own vegetable crisps, you know,

688
00:47:06,413 --> 00:47:10,753
you would find it really hard to like eat packets and packets and just kind of

689
00:47:10,753 --> 00:47:13,834
keep nailing it because it's, it's, um, uh,

690
00:47:14,513 --> 00:47:18,953
you know, like properly cooked food is, you know, it's not, I don't think it's addictive.

691
00:47:19,273 --> 00:47:20,453
No, no.

692
00:47:20,573 --> 00:47:24,314
I think you eat until you have that, what's that word? Is it satiety?

693
00:47:24,533 --> 00:47:24,753
Yeah.

694
00:47:25,213 --> 00:47:25,854
So like fullness.

695
00:47:25,854 --> 00:47:32,753
But like that feeling of like feeling full, you just never get that. You know, if you go eat at McDonald's,

696
00:47:32,773 --> 00:47:37,673
you just don't ever feel full. You're always like, I'm kind of still hungry. Whereas if you eat like a,

697
00:47:37,673 --> 00:47:42,713
you know, a proper, you know, a burger from good meat, you know, it's been grilled nicely. It's, you know,

698
00:47:42,713 --> 00:47:47,374
It's got, you know, nice tomatoes in it, nice lettuce, you know, nice sauces, a good bun from a good bakery.

699
00:47:47,513 --> 00:47:48,513
You know, you'll feel full.

700
00:47:48,653 --> 00:47:51,953
Like, you'll be like, I don't need to eat anymore because it's like it's real food going in.

701
00:47:52,473 --> 00:47:56,753
And you probably can make burgers healthy as well, can't you, Henry?

702
00:47:56,814 --> 00:48:03,334
Because you've probably made like burgers and you can actually probably turn something that would otherwise be deemed as, you know, a burger.

703
00:48:03,334 --> 00:48:04,253
It's got to be unhealthy.

704
00:48:04,773 --> 00:48:12,173
So actually you could make that a healthy vegetable burger and then, like, say, have all your salad and lovely bits in it, like your onion and all that.

705
00:48:12,173 --> 00:48:18,473
side of things and it ends up not being as bad for you as as you as you think yeah but you mentioned

706
00:48:18,473 --> 00:48:24,294
um yeah so so just a moment ago you mentioned you could perhaps make some vegetable crisps

707
00:48:24,294 --> 00:48:29,394
do you do you make them and how how do you make those henry do you do you do it in a particular

708
00:48:29,394 --> 00:48:34,953
way well i've made them a few times i i can't promise to say that i make uh vegetable crisps

709
00:48:34,953 --> 00:48:40,773
all the time the easiest way to do it so you you're kind of like frying them if you want to

710
00:48:40,773 --> 00:48:46,053
like recreate a crisp you need to then um i mean you get the potatoes but like beetroot works

711
00:48:46,053 --> 00:48:52,354
really well or like parsnips or any kind of like root vegetable carrots you then want to yeah

712
00:48:52,354 --> 00:48:57,053
slice them really thinly on a mandolin you can do it with a knife but like to get that really kind

713
00:48:57,053 --> 00:49:01,613
of like waffle thin is gonna be quite tricky um and you can even get mandolins have like little

714
00:49:01,613 --> 00:49:06,573
crinkle cuts so you can get like you know you're kind of um the real mccoy looking shape and um

715
00:49:06,573 --> 00:49:12,374
now if you if you were if you wanted to make them like super crispy you would then um you'd make a

716
00:49:12,374 --> 00:49:17,294
nice kind of mix of probably like potato starches and you would coat them in it so then when they

717
00:49:17,294 --> 00:49:22,093
crisp that bit really fries up and gets crispy and then they don't go soggy you probably don't

718
00:49:22,093 --> 00:49:24,993
want to do that because you're probably not gonna have potato starch knocking around your house

719
00:49:24,993 --> 00:49:30,973
um so then you i mean probably the best way to do is just to bake them so just a decent amount

720
00:49:30,973 --> 00:49:36,133
of olive oil or some kind of natural fat and then season them you could put some you know some

721
00:49:36,133 --> 00:49:41,374
paprika on there you could put some spices whatever you fancy you know some garlic some

722
00:49:41,374 --> 00:49:45,834
rosemary toss them around and then kind of bacon in the oven they're not going to be as you know um

723
00:49:45,834 --> 00:49:50,473
well if you if you're having like a nice drinks party and you're like you want to have some crisps

724
00:49:50,473 --> 00:49:54,753
and you don't want to just open up a bag of you know salt and vinegar and stick them in a bowl

725
00:49:54,753 --> 00:49:58,273
you could do this and they would kind of look a bit kind of funky they're going to be a bit

726
00:49:58,273 --> 00:50:02,193
different to you know they're not going to have that same kind of crisp crispy crunch because

727
00:50:02,193 --> 00:50:04,913
actually recreating that.

728
00:50:04,953 --> 00:50:08,374
And I think recreating ultra-processed food

729
00:50:08,374 --> 00:50:10,253
is really difficult to do that at home.

730
00:50:10,253 --> 00:50:12,593
And so actually it's probably just not worth trying.

731
00:50:13,413 --> 00:50:15,233
Imagine why the popcorn one's quite a good one

732
00:50:15,233 --> 00:50:18,113
because that is quite easy to cook some popcorn

733
00:50:18,113 --> 00:50:20,213
and some coconut fat and then just mix it

734
00:50:20,213 --> 00:50:21,533
with either a little bit of sugar

735
00:50:21,533 --> 00:50:23,314
or a little bit of maple syrup or a bit of honey

736
00:50:23,314 --> 00:50:24,854
or do a savory one.

737
00:50:25,374 --> 00:50:28,794
And actually people aren't going to judge you so much

738
00:50:28,794 --> 00:50:30,913
because it's not like you're not trying to recreate walkers.

739
00:50:30,913 --> 00:50:34,273
yeah no yeah and i think that's it we've been fooled haven't we but

740
00:50:34,273 --> 00:50:39,553
yeah having those ultra processed foods around us so much that like you say it's so difficult to

741
00:50:39,553 --> 00:50:45,253
create because we're not a laboratory at home you know we can't do that right that's interesting

742
00:50:45,253 --> 00:50:49,093
so if you do do that so you'd have to probably cook them for quite a while if you're going to

743
00:50:49,093 --> 00:50:53,953
try and do a vegetable crisp and like you say probably best just to chop the news a night

744
00:50:53,953 --> 00:50:59,334
but you tell me what yeah i've never tried in an air fryer and you might find you could if you've

745
00:50:59,334 --> 00:51:04,354
got an air fryer i haven't got one but i i reckon you because because you've got so much air flowing

746
00:51:04,354 --> 00:51:08,834
around you could probably make quite a good vegetable crisp in an air fryer yeah that it

747
00:51:08,834 --> 00:51:13,753
does say you can do that if anyone's got one give it a go just put a little bit of oil on it nice

748
00:51:13,753 --> 00:51:18,173
bit of seasoning and then stick them in the basket and kind of plump them up so there's plenty of

749
00:51:18,173 --> 00:51:22,553
and you might have to give them a bit of a shake you know halfway through just to kind of make sure

750
00:51:22,553 --> 00:51:26,573
that all the sides are getting crisped up but you might find that actually the air fryer works pretty

751
00:51:26,573 --> 00:51:30,453
well yeah or you're gonna have to get your deep fat fryer out yeah because i think that on the

752
00:51:30,453 --> 00:51:36,933
air fryer there's the dehydrate and the air fryer function isn't there so it's okay the dehydrate

753
00:51:36,933 --> 00:51:41,513
would work better would it or the no no you want you won't want to do the dehydrate you'll end up

754
00:51:41,513 --> 00:51:46,713
with kind of uh they'll be kind of like chewy so dehydrate would be great for things like like

755
00:51:46,713 --> 00:51:50,314
apple rings you know like slices of mango brilliant you know because then you're going

756
00:51:50,314 --> 00:51:53,633
to get that nice kind of like intense chewy because it's going to remove all the moisture

757
00:51:53,633 --> 00:51:55,693
but keep all the sugars and that nice kind of flavour in.

758
00:51:56,053 --> 00:52:00,613
But for a piece of potato, I don't think dehydrated potato,

759
00:52:00,834 --> 00:52:03,713
none of your guests will come back or they'll bring their own packet of crisps.

760
00:52:03,953 --> 00:52:04,854
Good, that's funny.

761
00:52:05,294 --> 00:52:06,814
Yeah, see, that's why I don't cook.

762
00:52:07,673 --> 00:52:08,314
I like that.

763
00:52:08,533 --> 00:52:08,753
Yeah.

764
00:52:08,894 --> 00:52:09,993
That's why I'm not the pro.

765
00:52:10,993 --> 00:52:12,273
You can try things, Hayley.

766
00:52:13,133 --> 00:52:14,053
God loves a try.

767
00:52:14,173 --> 00:52:17,033
Yeah, well, the thing is, I sort of love-hate the air fryer.

768
00:52:17,033 --> 00:52:19,773
My concern with the air fryer, I mean, I love the convenience

769
00:52:19,773 --> 00:52:23,473
and I think it's great if you can do things exactly what we've just said.

770
00:52:23,633 --> 00:52:26,473
If you can create a vegetable crisp, it's really healthy.

771
00:52:26,693 --> 00:52:32,093
My concern is the coating on air fryers and how healthy that is.

772
00:52:32,973 --> 00:52:37,453
And I know that's a topic for another day, but that's my only thing.

773
00:52:37,533 --> 00:52:39,993
So I'm a bit on the fence with the air fryers at the moment.

774
00:52:40,113 --> 00:52:42,193
I still have a love-hate relationship with it.

775
00:52:44,193 --> 00:52:46,513
Not to go off topic, but the problem you find,

776
00:52:46,633 --> 00:52:48,633
and I've definitely had conversation with my wife,

777
00:52:48,633 --> 00:52:52,933
is that where you start finding out about something

778
00:52:52,933 --> 00:53:05,453
And whether that's, you know, a coating on a pan or an ingredient in a packet of crisper and a cake or, you know, a coating on a waterproof coat or a chemical soaked as a fire retardant in your mattress.

779
00:53:05,633 --> 00:53:13,593
You know, the whole world is like stacked against us because we've like we've got all these incredible, amazing things that like do all these wonderful stuff.

780
00:53:13,713 --> 00:53:17,933
But they're not natural and they're probably not great for you.

781
00:53:17,933 --> 00:53:25,153
to to to limit down to zero you're gonna have to live as a hermit in the middle of nowhere but

782
00:53:25,153 --> 00:53:30,933
sadly it'll be quite a lonely experience and obviously we'll suit certain people but probably

783
00:53:30,933 --> 00:53:34,814
you know we you know we live in this world and we have to be like part of this world so

784
00:53:34,814 --> 00:53:41,033
i guess i don't know for me it's about um i guess it's about trying to like pick your battles and

785
00:53:41,033 --> 00:53:46,294
like and um and maybe not even maybe if i need battles just like pick some like red lines be

786
00:53:46,294 --> 00:53:51,334
like right i'm just gonna try not to cross this and um and so i think particularly with the with

787
00:53:51,334 --> 00:53:57,433
the upf probably the easiest thing you could do is just you know if you're if you're overly reliant

788
00:53:57,433 --> 00:54:04,473
on like takeaways or eating out or you know or like pre-made stuff just try and like reduce that

789
00:54:04,473 --> 00:54:09,173
down so if you're having a takeaway twice a week you know go to once a fortnight you know and try

790
00:54:09,173 --> 00:54:13,193
and just like cook more from scratch because that's gonna be the easiest way to like reduce

791
00:54:13,193 --> 00:54:18,894
stuff down obviously you know once you get into it you're like well you know say like a vegetable

792
00:54:18,894 --> 00:54:24,033
and you've got an organic one and a non-organic one well you know you could have you could now be

793
00:54:24,033 --> 00:54:28,573
cooking from scratch but now your non-organic one's covered in herbicides and pesticides and

794
00:54:28,573 --> 00:54:31,834
all sorts of sprays that are really not good for you and there's no way of finding out what they've

795
00:54:31,834 --> 00:54:35,573
put on because that happened in the farmer's field and you know unless you've got access to

796
00:54:35,573 --> 00:54:39,493
the farmer you've got no idea so suddenly you know you can just go deeper and deeper and i think

797
00:54:39,493 --> 00:54:44,173
those levels and i think for me it's about like it's not about trying to scare everybody to be

798
00:54:44,173 --> 00:54:49,273
like we're all going to live like hermits or but actually we could we can make we can make decisions

799
00:54:49,273 --> 00:54:55,854
that that can you know maybe improve and try and reduce our kind of the amount of of these kind of

800
00:54:55,854 --> 00:55:01,053
weird ingredients that aren't natural going into our diet and uh and i do i often hope that like

801
00:55:01,053 --> 00:55:05,633
you know someone in like 5 000 years will like look back and they'll see like you know right

802
00:55:05,633 --> 00:55:09,533
back from the Egyptians and, you know, kind of log what people are eating, what people are doing.

803
00:55:09,834 --> 00:55:14,294
And there'll be this little kind of blip, you know, in the kind of 21st century where we all

804
00:55:14,294 --> 00:55:19,794
got a bit clever about, you know, what we could do with food. And actually, and then we'll go back

805
00:55:19,794 --> 00:55:24,453
and be like, that was stupid. We, you know, we didn't make people healthier or happier. We made

806
00:55:24,453 --> 00:55:29,173
people sick. And let's not do that again. Anyway, that's like my hope. Obviously, we're currently

807
00:55:29,173 --> 00:55:34,314
living in that moment. And so we just have to do the best we can. Exactly. And I think you said

808
00:55:34,314 --> 00:55:39,394
that really nicely henry and i think with um with the sort of season upon us in terms of christmas

809
00:55:39,394 --> 00:55:44,153
and new year and people thinking about possibly like what changes they might want to make for their

810
00:55:44,153 --> 00:55:51,073
health for 2026 consistency is key and like you said just trying to reduce some of the consumption

811
00:55:51,073 --> 00:55:56,553
is is going any any change is a good change so if there's somebody listening could actually make

812
00:55:56,553 --> 00:56:01,834
a reduction it's going to significantly improve their health and and that's when it's really worth

813
00:56:01,834 --> 00:56:06,593
it and sometimes it's just knowing isn't it sort of little tips which is why we wanted to do

814
00:56:06,593 --> 00:56:12,894
these episodes because it's about those small little healthy bit um small chunks that we can do

815
00:56:12,894 --> 00:56:19,314
um that can make a big impact so not always going like you say into complete extremism of um

816
00:56:19,314 --> 00:56:25,253
living extra healthy and whatever i mean we both probably in our own fields do do things to the max

817
00:56:25,253 --> 00:56:29,693
because that's what we know and that's what we enjoy and we're passionate about yeah in terms of

818
00:56:29,693 --> 00:56:33,553
Just generally, anyone listening, just trying to make some healthier choices.

819
00:56:34,253 --> 00:56:37,733
Hopefully what we've discussed today might just help people make better decisions

820
00:56:37,733 --> 00:56:40,314
and then their health will improve as a result.

821
00:56:40,513 --> 00:56:46,854
I think that's all we can do because it is tough out there to make good choices all of the time.

822
00:56:46,854 --> 00:56:54,553
And I think it's interesting because when we get to talk about some of the kind of lifestyle changes and habits

823
00:56:54,553 --> 00:56:58,473
and also with setting New Year's resolutions and things like that,

824
00:56:58,473 --> 00:57:04,433
people often will fall down after about four weeks because they just completely set themselves

825
00:57:04,433 --> 00:57:08,653
at too big a challenge and it's not realistic so really challenging yeah so i think it's just

826
00:57:08,653 --> 00:57:14,894
trying to do consistent change isn't it so yeah yeah absolutely well this this it's been great

827
00:57:14,894 --> 00:57:20,593
great to talk about this and i think if this to me feels like a series like there's so much to

828
00:57:20,593 --> 00:57:24,894
talk about i mean we've just talked about essentially processed meat and and vegetable

829
00:57:24,894 --> 00:57:31,693
oils and actually you know that this is a vast and deep subject anyway maybe maybe it's something

830
00:57:31,693 --> 00:57:35,834
that we'll have to come back to again and uh and tackle some of the other other sides of it but um

831
00:57:35,834 --> 00:57:41,773
but yeah it's uh it's it's great hearing your perspective and um and uh yeah thank you for

832
00:57:41,773 --> 00:57:45,953
sharing yeah thank you henry i think everyone's learned lots from what you've said as well so um

833
00:57:45,953 --> 00:57:50,814
yeah lovely to chat as always and um i like you say i think we better cover more of that in future

834
00:57:50,814 --> 00:57:56,653
your episodes so yeah thanks very much henry thank you yeah cheers hailey