1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:06,120 All right, guys, for those on just joining us, that is going to be an interesting conversation. 2 00:00:06,420 --> 00:00:08,940 Join with Anhern, right? 3 00:00:09,040 --> 00:00:09,380 Anhern. 4 00:00:09,700 --> 00:00:13,060 Anyways, we're going to be talking about the Bible and anarchy. 5 00:00:13,480 --> 00:00:15,720 It's inspired on a post made by Lesserin. 6 00:00:15,840 --> 00:00:19,780 I invited her and the Beeb on the podcast as well, waiting to schedule that. 7 00:00:19,780 --> 00:00:26,260 But in this case, Anhern's going to share his point of view of why he thinks the Bible is one of the most anarchist texts out there. 8 00:00:26,400 --> 00:00:27,960 And he's an Orthodox Christian. 9 00:00:27,960 --> 00:00:34,300 So I would also like to get into the comparison between different, I guess, branches of Christianity. 10 00:00:34,600 --> 00:00:35,780 So it's going to be an interesting conversation. 11 00:00:36,160 --> 00:00:38,560 I'm on, let's say, my own path of spirituality. 12 00:00:39,020 --> 00:00:43,020 Something I have postponed for some time, but I'm getting more and more interested in it. 13 00:00:43,140 --> 00:00:43,680 So without ado. 14 00:00:43,880 --> 00:00:46,100 Okay, so I'll be reading the text while I was listening. 15 00:00:46,280 --> 00:00:47,540 I'll be reading the text. 16 00:00:47,860 --> 00:00:50,300 Oh, because Anand is going to be using text-to-speech. 17 00:00:50,340 --> 00:00:50,580 Oh, no. 18 00:00:50,660 --> 00:00:54,020 We were originally going to use text-to-speech, but we had problems with the audios. 19 00:00:54,020 --> 00:01:00,080 I'm going to be asking questions and he's going to be typing out his responses and I'll be reading them out. 20 00:01:00,440 --> 00:01:03,260 So Anhearn is saying, hello world, Anastar. 21 00:01:03,400 --> 00:01:06,280 I go by Anhearn, but that's of course not my real name. 22 00:01:06,480 --> 00:01:09,580 And yeah, he wants to keep his real identity separate. 23 00:01:09,840 --> 00:01:10,440 So let's begin. 24 00:01:10,600 --> 00:01:15,240 If you guys have any questions, feel free to ask in the chat. 25 00:01:15,240 --> 00:01:26,380 Okay, without ado, Unurn, can you give us a brief summary about your religious journey and how you got to Orthodox Christianity? 26 00:01:26,640 --> 00:01:27,140 Of course. 27 00:01:27,900 --> 00:01:32,860 I just grew up in Britain, where religion was seen as something for weirdos and old people. 28 00:01:33,080 --> 00:01:36,120 In my community, Christianity was viewed as superstition. 29 00:01:36,120 --> 00:01:43,600 You know, it wasn't something that most people care about or thought or thought about. 30 00:01:45,240 --> 00:01:48,200 nobody I knew was religious 31 00:01:48,200 --> 00:01:50,800 I didn't arrive at atheism through careful thought 32 00:01:50,800 --> 00:01:51,800 it was just the default 33 00:01:51,800 --> 00:01:53,640 okay so default atheism 34 00:01:53,640 --> 00:01:56,100 myself as well 35 00:01:56,100 --> 00:01:58,720 I mean I grew up as a Roman Catholic 36 00:01:58,720 --> 00:02:00,980 and by the time 37 00:02:00,980 --> 00:02:01,900 I was in high school 38 00:02:01,900 --> 00:02:03,920 I considered myself an atheist 39 00:02:03,920 --> 00:02:06,700 so I guess yeah similar thing 40 00:02:06,700 --> 00:02:08,700 it seems to be something that's happening around 41 00:02:08,700 --> 00:02:10,040 the western world by default 42 00:02:10,040 --> 00:02:12,100 I agree there 43 00:02:12,100 --> 00:02:14,060 and then how did you start slowly 44 00:02:14,060 --> 00:02:20,340 transitioning towards religion and specifically Orthodox Christianity. 45 00:02:20,660 --> 00:02:24,480 Ooh, well, this is going to sound crazy, but the internet converted me. 46 00:02:24,920 --> 00:02:25,260 How so? 47 00:02:25,520 --> 00:02:30,040 I was the obnoxious redder making fun of sky daddy believers. 48 00:02:30,480 --> 00:02:35,020 Then someone called me out quite harshly for mocking things I knew nothing about. 49 00:02:35,500 --> 00:02:36,880 Yeah, humans tend to do that, right? 50 00:02:37,880 --> 00:02:39,500 The Dunning-Kruger effect, I guess. 51 00:02:39,500 --> 00:02:41,760 So I started actually, I know, yeah. 52 00:02:41,760 --> 00:02:45,860 So I started actually listening to religious arguments initially to laugh at them. 53 00:02:45,980 --> 00:02:47,440 But then something happened. 54 00:02:47,740 --> 00:02:49,200 The arguments started making sense. 55 00:02:49,480 --> 00:02:51,960 The cosmological argument clicked for me. 56 00:02:52,140 --> 00:02:54,620 First, I thought it was a brain dead simple. 57 00:02:54,840 --> 00:02:55,820 It was brain dead simple. 58 00:02:56,180 --> 00:03:00,960 But I couldn't break it into, I couldn't break it no matter how much I tried to. 59 00:03:01,340 --> 00:03:09,720 Which, any arguments in particular, like something that was like, yeah, this argument is the one that made me go, okay, maybe there is a God. 60 00:03:09,720 --> 00:03:11,200 Or there totally is a God. 61 00:03:11,200 --> 00:03:18,040 oh here's and also he responds then the moral argument got to me too uh we're just me computers 62 00:03:18,040 --> 00:03:23,820 why does enter i kept saying suffering is bad but according to whom my neurons evolution couldn't 63 00:03:23,820 --> 00:03:30,740 couldn't have programmed me differently it felt circular and and empty yeah i agree and also i i've 64 00:03:30,740 --> 00:03:35,660 said it many times i don't think there's a thing as a true atheist like if you take out god from 65 00:03:35,660 --> 00:03:40,820 the equation, you just find something else to be your God, whether it's science, right? The state 66 00:03:40,820 --> 00:03:47,440 or things of the like, and then A is literally code. Where does information come from? And 67 00:03:47,440 --> 00:03:54,140 consciousness, that mess, message, I guess, materialism couldn't explain it. Saying it's 68 00:03:54,140 --> 00:03:59,660 just neurons is like answering what is software with electricity and circuits, you know, so it 69 00:03:59,660 --> 00:04:04,900 basically makes no sense. And even to this day, there's a lot of things that science cannot 70 00:04:04,900 --> 00:04:09,780 explain that also brings up another question or argument right like because something doesn't have 71 00:04:09,780 --> 00:04:13,540 an explanation doesn't mean you have the default to it was god you know what i mean so that's 72 00:04:13,540 --> 00:04:19,380 something that uh i see a lot in the i guess you say atheist that was definitely one of my thoughts 73 00:04:19,380 --> 00:04:24,500 back then this is right of course and uh that's why it takes years to actually convert 74 00:04:25,780 --> 00:04:32,260 yeah it's a definitely a rabbit hole so basically from what i understood the internet helped convert 75 00:04:32,260 --> 00:04:36,420 you because you started asking questions you weren't just satisfied with uh hearing the default 76 00:04:36,420 --> 00:04:45,380 arguments uh but but then why orthodox christianity and not roman catholic or um protestantism uh 77 00:04:45,380 --> 00:04:52,980 protestantism gave us sola scriptura table alone look what happened 30 000 denominations all 78 00:04:52,980 --> 00:04:58,420 claiming scripture all contradicting each other without tradition the church fathers everyone 79 00:04:58,420 --> 00:05:03,800 becomes their own pope. The Bible didn't fall from heaven as a book. The church compiled it. 80 00:05:03,920 --> 00:05:08,780 You can't have scripture without tradition. You're going to have to educate me on this because I have 81 00:05:08,780 --> 00:05:14,020 not looked deeply into the profound differences between the different branches. So for example, 82 00:05:14,380 --> 00:05:19,460 in Catholicism, because that's the most, I guess that's the biggest branch, definitely in Mexico. 83 00:05:20,060 --> 00:05:24,640 How does that differ from Orthodox Christianity? Oh, interesting response. 84 00:05:24,640 --> 00:05:31,760 neutralization okay so yeah i i can you explain that exactly because so i know for uh in and uh 85 00:05:31,760 --> 00:05:36,000 former roman catholics there's a pope right who's in the vatican so i guess like you could say that's 86 00:05:36,000 --> 00:05:42,640 the the leader let's see about orthodox christianity if responses orthodox christians 87 00:05:42,640 --> 00:05:49,440 don't just follow a single leader like the pope follow the wisdom of those who are there before us 88 00:05:49,440 --> 00:05:54,560 those who learned from Christ and those who learned from them, the church fathers. 89 00:05:54,560 --> 00:05:55,040 Interesting. 90 00:05:55,280 --> 00:05:58,880 Wouldn't that give also way to other branches? 91 00:05:59,360 --> 00:06:04,720 Because eventually down the line, everyone has their own interpretation over time. 92 00:06:04,840 --> 00:06:09,120 Whether we go for good intentions, bad intentions, just random chance. 93 00:06:09,440 --> 00:06:10,360 Isn't that something that happens? 94 00:06:11,300 --> 00:06:15,820 Orthodox keeps the same tradition that has been followed for thousands of years. 95 00:06:16,940 --> 00:06:18,900 Okay, so there's like a base code, you could say. 96 00:06:18,900 --> 00:06:24,020 you know, like, I guess like Bitcoin, it's the one branch of Christianity that hasn't changed. 97 00:06:24,280 --> 00:06:30,940 Yes, I guess. Interesting. So it's a, as a decentralized, could you explain that a bit 98 00:06:30,940 --> 00:06:38,080 further? Like what traditions, is there anything else that also separates it from Roman Catholicism? 99 00:06:38,160 --> 00:06:43,340 So decentralization and tradition of the big ones, in my opinion, like, again, traditions, 100 00:06:43,340 --> 00:06:49,640 what exactly because i i i got the decentralization arts different the thought leaders 101 00:06:49,640 --> 00:06:57,460 are all based on those follow jesus okay so it says divine lethargy lethargy is practiced 102 00:06:57,460 --> 00:07:01,780 the exact same way it was 2 000 years ago okay so it's all i guess you could say it's a more 103 00:07:01,780 --> 00:07:08,200 conservative in in nature that we're saying basically because yeah again i'm not very uh 104 00:07:08,200 --> 00:07:11,080 religious on the journeys, 105 00:07:11,340 --> 00:07:13,220 but I do know the Pope can perhaps 106 00:07:13,220 --> 00:07:15,020 recommend, maybe not dictate 107 00:07:15,020 --> 00:07:17,020 the law, but give his recommendations or 108 00:07:17,020 --> 00:07:18,980 point of view on what to do in certain 109 00:07:18,980 --> 00:07:20,520 situations, and perhaps 110 00:07:20,520 --> 00:07:23,060 see the way 111 00:07:23,060 --> 00:07:25,040 the church should think about things, 112 00:07:25,680 --> 00:07:27,000 I believe. And I think I saw 113 00:07:27,000 --> 00:07:28,980 it with the previous Popes. Yeah, they've been 114 00:07:28,980 --> 00:07:30,240 doing some of those things. 115 00:07:30,960 --> 00:07:32,720 So, I have no idea how to pronounce that. 116 00:07:32,840 --> 00:07:34,700 Okay, so he responds that, 117 00:07:34,700 --> 00:07:36,700 indeed, we have multiple autocephalus, 118 00:07:36,700 --> 00:07:39,100 So cephalus, essentially patriarchy. 119 00:07:40,160 --> 00:07:40,600 Okay. 120 00:07:41,020 --> 00:07:44,820 I used to think that the Orthodox Church also has like its own Pope. 121 00:07:45,080 --> 00:07:50,040 You know, he would even meet with the Catholic Pope. 122 00:07:50,280 --> 00:07:50,580 You don't. 123 00:07:50,680 --> 00:07:50,940 Okay. 124 00:07:51,060 --> 00:07:51,460 That's weird. 125 00:07:51,580 --> 00:07:52,820 I have no idea why I have that in my mind. 126 00:07:53,040 --> 00:07:53,300 Interesting. 127 00:07:53,680 --> 00:07:53,860 Okay. 128 00:07:54,000 --> 00:07:55,220 So, oh, that's interesting. 129 00:07:55,220 --> 00:07:57,860 Christians are made through councils and consensus. 130 00:07:58,600 --> 00:08:00,280 There isn't one central authority. 131 00:08:00,660 --> 00:08:03,560 Every parish is slightly different. 132 00:08:03,800 --> 00:08:05,560 Actually sounds interesting. 133 00:08:05,560 --> 00:08:10,600 I'm gonna have to look more into this. Okay, that's really that's really interesting. I also want to share again 134 00:08:10,600 --> 00:08:15,880 This was all inspired off of a post made by Lesserin. I'm gonna talk about 135 00:08:18,120 --> 00:08:19,800 I want to start 136 00:08:19,800 --> 00:08:26,120 With that I I did invite her and the beeve who were the main people talking in this in this thread 137 00:08:26,520 --> 00:08:30,920 Hopefully they'll be they'll come on the podcast and uh, okay, so here's what lesser and 138 00:08:30,920 --> 00:08:33,140 originally posted on Noster. 139 00:08:34,480 --> 00:08:35,500 Anarchists know 140 00:08:35,500 --> 00:08:37,460 that they can destroy civilization 141 00:08:37,460 --> 00:08:39,780 and set the world on fire 142 00:08:39,780 --> 00:08:41,700 and then create order 143 00:08:41,700 --> 00:08:43,820 out of chaos, just like God 144 00:08:43,820 --> 00:08:45,680 did. And then that evolved into a 145 00:08:45,680 --> 00:08:47,300 more deeper conversation. We'll get into that later. 146 00:08:47,600 --> 00:08:49,860 I guess the first question out of there... 147 00:08:49,860 --> 00:08:51,840 Oh, wait. Okay, first I'll read out your response. 148 00:08:52,080 --> 00:08:53,740 Okay, you agree with her, but... 149 00:08:53,740 --> 00:08:55,800 Because we're going to get... 150 00:08:55,800 --> 00:08:57,780 I think one of the first good questions would be 151 00:08:57,780 --> 00:08:59,680 because you made a comment. You believe 152 00:08:59,680 --> 00:09:06,880 that the Bible is one of the most anarchist books out there. So I want to get into that first before 153 00:09:06,880 --> 00:09:13,440 getting deeper into this post. Okay, so again, Einherr's response was, I agree with her, but you 154 00:09:13,440 --> 00:09:19,800 know, the devil is in the details. All right. So Einherr also responds that I believe the Bible is 155 00:09:19,800 --> 00:09:25,100 the most anarchist and pro-decentralization book ever written. We Orthodox believe in the wisdom 156 00:09:25,100 --> 00:09:30,280 of the church fathers, but primarily in decentralization, the wisdom within. The only 157 00:09:30,280 --> 00:09:35,620 true leader is the Lord. We reject earthly leaders, but we're also told to act as Jesus would. 158 00:09:36,400 --> 00:09:41,780 Okay. So basically, I can think a good follow-up question here is, what is anarchy exactly? Because 159 00:09:41,780 --> 00:09:46,420 a lot of people are going to think it's basically chaos. For those listening, I guess, yeah, 160 00:09:46,560 --> 00:09:52,480 I might be biased, but I guess you could say I identify as an anarcho-capitalist, 161 00:09:52,480 --> 00:10:12,115 free marketeer or libertarian You can I guess any of those definitions kind of do I guess Anarchy is not chaos It choosing to live freely Anarchism isn against all hierarchy It against hierarchy that gives itself moral authority The Lord is the only one who can pass divine judgment on me not a government 162 00:10:12,335 --> 00:10:13,435 And hierarchy isn't bad. 163 00:10:13,635 --> 00:10:16,275 First tyrannical hierarchy, that's impossible to escape from. 164 00:10:16,735 --> 00:10:17,535 That's what's bad. 165 00:10:18,235 --> 00:10:21,755 Yeah, so I think here's another thing that was going on in the thread. 166 00:10:21,935 --> 00:10:26,095 It seems that people have also have difficulty defining what the state is. 167 00:10:26,095 --> 00:10:27,475 Like, what is the state? 168 00:10:27,475 --> 00:10:29,415 What is government? 169 00:10:29,675 --> 00:10:37,495 Okay, so the state is a tyrannical, unelected group of people who think they can rule over us and control everything we can and cannot do. 170 00:10:37,735 --> 00:10:38,335 Yeah, I agree. 171 00:10:38,475 --> 00:10:40,395 It's a monopoly on violence, in my opinion. 172 00:10:40,815 --> 00:10:42,335 So 1 Samuel 8. 173 00:10:42,535 --> 00:10:48,275 Israel demanded a king, and God warned them about the incoming tyranny. 174 00:10:48,635 --> 00:10:53,115 This is God explicitly warning against earthly kings and governments. 175 00:10:53,455 --> 00:10:55,515 God wants Ancapistan. 176 00:10:55,515 --> 00:10:57,255 It's right there in the scripture. 177 00:10:57,475 --> 00:10:59,835 I did come across this. 178 00:11:01,035 --> 00:11:03,575 I've been reading parts of the Bible over the years. 179 00:11:04,335 --> 00:11:06,215 And reading about that, I was like, oh, my God. 180 00:11:06,335 --> 00:11:10,135 If I'm not mistaken, that's when the Jews left Egypt. 181 00:11:10,135 --> 00:11:12,435 And they've been wandering for years in the desert. 182 00:11:12,895 --> 00:11:15,875 Or eventually, they eventually reached the Holy Land. 183 00:11:17,155 --> 00:11:20,595 And they asked, I have to do so much more reading. 184 00:11:21,055 --> 00:11:23,175 It was Moses, you know, who left him out. 185 00:11:23,255 --> 00:11:23,975 Was he the one? 186 00:11:24,375 --> 00:11:26,035 And then they were asking him for a king. 187 00:11:27,475 --> 00:11:37,935 And wasn't he also saying, oh, guys, you know, this could devolve into madness or what most people would call anarchy or I would say tyranny, right? 188 00:11:38,475 --> 00:11:39,235 But yes. 189 00:11:39,435 --> 00:11:41,375 Yeah, this was after Moses, but correct. 190 00:11:41,495 --> 00:11:42,355 Okay, after Moses. 191 00:11:42,715 --> 00:11:43,455 Yes, yes. 192 00:11:43,535 --> 00:11:45,575 I was like, God, this is super anarchy. 193 00:11:45,715 --> 00:11:46,715 It's in the Old Testament. 194 00:11:47,035 --> 00:11:51,575 So that was an interesting observation to me. 195 00:11:51,835 --> 00:11:53,115 Okay, how can I follow this up? 196 00:11:53,115 --> 00:12:00,195 I think another big comment here is the strong will always overtake the weak. 197 00:12:00,515 --> 00:12:06,795 Because let's be honest, there's very few people who are anarchists, 198 00:12:07,575 --> 00:12:11,375 or follow this way of thinking and are willing to actually implement it, 199 00:12:11,375 --> 00:12:14,375 like agorists, or how you pronounce it. 200 00:12:15,415 --> 00:12:16,395 Therefore, it's a small group. 201 00:12:16,655 --> 00:12:20,655 And you have a bunch of these peaceful people who are willing to use violence, 202 00:12:20,655 --> 00:12:21,935 it's not necessary, but peaceful. 203 00:12:23,395 --> 00:12:24,675 They can be overtaken 204 00:12:24,675 --> 00:12:26,095 by a larger group. 205 00:12:26,415 --> 00:12:28,515 So if you can get your Encapistan, 206 00:12:28,695 --> 00:12:30,135 your little region of 207 00:12:30,135 --> 00:12:32,375 anarchic people cooperating, 208 00:12:32,595 --> 00:12:34,255 it would probably be a short-lived, 209 00:12:34,695 --> 00:12:36,455 you can say it that way, because 210 00:12:36,455 --> 00:12:38,975 the neighboring states 211 00:12:38,975 --> 00:12:40,695 will see it easy 212 00:12:40,695 --> 00:12:42,495 and ripe for the taking, you know what I mean? 213 00:12:43,455 --> 00:12:44,755 That's one argument as to 214 00:12:44,755 --> 00:12:46,595 why anarchy is perhaps, you know, 215 00:12:46,595 --> 00:12:48,635 people will call a utopia or 216 00:12:48,635 --> 00:12:49,295 an illusion 217 00:12:49,295 --> 00:12:56,215 or doctrine sure okay so i guess the question there would be even if it's uh mentioned in a 218 00:12:56,215 --> 00:13:00,615 way in the bible as to like oppose where it's like okay maybe you don't want a king because 219 00:13:00,615 --> 00:13:07,355 here are the problems can anarchy and kapistan i guess that's the question okay so most wars are 220 00:13:07,355 --> 00:13:12,235 caused by states armed communities are hard to invade violence and militia and armed population 221 00:13:12,235 --> 00:13:20,015 is a deterrent but also in orthodox and kapistan why would we be worth invading we're not hoarding 222 00:13:20,015 --> 00:13:26,795 resources or threatening neighbors yeah i think the decentralization definitely makes it harder to 223 00:13:26,795 --> 00:13:31,875 like cut off the head because there's no head i guess a lot of little heads if you include 224 00:13:31,875 --> 00:13:37,555 communities i do that would definitely make it harder true and honest okay so one interesting 225 00:13:37,555 --> 00:13:42,575 common first i'll read your response and then i'll continue polycentric law works evil iceland 226 00:13:42,575 --> 00:13:47,195 had it for centuries but arbitration works today you don't need a monopoly on law enforcement 227 00:13:47,195 --> 00:13:52,455 competing private security firms and arbitration companies would create better justice than our 228 00:13:52,455 --> 00:13:57,415 current system and orthodox communities in encapistan would defer to church teaching for 229 00:13:57,415 --> 00:14:03,775 most things yeah i think another good comment here is uh correct me if i'm wrong i believe common law 230 00:14:03,775 --> 00:14:09,135 was actually, obviously comes from England, UK. 231 00:14:09,875 --> 00:14:13,235 And it was private to begin with. 232 00:14:13,375 --> 00:14:14,955 The state did not create common law. 233 00:14:15,795 --> 00:14:19,255 Took over, but it was created in a decentralized fashion, 234 00:14:19,355 --> 00:14:21,835 a way to negotiate disputes. 235 00:14:22,435 --> 00:14:23,215 So that's interesting. 236 00:14:23,395 --> 00:14:25,875 People working in their own best interests 237 00:14:25,875 --> 00:14:28,375 without coercion, it had common law. 238 00:14:28,375 --> 00:14:32,775 But the state, in this case, England or Great Britain, 239 00:14:32,775 --> 00:14:34,315 I know there's a different way. 240 00:14:34,415 --> 00:14:35,315 England is one part. 241 00:14:35,395 --> 00:14:38,135 There's England, Scotland, and I guess Northern Ireland. 242 00:14:39,295 --> 00:14:39,835 Great Britain. 243 00:14:41,175 --> 00:14:43,315 There's a differentiation there. 244 00:14:43,415 --> 00:14:44,995 So forgive me if I've used the wrong term. 245 00:14:45,095 --> 00:14:47,935 But basically, common law is attributed mostly to Great Britain. 246 00:14:50,875 --> 00:14:57,075 When the state, when it was actually individuals working and cooperating. 247 00:14:57,475 --> 00:15:01,835 One comment I want to do also is, I think Ancapistan. 248 00:15:01,835 --> 00:15:06,995 is actually possible, more possible now than in the past. 249 00:15:07,075 --> 00:15:08,395 And that's things to technology, 250 00:15:08,955 --> 00:15:11,635 things like Bitcoin and now Nostra communication. 251 00:15:12,135 --> 00:15:16,895 Back then, perhaps creating the state was a more viable solution, 252 00:15:17,275 --> 00:15:18,255 at least in the mainland. 253 00:15:18,255 --> 00:15:21,255 The continent, like Iceland, is isolated 254 00:15:21,255 --> 00:15:24,575 and they can do their own things without being really bothered. 255 00:15:25,695 --> 00:15:28,495 I think now with technology, 256 00:15:28,495 --> 00:15:34,155 it becomes much more feasible to do so and i don't know if you've heard of i forgot i can't 257 00:15:34,155 --> 00:15:39,535 pronounce his name but the guy who wrote a book it's called the network state that's an interesting 258 00:15:39,535 --> 00:15:48,995 thesis as well basically creating your community or anarchic communities online um or a nation you 259 00:15:48,995 --> 00:15:57,075 want to call it that online and then maybe putting capital enough to eventually get land or who knows 260 00:15:57,075 --> 00:16:00,395 or maybe some type of community in the sea. 261 00:16:00,575 --> 00:16:00,975 You know what I mean? 262 00:16:01,315 --> 00:16:05,635 So I think nowadays it's more possible than ever 263 00:16:05,635 --> 00:16:07,775 and not the other way around. 264 00:16:08,015 --> 00:16:09,895 So it says Bitcoin, Anhern responds, 265 00:16:10,135 --> 00:16:12,935 Bitcoin, Noster, Orthodoxy, and Cap Philosophy. 266 00:16:12,935 --> 00:16:15,015 They all converge on the same principles. 267 00:16:15,475 --> 00:16:17,035 Centralization, voluntary interaction, 268 00:16:17,335 --> 00:16:20,375 rejection of coercive authority, truth over lies. 269 00:16:20,575 --> 00:16:22,235 That's actually, that's a good combo, right? 270 00:16:22,335 --> 00:16:23,595 You know, Bitcoin, it's money. 271 00:16:23,835 --> 00:16:24,915 Noster, communication. 272 00:16:25,155 --> 00:16:25,975 We need that, we're humans. 273 00:16:25,975 --> 00:16:33,115 orthodoxy you need i mean not you need but humans i would say need to have a spiritual thing something 274 00:16:33,115 --> 00:16:37,815 that fills that gap it's just natural in humans so orthodoxy fills i would say fantastically from 275 00:16:37,815 --> 00:16:43,555 what i'm understanding obviously ancap philosophy which uh under capitalism you know basically 276 00:16:43,555 --> 00:16:48,255 teaches you how to how humans can interact using the free market in a peaceful way to maximize 277 00:16:48,255 --> 00:16:54,675 uh wealth for everyone i think that's actually a very good combo and anyways they're all 278 00:16:54,675 --> 00:17:00,615 expressions of the same worldview in my opinion god is the only true authority and humans flourish 279 00:17:00,615 --> 00:17:08,155 when free from tyranny okay so my original question i guess you could say it was strong 280 00:17:08,155 --> 00:17:12,435 okay so the strong always overtake the weak how can the supposed weak or minority 281 00:17:12,435 --> 00:17:18,095 stand the chance have you got give you have you given this any thought like how could we 282 00:17:18,095 --> 00:17:26,555 kick off the encapistan how would this materialize in in the real world what would be the the the uh 283 00:17:27,555 --> 00:17:34,615 about the the steps the chain of events okay so you start small you start with your community 284 00:17:34,615 --> 00:17:44,675 create a parallel economy and parallel world where everyone is free then you're gonna scale 285 00:17:44,675 --> 00:17:46,635 from there, right? Yes, and I believe 286 00:17:46,635 --> 00:17:48,635 this is, I forgot all these 287 00:17:48,635 --> 00:17:50,315 foreigners' names I can't pronounce, and 288 00:17:50,315 --> 00:17:51,475 honestly, I forget the names. 289 00:17:52,415 --> 00:17:54,495 What used to be Czechoslovakia, 290 00:17:54,575 --> 00:17:56,635 there was a guy 291 00:17:56,635 --> 00:17:58,635 who I believe termed, 292 00:17:58,895 --> 00:18:00,095 who coined the term 293 00:18:00,095 --> 00:18:02,315 parallel economy, right? 294 00:18:02,755 --> 00:18:04,315 So even the Soviet Union 295 00:18:04,315 --> 00:18:06,155 or in the satellite states, 296 00:18:06,695 --> 00:18:07,835 there was 297 00:18:07,835 --> 00:18:10,215 resistance movement to 298 00:18:10,215 --> 00:18:12,135 what was perhaps one of the most 299 00:18:12,135 --> 00:18:12,975 authoritarian 300 00:18:12,975 --> 00:18:21,615 states out there in human history. So even in those conditions, economies were possible. 301 00:18:22,815 --> 00:18:28,015 Nowadays, in the Western world, despite, okay, despite we are losing our liberties and our 302 00:18:28,015 --> 00:18:31,775 freedoms, I still think it's a lot easier than they had it, you know, I mean, because of the 303 00:18:31,775 --> 00:18:36,395 tools we just mentioned, you know, and indeed, the thing is that you can't fix the world, you can fix 304 00:18:36,395 --> 00:18:41,615 yourself. And that helps get a small steps, you know, that's exactly what I was thinking, like, 305 00:18:41,615 --> 00:18:47,035 people want solutions now. They want things now. They want things to be better now. Like, 306 00:18:47,095 --> 00:18:51,535 I'm good. I want good things. What's the best way to do it? Through the state, right? Because they 307 00:18:51,535 --> 00:18:59,115 have a lot of power, more power than individuals do in the short term. But in the long term, 308 00:18:59,675 --> 00:19:07,155 who I think have like a good morals, stand by something, can create, exert change in the long 309 00:19:07,155 --> 00:19:11,195 term. So you have to have a long time horizon. You have to have a low time preference. So yeah, 310 00:19:11,195 --> 00:19:12,815 And Kappa Stan can't exist tomorrow. 311 00:19:12,975 --> 00:19:13,255 I agree. 312 00:19:13,415 --> 00:19:13,755 I agree. 313 00:19:14,095 --> 00:19:15,895 They have a point for those who argue against it. 314 00:19:16,295 --> 00:19:19,775 But I do believe that's something that can be done on the long term. 315 00:19:19,915 --> 00:19:23,815 So just like Anherne, I think the way to do this is you start small. 316 00:19:23,955 --> 00:19:26,215 You start with yourself, obviously, your family. 317 00:19:26,475 --> 00:19:27,195 Make a community. 318 00:19:27,535 --> 00:19:29,475 Isn't that something we always say in Bitcoin? 319 00:19:29,875 --> 00:19:34,655 Like friends of your local rancher, get secure meat there and start trading in the Bitcoin circular economy. 320 00:19:34,655 --> 00:19:36,595 You're creating a community if you start doing that. 321 00:19:37,175 --> 00:19:38,395 Perhaps we're more like-minded. 322 00:19:38,395 --> 00:19:44,595 and uh okay so and her has responded yeah 100 small communities strong families voluntary 323 00:19:44,595 --> 00:19:50,415 cooperation it's how humans live for most of history great great and kapistan you do you how 324 00:19:50,415 --> 00:19:56,455 do you how do you okay so i guess most people imagine kapistan as some some region on earth 325 00:19:56,455 --> 00:20:13,349 i guess the default by it having a border right i mean i guess the borders would be defined by the borders of the states around it if there are any but how do you exactly how would an encapistan look like to you the way i see it is it not necessarily a piece of land 326 00:20:13,349 --> 00:20:18,769 in a certain part of earth he has multiple small communities and stuff all over the world 327 00:20:18,769 --> 00:20:25,309 perhaps even living within the state within a state you know what i mean but uh how do you see 328 00:20:25,309 --> 00:20:30,529 it well you mentioned the network state and balaji there you go balaji was right in my opinion the 329 00:20:30,529 --> 00:20:38,669 internet allows us to have ancapistan without needing physical borders until you can buy land 330 00:20:38,669 --> 00:20:43,289 right because we we've actually we've been seeing that now in the real world it's like projects 331 00:20:43,289 --> 00:20:48,049 i don't know if people heard about for what are these they're uh free states no the free cities 332 00:20:48,049 --> 00:20:53,269 so there's multiple projects like these i know there's one in honduras or basically a group of 333 00:20:53,269 --> 00:21:00,389 entrepreneurs managed to negotiate something with the government and they started a city 334 00:21:00,389 --> 00:21:08,549 basically with special, I guess you could say privileges to work the economy. 335 00:21:08,549 --> 00:21:12,309 I think there's tax advantages and things that they have in this community. 336 00:21:12,589 --> 00:21:16,589 So they're creating basically a parallel economy within a state. 337 00:21:17,029 --> 00:21:17,949 So that's a very interesting. 338 00:21:18,389 --> 00:21:23,809 And even within states, I know there's free economic zones within countries. 339 00:21:24,029 --> 00:21:25,249 I know there's in Uruguay. 340 00:21:25,989 --> 00:21:29,429 I know there's a lot of countries that have these free economic zones where like it's more 341 00:21:29,429 --> 00:21:35,169 tax efficient there's more benefits for starting a business there so we're already seeing in the 342 00:21:35,169 --> 00:21:39,829 real world it's it's actually things like these are already kind of being implemented what belagi 343 00:21:39,829 --> 00:21:45,429 says in his book i don't see it as something that is too far-fetched you know um creating 344 00:21:45,429 --> 00:21:50,969 the network state i wouldn't call it a state but uh online and then eventually cooling capital to 345 00:21:50,969 --> 00:21:59,749 be able to purchase land somewhere and that being in a region um that is where people that 346 00:21:59,749 --> 00:22:05,309 share the same values can live in oh you completely agree yeah so again i guess we're preaching to 347 00:22:05,309 --> 00:22:10,429 the choir here right so but anyways i guess it's good we should like try to uh talk about 348 00:22:10,429 --> 00:22:15,089 the counter arguments a bit more from from the other side so you already kind of 349 00:22:15,089 --> 00:22:21,749 say what the state is the state is well my opinion it's basically a monopoly on violence 350 00:22:21,749 --> 00:22:26,109 but is the state inevitable or is the state necessary that's something we should we should 351 00:22:26,109 --> 00:22:33,809 also ask uh what do you think about that so on her response um good question no it's not necessary 352 00:22:33,809 --> 00:22:42,389 nor inevitable how so the state only came about because we stopped focusing as much on community 353 00:22:42,389 --> 00:22:48,629 well i guess it's also something that's part that's part of humanity you see it even now in 354 00:22:48,629 --> 00:22:52,869 something that i'm i've been kind of looking into for example the bitcoin core business 355 00:22:52,869 --> 00:22:58,829 people seem to want to look to leaders always and it makes sense you can't know everything and if 356 00:22:58,829 --> 00:23:02,729 you want to learn something new for example you look to someone who's a leader in that space 357 00:23:02,729 --> 00:23:07,570 perhaps someone who knows about what they're talking about experiencing it i guess humans 358 00:23:07,570 --> 00:23:09,989 try to go through the path of less resistance. 359 00:23:11,429 --> 00:23:14,229 And I think it's just, it's also in our state to have a leader, 360 00:23:14,409 --> 00:23:15,869 natural state or state of mind. 361 00:23:16,029 --> 00:23:19,329 In a group, you'll always, you will always kind of find it. 362 00:23:19,429 --> 00:23:21,549 I mean, even in Orthodox, from Christianity, from my understood, 363 00:23:21,769 --> 00:23:22,449 there are leaders. 364 00:23:22,709 --> 00:23:23,709 Well, it's decentralized. 365 00:23:24,009 --> 00:23:25,309 There are leaders nonetheless. 366 00:23:26,369 --> 00:23:29,469 So that's why I say, I kind of do tend to agree. 367 00:23:29,669 --> 00:23:33,570 It's the state is perhaps an inevitable in enough time. 368 00:23:33,570 --> 00:23:37,049 So even within God's people, God's people decided they wanted 369 00:23:37,049 --> 00:23:39,229 to have a state, a king and things 370 00:23:39,229 --> 00:23:41,089 of the likes. I don't know. My opinion is that it is 371 00:23:41,089 --> 00:23:42,609 kind of inevitable in 372 00:23:42,609 --> 00:23:45,029 humanity. I think there's ways 373 00:23:45,029 --> 00:23:45,609 around it. 374 00:23:46,969 --> 00:23:49,049 Oh, yeah. So your response was yes, but 375 00:23:49,049 --> 00:23:50,669 God rejected that belief. 376 00:23:51,649 --> 00:23:53,329 Hierarchy isn't bad. Force, tyrannical 377 00:23:53,329 --> 00:23:54,989 hierarchy. That's impossible to escape from. 378 00:23:55,070 --> 00:23:57,329 That's what's bad. Yeah. Yeah, definitely. 379 00:23:57,909 --> 00:23:58,769 Even if the 380 00:23:58,769 --> 00:24:01,209 initial rulers are benign, 381 00:24:01,329 --> 00:24:02,929 you have a good king, it's 382 00:24:02,929 --> 00:24:04,969 kind of inevitable to it. Eventually 383 00:24:04,969 --> 00:24:06,829 a bad apple will show up, right? 384 00:24:06,829 --> 00:24:12,509 and it devolves into tyranny and yeah i agree that that's something that eventually happens 385 00:24:12,509 --> 00:24:17,189 because one comment that lester and put there is like perhaps the focus should be on whether there 386 00:24:17,189 --> 00:24:21,989 should be more or less government because the state will always be there because another and i 387 00:24:21,989 --> 00:24:27,609 i wish she were here she were here to represent her own views i might be misrepresenting her 388 00:24:27,609 --> 00:24:35,169 but uh if the weak eventually become strong let's say anarchists become strong enough and uh 389 00:24:35,169 --> 00:24:40,469 they said the group leaders get together that can that eventually could turn into a state 390 00:24:40,469 --> 00:24:46,149 with time you corrupts and uh absolute power corrupts absolutely of course uh centralization 391 00:24:46,149 --> 00:24:52,309 decentral but but like we mentioned before as well things noster bitcoin orthodoxy in this case 392 00:24:52,309 --> 00:24:57,809 and having ancap value you know that uh that decentralization power i think makes it hard to 393 00:24:57,809 --> 00:25:03,209 for example lichenstein right oh okay so it's funny because people okay this is what anna is 394 00:25:03,209 --> 00:25:08,209 saying it's funny because people say that ancapistan will create tyrants or warlords we 395 00:25:08,209 --> 00:25:13,249 already have warlords we call them presidents and prime ministers the difference is we've been 396 00:25:13,249 --> 00:25:19,449 brainwashed to thinking their violence is legitimate yeah there you go so it's legitimized 397 00:25:19,449 --> 00:25:24,049 monopoly on violence that's what the state is and a lot of people draw their conclusions based on 398 00:25:24,049 --> 00:25:29,049 their current reality they can't think of something they can't think of a world of anarchy because 399 00:25:29,049 --> 00:25:30,009 There's never been one, right? 400 00:25:30,109 --> 00:25:32,109 They can't think first line of Bitcoin. 401 00:25:32,229 --> 00:25:35,449 No one imagined Bitcoin would be possible until it was. 402 00:25:36,409 --> 00:25:41,709 Just because Ancapistan hasn't existed yet doesn't mean we shouldn't strive to it. 403 00:25:42,069 --> 00:25:48,709 I'm of the idea that shoot for the stars because even if you fall short, you'll still get far. 404 00:25:48,969 --> 00:25:52,709 So I think morally, intellectually makes sense. 405 00:25:53,049 --> 00:25:54,229 It's not like socialism. 406 00:25:54,529 --> 00:25:58,489 I don't think Ancapistan or anarcho-capitalism sells you a utopia. 407 00:25:58,489 --> 00:26:05,469 It reaches a logical conclusion based on free market principles, individuals, voluntary cooperation. 408 00:26:06,329 --> 00:26:07,769 It starts from a moral point. 409 00:26:07,869 --> 00:26:10,449 It's a philosophy, you know, and that makes sense. 410 00:26:10,689 --> 00:26:13,989 In my point of view, anarcho-capitalism makes sense. 411 00:26:14,229 --> 00:26:15,789 And some people might call it extreme. 412 00:26:15,909 --> 00:26:23,109 And we should work towards that because even if we fall short, we would fall into a world with a small government. 413 00:26:23,429 --> 00:26:26,249 And I think a lot of people can agree with that. 414 00:26:26,249 --> 00:26:30,069 That would be a net benefit even if we don't get an encapistan. 415 00:26:30,629 --> 00:26:31,649 Okay, so Anne Hearn responds, 416 00:26:32,069 --> 00:26:35,149 Most humans can't think of things that don't exist. 417 00:26:35,889 --> 00:26:41,649 Only a few people truly have the imagination needed to create something that hasn't existed before. 418 00:26:42,669 --> 00:26:48,489 Socialism violates thou shalt not steal and thou shalt not covet. 419 00:26:49,689 --> 00:26:51,409 Covet, I don't know how to pronounce that. 420 00:26:51,909 --> 00:26:54,089 Democracy creates the illusion of consent. 421 00:26:54,089 --> 00:26:56,129 You voted, so you agreed. 422 00:26:56,249 --> 00:27:01,829 The moment you use force to take from people, even for good reasons, you've violated God's law. 423 00:27:01,949 --> 00:27:04,549 30 at gunpoint is against the Holy Bible. 424 00:27:05,349 --> 00:27:06,809 I completely agree. 425 00:27:07,529 --> 00:27:08,889 It's from Hoppe, a good book. 426 00:27:09,009 --> 00:27:10,289 Democracy, the God that Failed. 427 00:27:10,829 --> 00:27:13,229 It's a lot of these things that are brainwashed into you, right? 428 00:27:13,289 --> 00:27:14,369 Democracy is good. 429 00:27:14,529 --> 00:27:15,309 Government is good. 430 00:27:15,589 --> 00:27:17,469 Who are the people peddling this, right? 431 00:27:17,529 --> 00:27:18,629 It's the state, right? 432 00:27:18,749 --> 00:27:21,989 The education system is controlled by the state. 433 00:27:22,049 --> 00:27:24,029 Of course, they're going to be telling you these things are good, right? 434 00:27:24,029 --> 00:27:30,889 and thinking otherwise is perhaps not something you want to they just they don't encourage it 435 00:27:30,889 --> 00:27:36,129 let's just say that so democracy is two wolves and a sheep on dinner the majority has no more 436 00:27:36,129 --> 00:27:41,009 right to steal from me than a kingdom actually it's worse at least with the king you know who's 437 00:27:41,009 --> 00:27:46,009 oppressing you totally agree you know we know the other argument democracy is a voting game 438 00:27:46,009 --> 00:27:51,109 and it's high time preference because the guy in power only has a limited amount of time to 439 00:27:51,109 --> 00:27:56,469 steal from you. So that's something else I know. Seyfriede Namuz has been also, he's a proponent 440 00:27:56,469 --> 00:28:05,509 of, you know, even though he's an ANCAP, he thinks monarchy is generally better than democracies, 441 00:28:05,509 --> 00:28:08,869 you know, because at least, yeah, like you mentioned, you know, who's oppressing you, 442 00:28:08,869 --> 00:28:13,349 but also kings, since they intend to be in power, not just for their lives, but you know, 443 00:28:13,349 --> 00:28:17,669 their offspring will also, in theory, be in power. So because of this, they tend to have a more 444 00:28:17,669 --> 00:28:19,929 long time horizon in their 445 00:28:19,929 --> 00:28:21,909 or low time 446 00:28:21,909 --> 00:28:22,949 preference in their decisions. 447 00:28:24,689 --> 00:28:25,209 Yeah, so 448 00:28:25,209 --> 00:28:27,709 Anne Hearn says, I'll take monarchy 449 00:28:27,709 --> 00:28:29,649 over democracy any day. 450 00:28:29,949 --> 00:28:31,869 Yeah, I found the arguments quite 451 00:28:31,869 --> 00:28:33,689 compelling. It makes sense. 452 00:28:33,689 --> 00:28:35,149 And Saifidine has given 453 00:28:35,149 --> 00:28:37,689 the human analysis, I believe. He wrote a 454 00:28:37,689 --> 00:28:39,689 paper on it. I haven't read it myself, but 455 00:28:39,689 --> 00:28:41,729 I've heard in this podcast that he 456 00:28:41,729 --> 00:28:43,769 compared in the Middle 457 00:28:43,769 --> 00:28:45,769 East, the countries that 458 00:28:45,769 --> 00:28:47,449 switched from monarchy to 459 00:28:47,449 --> 00:28:56,569 democracy and saw the their um their fiat basically their fiat coin uh the fiat coin 460 00:28:56,569 --> 00:29:02,189 devalued more in the democratic nations than in the ones who continue to have a monarchy 461 00:29:02,189 --> 00:29:09,629 so i guess that that that also gives you a nice little hint there of uh of what's better democracy 462 00:29:09,629 --> 00:29:18,709 or monarchy okay so on her response something about fiat that you don't know but uh it's against 463 00:29:18,709 --> 00:29:27,769 the bible oh really explain that further proverbs 11 1 a just wait is his delight fiat currency is 464 00:29:27,769 --> 00:29:35,029 a false balance bitcoin is a just wait i'm guessing gold was also a just wait or is still 465 00:29:35,029 --> 00:29:39,609 a just wait right but bitcoin has well everyone here's a bitcoiner for those listening so 466 00:29:39,609 --> 00:29:42,169 Yeah, we understand why Bitcoin is superior to gold. 467 00:29:43,009 --> 00:29:43,689 That's interesting. 468 00:29:43,889 --> 00:29:44,789 I didn't know about that. 469 00:29:45,089 --> 00:29:46,209 Okay, so we've enhanced fiat. 470 00:29:46,449 --> 00:29:47,409 Yep, fiat. 471 00:29:47,409 --> 00:29:52,069 So that's, I guess, the next question would be, I guess, 472 00:29:52,149 --> 00:29:55,749 Enkampistan, obviously, would be the logical coin to take. 473 00:29:57,189 --> 00:30:02,889 The question, do you think this has, if Enkampistan were to come to fruition, 474 00:30:03,749 --> 00:30:17,584 would that have a snowball effect around the world So I know like the French Revolution happened and then that seemed to have snowballed revolutions all around the world So like but it was in theory of freedom movement 475 00:30:17,584 --> 00:30:19,404 and that was back then, you know, 476 00:30:19,424 --> 00:30:21,984 when communication wasn't as advanced as it is today. 477 00:30:22,124 --> 00:30:22,504 Oh, interesting. 478 00:30:22,984 --> 00:30:24,844 And Herman says, I'm not sure about that. 479 00:30:25,144 --> 00:30:27,564 Most people seem to be okay with the status quo. 480 00:30:27,844 --> 00:30:31,904 It's hard to convince people to use Bitcoin as real money. 481 00:30:31,904 --> 00:30:33,584 Yeah, I know, definitely is. 482 00:30:34,404 --> 00:30:42,244 But again, I think in this thread with Lesser and Sheet, they start talking about the weak and the strong. 483 00:30:42,524 --> 00:30:46,504 I think that the weak will just follow the strong. 484 00:30:46,704 --> 00:30:53,304 It actually depends on who the strong are more than the weak will just follow. 485 00:30:53,624 --> 00:30:58,844 So if the strong, like a strong being, let's say people who hold the wealth, in this case, Bitcoin, 486 00:30:59,024 --> 00:31:00,924 it's always going to be good versus evil, right? 487 00:31:00,924 --> 00:31:01,764 They're bad people. 488 00:31:01,924 --> 00:31:04,224 We've seen, we know bad people have Bitcoin right now, 489 00:31:04,284 --> 00:31:08,104 especially now with all this Wall Street adoption and whatnot. 490 00:31:08,424 --> 00:31:11,544 I think it does come down to the strong versus the strong 491 00:31:11,544 --> 00:31:14,564 and who can influence the masses more, right? 492 00:31:14,764 --> 00:31:19,064 And yeah, I guess you could say the evil side 493 00:31:19,064 --> 00:31:22,364 perhaps has more influence over the week 494 00:31:22,364 --> 00:31:25,704 in this stage of fiat, I guess, 495 00:31:25,744 --> 00:31:27,204 or the timeline of humanity. 496 00:31:27,204 --> 00:31:29,684 on her and saying, 497 00:31:30,024 --> 00:31:30,784 yeah, but realistically, 498 00:31:30,784 --> 00:31:32,524 we just need to create change. 499 00:31:32,804 --> 00:31:33,924 Governments won't voluntarily 500 00:31:33,924 --> 00:31:35,724 stop their control over money, 501 00:31:35,884 --> 00:31:37,444 but I don't need them to. 502 00:31:37,524 --> 00:31:38,984 I can build a better life now, 503 00:31:39,064 --> 00:31:40,744 my family, my parish, my community. 504 00:31:41,284 --> 00:31:43,184 Yeah, but I agree that 505 00:31:43,184 --> 00:31:45,624 I think that creates a snowball effect 506 00:31:45,624 --> 00:31:48,964 because just because a person is weak, 507 00:31:49,004 --> 00:31:49,384 let's say, 508 00:31:49,524 --> 00:31:50,304 weak in the sense that 509 00:31:50,304 --> 00:31:51,524 they just do what they're told 510 00:31:51,524 --> 00:31:54,104 without thinking about critical. 511 00:31:54,484 --> 00:31:55,224 Despite that, 512 00:31:55,304 --> 00:31:56,144 enough of those people 513 00:31:56,144 --> 00:31:58,464 have the ability to see reality. 514 00:31:58,944 --> 00:32:00,324 If they can see on TV, 515 00:32:00,504 --> 00:32:02,164 and again, this is where communication comes in. 516 00:32:02,404 --> 00:32:04,044 We can spread communication out faster than ever. 517 00:32:04,104 --> 00:32:07,284 If they can see the wealth and the prosperity 518 00:32:07,284 --> 00:32:08,284 in different parts of the world, 519 00:32:08,324 --> 00:32:09,744 I think it's only natural that eventually 520 00:32:09,744 --> 00:32:13,444 some of those weak people can start asking themselves, 521 00:32:13,444 --> 00:32:15,464 why is it so much better over there? 522 00:32:15,524 --> 00:32:17,204 Because I think even if you're weak now, 523 00:32:17,244 --> 00:32:18,364 you can become strong. 524 00:32:18,584 --> 00:32:20,084 It's not a permanent state. 525 00:32:21,304 --> 00:32:21,984 It's opening them. 526 00:32:22,124 --> 00:32:25,084 And then I think that just snowballs in time. 527 00:32:25,084 --> 00:32:30,964 I think the state also does, you can see in the actions of the state, the state wants to keep their population ignorant. 528 00:32:31,284 --> 00:32:33,604 What do big states do? They cut off the Internet. 529 00:32:33,824 --> 00:32:37,204 Like you see in Iran and China, you don't have access to certain platforms. 530 00:32:37,424 --> 00:32:39,724 So why go through the effort of doing that? 531 00:32:40,244 --> 00:32:48,204 Well, I mean, because they know if they let their, quote unquote, weak people get access to that information, 532 00:32:48,204 --> 00:32:58,304 Even if they're supposedly weak, I think there's a, you know, it could convert enough of them to become strong and challenge the state of it. 533 00:32:58,584 --> 00:32:59,724 So Anhurn says that's true. 534 00:32:59,964 --> 00:33:02,024 Yeah, so again, I do think there's a snowball. 535 00:33:02,204 --> 00:33:14,804 If some type of enkabistan can come into fruition, even if it's short-lived, even if the government invades it, just the fact that it was possible, I think that could raise, that could snowball over the years. 536 00:33:14,804 --> 00:33:19,764 even if it's taken over quickly it's something people can learn from like okay these mistakes 537 00:33:19,764 --> 00:33:26,464 were made maybe we shouldn't such a have a such a defined territory of uh free-minded individuals 538 00:33:26,464 --> 00:33:30,664 or maybe we should have been next to these states i don't know i don't know this is all theoretical 539 00:33:30,664 --> 00:33:35,044 stuff but it's interesting to do so okay so i don't know yeah i completely agree okay so 540 00:33:35,044 --> 00:33:38,484 there was another oh there's another interesting comment here in um 541 00:33:38,484 --> 00:33:46,784 on the in the in the thread though the beef said something like he doesn't believe in coercion 542 00:33:46,784 --> 00:33:52,624 coercion now you know basic basic and caps you know non-aggression but lesser did an interesting 543 00:33:52,624 --> 00:33:57,904 response she did an interesting response where like in religion excommunication and banishment 544 00:33:57,904 --> 00:34:07,144 are a form of coercion so i guess what do you think of that those comments so anton says yeah 545 00:34:07,144 --> 00:34:13,644 but that's not a violation of the NAP. Communities have laws and you should follow them. The point 546 00:34:13,644 --> 00:34:19,524 of Ancapistan is not that it's, communities have laws and you should follow them. The point of 547 00:34:19,524 --> 00:34:26,324 Ancapistan is not that it's a place where there are no laws. It's a small self, it's small self 548 00:34:26,324 --> 00:34:32,084 governing communities. Yeah, I agree. So when I read that comment, I was thinking, yeah, there's 549 00:34:32,084 --> 00:34:36,244 excommunication, there's banishment. There are rules in communities. If you don't want something, 550 00:34:36,244 --> 00:34:41,464 if you want to live in a place in a community you should abide to the norms it's voluntary no one's 551 00:34:41,464 --> 00:34:45,364 forcing you to live there and if you don't want to follow those rules well then you got to get out 552 00:34:45,364 --> 00:34:49,524 it's i think it's quite quite simple no one wants drug addicts in their streets or i think most 553 00:34:49,524 --> 00:34:53,404 people don't uh and i think it's in the right of the community if you agree to live there you should 554 00:34:53,404 --> 00:34:58,204 abide to the rules and you can just go find a place where that aligns more with your morality 555 00:34:58,204 --> 00:35:04,624 now if you agreed with being complete a complete liberal or don't know exactly the term would like 556 00:35:04,624 --> 00:35:08,684 If you want to be drugging or if you want junkies on the street, you want prostitution 557 00:35:08,684 --> 00:35:10,564 everywhere, yeah, go to that community. 558 00:35:10,564 --> 00:35:16,304 But I'm pretty sure a community like that will eventually degrade and cease to exist. 559 00:35:16,804 --> 00:35:21,604 Again, that's why I think you need something like religion, in this case, Orthodox Christianity 560 00:35:21,604 --> 00:35:26,804 as a guiding light to teach humans or instill a sense of morality. 561 00:35:27,704 --> 00:35:29,164 It's something that has to be learned. 562 00:35:29,364 --> 00:35:32,384 You're selfish as a baby, right? 563 00:35:32,424 --> 00:35:33,384 You want everything for yourself. 564 00:35:33,384 --> 00:35:35,164 You need to learn low time. 565 00:35:35,264 --> 00:35:37,684 It has to be instilled into humanity, into a human. 566 00:35:37,864 --> 00:35:40,404 Low time preference is something that just naturally comes. 567 00:35:41,424 --> 00:35:42,424 It has to be trained. 568 00:35:42,684 --> 00:35:45,704 So that's, again, that's why I think religion plays an important role in this. 569 00:35:45,844 --> 00:35:49,924 Generally, the big religions tend to teach low time preference, you know? 570 00:35:51,564 --> 00:35:56,304 And then I also said the difference between this and the state, which is what communities, 571 00:35:56,784 --> 00:36:02,344 the difference between this and the state is that when I pay taxes, a gun is pointed at me. 572 00:36:02,344 --> 00:36:03,544 That's not voluntary. 573 00:36:04,244 --> 00:36:07,744 Atheists often mention, render unto Caesar. 574 00:36:07,984 --> 00:36:11,444 Atheists do a complete 180 on render unto Caesar. 575 00:36:11,684 --> 00:36:13,244 They completely misunderstand it. 576 00:36:13,384 --> 00:36:14,444 This was Jesus. 577 00:36:14,904 --> 00:36:22,964 Jesus' way of telling the world that governments, if they are to exist, should not handle matters of faith, spirituality, or morality. 578 00:36:23,704 --> 00:36:25,244 Let them deal with other matters. 579 00:36:25,444 --> 00:36:29,864 Have them serve the Lord and then pass judgment on what the Lord doesn't guide against. 580 00:36:29,864 --> 00:36:55,764 Yep. And that sounds kind of, that sounds logical to me. And that's what we've been doing with time. Separation of church and state. Right now we're trying to do separation of money and state. So the more the state is, I guess, separated from our lives, I would say, again, and cap. So I would say no state is the best, right? Less state is, okay, good enough. But yeah, basically. 581 00:36:55,764 --> 00:37:01,424 agree i agree completely and is there anything else you would like to include you think it's 582 00:37:01,424 --> 00:37:06,424 worth mentioning out there again i'm hoping lesser in and the beev will also want to come oh 583 00:37:06,424 --> 00:37:16,304 that's another topic okay so oh god beev beev i forgot if he's a roman catholic what he's following 584 00:37:16,304 --> 00:37:23,804 what's your opinion on that is following any religion okay any of the big religions is that 585 00:37:23,804 --> 00:37:28,604 good enough or do you think people should heavily consider orthodox christianity because of the 586 00:37:28,604 --> 00:37:34,964 values or decentralization nature of it so on her response following some religion 587 00:37:34,964 --> 00:37:42,004 is better than no religion i believe the others are wrong of course i even believe that about 588 00:37:42,004 --> 00:37:47,724 buddhism and others all right yeah so you basically you consider that they should look 589 00:37:47,724 --> 00:37:53,784 into orthodox christianity a bit more and uh instead of just dismissing it yeah i mean 590 00:37:53,784 --> 00:38:00,404 that again if you're raised in a roman catholic family but it makes sense to like not like this 591 00:38:00,404 --> 00:38:04,924 is my religion it's why look into something else like in the in a way followers something i've heard 592 00:38:04,924 --> 00:38:12,744 a lot in the end it's all christianity like choose your branch but uh yeah i i guess the message here 593 00:38:12,744 --> 00:38:18,104 would be look into the different things i think it's like just when people got into bitcoin i think 594 00:38:18,104 --> 00:38:24,124 most people get into Bitcoin looking for a way to conserve purchasing power, right? So I think 595 00:38:24,124 --> 00:38:30,204 they end up comparing everything, no stock, comparing stocks, gold, silver, real estate. 596 00:38:30,204 --> 00:38:36,584 I think a similar process, something that perhaps should be taken when it comes to spirituality, 597 00:38:37,064 --> 00:38:42,724 look into everything, you know, but agree. Some, a religion, a major religion is better than no 598 00:38:42,724 --> 00:38:48,144 religion. So Anhan responds, yeah, and if you're an atheist hearing this, I was you. I know how 599 00:38:48,144 --> 00:38:52,204 absurd this all sounds. I'm not asking you to believe me. I'm asking you to honestly examine 600 00:38:52,204 --> 00:38:56,724 your worldview. Don't believe me. Don't believe anyone, whether they're Catholic or Orthodox. 601 00:38:57,084 --> 00:39:03,764 It is your life. Live it. But I ask you to actually research what you believe. Plain and 602 00:39:03,764 --> 00:39:10,444 simple. Verify, don't trust. That's in the ethos. Yeah. So, okay. Anything else you would like to 603 00:39:10,444 --> 00:39:15,384 include? I think we, we, it's important to mention. Okay. And her response. No, I think 604 00:39:15,384 --> 00:39:19,944 we've gone through a lot of important topics. I do want to eventually join the, that discussion 605 00:39:19,944 --> 00:39:25,664 with Lesserin and the beef. Uh, though. Yeah. Yeah. We'll be interesting. Yeah. It will 606 00:39:25,664 --> 00:39:30,644 definitely be interesting. I got to get back to them. So not Nostra messages are kind of 607 00:39:30,644 --> 00:39:35,004 buggy. Sometimes I don't even know if they re they receive the text, but I'll be looking 608 00:39:35,004 --> 00:39:41,024 into that. I am moving currently. I'm changing countries. So I think it'll be a month or two 609 00:39:41,024 --> 00:39:46,984 before I can organize things, but it'll be good. I'll be happy to have you on and we can focus 610 00:39:46,984 --> 00:39:52,544 perhaps on the different branches of Christianity. Thank you. And sorry for the technical issues 611 00:39:52,544 --> 00:39:58,624 today. And no worries. This was interesting. The first time I do a podcast like this, I'll do the 612 00:39:58,624 --> 00:40:04,504 editing so that there's no these prolonged silences. They'll be more fluid. Anyways, 613 00:40:05,004 --> 00:40:10,264 Arndt, thank you for joining and look forward to having you on. 614 00:40:10,384 --> 00:40:12,184 So take care.