I can't tell you how many clients, new clients I've gotten because they've had an existing
relationship with the financial advisor.
They're very into Bitcoin.
Bitcoin's a growing part of their portfolio.
And when they bring it up, they get laughed at or they get told to sell.
And you really just kind of show your hand as not understanding potentially the most
important technology and asset class of our generation.
I think one of the most valuable things you can do as an entrepreneur, obviously there's
There's a lot of macro trends that are very hard to weather, you know, AI, and tariffs,
and all this stuff.
Just plant the orange flag.
Like be bold about it, be proud, plant the orange flag, offer services around Bitcoin,
and you will stand out from your competition.
Bitcoin is a currency on the internet.
If you don't trust any other currency, this is where you go.
It's going to outperform everything.
Bitcoin could eventually be worthless.
Every day is a good day to buy Bitcoin.
Bitcoin reaches highest price to date.
Bitcoin hitting a new high.
It really has reached escape velocity.
There is no second best.
Who cares about Bitcoin?
It's the only secure database that's ever been invented.
Antisocial.
Bitcoin is the real deal.
Stupid.
Everything is bullish for Bitcoin.
Immoral.
It's going up forever, Laura.
Fix the money.
Fix the world.
Wide Work is a registered investment advisor,
and the opinions expressed on the show are their own
and do not reflect the opinions of the Silk LLC.
Joining us as a CPA,
and the opinions expressed on the show are their own
and do not reflect the opinions of trusted CPA
or other affiliated firms.
Information presented is for educational purposes only and does not intend to make an offer or solicitation for the sale or purchase of any specific securities, investments, or investment strategies.
Investments involve risk and almost otherwise stated or not guaranteed.
Information expressed is not taken into account your specific situation or objectives is not intended as a recommendation appropriate for any individual.
Listeners are encouraged to seek advice from a qualified tax legal or investment advisor to determine whether any information presented may be suitable for their specific situation.
Past performance is not indicative of future performance. Any statements or opinions are subject to change without notice.
Welcome to the Bitcoin for Financial Services Media, the podcast where saw money meets professional services.
We explore how to build the financial services industry within the principles, ethos, and values of Bitcoin.
We're super excited to be taking you through the first episode. Let's get started.
All righty. We're not live, but first episode. Welcome, White O'Rourke. How's it going, man?
I'm great, brother. How are you doing?
Doing well. So just so everyone knows, today is, I guess, the day after Black Friday.
and this is the very first episode of the Bitcoin for Financial Services podcast and it's going to
end up being a pretty crucial part of a brand that Wyatt and I have been building at this point for
about six months and so we are thrilled to kind of finally be in front of some mics, cameras,
there's been a lot of work that's gone into all of this and so we are excited to kind of kick
things off. The structure today is mainly just, hey, let's give some introductions about who we
are individually, how we're working together, and then really lay the groundwork for where we're
going with this whole endeavor with integrating Bitcoin into TradFi existing financial services
and where we go from there. So why, why don't you tell us a little bit about what you get into on a
daily basis? What qualifies you to be on the show and kind of talk through all these topics?
Yeah, absolutely. So I'm the founder of Basilic Financial. We're a Bitcoin-focused wealth
management firm. We help our clients with sound money strategies, and our ultimate goal is to help
them achieve prosperity with purpose. We still do some traditional finance work, but it's
predominantly focused on serving Bitcoiners were state registered RIA in Colorado. And when I
started this business, I was already a Bitcoin maximalist, had some history in traditional
finance, my degrees in finance, really just kind of identified more as an entrepreneur. At that
point, I was very involved with the Denver Bitcoin community. I want to start Bitcoin company, but
I didn't know how to code or whatever. And, you know, my peers are other maximalists. And so I was
just thinking, how can I do this? And was talking with friends and mentors and decided to adopt the
RIA business model and just integrate Bitcoin into it. And I think one of the big themes we'll
be talking about over the course of this podcast is I think Bitcoin financial services is the most
exciting subsector of Bitcoin to be in right now, because we have this tried and true
traditional finance playbook.
It already exists.
We don't need to recreate the wheel.
We just need to apply Bitcoin to it.
And we'll really kind of get in the nuts and bolts of how different professionals do that
with their businesses, which will be exciting.
So, you know, we predominantly help Bitcoiners with, you know, I've stacked stats.
Now what?
And that kind of comes in the terms of financial planning, custody solutions, inheritance planning, helping them be good stewards of their assets, understanding the responsibility they have as the first generation of Bitcoiners and how that plays into their financial lives.
I'm also the author of the Bitcoinization of Finance.
I currently serve as the chief marketing officer of the space, which is Denver's Bitcoin Citadel.
You can think of it as co-working meets event space, meets social club meets professional trade organization.
I'm also working on some opportunities here, which I'll be excited to announce on the podcast in digital credit.
I can't can't quite do that just yet, but a little teaser.
And I'm also very excited about that.
No, I love it, man.
And yeah, my name is Jordan Guess.
I own a CPA firm here in Kentucky and I am also co-founder of a Bitcoin accounting and tax software called Bitment and been a Bitcoiner since I think late 2020.
and yeah just i'm thrilled about this because i've seen and wide seen the landscape of you
talk to enough um folks in the financial planning advising space and on my side on the tax advisory
side specifically you know there's just there's a lot of bad information out there about what
bitcoin is there is the cringe word i cringe at least when i hear it uh crypto and how that gets
lumped in. I think that's going to be a really just consistent theme that we talk about and why
Bitcoin is different. Even driving over here, Wyatt, today to record, I was thinking through
that meme of the two Venn diagrams of someone who thinks Bitcoin in one circle has no value.
And the other circle is someone who can explain the difficulty adjustment. And in the middle,
right when that when those two circles overlap and the meme is i've never met someone in the
middle here where they understand the difficulty adjustment and can explain it and they think
bitcoin has no no value and and i think that kind of lays out dude i think that it kind of lays out
like what we're getting at with this whole show is that if you understand what bitcoin is why it's
different from every other cryptocurrency and frankly every other um fiat currency you start
to see the world differently.
You go down, you know, pick your favorite rabbit hole.
And there's lots of that.
We won't be able to touch all of those rabbit holes
on the show.
But that's kind of the whole essence
of what we're getting at here.
Using Wyatt's extensive background and planning,
financial planning, and on my side
with the tax planning and tax prep work.
Yeah, I'm just excited to see where this goes.
And I guess, Wyatt, you should probably tell the story
because one, you have a funny antidote
going all the way back to Vegas, I guess, earlier this year of just how we got started,
because I think we've both been thinking about this, you in Denver, me in Kentucky.
And it's a I think it's a fun story that's worth taking four or five minutes to tell
on how we even got got to meet and started putting all this together.
Yeah, certainly it is a very Bitcoin story.
And this will be this is a fun episode.
because it's just you and I usually will be bringing guests on and we want to take the
opportunity here to kind of really kind of give the audience some some background what we're going
to be talking about how we got to this point and it was back in May I was talking to a mutual friend
Jesse Gilger he's at Sound Advisory another big one you know focus or RIA I guess they're now under
gain of trust actually and part of the the work we do at the space is we're big into events and
we've identified summits or small conferences, generally around 150 folks or so, as being
very high signal events or type of events that Bitcoiners enjoy going to because you have very
intimate networking opportunities. You can talk to the speakers. You can actually get your hands
dirty and learn a little bit as opposed to just getting lost in the crowd of 10, 20, 30,000 people
at a conference and so in Vegas I was talking with Jesse and I was you know we kicked around
the idea of doing something in this kind of realm at the space I wasn't quite sure how it would be
put together or what we would talk about or if the industry is even big enough to to do something
like this and yeah this is yeah back in you know early early last year so I was talking with Jesse
He's like, hey, you got to get a hold of this guy named Jordan Guess.
I was like, I have no idea who who the hell that is.
But sure, I'll reach out to him, go through the conference, talk to a handful of other
folks, get back doing the follow ups.
And all of a sudden, this guy named Jordan Guess schedules a call on my calendar.
I was like, holy smoke, that's crazy.
I was supposed to reach out to Jordan Guess.
And that's how we got introduced.
And, you know, come to find out you had already done quite a bit of legwork of trying to plan
something in this, you know, industry. And as soon as you kind of gave me your sales pitch,
I was like, you know what, screw it. Let's do it. I was instantly in, we hit it off.
I think, you know, we're, we're pretty much two peas in a pod. Think about things very
similarly. You see the world very similarly, have similar backgrounds,
obviously very complimentary work, me being RIA and you being a CPA. And then
we just really hit the ground running. Fortunately, you kind of had a,
you know, playbook of what we want to do. I had some experience running events at the space,
uh, and we really kind of got into planning our, you know, inaugural summit, which I think we should,
you know, touch on a little bit later, but that's my recollection of the, the, uh, the beginnings
of Bitcoin for financial services. Jordan, I don't know if I left anything out. No, it's perfect. I
mean, the funniest part about the whole thing was I'd basically given up on the idea when,
when I was talking with Mitch Moore, because Mitch Moore is the guy who introduced, was saying,
hey, you should talk to Wyatt. He might be interested in this. And it was kind of a final
gasp. Like I just had a quick intro call with Mitch, who's not too far away from you. And you
all know each other from the Colorado Bitcoin scene. And I just was still telling people about
it. But at this point, it had gone through the iteration of, well, I'll do it here in Louisville,
Kentucky where I'm at, that wasn't going to work. I looked out, you know, to a few different venues.
It wasn't, it just didn't make sense. And there was, you know, there's a financial risk, right?
Of starting an event, especially if you're just going at it completely solo and you say, well,
I'm just going to host it at a hotel and I need to block off a certain number of rooms and I'm on
the hook for the rooms we don't sell and the event space, the food, the drinks, blah, blah,
lot, right? It's, it's a lot of work as we found out. And so, um, I was, uh, I was thrilled that,
Hey, there's another, you know, Bitcoin citadel out there that, Hey, maybe this is a good fit.
And so, and just thank God for cal.com, right? Uh, you had some, and you're two hours behind me.
So, I mean, it was already three or four in the afternoon by my, you know, for my time,
but you had some time about three or four year time. So we hopped on that day and the rest is
history. So yeah, we should touch on, on the summit. Um, we threw that event together really
in the course of four months and got corporate sponsors involved. We got a really high caliber
group of speakers to come out, make the trip to Denver. Of course there was, I don't know,
maybe three or four that were local, but many of them had to travel to come speak. And, uh,
yeah, I think we should just, and I always appreciate why it's always just very thankful,
no matter who he's talking to have something I've noticed about you. And I think it's, I just
applaud you on that. Just however it comes up or whatever situation we're in, you're always the
first to say, thanks for having us. This means a lot. And I think we should lead with that. I mean,
the number of people that took a risk on our event for 2025, just about a month and a half ago,
was really just something that kind of blew me away. I'm sure it did for you as well, Wyatt,
the speakers, the attendees, and of course, the corporate sponsors who, you know, put their time,
put their money behind this endeavor was just, that was moving. And I think that fueled us to
make sure that we put on a truly unforgettable inaugural event, which is hard to do. The first
year, right? I mean, it's always, that's tough. So, um, so yeah, we had about a hundred, 150 people
that came out and I think there was a lot to be learned more than anything. I think a lot of
people made some great connections and that's really what these events are about, right? You
meet other service providers. They do things that you don't do, but your clients ask about. And so
you're just building that network of trusted people that you can refer things out to over time. So
that was at least what i got out of it no 100 man i appreciate you saying that and something
i appreciate about you is that you always uh remember to thank the wives uh which sometimes
i forget which is not good uh so you say just a sticky note on my computer screen yeah right
uh yeah well and that's what i think you know when i look back on why before we met i was bearish
if you know, I could pull this off single handedly, which I don't think I could have done just because
it is, you know, a lot of work. But I was wrestling back and forth with, you know, is this industry
big enough Like do we have enough you know RIAs estate planning attorneys CPAs asset allocators investors that come talk And for some reason I was just thinking very small And you know January February of 25 it like I don know I don
know. Like, what are we going to talk about? It turns out that was very silly. Like we had
a lot of corporate sponsors that were interested in being involved in the event, you know, from
We had a local mortgage lender with Bitcoin.
Well, you know, big exchange.
We had speakers from lending companies.
Unchained was a sponsor.
We had the Pearl Fund was a sponsor.
Satoshi Pacioli was a sponsor.
I think I'm forgetting one, unfortunately.
That would come to me.
But regardless, like once we actually started doing the legwork and getting out into the
community, I was really impressed by the amount of companies that were interested in being involved.
And I'm really excited for next year's event because we were still even a little slow for
some bigger companies to get involved. We had some conversations with hedge funds that weren't
able to make it due to time constraints. We had some conversations with ETF issuers that weren't
able to make it given time constraints. And now that we're just being so much more intentional
with it because of the success of the event, I'm really excited about what we can build it into.
but in classic bitcoin fashion you know it's two guys came together it's like hey i think we should
do this do you know how to do this and it's like wow i think so maybe it's like ah screw it we'll
make it work uh and that was really kind of the the motivation but then you know our kind of
selfish intentions where jordan and i've talked about this a lot just privately where it's really
kind of a shame or embarrassing where we obviously, you know, put ourselves out to be professionals
in the space. I think we do great work. But then when it kind of comes down to referrals, you know,
I'm working with a Bitcoiner, I want to refer them to a Bitcoin native estate binding attorney,
or Bitcoin native, you know, CPA, I have like a referral for both of those things. And it's insane.
and it doesn't make me feel the most comfortable being very deep in this space. I have a single
referral partner for a lot of these auxiliary services my clients need to utilize. And so
we really wanted to try to bring everybody together, get them in one space. I do think
doing events at a Bitcoin Citadel just kind of elevates it. Just the fact that the space itself
is Bitcoin themed, you really kind of have a good sense of, okay, this is going to be legit.
I'm not going to have to be worried about if I'm stuck talking to crypto bro.
And so I do think that that really kind of helps elevate, you know, an event.
So I would really encourage anybody interested in doing that.
Check out, you know, the space, check out everyone park, check out Presidio.
It's very cool thing to do.
And so once we kind of had our guiding light there, I think we were kind of off the races.
And then I think we really just started reaching out to speakers and folks that were interested in coming.
Your wealth deserves intention.
Basilic Financial is a Bitcoin-focused wealth management firm
built to help our clients find balance between money and meaning.
We integrate sound money strategies across four distinct personalized services.
Financial planning, individual wealth management,
retirement services for SMBs, and Bitcoin financial services.
Your prosperity, your purpose, intentionally guided at Basilic Financial.
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Yeah, there's definitely, there's a gap. I mean, at least in the tax side, I know that there's more, I run across a lot of crypto CPAs that are on Twitter, but the market I think right now is really demanding more serious advisors to, to kind of come out of the woodwork.
and it's folks that of course can explain the difference between the proof of stake
and proof of work networks i think that's extremely important which some of that does
get technical and and that is a piece of this right like i don't know how many hours you and
i combined have listened to bitcoin related content be it podcasts or read books but there
is a lot of work and there's a lot of things to actually understand and that's why so many people
just, they just give up. They're like, I don't understand it. So I just, if I don't understand
it, I'm not going to invest in it. I'm not going to, you know, put any time into this.
And so that's, I would say that's probably one of our just fiduciary duties at this point,
specifically, definitely on your side to be able to explain, here's the value prop of Bitcoin.
And here's why you should at least look into it. And I can help you with the education side.
And then once you feel comfortable with understanding what it is and why you should probably get some of it, why it's smart to get some, then I can help you buy and hold through all the turbulence because, of course, there is turbulence.
There's a lot going on in the world, which I'm sure we'll touch on some of those pieces over the course of the show with the different guests.
but yeah if you're going to someone who doesn't understand what bitcoin is just your you know
run-of-the-mill advisor right i think that they're probably dropping the ball a little bit especially
now that what we're sitting here at the end of the end of november the etfs have been out for
almost two years at this point right and so clients are having questions about what bitcoin is they've
seen it run up and they've seen it pull back and they've seen just all the things that have happened
most people are focused on inflation and Bitcoiners have been talking about inflation for a long time,
even the class of 2020, 2021, which I feel like a lot of the people I meet in the space
are a part of that class. That's what originally got them into Bitcoin in the first place.
And so, yeah, I think it's kind of our duty to educate advisors even on, okay, I understand
you're not going to listen to Michael Saylor for 25 hours, uh, you know, over the course of a month,
we did that, but that's okay. Like if you don't want to do that, whatever, but we can explain it
in a more succinct way to you. Or if you're, if you want to just bring us in to talk to your
clients directly, happy to do that as well. But I think there's a, there's still a lack of good
education out there. And especially with guys like Peter McCormick, I totally, you know, support
Peter doing what he wants to do, but there's shows that were very approachable for kind of the normie
American that have pivoted. And yeah, I just don't think that there can be enough approachable Bitcoin
content, especially for people in very, you know, this is obviously a niche audience and we're fine
with that. I think that that's actually one of our, one of our big differentiators, right?
100 i'm happy you brought that up um because yeah we're not trying to be another bitcoin
podcast here right we want to focus specifically on folks working or building in the professional
the financial services industry and we will help them integrate bitcoin into it and one of the
things you touched on there jordan that i think is crucially important is i also got into bitcoin
in 2020. Unfortunately, my shitcoin phase was pretty brief. I was guided by some quality folks
in the industry. So I didn't get too wrecked there, unfortunately, like a lot of people do.
But I've always had such a pessimistic attitude towards crypto. And I think they give
this industry or Bitcoin really such a bad name. I think it's extremely degenerate.
It's foolish. I don't like how the crypto folks carry themselves. And I think that's really kind
of prevented a lot of the professional service providers that take themselves seriously. They
want to do good work. They want to offer quality services to their clients from being shy to
adopting Bitcoin specifically. You and I are both Bitcoin only. We're not interested in helping
clients or other service professionals adopt anything crypto related. And so I think it's
important for the folks we're specifically trying to reach to understand that if you haven't
integrated Bitcoin into your practice yet, you are, you're missing the boat. And I can't tell
you how many clients, new clients I've gotten because they've had an existing relationship with
the financial advisor, they're very into Bitcoin. Bitcoin's a growing part of their portfolio.
And when they bring it up, they get laughed at or they get told to sell. And you really just kind
of show your hand is not understanding potentially the most important technology and asset class of
our generation. And if you're not willing to embrace it or integrate it, and it doesn't have
to be full bore right off the bat, you know, you just got to start preparing yourself to be able to
answer questions and facilitate it in your practice. We'll get into how that looks more
down the road and we'll be bringing on a series of professionals that have already done this.
But the moral of the story is you need to start doing it. And if you don't, you will continue to
lose clients. And I think one of the most valuable things you can do as an entrepreneur,
obviously, there's a lot of macro trends that are very hard to weather, AI and tariffs and all this
stuff, just plant the orange flag, like be bold about it, be proud, plant the orange flag,
offer services around Bitcoin, and you will stand out from your competition.
Yeah. And it's, it's interesting, even so, you know, I sit in on some client meetings with
their financial advisor, if it makes sense, if we overlap on the work and, you know, it's just best
to be efficient with the client's time and we can answer questions on both sides. And I don't know
I think it was the week before last, but I was in a meeting in person and the client was actually
asking about what their portfolio looked like. And it was the day that we dropped all the way
down to 80. So it really wasn't that long ago, whenever, but the, the advisor even was like,
went immediately on the defense, right? It was, it was essentially was saying,
well, I should say they kind of laid off the big tranches of the portfolio,
which was kind of the normal 60 40 ish uh what you this was for an older client and so maybe it
was 40 60 i don't know but all that to say there was it got to it where it was like oh we also have
you know one or two percent in alternatives and the client asked so what are the alternatives and
the advisor said it's some gold and don't freak out but it is a little bit of bitcoin
and it you know of course this i work with a lot of normie clients and also bitcoiners so i i know
exactly how to kind of play both sides of it but it was just funny i mean i had to bite my tongue
and just i'm just it's not that's not my my role in the meeting is to talk about investment strategy
at all so i don't that's not my place so i didn't say anything but i did have to like internally
have a bit of a smile on, well, if you understand what Bitcoin is, you've taken a long-term view
on the asset. And so one might see this opportunity actually as a nice buying opportunity. It's that
classic, I mean, I remember bringing up memes all the time, I guess, on the show, but it's that
classic meme of like, oh, you know, when it goes way up and it's that guy who's like, oh man, I
can't believe I didn't buy. And then when it just dips down, when he has the opportunity to actually
buy at a lower cost base. He's like, oh, I'm not buying that. And that's just, and then that just
happens over and over and over again. So I think that's the other pieces. And that's just classic,
you know, every advisor knows that to their core, right? You take long-term positions and sure,
there's fluctuations, but that's the whole, that's why you get higher rate of returns than just going
and buying treasury bonds or something like that. So yeah, there's just so much to, I think even
help framing the conversations for advisors with their clients on the portfolio management side.
And it's going to be really important as Bitcoin does what it does. It naturally becomes a larger
portion of your portfolio over time, just because generally speaking, it outpaces the fiat
growth of other asset classes. And so then there's a question of, well, do we rebalance or do we
double down? And of course, that's, that's again, not my, that's not my thing to at least advise
clients on, but all of us Bitcoiners at this point, you know, we have our opinions and there's,
there's no real hiding that. So. Well, there's, I think too, it's a beautiful example because
there's two great trends there that I think we'll be touching on a lot over the course of
this podcast i think one is helping financial professionals understand how to talk with
bitcoiners bitcoiners are a unique bunch and i love that graph that gets circulated on twitter
every once in a while of the personality types and my briggs personality types is i you know i think
it's like vast majority is entj and intj and i think that's just like an interesting data point
because Bitcoiners do generally have a way of thinking and they're wired a particular way.
I think a certain type of person is attracted to Bitcoin.
And so one of the things or one of the ways I think I stand out for my competition is I
speak my client's language.
You know, it's like understanding like the language of Bitcoin, which is, you know, fairly
chronically online and understanding the memes and, you know, what they mean and what they're
trying to achieve.
And so that advisor, like you were saying, automatically taking a defensive position,
trying to justify like allocation in the best performing asset over the last 10 years.
You don't want to be on your heels with this kind of stuff.
Like you want to be proud and then you need to be able to, you know, obviously communicate
your investment thesis.
And the second trend, I think, too, is we'll be talking about how to integrate Bitcoin in
your practice and what that means for the service you offer and the business model.
any tweaks you need to make to your business model.
You know, one of the things I specifically do
that I've been talking to a lot more wealth managers about
is, you know, Bitcoiners don't necessarily want to be charged
AUM fees on Bitcoin.
And it's like, okay, if you're sitting in your wealth manager chair,
are you just allocating 1% to 5% of their Bitcoin
or their portfolio into the Bitcoin ETF
just to say that you have some Bitcoin exposure?
or are you actually doing good work to try to get them to have some self-custody Bitcoin
and be fully in control of their wealth And then how are you charging on that So bitcoin will force you to reevaluate your business practices i think for the better bitcoin has a way of aligning incentives
and i think that just comes from its beautiful design to begin with i think it's very unique
in that aspect and so we'll help you walk through these conversations and we're going to bring on
folks to talk to how they've done it. We'll obviously share our opinions on how we've done
it, how we've seen other folks do it. And this is really meant to be not something you should
shy away from, but rather a learning experience to get the wheels turning.
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Yeah. And I think highlighting even for the small business clients that we work with, and I'm sure that, well, we can definitely test on our side. You integrate Bitcoin. It is scary at first, but you learn and you test things with small amounts. And it's honestly, it's fun.
If you've never really played around with a computer or gotten into like the terminal and, you know, written any code for fun, it actually is kind of interesting to see these tools talk to each other and then understand that I can send money directly to Wyatt and we didn't have to go through Chase Bank and see if JP Morgan Chase and Jamie Dimon are okay with our, you know, our business relationship.
And of course, they don't have a good record on that anyways, but as we might get into at some point. But the tech itself, for someone who never went to school to study anything with computer science is very interesting. So that's a fun part.
But of course, we're in the industry of helping clients, you know, baseline, keep their wealth, right? But in most cases, try to earn, earn, you know, where they have more wealth at the at the end of our time together.
And seeing how some of these businesses who have been earlier movers in the space, in the Bitcoin space, grow their balance sheet or grow their P&L or grow both has just been really interesting to me.
These merchants now that are able to collect a revenue in either Bitcoin or fiat and they see Bitcoiners move, they vote with their money.
And so if they see whatever, pick the business service or good out there who is out there, they're just willing to accept Bitcoin for their goods or services.
We are willing to go either spend our dollars or spend our Bitcoin and then replace it on the back end and actually go support that business.
And probably Steak and Shake is like the most prominent example that comes to mind of a quasi dying business, right, that took a stand, I guess, about a year and a half, year ago. And my understanding is that their quarter on quarter earnings and top line, like everything is trending. It's all like done a 180 in the in the positive direction.
And so that's the other piece of the puzzle is that for anyone who's brave enough, who also puts in the proof of work to learn and then implements these strategies, either in their own personal investments or their business, they're going to reap a benefit because, you know, Bitcoiners like to say we're still early.
And I, I believe that we're still, we're still very early on all of this.
So that's another part.
I know we both work with a small business owners, a good chunk of our time and that the tools
are coming online now to, it makes it much easier.
It makes it an easier pitch, right.
To onboard the small business owners than it was, uh, you know, trying to set somebody
up on a BTC pay server, maybe three or four years ago.
Well, a hundred percent.
And that's why I think to allude more on my previous point of why Bitcoin financial service
is such an exciting industry to be in right now.
And we'll be bringing these folks on to discuss on the pod.
But I'm extremely thankful for the entrepreneurs and builders in this space, because my point
as an advisor, we have companies like Orange Bridge and Horizon that are building out home
equity line of credit products of Simply Buy Bitcoin.
We have Zach Townsend over at Meanwhile, he's built a Bitcoin denominated whole life insurance policy.
We have a lot of different lending companies that are popping up.
And so we have a lot of tools and resources at our fingertips that weren't necessarily there two to three years ago to help our clients better utilize their Bitcoin, to better acquire more Bitcoin, to utilize different assets.
to further their Bitcoin acquisition and utilization strategies.
And so I think that's extremely exciting.
It will be helping our audience learn about how these,
what these tools are, who's building these tools.
I think one of the most important things you can be doing from our seats,
Jordan, working with clients is just understanding how to perform due diligence
on Bitcoin companies or companies operating within the Bitcoin space.
um i you know when i go to a new service provider one of the things i you know look for first is like
do they service crypto do they have a token you know bitcoiners don't want to work with these
types of companies and i tend to be at the belief where i'm probably going to be pretty judgmental
off the bat if you do any of those things and i'm gonna question and judge your incentive structure
because i already think you're leading consumers down a road that shouldn't be traveled and so
we'll help you know different professionals you know identify what is is valid or not you know
unfortunately there's still a lot of scams in this you know industry that we we have to overcome so
just identifying quality service providers to to work with and to your point jordan there i was in
2024 i went to bitcoin for corporations michael saylor's um conference and he had i believe the
president of bc media and he gave a keynote just about the brand of bitcoin this to your your
stake and shake coin where bitcoin has an amazing brand and it has a very cool brand and if you're
able to tap into that that gives you um i think tremendous competitive advantage by just embracing
Bitcoin and Bitcoiners. Where we need to be cognizant of what that means, I think, and I think
some we're going to helpfully help steer the ship on in this industry is Bitcoin's the culture.
Bitcoin is kind of this amorphous thing, right? It's a grassroots movement. Satoshi Nakamoto is
So pseudonym, no one company, country or individual controls Bitcoin.
So it's the individuals that interact with the protocol that really kind of shape its
future, which is extremely exciting.
And I think regardless of what industry you operate in, you have the responsibility to
build that industry within the principles, ethos and values of Bitcoin.
And what Jordan and I are specifically trying to do is apply those to the financial services
industry.
Yeah. I mean, if you just take a step back, right, broadly speaking, trust is at potentially all time lows. Right. And so and that's I love the point that you brought up about us helping professionals identify the correct partners in the space and be able to very quickly sniff out folks who are just potentially running not all the way scams,
but things that could easily rug their clients. Because all of us know, if you make a recommendation
to your client for them to go use a service or some kind of product, and it turns out
that is not legitimate, you refer Block or your client to BlockFi or FTX, God forbid,
you know, a few years back, you most likely lose that client. You potentially find yourself
in some legal trouble. And so that's kind of, it's funny. I almost think about us.
You and I probably both watch Marty and Matt on rabbit hole recap, right? They are kind of
constantly on the cutting edge of, Hey, should you use this tool? And more so on the wallet side,
the kind of more technical side of things, be it lightning, multi-sig, some of the
mini script type of tech that's coming out. That's again, no, no financial advisor is going to go
read a GitHub repo, right? So that's not our audience. But for us, there's all these financial
services companies that are popping up. And I would love for us to serve the role of, hey, look,
we vetted these people. We've, we've either, you know, got on calls with the founders,
we've interviewed folks, and we're critical. And I think that that's one of the beautiful
things about Bitcoiners is that we hold ourselves, our companies, our partners, everyone in our lives
to a very high standard. And, you know, some people call us maximalists or say that we're
toxic for that, but it really comes down to, we've seen too many people get burned and there are
unsuspecting folks who come into a situation and they are the, you know, they're the retail that
buys what the big players are selling and they get screwed. And so it's important. I mean, even
some of these Bitcoin treasury companies, I think that that still has to play its course,
but financial advisors play an extremely important role to help clients think through
what are the actual fundamentals in this? Why are we putting money in this versus actually just
buying out real outright Bitcoin. And so those are, there's just constantly, there's things
changing. So I really love that we are helping really at the advisor level because you help an
advisor understand these concepts. You don't just reach, it's not a one-to-one where you reach a
client, you reach a service provider that then helps you actually reach closer to a hundred,
200 300 clients like however they service within their firm and that's just a nice multiplying
effect right so and and it's something we're up against because even xrp right you talk to any like
dude you talk to any just normal uh like a server or an uber driver or just kind of anyone off the
street and if you mention bitcoin it's so funny at this point to me i almost think they're kidding
with me. Like, I think that I've heard it so much. I'm like, you're, I almost want to be like,
you're joking. Right. But they're not. And so in some ways, I think we have to upgrade Bitcoin's
marketing team, which of course it doesn't have an actual marketing team other than just Bitcoiners
to be able to reach people and protect them from just a lot of misinformation out there is what I,
is what I'll say. So, oh, it's crazy amounts of misinformation, man. And that's what,
to your point about, you know,
earlier proof of stake versus proof of work networks,
you know, all these venture funded projects,
if we want to call them that,
they pour tons of money in these flashy marketing schemes
that grabs people's attention.
The XRP thing like blows my freaking mind.
Like I used to get texts about Ethereum or Solana
and now it's almost only exclusively XRP
if it's not about Bitcoin.
I've just wondered like why that is,
like why it's kind of catching like the Zeitgeist
I have no idea.
I generally just direct people to Pierre Richard's profile.
You know, pretty almost weekly.
He's destroying XRP, which is awesome.
And he's a great resource for that.
But yeah, to your point, Jordan, you know, one of the reasons why, you know, kind of building
off the summit.
So we weren't sure how the summit was going to go.
We put a ton of work in it.
Fortunately, you know, I think we're both super proud and stoked with how it turned out.
you know, we got a ton of great feedback. The all the attendees and the speakers had very positive
things to say. And so that was really all we needed to do, you know, round two. So we already
decided we're running back to some in 2026, December, or excuse me, October 24 through 26
in Denver, Colorado at the space be there. We'll have exciting updates coming to the website and
newsletter. But it was really from there where it's like, okay, we really have something going
here, we kind of like struck a nerve. And so we were just thinking of how we can make this bigger
and better and more impactful for the folks we're trying to serve. And that just kind of naturally
led into a long form conversation via the podcast so we can help build trust within this community.
That's why I trust Marty and Matt. Yeah, met them a couple of times like offhand. They don't really
know me from Adam, but I trust these guys because I've listened to hours and hours and hours of them
for years. And so that was only because of like the long form content they produce. And something
Jordan and I take very seriously stepping into that role of trying to do that same thing for
our specific niche is actually taking the time to bring on the service providers and the people
building these companies and talk to them about how they run their companies and talk to them
about the business model decisions they made
to intentionally serve as Bitcoiners and Bitcoiners only.
And so I think that's going to be extremely valuable.
I still like to do business a bit of an old school way.
I think you got this in you as well, Jordan,
where I don't really feel comfortable recommending a partner
or vendor to a client if I haven't actually sat down
and talked with them and gotten the opportunity
to understand how their business works.
And so that's one of the things
I'm most excited about doing this
and just having this long form content component
on top of the summit to make the community more robust and the summit even more fruitful
stay compliant while building for the long term. To learn more or book a consultation,
visit satoshipacioli.com. Yeah. Yeah. So I think we should probably just make sure. So the cadence
of the show will be a weekly show. We're going to see how many weeks we can get in a row. I know
Marty and Matt are at some large number. And of course, we're not competing with Marty and Matt,
but they do keep coming up because they kind of are one of the shows I go back to when I do go
back to a Bitcoin podcast. And you don't always, you know, you get to a point where you're like,
I don't listen to Bitcoin podcast all the time. I know you're supposed to listen to 40 hours a week,
but I, I, uh, 40 hours a week, man. That's the other thing is we're going to bring in
some, uh, some older advisors. We're going to bring them up to speed on the memes. That's just
like ancillary benefit of listening to the show. And then this time next year, you're going to walk
into Thanksgiving and you're going to know all the lingo for your millennials in the household,
even potentially some zoomers. I know, I don't know why, you're like right on the cusp, right?
Are you officially a zoomer or no? It depends on who you ask. I'm like right on the cutoff year.
So I generally just use it to my advantage depending on the conversation I'm having.
I love it. Okay. So you're flip-flopping depending on if it's an older client, younger client.
that's right yeah all right cool well um yeah i think that that probably sums it up i know that's
just a big intro there's so many pieces uh that we could really uh dive into but of course it is
the day after black friday meaning it is a saturday um you know we've got our families and
all that so we should we'll probably wrap it up here soon i guess do we want to maybe just give a
high level of, uh, some, maybe a highlight from the, from the actual summit. And then let's end
with, you know, maybe a few topics that you're excited about, you know, speaking about in some
of the future episodes, give people, you already gave someone, you gave everyone a teaser about all
the companies that, that you are, uh, LP on, but maybe give us that teaser as well, Wyatt,
and I'll do the same after you. Yeah, absolutely. So I think one of the things we did,
really well and were really intentional about just building out the schedule of the summit.
And so we built in a lot of time for folks to organically network. I think the content was
amazing. All the content's available on the Space YouTube channel at Denver Space.
And so that was phenomenal. But when people go to conferences, myself included, I want to talk to
people. That's how I justify the business expense. I want to potentially meet new clients. I want
to potentially meet new business partners. If I learn something from the content, that's fantastic.
And so I thought our networking segments were amazing. You know, we had long breakfasts,
long lunch. We brought everybody together for group meals in the evening. We had some
entertainment with wine and bourbon tasting and just giving people kind of that organic surface
area to meet each other, to actually sit down and have a conversation as opposed to some sort of like
speed networking slash dating, you know, setup that's not very real or organic, I think is
really important. And we're already kind of workshopping some ways we can expand on that
next year and tweak the schedule to offer more of that. But that was some of the things
I enjoyed the most and got some of the most positive feedback on.
yeah i mean if i had to point to no and i agree with all that by the way i you know it was very
crazy that andrew holmes came out it was crazy that a lot of people came out i mean we could
probably run down the list and there's there's a lot of names on that list of like wow really
gracious of them to spend their time with us uh andrew holmes coming in that was just a huge win
i'm very excited to hear you know all the updates that he has going into the new year
and I'll be thrilled to have him on the show here as soon as we can, just because I think a lot of
Bitcoiners are just asking themselves, especially younger Bitcoiners. So, you know, we're $38
trillion in debt. So what are we doing here? You know, you guys just going to hand that off to us
and say good luck. And so I love what he's cooking up with BPI to help the U.S. government
potentially dig themselves out of their debt hole using Bitcoin.
So I really loved that.
Loved having Morgan and Pierre come and speak.
And then, yeah, we grabbed John from ZapRite, the CEO and founder.
He jumped on board.
Man, it was like a week prior, I think, that we talked to him.
And he was like, all right, I'm going to be able to fly in from like,
he was somewhere in Canada or something.
So anyways, and that was one other fun part.
well, it's fun to look back on it now, but the event planning was, it's a whirlwind, right? You,
you think you've got something, oh, it changed. Oh, we've got to completely rewrite this part of it.
And even doing that on the fly. I remember when we first, when the event was about to start on
Friday, I don't know if you remember this. It's like, where's Pierre? You know, we're about to
start. We're about to start, like we're kicking things off. He's the first keynote and he's nowhere
to be found right and so and of course he he made it in on time shout out to pierre um with the whole
family that was the other thing very family friendly oriented oriented event which we want
to keep it that way uh just because bitcoiners have families we are if if nothing else dude we
will we will uh we will make sure to out reproduce the xrp guys almost certainly so um bullish on that
Um, yeah. And then I guess on my side, specifically, when I look out to some of the different topics that I know we'll cover, of course, I'm in the accounting tax side. So getting into some different strategies for being as efficient as possible on taxes.
I'm curious to learn more from you, Wyatt, and some of our guests exactly what you all think about some different income strategies with Bitcoin.
So earning a legitimate yield on your Bitcoin, whether that's peer-to-peer lending or potentially some option strategies with something like an IBIT or posting Bitcoin to the Lightning Network and earning a routing fee.
just getting into the weeds on legitimate practices within the Bitcoin ecosystem versus,
hey, give me your coins. I'm going to pay you this high yield. And anyone with half a brain
sitting around thinking, well, how are you paying me 10% on my whatever Solana holdings or whatever,
right? How are you making money on that deal? And I think that's a legitimate question that
everyone should be asking. And so it's just that classic, like if it's, if it sounds too good to
be true, it probably is. So I'm, I'm excited for some Bitcoiners to even, you know, teach me some
things through this process to say, Hey, you're thinking about that wrong. Uh, you should, you're
not, this is a blind spot that you've got, but I'll help you see it. And then you're going to
help your clients make sure they see it as well. So toll is so exciting. I couldn't be more excited.
So 100%.
Now, I'm excited to get into all those things as well.
I always learn a ton from you, Jordan, on the tax side.
You make quite a few mental notes.
I was like, oh, I probably shouldn't do that again.
Or it's like, oh, that's good to that.
Like, whoops.
And so that will be just great general knowledge.
I'm very excited to break down these products and understand.
Yeah, it's like, okay, how are you generating the yield?
How is my Bitcoin custody?
All these things are very important for us to understand.
One of the things I will be hammering home quite a bit is I think specifically the wealth
management industry has needed to change for a long time.
I think even, you know, Tradify normies are kind of sick of the standard AUM fees just
to be put into passive index funds.
And so I think Bitcoin is really going to shake up this specific subsect of the financial
services industry.
I'm really excited to be on the leading front of that and talking to other folks that are on the leading front of that and really kind of trying to help wealth managers specifically understand their business model, how their business model can change on a Bitcoin standard, what type of services would be new or pertinent for them to offer, like being a key agent.
So I think this industry has been ripe for disruption for a long time.
I think Bitcoin is going to have a big role to play in that.
And then just something I think we can add the most value to our audience building on the summit is one of the most impactful things I've done in my career is join the Bitcoin Financial Advisors Network.
And that's a brain trust about 11 other advisors across the country that lead with Bitcoin and their Bitcoin financial advisors.
And we have a quarterly called brain trust call to bounce up different case study ideas or talk about different, you know, customer solutions or lending products.
And one of the things as we get this really humming is we want to focus heavily on building out a community.
We have a signal chat.
We're looking to build a forum as well.
We're getting a newsletter started.
And I would just encourage everybody to really plug in to the community aspect and work with
other like-minded professionals and understand the Bitcoin pie is so large.
And there's such a growing contingency of Bitcoin wealth out there that you're very
much more on the same team than you are competitors and that everybody has the opportunity to
win in this scenario. And so I'm really excited about getting this community aspect off the ground
because I've learned more from Bitcoiners than anybody else. And I think we have a really cool
opportunity to help facilitate that in the financial services industry.
Yeah. No, absolutely. Yeah. So we'll make sure that there's links in the description of the video
and of the podcast to join the Signal Group.
Of course, there are rules in there.
If you do try to tout a shitcoin,
you're going to be removed.
And so just we kind of lead with that.
So we're not pulling any punches if that happens to you.
We were very upfront with that and will continue to be.
So yeah, I would echo that too.
We're excited to build a community of folks
and help people build their businesses,
grow their wealth, grow a legacy for their family.
and um yeah it's great so uh i think we will lead off or leave it there um yeah we will be back
next well i guess are there any announcements on your side wyatt anything you want to talk through
i guess this will probably come out um i hope next wednesday which would be the third december
3rd yeah uh we just have a lot of exciting things kind of kicking off here very shortly
we got updated website like i mentioned we got the newsletter and the signal chat so i encourage you
to follow along with all those things like and subscribe and and share all these so we can really
kind of help get some momentum going and help you know market and get the word out for the the summit
uh better next year that's really kind of you know our our bread and butter and this is just really
all these efforts are meant to support the summit because there's nothing better than get point
Bitcoiners together in person. So just be on the lookout for that. I will be at Bitcoin Mina. I
would love to meet up with anybody in this space who would love to chat. Jordan and I are pretty
frequently getting to different Bitcoin conferences. And so we'd love to bump into you.
Yeah. Yeah, no, that's great. And the only thing I would say, so if it comes down on the third,
a week later if you are in the nashville area we will be hosting a um a like bitcoin tax and policy
update we're partnering with bpi that'll be at the bitcoin park and it will be so december 10th
from 5 to 8 p.m uh central time so if you're around there's the meetup.com you can go to the
Bitcoin Park site and sign up. It's free to attend. So we'll just be discussing. Be on the lookout.
We might be having a U.S. senator come in and give a quick little fireside chat. On the tax side,
specifically, we're going to be giving updates on Big Beautiful Bill, how that changes personal and
business tax considerations. And then also, yeah, we'll hone in a little bit on the bonus
depreciation side for our business clients and then any of our clients that are in the Bitcoin
mining space, because at that point we'll have, we'll still have roughly three weeks to make some,
to make some adjustments if needed prior to year end. So yeah, if you're around a Nashville area,
make sure to come out. So cool. All right, well, we'll, we'll leave it there. If you have any
questions or if you want to request that we speak about any topics or you have a suggestion on
someone we should bring on to the show here, you can actually shoot us an email at contact at
bffs.media. And we will, we are monitoring that email and we'll get back to you. Okay.
Thanks so much, everyone, for tuning into the first episode and we will see you next time.
Thank you.