I realized those are the two components of the film. It's inflation and bitcoin.
And so for inflation, I really wanted to show what life looks like under different
intensities of inflation. So I interviewed people from western countries, USA, Sweden, Canada,
but then Jamaica, double-digit inflation, Argentina, triple-digit inflation, Venezuela,
you know, quadruple-digit inflation. And all of this culminates in the understanding that
this is what happens to money, you know. You think in the U.S. that it's not going to get like this,
but it will get like this. And if you just think about it, the price of things always goes up.
And if it keeps going up, how can it not end up this way? And so I really wanted to take viewers
through that to see how life changes and then to understand that this has happened to every money
in human history. And so that was kind of the inflation story. And then of course,
like why is this happening, right? And again, I've experienced this with people in person and say,
it's money printing. That's all it is. It's just because they're printing more money, right? And
they would say, well, why do they keep printing it? It's like, yeah, okay, that's where it gets dark,
you know. And so the film goes into that too, is why we're printing money and it touches on war
and health and food and foreign aid and bailouts of, you know, banking and COVID. And so that was
kind of, I felt like the whole story of inflation. We're suffering, it's going to get worse. This
is why it's happening and this is what it's, you know, paying for. So when you look at that price
of milk and it's gone up, that is what you're paying for all of these things, right? And so I
wanted to put the viewer in a dark place because it is a dark place. Like if I didn't know about
Bitcoin and I knew about all these problems, I would be absolutely depressed. I think most
bit corners will tell you that. I mean, you might even contemplate not having children because it's
like, okay, things are going to get worse. I'm already struggling. Why am I going to bring
children into this world so that they can struggle even more? Like what is their future
you're going to look like? So I wanted to get that across to people. And what that does though,
is it perfectly segues into Bitcoin because if inflation is just because of money printing,
what if there's a money that can't be printed, right? And so that's how we segue into Bitcoin.
Greetings and salutations, my fellow clubs. My name is Walker and this is the Bitcoin podcast.
The Bitcoin time chain is 870989 and the value of one Bitcoin is still one Bitcoin.
Today's episode is Bitcoin talk where I talk with my guest about Bitcoin and whatever else
comes up. Today, my guest is the legendary Bitcoin shooter. Shooter is an incredibly talented filmmaker
and he's about to release his biggest and best film yet. No more inflation. I got a chance to
see an early cut of the film before we recorded together. And in my humble opinion, it is the
best Bitcoin documentary I have seen yet. I highly recommend you go to no more inflation.com
and support shooter by buying the film. We cover a lot in this episode to give you a deep dive into
the filmmaking process, how he structured the film to talk about inflation first and Bitcoin
second, and also had time for a fud busting and getting rid of the notion that Bitcoin and crypto
are the same thing. We also get into some of the stories of the wide range of people he interviewed
while making the film and why people need to see this film now more than ever plus a whole lot more.
I think you are going to love this conversation. Shooter is an awesome guy. And again, go to
no more inflation.com to preorder the film which drops on November 21st. Then I don't know, show it
to your family at Thanksgiving. It will be sure to get the conversation started. Before we dive
into me, favor and subscribe to the Bitcoin podcast. Wherever you're watching or listening,
check out Bitcoin podcast.net for episodes and additional resources. Head to the show notes
to grab your referral link for my sponsor, Bitbox or go directly to bitbox.swiss.walker and use
promo code Walker for 5% off the fully open source Bitcoin only Bitbox O2 hardware wallet. Then get
your Bitcoin off the exchange and into your own self custody. Send an email to hello at Bitcoin
podcast.net. If you have feedback or if you're interested in sponsoring the Bitcoin podcast.
And if you find this show valuable, consider giving value back by giving it a zap on Noester or a
boost on Fountain. I really appreciate it. Without further ado, let's get into this Bitcoin talk
with Bitcoin Shooter.
See, this is why I need like, you know, Joe Rogan's got like his, what's the name, Jamie?
Like he's got like his guy, you know, that's, that's, that's what I need. Definitely,
I'm not even close to big enough to justify any kind of help like that. But, you know,
so a guy can dream anyway.
Yeah, man, someday. That's how all these things happen, you know, it's,
I mean, even Joe Rogan, right? It was like years and years and years of him just doing it for fun.
And then somehow it's like the most influential platform.
So it's, it's insane that he has the audience that he does. And the fact that he was like,
okay, he's a reality TV show host. He's an MMA guy. Like he's just a dude, you know,
just a normal guy, but just was like, I'm going to get a couple microphones,
just start talking to people. I forgot, you know, comedian too. I've noticed that as well. It's like,
a lot of comedians do really well with podcasts. I think because they're like,
you got to be pretty damn smart to be a comedian. Like even if you act like an idiot,
like it's tough to write jokes. Like, and it's tough to do it all the time in front of people.
But like, I think that's a, like it's no coincidence that comedians podcasts tend to
kind of crush it. Like they've, I don't know, they help people open up a little bit more too, I think.
Yeah. And they're quick. They're usually witty and like, you know, can come up with things. And
I mean, they just make connections in their brain, I think quickly. And so, yeah. Yeah.
Absolutely. I think that makes sense.
Well, and you're, you know, so we're here. And look at that. See, this is, this is why I wanted
to make sure we had the live stream and hello to anyone who's listening. There's 34 of them right
now. I have to imagine that number will grow. But you're somebody who you actually talk to people
all the time as part of filmmaking. Now you do it usually off camera, you know, like, I always
know there's a, whenever there's a great answer in, in, you know, your work, it's like, you know
that the question you set them up with must have been good because you don't get good answers without
good questions. But yeah, I, we've got a lot to dig into today. So no more inflation, your film,
multiple years of pretty insanely tough work going all over the place. There's a whole bunch
of different sides. This I want to dig into with you. But maybe just like for folks who, who don't
know you because you do keep a pretty, you know, pretty low profile for folks who do not know
Bitcoin shooter, can we just start out with who are you? How did you get here today to become
Bitcoin shooter, to become this, you know, master filmmaker, to be making a film about inflation
and about Bitcoin? What, what was that journey to getting here? Yeah. So I always had a passion for
photography or filmmaking, you know, when I was like eight years old, one of my best friends,
mom had a camcorder and we used to make stupid little videos, you know, like some of his stuffed
animals being a murderer or whatever, you know. And so I think what I liked about it was when
people would watch what we made, it typically we were making funny things. So they would laugh or
whatever. And so I think I got a kick out of making people feel a certain way. And then as I got
older, you know, I got interested in photography and all these things I kind of just learned on
my own. I didn't necessarily go to school for it. And then, you know, I started making,
I made a film for a business, like a short video, like a commercial almost for free. And somebody
asked me to, and then, you know, that led to someone else seeing that. And then they wanted me to do
it. So I charged them a little bit. And then, you know, long story short, over the years, I just
kind of kept doing that. And so getting into Bitcoin, you know, my brother was the one that
really orange-pilled me. He had kind of heard about it a few times, you know, years before.
And then he saw, it's funny, it's full circle now, but he saw banking on Bitcoin on Netflix.
And that was really like the thing that I call the orange pill, which is when you have that
that spark inside of you to want to learn more about Bitcoin, right? Like, you can't stop yourself
from wanting to learn more. You're seeking information after that. So that's what kind of
kind of sparked that in him. And then, you know, years later, he finally got through to me on it.
And then my own, you know, journey was really listening to a lot of Max and Stacy. And at
the time they were doing the orange pill podcast, and they were doing the stuff on RT. And they were
doing the fuck Elon tour. And so I had reached out during one of their live streams saying, hey,
I got a ticket to the event. And, you know, I'm a filmmaker. And if you don't have a caravan
already, like, I'll do it for free, you know. And so, yeah, that was kind of my first step into
the Bitcoin space and never had gone to any sort of events or met other Bitcoiners really
besides that. And at that point, I started to really see the biggest value of Bitcoin was meeting
all of these other people that like, were going through so many of the things that I was going
through from, you know, inflation and, you know, cost of living to the COVID things that were
happening and the political things around Black Lives Matter. And like, I just met so many people
that like, I'm like, dude, you're just like me, like you're reliving the same life. And so, anyway,
the last stop on the tour they did was El Salvador. And that was the first time Max and
Stacey had gone to El Salvador. So I went with them. We filmed a couple of Kaiser reports there.
And that exposed me to El Salvador. And while I was there, I met a lot of Salvadorans. And I was
hearing about the history of the country, which I had no idea about. And then for the first time
ever, I just really, I was infected, like I couldn't stop thinking about it. And I felt like, you know,
maybe I should put some type of video or film together, like, you know, and so I spent a year
kind of doing that on my own. And I produced a 10 minute short film called Comeback Country,
which goes from like, you know, the Civil War of El Salvador.
It's awesome. For anyone that hasn't, well, I'll link it in the show notes, because it's like,
I watched it. I was like, damn, I think that was the, that might have been the first one of your
films that I, that I saw. And I was like, Oh man, like this is, this is different than the other
Bitcoin documentary type things I've seen before. I didn't continue, but just wanted to throw that
out there for people. It's awesome. Yeah, thanks. I think what was best about it was I found myself
when I was going back to the country after that, I was able to connect with Salvadorans much better,
even on the airplane on the way there, you know, because I would say, Oh yeah, you're going over,
you live there. Oh yeah, you know, my family lives there, but I haven't been there in like 10 years.
And I'm like, yeah, I know, I know why, right? You have all this and there and you start to build
that. And so that was one of the best feedback I've gotten from other people that watch the film
that were like, Hey, now that I've seen it, and when I go there, like, I can actually talk to
these people about it and they have a greater appreciation. So, um, so I published that and then
Nyebukkali retweeted it. And so that kind of created a lot more awareness about what I was doing.
And a lot of people in the Bitcoin space were kind of telling me like, dude, like you should really
consider making a full length film, you know, and so the 10 minute film was the longest thing I had
ever done up to that point. And, um, and so yeah, so after that, I really started planning the film,
which was October 2024, I started planning it, and then announced it in January, started filming
April 23. And then, um, yeah, wrapped up filming a few months ago and was editing throughout the
whole process. And so yeah, that's kind of, you know, I've been interested in film ever since I
was young. I was doing it, you know, professionally for businesses. And then yeah, through, you know,
proof of work and hustle and luck, you know, I think luck plays some factor in there. You know, I
was able to work on this film for the last two years. And really the goal was to try to produce
like, um, you know, the Bitcoin standard of films, you know, everybody. I took, I've learned so much
from the Bitcoin standard and I've bought that book for many people. But most people don't read it,
you know, and so I saw this as like a step before that, you know, a film was a lot easier to ask
someone to watch it. It's more entertaining. And I think it can spark that desire inside of someone
to say, okay, I'm starting to see what this thing is and I'm willing to dedicate more time, you know,
to reading a book. And so yeah, that was really the goal of this film was to give the average person
the whole pictures. They could see the whole picture of, you know, what's going on with the money
being broken and helping it crank and fix it. And maybe why some of the things that they've heard
before may not be true. And so yeah, that's what I set out to do. And I feel like I accomplished it.
So yeah, it's a really great feeling. So you, and you said you started working on the film in
October 2022. So it's been like, this is an over two year process between, I mean, you've been
obviously all over the world. Thank you for letting me watch the rough cut of it. I was watching it
last night and just like goose bumps on multiple occasions. It's extremely powerful. I'm stoked
for more people to be able to watch it. Did you, did you go to like film school or have like formal
training or were you just, were you self taught? Yeah, self taught. I mean, mostly through making
mistakes, you know, as I was working on it. So no, no film school. And I think that's probably one
of the reasons why I'm like, people say have a kind of a style. Like if they see something, they kind
of go like, I think that's all that is you. I thought that was your work, you know? So I think
maybe that's a reason why, but you know, maybe again, I don't have any experience, but if it's
like any other type of schooling, you know, I think maybe you have to unlearn a lot of things,
you know, to, to actually stand out. So no, I was always drawn towards human stories and telling
human stories whenever I would work with businesses, you know, and say like, let's not do a commercial
man. Like let's make a short film. Let's, let's, what's the most inspiring story that you got,
whether it's your founder or somebody that works on your product line or a customer, like let's
tell that story so that people get drawn in by the story. And then it just so happens that, you
know, it's related to this, to this business. So no, no film school, just, just tinkering and
making mistakes. And, and then at the end of the day, like just building the confidence to understand
that, you know, people like my work for me, you know, when you're looking at my film, you're,
you're seeing something through my brain, essentially. And so just trusting that and, and, and not
trying to be so technical, like, and, you know, having check sheets and things like, oh, I need
to do this every single time, more just like flowing with it and being present and, you know,
and, and just allowing myself to be the filter that people like to see, you know, the film through.
So yeah, just all, all, all personal experience really is how I got here.
I mean, I think you're right about the unlearning part of a lot of formalized education, especially
when it's with something creative, because so much of that's just got to come from you, right?
Like you, you can't, I mean, you can give somebody the tools to find, you know, little ways to be
more creative or to skits. But it's like, some of that's just got to be inside you. Like, you've
just got to, you've got to have that, and you've got to have that desire and that drive. It's like,
otherwise you can, you can kind of tell when somebody's trying to be creative versus somebody who is
creative. Like there, there's a disconnect otherwise. And I think it's interesting about the Bitcoin
standard. I've given that book to a lot of folks too. Not sure how many of them actually went and sat
down and read it because you're right. Like that's a, you know, given somebody a book, even though
it's like a book that, you know, Bitcoiners are like, you know, yeah, you know, read it a few times,
like, you know, always give it out. It's like, in reality, not everybody has the attention span
to sit down and do that. And when you give somebody a book, it's like, you know, you're giving them
homework almost like you're giving them something they have to know, okay, I've got it. I've got to
read this whole damn book, like, okay, thanks a lot. Like, but a film and a story and stories about
people, not just technical jargon, but stories about people, I think that reaches across,
like, I should say that that has the ability to reach into everyone, because everybody's going to
find someone in your film that they say, Oh, like, I feel that because you go, you go in a lot of
different directions in terms of where you are, in terms of who you're talking to in terms of the
stories that they're telling. And I'm kind of curious, like, how when you were planning this out,
how did you go about like, did you already kind of know, okay, I want to go to these countries,
I want to talk to these kind of people, like, how did how did that process even work? Because
obviously, two years, that's like, you had to put a lot of work into this. How did you even how did
you start? Yeah. So when I was setting out to make the film, I wanted to, you know, have the biggest
impact possible. And I knew that Bitcoin was definitely the thing that would have the biggest
impact, you know, I think, um, that's what the world needs most right now. And so that was nice,
because creative stuff, you know, if there's infinite possibilities, it's really hard to be
creative, right? Like once you start setting things in stone, then actually the creative process
comes in, right, being resourceful and like focusing on certain things. And so I knew it was
going to be Bitcoin related. And then I was, you know, the rabbit hole is already so rich, in my
opinion. I'm a testament to that. You're a testament to that. Once you have that spark, like I was
saying, you there's there's plenty of information there for people. And so the way I thought is,
you know, I need to try to reach people outside of the Bitcoin bubble. I need to trip them into
the rabbit hole and then let the rabbit hole do its thing. And so I was trying to think what is the
most relatable angle into Bitcoin, right? Because all of this stuff really comes down to relatability.
And it's one of the reasons why I interviewed so many just regular people, because my audience is
regular people. And so you're going to connect with another regular person. And so inflation,
what became clear that that was the topic, because I found myself when I was at like the cashier at
a grocery store, for example, and I was had a Bitcoin thing on and the cashier asked me, oh,
this Bitcoin thing, so is it like real deal or something, you know? And I realized I have like
five or 10 seconds with this person, right? So it's like, what do you even say to that? And so I
found eventually I had distilled that response to, okay, what imagine if the price of everything
stayed the same? Does that sound good? You know, and people are always like, yeah, that sounds
great. You know, I say, that's what Bitcoin is. Bitcoin is a world with no more inflation. There's
a lot of reasons why that is. And you should really look into that. But that's what it is. That's what
it promises. And so I just found that for the average person, they understood that and they
could see that as like a hopeful thing to look forward to. And so from there, I realized those
are the two components of the film, it's inflation and Bitcoin. And so for inflation, I really wanted
to show what life looks like under different intensities of inflation. So I interviewed people
from Western countries, USA, Sweden, Canada, but then Jamaica, double digit inflation, Argentina,
triple digit inflation, Venezuela, quadruple digit inflation. And all of this culminates in the
understanding that this is what happens to money. You know, you think in the US that it's not going
to get like this, but it will get like this. And if you just think about it, the price of things
always goes up. And if it keeps going up, how can it not end up this way? And so I really
wanted to take viewers through that to see how life changes and then to understand that this has
happened to every money in human history. And so that was kind of the inflation story. And then,
of course, like why is this happening, right? And again, I've experienced this with people in
person and say it's money printing. That's all it is. It's just because they're printing more
money, right? And they would say, well, why do they keep printing it? It's like, yeah, okay, that's
where it gets dark. And so the film goes into that too is why we're printing money. And it touches
on war and health and food and foreign aid and bailouts of banking and COVID. And so that was
kind of, I felt like the whole story of inflation. We're suffering, it's going to get worse. This
is why it's happening. And this is what it's paying for. So when you look at that price of milk and
it's gone up, that is what you're paying for all of these things, right? And so I wanted to put the
viewer in a dark place because it is a dark place. Like if I didn't know about Bitcoin, I knew about
all these problems, I would be absolutely depressed. I think most bit corners will tell you that. I mean,
you might even contemplate not having children because it's like, okay, things are going to get
worse. I'm already struggling. Why am I going to bring children into this world so that they can
struggle even more? Like what is their future even going to look like? So I wanted to get that across
to people. And what that does though is it perfectly segues into Bitcoin because if inflation is just
because of money printing, what if there's a money that can't be printed, right? And so
that's how we segue into Bitcoin. But of course, you can't just mention that in a film without
addressing the preconceived notions that people have about Bitcoin, the common objections, right?
So like it's complicated to use, it's too volatile, it's only for criminals, right? It's bad for the
earth. The government's going to shut it down. So I felt like I needed to address all of these
things. So anyway, so part of that, you know, this all happened over time, right? Planning and
thinking and researching and shifting things. And then, you know, but for example, in the energy
segment, I wanted to not necessarily go on and fight on the grounds that have been defined
already like, hey, let me tell you why Bitcoin mining isn't polluting the earth, right? I don't
want to address that. All I want to do is show you an example of a situation where it's actually
reducing the pollution. And let me show you an example of how it's actually bringing energy to
people. So even though you might have heard of the things, you haven't heard about these things. And
and maybe that should show you that there's more that you should look into. So one of the things
I wanted, you know, when I was doing the research, like what are good things that Bitcoin mining is
doing? I saw a common thing was, you know, what gridless was doing out there in Africa. And I
was reading, I was like, this is amazing. You know, they're they're they're giving cheaper power to
people and bringing people to the first, you know, the power for the first time. And so I saw it was
gridless. And I looked and saw that, you know, the CEO was going to go speak at Bitcoin Miami 2023.
And so I went over there sat in and his talk, you know, and then afterwards like approached him,
hey, man, I'll make a movie. I love what you're doing over there. I want to come out there.
When's a good time for me to come out there? You know, and so that's just kind of how all these
things happen where I planned it, I would do research, I would kind of figure out some stories
I wanted to tell. And then, you know, I would I would figure out how to how to how to how to
schedule them. So yeah, that's kind of a process. The best way to protect yourself from inflation
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but you also help support this podcast. So thank you. I mean, so does a lot of it,
like you set out these kind of like, okay, this is the basic structure I want. And I think that
the structure that you had in terms of let's define the problem first, make sure we all agree on
what the problem is. We all agree that inflation is a problem. I mean, except for like a few,
you know, fiat economists like Paul Krugman, you know, inflation is actually a good thing.
But every normal person does not want things to keep getting more expensive forever. They don't
want their money to continue buying less forever. And that's how you set it up. And you set it up
with just some like really powerful interviews of like you said, you know, like just normal people.
How did you find these like, just random people were these people that like, did you put out any
sort of like a call for this? Did you just like go around and find people? Like, how does that
process work for like a documentary filmmaker like that? How do you find the average person and know
that they're going to be like, tell this amazing story? Yeah, well, you have to do a lot of interviews.
But of course, the good thing is that the Bitcoin, there's Bitcoiners everywhere. So pretty much
everywhere I went, even with Jamaica, there's not a whole lot of Bitcoin action going on there.
But, you know, Dredd is a developer in the space, he's doing flash and, you know,
he's part of OpenSat and stuff like that. And so when I had kind of, you know, focused on Jamaica,
you know, he helped connect me to some people that could help bring in lots of regular people.
And so I probably interviewed, you know, a dozen people in Jamaica, of which, you know,
you hear from like four people. Argentina, I interviewed like 25 people. Because again,
you just don't really know, you don't really know anyone's story until you actually sit down and talk
to them. So it was a lot of that, you know, tapping into a Bitcoiner who was from the area
and then having them help kind of like, you know, line up interviews and things like that. And then
some of them are just luck, you know, like while I'm actually there, like I come across somebody,
like for example, in Argentina, one of the interviewees, I met like the day before I left,
or two days before I left. And he lived like an hour and a half outside of Buenos Aires. And,
you know, I was like, dude, can I come out tomorrow? Like, let's just film this thing, you know.
And so some of them were luck, lucky, lucky like that, where it just stayed open and stayed,
you know, available and just made it happen. But yeah, mostly it's just capturing a lot of
content, a lot of interviews, and then, yeah, trimming it down to, you know, the cream of the crop.
What I thought was just incredible about this film is that, like, I think this is going to go down
as like the most comprehensive, like, yeah, it's a Bitcoin film. But, you know, you don't get into
Bitcoin until a little ways into it. But you talk about the problems and not just, okay, inflation,
grocery prices are up. Like you have Gladstein in there talking about monetary colonialism,
you have all these different things. I mean, you're talking about, you know, fiat being used to fund
war, you're talking about the, you know, and stop me if I'm starting to give, you know, too much
away. Me explaining it is not going to spoil anything because my words could never do it justice.
But you're talking about the health system, you're talking about all these different things,
all these different things that broken money also breaks. And I think that it's like, it's so
comprehensive in terms of that. Like, it's amazing that you fit it into the time that you did because
these are not small topics. These are like, these are the biggest topics, right? These are the topics.
And there were like a couple of quotes in there too. Even you mentioned, you know,
deciding maybe not to have kids just because like monetary stress is so high. And there was a quote
in there about like, before we even enter this world, we've already been impacted by money just
because if you're, you know, the mother that's carrying you is stressing about money, like that
stress goes into you. And that was just such a, I thought such a powerful thing, especially as like
a new dad, just thinking about that, like, man, it is wild. I mean, money is something, you know,
what's the saying like, you know, death and taxes are the, you know, the two like certainties in life.
But it's like, man, even before you're born, this broken money can affect you. And that just like,
it's just kind of messed up. Like was there, as you were going through this, like,
was it hard to hear some of these stories? Because some of them, some of them were like,
you could tell people were really, really hurting.
Yeah. It's crazy, man, because I definitely, I shed tears for sure, you know, throughout the
whole process. I mean, whether it was during the interview or and or like editing, but it was on
both ends of the spectrum. You know, some stories were incredibly sad, and some stories were incredibly
hopeful. You know, I mean, like, after I interviewed some of those farmers in Kenya that had gotten
power for the first time, and you hear about a guy who used to spend two hours with a machete
chopping food for his cows, and now he does it in 10 minutes. And I didn't touch on the film,
but also the cows eat a higher percentage of the food because it's being ground up so well
with the little saw that he's got with energy. So he's becoming so much more efficient. And then
another woman farmer was talking about the power of just having light bulbs and her kids being able
to study at night without their eyes burning from the kerosene candles. And so a lot of times,
in the moment, you know, I'm in the moment, I'm having a good conversation with them and they're
hopeful now. So they're not sad about it, you know, but sitting in the truck on the way back,
it's just like overcome with emotion, you know, like, wow, this is so crazy. And these people
don't even know what Bitcoin is. They don't know what Bitcoin mining is. They have no idea that it's
actually the thing that brought them this. So yeah, it was it was it was hard to listen to some of
the stories. But even those sad stories, I could tell after people talked about it, I could tell
they had a little bit of a weight lifted off of them. Because I don't think it's something you
really talk to people about, you know, if this didn't make it into the film, but I'll release it as
a separate cut. But a woman from South Sudan lived through hyperinflation, talking about waking up,
you know, going to sleep a bottle of water is two pounds, two Sudanese pounds, and you wake up and
it's five pounds, and then it just keeps going up. And people are drinking out of the Nile River,
and then getting typhoid and getting cholera, and then you don't have money to go to the hospital.
So then you go rob and steal, you know, and she's like, what would you do if your kids are crying
because they're hungry? You know, and it's like, yeah, yeah, I would probably would, I probably would
steal, you know. And so, but I don't think she talks to people about that, you know, and talking,
she talked about living like staying because there was a war going on at the same time too,
and like staying under the bed for two weeks with biscuits and water, it's like,
so it was hard to hear those things. But I also feel like for those people, it was kind of therapeutic
to share that story too. So in so many ways, it was a beautiful film. I mean, even like,
if it didn't see the light of day and no one else, you know, saw this and benefited from
the stories that I'm sharing, I think, you know, just me meeting those people and them meeting me,
and I think it's, it was good for everybody. And one thing I want to touch on too is one thing I
like best about the film is that it is perfect for a normal person to watch and to understand.
Everything's very simple. There's not very, you know, big terms that are being used. And anytime
there is a term that is being used that I think the average person doesn't understand will have
like a little, you know, definition of it so that you can keep following along. But for the most
seasoned Bitcoiner, there's always, there's also going to be stuff in there that, that you enjoy
and appreciate like that said bunny quote that you mentioned about being impacted before you're
even born. And then, you know, maybe you've never been to North Dakota or you've never seen a,
a mining operation off of flare gas, you know. And so I think that's what I like most about it
is it's a film for the average person, but it's also a film for like the cypherpunk, you know what
I mean? And so, yeah, and again, that's why I led with inflation too, because, you know,
in my opinion, if Bitcoin's in the title, you might scare people off before they even start.
But if it's about inflation, yeah, probably you get most people dragged into that, you know, and
then, and then, you know, bring in the Bitcoin. So, yeah, anyway, long and short, yes, it was
difficult to listen to some of those. But in the end, it was even the hardest stories were beautiful,
man. It just, it, it's almost like we turned it into something beautiful. So it was really rewarding.
And those stories, like they, they need to be told to, right? And it doesn't matter if you're
hearing about, you know, a farmer in Kenya or somebody in, you know, LA, it's like, you find
parts of that person's story that you can relate to, even if you're different than that person.
Like that's the beauty of good storytelling, which I think you've clearly become a master of,
like everyone can find a piece of themselves in it. And I think that's what matters, because that's
what draws you into it, because you see something of yourself, of your own experience. And then,
once you see that, you know, then you start bringing it to Bitcoin. And it, you know, like,
I'll be honest, like the first part of it, there's some of those stories are like, they're heavy,
you know, and then you start to switch a little bit more towards, okay, we all agree, right?
This is a problem. And it's a really, really big problem. But then you switch that focus a little
bit, and you start bringing it to hope, you give, like, this isn't just a doom. This isn't a doom
and gloom documentary. This is ultimately a really hopeful message. And so can you, and what I thought
was great that you did was you do a lot of it's not just okay, here's what Bitcoin is, you know,
you know, here's the blockchain, the time chain, you know, here, you know, and if Alice wants to
send Bob some, you know, no, it's, it's relatable, it's easy to understand, but you also do some
fud busting in it, you go down some of the common misconceptions. So can you talk about that a little
bit, just how you decided to kind of go through that fud busting exercise and really like, like at
the end, it's pretty hard to argue with once you've kind of made your point on those.
Yeah, again, it was really just identifying the most common objections that I would find with
people, you know, just, and also like, you know, you see them online, I mean, I feel like we talk
about the same things over and over again, to a certain extent. And so, in that way, it's like,
okay, this is the foundation of, this is the baseline information someone needs to know before
they can really start to be like, okay, maybe this thing isn't what I thought it was. And so, yeah,
again, the, the, the fud I address was, you know, it being complicated to use. And so like, I mean,
literally, most people don't even know what it looks like to make a lightning payment, you know,
I mean, they don't, like, it's just so abstract still. And so just, just literally the 10 seconds
or 15 seconds of the film, where there's nobody talking, and you can see like, someone pressing
the app icon and pressing $5 and create invoice and then someone else scanning it, I think like
that alone is just profound to show people that, like how easy this is, you know, and, and then,
you know, we go into a Salvadoran who is getting remittance payments in Bitcoin instead of waiting
in line for hours and maybe not getting his cash. And so again, I was going through each of these,
these fud points and just showing stories of this person is literally living proof that
it's not difficult to use, you know, and, and also we, in that same regard too, there's a story
about somebody who was trying to buy an expensive vase overseas and like, you know, anybody who's
trying to send wires overseas knows it takes forever, it costs a lot of money. And with Bitcoin,
it's like, it's so much easier than a wire. And so yeah, that's really, you know, through the rest
of the fud points, that's how I addressed it was just, let's find a story that, you know, contradicts
what, what people have heard. And, and let's tell that story. So yeah, complexity of the usage of
it, the energy, right, it being for criminals, which is so funny because like the criminal
thing, Alex Glassin has a great quote, he's like, what's a criminal, right? Yeah, if you're in a
country and the government doesn't like you and they, they deem you a criminal, it's like, you
know, it's, it's completely subjective. So, so yeah, so again, it was just identifying the most
common objections that I know people will have, and then telling a story that makes them, that would
make them think about that again and maybe say, you know, okay, obviously, I didn't hear this story
before, you know, I must be missing something. And, and you know, again, like no one can fully
explain Bitcoin in any book and any film and any one course. And I knew that. And so one thing I
like is that it does leave room for people to go do their own research, you know, and I don't really
see this as something I'm not trying to convince anyone of anything. All I'm trying to do is share
the stories that helped me and hopefully it'll help you too, you know, and, and ultimately,
the film really ends on a note of self responsibility, you know, it comes down to
taking responsibility and, you know, and any questions you have about Bitcoin have been
answered, but you have to go and seek those answers for yourself. And so I like that. I, I never want
to, you know, make people think I'm trying to brainwash them or, you know, have an agenda or
I'm trying to pump my bags. Like, no, I just want to share these stories. And so, yeah, I think I
answered your question. I'm not sure. You absolutely did. And I got to say the part about the fud
busting about criminals was, I think, my favorite part of the fud busting. I liked all of them.
Like, I loved seeing Tarantula out there, you know, in the fields, because he's just a badass dude.
And like, what a great guy. And like, that was awesome that you got him in there. But the criminals
part, I've got to say, was just amazing because you start, you know, you throw out that clip that
everyone probably has seen. And if not, you'll see in the film about Jamie Dimon. He's at like,
I think he was at Davos, right? And he was on the CNBC panel, you know, Joe Kernan's there.
And he's blustering about, oh, well, you know, what is this? It's just a, you know, it's basically
only used by criminals. That's the only reason it exists. Those are the only transactions that are
on there. And so they're not even legitimate and rub it up and up and Joe Kernan comes back at him,
you know, and he comes back at him pretty hard. He's basically, well, actually, the
choice currency for criminals is the US dollar. And God bless Joe Kernan. That dude, like,
he's super based. But I love that criminals part because if all you've ever done is read
mainstream news and or, you know, read it or watch it, whatever it might be, you legitimately
probably think that because that's all you've ever seen is a bunch of people who are very important
and, you know, authoritative, telling you that it's just used by criminals. But then as you
mentioned, the Gladstein part, which was, you know, amazing. And he said something about, you know,
like, it's money for criminals, like it is for criminals because anyone can be a criminal. It
just depends what your government decides. And you get into the, I love that you got into the
Canadian trucker protests. That was awesome. And there's a lot of a lot of stuff in there that
just like some of the footage you had that I just like had not even, you know, obviously hadn't seen
before. That was really powerful. Can you talk about that part a little bit? Because it's you,
I think you might have spent a little bit more time on the criminal side of things than on some
of the other fud busting, it seemed maybe it was just my perception. But, but I liked that you did
that because it allowed you to tell some really powerful stories about activists, about just
normal people like the Canadian truckers. Like that, that was really powerful. Yeah, absolutely.
I think it was an important story. I mean, I know I had, especially going to El Salvador,
lots of Canadians moved to El Salvador after that event, because, you know, whether or not they
actually had their bank accounts shut down. And there is an individual that did who does live
in El Salvador now that I interviewed for the film. But I think they came to that realization of like,
whoa, I can just, they can just, you know, stop me from using my money. Like how do you buy groceries?
How do you pay for rent? Like what do you do? And so I knew that that story had, you know,
had was the reason why a lot of people woke up. And so I thought it was important to, to share that
story. Because again, it was the only money that got to the truckers and still, you know, and still,
all that money that was confiscated is still confiscated, the GoFundMe stuff. And then,
yeah, and then, you know, just by luck, you know, Gladstein also talked a bit about, you know, he
was descendant from, you know, people who fled Germany during World War II and how they couldn't
bring their wealth with them. And, you know, I guess technically you'd be a criminal at that time
in Germany too, right? If you were just Jewish. And so, and so, yeah, so I just thought it was
important because it was one of the things that people hear a lot. I mean, the energy stuff too,
you know, but the criminal stuff, like especially like, it gets talked about so much. And so I
really just wanted to, and also use that opportunity to show that, hey, all you need are these 12 words,
you know, these 24 words, like, that's it. And that's what, so, you know, a lot of it was also
figuring out where to place different important things about Bitcoin that people need to know,
you know, and doing it strategically and not in a way that it's like, okay, let me tell you about
the seed phrase and what it is and what it does, but more just putting it in a real situation and
understanding that, you know, this is how it works in this situation. So I probably spent
more time on it for that reason. And then also making a film is kind of like making a sculpture.
And when you make a sculpture out of, say, marble, you have to work with the marble. You may have a
vision for it, but there are certain parts of the marble that are more dense than others,
certain fissures and things that you just can't chip into if you want to. And so when you come
across that, you have to shift your vision for the sculpture and you have to make it a little bit
different. And so part of the reason why it was longer in that section was probably for that reason.
I just had more material there, you know, to work with. So but I think all the flood points are
are equally important because someone gets stuck on any one of those, right, where they thought it
was bad for energy. Okay, it's not for criminals. Okay, that makes sense. Okay, it's easy to use.
Okay, it's not volatile if you save it for the long term. Okay, but it's like, you know, if it's
going to destroy the earth and I really don't care. So I think it's important to touch on all of those.
But yeah, that's probably why that criminal section was a little bit longer, just a little
bit more material to work with. And just knowing that it was one of the main ones that, you know,
people hear often. I think that is such an important point that you mentioned about, like,
people just need one reason to say no, right? Just and it doesn't make maybe like you said,
maybe they come around on on the okay, it's not used by criminals. Okay, it's actually pretty easy
to use. But you know, but it's burning the planet. I've been told by Greenpeace and, you know, and
Elizabeth Warren that it's burning the planet. So I can't possibly support something that's so
bad for, for the planet. And they'll use that that'll just be their excuses, their sticking point.
But if you take those away, you take away their ability to, to throw up obstacles, right? And
ultimately, like the funny thing about Bitcoin is it's like, you know, you're not like you said,
you're not trying to sell anyone anything, you're not trying to, you know, pump your own bags,
I'm not trying to pump my bags with this podcast. The effect that we have on any bag pumping is
minute, right? It's the reason we share these things, the reason that we, you know, want to tell
stories, the reason you made this film is because you want people to know there is a solution out
there. You want people to know that there is a way out of this pain of inflation that they're
feeling. And it's like, but it's kind of tough because you're like, okay, I've got to literally
break down every wall that I know they're going to throw up. And one of the other ones that you
dig into that I, I love that you did was you talk about Bitcoin versus crypto. And I wasn't sure
if you were going to do that, but you do. And I thought that part was like all parts of this film.
It was spot on. Can you talk about how you structured that? Because that is, I think
it's one of the biggest confusions for people. And, you know, all of the scammers out there that
associate themselves with Bitcoin, they don't make your job any easier as a filmmaker to try and
tell the story of no, look, these are different. Right. Yeah, I didn't want to leave an opportunity
for crypto people to point to the film and then say, you see why, you know, we're into this,
you see why Bitcoin and these other things are good for the world, you know. And like,
I try to be humble in that, like, I think the best argument for crypto I've ever heard is that we
shouldn't, we should develop in all areas we possibly can because we shouldn't discourage
innovation because we don't know what will work in the end necessarily. And so I think, you know,
of course, 99.9% or flat out outright scams where people know it's a scam and they're just scamming
on purpose. Maybe there's a small percentage that actually think they're doing something that could
be meaningful. And so, I mean, anyway, so, but outside of that, it just seems like it's such a
distraction to think about crypto. And again, I didn't want the film to be coopted by crypto. And
so I thought it was important to touch on that and to present the best arguments against crypto.
And so I think really the way I've led into those questions was, you know, asking, you know,
some of the interviewees, like, people think Bitcoin is described as digital gold. So like,
you know, what's silver going to be, you know, and so that kind of helped really frame it up. But
yeah, I think ultimately, the consensus was that, you know, Bitcoin's open source. And so if some
other coin actually makes something that is valuable, it can pretty easily be rolled into Bitcoin.
And Bitcoin is by far the largest network and money is a winner take all type of situation. So
yeah, I definitely, again, I wanted to touch on it because I thought it was important. I mean,
I know people and I'm sure you know people that, you know, you talk to about Bitcoin, they're like,
oh, awesome, that's great. Yeah, I got a little bit of Bitcoin then a year later, it's like,
hey, how's it, you know, you still holding it like, oh, no, I sold it for this and that. And
it's like, oh, God, man. So I thought it was important to touch on.
Oh, sorry. Yeah. Like the other thing that they follow that up with is, oh, should I get some
like, should I get some doge or have you heard of, you know, Shiba or like whatever? And you're like,
no, man, did I tell you that? Or because I didn't like, I see that you saw that on Robinhood now.
And now you think that that's going to be worth what Bitcoin is someday and you are going to lose
all your money. But okay, you know, do what you want. Yeah. Yeah. So again, yeah, I think it was
important to cover. And yeah, I think I did a good job. Probably, you know, you could get more
detailed. And that's kind of one of the difficult things about making a film is like, so much of
it is editing and cutting. And so it's like, how much do you put in? How deep do you go down different
rabbit holes? But ultimately, I think, I think it did a good job of summarizing why, you know,
people, you know, most should just ignore crypto and focus on Bitcoin. But yeah, I thought it,
I thought it was important, you know, to put in there. No, I think you did a great job. But again,
it's like, I was as the further I'm getting in the film, the more I'm getting blown away that
you're actually like covering, you know, because as you as you start to watch a film, like, oh,
you know, I wonder if I'll get into, you know, whatever it might be, like watching that, you
know, the Satoshi reveal documentary on HBO, like you're wondering what they're going to get
into. And like, got your film could not be a starker contrast to that film, in terms of the
actual, like real knowledge that you are giving people through stories, rather than trying to
have some sensationalized, you know, we found Satoshi type thing, like this is a this is a
film that's going to help people, you know, it's entertaining to no doubt, you like you will be
on the edge of your seat, but it's actually has a chance at helping people. I don't think that
Satoshi documentary is helping anyone, you know, no, the purpose of the films are completely
different, right. And I think it's a shame and it was a misstep because if you're gonna, if you're
trying to go for shock value, right, like, and you're going to focus on who Satoshi is, I mean,
you must realize that the Bitcoin community in general is not that interested in that, like,
you know, I mean, already like from the announcement, like people are already like,
oh, you know, like, we already know how this ends, you don't know who it is, you know,
when nobody knows who it is, you think you're gonna, you know, HBO is gonna fly and do better
investigation than an open source, you know, like decentralized everyone around the world doing
this. And so you don't get the Bitcoin community interested in it. And then so who are you catering
to? You're catering to the average person. And then it's like, how interested is the average
person in Bitcoin right now anyway, like, is it really going to draw them into the film if you're
like, hey, we know who Satoshi is, maybe some, but to me, it just felt like it was a film without an
audience. And so and again, and what was the point of it was to uncover who Satoshi is, but for what
purpose, to what end, why, you know, and so I think with my film, it's much different, right. It's
the purpose of the film is to better understand inflation and to better understand Bitcoin. And
and again, I, the best part is I think it caters to both audiences. The average person will learn
more than they've learned probably their whole life, you know, in terms of learning something
that actually can have a meaningful practical difference in their life, something they can
they can actually do, you know, and and same thing for Bitcoiners. I mean, some of the footage I
released, you know, as I was as I was making it. And so like the Kenya stuff, I had released a good
amount of the Kenya, you know, mining, bringing electricity to people for the first time. And I
can't tell you how many Bitcoiners, you know, like message me like, dude, I had no idea that this
was going on, you know. And so I think that's, again, that's my favorite part about it is that
this is a film that you can watch as a Bitcoin or an appreciated or you can watch it with your
family and like, they're going to appreciate it. And and and you're going to find new things there.
And it is very dense. And I think it is one of those films that, you know, you can watch it
multiple times and you'll catch new profound quotes, you know, or or so. Yeah, it's been a lot
of work. It's been a lot, a lot of work. But, you know, I think it, I think it will be timeless.
I think it's a true asset. It will exist forever. And and yeah, and that's one of the most beautiful
things about making anything in Bitcoin is you have the ability, the potential to make something
that is timeless. And yeah, man, I think, I think that's what I did.
I agree. As someone who's already started watching it again, because I was like, I know, I know I
missed some stuff, you know, because I was taking my notes on the side and everything. And now I need
to watch it again, just fully put everything else away, sit down and fully enjoy it. But, you know,
I had to, I had to get my prep in to make sure make sure I was ready for this. And I have honestly
still quite a few topics I want to get into you, but get into it with you. And I think that's
what I want to get into you, but get into it with you. But before we do, I do want to make sure
we get this out there too, just for people who may decide to turn off this interview partway
through. But where are where is this actually getting released? What is the release mechanism?
How can people find this? How can they support it? What can they what can they do?
Right. So no more inflation.com is where it'll be released. You can go there now and pre-order
the film. It'll be available to stream on no more inflation.com November 21st, so a week before
Thanksgiving. And so I think it's a really great film for Thanksgiving. If you're the type of,
you know, especially with the price now, I mean, you know, if you're going to be at Thanksgiving
weekend or whatever, and family members are going to be asking you about, oh, you know, you must be
feeling pretty good, you know, Bitcoin price is looking pretty good. I think this is the perfect
opportunity and time to show them something like this. So yeah, it'll be released on the website
for now. When it's available, you know, each person that purchases will get a password or
give you access to the film for, you know, a few days where you can watch it. And then that's where
it'll live for now. You know, I have done some work to try to reach out to some platforms to see
if they're interested in it. Nothing fruitful yet. But, you know, I think it's, I think it's a matter
of time really before a Netflix or an HBO or something like that is interested in it. But for
now, no more inflation.com self released, you know, I basically this whole project's been all me,
you know, I mean, I travel with a few suitcases and a backpack, I, you know, set up the lighting,
I set up the camera, I do all the audio, I do the interviews, I raise the money, I planned it,
I built the website, like, you know, so it is, and maybe that's one of the things too that when
you go to film school, maybe you think you need a big crew and you kind of get compartmentalized
into different roles, like I'm an assistant camera, like I'm a cinematographer, you know, but
this was just, you know, it's really one man. And I think that's one of the coolest things with it
being released the way it is now is, you know, it's a way for people to directly support me,
you know, an artist. And, and I hope that I can continue to make films like this, you know,
I'm coming to a point in my life where I, you know, it's time to start a family and, and, and
to have some, have some stability and stuff like that. So it would be a dream if I can continue
to do this. But yeah, anyway, that's where it is on the website. And, you know, ultimately though,
I know the film will go far and wide, it's just a matter of time, you know, whether it's,
that's me promoting it on a big platform, like, you know, Joe Rogan type of thing,
or it's a big platform picking it up. I knew when I was making the film, if I just make a great
film and I make it undeniable, it'll just be a matter of time. And so yeah, inflation's raging,
Bitcoin's raging, it's entertaining. And so yeah, anyway, no more inflation.com is where you want
to go. I love it. And I think this is actually the, when you're in that, you know, post Thanksgiving
meal coma, this is the perfect thing. Toss it on the TV, you know, forget the football, like put on,
put on no more inflation. That is, that is the move right there.
And I'm curious.
It's guaranteed to spark conversation. Like, I mean, again, like you're saying,
there's so many topics is covered there. There's something there for everybody,
you know, like it's impossible that it's not going to spark a conversation. Like it's guaranteed
or your money back, you know, like, but yeah, it's, it's, it's, it's going to spark a conversation,
certainly. And, you know, I'm curious too about the, because this, see, this is something that I would
want as many people as possible to see. And it's an incredibly well made film. Like this is the
quality of a film that you will see on Netflix, on Amazon, on whatever streaming service it is.
What is that process like for actually getting that, like you, you, they have like a submission
form that you go through? Like, is it just like a, do you reach out to somebody? Is there any way
that people who are listening to this, who, if they have some sort of connection, they can help
you with that?
Yeah. So I think the only one that has a formal submission process is Angel Studios. So definitely
when the film is done, I'll go through that process. HBO and Amazon, it's, it's kind of like
you have to know somebody, you know, it's, it's, it's a little bit of a, there's gatekeepers there.
And so, you know, one of the people in my film is Graham Hancock. Graham Hancock has a show on
Netflix called Ancient Apocalypse. He just released season two of it. He's in the film talking about
the same things that Alex Gladstein is in terms of like foreign aid and monetary colonialism. And
actually, and the reason I've loved Graham Hancock for a long time and the work that he's done,
but I didn't know that he wrote a book about foreign aid in 1989 until I read Alex Gladstein's book
where Alex Gladstein cited Graham Hancock's book many times. And so that's how I was able to get
the interview with Graham. His, it was, I was approaching him about a topic he hadn't talked
about in a while. So anyway, you know, I think to get to Netflix or HBO, you have to know somebody
who knows somebody. You have to know a producer. You have to know, you know, somebody that, that
works high up there. And so, so yeah, anybody who's out there that works at Netflix, who works at HBO,
who, you know, knows somebody. Yeah, I would say, you know, wait and watch the film first. And then
if you can make a connection, then I'd be happy to do that. Because again, I think the pitch for
Netflix is solid. It's again, like, if you're Netflix, what do you want? You want content that
your viewers are going to relate with and appreciate. And you want ideally content that might bring in
new users, you know, and so it's interesting when you have that stamp, like that, as soon as, like,
Money Electric was announced, just the fact that it was an HBO film brought all of this attention
and all of this interest. And so, yeah, I think the pitch for Netflix is like,
how many of your users are feeling inflation right now, right? How many of your users like,
might be interested in Bitcoin, but just don't know how it works, you know. And then on top of that,
if you release a film like this, you're likely going to have a lot of support from Bitcoiners
coming in appreciating the fact that you're putting out a film like this. So it's going to serve
probably 99.9% of your users already. And it's going to bring in people from probably the most
passionate community in the world, right? Maybe there's not as many Bitcoiners as Nike customers,
but like, what are Nike customers like about Nike that it makes them look cool, that it's like,
cool shoes, like, that's cool. People can get passionate about that, but not the same kind
of passion as money that can fix so many of these problems. So again, I think, I think it's really,
my job is done. My job is to make a film that is undeniable. And then from there,
it's just a matter of time before somebody who knows somebody sees it and then sends it to
somebody else and then, you know, conversations happen. That's what I think, unless there's
some concerted effort by, I don't know who, you know, that really doesn't want this kind of message
to get out there. But then still, like, I can totally see this being something that if, you know,
Joe Rogan saw, like, let's say Adam Curry, right, the Podfather knows Joe Rogan. If Adam Curry sees
this and is like, Joe, this is what I've been trying to explain to you about Bitcoin for so long,
watch this film. Like, I can totally, it doesn't seem completely unrealistic that Joe Rogan might
see it and say like, okay, let's have this guy come on and talk about it, you know. So I think
there's a lot of paths forward. And ultimately, my job is done, I make the film the best it can be,
and I know it's going to, you know, it's going, it's very impactful, man. Like, you definitely
have a lot of emotions, you feel a lot of things when you watch it. So, yeah, that's kind of how it
goes. I hope that somebody listening to this is someone who can make a connection or knows someone
who can make a connection. Because again, I think that this is such a, it is perfectly timely right
now. You know, not only are people feeling the pain of inflation, but Bitcoin is ripping in terms
of its fiat price. Who knows how high this is going to go by when I mean, it's going to just,
you know, it's going up forever, Laura, but like, things can move really quickly. And I want as many
people as possible, normal people who are feeling the pain of inflation to hear the message in your
film and to, you know, you said something earlier that I actually wanted to come back to because
you mentioned usually when I hear people talking about orange pill, they're, it's like something
that they're giving to somebody, right? They're thinking about me and it's like something I'm
giving to you. I orange pilled this person, which like, I don't love that, that phrasing, but you
phrased it differently. You're a refreshment member, but it was something about like, the orange pill is
something you're doing to yourself. Like it's that spark. Can you talk about that more? Because I think
that is why this film is so important because it can give people that spark. But you used it in a way
that I like a lot more than the way people typically use orange pill. Yeah. Again, I think you are
orange pilled once you have an unstoppable desire to learn more about Bitcoin. You have a pull,
you know, like you're, yeah, it's like that spark of interest is lit in you. And yeah, I agree with
you. I think that everybody ultimately orange pills themselves, you know, because you can't have,
you can have a conversation for three hours and you can't get everything across, you know? So
if you want to orange pill somebody else, you, you just need to figure out how to spark their
interest and how to get them to want to learn themselves. And, and yeah, I think, again,
I think a film is just the best way of doing it. It's one of the, my favorite parts about finishing
it is like, the film is there because when people would ask me like, what's the film going to be
about? What's it going to cover? It's like, dude, I literally cannot explain it to you. Like the only
way to actually convey this to you in a condensed manner is to actually just make the film because
there's no other way of doing it. But yeah, again, that, and I think for someone to have that spark,
I think this is how I put it. Most people, okay, when it comes to lightning, a lot of people will
say no one will ever run their own node. It's too complicated right now. Right. And I disagree. I think
that if you have a big incentive to do it, if it's the only way that you'll be able to transact,
because some government ban or whatever, people can do it. They just need to have the desire or the
need to do it. And unfortunately, I think most people come into Bitcoin after they felt the
pain of something. And I think that if, and anytime there's ever been anyone that you have orange
pilled without them feeling the pain, but they get it without feeling the pain, like you're
literally enlightening that person. I think that's the definition of that word. It's to have the
realization of something without actually having to go through the experience yourself. And so
I think in order for someone to be enlightened, to actually have the desire to spend the time to
learn more, they just need to see the whole picture. They don't need all of the resolution
necessarily to begin with, but they need to see how it all ties together. And I think that's what
film can do best. You're not going to get everything across in a message, but you're going to give
somebody an idea of the whole picture of what's going on. And then they're going to go down the
rabbit hole and they're going to fill in the resolution for themselves. So anyway, yeah,
I think that's what an orange pill is. It's igniting that fire inside somebody to go,
okay, I see why this is important. I see the problem that this can fix and the way that this
can help me. And it's worth my time to look and do it a bit more. So yeah, that's what I think.
I like that definition a lot. One of the things you talked about near the end of the film was just
how Bitcoin changes people. And I'm just kind of curious, how has it changed you?
Yeah, I mean, the whole film is kind of framed around my story. I mean, that's kind of the
perspective that it's coming from, which is again, a very relatable perspective, even people my age
or older, it doesn't really matter. I mean, at this point, if you don't own a house, you probably
aren't getting it unless you're saving in Bitcoin, right? And so for me personally, it really is a
kind of a story, my story, you know, of how I came across Bitcoin and found appreciation for it was,
I started to become aware of inflation. And I was like, Oh, shit. Yeah, like everything's getting
more expensive. This is really weird, you know. And so fortunately for me, I learned about all of
the problems of inflation at the same time I was learning about Bitcoin. Because again,
if I had just learned the problems, man, like, I would not want to have kids. I don't think so.
I just, I don't know, man, it just seems like it would be too dark of a place. So yeah, it just
like the other people in my film, it's changed me completely in many, many, many ways. It's changed
my diet. It's changed my outlook for the future. It's changed like even my circle of people that
I communicate with on a regular basis. It like so many things. I mean, even like ignoring pop
culture and like what's in the news, it's just like, I find myself so disinterested in so many of
the things that the normal person is interested in. And ultimately, I feel like just more at peace.
One of the things like, you know, I'm in Los Angeles. One of the things I noticed that I lived
outside of Los Angeles for a little while in a more suburban rule kind of area. And I felt so
much more relaxed when I was out there. And I realized one of the reasons was when you're driving
on the road in those kinds of areas, the streets are typically wider and longer. There's not so
many driveways, not so many streets, but when you're in LA, it's like constantly your cars are
coming out of here, you're coming out of stop sign here. It's like there's so much going on that
it's like you feel anxious because so much is happening all at the same time. And I feel like
that's what happens with people too now with in the news and pop culture and this issue and that
issue. And like they focus on so many things that it kind of builds this anxiety. And so, yeah,
for me, Bitcoin absolutely, you know, has changed my life in so many ways. And yeah,
it's like, I don't even know, I don't think there's words to describe it.
There is a film, though, to describe it pretty. Again, that's the beauty of filmmaking and of
this film. I think you're so correct when you say like, yeah, you can you can have a three hour
conversation with somebody like just you and them, you can talk about nothing but Bitcoin and the
problems of money for three hours. It's just not going to be as effective as a really well made
film. It's just not like I mean, unless somehow you're also putting in dramatic music at certain
times and you can show them all like, like, you can't do it. Like maybe there's some really talented
people who can find some way. But I firmly believe like a really good film is always going to be more
impactful. Because it also kind of it lets somebody come to it as an observer, but then to observe
something of himself in the film. And then, you know, to maybe get into a little bit of a dark
place, you know, where where inflation takes us, but then to realize there is hope, there is a
solution, there is something, there is a light at the end of the tunnel. You know, and it seems,
you know, that a major kind of theme in this is, you know, okay, fix the money, fix the world,
right? Because you do go through so many different fiat, let's say fiat problems, right?
And I'm just, you know, wondering like, did you have a, did you have a favorite part of the film
in terms of like that, as you put it together, you were like, you know, this is the part that really
like, you know, hits me particularly or like, is it too hard to tell because you view it as a whole,
as the filmmaker? Yeah, it's really hard to pick. Because it all does kind of go together, you know.
But the Kenya stuff, I don't know for whatever reason, and then also like the North Dakota stuff
with HT for different reasons. So the Kenya stuff because to see like those people were living like
literally dirt poor, like dirt floors, like aluminum walls and roofs, you know, but they're happy man,
oh man, they're so happy, happier than, I don't know, probably the happiest people I interviewed
the whole film. And that was like, I don't know, it just hit me differently, you know. And then
in North Dakota, I went in April, which is not the coldest time of the year, it was fucking cold,
man. It was so cold, it was like, it was like 40 degrees or something like that. But the wind,
oh my god, the wind, like, you know, after a while, you just like need to stand by a building to like
get some blockage from the wind. And it feels like you're by a fire, like if you get out of the wind,
like you're like, ooh, we're getting warmed up, you know. And but in North Dakota, like,
you know, HT, Hodel Tarantula was telling me like the grind that it takes, you know, to wake up every
day before the sun rises and to get home after the sun sets and every day in and out, in and out,
six months out of the year, you know, to do that. And I know it's not just with the Bitcoin miners
out there, that's just oil in general, oil field, oil workers in general. I never saw that side.
I never met somebody like an oil worker before. And so it just gave me such a profound
appreciation for those people because we all need that energy. So for whatever reason, the mining
stuff always seemed to be the most impressing, you know, impactful. But yeah, all of it just in
the hole, it's so great, man. I mean, you know, I can't tell you how many people like told me
after they went to like some Bitcoin conference in Argentina or in El Salvador right now, and they're
like, oh, hey, man, people have been telling me like they saw me in this trailer of yours, you know.
And so I think the nicest part is that it is one whole thing and everybody is that's a part of it.
Like we're all sharing in the beauty of it. And so yeah, it's hard to really pinpoint an exact
moment because again, I think you need the whole story to really appreciate it all, right? You
need to understand the problem before you understand the solution. And so yeah, it's really hard to
pinpoint it. But I mean, like interviewing Graham Hancock, dream. I mean, never thought I would
do that, you know. And so yeah, just lots of cool stuff, man. I was not expecting to, you know,
to see Graham Hancock in there. Like that was really, really cool. And it's nice, you know,
because like I'm familiar with his ancient apoclasm, familiar with his show, I think a lot of people
are. But I was not aware that he I guess I didn't notice it when reading Gladstein, like didn't
put the pieces together. This was this is the same guy, you know, that that I'm familiar with. So
like that was just really, really cool. And I think it also helps to have people that like,
you know, you could even call him like a pop culture figure at this point, you know, he's
known like people know his face. And, you know, maybe some of these Bitcoiners are not as well
known. People may, you know, and people make snap judgments, but it's like, it helps to see somebody
who you're like, Oh, I know that guy, I've seen him on Netflix. Like that, that makes a difference
for the average person to be like, huh, okay, this adds some, you know, credibility in my mind,
and like, for better or worse is the reality, right? People do make these, these judgments.
And I think again, that's why it's so important the way that you structured this where
it's not called, you know, Bitcoin, the solution to inflation, or, you know, something like that.
It's you, you don't touch Bitcoin at all until the problem has already been defined. And I think
that's so important because I think so much of the Bitcoin material out there is understandably
kind of, okay, Bitcoin first. And then yeah, here's this really cool thing, Bitcoin. And let's also
talk about the problems. But it's like, if you start with that, you lose so many people
right off the bat, and you're not going to get them back because they already checked out when
you mentioned Bitcoin. But if you can lead with that problem, if you can come in there and get
them to agree and get them to feel something and get them invested, then they're ready. They've
already made it through, you know, half of the film, they're ready to hear like, please let
there be a solution, you know, please tell me that we're not just all screwed. And I thought that
that was really masterfully structured on your part. And again, I'm just, I'm just stoked for
people to watch this man. Like it's, I think it's going to have a huge impact. I really do.
Yeah, me too. One thing I thought about, which was kind of cool is I was trying to quantify like
how much time I spent making this thing, you know, and I think the best way to add it up is literally
just to add up all the hours of the last two years because like, I don't know what it is, but maybe
it's just I'm the type of person, but like, the same thing with all Salvador film, I just could
simply could not stop thinking about it until it was done. And so whether I'm planning it or
filming it or traveling for it or like literally dreaming about it, like, it's just like, I think
if you add up two years, it's like 13,000 hours or 14,000 hours or something like that. And so
the film is about an hour long, a little more than that. And so one cool thing I thought about was like,
I've invested 13,000 hours. Once 13,000 people have seen the film, I'm at a break even, right?
Like, like, all the time I spent has now been spent also by other people. And then above that,
it's just positive. It's like, it's like, my investment of time is returning so much more time.
And I don't know what that means exactly. But for some reason, I feel like it's a, it's a special
profound thing that it was a really good use of my time. It's I'm scaling my time very well. And
it's a, again, film is perfect for that. Anybody with a phone can watch a film, right? It engages all
your senses, like you're saying music really sets a tone for emotion. Emotion is what makes people
take action. And so, yeah, anyways, it was, it was a lot of, it was a lot of time, but I know
what's gonna, I know what's gonna come back. And I mean, I met so many people that like,
like, I've gone to dinner with Bitcoiners, and like one guy wants to pay for everybody,
because this other guy that we're having dinner with was the guy that Orange killed him. And
is the reason why he's a Bitcoiner now. And there's so much value there, you know, and that's another
cool thing I think about is anyone that I can reach with this, you know, what a, I don't know
what you could do for somebody, you know, that's more profound than getting them on the Bitcoin,
you know, starting to think about Bitcoin, even Graham Hancock, you know, like he's not necessarily
a Bitcoiner, but he's an open-minded person, and he was open to it. And so, the film kind of served
as that for him too, you know, he was asking me because I showed him a shorter cut of it before
it was done. And so he was like, you know, what about the volatility? Well, like, how do you get
it? And what do you do with the keys and everything? And so, it was just one of the touch points for
him, you know, and who knows now, I haven't spoken with him in a bit, but with the price going up,
like, I can't imagine he's not, you know, thinking about the film and some of the things that are
touched on it. So, that's a nice thing too, is he is a household name. I knew it would be helpful
for getting on platforms like HBO or Netflix to have that. But at the same time, it's a way to
actually start that person's, you know, Bitcoin journey. And so, yeah, yeah, it's pretty cool, man.
Pretty fucking cool. We're going to see a new Netflix series from Graham Hancock, like a couple
years from now, it's going to be like monetary apocalypse or something, you know. I'm looking
forward to it already. But I mean, so that is an insane amount of hours, like 13, 14,000 hours.
That is impressive. Like, that is, you know, the finished product, yes, that like,
people see that and they're like, you know, an hour, a little over an hour long. I think it's
difficult for people who don't understand everything that goes into it to even comprehend
the amount of time that you put into this, that you traveled all over the world to do this.
Like, so I'm, I'm, I hope people realize like this, your proof of work is, I mean, second to none.
And to do this as, as one man is just impressive, dude. Like, it's really impressive. But I think
maybe you also needed to do that because you had that vision for what it needed to be. And you
have the skills as well to be able to do, you know, like it's, you know, you weren't just shooting
it, you weren't just editing it. No, you were doing all of that, you were writing all of it.
You were the one asking the questions. Like, this is 100% your film, your vision. And I think that
shows through too, because it's also your story. Like, I think that's why it almost, it had to be
just you, you know, I'm sure at times you were probably like, man, I would love some help on this,
but like, I can't even imagine, dude. How do you, how do you know when it's done? Like, how do you
know, okay, I'm done editing, I'm finished now, like ship it. How do you even begin to know when
it's done? So, fortunately, I had a circle of people, call them advisors or whatever, you know, so
I'm never afraid of feedback, you know, because I always see it as suggestions, you know,
if some, but sometimes someone will see something that I don't see and I'm like, oh,
that's a good idea, right? So throughout the whole process, I was feeding people, you know,
what I was doing and gathering feedback and this and that, and even Graham Hancock gave me one of
the best points of feedback, because the flow of the film was slightly different before. Before,
right now, the flow of the film is it starts with people living in different intensities of inflation.
So you're seeing all of those personal stories. And originally, it started with people in the
US talking about inflation, and then it kind of went into why it's happening. And then it went
into like, okay, what happened? Is it going to get worse? And then it goes into those other things.
But Graham's point of feedback was like, the most relatable part of the film are these average
people that you're talking to. That's the most impactful part of these people talking about
living with inflation. Put that up front, you know, and I was like, yeah, that makes a lot of sense.
So I think by doing that, you kind of get a feel as you go along. And then eventually,
when you start sending cuts to people and they're like, honestly, I don't even know, I don't have
any other feedback. Like it just looks great. You know, like, I think this is, you know, I can see
this being, you know, picked up by a big platform. Then you kind of go like, okay, what I've got is
good. And let me just polish, polish, polish, polish, polish. And so yeah, that's kind of, I think,
how and of course, like, I think nothing can ever be perfect. Like if I had more time, you know,
maybe I can make it 1% better, 2% better, something like that. But at a certain point,
it's kind of like, okay, look, it's more than good enough. You know, let's put it together
and let's get it out there. So yeah, I think that's kind of, I think kind of know when you know.
You know what I mean? Yeah. Yeah. Well, and it's like, what's this saying, you know, perfect is the
enemy of good. Like, you know, you could try to perfect it forever. You could always find something,
you know, change this cut a little bit, you know, change the timing slightly. But it's like,
you're right. And people do need this message now. They really need it now. And I'm curious too,
just if you have any kind of advice for any other aspiring filmmakers or content creators, like,
who watch this film and say, like, this is amazing, I want to, I want to take on a big project like
this, like, you know, but I don't, I don't know if I can do it. I don't know if, like, I don't even
know how to, how to start, but like, I have the desire. Like, what advice would you give to
people who see this and it impacts them? And they say, I want to help tell these stories too.
Because ultimately, you're doing this and you did this in service of people and of Bitcoin as a
network. And it is just a network of people, right? But to help that network grow. And I think a lot
of people have that desire. And maybe they have the skills, but they don't know where to start,
or they don't know how they should tackle it, or they're just overwhelmed by even the idea of it.
Yeah. So first of all, I wanted to touch on this actually. You know, I think whenever
you come into Bitcoin, and then you realize how much it can help people, you start to naturally
think about how you can contribute, right? And then that leads to like, okay, what do I know how to
do best, right? Or what am I really passionate about that I've always wanted to learn how to do
and let me do that. And so again, I think that's probably one of the reasons why I was so passionate
about doing this, because I really felt like, man, we can reach people. We totally can. You know,
it's like, it's just a matter of education. And it's not even like the, again, I don't need to
define everything. The rabbit hole is there, you know? And I felt like I, film would be perfect.
And that's what I do. And I need to do this. Because if I don't do this, and the transition
between fiat and Bitcoin is a rough transition, I might have some regrets and I might feel like
I should have done that, man. Maybe I could have helped people, you know what I mean? Maybe I could
have helped myself, you know, and my kids, you know, if the transition is more difficult or easier.
And so anyway, so I think that's really why I needed to do it, man. I just, I needed to do it,
no matter what happens. In terms of people, you know, wanting to maybe do something similar,
I think there's two different camps. One camp is someone who, and this is something you determine
for yourself, who feels that they can produce something like this, that they have the experience
and they have the knowledge and the skills to produce a film like this. And then there's the
other camp, which is like, I've never done it before. I don't know if I could do it, but I am
interested in doing it. So I would say for the latter, for the people who have never done it
before, you know, I would say like, you don't need expensive equipment, you know, you can do it on
your phone, you can do it with like a microphone that's not that expensive. And I think the most
important thing is just a compelling story, you know. So if there's a good story of a Bitcoiner
or something that Bitcoin is doing, like just capturing it on your phone and with a microphone
is going to be good. Like there's a Kanye West documentary that's on Netflix and like 80% of
the documentary is done at a time when it's shot by a guy who's never done a documentary before.
And he kind of was like, thought that Kanye was going to become up and coming and decided to follow
him and the camp, all the shots are shaky as fuck, the audio sounds like shit, you know. But the thing
is it doesn't matter because the story is what's the most important thing. So I think that's a good
place to start for people. Identify stories, use your phone or just do audio or write an article
or whatever it is, you know, but realize that the story is the most important thing. And then for
people who actually feel like they have the chops to do it, man, it is not easy, dude. It is not easy.
I mean, like, again, I think if I had to do this again, it's possible that it would not have happened
because it requires so much time. And I definitely used some of my own money, but I also, you know,
raised money also. And I was doing that throughout the whole process of the film, the whole thing.
And I felt like I had proof of work. I mean, fucking president of El Salvador is, you know,
like retweeting my film I made about the country. It's like, what more do you want from me? You
know what I mean? Like, you see the quality, can you imagine on Netflix? Okay, help me, you know.
And still, it was difficult. So I would say for somebody who wants to do something similar,
I don't know. The only way I know how to do it is the way I did it. Make a short film
about some interesting story in Bitcoin. Use that as a proof of work and then have a big vision.
And then, you know, of course, you have to believe in yourself and then you have to
convince other people to believe in you too. That's really what the best part is, dude,
when I started to make this, that's how I was approaching people. I was saying, look,
we have an opportunity to enlighten people before the next financial disaster. You know,
we can do this with film. It's a very powerful tool. There's no film out there like this.
Look at my work. I can do this, but I need your help. Help me do this. And so, again,
if the vision wasn't so grand, you know, then I couldn't have done this. So that's all I would say
is, and I think one thing that's always been helpful for me is I remind myself life is always
harder than I think it's going to be. Always, always, always, always, always, always. Like,
I feel like this is the last hill to climb. Oh, man, I got this shit together. It looks so good.
I know Netflix is going to want this. Graham Hancock's in it. Why wouldn't they want it?
Man, if they can jump in now, like, they'll help me because they can help me polish up some of
these things and I can finally be done with this thing. You know what I mean? But I always knew.
I always remind myself it's not going to happen like that. It's probably not going to happen
like that. There's going to be another hill to climb. So I think that if you're going to try to
do something like this, just remind yourself that every day, you know, like, this is probably
going to be harder than I think it's going to be, and that's okay.
That's good advice. I'm curious too. So when somebody finishes watching your film, and again,
it's out on November 21st, right? That's when it'll be available. And I encourage people,
nomoreinflation.com, go there, support shooter, because this, you are going to want to watch this
film. But when they finish it, what do you hope that people feel? What do you hope that they think?
What do you want them to come out of that with? So again, I think there's two camps. I think
there's the Bitcoiners and then there's the Normies. And I think the Bitcoiners,
what I've heard from other Bitcoiners is that they come out of it with like a validation almost,
that this thing that they've been focusing on and researching and loving for so long is,
not that they needed the validation, but the film is, it's a validation of all of that. It's all of
these things that you've talked about, all these topics condensed in like, in a Netflix quality
film. It's amazing, man. So I hope that the Bitcoiners, that's what they step away with,
with gratification, like, yes, yes, this is exactly why I love this thing. And I hope that they
share it with people. I hope people buy it for their coworkers and like, because when it's available
and you make the purchase, you'll get a password to log in and to watch it. And so you can buy 10
passwords, 20 passwords, 30 passwords, whatever, and just share it with people. And so that,
I hope that that's what they do. I hope they show it to their family and I hope they tell me about
their experience, you know, and if there's ways I can make it better, man, let me know too, you know,
that nothing's impossible now. And then for the average person, I hope that they just buy a little
bit of Bitcoin. And I hope that they, that they, you know, start learning. And I realize that maybe
some people will watch it and immediately be like, wow, okay, I'm going to start learning about this,
I'm going to buy some. But probably most people, it's just going to be that first real good
touch point, that first really, really good one. And it might take a year later to like, you know,
who knows, right, when the price of houses double again, they're like, oh, shit, yeah, I know why
this is happening, you know, they're just keep printing money and this Bitcoin thing is just like,
it's $300,000 now, like, okay, like I need to start actually looking into this thing. So,
yeah, I just hope for the average person that, yeah, they just, they see it as a potential solution
to the suffering that we're feeling, I feel like inflation causes the most suffering in the world.
And, and that it inspires them to learn more about this Bitcoin thing.
Was there just speaking of inflation, because you talk to so many people and we see, you know,
even just a fraction of all the people that you talked to over these past two years.
Was there kind of like any new aha moments for you or the way that somebody put something that you
just, you hadn't heard it described that way before and it like, you know, even as somebody who has
been studying this, who's been making films about it, that it made something click for you in a
different way? Yeah, I think I had an idea of what inflation was like as it got worse, but
I didn't really know until I talked to people. And so like in Jamaica, for example, like they're
skipping meals, you know, I'm like, ah, yeah, I never really thought about that. But that makes
sense that you would need to start skipping meals, right? People, I think, average person
tends to think like, well, if things keep getting more expensive, like what's going to happen exactly?
It's like, well, what do you think, you know, you're not going to be able to buy everything
that you need. And so, and even in Argentina, like, again, this one didn't make it in, but
there's this business owner that shut down his business. He would spend like four hours a day
determining his prices, you know, like, wow, man, what a waste of time, what a waste of time.
And so, yeah, I think I had an idea of what life was like as things got worse, but you don't really,
and it's even hard, dude, it's even hard to describe it in words right now, you know, it's like,
you almost need to hear it from the people and see their faces and their emotions and to understand.
So, again, that's why I think it's going to be a beautiful film for Bitcoiners, too, because you
probably have read about a lot of these things, but it's different to see it and to hear from it.
I mean, again, it's completely changed me as just going through and making the film and talking to
all these people, and it's given me a much better understanding of the world, and yeah, it's changed
me for sure. And I hope that it changes people who watch it, too. Like, it is,
it is truly a powerful film. And I'm curious, too, like, okay, you've been working on this now for
two years. The product of all that work is something that's really powerful, I think is going to be
really impactful. Where do you go from here in terms of your own film? Are you even, I mean,
I assume right now you are still laser focused, like, you know, it's coming up on D-Day here,
like you're still nose to the grindstone. Like, after that, you just want to sleep for a while,
like take a little break, or are you already thinking about what you want to create next?
Yeah, it's funny, man. You know, throughout this, when I was making the film, I was listening to
this book called The Ecstasy and the Agony, it's a kind of a biography of Michelangelo.
And one of the takeaways, it was like, you know, when you really know you're doing something you
love, like you don't eat, you don't sleep, you, and this is what I've been saying to people, like,
you don't wear underwear for a couple of months, you know what I mean? Like, those are unnecessary
things. And so a lot of that is behind me. Definitely, there's a lot of work now to polish
just to make sure it's perfect in the best way that I can do it. And so that's nice. But I don't
know what's next, you know, I think I always want to approach my projects from the same perspective.
I approach this one, which is what is the most impactful thing I could possibly do.
I can't imagine how it wouldn't be related to Bitcoin. And so I don't know what's next, you know?
I know that mining is something that is the pools are more centralized, but also Bob Burnett talks
about like the necessity for 30% of the hash power to be like smaller size miners. And so I don't
know, maybe it'll be something I've been kind of kicking around the idea of making like an open
source kind of course or academy with like film and documenting like, okay, basics of, you know,
how to identify a site, how to how to maintain the equipment, you know, what to expect if you're
going to do it like, you know, off grid on gas, if you're going to do it on hydro, because I met
so many of these people now. And so, you know, that or maybe like, right, there's like scaling
solutions that may need to come with Bitcoin. I don't know, like, I love lightning. I don't know
if we need to be able to fit more people on chain for, you know, if in the next 100 years for it to
remain decentralized. And so, you know, but I think a lot of this is really, I think the solution to
a lot of these things is just pulling more people in more people that want to mine, more probably
already programmers and developers that might already have all the tools to contribute, but just
don't have the education to want to do it or see the importance. And maybe this film, no more
inflation will help with that, but maybe something more focused on that would help too. But again,
like, at this point, like, it's coming like a fork in the road. I look younger than I am, but like,
you know, the time to start a family is now. And so, honestly, if I was approached next week by
whoever, people, some somebody that, you know, Bitcoiners that aligned with incentives, and
they're like, dude, this is the most impactful thing that you can do. And, you know, we're gonna,
we're gonna fund it. I'm ready to go, you know, but, but other than that, I think this will be my
contribution to the space. And if I need to go back to doing what I was doing before in order to
fulfill, I think the most important thing, which is having a family and raising a family, you know,
my girl, we've been together for a long time. She's been very patient, especially through this
last two years of the film. And so, so yeah, we'll see. I think, I think this film will lead to more
opportunities to create more. I think that it's an important thing to do. I think that I'm the
perfect person to continue doing it, but the market will decide. So we'll see you, man. Oh, I love it.
Last thing, I'll, because we've been, we've been running already for over 90 minutes, but
it's flown by talking about this film, because again, I really encourage everybody go to nomore
inflation.com, support shooter, watch this film, share this film. It is really magnificent. And
what I'd like to wrap up with is just like, what makes you hopeful, man? What, what, what, what makes
you excited about the future? Yeah, it's, it's always going to be Bitcoiners. I think I always
tell people like, you know, we've never done this before with Bitcoin. We've never had money like
this before. So I think we don't really necessarily know the outcome. Worst case scenario, like for
whatever reason, it doesn't work. And then like, fuck it, we were doomed from the beginning anyway,
like just to repeat this thing. And I, you know, I think really we're just, I think life is
relatively petty in general. I think once we die, whatever happens after that, I think we look back
at this and kind of like, oh, that was fun, you know, like even if it was difficult and even if I
suffered, at least I got to experience that, you know? And so I think ultimately at the end of the
day, it's going to be fine whether we fail or not. But I don't think we're going to fail because,
you know, I think Bitcoin infects you and, and it makes you want to make this thing work because
we understand the opportunity that we have, right? Like one thing I realized is like the value of a
solution is equal to the size of the problem that it fixes. So if you're in the middle of the desert
and you're about to, you know, die of dehydration, that a bottle of water is very valuable. It's not
a dollar bottle of water, right? Like you'll pay anything. You'll probably pay your hand, you'll
probably pay to cut off your hand for that bottle of water, right? Because why not? Because you're
going to die anyway. So I think we see that, we see that this solution is so valuable because the
problem is so massive. And I think that ultimately we won't fail. I think that there's enough of us
good, strong people. And as the Bitcoin price goes up, you know, the wealth of Bitcoiners goes up
too and those people become, more people become free to do what they want. And the people who are
already free doing what they want have even more power to do more stuff. So yeah, Bitcoiners are
what make me hopeful, right? Like a lot of people out there probably had no idea I was working on
this for the last two years. And I think there's a lot of other people like me doing all different
kinds of things in Bitcoin that we have no idea about. And I think that's the best part. And again,
we're not working for some company. I'm not doing this because some company is paying me,
right? The motivation is much deeper than that. And it allows me and others to push through
difficult situations and to keep going because I'm doing it for a different reason. I'm doing it
for myself, for my family, for the world. So yeah, I think there's a lot of knees out there,
use out there, rock stars. A lot of like rock star would say there's a lot of rock stars out there
and there's only going to be more coming in. So yeah, I think we got this. I'm extremely hopeful.
I can never say I know what's going to happen, but I feel very good about the future. I think
I think even the transition might be it could be really bad, but I think there's a possibility
the transition can actually be very smooth and very beautiful from fiat to Bitcoin. And so yeah,
that's what I'm hopeful for. People like you make me hopeful. And I think this film is ultimately
going to make a lot of people very hopeful and probably people that I hope this gets into as
many non-Bitcoiner hands as possible. And so again, nomoreinflation.com. I'll link that in
the show notes. You know, I'll be blasting it out to everyone when this is released. I'll link your
your your x and your noster. I assume there's nowhere else we should send people except nomoreinflation.com.
Yep. Yep. And then exactly. Yeah, that's the best place. And then yeah, I definitely haven't been
as active on noster as I need to be. But after this, I definitely will. I mean, the point of being
to be honest on Twitter on x was just to gain awareness to be able to finish this thing. I
really don't care about the followers or the likes or any of that stuff. But I do appreciate what
noster is doing. And I would like to have my stuff exclusively there. So I think moving forward,
you know, once the kind of first push for awareness for this is out, then I'll just be on,
I'll be on noster. So yeah, but nomoreinflation.com is the best place to do it. Dude, thanks for having
me. I really appreciate it. You know, you and I, we've been running across each other at different
events and stuff too. And I appreciate what you do. And I'm happy that, you know, you're a dad and
like, man, I just I look forward to seeing your kid grow up too. And like, how cool, man, we're
going to have so many great memories between you and me and other Bitcoiners and everything. So I
really appreciate what you do, man. And I appreciate you, you know, wanting to help me spread this.
Dude, you know, I mean, we've clicked for a long time. And at least long time, it feels like a
long time. You know, I've couple of years now. And I like, you are a talented dude. This film is
just like a, it is a, is a triumphant. So I will do everything in my power and use whatever voice I
have to be able to share this out there. Because again, and you know this well as the person who
made it, people need this message right now more than ever. So I just want to thank you for making
it. And thanks for sharing your time on here. And yeah, I think people will be very glad to zap
you some Bitcoin on noster. After seeing this film, I can guarantee that. Cool, man. I appreciate it,
man. Thank you, dude.
5 Star Review wherever you're listening, or better yet, share this show with your network so more
people can learn about Bitcoin or don't Bitcoin doesn't care, but I sure do appreciate it. You
can grab links in the show notes to watch or list this show wherever you get your podcasts or go to
Bitcoin podcast.net slash podcast. And you'll also find the links to follow me and the show on
noster and on X. Bitcoin is scarce. There will only ever be 21 million. But Bitcoin podcasts are
abundant. So thank you for spending your scarce time to listen to the Bitcoin podcast. Until next
time, stay free.