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Strategy was the demand side of the Bitcoin story for five or six years.

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It was the Saylor era.

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And now vulnerabilities in the strategy have been exposed.

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Hedge funds are after them.

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Right? They've got, what, 600 and something thousand Bitcoin.

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OK, so let's choke this company so that they've got to cough up some of that Bitcoin, which they're now doing.

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Do you think Saylor's been a net positive for Bitcoin?

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He has said a couple of things that go against the ethos of Bitcoin.

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Bitcoin is going through kind of like reverse archaeology.

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It got to the Wall Street pocket of money.

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Anyone in that band of financialization went through the exact same learning curve as everyone in the previous ages of Bitcoin.

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So the suit coiners essentially recreated the ICO market.

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I do a lot of the AI policy in El Salvador.

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And the AI community is way more cypherpunk than a lot of the Bitcoin community.

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What do you think is going to be the most misunderstood part of what has happened in El Salvador?

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The idea where El Salvador has gone through the fourth turning and is the first country in the world to start up into the first turning.

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Max and Stacey, Stacey and Max, it's good to have you guys here.

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it's been been a little while since we've seen each other in the flesh i feel like the last time

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was el salvador but now i'm not now i'm not actually sure that the years are running together

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for me now and time moves strangely in bitcoin uh in the bitcoin universe i think but it's good

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to see you guys yes it's good to see you too and i'm not sure where we saw each other but

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you know it was definitely at a bitcoin conference i could probably guarantee you that i think it was

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Backstage in Nashville or Vegas?

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That sounds right.

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Wouldn't have been Vegas.

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We got nixed from the MC slots for Vegas.

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No hard feelings whatsoever.

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I think they wanted perhaps somebody a little bit less inflammatory.

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Who can say?

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But no hard feelings whatsoever.

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Honestly, emceeing is so much darn work that it's nice to be just an attendee

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or a speaker.

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Like it's a, it's a welcome change, but yeah, it's, we were just talking backstage.

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Carl and I have, the first time we went to El Salvador was 2022.

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We actually, we had a, saw you guys while we were there.

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I remember had a, had a lovely dinner.

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Archie was there as well when he was still a full nim.

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Yeah.

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Just good times.

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It's wild that that's been four years.

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Cause last time we went back to El Salvador was, I guess it was start of last year.

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We weren't able to go this year.

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And even just after a couple of years, it's amazing to me how much changed.

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Like you could already feel it when we were there in 2022.

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You could feel that there was something happening.

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And then going back there again a few years later, and we've been there three times now,

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two were in the same first year, months apart, because we apparently couldn't stay away.

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But it's kind of incredible.

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And it's one of the things I want to focus on with you guys a bit today,

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because it seems that in so much of the world, there's a lot of nihilism.

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There's a lot of despair.

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There's a dearth of hope.

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And it seems like El Salvador sort of has those things in plentiful supply right now.

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And maybe just as like a starting point,

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because I think there's a lot of misunderstandings about what's happening in El Salvador,

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what has been happening, what will be happening.

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It's kind of like when the history books are written, so to speak,

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What do you think is going to be the most misunderstood part of what has happened in El Salvador?

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Well, just first of all, as we were talking briefly before air, the idea where El Salvador has gone through the fourth turning and is the first country in the world to start up into the first turning is true.

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It's palpable. We've been talking about this for a couple of years.

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You know, El Salvador had 40 years of bad times and that civil war, gang war.

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And then the president, McKellie, arrives in 2019 and strongmen create good times.

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So that's important to note.

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And now El Salvador has become the shining city on the hill.

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It's become the beacon of freedom.

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It's taken the place of countries, let's say, like the United States,

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that were the go-to country for people seeking freedom and free speech and opportunity.

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That country is now El Salvador.

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And so we're seeing it in the migration.

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We're seeing it in the GDP, which is now exploding higher.

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We're seeing it in culture.

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All kinds of cultural phenomenon are happening where the generation Bukele,

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which have been the beneficiary of the education programs that Stacy has architected,

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like Kubo Plus and Kubo AI and others.

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Now they're second, third generation years in these programs.

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And the students are now teaching the new coterie of the new students.

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So it has a compounding effect. And so this generation in El Salvador is wildly hopeful, wildly optimistic. And that message is being broadcast all over the world, right?

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The history of the world is but the biography of great men. Right?

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Amen.

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And that is what you're seeing right now. El Salvador is in the headlines because of President Bukele. El Salvador would not be in the headlines as it were today were it not for President Bukele.

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It was the only headlines that had ever made before President Bukele was for massive corruption, massive violence.

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When you met us in El Salvador four years ago, it was before the war against the gangs had started, I think.

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And I'm sure after maybe or like, yeah, it was very, very soon.

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I think it was literally just after he had made some of the initial moves, which was fresh.

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It was very fresh.

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It was very fresh.

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But nevertheless, when you came to El Salvador four years ago or even three years ago, if you had Googled El Salvador.

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Well, it would have been very scary.

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The Google results were don't go.

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Basically, it's the most dangerous place on Earth.

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Homicide capital of the world.

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You know, horrible things.

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Now, you know, go Google it like you don't see that anymore. Right. Like you see a country transformed by President Bukele. So that's the fourth turning. I mean, of course, coming out of the fourth turning into the first turning is great men is like that's when they appear. Right. Right. When they're needed.

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that cometh the hour cometh the man like all these great men always arrive when the world when

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humans need them and that's partly because um you know it's the hard times that create the strong men

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and the strong men are arrived to create the good times so he comes out of you know he was born into

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a civil war in El Salvador, followed by the gang war, you know, the gang occupation.

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So those hard times in El Salvador for 40 years, which is about one of these cycles, right?

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They created a strong man. And, you know, it wasn't those hard times, his parents,

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His wisdom taught to him by his parents and his own character, you know, made him a great man of history.

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I think, you know, 500 years from now, they'll still speak his name.

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It is wild because exactly what you mentioned in terms of like searching for just whatever you could find about El Salvador before we went.

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Like we did that and we had like friends and family asking us, like, are you guys sure you should be going there?

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like yeah and we were like no no it was and this was still early in this like right on the heels of

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in making these initial moves but we were like no no it was the murder capital of the world but it's

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okay now like there's a new guy you know there's a new a new sheriff in town so to speak and he's

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he's run this incredible campaign to actually get the gang you know call it crazy like enforce the

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law like you know you know i mean like this wild concept where you put violent criminals behind

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bars which is apparently and like this is the crazy contrast that i think anybody who is paying

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attention sees right now it's like okay there are plenty of people who may have issues with

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bukele for whatever reason i don't know if they're always the most well thought out probably some

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plenty of legitimate you know uh legitimate grievances too i'm not here to you know whatever

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My point being, I don't know how you can look at what has happened in El Salvador.

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And then contrast that to what is happening in most other places in the so-called developed world where the law is not being enforced, where violent criminals are allowed to return to the streets to commit violent crimes again and again and again.

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I mean, how many cases of this in America have we seen just recently where it's like, oh, yeah, this was his 67th arrest.

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And you're like, why was he on the street?

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What are you talking about?

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This is insane. Like we know that a very small percentage of the population commits a disproportionate amount of the violent crime.

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When you put those people away and deal with them and enforce the law, that problem just like magically goes away.

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But apparently this is like somehow an unpalatable thing for a lot of folks in the, again, so-called developed world to admit.

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And it's like, why is that?

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How have we gotten to the point where it's a controversial thing to say violent criminals should go to jail and the law should be enforced?

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How can we have gotten to a place in society where that is the case?

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Well, look, I mean, you talk about following the law.

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The reason why crime-ridden cities in America are the way that they are is because the people there are following the law.

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And the law allows for recidivism.

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It allows for these repeat offenders to go in and out of the system.

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The courts are not effective. And there's constant lobbying by certain elements in the political class who seem to favor a society that is functioning under the rubric of total chaos.

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chaos. And in El Salvador, it was the president's decision to understand that El Salvador was

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essentially a failed state. Every single institution in the country had failed. The court

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system, the judicial system, the police, the press, it was all one big failure, except for,

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I guess you could say, the military was still in pretty good shape. So he took it upon himself to

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exercise and go after not just picking a few criminals here and there. He decided to eliminate

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the entire gang class, the entire 80,000 gang members in the country who were terrorizing the

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population and had taken over the entire country. And in so doing, unleashed an unbelievable

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rebirth and renaissance by getting rid of this gangocracy that was essentially ruling the country.

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And he did so very strategically. I'm sure the story will come out how he was able to eradicate

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the gangs by very savvy and strategic methodologies. And it's a fascinating story.

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And so that's part of what we're talking about here is that there's got to be a will of the people and the political class to eradicate themselves from an overlord, violent criminal class that's ruling.

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Yeah. Yeah. So I am going to go further into that point that you've just made there. But first, I want to tell all the people out in Nostra watching this that the truth is, I believe that Walker has a filter on this because I see he looks super tan and we look super white.

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So I don't know what's up.

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I spend a lot of time in my garden I spend a lot of time in my garden Yeah we working even though we live right near the equator Right now we actually in North Carolina So you know we not we not in El Salvador at the moment

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That's why I have to wear my El Salvador cap to remember where I come from.

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But the what Max is also pointing out there is ties into what you were talking about, the nihilism,

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because when plunder becomes a way of life for a group of men in a society,

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over the course of time, they create for themselves a legal system that justifies it

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and a moral code that glorifies it.

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Now, that is Frédéric Bastiat, the great French statesman,

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who wrote in that essay, The Law, and argued that the only purpose for our government,

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the only legitimate reason for a government is to protect life, liberty, and property.

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Now, so a government exists only legitimately to protect life, liberty, and property because each

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human has the right to life, liberty, and property. In the U.S. Constitution, we said

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pursuit of happiness instead of property. There's a long story behind that, how they're kind of the

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same thing. Now, think of that nihilism that has undermined society for the past 40, 50 years.

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Well, 50 years, let's say since the beginning of the U.S. dollar system, all fiat system.

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It is, they've created for ourselves like a moral code that glorifies the plunder that's going on.

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by the government without doing any of the basic function that the only one purpose for the

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government is to, for the people collectively, as your human rights, you gather together as a society

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to protect yourselves, your life, liberty, and property from bad guys. That's the one thing

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that the government no longer does in many areas of the country, in many cities in particular.

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Um, so they're, they've totally abdicated your, the one reason for their existence, the one legitimate reason for their existence.

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And the nihilism is part of that process of over the course of time, they have created this legal system that justifies it and a moral code that glorifies it.

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Where the glorification comes through these sort of woke mindsets, these woke ideas.

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This, you know, you sometimes you'll see on the news, like somebody who's just had everything stolen, their house burned down by some like vagrant, like shooting up heroin or fentanyl outside.

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And then they burn down their home and they're like, I'm OK with this because, you know, they were somehow a minority group or like they were transgender.

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And I'm OK with this.

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I don't want him to be punished or her or whatever the person is.

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And you're like, OK, wait, like this is the actual system of of the glorification of the

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plunder.

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Right.

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Because you've literally just been plundered and you're glorifying it.

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You're like, well, that was pretty cool.

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Right.

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I don't want to stop it.

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And you're like, wait, this is all messed up.

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But I think it's a it's just a process.

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It started 54 years ago in 1971, but probably earlier than that.

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They just want you to have no hope, right?

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There's no hope to fix it because it's so profitable for the plunderers.

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And so, like, let's not fix it.

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Let's make sure that nobody fixes it.

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And part of that process of glorification is how they instill the nihilism.

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Yeah. And, you know, the irony is, and this is pointed out by the president often, is that during the period, let's say during the gang wars where they became the capital of the world and innocent civilians and people were being ritualized.

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holistically tortured and burned, you know, and babies were, you know, I don't want to go in the

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details. It's too horrific. But where were the human rights groups? You know, where was the

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outcry? Who spoke up for these people? We didn't hear a peep from anybody. So then President

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Bukele comes along and says, you know, we have to protect the human rights of our citizens

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first. They're the ones who should be the beneficiary of human rights protection.

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And so he went after the criminals and the murderers.

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And then we finally heard from the human rights groups.

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I mean, it was so obvious.

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It was literally, have you ever seen that film Idiocracy?

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Like this guy comes back 50 years in the future and he's like becomes a president because he's like figures out, oh, you don't use Gatorade on the lawn.

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Let's just use water.

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And people like, wow, you're so smart.

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I didn't know how to do that.

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And it's just like we've become at that point where it's total idiocracy after 50 years of celebrating the plunder and glorifying it that we're like, oh, my God, how did the murder rate fall?

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And you're like, dudes, I just like I put the murderers in prison.

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Like it's not difficult.

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Right.

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So the human rights groups were completely invisible until the president went after the gang gangsters.

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And then suddenly they appeared on mass saying, oh, we need to protect the human rights of the murderers.

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But they were nowhere to be found during the period when the murdering was taking place.

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So that's a glorification of murder.

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You know, from the World Bank, there was a report when the president began his war on

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the gangs that said, like, you have to be careful because the gangs account for more

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than 25% of the economy of El Salvador.

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And if you get rid of them, your economy will shrink by 25%.

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And the president rightfully told him to buzz off.

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He accepted that there might be or could be a drawdown in GDP.

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Miraculously, there was no real drawdown in GDP.

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They managed to grow even through COVID and even through the gang war.

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The economy did continue to expand.

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And now with the gang war and the COVID behind them, you see the GDP expanding by 4%, 5%.

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Soon it's going to be over 10%.

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This really is Singapore of the West.

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This is the new really miracle economy story and it's taking shape right now.

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It's really starting to boom.

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in El Salvador. It's crazy, too. This reminds me, the President Bukele shared that chart and I was

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gave it a quote tweet and he was nice enough to retweet that, which was a nice day. You know,

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it happened on Father's Day, too. It was a nice little father. And Elon Musk also tweeted you.

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What a wild 24 hours for social media for me. That was pretty nuts. But he tweeted out this

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chart that was, you know, murder rate versus incarceration rate in El Salvador from 2000 to

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2024. And it's like, shockingly, the incarceration rate goes up and the murder rate goes down almost

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to zero. And, and it was in response to somebody, you know, 1% of people account for 63% of all

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violent crimes, uh, you know, 0.2% of people ever commit, uh, murders. 67% of all murders are

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committed by people with prior arrests. So it's like, and he said to it, you know, this, it's a

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pretty, you know, very simple concept really, but this is the kind of the larger like point that

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really does make you a bit, I'm not a nihilistic person. I'm a very optimistic person. I'm very

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optimistic because of the things that I know, the things that pay attention to people that I

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am privileged enough to talk to, but you can see why a lot of people will drift into nihilism

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because they see that, look, we've got, we have these really obvious problems.

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It seems like to any logical thinking person that there's pretty obvious solutions that everyone

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knows. But for some reason, talking about those solutions makes you a bigot or a racist or a

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xenophobe or insert whatever conspiracy theorist, conspiracy theorist. Yep. You know, only to be

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today's conspiracy theory is six months from now's news or whatever it is. You know, it's just it's

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it really does kind of feel like the idiocracy moment, though, Stacey, as you said, where

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this is all just it just feels so stupid. Like, just fix the problem. Do your one job. Do your

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one job, protect people from the plunders, enforce the law. And that's it. Like, but,

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but that's just a bridge too far, apparently. And, you know, part of that whole nihilism,

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of course, is that this is by design. They, they, the, you know, the people who benefit the most

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from the plunder, whether they're the contillionaires next to the money printer or in the

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seats of power in in dc or like the deep state who knows where they live um you know there is

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part of that design that's well documented about modern art right right like to how

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like they don't even like they train you to even disrespect beauty right any anything like nothing

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can save you from the despair that they are the only way out, right? Like there's no hope,

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no beauty no peace Everything is a hamster wheel of despair is what they want you to believe and want you to feel

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There's no God. Yeah. Right. And there's no faith. And it's Maoism, essentially. Right. It's socialism. It's communism. It's authoritarianism.

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And in El Salvador, the president has a 94% popularity and is rising

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So it's their country and the people are overwhelmingly happy about what's going on there

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And if some liberal types in the United States or what have you are unhappy about it

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It's not really their business, it's not their fight to fight

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The people of El Salvador are voting for the president and they'll vote for him overwhelmingly in the next election.

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And at a 94 percent, soon to be 95 percent popularity rating, that means that many of the family members of the gang members who are now in prison are for the president.

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Right. It's like their own families are supporting them.

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I mean, that nobody why would anyone support this group internally in the country after 20 years of a torture terror campaign?

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And so the amount of hand-wringing and pearl-clutching that goes on by folks that haven't been there and don't understand the dynamics is comically misplaced.

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It's just absurd.

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You know, people need to go there and get their boots on the ground and see what's happening to really understand that this really is Renaissance 2.0.

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This is the first country out of the fourth turning into the first turning.

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This is the shining city on a hill.

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it's interesting too you know you brought up like this what we see now is very much like

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malice socialist communist like and so you know quote socialism or democratic socialism as they

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like to brand it in the in the u.s now like we we all this is just a transitional phase to communism

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right and communism has killed 100 million plus people in the past century but apparently

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it's still you know it's still a politically palatable thing to say that like proudly

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proclaim you're a communist i mean many you know university professors and like people

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held in high regard, highly regarded people,

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can just comfortably come out and say you're a communist,

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which is crazy to me because, again, it's a murderous ideology

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based on theft, based on the destruction of society

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and destruction of personal property.

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But somehow it's okay to just come out and say that,

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yeah, but this is what we want.

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Aren't you empathetic?

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Aren't you morally superior like us?

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Because that's what a lot of it comes down to.

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But I'm curious because you look at El Salvador

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and what Bukele is doing,

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he is doing a lot for the citizens, like not just cleaning up the gangs, but like in terms of the

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public works projects, all the different things, the things that like the socialists and the commies

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claim that only socialism or communism can do, but he's doing it without that. So how is that

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possible? Can you explain it to the commies out there? Well, there's a quote he always says

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something along the lines of there's the money is enough if nobody steals it. So that's the thing

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about communists and socialists. It's they drive, they have huge salaries. All those NGOs have

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massive salaries. If they receive a billion a year from George Soros, about, say, of the billion,

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maybe 50 million might make it to the people they're helping because the rest gets plundered

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by them and salaries and cars and drivers and houses and all this sort of stuff. Right. So

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that's why there's money to do things in El Salvador, because he's not taking it. There are

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no NGOs. We're doing it ourselves. We're fixing our country ourself. Right. We don't need the

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people who have, you know, million dollar salaries to dispense the money so that they feel great

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about themselves. And then they use that as a part of their resume to then become a senator or

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something like that or whatever. So I think that's the simple answer is that the money is enough when

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nobody steals it. So that's his basic philosophy about governance and building infrastructure,

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is that there's plenty of money there. And there always has been. It's just that it had been stolen

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for so many years, partly because of the nihilism of the ruling class as well in El Salvador before

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President Bukele is like, I mean, all the NGOs were stealing most of the stuff. Right. And so why

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not them? Right. Because like none of it was going to be allowed to get down to the ground anyway. So

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they might as well steal whatever is left. And that's what they did. They just stole whatever

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was left that, you know, the NGO class had not first stolen. So I think, again, like over the

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course of time, these sort of systems, these moral codes develop to justify and glorify what they're

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doing. And the NGO class is a perfect example of glorifying their own plunder. They glorify it.

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That like we're so amazing. Like I feel so amazing for like, well, the AOC photo of her like crying

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in front of this like, you know, the border wall. That's that's the sort of, you know, propaganda.

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Yeah, you know, the president just, you know, celebrated the completion of this brand new hospital. It's the finest hospital probably in all of Central America, for sure, possibly in Latin America.

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and it was done entirely from the existing budget

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that was a line item in the budget for hospital

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that was on the books for a while.

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The previous governments had talked about

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doing something with this hospital for 20 years.

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They never did.

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It's an historic building.

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He restored the architecture.

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He restored the building.

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He expanded the building.

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He brought in, you know,

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40 or 50 or 80 kidney dialysis machines.

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It's got an incredibly array of modern hospital equipment

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and he did it all on budget and under time.

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And he's done it with now, you know, stadiums, with convention centers.

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Hydroplants, the dams.

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He's redone the center, historical center of San Salvador.

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So it's become a beacon.

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People come here.

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It's like Times Square of Central America.

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You could get a million, two million people visiting there during a holy holiday week or something like that.

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And they're out dancing in the streets.

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The Salvadorans are literally dancing in the streets at night at three o'clock in the morning.

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The library is open 24 hours a day.

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They're in front of the library, which is lit up brilliantly and beautifully dancing with guys on the street playing saxophone or what have you.

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And they're literally like – it's like Liberation Day post-World War II where people were celebrating and happy and dancing in the streets.

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It's like that in El Salvador and San Salvador every day.

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I can't wait to go back again.

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Also, mainly for the Papusas, of course.

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And Bitcoin Historico.

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00:32:55,716 --> 00:32:56,956
Bitcoin Historico.com.

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00:32:56,956 --> 00:33:08,456
Everybody should come check it out. Speaking of Central Historico, we're in the center in the revitalized National Palace, which just only opened like a month before our first inaugural Bitcoin Historico.

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00:33:09,256 --> 00:33:14,376
And so come see us. We have a whole like go to the website and you'll see all the amazing speakers that we'll have there.

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00:33:14,376 --> 00:33:24,216
It's an OG conference experience, an OG Bitcoin conference experience before all the ICOs, before all the Bitcoin treasury companies, before all that stuff.

372
00:33:24,216 --> 00:33:30,836
what we talked about, all the first principles, all the, you know, self-custody, owning Bitcoin,

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00:33:30,976 --> 00:33:35,256
holding Bitcoin, not exposure to Bitcoin. So this is the sort of conference you'll find

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00:33:35,256 --> 00:33:40,616
in Bitcoin country at BitcoinHistorica.com. Yeah, I think of President McKellie and a lot

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like Steve Jobs, you know, like Steve Jobs when he did his annual meeting.

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I have my Steve Jobs outfit on. Yeah, there you go.

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Right. And, you know, he'd give the new iPhone pitch and or the new product pitch. And then he'd

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say at the end, oh, and just one more thing, you know, and he whip out the iPhone or something

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miraculous. The president is this type of mindset where he just doesn't want to improve people's

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lives. He's not satisfied with making the country stand out in Central America. He literally wants

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to blow people's minds like a Steve Jobs. You know, it's like Steve Jobs meets John F. Kennedy,

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on the political side.

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And you put those two elements together

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and you end up with somebody

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who's got the capabilities,

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who's got the charisma,

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who's got the intelligence,

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who's got the support,

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who attracts talent.

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Well, that's like when you mentioned

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John F. Kennedy,

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it's like the Apollo program, right?

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Like he treats everything

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like an Apollo program

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and that we're in this as a nation together

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and never let anyone tell you

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that El Salvador is too small

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to be big, to be great.

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where El Salvador is going is to the place we want to be. And, you know, and you approach every

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single task you do as you rebuild El Salvador with the same sort of passion and same sort of

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desire for excellence, whether it's a pedestrian bridge, a huge like bridge for the cars over a

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big giant gorge, or it's, you know, the dam, the hydro dam, or a big, huge project like the

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metro cable that we're just putting in. We just put the first tower in for the metro cable that

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they're going to build over the next year and a half. So he does everything with that sort of

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passion. Every single thing he does is done with passion. So you see that in the results in El

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Salvador. And you felt it in just those early days, as you pointed out, that there was the first

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days of the new El Salvador, right? Like once the plunderers were taken out of the equation,

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i.e. the corrupt politicians first and the gang members next.

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So once they were all out and then the corrupt money and the corrupt money mindset, the fiat mindset brought in Bitcoin country mindset.

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So then we were ready to build a new country.

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And you saw the results were very fast, very early on.

412
00:36:03,376 --> 00:36:12,556
And Walker, you and Carla must come to El Salvador, come to Bitcoin Historico and see for yourself like the changes that have happened in the past three years since you've been there.

413
00:36:13,436 --> 00:36:13,876
Yeah.

414
00:36:13,876 --> 00:36:15,076
We cannot wait to come back.

415
00:36:15,076 --> 00:36:19,056
Max, can you move your mic just a touch closer? I had a nice listener.

416
00:36:19,656 --> 00:36:20,056
How's that?

417
00:36:20,696 --> 00:36:21,536
That's perfect.

418
00:36:21,936 --> 00:36:27,616
Shout out to Gwydian in the Noster Chat, who is looking at the audio levels very closely.

419
00:36:28,576 --> 00:36:30,676
Okay, thanks. Thanks for that tip.

420
00:36:31,256 --> 00:36:34,056
But, you know, the president also has an aesthetic.

421
00:36:34,676 --> 00:36:41,196
You know, he believes in the public should be, the public spaces should be more beautiful than the private spaces.

422
00:36:41,196 --> 00:36:48,536
like he's not interested in individuals aggregating great wealth as much as he is in the public spaces

423
00:36:48,536 --> 00:36:55,856
generating awe and beauty and inspiring people and that's something you don't find like ancient

424
00:36:55,856 --> 00:37:03,256
greece or ancient uh rome let's say we don't build like really beautiful things anymore right

425
00:37:03,256 --> 00:37:08,556
like it's just kind of like a trend where it's like you know from brutalism onward basically it's

426
00:37:08,556 --> 00:37:14,396
like everything just feels kind of brutalist and devoid of any like emotion or do any things don't

427
00:37:14,396 --> 00:37:19,716
inspire you right what is the old buildings the old beautiful buildings where you say look at the

428
00:37:19,716 --> 00:37:25,336
stonework look at what they did by hand how like look at the the toil that went into this thing

429
00:37:25,336 --> 00:37:29,476
it's like it's not just the product of it but it's the fact that the people actually built it

430
00:37:29,476 --> 00:37:34,376
and wanted to build it it's both of those things that duality and like that's there's a dearth of

431
00:37:34,376 --> 00:37:40,976
that these days. Well, that's that nihilism, the absence of hope and the absence of joy and beauty.

432
00:37:41,676 --> 00:37:46,856
And so they want you to sneer at those who want excellence, those who strive for beauty,

433
00:37:47,256 --> 00:37:52,556
those who want those things. Those are the most mocked people. Like Elon Musk is constantly

434
00:37:52,556 --> 00:37:57,516
mocked. And what is it? All he does is like he strives to like get to the get to Mars,

435
00:37:57,616 --> 00:38:03,716
get to the moon, do like amazing, extraordinary things, like massive ideas. Right. And people

436
00:38:03,716 --> 00:38:11,776
just mock him, right? So that's a control mechanism to try to keep the ordinary person

437
00:38:11,776 --> 00:38:18,296
from wanting much, from wanting better things, from wanting beauty, from wanting low time

438
00:38:18,296 --> 00:38:25,596
preference, for peace, joy, family, love, all the important things. Instead, you have a world of

439
00:38:25,596 --> 00:38:33,196
incels and transgenders and fentanyl abuse and zombie people on the streets of Philadelphia and

440
00:38:33,196 --> 00:38:37,896
stuff like that. Like this is, this is, that's not, none of that is beautiful at all, right?

441
00:38:37,936 --> 00:38:42,876
It's not beautiful. It's funny you brought up Elon, because I was, I was actually just thinking

442
00:38:42,876 --> 00:38:47,316
right before you said that you were reading my mind clearly that it, that it seems to be a very

443
00:38:47,316 --> 00:38:53,256
similar reaction that you see with people who really go after Bukele and people who really go

444
00:38:53,256 --> 00:38:58,516
after Elon. Yes. It's almost, I don't, I don't know if it's, I'm sure everybody has their very

445
00:38:58,516 --> 00:39:10,224
legitimate reasons sure But what I see is it seems to be this attempt like these are two men who you can say what you want about them but they are proving that really incredible

446
00:39:10,224 --> 00:39:18,384
revolutionary things are possible. And that it's okay for us to, to have nice things and to strive

447
00:39:18,384 --> 00:39:23,024
for something more like to Elon. It's like, he's trying to take us to the stars. And it's like,

448
00:39:23,024 --> 00:39:27,644
why do men climb mountains? Why do we want to go to the stars? Because we must, right? Because we

449
00:39:27,644 --> 00:39:37,284
We need things to believe in. We need things to be able to show our children, show the next generation, say, look what these people, look what they did. Isn't that amazing?

450
00:39:37,464 --> 00:39:37,944
Greatness.

451
00:39:38,264 --> 00:39:40,284
Isn't that truly great?

452
00:39:41,064 --> 00:39:49,204
Yeah. Well, make America great again. Remember, that was President Trump's campaign motto on the first in 2016.

453
00:39:49,204 --> 00:40:19,124
So make America great again. And what did it that sparked like this wave of total insanity in the United States because you cannot make America great again. How dare you? That's ridiculous. That's clownish. That's buffoonish. Like, don't don't aspire to anything greater than what we have. Instead, become transgender. Instead, become fentanyl addicts. Instead, become like all of this degradation of public life.

454
00:40:19,204 --> 00:40:26,864
Uh, that's the word that sparked the insanity. We were on a four year long, well, actually like

455
00:40:26,864 --> 00:40:33,304
eight year long nightmare, a national nightmare inspired by that, by the word great. They didn't

456
00:40:33,304 --> 00:40:39,664
want America to be great. Just uttering those words caused them to lose their minds. That Trump

457
00:40:39,664 --> 00:40:45,124
derangement syndrome was really about greatness, derangement syndrome. They didn't want the people

458
00:40:45,124 --> 00:40:51,004
to want to be great. It's wild too, because the same people who would say like, well, you know,

459
00:40:51,144 --> 00:40:55,584
they would counter that by saying, well, America's already great are the same people who'd be like,

460
00:40:55,844 --> 00:40:59,184
but America's actually the worst. It's the most racist and it's the most, you know, whatever.

461
00:40:59,184 --> 00:41:02,444
It's the absolute, it's the bottom of the barrel. It's terrible. For some reason, everybody still

462
00:41:02,444 --> 00:41:06,264
is trying to come to America. And, you know, America has given me the platform to actually

463
00:41:06,264 --> 00:41:09,764
say these things freely, unlike a lot of other countries, but no, it's the worst, but also,

464
00:41:09,764 --> 00:41:15,804
So, well, it's still great, but like the mental gymnastics required to take issue with that stuff.

465
00:41:15,804 --> 00:41:17,444
It's not a place, it's a state of mind.

466
00:41:17,984 --> 00:41:20,284
It's not a place, it's a state of mind.

467
00:41:20,444 --> 00:41:21,824
So you're never great.

468
00:41:22,044 --> 00:41:24,044
You always need to be greater and better.

469
00:41:24,124 --> 00:41:27,304
Like every single day, you never get to that point, right?

470
00:41:27,624 --> 00:41:29,264
Like there's no there, there.

471
00:41:29,584 --> 00:41:31,524
So it's about a state of mind.

472
00:41:31,744 --> 00:41:33,444
Just like Bitcoin is a state of mind.

473
00:41:33,524 --> 00:41:36,284
It's a mindset, it's a vibe, it's a way of being, a way of living.

474
00:41:36,284 --> 00:42:06,264
And so it's not like an absolute thing. Great is like a word that we understand as how we want to feel and how we want to feel better. We want to feel like to enjoy beauty and enjoy the innovation and creation and the things that we can invent, like the things God gave us and explore the world and explore the stars.

475
00:42:06,284 --> 00:42:15,584
and behold this with awe, all these things around us that were given to us by God, humanity,

476
00:42:16,024 --> 00:42:23,344
our invention, all these things. So like all those things are the opposite of what they try to seek

477
00:42:23,344 --> 00:42:30,244
to control you with through nihilism. They would rather you not have any awe about anything. They

478
00:42:30,244 --> 00:42:37,284
want you to sneer. They want you to mock. They want you to troll. They want you to just have

479
00:42:37,284 --> 00:42:47,204
total cynicism and despair. Yeah, America is an idea, and that idea is about freedom. And so it's

480
00:42:47,204 --> 00:42:52,624
an attempt, the Constitution, the Bill of Rights is an attempt to codify a governing body that would

481
00:42:52,624 --> 00:42:58,544
ensure maximum freedom, freedom of speech, freedom of expression, et cetera, for the widest

482
00:42:58,544 --> 00:43:08,544
poor portion of the population. And so over the last few decades, the cynicism has creeped in.

483
00:43:08,544 --> 00:43:12,864
And so the curtailment of those freedoms has crept in, principally freedom of speech.

484
00:43:13,344 --> 00:43:18,304
One of the great things about Elon that people recognize now is that his acquisition of X,

485
00:43:18,384 --> 00:43:23,604
now X, formerly Twitter, was really saving free speech. That's something a founding father of

486
00:43:23,604 --> 00:43:28,604
of the America would have done, you know, like free speech is essential. And he guaranteed that

487
00:43:28,604 --> 00:43:35,724
it was alive by making that purchase. And El Salvador, that's, I think that that idea that's

488
00:43:35,724 --> 00:43:41,404
embodied in the documentation, the documents, the founding documents of America, you can find that

489
00:43:41,404 --> 00:43:47,724
in El Salvador. And that's why it's so many people who go there are find that breathing the fresh air

490
00:43:47,724 --> 00:43:51,544
of freedom, you know, and so many people who visit, they end up moving there. And that's really

491
00:43:51,544 --> 00:43:59,504
on the cutting edge. That's really the place now where you will have a find most of freedom

492
00:43:59,504 --> 00:44:05,804
there. And so this is what El Salvador has taken the place of the United States in a lot of ways.

493
00:44:05,804 --> 00:44:13,184
And it's relative small size is turned into an advantage. The incredibly dynamic president

494
00:44:13,184 --> 00:44:20,384
running the country is a once in 500 year type leader. And it's all falling down to the bottom

495
00:44:20,384 --> 00:44:23,404
line because there's layers and layers of corruption have been removed.

496
00:44:23,864 --> 00:44:25,524
Layers and layers of gangs are gone.

497
00:44:25,964 --> 00:44:32,344
So people, when they're working, they know that they're contributing, as Stacey was saying,

498
00:44:32,384 --> 00:44:34,744
to a greater project, which is the greater El Salvador.

499
00:44:35,164 --> 00:44:36,884
And they're happy to do so.

500
00:44:37,744 --> 00:44:39,904
We hold these truths to be self-evident.

501
00:44:40,864 --> 00:44:42,844
All men are created equal, right?

502
00:44:43,344 --> 00:44:48,664
Like you started the show with the so obvious thing, right?

503
00:44:48,664 --> 00:44:52,084
The 1% of the population, they're the murderers.

504
00:44:52,424 --> 00:44:56,264
We'll just lock them up so the people who are not murderers can live freely.

505
00:44:57,624 --> 00:45:03,784
So all these, there's so many truths of human, of all humans, all of humanity.

506
00:45:04,144 --> 00:45:09,384
They all, every baby comes out smiling, filled with love and joy and optimism.

507
00:45:09,924 --> 00:45:12,744
Like you don't, you don't encounter like a miserable,

508
00:45:13,344 --> 00:45:18,384
just filled with despair baby unless you forget to change your diaper for a few hours.

509
00:45:18,384 --> 00:45:25,484
Right. But the fact is, like, we all are born with awe.

510
00:45:26,044 --> 00:45:29,224
Like, that's why people love looking at babies.

511
00:45:29,224 --> 00:45:34,164
Right. They're like, wow, everything is like incredible.

512
00:45:34,524 --> 00:45:36,564
Wow. You have a watch on.

513
00:45:36,804 --> 00:45:38,824
Oh, my God. Wow.

514
00:45:39,204 --> 00:45:44,784
It's like that's the human nature that they try to destroy.

515
00:45:44,784 --> 00:45:58,784
The fact is the idea of America is a universal idea and it's a universal idea that it was expressed by the great man of history, which is who is President Bukele.

516
00:45:58,784 --> 00:46:04,844
when he said something like where El Salvador is going is to the place we want to be.

517
00:46:05,344 --> 00:46:09,084
The same could be said of the U.S., of France, of Italy, of wherever you are.

518
00:46:09,404 --> 00:46:13,664
You, the people, always where you want to be is where you will be.

519
00:46:13,664 --> 00:46:15,884
But it's by design, your design.

520
00:46:16,104 --> 00:46:17,584
You have to make the choices.

521
00:46:17,924 --> 00:46:19,724
You have to do something about it.

522
00:46:19,904 --> 00:46:22,244
And they don't want you to do something about it.

523
00:46:22,324 --> 00:46:27,104
That's why when President Trump or then candidate Donald Trump said,

524
00:46:27,104 --> 00:46:32,344
make America great again, that was that exposed.

525
00:46:32,704 --> 00:46:33,224
Wow.

526
00:46:33,344 --> 00:46:36,864
The panic and fear in the deep state and the ruling.

527
00:46:37,024 --> 00:46:40,944
I mean, they literally came out on camera on the news and told you.

528
00:46:41,244 --> 00:46:46,524
I think it was Chuck Schumer said something like, yeah, the CIA has seven ways to like

529
00:46:46,524 --> 00:46:48,344
to take this guy down.

530
00:46:48,424 --> 00:46:49,404
They're going to come after him.

531
00:46:49,404 --> 00:46:50,584
It's like, why?

532
00:46:50,884 --> 00:46:55,044
Like, just because we're not supposed to be great, we shouldn't want to be great.

533
00:46:55,044 --> 00:46:57,544
Like, who are you?

534
00:46:59,464 --> 00:47:01,524
Yeah, the freedom to be who you are.

535
00:47:01,664 --> 00:47:05,964
Individual sovereignty is certainly a concept well-known in the Bitcoin space.

536
00:47:06,424 --> 00:47:11,424
And it's also now becoming a concept in the AI space as well.

537
00:47:11,664 --> 00:47:20,824
And El Salvador is developing a freedom stack, which includes security, Bitcoin, AI, education.

538
00:47:21,904 --> 00:47:22,224
Health.

539
00:47:22,324 --> 00:47:23,204
Health, right.

540
00:47:23,204 --> 00:47:24,864
Infrastructure, energy.

541
00:47:24,864 --> 00:47:26,784
It's all based, they all work together.

542
00:47:27,084 --> 00:47:28,984
They're all complementary to each other.

543
00:47:29,584 --> 00:47:35,644
And they're all creating a freedom, a sense of freedom that's been, it could exceed the

544
00:47:35,644 --> 00:47:41,444
greatest period in the United States history in terms of how, what it was able to achieve

545
00:47:41,444 --> 00:47:43,304
for individual freedom.

546
00:47:43,824 --> 00:47:49,364
You could see it eclipsed by what's happening in El Salvador, a new high watermark for a

547
00:47:49,364 --> 00:47:57,484
a governance model that encourages individuals in a safe, secure way to pursue their dreams and hopes

548
00:47:57,484 --> 00:48:04,184
and achieve them. I think what we're seeing right now in El Salvador.

549
00:48:04,684 --> 00:48:10,184
I think, Walker, you know, I want to tie a few of the things we've talked about together here,

550
00:48:10,264 --> 00:48:14,684
because I know we're a live stream around Nostra, and there's like five or six people there,

551
00:48:14,684 --> 00:48:19,904
including Matt O'Dell had been there. And I want to bring this back to this notion of

552
00:48:19,904 --> 00:48:25,004
this narrative that we're talking about, because narratives matter and people talking to each other

553
00:48:25,004 --> 00:48:30,844
matter. Bitcoin conferences mattered before all of this like corporatization of it. Why it mattered

554
00:48:30,844 --> 00:48:37,024
was that we were meeting in person and communicating to each other and, you know, building that

555
00:48:37,024 --> 00:48:43,224
confidence of having these crazy ideas. It's that famous classic, the one leader, the guy goes up

556
00:48:43,224 --> 00:48:47,424
dancing crazy, but the important one is the second guy who comes up and dances crazy with him. And

557
00:48:47,424 --> 00:48:52,404
then the whole crowd is dancing crazy. Well, we were dancing crazy, right? And Bitcoin up until

558
00:48:52,404 --> 00:48:58,744
then, like Nostra comes along, Matt O'Dell abandons Bitcoin Twitter, then all the memers

559
00:48:58,744 --> 00:49:04,004
abandoned it. And all we had were the suit coiners. And then we were in a period of like,

560
00:49:04,064 --> 00:49:09,564
remember, well, you probably were not alive then, but there was a period of time when Steve Jobs

561
00:49:09,564 --> 00:49:17,244
was fired from Apple. And why? Because he was a crazy person, right? So they got rid of the

562
00:49:17,244 --> 00:49:23,024
visionary and they installed the suits. The suits were going to like now that this company was a

563
00:49:23,024 --> 00:49:27,764
little bit bigger, that they were going to make it legitimate. And they didn't understand who the

564
00:49:27,764 --> 00:49:33,944
owners, the people using the Apple, the Macintosh were. They didn't understand because they only

565
00:49:33,944 --> 00:49:37,164
understood Wall Street and they understood the numbers and they understood what Wall Street

566
00:49:37,164 --> 00:49:42,984
wanted, right? This is how you make it legitimate. This is how you legitimize Apple. Well, we had the

567
00:49:42,984 --> 00:49:48,004
suit coiners for the same time, and they took over the narrative, just like, you know, what happened

568
00:49:48,004 --> 00:49:54,204
in that period of time. How many years? It was like three, four years when Steve Jobs was fired

569
00:49:54,204 --> 00:49:59,644
from Apple. And then the company almost went bankrupt, of course. And Steve Jobs had to return.

570
00:49:59,644 --> 00:50:05,344
So just like Matt O'Dell, I'm saying Matt O'Dell is like Steve Jobs of the Bitcoin narrative.

571
00:50:05,344 --> 00:50:06,804
He's going to take that one straight to the bank.

572
00:50:07,164 --> 00:50:17,364
No, but like that's important that the right people are part of the conversation.

573
00:50:17,624 --> 00:50:25,384
Removing yourself from the conversation is not a clever way to, you know, change the world.

574
00:50:26,704 --> 00:50:29,864
And I think he agrees with that now.

575
00:50:29,964 --> 00:50:35,444
I just had him on the show actually like last week and he had like a mea call place.

576
00:50:35,444 --> 00:50:52,124
Like, look, I was, I was wrong. I'm, I misjudged this. I thought this was the better path. It was not like I, you know, and, and credit where credit is due for, you know, saying, look, yeah, I made a wrong call. I'm back now. I don't think he can get his original Odell handle back though.

577
00:50:52,124 --> 00:50:58,624
They're trying to charge him like a crazy amount of money for it, which is just kind of like, you know, kind of kind of funny.

578
00:50:58,804 --> 00:51:00,924
Like, it's like, oh, you got to buy your own name back.

579
00:51:01,224 --> 00:51:10,324
But I want to I want to talk about kind of I want to talk about a number of the things that El Salvador is doing on the educational front and with some of these initiatives.

580
00:51:10,324 --> 00:51:20,824
I think that's really interesting in an age where even like in the United States of America, even though we spend a ton on education, even though people say we don't spend much on education, we spend plenty per student.

581
00:51:20,824 --> 00:51:25,264
Again, the problem is it's being stolen by administrators and bureaucrats in between.

582
00:51:26,304 --> 00:51:31,664
Literacy rates are declining in major public schools and major metropolitan areas.

583
00:51:32,664 --> 00:51:40,604
But before we kind of get into that a little bit, I do want to talk about the Bitcoin suit coin dynamic right now.

584
00:51:40,784 --> 00:51:45,664
Because you guys have been obviously in Bitcoin, I mean, for as long as anyone, right?

585
00:51:45,684 --> 00:51:46,704
For a long time.

586
00:51:47,224 --> 00:51:50,604
You were educating people about Bitcoin back on RT back in the day.

587
00:51:50,604 --> 00:51:54,364
You've done so much to Orange Pill, so many people.

588
00:51:54,364 --> 00:51:56,604
I mean, not least of which was, I believe,

589
00:51:56,604 --> 00:51:59,604
coined the term Orange Pill, if I'm not mistaken.

590
00:51:59,604 --> 00:52:02,244
You know, among many, many other things.

591
00:52:02,244 --> 00:52:04,944
Like, you guys have done an incredible service

592
00:52:04,992 --> 00:52:09,032
to so many people by opening up their eyes to Bitcoin.

593
00:52:09,672 --> 00:52:14,392
And I'm curious of in the long arc of now what you've seen,

594
00:52:14,652 --> 00:52:18,212
and Bitcoin's still young, but it's like we've been able,

595
00:52:18,352 --> 00:52:19,812
or folks who have been around as long as you,

596
00:52:19,892 --> 00:52:22,612
have been able to observe some trends, some cycles,

597
00:52:23,132 --> 00:52:24,732
things that change and things that don't.

598
00:52:26,052 --> 00:52:27,532
Where are we at right now?

599
00:52:27,632 --> 00:52:31,172
Like, was this a natural, did we have to come to this point

600
00:52:31,172 --> 00:52:36,192
with the suit coiners, with the Wall Street kind of embracing Bitcoin to a certain extent,

601
00:52:36,252 --> 00:52:42,432
with the ETFs? Because to me, that does seem like a logical step along this path. Of course,

602
00:52:42,432 --> 00:52:47,852
if Bitcoin was successful, corporations, nation states, everyone is going to want Bitcoin.

603
00:52:48,432 --> 00:52:51,652
But I think what you're getting at, you're not discounting that, you're more so saying,

604
00:52:51,992 --> 00:52:55,972
and tell me if I'm putting words in your mouth, that the narrative has become controlled

605
00:52:55,972 --> 00:52:58,312
by that faction. Is that correct?

606
00:52:59,792 --> 00:53:07,812
The narrative is that these, you know, plebs, the memes,

607
00:53:08,872 --> 00:53:12,672
those are not, that Wall Street won't accept these,

608
00:53:12,672 --> 00:53:15,792
that you can't be, that, you know,

609
00:53:15,932 --> 00:53:18,712
that the audience was embarrassing to Wall Street.

610
00:53:19,312 --> 00:53:22,212
And that's the same thing of the people, the early users,

611
00:53:22,212 --> 00:53:32,232
the early adopters of Apple Macintoshes were more creatives, right? They weren't the back office

612
00:53:32,232 --> 00:53:37,492
accounting departments that were using, say, the IBM or something like that, the mainframes.

613
00:53:37,792 --> 00:53:45,652
So they were more of the hacker mindset. Steve Jobs was a hacker. The same thing with Bitcoin.

614
00:53:45,832 --> 00:53:51,012
It was a very hacker mindset. In the early, early days, it was like hackers. It was Julian Assange.

615
00:53:51,012 --> 00:54:17,892
It was the open source. It was the Internet freedom. It was very tied to there was a, remember, the anti-PIPA, SOPA, SOPA, PIPA. There were these acts across Europe and one in the U.S. as well that they were going to sort of like basically start surveilling things online, right? Your freedom online wasn't going to be so obvious, but they defeated it.

616
00:54:17,892 --> 00:54:23,392
But it was very tied to that in the early days, those that more cypher punk mindset.

617
00:54:23,772 --> 00:54:30,552
And then I remember when the first wave of bankers came in with Barry Silbert was one of the earliest ones.

618
00:54:30,792 --> 00:54:35,912
And there was a sort of like the beige khaki suits, you know, pants came in.

619
00:54:36,052 --> 00:54:41,892
And then like, you know, you can't have that sort of person on stage.

620
00:54:42,052 --> 00:54:44,292
It would be Amir Taki. He's crazy.

621
00:54:44,292 --> 00:54:56,192
And then in 2021 at the Miami conference, remember after that, Mike Novogratz said Max Kaiser shouldn't ever be on stage at a Bitcoin conference.

622
00:54:57,392 --> 00:55:05,672
I, Mike Novogratz, I'm legitimate and by Luna, you know, the tattoo removed yet or does he still have it?

623
00:55:05,972 --> 00:55:11,352
Yeah, but he's legitimate. Right. But Max isn't right.

624
00:55:11,352 --> 00:55:27,392
So that sort of narrative came around of like, you shouldn't listen to those people and you should listen to these legitimate people who are close to their respectable, this notion of respectable people.

625
00:55:27,392 --> 00:55:41,012
You know, that's that's that's always been the the the main way to bring about spread mediocrity is right through respectable people.

626
00:55:41,352 --> 00:56:06,692
So middle class thinking. And yeah, so I could see that you and you can see this right now with Bitcoin falling from 120 something down to I guess it went to 58 again. Right. But where are the memers? Like unless you have a good meme, there's always a new meme during the crashes. Right. And it unites the community. It's gallows humor.

627
00:56:06,692 --> 00:56:14,752
and you know I always like during the the worst of the crashes that we've had like those are always

628
00:56:14,752 --> 00:56:22,032
the like nerve-wracking right but it's also when you end up giggling uncontrollably at your computer

629
00:56:22,032 --> 00:56:28,112
why because of a new meme and you're like oh right and you're like I guess we are gonna go

630
00:56:28,112 --> 00:56:33,692
all work at McDonald's or yes the wojack you know crying emoji and all of those things like

631
00:56:33,692 --> 00:56:40,612
those memes came out and they united the community and kept us strong. It was like a way it was

632
00:56:40,612 --> 00:56:45,292
rallying the army, keeping us strong, hold the line, hold the line. But now there isn't any.

633
00:56:45,392 --> 00:56:51,132
There's just some Wall Street guys who are very respectable. Right. And they start talking about

634
00:56:51,132 --> 00:56:55,952
the balance sheet and and how this is going to we're all fine. We're going to be able to meet our

635
00:56:55,952 --> 00:57:02,172
our dividend or stuff like that. And like, where's the community for that? Right. There's no

636
00:57:02,172 --> 00:57:09,672
community. This is a mindset. It's a movement. It's a new way of thinking. It's a paradigm shift.

637
00:57:09,792 --> 00:57:16,412
It's a new epoch. And yet the storyteller has always been there through history to tell the

638
00:57:16,412 --> 00:57:23,752
story, to explain to people where you are. The town crier, the guy in the center of the square

639
00:57:23,752 --> 00:57:31,932
in ancient Rome. Like there's always somebody explaining to the people who they are, where they

640
00:57:31,932 --> 00:57:38,092
are, where they're going, and keep them on the mission. The keeper of the vision, as Steve Jobs

641
00:57:38,092 --> 00:57:43,732
would call it. You need to have somebody who's inspiring the troops that where we're going is

642
00:57:43,732 --> 00:57:50,192
there. It seems far away. We're only like a few steps into the march towards there. But those,

643
00:57:50,712 --> 00:57:57,312
the memers were such an important part of that. And they've been removed or ostracized or exiled

644
00:57:57,312 --> 00:58:04,072
somehow, but they're not there in the community at the moment. And I think that is also by design,

645
00:58:04,292 --> 00:58:09,912
whether intentional or unintentional. And I think once you see the memers back,

646
00:58:10,212 --> 00:58:12,992
once you have a new meme, I think that's going to be the bottom.

647
00:58:13,452 --> 00:58:21,472
So there was one of the more famous suit coiners had a big $100,000, 100,000 Bitcoin party

648
00:58:21,472 --> 00:58:22,912
in Florida, in Miami.

649
00:58:23,712 --> 00:58:28,192
And Stacey noted that the memers were absent.

650
00:58:28,772 --> 00:58:30,232
The memers had not been invited.

651
00:58:30,812 --> 00:58:33,512
So the people who memed Bitcoin 200,000

652
00:58:33,512 --> 00:58:35,412
were being cast aside.

653
00:58:35,512 --> 00:58:37,732
Yeah, the laser eyes to 100,000.

654
00:58:37,892 --> 00:58:38,832
None of them were there.

655
00:58:39,032 --> 00:58:42,372
Right, and guys like Yellow and others

656
00:58:42,372 --> 00:58:46,832
who are really brilliant memers,

657
00:58:47,192 --> 00:58:48,772
you know, they were not there.

658
00:58:48,772 --> 00:58:50,632
And so that was the first indication

659
00:58:50,632 --> 00:58:53,452
that there was a changing of mindset.

660
00:58:54,632 --> 00:58:56,492
And so, but I think of, you know,

661
00:58:56,532 --> 00:58:59,452
Bitcoin is going through kind of like reverse archaeology.

662
00:59:00,032 --> 00:59:02,112
You know, in archaeology, you're digging down,

663
00:59:02,352 --> 00:59:04,212
digging, digging, digging, and you find the past.

664
00:59:04,952 --> 00:59:07,632
And, you know, it goes through the history

665
00:59:07,632 --> 00:59:09,492
and it goes through the Bronze Age

666
00:59:09,492 --> 00:59:11,172
and the Iron Age and the Stone Age.

667
00:59:11,172 --> 00:59:14,072
And you're going progressively back toward primitivism.

668
00:59:14,512 --> 00:59:16,292
With Bitcoin, it's a reverse archaeology

669
00:59:16,292 --> 00:59:19,772
where the coin is drilling through,

670
00:59:19,772 --> 00:59:25,092
essentially layer and layer and layer of finance and money and the concept of money and finance.

671
00:59:25,652 --> 00:59:29,852
And it finds bigger and bigger pockets of money. So the Wall Street is a pocket of money.

672
00:59:29,852 --> 00:59:37,512
And Bitcoin got to the Wall Street pocket of money. And everybody in that milieu, anyone in

673
00:59:37,512 --> 00:59:43,632
that band of financialization went through the exact same learning curve as everyone in the

674
00:59:43,632 --> 00:59:50,472
previous ages of Bitcoin. So the suit coiners essentially recreated the ICO market. You know,

675
00:59:50,492 --> 00:59:58,712
the ICO market was an incredible boom and bust. The staking phase, the NFT phase, the shitcoin

676
00:59:58,712 --> 01:00:05,632
phase or altcoin phase, you know, all these things were the trajectory of Bitcoin, the vector,

677
01:00:06,012 --> 01:00:10,732
it takes it through, you know, everything that anyone's ever thought about what they think they

678
01:00:10,732 --> 01:00:15,972
know about money and includes everyone on the planet and everyone goes to the same learning

679
01:00:15,972 --> 01:00:23,592
curve. So there's no accumulated knowledge. You know, when I saw one of, I mean, I saw,

680
01:00:23,592 --> 01:00:31,792
I saw Michael Saylor at a meeting in El Salvador, you know, his comment to me after I told him,

681
01:00:31,852 --> 01:00:36,412
you know, he was surprised that I'm, you know, 65, 66 years old. And he said, well,

682
01:00:36,412 --> 01:00:43,412
by now you should have accumulated some wisdom right and i i looked at him and i said

683
01:00:43,412 --> 01:00:51,772
hold on my son hold on let's talk again and see where this see where this goes

684
01:00:51,772 --> 01:00:59,592
do you think sailor uh i will say also i i was invited to the 100k party and it was a very nice

685
01:00:59,592 --> 01:01:05,372
party for what it's worth i occasionally meme so there you know and and i've got to say uh

686
01:01:06,412 --> 01:01:10,932
I mean, I think that most of the treasury stuff

687
01:01:10,932 --> 01:01:15,352
has clearly been like a capital incinerator for retail.

688
01:01:15,612 --> 01:01:16,392
Like, that's undeniable.

689
01:01:17,492 --> 01:01:21,932
Strategy I would put in a bit of a different ballpark.

690
01:01:22,072 --> 01:01:24,192
But I'm curious from you guys,

691
01:01:24,192 --> 01:01:27,192
do you think Saylor's been a net positive for Bitcoin

692
01:01:27,752 --> 01:01:29,172
from an adoption perspective?

693
01:01:29,872 --> 01:01:32,732
Like, you know, if you want to reach the, you know,

694
01:01:32,772 --> 01:01:34,272
the majority of capital in the world,

695
01:01:34,272 --> 01:01:38,932
but the majority is still sort of, you know, for better or worse, like it's tied up in the fiat

696
01:01:38,932 --> 01:01:42,772
system, right? Or, you know, it doesn't have to be tied up, but it kind of just is. Like,

697
01:01:43,452 --> 01:01:47,472
is that just a stepping stone, like a meeting people where they are, not where you want them

698
01:01:47,472 --> 01:01:52,612
to be? That was a necessary transitional phase? Or do you think about it differently?

699
01:01:53,672 --> 01:02:00,852
I think the adoption happened one conference at a time, one Bitcoin meetup, one Bitcoin conference

700
01:02:00,852 --> 01:02:09,472
at a time. And as they got bigger and bigger and the incentive model changed of like it became a

701
01:02:09,472 --> 01:02:16,492
big, you know, profit center to even put on conferences. Right. And then then you it becomes

702
01:02:16,492 --> 01:02:20,952
more and more expensive and you get bigger and bigger venues and then you need more and more

703
01:02:20,952 --> 01:02:28,712
crypto companies and they all get a slot on the stage. And then and then you get to the Bitcoin

704
01:02:28,712 --> 01:02:38,732
treasury companies and what the incentive structure for the CEO, these are publicly listed companies

705
01:02:38,732 --> 01:02:44,592
now because they SPAC'd into these, a reverse merge into these existing entities. So now they

706
01:02:44,592 --> 01:02:49,772
have a fiduciary responsibility to their shareholders and they must go and pump their

707
01:02:49,772 --> 01:02:58,572
stock price. So you have to then, it's just the incentive model. That's from the beginning of the

708
01:02:58,572 --> 01:03:05,112
time in the early Bitcoin conferences, we would talk about the incentive model, right? And the

709
01:03:05,112 --> 01:03:11,152
stock price, if you're a CEO of a publicly listed company, you have to pump your stock price when

710
01:03:11,152 --> 01:03:16,472
you go up on stage and you don't tell people, don't buy my stock price, buy Bitcoin instead.

711
01:03:17,752 --> 01:03:24,172
You're telling them to buy exposure. So you have to come up with a pitch, right? And what you're

712
01:03:24,172 --> 01:03:32,192
giving them exposure to is just one part of Bitcoin. And that is the number go up technology,

713
01:03:32,912 --> 01:03:39,732
which is a great way. That's a great tool for adoption since the beginning of Bitcoin, right?

714
01:03:39,752 --> 01:03:47,592
When it goes on a tear during the four year cycle, you know, it drives memes, it drives

715
01:03:47,592 --> 01:03:57,232
headlines, which drive awareness, which drives adoption. So that is a super amazing part of

716
01:03:57,232 --> 01:04:04,332
Bitcoin, but it's just one small part and probably the least important part for the actual technology

717
01:04:04,332 --> 01:04:09,452
itself, what it means for an individual. It is, I think, the loudest part of it in terms of

718
01:04:09,452 --> 01:04:17,292
communicating to the world, like, hey, get on board and adoption. But so you're offering exposure

719
01:04:17,292 --> 01:04:24,572
just to the price and you're offering exposure in U.S. dollars and fiat to that price, but you're

720
01:04:24,572 --> 01:04:32,472
not offering exposure to individual sovereignty, right? You can't be exposed to individual

721
01:04:32,472 --> 01:04:37,472
sovereignty or either individually, you either have individual sovereignty or you don't. And you

722
01:04:37,472 --> 01:04:42,772
can only have it if you have, if you hold permissionless money, right? So you can't

723
01:04:42,772 --> 01:04:48,532
sell that it's not permissionless money. A stock certificate is not permissionless.

724
01:04:48,532 --> 01:04:53,812
There's a lot of permissions and a lot of regulations around it. So you're like, so

725
01:04:53,812 --> 01:05:00,772
again, so your incentive is to push just that one bit of it, which is number go up. And therefore,

726
01:05:00,772 --> 01:05:14,220
you not talking about the other parts of it which are so important Maybe the number go up is most important for driving adoption in terms of awareness

727
01:05:14,380 --> 01:05:15,040
at least adoption.

728
01:05:15,040 --> 01:05:22,540
But I think holding that mindset of hodling is really important to the long term sustainability

729
01:05:22,540 --> 01:05:23,340
of Bitcoin.

730
01:05:23,640 --> 01:05:27,540
And that only comes with hodling it, right?

731
01:05:27,960 --> 01:05:29,920
So you have to hold it.

732
01:05:29,920 --> 01:05:31,400
You have to have individual sovereignty.

733
01:05:31,560 --> 01:05:38,000
You have to own your own permissionless money in order to become a hodler, become a Bitcoiner.

734
01:05:39,440 --> 01:05:44,920
And so you raise awareness in the price and then it becomes in a...

735
01:05:46,600 --> 01:05:47,720
But then what happens, right?

736
01:05:47,760 --> 01:05:48,580
Because you're just focused.

737
01:05:48,740 --> 01:05:49,820
It's a piece of paper.

738
01:05:49,980 --> 01:05:52,320
It's a stock price exposed to something that's going up.

739
01:05:53,240 --> 01:05:58,840
But hey, then NVIDIA goes up faster and Micron goes up even faster.

740
01:05:58,840 --> 01:06:16,400
And so those are paper that you're going to make more paper gains with those. So why go to this other paper price thing? And so it loses it lose. You see what I'm talking about is like you're pushing people just to focus on the price because that's the thing that you can point to.

741
01:06:16,400 --> 01:06:20,040
but the technology itself,

742
01:06:20,200 --> 01:06:22,200
unless it's being used

743
01:06:22,200 --> 01:06:24,460
by all those individuals

744
01:06:24,460 --> 01:06:26,500
getting exposure to the price,

745
01:06:27,040 --> 01:06:28,880
then it's not being adopted.

746
01:06:29,960 --> 01:06:32,020
Like it would be the same of like

747
01:06:32,020 --> 01:06:33,340
if everybody in the world

748
01:06:33,340 --> 01:06:34,360
didn't own a computer

749
01:06:34,360 --> 01:06:35,260
or go on the internet,

750
01:06:35,380 --> 01:06:36,420
but they had the ETF

751
01:06:36,420 --> 01:06:37,800
of internet companies.

752
01:06:38,160 --> 01:06:38,880
It's like, well,

753
01:06:38,900 --> 01:06:40,180
people actually have to use it.

754
01:06:40,320 --> 01:06:41,800
They actually have to build

755
01:06:41,800 --> 01:06:43,220
the community, build the networks,

756
01:06:43,380 --> 01:06:44,220
build the infrastructure

757
01:06:44,220 --> 01:06:45,920
in order for the internet

758
01:06:45,920 --> 01:06:52,560
to succeed. If you just created an ETF from day one of like a TCP IP, I'm like, let's just like

759
01:06:52,560 --> 01:07:00,320
have an ETF about this. Like, it's like, well, no, you need, you need all that sort of thing to happen

760
01:07:00,320 --> 01:07:08,680
to create the network effect, to make it valuable and, you know, all the other benefits of, of,

761
01:07:08,680 --> 01:07:13,860
of TCP IP besides just like the network value.

762
01:07:15,300 --> 01:07:17,140
Yeah. And the, I mean,

763
01:07:17,180 --> 01:07:23,420
he has said a couple of things that go against really the ethos of Bitcoin,

764
01:07:23,660 --> 01:07:28,800
just to name two things when he was suggesting that self-hodling is overrating

765
01:07:28,800 --> 01:07:30,600
self-custody is overrated,

766
01:07:30,900 --> 01:07:34,820
that having an outside custody is equally as good,

767
01:07:34,820 --> 01:07:39,900
But clearly that's completely wrong and gets away, as Stacey points out.

768
01:07:40,040 --> 01:07:44,140
You know, if you want to separate money from state, if you want to be individually sovereign,

769
01:07:44,240 --> 01:07:46,980
if you want to take the full benefit of everything Bitcoin has to offer,

770
01:07:47,440 --> 01:07:51,300
self-custody is obviously a superior form of custody.

771
01:07:51,300 --> 01:07:55,280
And it's unique as an asset class in that sense that you can self-custody

772
01:07:55,280 --> 01:07:59,500
an unlimited amount of wealth in Bitcoin at virtually no expense.

773
01:07:59,660 --> 01:08:00,740
You can't do that with gold.

774
01:08:00,840 --> 01:08:01,900
You can't do that with housing.

775
01:08:01,980 --> 01:08:03,740
You can't do that with any other asset in the world.

776
01:08:03,740 --> 01:08:07,840
it costs you have insurance, you have to put it someplace that's secure, you have to pay for the

777
01:08:07,840 --> 01:08:13,380
security. And it's very expensive to be wealthy, you know, costs a lot of money to maintain it.

778
01:08:13,720 --> 01:08:18,720
But with Bitcoin, you know, you can have a billion dollars and its cost of protecting it is virtually

779
01:08:18,720 --> 01:08:24,760
nothing. So that's a very unique attribute that you don't get with any other asset class. And he

780
01:08:24,760 --> 01:08:30,880
also mentioned, you know, in, you know, he said, essentially, he, he was inferring that Bitcoin

781
01:08:30,880 --> 01:08:32,780
is not money, right?

782
01:08:32,800 --> 01:08:35,080
He was saying that his securities are money.

783
01:08:35,900 --> 01:08:38,860
But, you know, Bitcoin itself is not money.

784
01:08:39,300 --> 01:08:41,460
And again, that's a blatant disregard

785
01:08:41,460 --> 01:08:45,620
for the ethos and the actual reality

786
01:08:45,620 --> 01:08:48,100
of Bitcoin being perfect money,

787
01:08:48,560 --> 01:08:49,420
the only money,

788
01:08:50,400 --> 01:08:53,260
the predator money,

789
01:08:54,040 --> 01:08:56,200
the apex predator of money, right?

790
01:08:56,460 --> 01:08:58,580
So just on those two points,

791
01:08:58,580 --> 01:09:06,540
you know ideologically he's not aligned with with a with bitcoin well but but the point is that

792
01:09:06,540 --> 01:09:11,880
there's no there's no counterpoint there's no conversation there's less conversation happening

793
01:09:11,880 --> 01:09:18,880
now because everything is financialized in a in a fiat way so the whether it's the conferences or

794
01:09:18,880 --> 01:09:26,440
the podcast is like uh there's the financial incentive is to get paid in the fiat dollars that

795
01:09:26,440 --> 01:09:30,200
that, you know, these people can print, right?

796
01:09:30,480 --> 01:09:33,860
And so there isn't a counterpoint.

797
01:09:34,060 --> 01:09:36,880
Now that Matt O'Dell is back on Bitcoin Twitter

798
01:09:36,880 --> 01:09:39,400
and able to engage and debate,

799
01:09:39,600 --> 01:09:41,840
it's important to have these debates, right?

800
01:09:42,120 --> 01:09:47,280
Like this is what early Bitcoin conferences were about.

801
01:09:47,620 --> 01:09:50,180
There were lots of debates and none of us,

802
01:09:50,280 --> 01:09:52,920
nobody knew what Bitcoin, nobody still, you know,

803
01:09:52,920 --> 01:09:55,340
I think James Lopp is the one that always,

804
01:09:55,340 --> 01:09:59,780
He has an article that he links to all the time is that nobody understands Bitcoin.

805
01:10:00,020 --> 01:10:00,560
Nobody does.

806
01:10:00,660 --> 01:10:02,020
Not one single person does.

807
01:10:02,320 --> 01:10:03,740
So it's still a conversation.

808
01:10:03,740 --> 01:10:07,380
It's an ongoing conversation and it's evolving with us.

809
01:10:07,900 --> 01:10:11,440
And that's like so we need to evolve in the right direction.

810
01:10:11,440 --> 01:10:11,920
Right.

811
01:10:11,920 --> 01:10:18,680
And I think, you know, number go up technology only works for a brief period of time, one cycle.

812
01:10:18,680 --> 01:10:39,680
But if the community and the network does not continue to grow, then that becomes a problem for number go up technology. If it's all hoarded on one balance sheet where everybody gets exposure only to the number go up and not to the actual technology and the freedom money, then that's going to become a problem.

813
01:10:39,680 --> 01:10:44,820
And I think we are seeing that right now because we need a floor, right?

814
01:10:45,060 --> 01:10:48,260
If we need to, who are the new buyers that come in?

815
01:10:48,340 --> 01:10:49,340
Who is the new community?

816
01:10:49,460 --> 01:10:53,580
The community begets the community normally, but the community has disappeared.

817
01:10:53,900 --> 01:10:55,660
The storytellers are the memers.

818
01:10:56,380 --> 01:10:57,800
They're one of the storytellers.

819
01:10:57,900 --> 01:10:59,840
The podcasters are another storyteller.

820
01:11:00,260 --> 01:11:04,180
The speakers on stage at Bitcoin conferences are another part of the storyteller.

821
01:11:04,180 --> 01:11:08,000
So, like, it's all become homogenized very quickly.

822
01:11:08,000 --> 01:11:11,940
And it's like that period of time when Apple was run by a few suits.

823
01:11:12,100 --> 01:11:15,300
The same thing happened then in that same four-year cycle.

824
01:11:15,480 --> 01:11:20,420
They destroyed the company because they did not have a narrative and they didn't know who their audience was.

825
01:11:20,460 --> 01:11:26,580
And they didn't know how to sell the technology, the profound change that a Macintosh was offering.

826
01:11:26,780 --> 01:11:29,1000
It was a mindset that they were selling and it was a way of living.

827
01:11:30,680 --> 01:11:33,800
Yeah, I mean, you see the same pattern emerging with private equity.

828
01:11:33,920 --> 01:11:36,720
Private equity takes over established brands and ruins them.

829
01:11:36,720 --> 01:11:43,720
You know, whether it's fast food restaurants get taken over by private equity and they've driven into the ground and destroyed.

830
01:11:43,900 --> 01:11:46,600
They're loaded up with debt and the quality goes down.

831
01:11:46,680 --> 01:11:50,120
They go bankrupt and the bankers made a lot of money and the franchise goes out of business.

832
01:11:50,540 --> 01:11:52,180
And you see that happening all across America.

833
01:11:52,300 --> 01:11:56,040
Most of the products that you own, especially in the supermarket, you remember the brand.

834
01:11:56,120 --> 01:11:58,180
You remember how great they were a couple of years ago.

835
01:11:58,280 --> 01:12:01,520
You buy them and this doesn't taste anything like it did a few years ago.

836
01:12:01,520 --> 01:12:08,680
It's because private equity took over the company, made substitutions on the ingredients and turn it into slop like everything else there on the shelf.

837
01:12:08,780 --> 01:12:10,520
So the brand equity is worth X.

838
01:12:10,880 --> 01:12:14,180
Private equity borrows money to acquire that brand.

839
01:12:14,180 --> 01:12:21,180
They extract them with a huge dividend to themselves and substitute the ingredients and sell an inferior product until it goes bankrupt.

840
01:12:21,680 --> 01:12:27,080
So essentially with strategy, it's similar in that the melting ice cube was an interesting idea.

841
01:12:27,080 --> 01:12:31,160
you're replacing, instead of buying back your own stock, you're just going to replace the cash

842
01:12:31,160 --> 01:12:35,820
on the balance sheet with Bitcoin. But then it became essentially private equity ties in that

843
01:12:35,820 --> 01:12:39,440
they loaded it up with debt, right? So they loaded it up with these debt bearing instruments.

844
01:12:39,960 --> 01:12:45,340
And then what I think was the miscalculation was that once you do that, you're exposing yourself to

845
01:12:45,340 --> 01:12:51,100
the ability of Wall Street to issue its own fake paper, right? Wall Street can issue

846
01:12:51,100 --> 01:12:57,020
an unlimited amount of fake paper at zero cost. And so that's the squeeze that we're seeing

847
01:12:57,020 --> 01:13:01,580
right now between Bitcoin and strategy because the company-

848
01:13:01,580 --> 01:13:03,080
Hedge funds are after them.

849
01:13:03,140 --> 01:13:03,300
Right?

850
01:13:03,380 --> 01:13:05,380
They've got, what, 600 and something thousand Bitcoin.

851
01:13:05,780 --> 01:13:06,080
Okay?

852
01:13:06,380 --> 01:13:11,220
So let's fucking choke this company so that they've got to cough up some of that Bitcoin,

853
01:13:11,340 --> 01:13:15,680
which they're now doing, and then they'll put it into their corporate notes that they

854
01:13:15,680 --> 01:13:18,920
have the ability now to sell Bitcoin, something they said they would never, ever do.

855
01:13:19,340 --> 01:13:25,400
So that's engineered by the hedge funds and the other very large pockets of money that

856
01:13:25,400 --> 01:13:33,320
are able to arbitrage what is an obligation of the company to pay dividends, their ability

857
01:13:33,320 --> 01:13:35,400
to do so, and what's sitting on the balance sheet.

858
01:13:35,560 --> 01:13:39,080
So they're attempting to get the company to choke.

859
01:13:39,740 --> 01:13:41,040
Yeah, that's the thing.

860
01:13:41,040 --> 01:13:47,420
Remember what happened to the United Kingdom when Soros broke the pound, right?

861
01:13:47,560 --> 01:13:48,280
The British pound.

862
01:13:48,440 --> 01:13:54,880
It was because the exchange rate mechanism, they had to like peg it to the franc or something,

863
01:13:54,880 --> 01:13:59,720
the Deutsche Mark, and they figured they could break it because they had enough money that they

864
01:13:59,720 --> 01:14:06,560
knew that the UK would not be willing to pay the amount of money to cover what they could just push

865
01:14:06,560 --> 01:14:12,320
the exchange rate to bleed them dry. And they knew that they would have to stop printing money to do

866
01:14:12,320 --> 01:14:17,720
this. So it's that. It's not they weren't taking any sort of position. They just saw a vulnerability

867
01:14:17,720 --> 01:14:23,880
that they could exploit. And the same thing. So as soon as you do enter Wall Street and as soon as

868
01:14:23,880 --> 01:14:30,520
you do have a paper product upon which they could bet against and tear apart your par or your peg,

869
01:14:30,940 --> 01:14:37,880
like they'll do it. And that's what you're seeing. They do have unlimited amounts of money

870
01:14:37,880 --> 01:14:43,800
because they are able to do all sorts of leverage games through options and derivatives themselves

871
01:14:43,800 --> 01:14:51,860
that they're way faster. And they don't have like shareholders to have to explain this to.

872
01:14:51,860 --> 01:15:04,520
Like the problem with the Bitcoin treasury companies and like all of them will be that they have, you know, they've sold their shareholders on the story of number go up technology and gold 2.0.

873
01:15:05,040 --> 01:15:10,200
And, you know, it's a you think of gold as a safe investment, safe haven and blah, blah, blah.

874
01:15:10,260 --> 01:15:12,180
It's a soft, like gentle pitch.

875
01:15:12,180 --> 01:15:18,820
and in the meantime these sharks like with trillions of dollars of access to you know at

876
01:15:18,820 --> 01:15:24,320
least for a day that's all they need it for is a few hours to just like annihilate your peg or your

877
01:15:24,320 --> 01:15:29,760
par your attempt to be at par and you have to go out there as a ceo and try to explain to your

878
01:15:29,760 --> 01:15:34,220
shareholders oh it's just these hedge fund guys and you know they're doing this and you're like

879
01:15:34,220 --> 01:15:40,120
yeah but i you know i'm is this gonna like are you gonna be able to hold this peg or

880
01:15:40,120 --> 01:15:47,260
to par or whatever, you know, so you are in a game where you are swimming in an ocean with great

881
01:15:47,260 --> 01:15:52,720
white sharks and they might eat you up and maybe they didn't, you know, had nothing against you,

882
01:15:52,800 --> 01:15:57,780
but you kind of looked like a seal. And so they ate you. And, and, you know, they tell you all

883
01:15:57,780 --> 01:16:01,340
the time when somebody gets eaten by a great white shark, it's like, oh, they don't really

884
01:16:01,340 --> 01:16:05,500
like the taste of humans. And it's like, yeah, but they still ate that human. It's like, yeah,

885
01:16:05,500 --> 01:16:06,300
That was a mistake.

886
01:16:06,480 --> 01:16:10,540
It's like, well, that was my entire net worth.

887
01:16:10,640 --> 01:16:11,900
Thank you very much, you know?

888
01:16:12,380 --> 01:16:12,640
Right.

889
01:16:12,720 --> 01:16:20,480
So you can sell Bitcoin short and use the proceeds from that short sale to go attack some company like Strategy, right?

890
01:16:20,680 --> 01:16:21,700
And you can do that.

891
01:16:21,700 --> 01:16:27,600
And, you know, in the U.K., you can rehypothecate an infinite number of times, right?

892
01:16:27,680 --> 01:16:29,900
You're not limited in the number of rehypothecations.

893
01:16:30,100 --> 01:16:33,400
You know, you can sell the same bond in the U.K. a hundred times, a thousand times.

894
01:16:33,460 --> 01:16:35,420
There's no limit to the rehypothecation in the U.K.

895
01:16:35,500 --> 01:16:36,660
In the U.S. there is.

896
01:16:36,720 --> 01:16:40,060
So that's why the U.S. outsources a lot of their banking maneuvers to the U.K.

897
01:16:40,180 --> 01:16:42,100
That's what the U.K. has served that purpose.

898
01:16:42,360 --> 01:16:46,020
And the city of London, of course, is its own country with its own laws and its own governance,

899
01:16:46,300 --> 01:16:47,120
just like the Vatican.

900
01:16:47,760 --> 01:16:50,300
And there's one other city, Washington, D.C.

901
01:16:50,400 --> 01:16:52,960
Those three territories are countries within countries.

902
01:16:53,260 --> 01:16:58,640
The city of London has always been where bankers and hedge funds go to commit what in the United

903
01:16:58,640 --> 01:17:01,720
States would be illegal financial leisure domain.

904
01:17:01,720 --> 01:17:17,680
So those guys are there and they see an opportunity to borrow an infinite amount of money against, let's say, selling Bitcoin short and engaging in all kinds of other flora and fauna in financial engineering and attack what they want to do.

905
01:17:17,680 --> 01:17:23,740
ironically, remember, when the strategy melting ice cube was launched, it was a speculative attack

906
01:17:23,740 --> 01:17:29,860
against the U.S. dollar. Yeah. Right. That we're going to essentially take on the U.S. dollar by

907
01:17:29,860 --> 01:17:37,200
borrowing to buy Bitcoin. OK, that's a simple equation. But once you add this stack of preferreds

908
01:17:37,200 --> 01:17:43,320
with interest bearing obligations, you then become the the victim. You know, the speculative

909
01:17:43,320 --> 01:17:45,060
of attack against is against you.

910
01:17:45,060 --> 01:17:46,460
And I think that's.

911
01:17:46,460 --> 01:17:52,460
But yeah, but that's the point is even from day one, when it's just, you know, the melting

912
01:17:52,460 --> 01:17:53,060
ice cube.

913
01:17:53,060 --> 01:17:59,320
And I think, to be fair, you have to say that SpaceX and Square both have that original

914
01:17:59,320 --> 01:18:15,668
design of a Bitcoin treasury within a company with an operating income and using their revenue to buy Bitcoin or you know their cash on the balance sheet to convert some of it from a melting ice cube to Bitcoin But it is

915
01:18:15,668 --> 01:18:21,908
a stock price and every single stock price is vulnerable to the great white sharks, the predators

916
01:18:21,908 --> 01:18:29,748
in that the ocean of paper in that system. So there's that is a risk that you don't have when

917
01:18:29,748 --> 01:18:38,448
you're holding your own Bitcoin. So as soon as, even if it's an ETF, okay, maybe they have a little

918
01:18:38,448 --> 01:18:44,428
bit easier time, less risk than one of the Bitcoin treasury companies, but there's still a risk

919
01:18:44,428 --> 01:18:50,428
because the hedge funds have unlimited capital and they could attack things through options and,

920
01:18:50,428 --> 01:18:58,348
you know, the futures markets and stuff like that. So you're always going to be, there's whatever,

921
01:18:58,348 --> 01:19:01,788
However much the risk is, there is an added risk.

922
01:19:02,288 --> 01:19:14,528
It might only be small in the case of an ETF versus a Bitcoin treasury company, but there's a risk that you maybe are not being adequately compensated for because you don't understand the risk.

923
01:19:15,088 --> 01:19:15,168
Right.

924
01:19:15,288 --> 01:19:22,108
So the future, the question is, who is going to step in and be the new source of demand?

925
01:19:22,428 --> 01:19:22,828
Yeah.

926
01:19:22,828 --> 01:19:28,548
Okay, so strategy was the demand side of the Bitcoin story for five or six years.

927
01:19:28,728 --> 01:19:30,088
It was the sailor era.

928
01:19:30,868 --> 01:19:35,208
And now the vulnerabilities in the strategy have been exposed.

929
01:19:35,708 --> 01:19:40,428
And so they're not really big on the demand side as they were.

930
01:19:40,488 --> 01:19:43,808
In fact, they're sellers, okay, after saying that they would never sell.

931
01:19:44,208 --> 01:19:46,728
So we have to look for a new source of demand.

932
01:19:47,408 --> 01:19:50,528
So you have the sovereigns, the big sovereigns, potentially in the Middle East.

933
01:19:50,528 --> 01:20:01,668
You have a, there's a dynamic between AI and Bitcoin where it's like, Bitcoin is the floor and AI is the ceiling.

934
01:20:01,948 --> 01:20:09,728
And we know that the AI sector is trading at incredibly, incredible valuations, multi, multi-trillion dollar valuations.

935
01:20:09,968 --> 01:20:19,288
If we see a reversal in that trend, I would believe that a substantial portion of that retracement of capital would end up back in Bitcoin.

936
01:20:19,288 --> 01:20:25,588
because Bitcoin would be the only AI agents, the agentic economy itself, AI agents themselves,

937
01:20:26,048 --> 01:20:29,708
according to Bitcoin Policy Institute in Washington, D.C., when they did the survey,

938
01:20:29,868 --> 01:20:33,968
they prefer Bitcoin. So the robots are buying Bitcoin. The AI prefers Bitcoin.

939
01:20:33,968 --> 01:20:40,888
Yeah, but there's no like, like I do a lot of the AI policy in El Salvador. And so I'm very

940
01:20:40,888 --> 01:20:48,248
exposed to the AI world and community. And the AI community is way more cypherpunk than a lot of

941
01:20:48,248 --> 01:20:50,048
the Bitcoin community at this time.

942
01:20:50,048 --> 01:20:51,348
You see the EAC.

943
01:20:51,948 --> 01:20:54,788
They're like how original cypherpunks

944
01:20:54,788 --> 01:20:56,908
and OG Bitcoiners were, right?

945
01:20:56,908 --> 01:21:03,908
So the vibe, that mindset of Renegade and Cypherpunk

946
01:21:04,708 --> 01:21:07,508
is with the AI community at the moment

947
01:21:07,508 --> 01:21:12,528
because they are inspired by the beauty

948
01:21:12,528 --> 01:21:15,548
and the power of individual sovereignty

949
01:21:15,548 --> 01:21:19,288
of their own locally hosted model, right?

950
01:21:19,328 --> 01:21:23,108
Like they see AI as a path to abundance,

951
01:21:23,308 --> 01:21:24,648
amazing abundance, right?

952
01:21:25,088 --> 01:21:27,308
And that is a liberating mindset.

953
01:21:27,568 --> 01:21:29,708
And that's why they have an infectious community.

954
01:21:29,828 --> 01:21:30,528
It feels really nice.

955
01:21:30,708 --> 01:21:33,368
And actually AI has a lot of really funny memes, right?

956
01:21:33,408 --> 01:21:35,228
That's where you'll find funny memes.

957
01:21:35,228 --> 01:21:37,988
If you find the right AI community on AI Twitter,

958
01:21:38,368 --> 01:21:39,828
you'll see the funny memes.

959
01:21:40,368 --> 01:21:43,328
But Bitcoin has become very middle-class thinking.

960
01:21:43,328 --> 01:21:51,948
It's just it's it's just a number on a Schwab screen, a Fidelity stock portfolio report.

961
01:21:53,248 --> 01:21:56,308
And it's only focused on that number go up technology.

962
01:21:56,388 --> 01:21:59,928
And they forget the rest of the technology and the importance of it.

963
01:22:00,128 --> 01:22:02,068
And again, I'll bring it back to Matt O'Dell.

964
01:22:02,228 --> 01:22:03,028
It's his fault.

965
01:22:03,228 --> 01:22:04,208
I blame him.

966
01:22:04,368 --> 01:22:06,008
OK, let's start a campaign.

967
01:22:06,108 --> 01:22:07,408
Let's make that the meme.

968
01:22:07,568 --> 01:22:08,988
It's Matt's fault.

969
01:22:09,208 --> 01:22:12,548
I'm going to get that on a T-shirt, I think, you know, maybe a hat, too.

970
01:22:12,548 --> 01:22:24,568
Well, it brings it back to El Salvador because El Salvador was very early recognizing AI as a technology of infinite abundance and liberation.

971
01:22:25,788 --> 01:22:32,808
And so and Stacey, as she pointed out, she is involved in much of the policies that are happening in El Salvador with AI.

972
01:22:32,808 --> 01:22:40,048
And so the country has the first AI law, really.

973
01:22:40,628 --> 01:22:46,448
And it also has a statement of a strategy.

974
01:22:46,648 --> 01:22:48,088
National AI Strategy Report.

975
01:22:48,188 --> 01:22:53,748
National AI Strategy Report, which is now being quoted by other countries as they catch up.

976
01:22:54,348 --> 01:22:56,428
So El Salvador, again, is leading the way.

977
01:22:56,508 --> 01:22:58,168
And other countries are catching up to El Salvador.

978
01:22:58,408 --> 01:22:59,708
So it's part of that freedom stack.

979
01:22:59,708 --> 01:23:02,108
Yeah, it's because I saw that same vibe.

980
01:23:02,108 --> 01:23:11,088
Like I could see on my Twitter, you know, stream is that on the timeline, I could see like that same mindset of this, like.

981
01:23:13,108 --> 01:23:28,568
That sort of like we could do anything, you could just do things mindset and the tools like the AI tools available, especially since DeepSeek, when it like drove down the costs of these frontier models for all the models.

982
01:23:28,568 --> 01:23:33,168
But all like all sorts of tools also started to be released from January.

983
01:23:33,608 --> 01:23:34,088
And you know what?

984
01:23:35,128 --> 01:23:38,128
Jack Dorsey also mentioned that he mentioned it in an interview.

985
01:23:38,248 --> 01:23:42,508
He didn't say what it was the cause of it, but he mentioned that January 2025, everything changed.

986
01:23:42,928 --> 01:23:47,448
And if you were following AI or doing anything in AI, you saw it like you felt it.

987
01:23:47,608 --> 01:23:55,648
Something clicked, just like in March 2020 with Bitcoin, when they shut down the global economy and first Bitcoin crashed.

988
01:23:55,648 --> 01:24:01,068
remember like on BitMEX it crashed like 20 something percent one day and then it went up

989
01:24:01,068 --> 01:24:08,928
forever after that right so uh the same something happened in January 2025 and like you got goosebumps

990
01:24:08,928 --> 01:24:17,128
watching it you could see it like suddenly take off and the community was that same like yeehaw

991
01:24:17,128 --> 01:24:26,148
pioneer, cowboy, like cypherpunk, fun, fun, loving, like memeing, like that attitude,

992
01:24:26,668 --> 01:24:32,848
that confidence of like, when you know you can just do things, that gives you a lot of confidence.

993
01:24:32,848 --> 01:24:39,288
And Bitcoiners used to have that. Like we were like, dudes, like we have our own money. And even

994
01:24:39,288 --> 01:24:45,808
on a day that it would crash, like, okay, it's crashed 90% in the past year, 18 months, you'd be

995
01:24:45,808 --> 01:24:50,208
like, dude, I have my own money. And they're like, yeah, dude, you're poor. Like you have Bitcoin,

996
01:24:50,348 --> 01:24:56,248
you're poor. It's down 90%. You're like, I don't care. I have Bitcoin and you don't. And you're

997
01:24:56,248 --> 01:25:03,568
like, oh my God, that attitude of just total confidence. And because you know what you own,

998
01:25:03,568 --> 01:25:08,548
you know what you have, and you know the power that this technology has given you.

999
01:25:08,908 --> 01:25:14,908
And that's what I feel like. I mean, I don't want to blame any one individual. And I'm sure like

1000
01:25:14,908 --> 01:25:20,588
best intentions and many people thought they had like found an infinite money glitch and that this

1001
01:25:20,588 --> 01:25:25,848
was like somehow unique and just if like if i do this honestly but over the course of time the

1002
01:25:25,848 --> 01:25:32,908
incentive model and this incentive structure um breaks down because it a network needs the whole

1003
01:25:32,908 --> 01:25:38,148
network right and you need the all the feedback loop that made bitcoin what it is and that includes

1004
01:25:38,148 --> 01:25:54,668
These, you know, annoying community who, despite all of the, you know, the elite media sorts and the respectable officials telling them, dudes, you have, you know, fake Internet money.

1005
01:25:54,968 --> 01:25:56,508
You are like you have nothing.

1006
01:25:56,648 --> 01:25:58,908
You're like, uh-huh, I've got Bitcoin.

1007
01:25:59,128 --> 01:26:01,928
And the same thing with these, you know, EAC community.

1008
01:26:02,208 --> 01:26:07,228
They're like, no matter how much you mock them, they say they're going to Mars and it's going to be amazing abundance.

1009
01:26:07,228 --> 01:26:09,828
And you're like, OK, well, you know, they're convinced.

1010
01:26:10,208 --> 01:26:15,808
And you're missing that right now from the new bees being brought.

1011
01:26:16,148 --> 01:26:19,028
Like that newbie community is always very important.

1012
01:26:19,508 --> 01:26:19,688
Right.

1013
01:26:19,828 --> 01:26:24,468
Everybody starts out a newbie in Bitcoin, but there are no where are the new newbies?

1014
01:26:25,328 --> 01:26:28,028
Have you ever met a newbie in the past this cycle?

1015
01:26:28,328 --> 01:26:29,828
No, there are no newbies.

1016
01:26:29,828 --> 01:26:30,088
Right.

1017
01:26:30,088 --> 01:26:37,568
They're somebody with a Schwab account, like with a bunch of stocks.

1018
01:26:38,048 --> 01:26:40,568
And that's not a Bitcoiner, right?

1019
01:26:41,328 --> 01:26:41,688
Yeah.

1020
01:26:41,868 --> 01:26:49,788
To bring it back to El Salvador, El Salvador has managed to be in the leader of this whole frontier mindset of AI,

1021
01:26:50,148 --> 01:26:54,008
where the whole rules of the game are changing almost on an hourly basis.

1022
01:26:54,008 --> 01:26:59,028
but because El Salvador is being led by President Bukele,

1023
01:26:59,208 --> 01:27:01,988
who is able to look at the field,

1024
01:27:02,328 --> 01:27:05,428
is like, you know, Tom Brady, you know,

1025
01:27:05,648 --> 01:27:07,168
I'd use another sports analogy.

1026
01:27:07,688 --> 01:27:09,488
You know, I mean, he can pick apart the defense,

1027
01:27:09,648 --> 01:27:11,208
you know, find a receiver and, you know,

1028
01:27:11,248 --> 01:27:13,408
get that ball to the receiver and get a touchdown

1029
01:27:13,408 --> 01:27:15,908
where, you know, President Bukele will look out

1030
01:27:15,908 --> 01:27:18,668
over 50, 60, 70 advisors

1031
01:27:18,668 --> 01:27:22,088
or people that are coming in with ideas and things

1032
01:27:22,088 --> 01:27:23,368
and be able to pick, you know,

1033
01:27:23,368 --> 01:27:28,148
Now, this one, this is, you know, and understand which one gives him the biggest bang for his buck.

1034
01:27:28,288 --> 01:27:29,808
And you can't print money in El Salvador.

1035
01:27:29,948 --> 01:27:30,828
You got to be really strategic.

1036
01:27:30,968 --> 01:27:31,808
Got to be really precise.

1037
01:27:31,948 --> 01:27:33,428
Got to be laser focused.

1038
01:27:34,568 --> 01:27:45,408
And so he really picked up on this AI story and has been able to attract fantastic developments in the AI story as a result.

1039
01:27:45,508 --> 01:27:46,788
And that's part of this freedom stack.

1040
01:27:47,308 --> 01:27:49,028
And that's very, very attractive.

1041
01:27:49,188 --> 01:27:52,428
When you stack all this stuff up and you put it all together, it all is self-reinforcing.

1042
01:27:53,368 --> 01:27:55,628
And it attracts more talent.

1043
01:27:55,708 --> 01:27:56,548
It attracts capital.

1044
01:27:57,228 --> 01:28:04,208
And then your primary job of keeping the country secure and safe from gangsters is being fulfilled.

1045
01:28:04,608 --> 01:28:06,508
And it all comes together.

1046
01:28:07,168 --> 01:28:07,248
Yeah.

1047
01:28:07,248 --> 01:28:18,008
And again, a reminder that if you're buying a piece of paper that gives you exposure to Bitcoin, you're also gaining exposure to Jane Street.

1048
01:28:18,008 --> 01:28:23,808
so you know if you don't know who jane street is and you don't know who the other hedge funds are

1049
01:28:23,808 --> 01:28:31,728
and the big the predators in the markets then you're you're not understanding what you've

1050
01:28:31,728 --> 01:28:36,948
bought exposure to like you're not just buying exposure to number go up technology you're

1051
01:28:36,948 --> 01:28:45,608
buying exposure to quite a few other things that are uh very scary didn't didn't didn't

1052
01:28:45,608 --> 01:28:56,488
Every time you buy any stock anywhere, you should hear that in your mind and just understand that it could be inflated away or predated away.

1053
01:28:58,388 --> 01:29:09,408
How important do you think medium of exchange adoption acceleration is for Bitcoin to achieve what we all know it can and will achieve?

1054
01:29:09,808 --> 01:29:14,268
How important do you think that medium of exchange side is both on, you know, merchant adoption wise?

1055
01:29:14,268 --> 01:29:24,568
I think one of the most bullish things I saw in the past year was Square turning on Bitcoin acceptance for millions of merchants, like getting that merchant side adoption.

1056
01:29:24,788 --> 01:29:26,548
But how crucial do you think that is?

1057
01:29:26,588 --> 01:29:37,488
Because it feels like in the, especially in this Bitcoin treasury company era in which we find ourselves, the whole medium of exchange side has just people seem to not want to.

1058
01:29:37,548 --> 01:29:43,308
Now, meanwhile, we've got people who are zapping sats to me permissionlessly on Noster as we stream this live.

1059
01:29:43,308 --> 01:29:44,568
So shout out to all of you guys.

1060
01:29:44,668 --> 01:29:47,368
There are still some people out there who want to use Bitcoin as a medium exchange.

1061
01:29:48,268 --> 01:29:49,668
You got to take it a step further.

1062
01:29:49,908 --> 01:29:55,208
You got to take it a step further to the circular economy, which, again, we see it in El Salvador.

1063
01:29:55,308 --> 01:29:58,248
People that are earning in Bitcoin, saving in Bitcoin and spending in Bitcoin.

1064
01:29:58,788 --> 01:30:02,468
So, for example, if the price movement is totally, it becomes invisible.

1065
01:30:03,588 --> 01:30:10,808
If you're saving, earning and spending in Bitcoin, the price movement means nothing because you're in the Bitcoin economy.

1066
01:30:10,968 --> 01:30:12,048
It's a circular economy.

1067
01:30:12,048 --> 01:30:17,828
So that started at Bitcoin Beach, famously, which kicked off the entire Bitcoin phenomenon in El Salvador.

1068
01:30:18,068 --> 01:30:21,408
But it's now spread to several other communities all over the country.

1069
01:30:21,628 --> 01:30:22,888
And they're popping up everywhere.

1070
01:30:23,248 --> 01:30:26,068
So I would imagine at some point they're all going to kind of emerge.

1071
01:30:26,408 --> 01:30:28,228
And that's how you really get Bitcoin country.

1072
01:30:28,308 --> 01:30:29,868
You really get a Bitcoin economy.

1073
01:30:30,088 --> 01:30:33,708
That's people are earning, spending, and saving in Bitcoin.

1074
01:30:33,948 --> 01:30:38,868
And that's your medium of exchange, your savings rate, and what you're making as earnings.

1075
01:30:38,868 --> 01:30:42,308
and it becomes the standard and it replaces everything else.

1076
01:30:42,828 --> 01:30:45,008
I think a little bit.

1077
01:30:45,108 --> 01:30:47,968
Yeah, if you're earning Bitcoin, then it's easier to spend it.

1078
01:30:48,208 --> 01:30:50,068
But Gresham's law exists.

1079
01:30:50,288 --> 01:30:56,168
And if you're earning dollars and you are using those dollars to acquire some, you know,

1080
01:30:56,188 --> 01:31:14,516
Bitcoin and hodl it in your own wallet you reluctant to spend it when you have shit money Right Like and I seen that even say with BitcoinHistorico Go to our website BitcoinHistorico and you can buy your ticket for the conference

1081
01:31:15,376 --> 01:31:24,476
Now, last year we were offering it was something like 10, 20 percent cheaper to buy Bitcoin, use to pay for your ticket in Bitcoin.

1082
01:31:24,476 --> 01:31:34,076
and I thought like okay at one time it used to be very difficult to get Bitcoin and then transfer

1083
01:31:34,076 --> 01:31:39,316
and pay instantly or something like that but Cash App exists like you could just go use your Cash App

1084
01:31:39,316 --> 01:31:46,296
wallet convert the ticket price from your dollar account to Bitcoin and pay in Bitcoin and get 10%

1085
01:31:46,296 --> 01:31:54,256
off nobody wanted to do that nobody would they rather pay 10% more to spend in dollars right

1086
01:31:54,256 --> 01:32:00,516
So I don't know where it had to go. Maybe it would be like 50 percent more and people would rather just pay.

1087
01:32:00,896 --> 01:32:05,796
You know, that might have been the point if you had a 50 percent discount for them to pay in Bitcoin.

1088
01:32:05,976 --> 01:32:12,836
Maybe that would have been enough. But that's what merchants will have to do is it is perfect money.

1089
01:32:12,836 --> 01:32:21,156
And so if you the merchant is up to you, it's not just like if you make it equal, if you say here, this cup of coffee is ten dollars,

1090
01:32:21,156 --> 01:32:28,956
U.S. dollars, fiat dollars, or $10 worth of Bitcoin, they're going to pay the $10 in fiat cash.

1091
01:32:29,056 --> 01:32:36,336
Of course they are. But if you say it's $10 cash, or I really want your Bitcoin, I'll give that same

1092
01:32:36,336 --> 01:32:45,556
cup of coffee to you for $5 worth of Bitcoin. So once you start seeing clever people, merchants

1093
01:32:45,556 --> 01:32:53,456
becoming clever. That's how it happened with the Florentine, right? The Florin in Florence, right?

1094
01:32:53,536 --> 01:33:00,336
So they had the perfect unit of account that was trusted. So if a merchant from Florence traveled

1095
01:33:00,336 --> 01:33:07,176
to North Africa to buy in a Medina some, you know, fabrics or spices, the merchant there would be

1096
01:33:07,176 --> 01:33:12,316
like, oh, I recognize that. And I know I won't have to waste my time, lose some sales by measuring

1097
01:33:12,316 --> 01:33:17,596
it, weighing and checking it out, making sure like I'll just take that here. You're giving me the

1098
01:33:17,596 --> 01:33:23,916
perfect money that I the best money available in our ecosystem and our financial system. And I'm

1099
01:33:23,916 --> 01:33:28,956
going to give you my best product. Right. So because I want you to return because I know you

1100
01:33:28,956 --> 01:33:34,176
have good money. So I want you to return with your good product or purchase my stuff. And so

1101
01:33:34,176 --> 01:33:39,776
that's how you attract people. You want to like offer them like I'll give you a discount if you

1102
01:33:39,776 --> 01:33:46,176
give me your florin if you give me your bitcoin right so until you see that like it's a mindset

1103
01:33:46,176 --> 01:33:50,776
that the merchants have to adopt they're they're they're still in the fiat mindset if they're

1104
01:33:50,776 --> 01:33:56,616
saying ten dollars in fiat or ten dollars worth of bitcoin uh you know that i think they're the

1105
01:33:56,616 --> 01:34:02,616
ones that are thinking wrong yeah good point i mean there is i think some major retailers are

1106
01:34:02,616 --> 01:34:08,816
figuring this all out there's one called sheets yeah which is a like a roadside convenience store

1107
01:34:08,816 --> 01:34:10,876
chain. I believe that they're

1108
01:34:10,876 --> 01:34:12,896
offering discounts. 50%

1109
01:34:12,896 --> 01:34:14,856
discount. Yeah. Seriously.

1110
01:34:15,036 --> 01:34:16,876
And it's really good right now

1111
01:34:16,876 --> 01:34:18,896
because it's called Sheetz and there's

1112
01:34:18,896 --> 01:34:20,776
a new parasite going around giving people

1113
01:34:20,776 --> 01:34:23,036
explosive diarrhea. So if you have explosive

1114
01:34:23,036 --> 01:34:24,656
diarrhea, stop at Sheetz

1115
01:34:24,656 --> 01:34:26,216
and you'll get 50% off

1116
01:34:26,216 --> 01:34:28,756
your pepto-bismol. I can't tell

1117
01:34:28,756 --> 01:34:30,776
if this is a bit or not. You're

1118
01:34:30,776 --> 01:34:32,636
telling me there's explosive diarrhea

1119
01:34:32,636 --> 01:34:33,716
and it's called Sheetz?

1120
01:34:34,256 --> 01:34:36,616
There is a gas station called

1121
01:34:36,616 --> 01:34:38,016
Sheetz. And

1122
01:34:38,016 --> 01:34:44,256
And I don't know if it's out where you are up north, but it's definitely on the southern, southeastern U.S.

1123
01:34:44,736 --> 01:34:48,616
And it's, you know, some weird people hang out there.

1124
01:34:48,616 --> 01:34:49,376
But you know what?

1125
01:34:49,436 --> 01:34:53,296
They're offering a 50 percent discount on a lot of stuff if you buy it in Bitcoin.

1126
01:34:53,576 --> 01:34:56,616
Yeah, that's just a news story that The New York Post had this afternoon.

1127
01:34:57,436 --> 01:35:03,136
This explosive diarrhea is making a huge in New York and other states.

1128
01:35:03,176 --> 01:35:06,016
And it just so happens that we were also talking about the sheets.

1129
01:35:06,616 --> 01:35:07,696
It's just a coincidence.

1130
01:35:07,696 --> 01:35:11,336
If you have the sheets, then stop at sheets.

1131
01:35:11,576 --> 01:35:12,856
Pick up your Pepto-Bismol.

1132
01:35:12,956 --> 01:35:15,276
You can buy it for 50% off if you pay in Bitcoin.

1133
01:35:15,276 --> 01:35:19,056
It's part of the Orange Pill podcast genius coming through.

1134
01:35:19,496 --> 01:35:21,436
Coming through into your podcast.

1135
01:35:22,196 --> 01:35:22,636
Sorry.

1136
01:35:22,956 --> 01:35:24,236
We always go there.

1137
01:35:24,596 --> 01:35:26,516
You know, we always go into the toilet humor.

1138
01:35:26,616 --> 01:35:27,816
We always manage to be super entertaining.

1139
01:35:28,576 --> 01:35:29,856
I'm a fan of it.

1140
01:35:30,596 --> 01:35:32,776
Okay, Max and Daisy, I've kept you guys a little bit long,

1141
01:35:32,876 --> 01:35:34,616
and I sincerely appreciate you sharing.

1142
01:35:34,616 --> 01:35:34,816
Yes, pass our bedtime.

1143
01:35:35,016 --> 01:35:35,736
Yes, I know.

1144
01:35:35,736 --> 01:35:46,736
Can I ask you one more question that actually Jimmy Song had posted in the Noster chat, which is he said, we know that El Salvador has changed a lot.

1145
01:35:46,956 --> 01:35:49,836
But how has El Salvador changed you?

1146
01:35:50,356 --> 01:35:52,796
Which I thought was perhaps a nice way to end things on.

1147
01:35:54,656 --> 01:36:03,516
Well, it's changed me so much because I see the individual lives transforming.

1148
01:36:03,516 --> 01:36:33,136
All of my students at Kubo Plus, Kubo AI, who many of them end up working at Bitcoin office or the ANYA National AI Agency, to be able to just do things and have an impact that will, that, you know, in so many ways, not only, you know, like we are planting seeds that some of them are actually bearing fruit now with my students that I taught four years ago.

1149
01:36:33,516 --> 01:36:40,256
Um, and by the way, uh, UNESCO recently just did a report on El Salvador looking at, they studied

1150
01:36:40,256 --> 01:36:45,696
El Salvador for about six or seven months. They were on ground and country. And one thing they

1151
01:36:45,696 --> 01:36:50,976
found, uh, they were looking at AI readiness for El Salvador. And what they found was, well,

1152
01:36:51,036 --> 01:36:56,156
they found Jimmy Song because four years ago, Jimmy Song came to El Salvador and he taught my

1153
01:36:56,156 --> 01:37:01,256
first group of students, Bitcoin, uh, the Bitcoin programming course, programming Bitcoin course.

1154
01:37:01,256 --> 01:37:09,176
And I called him the Jimmy Song 7 because we only managed to find seven students who were able to pass the quiz he gives to get into the class.

1155
01:37:09,356 --> 01:37:11,076
Something like 130 applied.

1156
01:37:11,416 --> 01:37:12,356
Only seven got in.

1157
01:37:13,216 --> 01:37:28,476
And what the UNESCO report found was that unexpectedly, they said El Salvador is the number one country in all of Latin America for quality of open source contributions.

1158
01:37:28,476 --> 01:37:31,396
and they had no idea, they couldn't explain it,

1159
01:37:31,576 --> 01:37:33,656
but it was my programs.

1160
01:37:33,836 --> 01:37:35,816
It was like, they all have to contribute

1161
01:37:35,816 --> 01:37:37,396
to open source projects.

1162
01:37:38,256 --> 01:37:40,496
And so they all open like their GitHub

1163
01:37:40,496 --> 01:37:42,656
and they all have to contribute.

1164
01:37:42,656 --> 01:37:46,736
So in our office motto and our program motto

1165
01:37:46,736 --> 01:37:48,696
for Kubo Plus, which is our Bitcoin

1166
01:37:48,696 --> 01:37:51,356
and Lightning Devs program is excellence only.

1167
01:37:52,056 --> 01:37:55,576
So like the report from UNESCO also found

1168
01:37:55,576 --> 01:38:03,116
that the quality of our contributions from El Salvador are three times as high as the average

1169
01:38:03,116 --> 01:38:08,676
for the rest of Latin America. So they were totally baffled about what this possibly could be.

1170
01:38:08,916 --> 01:38:15,056
But I know that's my flower. Like that's the fruit that I've borne in El Salvador.

1171
01:38:16,096 --> 01:38:22,356
And I believe, as Max just said, that President Bukele is a one in 500 year type leader.

1172
01:38:22,356 --> 01:38:52,276
And it's amazing. Imagine if you got to be at that table having dinner with Lorenzo the Magnificent and Da Vinci and Machiavelli and, you know, all these amazing Michelangelo, all these like amazing, the Age of Discovery, all these like amazing adventurers and astronomers and architects and like building this renaissance, right?

1173
01:38:52,356 --> 01:38:53,636
Imagine being there.

1174
01:38:53,936 --> 01:38:56,016
That's what we're at right now.

1175
01:38:56,296 --> 01:39:01,356
We're changing the course of history into a new epoch.

1176
01:39:01,896 --> 01:39:04,616
And it's fun to be there.

1177
01:39:04,696 --> 01:39:11,496
And it's really changed me a lot to appreciate why we are even building.

1178
01:39:11,496 --> 01:39:13,156
Why Bitcoin?

1179
01:39:13,736 --> 01:39:15,416
Why Bitcoin matters?

1180
01:39:15,616 --> 01:39:18,236
And it matters because of the future of humanity.

1181
01:39:19,876 --> 01:39:20,476
Max?

1182
01:39:20,476 --> 01:39:26,856
it's a tough one to follow nothing to add to that no you do he's the poet he should be able to add

1183
01:39:26,856 --> 01:39:36,216
something well i mean um i think that as as a as a production team and as a talent team

1184
01:39:36,216 --> 01:39:42,316
you know one of the the roles that i play is the person that's not changing if you you know i'm like

1185
01:39:42,316 --> 01:39:49,556
the boomer and i'm i'm like a tough you know i'm like stuck you know to create a dynamic type of

1186
01:39:49,556 --> 01:40:04,316
thing. And in El Salvador, what that means is that I've been kind of changing in the way that I

1187
01:40:04,316 --> 01:40:11,236
appreciate a few different things. Like, for example, there's the idea that governments and

1188
01:40:11,236 --> 01:40:16,636
all governments are worthless, particularly in the U.S. Ronald Reagan is like, during that era,

1189
01:40:16,636 --> 01:40:18,276
that government's too big, you can't have government.

1190
01:40:18,396 --> 01:40:20,876
Anarcho-capitalism is like, no government, we don't need government.

1191
01:40:21,576 --> 01:40:26,776
But in fact, if you go back to the founding fathers

1192
01:40:26,776 --> 01:40:29,636
and the creation of Constitution, Bill of Rights, this type of thing,

1193
01:40:30,116 --> 01:40:34,356
I mean, the idea of a governance model existing is a reality.

1194
01:40:34,456 --> 01:40:36,136
You need a governance model to exist.

1195
01:40:36,476 --> 01:40:40,116
And Bitcoin is one of the strictest governance models ever imagined.

1196
01:40:40,936 --> 01:40:45,796
And so in El Salvador, you see where a functioning government

1197
01:40:45,796 --> 01:40:51,496
can actually offer very sound benefits

1198
01:40:51,496 --> 01:40:53,596
to the population that's being governed.

1199
01:40:53,996 --> 01:40:56,956
So the social contract, I guess I would say

1200
01:40:56,956 --> 01:40:59,236
that the change for me is rethinking

1201
01:40:59,236 --> 01:41:00,456
about the social contract.

1202
01:41:00,856 --> 01:41:03,696
You know, the social contract between the government bodies

1203
01:41:03,696 --> 01:41:05,176
and those being governed,

1204
01:41:05,616 --> 01:41:08,976
and how it can manifest in the 21st century,

1205
01:41:09,396 --> 01:41:13,016
and how a small country led by a dynamic leader

1206
01:41:13,016 --> 01:41:17,696
can create freedom in the way that's being done.

1207
01:41:18,476 --> 01:41:22,356
And so to be there and be a part of that,

1208
01:41:22,696 --> 01:41:27,636
it's keep an open mind and really try to embrace that

1209
01:41:27,636 --> 01:41:32,336
and be like water, like Bruce Lee says, right?

1210
01:41:32,776 --> 01:41:34,896
To go with the flow.

1211
01:41:35,816 --> 01:41:41,336
And so it's been just a remarkable eyewitness to history.

1212
01:41:41,336 --> 01:41:53,896
I think ultimately the bottom line is that this is a chapter in our life and my life where we're actually eyewitnessing an incredibly important piece of history that will be talked about for hundreds of years.

1213
01:41:54,196 --> 01:42:00,316
So it's like being right there at the signing of the declaration or being in Kitty Hawk or being at the Apollo lunar launch.

1214
01:42:00,416 --> 01:42:08,816
You know, we're actually witnessing and we have a good relationship with folks who are doing all these things to be an eyewitnesses and see it firsthand.

1215
01:42:08,816 --> 01:42:22,796
And it has it changes. It changes. I guess what I'm getting at is that the scale of this change as it now impacting the world is enormous.

1216
01:42:24,796 --> 01:42:36,876
So it's humbling. Right. It's it's kind of a humbling experience because you you you're seeing something happen that very few people have ever had this kind of experience.

1217
01:42:36,876 --> 01:42:43,776
And the profound impact it's having globally is now just being recognized around the world.

1218
01:42:44,596 --> 01:42:54,276
And so it's a very hopeful expression of humanity, what can be done, what is possible.

1219
01:42:55,476 --> 01:42:59,096
And, you know, Max invented the Coco Max in El Salvador.

1220
01:42:59,376 --> 01:43:04,036
And you can come to our restaurant, La Cajita, in Bitcoin Beach and enjoy the Coco Max.

1221
01:43:04,036 --> 01:43:08,516
And it really has put El Salvador on the map, this Coco Max drink.

1222
01:43:08,836 --> 01:43:09,136
Totally.

1223
01:43:09,296 --> 01:43:11,236
It made the big difference.

1224
01:43:11,516 --> 01:43:14,536
It took them over the top, the Coco Max.

1225
01:43:14,616 --> 01:43:15,896
It is like the Sistine Chapel.

1226
01:43:15,896 --> 01:43:17,516
Coco Maxing next time I get there.

1227
01:43:17,996 --> 01:43:19,616
Yeah, it's the Sistine Chapel of beverages.

1228
01:43:20,416 --> 01:43:26,236
You know, it's the perfect combination of coconut grinded up, coconut meat,

1229
01:43:26,516 --> 01:43:28,436
coconut water, volcano coffee.

1230
01:43:28,836 --> 01:43:32,516
And we're going to introduce the Coco Max ice cream and Coco Max candy bar.

1231
01:43:32,516 --> 01:43:38,436
candy bar will have south salvador chocolate el salvador coffee el salvador coconuts and sugar

1232
01:43:38,436 --> 01:43:43,736
cane sugar cane so you get a quadruple hit of el salvador shipped anywhere in the world your local

1233
01:43:43,736 --> 01:43:49,836
whole foods you know for seven dollars you can get a coco max choco bar and experience the

1234
01:43:49,836 --> 01:43:55,316
quadruple hit of el salvador right there in the aisle seven of your whole foods and be elevated

1235
01:43:55,316 --> 01:44:01,696
to this posture of greater consciousness without you know spending more than seven dollars or

1236
01:44:01,696 --> 01:44:04,696
leaving the comfort of your local Whole Foods.

1237
01:44:04,696 --> 01:44:09,956
And by elevated, he means high as a kite, as with all the

1238
01:44:09,984 --> 01:44:11,524
chocolate sugar and coconut.

1239
01:44:12,204 --> 01:44:18,024
It's like you're on top of a volcano and you can see infinitely into the Pacific Ocean

1240
01:44:18,024 --> 01:44:26,544
and see, you know, where the mermaids dancing in the fluorescence of the bioluminescence

1241
01:44:26,544 --> 01:44:32,904
of fish that can generate their own electricity and light are dancing in the Pacific.

1242
01:44:33,224 --> 01:44:34,544
And they're all drinking Cocomax.

1243
01:44:34,644 --> 01:44:37,124
And you're there witnessing this on top of a volcano.

1244
01:44:37,124 --> 01:44:44,204
out and you're thinking to yourself, my God, this is, I am, I am in the presence of a, of a higher

1245
01:44:44,204 --> 01:44:51,904
being. And, and, and that, um, that meat turns your soul immortal. You become an immortal. If

1246
01:44:51,904 --> 01:44:57,184
you wish to become an immortal, come to El Salvador or go to your local Whole Foods, get a Choco

1247
01:44:57,184 --> 01:45:03,864
Coco Max bar, peer out into the Pacific, watch the bioluminescent fish dance with each other

1248
01:45:03,864 --> 01:45:05,664
and stack sets.

1249
01:45:06,264 --> 01:45:06,684
Yes.

1250
01:45:07,084 --> 01:45:08,504
I got to get one of these candy bars.

1251
01:45:08,664 --> 01:45:09,464
I mean, wow.

1252
01:45:12,004 --> 01:45:13,884
We're going to call it the Matt Odell bar.

1253
01:45:14,004 --> 01:45:14,624
Yeah, yeah.

1254
01:45:14,844 --> 01:45:15,664
Oh, boy.

1255
01:45:15,844 --> 01:45:16,844
And then we changed it now.

1256
01:45:16,924 --> 01:45:19,304
It became the Coco Choco Max instead.

1257
01:45:19,724 --> 01:45:22,004
And remember, somebody needs to create the meme

1258
01:45:22,004 --> 01:45:23,704
that it's Matt Odell's fault.

1259
01:45:24,364 --> 01:45:24,524
Yeah.

1260
01:45:26,104 --> 01:45:27,844
Whoever's out there in the Noster chat right now,

1261
01:45:27,844 --> 01:45:30,844
I'll zap 5,000 sats to the best

1262
01:45:30,844 --> 01:45:32,864
it's Matt Odell's fault meme.

1263
01:45:32,864 --> 01:45:41,564
so yeah tag tag me in it uh this is all his fault oh yeah thanks a lot odell geez thanks a lot dude

1264
01:45:41,564 --> 01:45:46,884
that's why we don't have real shit okay this is why we how to say like buy buy bitcoin not that

1265
01:45:46,884 --> 01:45:54,344
fake shit yeah there you go well max first of all i can't stop thinking about tripping out on a max

1266
01:45:54,344 --> 01:45:59,664
or choco caco max on top of a mountain staring out of the pacific and watching the bioluminescent

1267
01:45:59,664 --> 01:46:00,644
fish dance with each other.

1268
01:46:01,064 --> 01:46:02,144
Volcano, yes, excuse me.

1269
01:46:03,024 --> 01:46:03,684
They're all beautiful.

1270
01:46:03,764 --> 01:46:05,484
The mountain is so blase,

1271
01:46:05,584 --> 01:46:07,524
so middle class.

1272
01:46:07,564 --> 01:46:08,684
One of the most volcanically

1273
01:46:08,684 --> 01:46:09,664
concentrated activity

1274
01:46:09,664 --> 01:46:10,744
in the world in El Salvador.

1275
01:46:10,964 --> 01:46:11,444
It's wild.

1276
01:46:12,004 --> 01:46:12,644
And that also,

1277
01:46:12,824 --> 01:46:13,124
the whole,

1278
01:46:13,264 --> 01:46:15,504
whether it's tokens like Bitcoin

1279
01:46:15,504 --> 01:46:17,224
or it's AI tokens

1280
01:46:17,224 --> 01:46:19,324
that are being circulated

1281
01:46:19,324 --> 01:46:20,884
in the new 21st century economy,

1282
01:46:21,144 --> 01:46:22,884
defining the 21st century economy,

1283
01:46:23,044 --> 01:46:24,404
they're all converting energy

1284
01:46:24,404 --> 01:46:26,504
into money, essentially,

1285
01:46:26,704 --> 01:46:28,244
because an AI token is money.

1286
01:46:28,244 --> 01:46:44,264
And so is the Bitcoin token. So and then the individual sovereignty and the sovereignty of El Salvador with its geothermal energy capabilities means that we become the AI Bitcoin powerhouse of the 21st century.

1287
01:46:44,864 --> 01:46:52,344
And that's one of the objectives because we have an enormous amount of potential geothermal energy, which is the best form of energy.

1288
01:46:52,344 --> 01:46:55,904
You know, it transformed the economy of Iceland, for example.

1289
01:46:56,184 --> 01:47:07,384
You know, they were able to export aluminum ingots by transforming their geothermal energy through Alcoa, which is a huge corporation there, into aluminum, which they then can export.

1290
01:47:07,684 --> 01:47:15,644
So in El Salvador, they can take their geothermal energy, turn it into AI tokens, and then send those tokens around the world, right?

1291
01:47:15,644 --> 01:47:18,084
So they're exporting, you're exporting energy.

1292
01:47:18,224 --> 01:47:25,284
You're a huge energy exporter because you're exporting AI tokens that were created by geothermal, local geothermal energy.

1293
01:47:25,544 --> 01:47:27,684
The same thing with Bitcoin, right?

1294
01:47:27,684 --> 01:47:28,584
You're mining for Bitcoin.

1295
01:47:28,724 --> 01:47:31,624
So we already have, we are already mining Bitcoin with geothermal energy.

1296
01:47:31,844 --> 01:47:33,984
So we're exporting that energy around the world.

1297
01:47:34,124 --> 01:47:36,204
And this is, gives us sovereignty.

1298
01:47:36,344 --> 01:47:37,624
Again, it's the sovereign stack.

1299
01:47:37,684 --> 01:47:38,584
It's the freedom stack.

1300
01:47:38,684 --> 01:47:40,684
AI, Bitcoin, education, security.

1301
01:47:40,984 --> 01:47:41,884
You put them all together.

1302
01:47:41,884 --> 01:47:48,644
You add a Coco Max bar on top of that, you smother it in a, you know, as I mentioned, I mentioned the ice cream.

1303
01:47:48,804 --> 01:47:55,564
I'm just laughing because when Max and I, during COVID, we started the Orange Pill podcast and we would live stream.

1304
01:47:55,724 --> 01:47:58,224
And then I would be like, OK, it's been an hour.

1305
01:47:58,704 --> 01:48:00,864
And I guess that's it.

1306
01:48:01,224 --> 01:48:04,964
And Max would finally wake up then and start talking.

1307
01:48:05,044 --> 01:48:09,464
And two hours later, I'd be like, OK, I'm trying to say goodbye.

1308
01:48:09,464 --> 01:48:16,124
And as soon as you say goodbye is the worst time for Max when the camera, the little light on the camera.

1309
01:48:16,384 --> 01:48:16,784
Don't go away.

1310
01:48:16,804 --> 01:48:18,564
He's like, don't go out.

1311
01:48:18,744 --> 01:48:19,864
Now I know the trick.

1312
01:48:20,064 --> 01:48:20,624
Now I know the trick.

1313
01:48:20,724 --> 01:48:22,924
Next time I'm just going to be like, okay, that's it.

1314
01:48:22,924 --> 01:48:23,804
15 minutes in.

1315
01:48:23,924 --> 01:48:24,664
The curtain's closing.

1316
01:48:24,764 --> 01:48:32,364
I'm like, okay, we're going to stop this by force majeure of my own lexiconic kind of composition.

1317
01:48:32,624 --> 01:48:37,904
If you ever want Max to talk, just say, okay, we're about to wrap up or we're going to cut camera.

1318
01:48:37,904 --> 01:48:42,264
and he's going to start talking as much as possible so you can't cut.

1319
01:48:42,704 --> 01:48:43,184
Exactly.

1320
01:48:43,364 --> 01:48:48,024
I'm going to get my thesaurus out immediately and dive into the splendor.

1321
01:48:48,044 --> 01:48:50,504
And remember, this is Matt O'Dell's fault too.

1322
01:48:50,824 --> 01:48:51,584
It is.

1323
01:48:52,164 --> 01:48:54,184
I'm so glad we have someone to blame now.

1324
01:48:54,544 --> 01:48:55,284
I've been looking at it.

1325
01:48:55,284 --> 01:48:57,004
I'm going to blame him for everything.

1326
01:48:57,144 --> 01:48:59,624
If I stub my toe, it's Matt O'Dell's fault.

1327
01:49:00,164 --> 01:49:05,024
If I forget to pay my taxes, it's Matt O'Dell's fault.

1328
01:49:05,024 --> 01:49:10,404
Like he is going to get the blame for everything from now on that goes wrong in my life.

1329
01:49:10,484 --> 01:49:15,344
And what went wrong in my life for sure in the past four years, everything was good.

1330
01:49:15,444 --> 01:49:19,624
All the stuff we did in El Salvador, except for Bitcoin Twitter, it disappeared.

1331
01:49:19,804 --> 01:49:20,804
All the memers are gone.

1332
01:49:20,904 --> 01:49:22,184
And that's Matt O'Dell's fault.

1333
01:49:22,324 --> 01:49:22,444
Yeah.

1334
01:49:22,604 --> 01:49:23,484
I blame him.

1335
01:49:24,164 --> 01:49:24,764
That's it.

1336
01:49:25,104 --> 01:49:26,984
It's like Murphy's law, Saad's law.

1337
01:49:27,184 --> 01:49:28,144
It's Matt O'Dell's law.

1338
01:49:28,324 --> 01:49:28,544
Yeah.

1339
01:49:28,784 --> 01:49:29,844
The O'Dell law.

1340
01:49:30,064 --> 01:49:41,092
The O conspiracy No one will remember who he is Adele went away and the memers left Yeah Hmm Thanks a lot Odell Correlation equals causation

1341
01:49:41,232 --> 01:49:42,252
I'm sure of this.

1342
01:49:43,592 --> 01:49:44,032
Yeah.

1343
01:49:44,132 --> 01:49:45,792
We're going to need to make T-shirts.

1344
01:49:46,252 --> 01:49:54,472
We're going to need to make maybe it's Matt Odell's fault candy bars as well as a secondary line for you guys on top of the Choco Kako Max bars.

1345
01:49:54,472 --> 01:49:54,992
I don't know.

1346
01:49:55,052 --> 01:49:56,132
You know what it will be?

1347
01:49:56,252 --> 01:50:00,032
The Matt Odell chocolate bar will just be a wrapper and there's nothing in there.

1348
01:50:00,032 --> 01:50:00,092
Nothing.

1349
01:50:00,092 --> 01:50:03,192
Because it's like that said, buy Bitcoin, not that fake shit.

1350
01:50:03,572 --> 01:50:06,872
And look, Matt Odell's fault is that he went away and it's all fake shit.

1351
01:50:07,052 --> 01:50:08,432
So we're going to sell fake shit.

1352
01:50:08,652 --> 01:50:10,312
It's just going to be cardboard in there.

1353
01:50:10,472 --> 01:50:11,512
And it's going to be nothing.

1354
01:50:11,892 --> 01:50:13,172
It's not going to be a real thing.

1355
01:50:13,432 --> 01:50:14,672
The Matt Odell nothing bar.

1356
01:50:16,252 --> 01:50:17,592
It's 100% nothing.

1357
01:50:18,352 --> 01:50:18,792
Organic.

1358
01:50:19,132 --> 01:50:20,652
The organic Matt Odell nothing bar.

1359
01:50:20,952 --> 01:50:22,072
No ingredients whatsoever.

1360
01:50:22,672 --> 01:50:23,112
Wow.

1361
01:50:23,352 --> 01:50:24,052
Totally organic.

1362
01:50:24,052 --> 01:50:25,932
Sustainably sourced because there's nothing there, you know?

1363
01:50:26,512 --> 01:50:26,712
Right.

1364
01:50:26,872 --> 01:50:28,192
It's 100% oxygen.

1365
01:50:28,192 --> 01:50:30,272
$12 a piece.

1366
01:50:30,692 --> 01:50:31,612
At least.

1367
01:50:32,732 --> 01:50:33,092
Hell yeah.

1368
01:50:33,892 --> 01:50:34,452
Fantastic.

1369
01:50:34,992 --> 01:50:47,472
Relive the memeless period of internet drudgery with a Matt O'Dell nothing bar available for $12 at Amazon or at Whole Foods.

1370
01:50:47,572 --> 01:50:48,472
What's the phrase he uses?

1371
01:50:48,652 --> 01:50:49,692
It's fake shit, right?

1372
01:50:49,812 --> 01:50:51,072
Like the fake shit bar.

1373
01:50:51,812 --> 01:50:51,972
Yeah.

1374
01:50:51,972 --> 01:50:53,212
Ooh, the fake shit bar.

1375
01:50:53,292 --> 01:50:53,792
There we go.

1376
01:50:54,212 --> 01:50:54,432
Yeah.

1377
01:50:54,432 --> 01:50:56,812
The fake shit bar all caused by Matt O'Dell.

1378
01:50:56,812 --> 01:51:02,512
It's Matt Odell's fault that we all have to eat fake shit bars for the rest of our lives because of him.

1379
01:51:02,632 --> 01:51:05,312
He abandoned the Bitcoin Twitter community.

1380
01:51:05,492 --> 01:51:05,712
Yep.

1381
01:51:06,472 --> 01:51:07,672
I'm not buying the mea culpa.

1382
01:51:08,572 --> 01:51:10,792
You know, I think there needs to be more penance.

1383
01:51:11,452 --> 01:51:11,772
Okay.

1384
01:51:11,892 --> 01:51:13,152
It's just not enough to say, you know.

1385
01:51:13,312 --> 01:51:18,552
His penance could be he needs to go on tour to every Bitcoin conference and speak.

1386
01:51:18,992 --> 01:51:23,812
And he should come to Bitcoin Historico, come on stage, and we'll, like, flagellate him.

1387
01:51:23,812 --> 01:51:25,272
We'll get these, you know.

1388
01:51:25,672 --> 01:51:26,292
Flagellate him?

1389
01:51:26,292 --> 01:51:27,412
Yeah, what's a word?

1390
01:51:28,132 --> 01:51:29,532
Yeah, it'll work.

1391
01:51:29,652 --> 01:51:30,352
Sure, flagellation.

1392
01:51:30,832 --> 01:51:32,192
We had to go old school.

1393
01:51:33,192 --> 01:51:33,332
Yeah.

1394
01:51:33,672 --> 01:51:36,572
Yeah, a little cat-of-nine-tails up there, you know, and just give him a-

1395
01:51:36,572 --> 01:51:38,792
Like that scene in Game of Thrones.

1396
01:51:39,352 --> 01:51:39,752
Shame!

1397
01:51:39,912 --> 01:51:40,432
Yeah, shame.

1398
01:51:40,512 --> 01:51:40,872
Shame!

1399
01:51:40,892 --> 01:51:41,572
That's it!

1400
01:51:41,672 --> 01:51:41,992
Shame!

1401
01:51:41,992 --> 01:51:44,872
We'll have him walk up on the stage in the National Palace.

1402
01:51:45,072 --> 01:51:45,192
Yeah.

1403
01:51:45,492 --> 01:51:45,892
Shame!

1404
01:51:46,492 --> 01:51:46,732
Shame!

1405
01:51:47,092 --> 01:51:48,832
Right, he's on all fours with a dog collar.

1406
01:51:49,252 --> 01:51:49,492
Yeah.

1407
01:51:50,452 --> 01:51:50,772
Shame!

1408
01:51:50,772 --> 01:51:51,592
This just took a turn.

1409
01:51:51,952 --> 01:51:52,312
Shame!

1410
01:51:54,372 --> 01:51:54,852
That's it.

1411
01:51:54,852 --> 01:51:56,912
Max was doing the OnlyFans version.

1412
01:51:57,112 --> 01:51:58,252
This is the OnlyFans version?

1413
01:51:58,832 --> 01:51:59,012
Yeah.

1414
01:51:59,112 --> 01:51:59,392
You know?

1415
01:52:00,332 --> 01:52:03,672
And yeah, we'll sell Matt O'Dell fake shit bars.

1416
01:52:04,972 --> 01:52:05,172
Yeah.

1417
01:52:05,172 --> 01:52:05,572
I love it.

1418
01:52:06,232 --> 01:52:06,652
It's fantastic.

1419
01:52:06,672 --> 01:52:07,152
I'm into it.

1420
01:52:07,972 --> 01:52:08,312
Okay.

1421
01:52:08,492 --> 01:52:08,932
I'm into it.

1422
01:52:08,932 --> 01:52:13,772
BitcoinHistorico.com, for those who want to see Matt O'Dell do his shame walk.

1423
01:52:13,812 --> 01:52:14,312
Is that correct?

1424
01:52:14,732 --> 01:52:16,092
Yes, the walk of shame.

1425
01:52:16,492 --> 01:52:17,512
We'll promise that.

1426
01:52:17,592 --> 01:52:21,932
We're going to put that on a poster campaign across the Bitcoin Twitter.

1427
01:52:21,932 --> 01:52:26,352
and or maybe Nasser now that he abandoned that.

1428
01:52:26,692 --> 01:52:29,592
So we're going to, you know, go wherever he's not going to yell at us.

1429
01:52:29,972 --> 01:52:32,432
So now that I know he's back on Bitcoin Twitter,

1430
01:52:32,432 --> 01:52:36,252
we can't go there and let him know that we're talking about him.

1431
01:52:36,592 --> 01:52:40,032
So hopefully nobody tells him because otherwise, you know.

1432
01:52:40,772 --> 01:52:43,532
Whatever you do, guys, don't tell Odell about this.

1433
01:52:43,872 --> 01:52:45,012
Don't tell Odell.

1434
01:52:45,212 --> 01:52:46,432
Definitely don't tell Odell.

1435
01:52:46,732 --> 01:52:47,732
His buddy, Marty Bent.

1436
01:52:48,172 --> 01:52:48,392
Yeah.

1437
01:52:48,512 --> 01:52:49,152
What about that guy?

1438
01:52:49,672 --> 01:52:51,052
Marty Bent should have kept him on the straight.

1439
01:52:51,052 --> 01:52:53,152
Now, Marty Bent stayed on Bitcoin Twitter.

1440
01:52:53,392 --> 01:52:54,832
He was loyal to Bitcoin Twitter.

1441
01:52:55,412 --> 01:52:58,192
But apparently he's not very powerful because it all fell apart.

1442
01:52:58,432 --> 01:52:59,152
It was Matt O'Dell.

1443
01:52:59,252 --> 01:53:01,412
Matt O'Dell was the one that left and everything fell apart.

1444
01:53:01,792 --> 01:53:04,632
So, you know, we have fake shit bars because of him.

1445
01:53:06,352 --> 01:53:08,892
Thanks a lot for your fake shit bars, O'Dell.

1446
01:53:09,532 --> 01:53:11,332
We love you, O'Dell.

1447
01:53:11,472 --> 01:53:12,032
We love you.

1448
01:53:12,532 --> 01:53:15,692
We're all looking forward to the walk of shame.

1449
01:53:16,592 --> 01:53:19,952
But, you know, it's just everyone's got to pay the piper at some point, right?

1450
01:53:19,952 --> 01:53:26,212
you know it's just the price of doing business but well i feel like old school i feel like we're

1451
01:53:26,212 --> 01:53:32,352
back we're back you've you've given me so much optimism for the future i have relentless optimism

1452
01:53:32,352 --> 01:53:40,012
again i haven't had that for five years in bitcoin now i have it i feel it i can i can feel it i can

1453
01:53:40,012 --> 01:53:45,892
feel it guys this is a lot of fun now i don't know if i if i start to say like and that's a wrap if

1454
01:53:45,892 --> 01:53:47,772
if Max is going to go off again.

1455
01:53:47,852 --> 01:53:49,272
Like, I don't even know if I should say the word.

1456
01:53:49,472 --> 01:53:50,572
Just turn the camera off.

1457
01:53:50,712 --> 01:53:51,252
Just don't.

1458
01:53:52,052 --> 01:53:54,012
And we're starting for the first time.

1459
01:53:54,012 --> 01:53:54,772
It's interesting, you know,

1460
01:53:54,832 --> 01:53:56,732
because you get through all the, you know,

1461
01:53:56,812 --> 01:54:00,472
conversation and all the bits you figure you're talking about.

1462
01:54:00,592 --> 01:54:01,692
You run through the list.

1463
01:54:01,752 --> 01:54:02,952
It's all very engaging.

1464
01:54:03,252 --> 01:54:05,672
And then, you know, you start to hallucinate.

1465
01:54:05,812 --> 01:54:06,752
You start to oxygen.

1466
01:54:06,992 --> 01:54:08,232
It starts getting depleted.

1467
01:54:08,732 --> 01:54:11,072
You start to have delusions.

1468
01:54:11,792 --> 01:54:13,712
And, you know, to be able to read those,

1469
01:54:13,712 --> 01:54:15,852
you know, like skywriting in your own unconscious.

1470
01:54:15,892 --> 01:54:22,872
mind and you just blurt it out what you see, you know, out there and it triggers, you know,

1471
01:54:22,972 --> 01:54:28,092
the stream of consciousness, which if you've been in Bitcoin for 15 years like we have,

1472
01:54:28,532 --> 01:54:35,552
it can, you can cough up a lot of interesting blood and guts and it can be interesting,

1473
01:54:35,792 --> 01:54:39,232
you know, because we've seen every single thing. We know everybody, we've seen it all. We've

1474
01:54:39,232 --> 01:54:43,832
experienced the entire panoply of disasters and triumphs for 15 fucking years.

1475
01:54:43,832 --> 01:54:52,192
and i just want to say speaking of fake ship bars i am convinced that walker has a filter on his

1476
01:54:52,192 --> 01:55:07,740
screen to make him look like a hunky tan like a fabio yeah and max and i look like corpses you know you know You got dug up you know It because I ate five Choco Coco Max bars before this

1477
01:55:07,840 --> 01:55:09,100
So I'm buzzing.

1478
01:55:09,300 --> 01:55:10,500
I'm glowing right now.

1479
01:55:10,920 --> 01:55:12,540
I was in the garden sweating

1480
01:55:12,540 --> 01:55:14,400
before this and then jumped

1481
01:55:14,400 --> 01:55:16,400
right on in here for a moment.

1482
01:55:16,480 --> 01:55:17,580
I had to move my sprinkler, guys,

1483
01:55:17,660 --> 01:55:19,580
when I got back from running

1484
01:55:19,580 --> 01:55:20,520
around before this.

1485
01:55:21,140 --> 01:55:22,360
And then, yeah, what can I say?

1486
01:55:22,420 --> 01:55:23,240
The glow has persisted.

1487
01:55:23,240 --> 01:55:25,340
I feel like I'm in my studio

1488
01:55:25,340 --> 01:55:27,180
and it's above the garage.

1489
01:55:27,360 --> 01:55:28,940
And so it's probably the least well,

1490
01:55:29,040 --> 01:55:30,380
like there's AC in here.

1491
01:55:30,440 --> 01:55:31,540
Like it's not Europe, you know,

1492
01:55:31,640 --> 01:55:35,440
but boy, it could be colder up here.

1493
01:55:35,460 --> 01:55:36,140
I'll just say that.

1494
01:55:36,240 --> 01:55:37,100
So that may be part of that.

1495
01:55:37,340 --> 01:55:38,700
Oh, it's cold in our house.

1496
01:55:38,920 --> 01:55:40,480
We have the AC cranked up.

1497
01:55:40,480 --> 01:55:41,600
It's like, it's like,

1498
01:55:41,620 --> 01:55:43,640
it's like Arctic conditions in here.

1499
01:55:43,800 --> 01:55:44,320
It's nice.

1500
01:55:44,320 --> 01:55:44,940
It's the way to do it.

1501
01:55:45,220 --> 01:55:45,740
It's the way to do it.

1502
01:55:45,740 --> 01:55:47,040
Yeah, it's very hot outside.

1503
01:55:47,620 --> 01:55:48,600
You're wearing a turtleneck

1504
01:55:48,600 --> 01:55:50,000
just to spite the Europeans.

1505
01:55:50,400 --> 01:55:51,240
Like you're just like, yeah,

1506
01:55:51,320 --> 01:55:53,140
it's so cold in my house.

1507
01:55:53,180 --> 01:55:54,220
I can just wear a turtleneck.

1508
01:55:55,340 --> 01:55:57,940
This is actually considered hate speech in Europe.

1509
01:55:57,940 --> 01:56:00,560
It could be warmer if I...

1510
01:56:00,560 --> 01:56:02,480
This is hate speech.

1511
01:56:03,080 --> 01:56:05,720
Oh, my God, we're going to be banned on X.

1512
01:56:05,880 --> 01:56:06,700
Oh, my God.

1513
01:56:06,800 --> 01:56:12,680
They're going to write to Elon and say that he owes them $5,000 million

1514
01:56:12,680 --> 01:56:16,080
for allowing us to spew this hate speech.

1515
01:56:16,380 --> 01:56:19,000
Yeah, heat-related reparations, I think.

1516
01:56:19,460 --> 01:56:21,260
To make it worse for French people,

1517
01:56:21,260 --> 01:56:24,220
we're going to take our Coco Max bar and eat it with ketchup.

1518
01:56:24,220 --> 01:56:34,680
oh yeah oh well speaking of that of course happy 250th birthday everybody you know is our 250th

1519
01:56:34,680 --> 01:56:42,200
birthday this weekend coming up right so uh max and i are going to celebrate with some uh sparklers

1520
01:56:42,200 --> 01:56:46,820
and fireworks in the house so we're going to stay cold right like we have a tall ceiling so we're

1521
01:56:46,820 --> 01:56:52,100
just going to light them up and like send off these firecrackers and but it's interesting like

1522
01:56:52,100 --> 01:56:55,040
I've been alive 20% of the history of the United States.

1523
01:56:58,040 --> 01:56:58,520
Shit.

1524
01:56:58,640 --> 01:56:59,580
Or more, right?

1525
01:56:59,900 --> 01:57:00,440
That's how I'm on.

1526
01:57:00,680 --> 01:57:00,940
66.

1527
01:57:01,280 --> 01:57:02,200
I think you just thought.

1528
01:57:02,200 --> 01:57:05,540
So 250, 10%, 25, 20, 20, more than 20%.

1529
01:57:05,540 --> 01:57:08,140
66, right?

1530
01:57:08,500 --> 01:57:12,780
So, you know, my parents were alive for, you know,

1531
01:57:12,940 --> 01:57:16,480
almost half the, it's a really young country, but.

1532
01:57:16,880 --> 01:57:18,300
It's a young country, for sure.

1533
01:57:18,300 --> 01:57:21,560
You really, like, we've participated in something,

1534
01:57:21,560 --> 01:57:23,600
called the United States,

1535
01:57:23,640 --> 01:57:26,640
which has been an incredible story.

1536
01:57:26,840 --> 01:57:28,020
But I think that's where El Salvador

1537
01:57:28,020 --> 01:57:29,080
comes back into it.

1538
01:57:29,080 --> 01:57:30,900
It's like it's taken the baton

1539
01:57:30,900 --> 01:57:34,500
of the best that the U.S. was able to achieve.

1540
01:57:34,660 --> 01:57:36,300
And it's now taking it further.

1541
01:57:37,420 --> 01:57:38,200
Hey, grab that mask.

1542
01:57:38,260 --> 01:57:39,300
I want to show something

1543
01:57:39,300 --> 01:57:40,560
from the old school days.

1544
01:57:40,740 --> 01:57:41,000
Okay.

1545
01:57:41,120 --> 01:57:43,180
This is, we have this

1546
01:57:43,180 --> 01:57:44,700
from the early Bitcoin days.

1547
01:57:45,220 --> 01:57:45,480
This was.

1548
01:57:47,820 --> 01:57:48,260
Yes.

1549
01:57:49,140 --> 01:57:49,660
I've got my.

1550
01:57:50,300 --> 01:57:51,140
Remember I was telling you

1551
01:57:51,140 --> 01:57:58,740
about the old days like this was like more like 2013 or 14 era bitcoin anonymous anon yeah

1552
01:57:58,740 --> 01:58:06,840
anonymous uh a good old guy fox yeah um the uh november 5th of november yeah yeah remember

1553
01:58:06,840 --> 01:58:12,900
v for vendetta v for vendetta yeah yeah we got a lot of good books here here's uh

1554
01:58:12,900 --> 01:58:19,320
yeah those were the days those were the days so we need to bring now that matt odell's back maybe

1555
01:58:19,320 --> 01:58:26,800
we might have some new funk return the funk is back it just reminded me of it uh you ever seen

1556
01:58:26,800 --> 01:58:34,320
the old greg video from uh from a mighty wind it was a british sitcom back in the day like but i say

1557
01:58:34,320 --> 01:58:38,680
back in the day it was like before i was born even but it's like there's a great if you if you guys

1558
01:58:38,680 --> 01:58:43,800
want a nice laugh you can probably just search for old greg with two g's and uh and have your

1559
01:58:43,800 --> 01:58:47,480
and have yourselves a nice chuckle um while you're lighting off fireworks in the house

1560
01:58:47,480 --> 01:58:55,760
what's that what happened to grijage yeah are you saying greg's age yeah i call him grijage

1561
01:58:55,760 --> 01:59:02,760
where is that old potato i don't know i don't know see every like matt odell left it's his fault

1562
01:59:02,760 --> 01:59:08,920
everybody left with him and if you happen to light your house on fire with those indoor fireworks

1563
01:59:08,920 --> 01:59:16,420
guess whose fault that one is too that is totally matt odell's fault right it's matt odell's fault

1564
01:59:16,420 --> 01:59:18,700
that I look like a cracker right now

1565
01:59:18,700 --> 01:59:19,380
and a corpse.

1566
01:59:20,280 --> 01:59:22,180
Because for whatever,

1567
01:59:22,340 --> 01:59:23,160
it's his fault.

1568
01:59:23,320 --> 01:59:25,360
Like, I don't look like this in real life.

1569
01:59:25,440 --> 01:59:26,440
I look way better.

1570
01:59:26,580 --> 01:59:27,920
I look almost like Giselle.

1571
01:59:28,580 --> 01:59:30,420
Like tan, lithe, and beautiful.

1572
01:59:31,360 --> 01:59:33,520
But on this camera,

1573
01:59:33,700 --> 01:59:35,500
whatever Walker's doing,

1574
01:59:35,640 --> 01:59:37,260
he's just trying to make me look bad.

1575
01:59:37,660 --> 01:59:38,040
So he looks better.

1576
01:59:38,040 --> 01:59:39,380
I thought this was a blame Odell party,

1577
01:59:39,480 --> 01:59:40,460
not a blame Walker party.

1578
01:59:40,480 --> 01:59:41,520
No, that's Matt Odell's fault.

1579
01:59:41,720 --> 01:59:43,760
Matt Odell gave him that idea.

1580
01:59:45,320 --> 01:59:46,280
Look what we have here.

1581
01:59:46,280 --> 01:59:49,120
See, this is the Constitution of the United States.

1582
01:59:49,940 --> 01:59:50,580
Beautiful.

1583
01:59:50,580 --> 01:59:53,020
And this is the Bitcoin white paper, right?

1584
01:59:53,380 --> 01:59:53,800
You see?

1585
01:59:54,080 --> 01:59:56,040
The two most important documents in history.

1586
01:59:56,100 --> 01:59:56,380
Pocket-sized.

1587
01:59:57,080 --> 01:59:57,860
Pocket-sized.

1588
01:59:58,380 --> 01:59:58,620
Yeah.

1589
01:59:58,680 --> 01:59:59,300
The pocket-sized.

1590
01:59:59,520 --> 02:00:00,240
Don't go anywhere.

1591
02:00:00,780 --> 02:00:04,220
You know, it's Matt O'Dell's fault that Max won't stop talking either.

1592
02:00:04,740 --> 02:00:11,800
Like, Max is just like, I might get up and go get some watermelon and turn up the AC.

1593
02:00:11,800 --> 02:00:32,068
You know now that I remember the misery of our European friends I might turn the AC down to like 60 degrees just to maybe even 58 Put on like a put on like a down jacket Maybe there we go 58 58 K It has to be 58

1594
02:00:32,388 --> 02:00:32,588
No,

1595
02:00:32,688 --> 02:00:35,428
we never figured out how to turn this thing on.

1596
02:00:35,868 --> 02:00:36,248
I never,

1597
02:00:36,448 --> 02:00:36,708
he,

1598
02:00:36,788 --> 02:00:37,928
he ripped us off.

1599
02:00:38,048 --> 02:00:41,768
I spent $400 on this and I never got it fucking working.

1600
02:00:41,988 --> 02:00:43,108
You can never figure it out.

1601
02:00:43,528 --> 02:00:43,668
He,

1602
02:00:43,848 --> 02:00:46,588
so he sent us another one and we still have it on.

1603
02:00:46,648 --> 02:00:47,088
Hello.

1604
02:00:47,488 --> 02:00:48,168
And it's his,

1605
02:00:48,368 --> 02:00:50,048
that's Matt O'Dell's fault though.

1606
02:00:50,108 --> 02:00:50,388
Fuck you,

1607
02:00:50,448 --> 02:00:50,608
Sierra.

1608
02:00:50,708 --> 02:00:51,028
Hello.

1609
02:00:51,628 --> 02:00:52,508
Yeah, he's famous.

1610
02:00:52,608 --> 02:00:53,188
Look at that chicken.

1611
02:00:53,948 --> 02:00:55,188
You know, Bitcoin chicken.

1612
02:00:56,528 --> 02:00:57,068
Oh, man.

1613
02:00:58,048 --> 02:00:59,968
He's the most famous economist.

1614
02:01:00,188 --> 02:01:02,128
Plucky used to be a central banker.

1615
02:01:02,268 --> 02:01:03,708
We should start calling him Matt O'Dell.

1616
02:01:04,028 --> 02:01:04,948
That's Matt O'Dell.

1617
02:01:05,088 --> 02:01:08,348
That's Matt O'Dell's cousin, Plucky.

1618
02:01:08,788 --> 02:01:09,268
Plucky.

1619
02:01:09,408 --> 02:01:10,668
Plucky's cousin, Matt O'Dell.

1620
02:01:10,768 --> 02:01:12,868
Plucky looks like this because Matt O'Dell.

1621
02:01:13,648 --> 02:01:15,768
Yeah, it's not Plucky's fault, that's for sure.

1622
02:01:15,768 --> 02:01:17,568
It's fake shit bars.

1623
02:01:17,568 --> 02:01:24,768
he ate fake shit and uh that's happened to him so yeah that's our that's that's what's going on

1624
02:01:24,768 --> 02:01:31,068
and we've kind of gone stir crazy and mad and we're in this house and uh freezing cold and um

1625
02:01:31,068 --> 02:01:35,908
but out of spite for my european friends i'm going to like keep it cold i'm gonna just

1626
02:01:35,908 --> 02:01:41,708
get a down jacket and some boots and i'm gonna well i'll tell you a funny story

1627
02:01:42,448 --> 02:01:42,808
Uh-oh.

1628
02:01:43,048 --> 02:01:47,568
So, you know, Max and Stacey, we met in the south of France in 2003.

1629
02:01:47,948 --> 02:01:48,808
Oh, yes.

1630
02:01:48,828 --> 02:01:50,468
And that was shortly thereafter.

1631
02:01:50,608 --> 02:01:52,048
They had one of these huge heat.

1632
02:01:52,308 --> 02:01:53,508
That was 2003.

1633
02:01:53,788 --> 02:01:54,228
2003.

1634
02:01:54,228 --> 02:01:56,708
They had a heat episode.

1635
02:01:56,888 --> 02:01:58,308
Thousands of French people died.

1636
02:01:58,668 --> 02:02:00,748
30,000 French people died that summer.

1637
02:02:00,928 --> 02:02:01,188
Right.

1638
02:02:01,388 --> 02:02:01,888
In 2003.

1639
02:02:02,408 --> 02:02:03,668
We had just met.

1640
02:02:04,128 --> 02:02:10,808
And so for a date, you know, I took Stacey to a store called Picard, which is a French

1641
02:02:10,808 --> 02:02:11,048
store.

1642
02:02:11,048 --> 02:02:12,968
they only sell frozen food.

1643
02:02:13,448 --> 02:02:15,828
So it's a store that's full of freezers.

1644
02:02:16,068 --> 02:02:16,188
Yeah.

1645
02:02:16,468 --> 02:02:17,228
Open freezers.

1646
02:02:17,388 --> 02:02:20,188
So I said, I'm going to take you to a place you're going to love, this place.

1647
02:02:20,828 --> 02:02:25,708
And we went into this Picard and just wandered, you know, for a half hour, 45 minutes to get

1648
02:02:25,708 --> 02:02:27,948
some of this cool air, you know, opening up.

1649
02:02:28,128 --> 02:02:29,568
It's like, oh, look at this frozen fish.

1650
02:02:29,608 --> 02:02:30,648
It's taking in the cool air.

1651
02:02:32,168 --> 02:02:32,568
Right.

1652
02:02:33,568 --> 02:02:38,948
So that was like the first time a major heat storm hit France in modern times and just

1653
02:02:38,948 --> 02:02:40,068
wiped huge people out.

1654
02:02:40,068 --> 02:02:44,988
But that didn't inform them that maybe they should improve their air conditioning or get the AC.

1655
02:02:45,508 --> 02:02:46,368
That didn't that didn't change.

1656
02:02:46,548 --> 02:02:48,068
And look, we were sensible Americans.

1657
02:02:48,588 --> 02:02:51,468
And where do we go to the place with the freezers?

1658
02:02:51,688 --> 02:02:51,868
Yeah.

1659
02:02:51,928 --> 02:02:52,648
Like like.

1660
02:02:52,768 --> 02:02:53,928
So we went and got cold.

1661
02:02:54,028 --> 02:02:54,308
Right.

1662
02:02:54,468 --> 02:02:57,608
So it was actually cold in there.

1663
02:02:57,868 --> 02:02:59,428
So I don't know.

1664
02:02:59,508 --> 02:03:00,108
I don't know.

1665
02:03:00,628 --> 02:03:00,988
Yeah.

1666
02:03:00,988 --> 02:03:02,588
But it's all Matt O'Dell's fault.

1667
02:03:02,588 --> 02:03:09,788
I mean, pretty much the heat wave is his fault, too, because you could you can make that argument, you know, that.

1668
02:03:10,068 --> 02:03:12,768
that it's like that butterfly flap his wings.

1669
02:03:13,188 --> 02:03:14,768
And that's what Matt O'Dell did

1670
02:03:14,768 --> 02:03:18,288
by abandoning his Twitter handle.

1671
02:03:19,348 --> 02:03:21,128
And, you know, that's,

1672
02:03:21,868 --> 02:03:24,548
he needs to start thinking about these sort of consequences.

1673
02:03:25,068 --> 02:03:26,908
That brief moment in his brain when he said,

1674
02:03:26,968 --> 02:03:28,288
you know, I'll just walk away from Twitter.

1675
02:03:28,408 --> 02:03:30,688
That was the wings of that particular butterfly

1676
02:03:30,688 --> 02:03:33,068
setting in motion the cosmic synchronicity

1677
02:03:33,068 --> 02:03:35,668
that resulted in the memes of Bitcoin dying

1678
02:03:35,668 --> 02:03:38,108
and gave rise to the suit coiners.

1679
02:03:38,108 --> 02:03:41,308
So he was responsible for the very thing he's critical of.

1680
02:03:41,468 --> 02:03:43,548
He says, oh, those suit coiners are worthless.

1681
02:03:43,908 --> 02:03:44,568
Well, you know what?

1682
02:03:44,908 --> 02:03:48,208
They got traction because you left Twitter, right?

1683
02:03:48,368 --> 02:03:49,868
So, you know, look in the mirror.

1684
02:03:50,288 --> 02:03:52,288
You know, this is what's going on here.

1685
02:03:52,468 --> 02:03:53,248
You are the butterfly.

1686
02:03:54,148 --> 02:03:55,448
You are the butterfly, Matt.

1687
02:03:56,048 --> 02:03:59,588
If we go by the multiverse theory, do you think there's an alternate pathway,

1688
02:03:59,688 --> 02:04:02,568
the other side of that butterfly's wings where he didn't leave

1689
02:04:02,568 --> 02:04:04,648
and we're actually already hyper-Bitcoinized?

1690
02:04:04,648 --> 02:04:05,868
And that is the perfect world.

1691
02:04:05,868 --> 02:04:07,868
He coins at $10 million right now.

1692
02:04:07,868 --> 02:04:10,128
$10 million. There's total Bitcoin adoption.

1693
02:04:10,428 --> 02:04:11,808
Yeah. But that's another

1694
02:04:11,808 --> 02:04:13,728
shirt to make. You are the

1695
02:04:13,728 --> 02:04:14,488
butterfly, Matt.

1696
02:04:15,388 --> 02:04:17,228
You are the butterfly, Matt O'Dell.

1697
02:04:17,528 --> 02:04:19,428
Matt O'Dell, butterfly bars.

1698
02:04:19,668 --> 02:04:21,528
Next. You know, they're

1699
02:04:21,528 --> 02:04:23,528
very, very, very thin pieces

1700
02:04:23,528 --> 02:04:25,528
of chocolate. But they're kind of nice.

1701
02:04:25,948 --> 02:04:27,088
You know, they're like a little crispy.

1702
02:04:27,768 --> 02:04:29,328
Yeah. With a hurricane,

1703
02:04:29,508 --> 02:04:31,588
a whirlwind, a tornado at the end.

1704
02:04:31,728 --> 02:04:33,388
Yeah. And his little butterfly wings.

1705
02:04:33,728 --> 02:04:35,528
That's beautiful, man. I think we should work on that.

1706
02:04:35,528 --> 02:04:37,468
Anyway. Oh, I think maybe we're fine.

1707
02:04:37,468 --> 02:04:38,828
Really genuinely go.

1708
02:04:39,068 --> 02:04:39,208
Okay.

1709
02:04:39,948 --> 02:04:41,588
Stacey, I'm kind of, okay.

1710
02:04:42,028 --> 02:04:44,788
And ending live stream now.

1711
02:04:51,708 --> 02:04:56,548
And that's a wrap on this Bitcoin Talk episode of The Bitcoin Podcast.

1712
02:04:57,208 --> 02:05:01,148
Remember to subscribe to this podcast wherever you're watching or listening

1713
02:05:01,148 --> 02:05:05,448
and share it with your friends, family, and strangers on the internet.

1714
02:05:05,448 --> 02:05:12,148
Find me on Noster at primal.net slash Walker and this podcast at primal.net slash Titcoin.

1715
02:05:12,588 --> 02:05:20,568
On X, YouTube, and Rumble, just search at Walker America and find this podcast on X and Instagram at Titcoin Podcast.

1716
02:05:21,308 --> 02:05:23,548
Head to the show notes to grab sponsor links.

1717
02:05:23,668 --> 02:05:28,368
Head to substack.com slash at Walker America to get episodes emailed to you.

1718
02:05:28,568 --> 02:05:32,148
And head to bitcoinpodcast.net for everything else.

1719
02:05:32,148 --> 02:05:36,268
Bitcoin is scarce, but podcasts are abundant.

1720
02:05:36,848 --> 02:05:41,608
So thank you for spending your scarce time listening to The Bitcoin Podcast.

1721
02:05:42,508 --> 02:05:44,928
Until next time, stay free.