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This is wildlife unschooling with my mom.

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Okay, awesome. So, very welcome, Christopher Hill. You are the pioneer in luxury volunteer

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traveling. And I am so happy that you're here with me because when my child was quite young,

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I really wanted to travel and to volunteer work with him, but I couldn't find anyone. I mean,

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And that has been like almost 15 years ago.

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And I couldn't find anyone that would accept me with a small child.

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So it's like, okay, I'm the only weirdo out there doing these kind of things.

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And now that I see your wonderful projects, I mean, you have award-winning brands and so many different ideas all over the world.

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You can go and travel with your kids and do volunteer work.

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So I think what you are doing is so impactful.

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Really awesome.

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Very welcome.

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Thank you so much, Alexander. It's such a privilege to be here.

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Nice. Thank you. Yeah, maybe you can tell us a little bit about how you ended up doing what you're doing,

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because I think it's a very special thing to do and not the average Joe job that everyone has.

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Sure. Yeah, there are a few twists and turns in the stories, but here we go.

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I studied business and law at university and was all set to become a lawyer and had accepted a job

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with a law firm and had also got them to agree that I could travel basically like a gap year

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for about nine months before starting working for them. And then in the course of that,

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well actually that I agreed to work with them just at the start of my final year of university and

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then in that final year I won a scholarship from one of the British investment banks and that

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ended up in me while I was traveling having some interviews with the bank and ultimately getting

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a job with them and thinking, well, if I don't take it, I'll probably always regret it.

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And so, yeah, let's give it a shot at London as someone in their early 20s was a very exciting

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place to be.

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And so I thought, yeah, I'd love to spend some time here.

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And in that stint, I did end up spending six years working in London.

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And in that sixth year, I took a trip to South Africa.

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And on that trip, in addition to going on safari and exploring the wonders of the garden route and the wine lands and Cape Town, I also helped to build a house for a family in one of the townships.

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And this just added two extra dimensions to travel for me.

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One, in contrast to that nine months of travel that I'd done previously and some other trips.

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On this occasion, I actually got to interact with the local people and hear their stories and gain insights into their lives.

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And as I say, in all that travel I'd done, that really didn't happen.

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And then secondly, it just felt great to actually make a difference in the lives of the family that we were helping alongside to build.

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And so I got thinking, well, I've learned some good business skills.

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why didn't I put it into something I'd find a bit more meaningful and fulfilling and make it easy for others to have similar experiences?

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And at that point, I left my job and I went to Canada for a year and did another year of study.

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And it was in that year that this idea really took root for me.

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And I wrote the first business plan and decided, yeah, this is what I want to do next in the next sort of phase of my life.

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And so I spent the next couple of years really traveling the world and building relationships with different communities before launching in 2006.

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So we're coming up for 20 years ago now.

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and at that point I had young professionals as our key target audience sort of 25 to 35 year olds who

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were cash rich time poor and who wanted to have a great holiday but at the same time make a

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difference but really right from the beginning we were getting bookings from families and

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at that point, families weren't on my radar at all. It just didn't occur to me that families

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would want to be booking with us. And so I'd ask our clients, our family clients that were booking,

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why they were booking with us. And they'd say things like, our kids come from pretty privileged

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backgrounds, and we really want them to appreciate how fortunate they are. Or they'd say,

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we're looking for a great family bonding experience or we want to inspire our kids

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to become the next generation of world changers.

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And this really resonated with me and even more so now that I do have children of my own.

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And so in fairly short order, we decided to shift our messaging to focus on families.

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It's not to exclude anyone else, but certainly our primary audience is the family audience.

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And it's, yeah, it's been a blast, really.

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It's certainly what gets me out of bed every morning is getting the feedback from our family

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clients as to the transformations that they're making, but also the transformations that they're

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seeing in their own families.

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It's really exciting.

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and just to flesh out slightly and just really quickly how the ages work we tend to say that

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from about the age of five children can get involved especially with our with our wildlife

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projects where they can get involved with like preparing the meals and helping

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maintain enclosures and creating enrichments to stimulate animals should they be in enclosures

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such as, you know, an example would be a project we have in Costa Rica

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with monkeys and parrots whilst they're in the process of being rehabilitated.

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And then we love to recommend when kids hit their teens, roughly,

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but it all depends on the family.

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It can be certainly earlier, to get involved with those building

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or renovation-type projects where there is, from my perspective,

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is where the magic really happens because that's where you like what happened with me in South

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Africa you get that interaction and the engagement and hearing the stories and and that's where the

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big impact happens um yeah so so that's the the the story in a extended nutshell for you Alexandra

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nice you know what I really like about your project is or projects um that because I really

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think we have a pandemic of disconnection. We put our kids in kindergarten, after that in school,

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we go to work, and we barely see each other. And not only within the family, but I really think

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without having all these things we would need to do normally in our everyday lives, we would be

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able to connect with our people that surround us way more. So I really see a lot of families,

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not only within but also with other females very disconnected and through opportunities like um you

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offer it's not only that the families can reconnect and deepen their bond but they reconnect to the

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rest of the world as well so i really think that's two way of reconnection that's very beautiful

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that's a great insight

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it is maybe not yes maybe you um can tell me a bit more about where exactly in the world is happening

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what i mean it is immense looking at the websites of your project it's like you can go everywhere

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doing anything basically maybe what is your favorite three places and your favorite three

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things like volunteer things okay i've got three yeah okay right i think i've got them

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um one i i was able to do with my my family quite recently which was in bali indonesia where it's

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installing a disabled accessible bathroom for a paraplegic and I it's well it's unique for for us

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because the benefit really accrues to just one person but the the impact on that one person is

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so profound and that's because in Bali being a Hindu island if you are born with a disability

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it can be considered as bad karma and and so you really sadly paraplegics can be like hidden away

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and lead very isolated lonely lives and so to be able to uh enable the the individual to have

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a measure of dignity and independence in an area so personal as you know going to the bathroom

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it's uh yeah as i said it's really profound and so that's one of my favorites in terms of projects

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and destinations as well and you know for instance you know our kids were involved with drawing water

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from the village well and then carrying that water over to where the cement was being mixed

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and then getting involved with mixing the cement and then loading it into the wheelbarrows and then

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carrying it over carrying the cement over to where the experts were doing the the the tricky

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parts and and most of the you know the real work um is done by the local experts um and and and that

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can you know be combined with um sightseeing as as a family wants to do like for instance we did

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some whitewater rafting, some mountain biking, a cooking class, some surf lessons,

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some hiking, visiting waterfalls and the rice paddies. And so, and each trip is tailor-made

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like that. So that's one. Another one that we've been able to do, well, yeah, within the last

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couple of years is in Belize, and that is installing eco-friendly stoves in people's homes.

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And the beauty of these stoves is threefold, really. One, they replace the open flames that

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you find in traditional huts. And so particularly with kids running around, there's risks of them

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getting burnt from the flames. So by having an enclosed stove, you reduce those burns. And

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they also have a chimney to expel the smoke. And so respiratory problems are dramatically reduced.

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And then they're much more fuel efficient. So from an environmental perspective, they're

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a win as well. And the other beautiful thing about these stoves is that they can be completed

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by a family in just a couple of days as well, again, with expert help.

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But still, it's quite satisfying to be able to go right from start to finish

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with a project like that.

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And that combines well with diving and snorkeling in the Belize Barrier Reef.

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There's kayaking to do.

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There's ziplining.

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there's um bean to bar chocolate making mayan ruins to explore so it's a it's a great destination for

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adventurous families and then thirdly i would say i'm gonna go with um argentina where our project

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there is actually creating solar heating panels out of recycled cans and bottles. It's a fairly

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innovative technology that a local person has developed. And so just in a short period of time,

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you can provide these, yeah, these, or create these panels for families. So you're saving on

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on electricity bills, on money that can be put into, for example, education. So that's another

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really satisfying project. And being such a huge country, there's so many options, but some of the

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favourites of things to do are exploring Buenos Aires, which can be on foot or by bike, going down

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to the glaciers or the mountain area in Patagonia or up to Aguasso Falls or into the desert area of

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Salta. Yeah, so many options, but there's three for you. Really nice. Thank you so much.

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Yes. So when we initially connected, you told me about a family that I think they took a gap year

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or they were world schooling all along, I don't know.

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And you told me about this great experience you had with them.

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Maybe we can deep dive into this because I think that's quite interesting.

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I meet more and more families that choose to travel full time

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and I hear the best stories and I see the most happy kids I've ever seen.

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Yeah yeah true I was actually really privileged to be able to spend some time with this particular family that from the United States But when they came down here to New Zealand I yeah I actually I showed them around Auckland for a day which was which was a blast as well

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But yeah, so they were in the very fortunate position of being able to take a year out from work and travel the world.

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And so we had the opportunity to arrange parts of it, not their whole itinerary,

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but we arranged New Zealand, Australia, Cambodia, Laos,

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and Japan for them.

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And so, yeah, they did a bunch of different projects with us as well

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from building predator-proof boxes for penguins in New Zealand.

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Oh, cute.

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yeah, yeah. The penguins being native to New Zealand are very vulnerable to introduced pests

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such as rats and stoats and weasels and then also things that you don't think of as pests

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but such as feral cats or dogs as well. And so these boxes are protecting the penguins

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from from those attacks um so they're gonna fall with that while they're in new zealand

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and then they they build a house when they're in cambodia for a family and in laos they

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participated in a a reading project um yeah like a literacy project for for local laotians and

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And I think that, yeah, in Australia, they got involved with doing some wildlife surveys

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with university researchers.

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So helping them with their statistics and counting of wallabies and wallaroos as well.

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Yeah.

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What field is that?

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That's nice. It's quite diverse, I would say. And I really experienced that traveling has immense power to educate kids. Because I think experiencing something firsthand is a huge difference than learning about it in school.

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it's quite a difference if you tell someone about hieroglyphs and the pharaoh and the beauty of

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old egypt but going there is no it's just a different story and i think it's connecting

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emotions experiences it's much deeper learning experience than anything else and i think

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especially through this volunteering projects you have it adds an extra layer to compassion

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and all these beautiful things that are getting more and more lost

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in our society nowadays.

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So you're bringing it back.

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Maybe we can talk a little bit about the big, yeah,

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educational advantages these kids have when they, yeah,

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go on these trips with their parents and what is there to learn

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and experience for them.

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Yeah.

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Well, as you've identified, there is the world classroom of Egypt or Rome or Jordan or wherever the case may be.

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But then on our projects, you can, as you say, add an extra layer through developing perhaps the soft skills, shall we say, of empathy and compassion and gratitude and generosity and contentment.

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You know, one thing, one story that springs to mind in that context really was a family that went to Morocco with us and they were involved with building a library at a rural school about an hour away from Marrakesh.

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and they

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the children were quite young

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they weren't so much involved in the building

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they were more involved just playing

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with the local kids and getting

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that interaction

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but what I heard

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when they got back home

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was when Christmas time came around

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they said actually we want our Christmas gifts to go to

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the children in Morocco that we were

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playing with

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and so yeah that really

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blew me away when I heard that because yeah clearly you know great lessons of

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one contentment and generosity and compassion were learned from our trip so yeah that's

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you know an example that I love to share. That's really nice and I can share maybe something from

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my travel experiences with my child because I think the strongest bonding moment sorry he had

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with like really poor people that have nothing like really nothing and we were in the jungle

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in Thailand when he was quite young and I figured out that I mean there was language barrier and

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everything cultural barriers but it was the easiest for him to connect with these people

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to play with the kids to really bond with the adults they took him on trips on their motorbikes

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through the jungle without any problem and my kid he he was born in Berlin I mean he has like the

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stranger danger thing in his genes but over there it was just something else and I think that brought

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for me some kind of hope that okay humanity can connect no matter where we are from and sometimes

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having like really just nature around you and very harsh environment maybe makes it even easier to

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really deeply connect with each other. I found that quite nice. But I wanted to ask you something

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completely different, to be honest about it, because you organize school trips as well.

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And when I was a kid, I was very, yeah, I had, I was lucky. I was in a private school,

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and we had trips every year to really nice destinations, if it was sailing, skiing,

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in monasteries with monks and everything.

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So I'm very, very lucky.

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Now, when I took a look at all the schools in Berlin

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that my son could apply to, I was like shocked.

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Like, oh my God, they have to stay at home

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like the whole year?

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The only way they can travel is with their parents.

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That doesn't make sense.

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So I figured out, okay, I was just very lucky

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and all the other kids around us,

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it is just normal that they stay home

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and do only the minimal basic stuff

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with the kids in school.

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So I really think that's a beautiful idea to involve the schools as well.

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Maybe you can share a little bit of your experience with that, because what kind of schools are doing these awesome trips?

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I mean, it's not a normal school, obviously.

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Well, some schools really surprise me that do do it.

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But you're right.

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it tends what i've found uh most of all put it most of our school and clients are international

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schools and also ones that offer the international baccalaureate curriculum and and that's

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particularly because the international baccalaureate schools have the requirements for the extracurricular

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components being uh what they call cass or creativity activity and and service as these

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three fundamentals that each student needs to do in addition to their curriculum and and so

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What we can do is help students achieve their CAS requirements on a trip.

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So, for instance, let's take a trip to India.

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The creativity component can be done with things like Bollywood dance lessons or cooking classes or handcraft stitching lessons.

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you know from from local artisans and then the activity parts could be um

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you're doing a hike in the in the in the mountains or you know bike riding through

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through villages or you know or some whitewater rafting uh so there's those options and then the

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service part is where we really come into our own. And so for instance, in India we've got projects

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like, again, helping at a, there's a wonderful school that we work with in the slums of Delhi,

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it's a number of schools now, but all set up by one Indian woman who was from quite a

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well-off background. Her father was an ambassador. And when he passed away, she decided to put her

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inheritance into actually founding these schools in the slums of Delhi, because whilst technically

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the children had to go to school, the quality of the education was terrible. So she wanted to

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something up, which would enable that. And so we've been able to work with them for, gosh,

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since we started, so nearly 20 years now, with people going and being either reading partners,

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or they might have more specialist skills that they can share with high school students,

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or special needs students that they have,

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or because they're in the slums,

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helping with repair and renovation work as well,

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which is an ongoing thing there.

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So there's an opportunity to get involved with that.

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They also have elephant conservation projects in India,

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which are really incredibly educational as well

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in terms of learning not only about elephant behaviour,

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but also to learn about why elephant riding is not a good thing

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and it should actually be banned,

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and actually showing students the torture devices

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that are implemented on the elephants in order to make them rideable.

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So there's that aspect to the education as well.

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And then there's also a bear conservation project

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for sloth bears in India that we've had students go to as well.

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So that's just an example of what a international baccalaureate CAS trip could look like.

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That obviously doesn't have to be that curriculum school, but that's like I say, the majority of our clients for our school trips are from international baccalaureate and or international schools.

250
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That's really nice.

251
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How do you choose your partners?

252
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because I've been reading about that you've been traveling for, I think,

253
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two years to find good partners for your projects.

254
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And I think the hunt is ongoing because there is a never-ending, yeah,

255
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I don't know, it's never-ending too.

256
00:26:46,516 --> 00:26:47,816
Yeah, it's crazy out there.

257
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How do you choose these partners?

258
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How do you find these people who need help?

259
00:26:54,316 --> 00:26:55,236
Great question.

260
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There's not really any, there's no one way.

261
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I think it's over the years, it's been a case of just keeping an ear out for an ear out.

262
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Sorry.

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And it's good network.

264
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And so that combination has meant that putting feelers out, you just hear about things and

265
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then think, oh, yeah, that sounds really quite innovative, and let's go and check it out firsthand.

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For example, the project I mentioned in Bali, that all came about because Vodafone, the mobile phone

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company, I don't know if they still do this, but certainly they used to have the Vodafone

268
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Foundation, which was where employees could basically get a scholarship to go and volunteer

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for like a year somewhere abroad.

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And one of these recipients did it in Bali.

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And she was working with the charity

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that is involved with building

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these disabled accessible bathrooms.

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Although she was more helping

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on the accounts and administration side.

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and primarily they actually do prosthetics is the main work that they do across across Bali but

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anyway so she came back to New Zealand and I didn't know her but someone knew her and said oh

278
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you know you should talk with her and so I did and and she told me about the work that she she did

279
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there and the charity she was assisting and so I made a trip up to Bali and met with them and and

280
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And my approach has always been and this as I say in every instance it never to come with preconceived ideas of what I think should be done It always really to start with firstly finding out if there is an openness to having people from overseas come

281
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And then secondly, if the answer to the first question is yes,

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then to find out what from their perspective help could look like.

283
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And so, you know, in that particular case, they spoke about, yeah,

284
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we could do with the help is the funding that's required to get these bathrooms built.

285
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I mean, they cost about two and a thousand US dollars each one.

286
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And that's well, well, well beyond the means of any family that needs the bathroom.

287
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And so this is where really our model comes in, which I describe as a philanthropic volunteering model, in that it's the funds that our clients bring, which enables us to pay for the materials and hire those local experts to do most of the work, particularly in the case of these bathrooms.

288
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And then our clients come and spend the last few days doing the finishing touches to the project.

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And that's where, so the benefit they bring is the funding to make it happen.

290
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And then the benefit the client gets is the interaction that I've been speaking about.

291
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And so, yeah, there's no real one way, but once I do hear about it, then the model is consistent in terms of going there, experiencing it firsthand and always from an asking questions perspective, never imposing anything about what I might think should be done.

292
00:31:11,312 --> 00:31:11,972
That's cool.

293
00:31:11,972 --> 00:31:19,212
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301
00:31:49,672 --> 00:32:00,452
what was maybe the craziest project you ever worked with let's see if this fits that fits

302
00:32:00,452 --> 00:32:16,172
the bill or not. It was involved with, it was actually in the US where, it was a wolf conservation

303
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project in the US where wolves have been since I think the late 60s, I might have that wrong,

304
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but I think since about then, a real success story in Wyoming

305
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and in Yellowstone National Park.

306
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And they've since spread out quite a lot, but apart from in Colorado.

307
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And the idea was really to get basically sufficient funding

308
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to lobby the government, the local Colorado government,

309
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to approve a wolf corridor,

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which would essentially enable them to roam across Colorado

311
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and have that basically the whole southwest,

312
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well, no, basically western part of North America

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wolf territory again.

314
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So that was

315
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kind of a one-off thing, but

316
00:33:24,552 --> 00:33:26,032
also pretty

317
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certainly unique. I don't know if it's

318
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crazy, but unique and a great

319
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success story as well.

320
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Yeah, if it's a success

321
00:33:36,552 --> 00:33:38,492
story, I think that's crazy. I think it's

322
00:33:38,492 --> 00:33:40,552
beautiful crazy. Maybe like that.

323
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What is your personal favorite

324
00:33:42,892 --> 00:33:44,732
maybe story

325
00:33:44,732 --> 00:33:46,812
that you want to share

326
00:33:46,812 --> 00:33:55,732
Over all these years, you experienced this volunteer traveling and from the business perspective, from the family perspective.

327
00:33:56,092 --> 00:33:59,932
What is your favorite story to share?

328
00:34:00,932 --> 00:34:01,452
Okay.

329
00:34:02,532 --> 00:34:08,052
There's one story where it was not a family.

330
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It was an early retired lady.

331
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She was English.

332
00:34:13,552 --> 00:34:19,532
and she hadn't travelled much at all, certainly not, never to Africa before.

333
00:34:20,072 --> 00:34:24,992
But for whatever reason, she decided to travel to Kenya with us.

334
00:34:26,392 --> 00:34:34,692
And so she required even more hand-holding than usual.

335
00:34:36,692 --> 00:34:38,332
Just a bit of a nervous traveller.

336
00:34:38,332 --> 00:34:45,752
And so sort of leading up to the trip and during the trip, there was a lot, you know, a lot of contact with her.

337
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And she was helping at a children's center in Kenya and then, you know, went on safari and had a bit of beach time as well.

338
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And, and the reason I tell the story is because, you know, as I said, she was very nervous.

339
00:35:05,372 --> 00:35:10,512
and then after the trip she was basically on the next flight back down there because she was so

340
00:35:10,512 --> 00:35:15,492
transformed by her time at the children's home and had gained so much confidence she was she'd

341
00:35:15,492 --> 00:35:21,012
rented her own apartment and and bought a car there and she was driving all around Nairobi

342
00:35:21,012 --> 00:35:28,472
all her own this was really um we just sort of helped facilitate the the relationship with the

343
00:35:28,472 --> 00:35:33,392
with the charity um after that but you know the rest of it she just arranged on her own so it was

344
00:35:33,392 --> 00:35:38,832
it was a great story of you know someone transformed and then um

345
00:35:40,192 --> 00:35:50,992
uh a lot more confident and and then deciding to actually um you know spend in the next few months

346
00:35:52,672 --> 00:35:58,752
serving in that way as well nice that is really beautiful i like to hear that because i really

347
00:35:58,752 --> 00:36:05,192
think and experience it for myself that traveling can be very transformative if you are open-minded

348
00:36:05,192 --> 00:36:14,272
and if you have a nice travel experience if it's i mean okay whatever nice so what is the go-to

349
00:36:14,272 --> 00:36:19,172
thing for most families when it comes to volunteering what is most popular i mean i can

350
00:36:19,172 --> 00:36:27,912
imagine feeding wallabies of course this is beautiful but what is the most popular thing

351
00:36:27,912 --> 00:36:29,092
amongst families?

352
00:36:31,092 --> 00:36:34,272
It probably, to an extent, comes back to what I was saying earlier

353
00:36:34,272 --> 00:36:35,292
about the age of the children.

354
00:36:35,712 --> 00:36:41,112
And so if the children are preteens, then it is our wildlife projects,

355
00:36:41,112 --> 00:36:47,132
which are definitely what we would recommend unless they wanted

356
00:36:47,132 --> 00:36:52,712
to have, you know, maybe they have older children as well,

357
00:36:52,712 --> 00:36:58,952
or maybe not, and just happy for the kids to focus on that interaction and just play.

358
00:37:01,832 --> 00:37:08,312
So, and on that, yes, certainly one of our most popular destinations, probably it is our most

359
00:37:08,312 --> 00:37:13,672
popular destination is Costa Rica. And there we do have this wildlife conservation project

360
00:37:13,672 --> 00:37:19,912
where there are injured or rescued monkeys, parrots, sloths,

361
00:37:20,872 --> 00:37:24,032
or whatever other animals are in there at the time.

362
00:37:24,932 --> 00:37:29,532
And children, as I mentioned, can get involved with preparing the meals

363
00:37:29,532 --> 00:37:34,972
and maintaining the enclosures and creating the enrichments

364
00:37:34,972 --> 00:37:37,092
and just learning an enormous amount about the animals.

365
00:37:37,812 --> 00:37:40,092
There's not any contact with the animals,

366
00:37:40,092 --> 00:37:43,092
but there's great opportunity to learn a lot about them.

367
00:37:43,672 --> 00:37:50,312
And then, as I say, if they get older, then it's the building projects that are popular.

368
00:37:51,032 --> 00:37:52,832
And I've touched on quite a few of those.

369
00:37:54,692 --> 00:37:59,392
What would be, what might be a slightly different one?

370
00:38:01,052 --> 00:38:03,112
Oh, well, okay.

371
00:38:03,892 --> 00:38:04,392
I don't know.

372
00:38:04,392 --> 00:38:17,972
In Kenya, one of our main projects is renovating classrooms there in the Maasai, just on the edge of the Maasai Mara, so it combines really well with safari.

373
00:38:17,972 --> 00:38:35,772
And then in Tanzania, just south, there's the opportunity to build homes for teachers that are near to the schools so that they don't have to spend so much time traveling in order to get to school.

374
00:38:36,592 --> 00:38:42,552
And thus their attendance of being a teacher is higher as well.

375
00:38:43,112 --> 00:38:47,952
So those are a couple of popular examples for those building projects

376
00:38:47,952 --> 00:38:50,392
that we love to get our teenage kids involved in.

377
00:38:51,052 --> 00:38:51,712
That's cool.

378
00:38:51,832 --> 00:38:54,212
You know what I would have chosen?

379
00:38:54,592 --> 00:38:58,092
I mean, I took a look and I was like, okay, if I could book a trip,

380
00:38:58,252 --> 00:38:58,892
what would it be?

381
00:38:59,392 --> 00:38:59,972
Costa Rica.

382
00:39:00,792 --> 00:39:03,812
So I'm a typical family booker, obviously.

383
00:39:04,772 --> 00:39:06,132
But because I thought, like,

384
00:39:07,212 --> 00:39:10,192
wildlife is just something beautiful for our kids.

385
00:39:10,192 --> 00:39:18,512
and especially my son now is pre-teen teen in this age and i had the same thought process of okay we

386
00:39:18,512 --> 00:39:25,872
met so many people blah blah blah what else could we do what might inspire him to i don't know change

387
00:39:25,872 --> 00:39:32,512
the way he sees the world and it would have been wildlife in costa rica he chose because i showed

388
00:39:32,512 --> 00:39:38,672
him i was like dude take a look all these beautiful places what would you choose and i chose wildlife

389
00:39:38,672 --> 00:39:47,292
he chose costa rica so yeah right so we have a two big discerning tastes yes seriously nice yeah

390
00:39:47,292 --> 00:39:53,452
um i mean we talked a lot about what the kids can learn but what do you think can the parents

391
00:39:53,452 --> 00:39:59,232
learn because i learned tons from my child while traveling because he is way more open-minded

392
00:39:59,232 --> 00:40:07,012
he is way more i forgot the english word valiente he has courage he's very courageous

393
00:40:07,012 --> 00:40:15,552
and I'm not I'm like a typical okay don't get me involved in anything crazy let's not do it and

394
00:40:15,552 --> 00:40:21,972
because of him I started to be okay with snakes because he wanted to visit the special snake

395
00:40:21,972 --> 00:40:27,712
center in Thailand like 10 days in a row and at the 10th day I was like okay give me that snake I

396
00:40:27,712 --> 00:40:33,112
want to touch it now and now I'm a pro in this kind of things and I really learned way more

397
00:40:33,112 --> 00:40:39,052
through my child how he's interacting with his surrounding while traveling than learning from

398
00:40:39,052 --> 00:40:45,432
myself so maybe you have something to share about what the parents gain and what they learn

399
00:40:45,432 --> 00:40:56,912
well yeah that's a great perspective i think you

400
00:40:56,912 --> 00:41:08,292
can just get that shift in perspective by observing children and taking on

401
00:41:08,292 --> 00:41:15,832
their point of view. And that can be, yeah, it can be just on a regular trope, or it could be

402
00:41:16,672 --> 00:41:25,572
observing them being open to playing. You spoke about stranger danger in your son,

403
00:41:25,572 --> 00:41:32,252
is that understandable reticence that we have these days

404
00:41:32,252 --> 00:41:35,932
with people we don't know.

405
00:41:37,712 --> 00:41:43,112
But our children, even if we try to instill that in them,

406
00:41:44,712 --> 00:41:46,272
there can just be an inherent openness,

407
00:41:46,972 --> 00:41:50,452
which we can learn from and I've learned from for sure.

408
00:41:51,312 --> 00:41:55,512
And then another thing, certainly I can say as an adult,

409
00:41:55,572 --> 00:41:57,952
one key thing that I learned

410
00:41:57,952 --> 00:42:01,292
and I'm still learning really

411
00:42:01,292 --> 00:42:03,772
is around contentment

412
00:42:03,772 --> 00:42:05,572
in these contexts

413
00:42:05,572 --> 00:42:06,752
and you touched on it as well

414
00:42:06,752 --> 00:42:10,912
the people that we interact with

415
00:42:10,912 --> 00:42:14,012
materially have very little

416
00:42:14,012 --> 00:42:17,132
but are so much happier

417
00:42:17,132 --> 00:42:18,752
than myself

418
00:42:18,752 --> 00:42:21,832
and people around me

419
00:42:21,832 --> 00:42:31,672
that it was a real key lesson for me that having the latest whatever,

420
00:42:31,812 --> 00:42:34,772
X, Y, Z, is not going to make me happy.

421
00:42:35,692 --> 00:42:40,012
It's more, you know, inner happiness and actually being content

422
00:42:40,012 --> 00:42:44,432
with what we have is a great step towards happiness.

423
00:42:45,092 --> 00:42:48,132
And that's a key lesson that I learned from actually getting

424
00:42:48,132 --> 00:42:51,952
to engage and interact with people, as I say,

425
00:42:52,032 --> 00:42:54,692
who materially don't have that much,

426
00:42:54,832 --> 00:42:58,412
but spiritually and emotionally are very rich.

427
00:43:00,352 --> 00:43:03,132
Yeah, I do have some questions around building

428
00:43:03,132 --> 00:43:04,912
such a unique brand.

429
00:43:05,232 --> 00:43:08,352
I mean, this is not something that happens overnight, obviously.

430
00:43:08,952 --> 00:43:12,632
And I can imagine that you faced quite some challenges

431
00:43:12,632 --> 00:43:13,792
when building this.

432
00:43:14,312 --> 00:43:15,932
Maybe we can talk a little bit about that

433
00:43:15,932 --> 00:43:20,812
Because I imagine, I mean, everyone who's building their own projects,

434
00:43:21,012 --> 00:43:23,012
it's like raising a kid.

435
00:43:24,532 --> 00:43:32,072
We had some challenges, things like when we first launched,

436
00:43:32,812 --> 00:43:36,452
we had the mindset.

437
00:43:36,632 --> 00:43:49,188
I mentioned that it was young professionals was our audience but also we were doing small group trips which meant we had fixed dates

438
00:43:49,188 --> 00:43:57,328
So the first brochure that we produced had a list of different travel dates in it.

439
00:43:57,328 --> 00:44:07,328
And we got to the point where, the really actually frustrating point,

440
00:44:07,328 --> 00:44:12,208
where we'd get some bookings, but not enough to hit the minimum numbers for that group,

441
00:44:12,208 --> 00:44:20,008
and then had to cancel or try and scramble and try and rearrange people onto other trips.

442
00:44:20,008 --> 00:44:28,908
And that, as I say, was really frustrating to potentially just not be able to run the trips for people.

443
00:44:29,528 --> 00:44:36,668
And so our solution to overcoming that really was to shift to a fully tailor-made approach

444
00:44:36,668 --> 00:44:44,088
where every trip is crafted for the individual unit.

445
00:44:44,088 --> 00:44:51,028
And that could be an individual or it could be a family or a couple or a group, a school or whatever the case may be.

446
00:44:51,428 --> 00:44:54,888
But yes, certainly that springs to mind as an early challenge.

447
00:44:55,508 --> 00:45:05,308
We launched in 2006 and wasn't too much before hitting the global financial crisis as well.

448
00:45:05,308 --> 00:45:11,548
So, you know, we spent the first couple of years trying to get the brand recognition out there.

449
00:45:11,548 --> 00:45:14,448
and then you have a global recession.

450
00:45:14,968 --> 00:45:16,808
So that was challenging times as well.

451
00:45:17,808 --> 00:45:21,888
And then obviously more since then, COVID was a big one.

452
00:45:22,348 --> 00:45:23,228
That's crazy.

453
00:45:24,328 --> 00:45:26,788
Yeah, that was a break for everyone, I would say.

454
00:45:28,068 --> 00:45:31,788
Were you able to observe any kind of changes?

455
00:45:32,408 --> 00:45:34,488
Like the world has so many issues,

456
00:45:34,488 --> 00:45:38,028
but I think you see a lot of projects

457
00:45:38,028 --> 00:45:43,948
and therefore you see like the broad range of problems the world has to offer you know what i

458
00:45:43,948 --> 00:45:49,648
mean what is fixable out there did it change over the years got it more extreme or do you think

459
00:45:49,648 --> 00:45:58,348
in which direction are we heading oh gosh i wouldn't like to say which which direction we're

460
00:45:58,348 --> 00:46:07,728
heading but um i could say things like certainly environmental issues uh are increasing and

461
00:46:07,728 --> 00:46:19,308
And so things like what I mentioned in Argentina with the creating the solar heating out of recycled bottles and cans.

462
00:46:19,728 --> 00:46:26,848
We have something a bit similar in Morocco these days as well is new and innovative.

463
00:46:26,848 --> 00:46:36,668
And I think also one new area, which is also environmental, is around coral reef restoration work.

464
00:46:36,668 --> 00:46:44,948
We were just in French Polynesia in Tahiti, or specifically Moria, just a couple of months ago.

465
00:46:46,108 --> 00:46:55,048
And we were evaluating it in terms of a potential new volunteer project

466
00:46:55,048 --> 00:47:03,608
because I read that what they were offering at one point was actually visitors could come

467
00:47:03,608 --> 00:47:12,548
and help to build these small parts of coral reefs,

468
00:47:12,548 --> 00:47:17,268
which then grow and go to, initially they go to like a,

469
00:47:17,428 --> 00:47:19,708
actually effectively like a nursery where they grow

470
00:47:19,708 --> 00:47:25,988
before they're then transplanted into more substantial existing coral reefs.

471
00:47:27,948 --> 00:47:32,688
However, that project, they now actually employ local people to do it.

472
00:47:33,608 --> 00:47:38,248
So they don't require volunteers anymore.

473
00:47:38,368 --> 00:47:40,088
So it actually didn't get off the ground as a project,

474
00:47:40,088 --> 00:47:50,568
but certainly that area of coral restoration is an area that is seeing a lot of interest and attention and innovation as well,

475
00:47:50,648 --> 00:47:51,708
which is really exciting to see.

476
00:47:52,468 --> 00:47:52,888
That's cool.

477
00:47:53,748 --> 00:47:55,128
I have maybe a question.

478
00:47:55,248 --> 00:47:57,348
If you don't want to answer that, that's perfectly fine for me.

479
00:47:58,228 --> 00:48:01,208
Because I've been traveling, as I said, with my child,

480
00:48:01,208 --> 00:48:05,988
And I've seen a lot of, let's say, like kids and also animals.

481
00:48:06,208 --> 00:48:11,468
I somehow suffer more when I see animals suffering than when I see humans suffering.

482
00:48:11,628 --> 00:48:12,128
I don't know why.

483
00:48:12,208 --> 00:48:14,708
That's pretty shitty of me, but it is what it is.

484
00:48:14,828 --> 00:48:16,308
No, it's natural.

485
00:48:16,948 --> 00:48:17,788
I don't know.

486
00:48:18,408 --> 00:48:24,868
So I've seen a lot of kids being born in unfair setups, I would say.

487
00:48:25,048 --> 00:48:27,228
And it made me question God.

488
00:48:27,228 --> 00:48:29,228
I was raised very religious.

489
00:48:29,228 --> 00:48:36,128
and through traveling I really lost faith in God now I have it back because I think I traveled more

490
00:48:36,128 --> 00:48:42,168
and more and I didn't give up questioning and questioning and then refinding my faith maybe

491
00:48:42,168 --> 00:48:50,188
but the first maybe five or six years of traveling I was like I think God is an asshole because why

492
00:48:50,188 --> 00:48:58,108
the fuck are some kids so rich in everything and some are born in the most awful environments

493
00:48:58,108 --> 00:49:05,068
possible and I go there I see it I can help a little bit that yeah cheers me up cheers them up

494
00:49:05,068 --> 00:49:11,308
and then I leave and then the situation is back to what it has been I live my life and I can go on

495
00:49:11,308 --> 00:49:17,308
with being unhappy because I didn't like the tv commercial and these kids are suffering every day

496
00:49:17,308 --> 00:49:25,548
so I somehow had immense trouble with this question like why is that going on out there and

497
00:49:25,548 --> 00:49:30,468
I mean, I'm fortunate, but there are so many more kids that aren't.

498
00:49:31,428 --> 00:49:33,508
How do you deal with these kind of things?

499
00:49:34,128 --> 00:49:35,728
Yeah, that's a big question.

500
00:49:38,208 --> 00:49:48,208
I think that the issue of suffering is,

501
00:49:48,208 --> 00:49:51,648
it is a

502
00:49:51,648 --> 00:49:57,988
argument against God. The interesting thing is that it's also

503
00:49:57,988 --> 00:50:03,948
an argument that's posed in the Bible itself against God, you know, in terms of, you know, Ecclesiastes and

504
00:50:03,948 --> 00:50:07,888
even Job, really, as well, questioning God

505
00:50:07,888 --> 00:50:11,368
when there's in the presence of suffering. So

506
00:50:11,368 --> 00:50:16,268
I don't have all the answers, but

507
00:50:16,268 --> 00:50:26,868
But what I might say, well, what I will say may come across as,

508
00:50:27,868 --> 00:50:33,628
it's not a full answer, but at best a partial answer.

509
00:50:33,628 --> 00:50:41,008
And it's retelling a story that I like of the starfish.

510
00:50:42,008 --> 00:50:48,568
You've probably heard it, the story of where one morning after a storm,

511
00:50:48,728 --> 00:50:51,688
there's thousands of starfish that are washed up onto the sea

512
00:50:51,688 --> 00:50:57,028
and a little boy decides to one by one put them back into the sea

513
00:50:57,028 --> 00:50:58,088
and someone says, what are you doing?

514
00:50:58,208 --> 00:51:02,188
You know, there's so much, so many here, you can't save them all.

515
00:51:03,988 --> 00:51:07,968
And he says, well, you know, I'm saving that one and I'm saving that one.

516
00:51:07,968 --> 00:51:19,888
And as I said, it's definitely not a complete answer to your question of suffering, but I think to an extent we can just look to ourselves and say, what can we do?

517
00:51:19,888 --> 00:51:36,168
And so personally, I think that's what God has put on our hearts to, in whatever capacity we're in, be the change.

518
00:51:37,268 --> 00:51:45,488
And so in a privileged position that is more than someone who is in desperate suffering.

519
00:51:45,488 --> 00:52:03,128
Even, well, this is me going off on a bit of a tangent potentially, but Jesus spoke about people given different talents and giftings and the person who's given more talents, more is required of them.

520
00:52:03,328 --> 00:52:13,868
That does put a heavier on us on the likes of us to use those gifts and abilities to benefit others.

521
00:52:13,868 --> 00:52:21,688
yeah nice I came to the same conclusion if I have the power to do that this is maybe what I should

522
00:52:21,688 --> 00:52:27,568
be doing really cool yes thank you so much for answering that because I don't think it's a

523
00:52:27,568 --> 00:52:35,808
normal question to ask maybe so I really want to know what did what are you planning for the future

524
00:52:35,808 --> 00:52:43,908
because you are expanding your buffet of things to explore constantly.

525
00:52:44,708 --> 00:52:48,868
And I've seen, I think you have three different brands, maybe.

526
00:52:49,188 --> 00:52:49,668
Is it right?

527
00:52:49,808 --> 00:52:50,648
Three different brands.

528
00:52:51,828 --> 00:52:53,708
So what is planned for the future?

529
00:52:53,868 --> 00:52:56,748
I mean, new destinations, new volunteering experiences.

530
00:52:57,088 --> 00:52:57,948
What do you have in mind?

531
00:52:58,048 --> 00:52:59,228
Or something completely different?

532
00:53:00,528 --> 00:53:00,768
Yeah.

533
00:53:00,768 --> 00:53:14,608
um there's well um i'll probably you know share about that the third brand which is impact

534
00:53:14,608 --> 00:53:21,068
destinations which is a much newer brand for us and and the idea with that one is that it's a

535
00:53:21,068 --> 00:53:28,728
it's really a pure philanthropic model as opposed to a philanthropic volunteering model like hands

536
00:53:28,728 --> 00:53:35,528
holidays is and what i mean by that is whereas hands of holidays involves actually you know

537
00:53:35,528 --> 00:53:42,968
physically helping it might be you know wielding a hammer or it might be um with a paintbrush or

538
00:53:42,968 --> 00:53:48,568
you know mixing the cement or whatever the case may be the idea with impact destinations is that

539
00:53:48,568 --> 00:53:56,408
it's a traveler's philanthropic donation which really enables the experts to do what they do best

540
00:53:56,408 --> 00:54:03,208
in the destination and at the same time will unlock a unique experience for the traveler.

541
00:54:03,768 --> 00:54:09,768
So for example, and this kind of comes back to my point around environmental concerns or

542
00:54:11,448 --> 00:54:19,848
yeah, yeah environmental concerns, in that 80% of our experiences are focused on

543
00:54:19,848 --> 00:54:22,968
on conservation, on wildlife conservation. So for example,

544
00:54:22,968 --> 00:54:34,128
in Indonesia, guests can fund the rescue of an orangutan family that's facing habitat loss due

545
00:54:34,128 --> 00:54:43,168
to palm oil production. And so their trees are being chopped down in order to make way for palm

546
00:54:43,168 --> 00:54:49,808
oil trees. And so to fund the rescue and the release of the family into a protected reserve.

547
00:54:49,808 --> 00:55:02,888
And then in return for that, the traveler actually gets to go into an exclusive tract of rainforest and track the orangutans in the wild.

548
00:55:04,328 --> 00:55:18,568
And so that's something I'm really excited about because it's around, for me, it really speaks about leaving a legacy and being able to say, you know, I saved the life of an orangutan when I was in Indonesia.

549
00:55:18,568 --> 00:55:23,128
but also having an incredible experience at the same time.

550
00:55:23,128 --> 00:55:29,228
So as I mentioned, about 80% of the projects are conservation-related,

551
00:55:29,368 --> 00:55:31,728
but other ones are things like in Australia,

552
00:55:31,828 --> 00:55:35,748
we offer the opportunity to fund a scholarship

553
00:55:35,748 --> 00:55:38,388
for a promising Aboriginal arts student.

554
00:55:39,208 --> 00:55:43,648
And in exchange for that, guests get to spend time

555
00:55:43,648 --> 00:55:45,688
with an established Aboriginal artist

556
00:55:45,688 --> 00:55:48,748
from whom they can commission their own unique work of art

557
00:55:48,748 --> 00:55:50,088
and take that home with them.

558
00:55:50,888 --> 00:55:56,028
So these are sort of, as far as I know, it's a unique concept

559
00:55:56,028 --> 00:55:58,008
and something I'm really excited about

560
00:55:58,008 --> 00:56:09,268
and always on the lookout for new ways that we can, as I say,

561
00:56:10,408 --> 00:56:12,808
enable the funding to have an impact,

562
00:56:12,808 --> 00:56:17,408
enable the locals to do what they need to do,

563
00:56:17,528 --> 00:56:20,728
but also create something unique for the traveler.

564
00:56:21,788 --> 00:56:22,468
Really nice.

565
00:56:23,308 --> 00:56:24,188
Pretty cool.

566
00:56:24,348 --> 00:56:27,548
So for everyone who's now feeling like, yeah,

567
00:56:27,708 --> 00:56:30,108
I would want to go on these trips,

568
00:56:30,108 --> 00:56:35,348
I will put all the links to your work in the podcast description, of course.

569
00:56:35,548 --> 00:56:38,948
And maybe you want to share where is the go-to source

570
00:56:38,948 --> 00:56:41,928
to stay up to date with the things you do.

571
00:56:42,808 --> 00:56:51,528
yeah thanks so much Alexandra uh probably still out our websites which then can take you to the

572
00:56:51,528 --> 00:56:58,288
socials if you're interested so there's handsupholidays.com and impactdestinations.com

573
00:56:58,288 --> 00:57:05,208
and handsupschooltrips.com yeah pretty nice nice really thank you so much for sharing all

574
00:57:05,208 --> 00:57:10,328
this information with me I know that some questions might have been like a bit off but

575
00:57:10,328 --> 00:57:15,528
I really enjoyed all your impact and everything that you shared.

576
00:57:16,608 --> 00:57:18,108
I love what you're doing.

577
00:57:18,428 --> 00:57:22,168
I really think that is what more and more people should be doing.

578
00:57:22,668 --> 00:57:23,528
Really awesome.

579
00:57:23,868 --> 00:57:25,428
Thank you so, so much for being my guest.

580
00:57:27,048 --> 00:57:28,468
Absolutely a pleasure, Alexandra.

581
00:57:28,568 --> 00:57:30,408
And thank you so much for the opportunity to share.

582
00:57:31,748 --> 00:57:33,328
Thank you so much for listening.

583
00:57:35,908 --> 00:57:37,468
Thank you so much for listening.

584
00:57:37,468 --> 00:57:41,268
If you want to support my work, please head over to Fountain or Linktree.

585
00:57:41,988 --> 00:57:47,128
I do accept Bitcoin and it means the world to me if you guys support my work.

586
00:57:47,788 --> 00:57:50,388
And leave a comment, reach out to me on Noster.

587
00:57:50,928 --> 00:57:52,328
I'm really happy to hear from you.

588
00:57:52,608 --> 00:57:53,268
Thank you so much.

589
00:57:54,348 --> 00:57:58,108
And if you want to have more of wildlife unschooling, head over to Fountain.

590
00:57:58,648 --> 00:58:00,608
There's a wildlife unschooling premium.

591
00:58:01,208 --> 00:58:04,408
It starts with $5 a month and you can pay more if you want.

592
00:58:04,548 --> 00:58:05,408
And you can pay in Bitcoin.

593
00:58:05,408 --> 00:58:12,708
there you will find all bonus episodes and you will have early access to all my scheduled episodes

594
00:58:12,708 --> 00:58:15,448
have fun and see you soon