1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:16,640 So my take on this, like when I started to live according to the flag theory, and when I started to look for alternative ways to educate my child, I was pretty much alone on this path. 2 00:00:16,640 --> 00:00:21,000 I mean, that was 10 years ago. Now the things changed, obviously. 3 00:00:21,560 --> 00:00:28,700 But I was looking for someone to help me with more knowledge, connections and any kind of support I could find. 4 00:00:28,700 --> 00:00:30,360 but it was really, really hard. 5 00:00:30,980 --> 00:00:33,880 So now I have someone here in this episode, 6 00:00:34,400 --> 00:00:36,120 Chris from Denationalize Me, 7 00:00:36,800 --> 00:00:40,460 because you are doing exactly what I would have needed 8 00:00:40,460 --> 00:00:41,660 like 10 years ago. 9 00:00:41,860 --> 00:00:45,000 You are out there and coaching families, 10 00:00:45,180 --> 00:00:47,820 consulting them and really helping them 11 00:00:47,820 --> 00:00:50,780 on the way to find their like optimal setup 12 00:00:50,780 --> 00:00:52,600 for alternative education 13 00:00:52,600 --> 00:00:55,580 outside from the state schooling system. 14 00:00:56,360 --> 00:00:58,620 So I'm really, really happy that you're here with me 15 00:00:58,620 --> 00:01:03,420 and I'm excited for all the information you are going to share with us. 16 00:01:04,260 --> 00:01:05,700 Well, thank you so much, Alex. 17 00:01:06,120 --> 00:01:08,220 I appreciate the introduction. 18 00:01:08,400 --> 00:01:09,400 What an introduction, really. 19 00:01:11,200 --> 00:01:16,680 Yeah, I'm glad that we changed this lack of information 20 00:01:16,680 --> 00:01:19,680 that people seem to seek outside there. 21 00:01:19,820 --> 00:01:22,400 So, yeah, I'm pretty glad to hear that. 22 00:01:23,060 --> 00:01:26,140 Yes, this is actually what we do at Stadenlos. 23 00:01:26,140 --> 00:01:33,500 yeah we are trying to help families to find more freedom in education and yeah this is what i do 24 00:01:33,500 --> 00:01:40,540 since i think it's almost a year now so yeah besides of that i do most of our content so 25 00:01:40,540 --> 00:01:46,220 the articles that you read on our website books and sometimes also the magazines that we have the 26 00:01:46,220 --> 00:01:52,180 global citizen explorer and yeah basically yeah a lot of the things that you see written from us 27 00:01:52,180 --> 00:01:57,680 And besides that, I do the education consultations. 28 00:01:58,340 --> 00:02:01,580 And yeah, I'm happy to speak about that today with you. 29 00:02:01,940 --> 00:02:03,160 Thanks for having me on the show. 30 00:02:03,800 --> 00:02:06,220 Yes, thanks for coming to my show. 31 00:02:06,620 --> 00:02:08,780 I really think that, let's call it startenlos. 32 00:02:09,360 --> 00:02:13,080 For me, that sounds, I don't know, more authentic. 33 00:02:13,420 --> 00:02:16,580 I mean, it's die nationality for all the English people out there, 34 00:02:16,660 --> 00:02:17,960 but it's startenlos. 35 00:02:18,080 --> 00:02:18,740 It is what it is. 36 00:02:18,740 --> 00:02:40,460 So I really think that your team and what you've been building is like a one stop for libertarian people because you are really deep diving into topics like flag theory, how to avoid taxation because taxation is theft and all these beautiful things to really create a freedom based lifestyle. 37 00:02:40,460 --> 00:02:48,600 I really appreciated that because when I was younger and when I started traveling with my son, I was too broke to take any kind of help. 38 00:02:49,380 --> 00:02:52,180 And now that I'm not that broke anymore, thanks to Bitcoin. 39 00:02:52,560 --> 00:02:53,360 Thank you so much. 40 00:02:54,260 --> 00:03:03,560 I was actually able to, yeah, to deep dive into this myself and to create a lifestyle that gives me way more freedom. 41 00:03:03,560 --> 00:03:10,040 And I really hope that there are a lot of people out there having the same experience that they are, I don't know, 42 00:03:10,680 --> 00:03:14,880 strumbling upon your website and then they are seeing all these beautiful options. 43 00:03:15,040 --> 00:03:24,140 Because when you start living this freedom lifestyle, I think it's hard to understand how many options you really have. 44 00:03:24,260 --> 00:03:28,460 Because especially when you come from Germany, these things you aren't told in school. 45 00:03:28,760 --> 00:03:30,560 Not at all. It's quite the opposite. 46 00:03:30,560 --> 00:03:39,280 it um so i would like to know why or i mean you already told us what you are doing at uh start 47 00:03:39,280 --> 00:03:44,340 but why are you doing it and what did you do before what happened that you ended up there 48 00:03:44,340 --> 00:03:51,380 are you a libertarian lifestyle do it yourself or what is the fascination behind that yeah well 49 00:03:51,380 --> 00:03:57,960 my background is actually pretty classic so i'm i was a secondary school teacher so i taught in 50 00:03:57,960 --> 00:04:04,960 schools and I also worked at the university and was training future teachers actually and yeah and 51 00:04:04,960 --> 00:04:10,620 and this way I was also like let's put it like this partly responsible for what kind of teachers 52 00:04:10,620 --> 00:04:17,100 ended up in classrooms at some point but yeah I had I had a lifetime fixed job so everything was 53 00:04:17,100 --> 00:04:23,720 pretty much set for me and I could have lived a pretty yeah I think in the perspective of many 54 00:04:23,720 --> 00:04:29,560 people pretty easy life. So things were quite secure. And I also liked the teaching part a lot, 55 00:04:29,620 --> 00:04:34,660 actually. So it was not something that I always hated or that I didn't like my job at all. 56 00:04:35,360 --> 00:04:41,060 Working with kids and seeing them evolve and stuff like that is great. I think it's a beautiful 57 00:04:41,060 --> 00:04:47,800 work, actually. But I think working in schools, you realize that a lot of things in the system 58 00:04:47,800 --> 00:04:53,300 just don't work properly. And the main issue is, in my opinion, that the system tries to squeeze 59 00:04:53,300 --> 00:05:01,400 everyone into some sort of mold, you know, and the individual way of learning, some sort of gets 60 00:05:01,400 --> 00:05:09,240 lost on the way. And yeah, and I mean, how can you actually do it? It's, it's, if you think about 61 00:05:09,240 --> 00:05:16,720 having 30 kids in one classroom, and you want to, you want to provide them the best education that 62 00:05:16,720 --> 00:05:22,040 they can get, how will you do it with 30 kids at the same time in one room? And the truth is 63 00:05:22,040 --> 00:05:22,920 It's actually pretty simple. 64 00:05:23,020 --> 00:05:23,480 You can't. 65 00:05:24,680 --> 00:05:29,800 And I mean, the best you can aim for is maybe, I don't know, 60%, 70% for everyone. 66 00:05:30,020 --> 00:05:39,720 But to really achieve like 100% what's inside of everyone sitting there, it's pretty much impossible because it's an individual job. 67 00:05:39,720 --> 00:05:51,620 And yeah, you have to take care that everyone is working in their pace and their interests, their motivation, their timing, the time of the day and stuff like this. 68 00:05:51,620 --> 00:06:16,100 So, yeah. So if you take everything like this into account, you realize at some point that there is a better way to educate people and to learn, especially. But yeah, and this was actually my main motive to stop this. And I simply didn't want to have the idea of living like this for the rest of my life. And this is why it changed. 69 00:06:16,100 --> 00:06:22,160 And I also live this free lifestyle that you explained before myself right now. 70 00:06:22,320 --> 00:06:24,920 And, yeah, I'm pretty happy about this decision. 71 00:06:25,180 --> 00:06:28,060 I think until today was the best decision of my life. 72 00:06:28,920 --> 00:06:32,040 Or one of the best decisions of my life. 73 00:06:32,860 --> 00:06:35,700 But, yeah, I'm pretty happy with the solution. 74 00:06:36,040 --> 00:06:44,880 And, yeah, I'm also pretty happy that we can provide better education now with the broader system with more options. 75 00:06:44,880 --> 00:06:48,580 We don't have to rely on German laws anymore. 76 00:06:48,740 --> 00:06:53,660 We can see what's out there in the world and just pick the best or what is the best for us. 77 00:06:53,920 --> 00:06:57,360 And yeah, this is pretty much what we do right now. 78 00:06:58,180 --> 00:07:00,060 Nice. I really like that. 79 00:07:00,460 --> 00:07:02,520 Maybe a side quest question. 80 00:07:03,080 --> 00:07:03,560 Side quest. 81 00:07:04,780 --> 00:07:09,300 Why do you think is the German school system like it is? 82 00:07:09,300 --> 00:07:21,160 I mean, we all have all this information about how we learn efficiently and how we also can enjoy learning here and there a little bit because learning is fun if you do it right. 83 00:07:21,580 --> 00:07:25,960 What is the reason why the German system is such a fuck up? 84 00:07:27,380 --> 00:07:29,860 So you're the one who started with the swear words first. 85 00:07:30,120 --> 00:07:30,280 True. 86 00:07:30,840 --> 00:07:32,360 I said it very slowly. 87 00:07:32,620 --> 00:07:33,800 I tried to avoid it. 88 00:07:34,880 --> 00:07:35,840 It wasn't me. 89 00:07:37,300 --> 00:07:38,320 It was impossible. 90 00:07:38,320 --> 00:07:59,000 Yeah, so icebreaker. Icebreaker came from you. I think the German system, so I think it's a cultural thing, first of all. So that system, that the system is so bad is, I think, mainly a cultural thing because you see so many things that don't go well in Germany. 91 00:07:59,000 --> 00:08:03,380 and it just takes ages until they change, if they change at some point. 92 00:08:03,660 --> 00:08:06,180 And everybody knows what's wrong with the system, 93 00:08:06,180 --> 00:08:09,800 but they just don't do it or they just don't want to do it. 94 00:08:09,840 --> 00:08:11,200 I don't know what the reason for that is. 95 00:08:11,340 --> 00:08:12,980 But yeah, it's an old system. 96 00:08:13,260 --> 00:08:15,200 I think it worked in the past. 97 00:08:16,060 --> 00:08:18,120 I think it worked well in the past also, 98 00:08:18,300 --> 00:08:21,580 but it didn't make the shift to the future. 99 00:08:22,220 --> 00:08:24,400 This is the main issue here, I think. 100 00:08:24,400 --> 00:08:30,820 and yeah I think it's also very pragmatic approach that they have in Germany because 101 00:08:30,820 --> 00:08:36,040 you have a lot of people living in the country it's a lot of different cultures that live in 102 00:08:36,040 --> 00:08:41,160 Germany and you just try to educate them and how can you do this you have a limited you have 103 00:08:41,160 --> 00:08:47,480 limited resources you have limited resources in terms of teachers buildings schools and stuff 104 00:08:47,480 --> 00:08:52,900 so what you do you squeeze them into one building and try to put as much as you can into their 105 00:08:52,900 --> 00:08:55,780 brains. So this is what you do basically says. 106 00:08:56,680 --> 00:08:57,800 And it's interesting. 107 00:08:58,280 --> 00:09:00,880 Yeah. It's a pragmatic approach. You know, how can you, 108 00:09:00,940 --> 00:09:02,520 how can you do it if you, 109 00:09:03,220 --> 00:09:04,440 if you have this, 110 00:09:04,620 --> 00:09:07,580 this task and you try to find a solution. 111 00:09:07,920 --> 00:09:10,000 So this is what they do. But the issue is, 112 00:09:10,000 --> 00:09:12,640 and I think everyone knows it, that this is not the best way. 113 00:09:12,880 --> 00:09:18,920 So it might be better to have this approach instead of have no schools. 114 00:09:19,660 --> 00:09:21,400 I mean, we can discuss about that, but, 115 00:09:21,400 --> 00:09:24,560 it's definitely not the best way. 116 00:09:24,780 --> 00:09:28,280 And it's, yeah, it's proven by science that, of course, 117 00:09:28,500 --> 00:09:31,660 it's always an individual process to learn 118 00:09:31,660 --> 00:09:36,400 and that you can just not deliver this with a school system 119 00:09:36,400 --> 00:09:37,560 that you have in Germany right now. 120 00:09:37,920 --> 00:09:38,560 So, yeah. 121 00:09:38,820 --> 00:09:42,240 But very interesting because yesterday I was asked the same question 122 00:09:42,240 --> 00:09:45,280 like I asked you today and I said the very same. 123 00:09:45,280 --> 00:09:46,860 Like, I think it's a cultural thing. 124 00:09:47,160 --> 00:09:51,280 I don't know why people are so comfortable in the situation 125 00:09:51,280 --> 00:09:57,440 in Germany because they know about what is going wrong over there and seems to be the best option 126 00:09:57,440 --> 00:10:03,200 at the moment but what do I know but you know what I'm a teacher as well and I think I I've been 127 00:10:03,200 --> 00:10:08,400 working in my job for eight hours or seven hours or something like that and then I quit I couldn't 128 00:10:08,400 --> 00:10:14,700 do it because I sat in front of all these people and I was like I cannot serve you all it won't 129 00:10:14,700 --> 00:10:21,060 make me happy because I will be sitting at home in the evening and I will be thinking of okay 130 00:10:21,060 --> 00:10:27,320 this didn't serve anyone here this was only surfing serving serving uh the i don't know 131 00:10:27,320 --> 00:10:34,280 the agenda that i have to push through but doesn't make sense i couldn't do it really in a way 132 00:10:34,280 --> 00:10:41,500 interesting so let's talk about like the individual or decentralized approach to learning 133 00:10:41,500 --> 00:10:48,120 because i'm a huge fan of decentralized education it took me years to let go of my 134 00:10:48,120 --> 00:10:55,320 school system in my head and of all these expectations the society has for my child 135 00:10:55,320 --> 00:11:01,400 for me as a mom and all these things and of course all the expectations I had for myself and my child 136 00:11:01,400 --> 00:11:07,020 especially as a teacher I was like when he was five I was like dude he needs to learn how to read 137 00:11:07,020 --> 00:11:14,800 he needs it to like now right now it is the time and he didn't want to so I gave up because he's 138 00:11:14,800 --> 00:11:36,699 really stubborn and I think just one day he was 10 or 9 or something like that He just opened a book and he was just reading flawlessly and I was like dude you can read And he was like yes What are you thinking about me I not stupid Of course I can read And I was like dude why didn you tell me Because in the back of my head it was always like oh my God this kid can read 139 00:11:36,939 --> 00:11:38,179 He's not going to survive. 140 00:11:39,079 --> 00:11:52,619 So this was a long, long de-schooling process for myself when I finally came to that point of, okay, I can trust him in choosing what he's interested in and pulling through with all these crazy ideas he has. 141 00:11:53,059 --> 00:12:01,119 And I just called it decentralized education because he's using sources I would never think about as educational sources. 142 00:12:01,299 --> 00:12:03,639 So I had to be very open minded at some point. 143 00:12:03,899 --> 00:12:05,999 And I see so many benefits. 144 00:12:06,319 --> 00:12:10,199 And now I want to know from you, what is your opinion about this? 145 00:12:11,159 --> 00:12:16,419 Yeah, the thing that we call, I don't know, individualized approach to education. 146 00:12:19,279 --> 00:12:20,639 That's a big topic, right? 147 00:12:21,639 --> 00:12:22,519 It is. 148 00:12:23,059 --> 00:12:33,099 Yeah, it's, I think it's the counterpart of the one size fits it all education, you know, 149 00:12:33,099 --> 00:12:39,239 where everything is just put into one mold. And what we do is the complete opposite. 150 00:12:40,059 --> 00:12:46,799 I think, first of all, it's important to understand how learning actually works. I mean, 151 00:12:46,799 --> 00:12:49,359 if we look at ourselves 152 00:12:49,359 --> 00:12:51,959 and if we see that something 153 00:12:51,959 --> 00:12:53,459 excites us like crazy 154 00:12:53,459 --> 00:12:55,979 we usually can't wait to 155 00:12:55,979 --> 00:12:57,159 keep working on it 156 00:12:57,159 --> 00:13:00,039 sometimes you get so absorbed 157 00:13:00,039 --> 00:13:01,599 in some sort of work 158 00:13:01,599 --> 00:13:04,039 and you love this task that you have 159 00:13:04,039 --> 00:13:05,399 that you can't even sleep 160 00:13:05,399 --> 00:13:08,039 it's like I don't want to waste my time 161 00:13:08,039 --> 00:13:09,819 with sleep I just want to work on this 162 00:13:09,819 --> 00:13:11,919 I want to continue working on what I'm doing here 163 00:13:11,919 --> 00:13:13,239 and 164 00:13:13,239 --> 00:13:15,899 what you do you sleep for 165 00:13:15,899 --> 00:13:17,799 I don't know, four hours, five hours or something, 166 00:13:17,899 --> 00:13:19,599 wake up in the morning, not even brush your teeth 167 00:13:19,599 --> 00:13:20,879 and get straight back to work. 168 00:13:21,079 --> 00:13:24,459 And this is, of course, some sort of extreme example, 169 00:13:25,139 --> 00:13:28,879 but I think it shows how powerful motivation actually is 170 00:13:28,879 --> 00:13:33,859 in the learning process and how strongly it especially 171 00:13:33,859 --> 00:13:36,759 influences your success in learning. 172 00:13:38,139 --> 00:13:42,639 And when you have a look on it like this, 173 00:13:42,639 --> 00:13:52,419 I think it's also clear that we're not all motivated by the same things and we have a different pace and we have different topics that interest us. 174 00:13:52,659 --> 00:14:01,819 But when you have, for example, Paul and Paul enjoys reading crime stories or horror stories or whatever, and you have Mary who prefers, I don't know, horse stories. 175 00:14:02,679 --> 00:14:06,279 I know it's very simple examples, very, very stereotype as well. 176 00:14:06,279 --> 00:14:17,059 But you will find Paul will find it much harder to get motivated the morning if the lesson is today we're reading Tina and her pony farm or something. 177 00:14:17,519 --> 00:14:21,979 And the same applies for Mary if there's a horror story going on something. 178 00:14:22,879 --> 00:14:32,919 And yeah, if you keep this in mind, then motivation plays a huge role in how we learn and how successful we are in education. 179 00:14:32,919 --> 00:14:45,659 I think this is the best way to keep in mind what good education actually is, that something needs to be, as you call it, decentralized. 180 00:14:46,359 --> 00:14:50,439 But I think it should also be focused on the individual. 181 00:14:50,819 --> 00:14:57,139 So it should be not only not centralized, it should also be very focused on the learner itself. 182 00:14:57,139 --> 00:15:03,279 because it makes a lot with your with your memory of course right with your memory with your brain 183 00:15:03,279 --> 00:15:08,299 and with your cognitive resources i know you're a teacher as well so you know what i'm talking about 184 00:15:08,299 --> 00:15:14,979 but um it's um yeah it's very interesting to see what you can actually reach without 185 00:15:14,979 --> 00:15:21,759 putting too much effort into it if you just let learner or learn freely in a way that 186 00:15:21,759 --> 00:15:23,559 that feels natural to them. 187 00:15:23,939 --> 00:15:25,999 Because, I don't know, it's always the same. 188 00:15:26,119 --> 00:15:27,499 If you think about yourself, 189 00:15:27,799 --> 00:15:30,279 if you have to do something 190 00:15:30,279 --> 00:15:31,839 because you have to do something, 191 00:15:32,299 --> 00:15:35,199 the task is boring or it feels even stressful to you. 192 00:15:35,259 --> 00:15:37,119 And this is what we all experienced in school 193 00:15:37,119 --> 00:15:38,659 most of the time, I could say. 194 00:15:38,779 --> 00:15:41,639 It was boring and we had no meaning in it. 195 00:15:41,799 --> 00:15:44,499 And I think this is the main concept that you have 196 00:15:44,499 --> 00:15:47,819 if you learn freely and unschooled, 197 00:15:47,819 --> 00:15:51,319 that you can find meaning in everything what you do. 198 00:15:51,759 --> 00:16:04,639 And I think this is for me the most surprising part also to see how fluent and how easy learning can be if things are just not as controlled as they are in school. 199 00:16:06,039 --> 00:16:08,799 Very interesting to see. 200 00:16:09,319 --> 00:16:10,339 Oh, yes, that's true. 201 00:16:10,579 --> 00:16:20,079 I really like that because I met so many unschoolers now that are now grown up and they don't have this. 202 00:16:20,219 --> 00:16:21,339 Where do I belong? 203 00:16:21,339 --> 00:16:24,299 What is the meaning or purpose of my life thing? 204 00:16:24,799 --> 00:16:29,139 And that made me reflect on the same thing you said. 205 00:16:29,319 --> 00:16:33,379 I was only working because or working on things, different things. 206 00:16:33,499 --> 00:16:41,099 I was only doing things because I had to and never because I wanted to do so or because I enjoyed doing so. 207 00:16:41,219 --> 00:16:46,239 In fact, I had as a child had no time to do things that I would enjoy. 208 00:16:46,239 --> 00:16:54,119 so as growing up that became like the normal status quo to me for me to just do stupid things 209 00:16:54,119 --> 00:16:59,799 that i don't enjoy and that made me think about this is what i learned in school basically you 210 00:16:59,799 --> 00:17:05,199 just have to do all these things and if you enjoy something from this you are lucky if not 211 00:17:05,199 --> 00:17:15,119 bad luck it is indeed indeed yeah but this is the thing you know it's uh i mean everything is 212 00:17:15,119 --> 00:17:17,979 centered in the brain at some point. 213 00:17:18,259 --> 00:17:20,239 So when we set a goal and when we feel motivated, 214 00:17:20,379 --> 00:17:22,219 our brain releases chemicals. 215 00:17:22,599 --> 00:17:25,479 And this doesn't just make us feel good. 216 00:17:25,579 --> 00:17:26,659 It sharpens us. 217 00:17:26,739 --> 00:17:29,279 It sharpens the focus and improves us. 218 00:17:29,599 --> 00:17:29,739 Yeah. 219 00:17:29,799 --> 00:17:33,919 And I think it makes it much easier to push through something 220 00:17:33,919 --> 00:17:37,219 or through challenges also. 221 00:17:38,159 --> 00:17:40,459 But yeah, it's a learning process. 222 00:17:40,459 --> 00:17:44,259 And I think everyone should experience this at some point, 223 00:17:44,259 --> 00:17:47,779 how easy things can be if you're just focused and motivated. 224 00:17:48,339 --> 00:17:51,879 And yeah, if your brain is really like sharp 225 00:17:51,879 --> 00:17:53,859 and focused on something and yeah. 226 00:17:53,959 --> 00:17:58,199 But at the end, everything is like, it's chemistry, you know? 227 00:17:58,999 --> 00:18:03,239 It's just, you need to, yeah, I think you need to push 228 00:18:03,239 --> 00:18:05,899 the right buttons and trigger something correctly. 229 00:18:05,899 --> 00:18:09,699 And then things might go the way they should. 230 00:18:09,899 --> 00:18:12,319 But yeah, at the end, I think this is also our job, 231 00:18:12,319 --> 00:18:22,239 to push these buttons at students to make them be able to learn the best way they can. 232 00:18:23,219 --> 00:18:26,839 So that's what we do in schools or what we did in schools back then. 233 00:18:27,219 --> 00:18:28,199 It's the complete opposite. 234 00:18:28,339 --> 00:18:31,379 We had a curriculum and we were learning by the curriculum. 235 00:18:31,579 --> 00:18:33,439 We had our topics that we had to push through. 236 00:18:34,359 --> 00:18:40,919 And yeah, pretty much the opposite of what actually science says about learning. 237 00:18:40,919 --> 00:19:02,759 So, yeah, I think it's a big chance if you keep in mind what options are actually out there and what you can do besides going to a building at 7.30 in the morning and sit there and hope that every lesson will actually be canceled the same day or something. 238 00:19:03,179 --> 00:19:06,459 So, yeah, it's a lot of chances that we have here. 239 00:19:07,279 --> 00:19:07,479 Sure. 240 00:19:08,339 --> 00:19:08,619 Yeah. 241 00:19:08,619 --> 00:19:16,079 so maybe a random question if you had like unlimited money to change something in the 242 00:19:16,079 --> 00:19:19,859 german school system what would be the number one thing you would tackle right away 243 00:19:19,859 --> 00:19:31,219 i think the first thing i would do is uh i would um i would cancel mandatory schooling and you 244 00:19:31,219 --> 00:19:36,079 don't even need money for that i think for most i think for most of the things you don't need 245 00:19:36,079 --> 00:19:36,939 too much money. 246 00:19:38,899 --> 00:19:39,919 I think 247 00:19:39,919 --> 00:19:42,199 mandatory schooling is the first 248 00:19:42,199 --> 00:19:43,019 thing I would change. 249 00:19:44,579 --> 00:19:45,639 I think I would 250 00:19:45,639 --> 00:19:48,139 have a system that is 251 00:19:48,139 --> 00:19:50,239 more UK 252 00:19:50,239 --> 00:19:52,119 based or English 253 00:19:52,119 --> 00:19:54,139 speaking country based where 254 00:19:54,139 --> 00:19:56,159 everything is a bit more free and where people 255 00:19:56,159 --> 00:19:58,179 can choose themselves what kind of 256 00:19:58,179 --> 00:19:59,859 schooling they want to have for their kids. 257 00:20:00,559 --> 00:20:01,819 Because I think this would 258 00:20:01,819 --> 00:20:03,759 give a lot of families the opportunities 259 00:20:03,759 --> 00:20:08,399 to have a bigger selection of things that you can choose from. 260 00:20:08,839 --> 00:20:11,579 Because right now we have nothing to choose from. 261 00:20:12,059 --> 00:20:16,659 And yeah, I think people who don't want to attend school 262 00:20:16,659 --> 00:20:20,459 or who would like to be taught at home 263 00:20:20,459 --> 00:20:24,359 or can learn better as, I don't know, auto-detect, 264 00:20:24,599 --> 00:20:26,399 I think they should have the chance to do so. 265 00:20:26,819 --> 00:20:29,779 But I think this is something I would do first. 266 00:20:30,919 --> 00:20:32,039 Yeah, it's very hard. 267 00:20:32,039 --> 00:20:38,859 I think the best solution is to have individual learning, individual schooling. 268 00:20:39,599 --> 00:20:42,339 And I think it's not possible to do it in Germany, to be fair. 269 00:20:44,079 --> 00:20:45,059 It's not possible. 270 00:20:45,619 --> 00:20:45,759 True. 271 00:20:46,319 --> 00:20:48,679 Yesterday I talked to a lawyer from the US. 272 00:20:48,779 --> 00:20:49,919 His name is Shaka Mitchell. 273 00:20:50,159 --> 00:20:54,559 And he's working on passing a huge bill. 274 00:20:55,159 --> 00:20:59,259 So every family who's into alternative education, 275 00:20:59,259 --> 00:21:05,899 Like it doesn't matter if it's unschooling, homeschooling, Montessori, just not state school focused. 276 00:21:06,559 --> 00:21:15,299 And they can apply for a fund and they will receive up to 10,000 K per year per child instead of like sending their kids to school. 277 00:21:15,479 --> 00:21:26,939 And I think that's beautiful because I really think a lot of these homeschooling, well-schooling families, they save the state a lot of money to, you know, through not sending their kids to school. 278 00:21:26,939 --> 00:21:43,579 And he's actually working towards that goal that even that the taxpayers can, instead of paying it to the treasury of the US, just paying it to these funds so it can flow directly into the education of free learners. 279 00:21:43,579 --> 00:21:52,479 I think it's beautiful if we had I don't know maybe a little bit more open-minded culture in 280 00:21:52,479 --> 00:21:58,599 Germany that would be a thing because Germans love their taxes and they I don't know if this 281 00:21:58,599 --> 00:22:04,159 would be something but you know what when I talk with my family about free schooling and my son is 282 00:22:04,159 --> 00:22:12,219 12 years old he's not six anymore they are still convinced like 100 percent that this is illegal and 283 00:22:12,219 --> 00:22:14,799 when I'm over in Germany and I visit them, 284 00:22:15,239 --> 00:22:18,199 they are actually afraid that the police will come over 285 00:22:18,199 --> 00:22:21,479 in this five days per year and catch me. 286 00:22:21,479 --> 00:22:24,399 I don't get it. 287 00:22:24,919 --> 00:22:27,899 And all their friends, everyone in this family, 288 00:22:28,059 --> 00:22:31,119 all these people do think I'm a criminal 289 00:22:31,119 --> 00:22:33,479 and I'm running from the system. 290 00:22:33,659 --> 00:22:36,239 And it's completely not acceptable. 291 00:22:36,619 --> 00:22:37,759 And I just wonder... 292 00:22:37,759 --> 00:22:38,799 Well, you're running from the system. 293 00:22:39,079 --> 00:22:42,179 I am so much running from the system. 294 00:22:42,219 --> 00:23:03,518 But the important thing is I think is that they really have this idea in mind that it like a criminalized act of choosing freedom And this is so deep in the German culture because when i talk to someone from france from belgium from anywhere else they are so much more open there oh 295 00:23:03,518 --> 00:23:08,217 this is so interesting tell me more but when i talk to germans about it's like oh my god 296 00:23:08,217 --> 00:23:16,178 yeah how can you do this to your kid and yes but you know this is i think this is also the hardest 297 00:23:16,178 --> 00:23:22,798 part for, I think, for parents in general, if they move from state school to free schooling 298 00:23:22,798 --> 00:23:23,658 or unschooling. 299 00:23:23,898 --> 00:23:26,138 And I think it's not the learning itself that makes it so hard. 300 00:23:26,258 --> 00:23:30,557 I think it's the, I don't like this word, but I think it's the mindset at some point, 301 00:23:30,638 --> 00:23:33,018 the way of thinking that blocks a lot of people. 302 00:23:33,398 --> 00:23:39,358 Because we all grew up in this system where school is like highly structured and you have 303 00:23:39,358 --> 00:23:44,237 everything is fixed and you have your grades and you have homework and I don't know, you 304 00:23:44,237 --> 00:23:49,638 have your exams and everything is structured and once you leave the structure you need to think 305 00:23:49,638 --> 00:23:56,957 yourself and you need to organize yourself and you need to become a bit more creative in how 306 00:23:56,957 --> 00:24:03,918 you achieve things i mean what they have is fear nothing else is it what they are explaining when 307 00:24:03,918 --> 00:24:09,258 they when they tell you is that is that right what you do are you a criminal or whatever i think it's 308 00:24:09,258 --> 00:24:14,618 easy to understand how they think because for them it feels normal this is what they've always 309 00:24:14,618 --> 00:24:19,697 known this is what they've always been told and i think once when there's something someone 310 00:24:19,697 --> 00:24:26,217 turning up and says well there's other options out there then the first reaction of course is to 311 00:24:26,217 --> 00:24:30,898 to block this away yeah i think so when you first step into free schooling if you have never heard 312 00:24:30,898 --> 00:24:36,558 of this before you can also feel scary at first not only for those around you but also for yourself 313 00:24:36,558 --> 00:24:41,778 because you are so brainwashed by German society and German rules 314 00:24:41,778 --> 00:24:44,098 that this is the only system that we have. 315 00:24:44,278 --> 00:24:48,217 And as you said, if you speak with people from Spain or France, 316 00:24:48,418 --> 00:24:49,538 I mean, they have a different system. 317 00:24:49,938 --> 00:24:53,737 I think in Europe there's no system as strict as the one that we have in Germany. 318 00:24:54,258 --> 00:24:56,598 This also has an impact on your mindset in general, 319 00:24:56,598 --> 00:24:59,258 how to see schools and schooling. 320 00:25:00,338 --> 00:25:04,018 And can you really trust the system that is different 321 00:25:04,018 --> 00:25:06,378 to what I've seen all my life? 322 00:25:06,558 --> 00:25:09,558 will my child really learn enough without tests? 323 00:25:09,778 --> 00:25:15,078 And how will it grow up if it has such a different schooling? 324 00:25:15,798 --> 00:25:18,838 But it's also interesting is also that kids also feel the same. 325 00:25:18,838 --> 00:25:23,538 So sometimes they're used to being told what to do. 326 00:25:23,957 --> 00:25:25,998 And then something changes. 327 00:25:27,258 --> 00:25:30,918 It feels also weird for them or scary to them. 328 00:25:31,358 --> 00:25:33,818 So I think fear in this process is supernatural. 329 00:25:33,818 --> 00:25:40,778 I think it's simply because people trust what they know and anything new takes time to build confidence in. 330 00:25:41,477 --> 00:25:54,298 And yeah, but once you see that learning does happen and maybe often in a deeper way and a more joyful way, in a better way, the fear will slowly leave and trust will set in. 331 00:25:54,638 --> 00:25:58,477 And that's when free schooling actually starts to show its real power. 332 00:25:58,477 --> 00:26:07,258 Yeah, but it takes time. And I think it also takes a lot of proof for people before they actually change things for themselves and in general. 333 00:26:08,678 --> 00:26:14,737 Interesting, because I started this podcast because I was afraid of the way I chose. 334 00:26:14,918 --> 00:26:20,498 I mean, there was no other option for me. I was very sure about what I want to do with my kid or not want to do. 335 00:26:20,498 --> 00:26:27,717 but I was so afraid and then I thought okay I need regular conversations about unschooling or 336 00:26:27,717 --> 00:26:33,538 alternative ways to educate and I had nobody around me doing it so I was like okay so I have 337 00:26:33,538 --> 00:26:39,058 to start a podcast to make people talk about it that was the only idea in my head and basically 338 00:26:39,058 --> 00:26:44,278 after I don't know 12 episodes or something like that I felt like wow this was therapy for myself 339 00:26:44,278 --> 00:27:13,278 I loved it. Really nice. And one thing I talked about, yeah, how kids react if you pull them out of that school system, what is happening with them. Because I mean, for parents, it's basically a mindfuck. You have to de-school yourself. You really have to get strong in, yeah, supporting yourself in staying with that decision, not being, yeah. 340 00:27:14,278 --> 00:27:17,197 You have to be full responsible for everything, 341 00:27:17,318 --> 00:27:18,898 every second of your kid's life. 342 00:27:18,977 --> 00:27:20,158 And that is a huge change. 343 00:27:20,258 --> 00:27:22,538 But for kids, I found it quite interesting 344 00:27:22,538 --> 00:27:24,258 because my child was never in school. 345 00:27:24,358 --> 00:27:26,258 So I never experienced that shift. 346 00:27:26,758 --> 00:27:29,578 But a teacher from a democratic school in Berlin 347 00:27:29,578 --> 00:27:33,358 once told me when they have kids from state school, 348 00:27:33,358 --> 00:27:38,697 they normally need about one year to balance themselves out. 349 00:27:38,798 --> 00:27:40,197 They play football for a year. 350 00:27:40,298 --> 00:27:41,457 They do nothing at all. 351 00:27:41,518 --> 00:27:43,457 They don't touch any book, nothing. 352 00:27:43,457 --> 00:27:51,518 and I really I felt that because I after school and university I needed almost 10 years to 353 00:27:51,518 --> 00:27:58,038 be interested in learning again and I don't know maybe you have more experience in this 354 00:27:58,038 --> 00:28:04,457 than me how kids react to being pulled out of the school system I mean yeah that's a lot of fear and 355 00:28:04,457 --> 00:28:09,477 uncertainty but I don't know maybe you have something to share on my story 356 00:28:09,477 --> 00:28:16,778 yeah i think the most obvious thing if you this is why i also say in the consultations that the 357 00:28:16,778 --> 00:28:24,118 best timing is actually between primary school and secondary school to take your kids out or 358 00:28:24,118 --> 00:28:32,758 before schooling in general because i think the the most important thing that you should keep in 359 00:28:32,758 --> 00:28:38,398 mind is that you pull your kids out of their social system and i think this is the most important part 360 00:28:38,398 --> 00:28:43,398 also for them losing their friends and not seeing their friends anymore because um going to school 361 00:28:43,398 --> 00:28:49,098 also means for them seeing your friends seeing your peer group uh hanging out with them playing 362 00:28:49,098 --> 00:28:56,118 with them and um yeah pulling them out from there right in the middle um let's say i don't know 363 00:28:56,118 --> 00:29:04,258 sixth grade or third grade or something like this um it's not the best um the best solution i would 364 00:29:04,258 --> 00:29:12,018 same yeah sometimes you cannot change it because you have you don't always have one child maybe have 365 00:29:12,018 --> 00:29:19,178 three kids and they're all in different stages and then you cannot avoid it but this is what i 366 00:29:19,178 --> 00:29:25,818 generally say if there is a chance and if you think about taking your kids out of school or not 367 00:29:25,818 --> 00:29:32,298 you don't want your kids to attend school and do it before they have their first day in school 368 00:29:32,298 --> 00:29:35,418 not only because of the social environment, 369 00:29:35,618 --> 00:29:39,358 but also because the brain gets used to how they learn in schools. 370 00:29:39,638 --> 00:29:42,498 And if they learned how they learned there, 371 00:29:42,618 --> 00:29:45,938 it's very hard to pull them back to a natural way 372 00:29:45,938 --> 00:29:48,278 where you just learn by motivation, 373 00:29:48,658 --> 00:29:51,178 where you learn by certain triggers, 374 00:29:51,418 --> 00:29:53,018 where you learn by your senses. 375 00:29:53,018 --> 00:29:55,918 You see something, you feel something, hear something, 376 00:29:56,018 --> 00:29:57,118 and then you get interested in it. 377 00:29:57,298 --> 00:30:02,078 Just the usual way that we all learned at the beginning of our lives. 378 00:30:02,078 --> 00:30:04,618 and try to find a good timing for this 379 00:30:04,618 --> 00:30:07,038 because it has an impact on several things, 380 00:30:07,197 --> 00:30:09,418 not only, as I said, social life, 381 00:30:09,498 --> 00:30:12,237 but also cognitive things. 382 00:30:12,818 --> 00:30:14,838 And yeah, as you say, 383 00:30:15,038 --> 00:30:18,598 whenever you change something so drastically, 384 00:30:19,138 --> 00:30:21,678 it's completely normal that you are also influenced 385 00:30:21,678 --> 00:30:23,118 by your surroundings. 386 00:30:23,398 --> 00:30:26,098 So I think if you have a supporting system around you, 387 00:30:26,178 --> 00:30:27,878 if you have a supporting environment, 388 00:30:28,118 --> 00:30:31,078 it makes it much easier to make decisions like this. 389 00:30:31,078 --> 00:30:48,658 So this is also a reason why I also say try to find communities wherever you are to get in touch with them and exchange experiences that they made so that you don't feel as alone with your decision because you are not. 390 00:30:48,998 --> 00:30:56,538 And it's just a matter of, at the end, it's just a matter of how you approach these kind of things, I would say. 391 00:30:57,598 --> 00:30:58,197 Yeah. 392 00:30:58,737 --> 00:30:59,298 Nice. 393 00:30:59,298 --> 00:31:06,618 so maybe a little bit about your work what are like the most frequent questions that the families 394 00:31:06,618 --> 00:31:13,178 bring to you when knocking on your door and telling you let's travel the world what are we 395 00:31:13,178 --> 00:31:20,838 going to do no um because i know a lot of families who who never brought their kids to school like 396 00:31:20,838 --> 00:31:27,838 this is the main peer group we have so for me it's hard to imagine bringing your kids to school 397 00:31:27,838 --> 00:31:30,158 and one day you were like, no, I have to change this. 398 00:31:30,558 --> 00:31:34,378 So I bet there are different questions than I would have maybe. 399 00:31:35,338 --> 00:31:40,378 I think there's one main question, one big main question that they all have. 400 00:31:41,758 --> 00:31:43,858 Or let's say, I would say 90%. 401 00:31:43,858 --> 00:31:46,217 And this is how can I get my kid out of school? 402 00:31:46,418 --> 00:31:52,838 Because usually it's not that they start with the idea of having their kids unschooled. 403 00:31:53,158 --> 00:31:57,498 It's usually they make better experiences and then they want to get their kid out of there. 404 00:31:57,838 --> 00:31:59,338 And this is the main question that I get. 405 00:31:59,418 --> 00:32:01,197 How can I get my kid out of school? 406 00:32:01,438 --> 00:32:03,977 So how can I avoid mandatory schooling in Germany? 407 00:32:04,258 --> 00:32:05,078 What are the options? 408 00:32:05,338 --> 00:32:07,457 And then we look into that. 409 00:32:07,758 --> 00:32:09,957 So usually it's a lot of life planning. 410 00:32:10,138 --> 00:32:15,358 If this is the only reason why you, for example, have to leave Germany, 411 00:32:15,358 --> 00:32:18,678 because if you want to exit mandatory schooling, 412 00:32:19,298 --> 00:32:22,477 you need to deregister and you need to leave the country. 413 00:32:23,618 --> 00:32:27,638 But I think this is the main question that I get. 414 00:32:27,838 --> 00:32:34,378 Like people living in Germany made bad experiences or see that their kid has struggles in school for whatever reason. 415 00:32:35,378 --> 00:32:36,737 And they want to change that. 416 00:32:36,737 --> 00:32:38,737 And here comes the point. 417 00:32:39,278 --> 00:32:48,058 The German system doesn't allow any other form of schooling than what they offer in state schools. 418 00:32:48,278 --> 00:32:54,237 I mean, there's a lot of private schools also, but they are also very tied to the German rules. 419 00:32:54,237 --> 00:33:10,938 So often the only solution that they have if they cannot leave the country or if they don't have, for example, grandfather, grandmother in another European country, they have to see what options we have in the private school market. 420 00:33:11,178 --> 00:33:11,977 Let's put it like this. 421 00:33:12,178 --> 00:33:20,398 Often it is Montessori that gives them a bit of relief or the Steiner schools, Waldorf school. 422 00:33:20,398 --> 00:33:27,998 yeah but as i always say that the the options in germany are quite limited so 423 00:33:27,998 --> 00:33:34,737 we have to see what we can do but if we have someone who wants to indeed travel the world or 424 00:33:34,737 --> 00:33:40,578 have an international lifestyle or they're expats anyway then you have so many options out there it's 425 00:33:40,578 --> 00:33:48,598 yeah more or less unlimited i would say and yeah but this is the main question indeed so i wish i 426 00:33:48,598 --> 00:33:55,498 could say something something else but mostly mostly it's um yeah it's it's usually something 427 00:33:55,498 --> 00:34:01,237 negative that happens and then they want to change that change that that's sad yeah it is kind of sad 428 00:34:01,237 --> 00:34:07,398 but it is yeah but i mean well that's also what we're doing with this work right we try to make 429 00:34:07,398 --> 00:34:13,877 people a bit more sensitive to what the options are before they choose for some sort of option 430 00:34:13,877 --> 00:34:29,316 because when you I would say 90 of people in Germany don even make a choice for schooling They just take their kids to the school that closest to them So this is actually the choice that they make for 431 00:34:29,316 --> 00:34:31,436 the education of their 432 00:34:31,436 --> 00:34:33,416 kids. They just take them to 433 00:34:33,416 --> 00:34:35,496 the school that's closest to where 434 00:34:35,496 --> 00:34:35,856 they live. 435 00:34:37,076 --> 00:34:38,956 Makes sense at some point, but 436 00:34:38,956 --> 00:34:41,416 it's not the best way to 437 00:34:41,416 --> 00:34:43,556 find the best 438 00:34:43,556 --> 00:34:45,456 education for your kid. This is 439 00:34:45,456 --> 00:34:45,916 the point. 440 00:34:45,916 --> 00:34:56,496 And yeah, maybe this is our work here to make people a bit more sensitive to how important this choice actually is for their kids. 441 00:34:57,696 --> 00:34:57,796 True. 442 00:34:58,276 --> 00:34:58,416 Yeah. 443 00:34:59,376 --> 00:35:13,876 And you know what I think is quite impressive that I know a lot of German families that left Germany without having anywhere, anybody to go to, just while traveling the world. 444 00:35:13,876 --> 00:35:16,736 to just avoid German school system. 445 00:35:16,876 --> 00:35:19,496 It's so bad that they just left their home country. 446 00:35:20,156 --> 00:35:22,136 And of course, in other countries, 447 00:35:22,236 --> 00:35:24,116 you have different options to avoid schooling. 448 00:35:24,336 --> 00:35:27,036 But in Germany, I think the number is rising. 449 00:35:27,556 --> 00:35:30,636 And to see that people actually just leave their home country 450 00:35:30,636 --> 00:35:34,236 to avoid state school, that speaks volumes, I think. 451 00:35:34,656 --> 00:35:35,656 I think it's very interesting. 452 00:35:35,656 --> 00:35:38,996 And are there only German families coming to you for help 453 00:35:38,996 --> 00:35:41,076 or is it an international thing? 454 00:35:41,076 --> 00:35:48,616 i think it's a german uh speaking thing so i also have people from i have people from austria as 455 00:35:48,616 --> 00:35:54,376 well but let me think i think i've never had someone from switzerland so they must have good 456 00:35:54,376 --> 00:36:02,996 choices over there oh they have yeah but um the yeah i think mainly it's it's germans because 457 00:36:02,996 --> 00:36:09,636 in germany the system is just so strict and but sometimes i also have people from austria who 458 00:36:09,636 --> 00:36:18,056 to come to me and ask how they can avoid the mandatory exam that they have every year. 459 00:36:18,616 --> 00:36:20,876 So in Austria, it's a bit more flexible. 460 00:36:21,116 --> 00:36:23,836 You can more or less homeschool. 461 00:36:24,436 --> 00:36:30,456 And then you have an exam every year where you have this, they call it externistenprüfung. 462 00:36:30,456 --> 00:36:38,536 It's just an exam where they check if you are online with what they do in schools when you're present in school. 463 00:36:38,536 --> 00:36:47,696 But even those tests can be so disturbing to people that they want to change that and leave Austria as well. 464 00:36:47,996 --> 00:36:54,136 So then you also try to find solutions where you can like properly unschool and learn freely. 465 00:36:54,996 --> 00:37:03,016 But yeah, mainly it's Germans because if you compare the systems in Europe, it's just one of the worst. 466 00:37:03,076 --> 00:37:04,556 I think it's the worst, actually. 467 00:37:04,556 --> 00:37:08,836 I know it sounds bad, but I think it is the worst because it's so strict. 468 00:37:10,316 --> 00:37:14,156 And, yeah, this is why most people come actually from Germany. 469 00:37:14,796 --> 00:37:15,676 That's interesting. 470 00:37:16,236 --> 00:37:24,056 I had someone on the show and he said the only other school system that is worse is actually North Korea. 471 00:37:24,396 --> 00:37:26,596 Every other school system is better than the German one. 472 00:37:26,936 --> 00:37:28,076 I don't know that. 473 00:37:28,796 --> 00:37:30,376 I didn't experience it personally. 474 00:37:30,956 --> 00:37:31,576 Yeah, me neither. 475 00:37:32,576 --> 00:37:33,576 We should travel there. 476 00:37:33,576 --> 00:37:45,956 yeah let's travel yeah but i can't talk about traveling yeah because i really most people i met 477 00:37:45,956 --> 00:37:53,676 yeah using like flag theory to avoid school state there most of them are from germany at least from 478 00:37:53,676 --> 00:38:00,336 what i yeah from the people i met when traveling so let's maybe talk about flag theory because i 479 00:38:00,336 --> 00:38:07,176 think you guys your team from startenlos you mastered the flag theory uh you are the number 480 00:38:07,176 --> 00:38:13,416 one thing or the number one resource to go to in germany when you need information about the 481 00:38:13,416 --> 00:38:21,076 flag theory and i myself lived um and now living again according to flag theory to avoid state 482 00:38:21,076 --> 00:38:27,276 schooling in any country not only germany but all the other countries as well i think it's it's a 483 00:38:27,276 --> 00:38:35,776 genius hack because it combines running from the state and having like cultural exposure for your 484 00:38:35,776 --> 00:38:41,356 kids at the same time so i think it's beautiful maybe you can say a few words about this how that 485 00:38:41,356 --> 00:38:49,016 works together with avoiding the state school system yeah it's indeed i i completely agree 486 00:38:49,016 --> 00:38:55,796 it's the best of both worlds more or less because it doesn't only give you the chance to escape it 487 00:38:55,796 --> 00:39:01,196 also gives you the chance to have much better options and also the best options that are out 488 00:39:01,196 --> 00:39:06,876 there for you. And this all is very, very individual. It's a completely individual approach. 489 00:39:07,376 --> 00:39:13,236 And yeah, if you look on it from an education perspective, I mean, the flag theory is also about 490 00:39:13,236 --> 00:39:18,756 founding a business and second citizenships and all these kind of things. It's not only about 491 00:39:18,756 --> 00:39:24,476 education. Education is just one of these flags. You will see that you don't have to limit yourself 492 00:39:24,476 --> 00:39:26,916 to just one country's school system. 493 00:39:27,116 --> 00:39:28,916 Yeah, you're missing out on so many opportunities 494 00:39:28,916 --> 00:39:30,896 if you'd stay with one school system. 495 00:39:31,076 --> 00:39:31,856 Because around the world, 496 00:39:31,916 --> 00:39:34,796 there are systems that do things so differently. 497 00:39:35,236 --> 00:39:39,396 Like, for example, Finland focusing more on creativity. 498 00:39:40,616 --> 00:39:41,096 I don't know. 499 00:39:42,136 --> 00:39:45,436 Singapore is stronger in math and science in general. 500 00:39:45,816 --> 00:39:46,936 And then you have, of course, 501 00:39:47,056 --> 00:39:49,336 completely different schooling philosophies, 502 00:39:49,336 --> 00:39:51,776 like the ones that we have also in Germany, 503 00:39:51,916 --> 00:39:52,836 Montessori and stuff, 504 00:39:52,836 --> 00:39:57,616 but also completely new systems, private schools, completely new approaches, 505 00:39:57,856 --> 00:40:05,476 approaches with AI teachers, no teachers at all, learning by yourself, unschooling, homeschooling, 506 00:40:05,576 --> 00:40:06,436 whatever you want to do. 507 00:40:06,556 --> 00:40:07,996 Like all the options are out there. 508 00:40:08,036 --> 00:40:09,016 You just have to take them. 509 00:40:09,256 --> 00:40:12,816 And this is what the flag theory more or less teaches you. 510 00:40:12,816 --> 00:40:21,276 If you look on your options internationally, you will find the best solutions, best practices. 511 00:40:21,276 --> 00:40:25,996 instead of staying with one single model. 512 00:40:26,296 --> 00:40:28,656 You know, it's when you stay with one system, 513 00:40:28,956 --> 00:40:34,556 there is no chance to find what actually fits you. 514 00:40:35,056 --> 00:40:38,796 And so I think the best possible education 515 00:40:38,796 --> 00:40:42,296 is indeed something that you can find with the flag theory. 516 00:40:42,536 --> 00:40:45,236 Indeed, that you go out there 517 00:40:45,236 --> 00:40:48,116 and find the best solution for yourself. 518 00:40:48,116 --> 00:40:50,316 There is no one size fits at all, 519 00:40:50,316 --> 00:40:51,696 even in the flag theory. 520 00:40:52,056 --> 00:40:53,736 It's completely individual. 521 00:40:54,096 --> 00:40:57,016 And it means also asking yourself what, 522 00:40:58,016 --> 00:40:59,576 and this is an important question, actually, 523 00:40:59,716 --> 00:41:02,256 what's out there internationally, globally, 524 00:41:02,256 --> 00:41:05,916 that matches my needs, my child's needs, 525 00:41:05,916 --> 00:41:08,256 and also both of our personalities. 526 00:41:09,636 --> 00:41:13,396 And for example, maybe it's bilingual schooling or something, 527 00:41:13,696 --> 00:41:17,996 or it's international schooling, online learning, 528 00:41:18,136 --> 00:41:20,236 combined with traveling, whatever it is, 529 00:41:20,316 --> 00:41:24,896 It's a big chance to go out there and find a solution for yourself 530 00:41:24,896 --> 00:41:29,196 instead of sticking to one weakness, like one weak system 531 00:41:29,196 --> 00:41:33,456 that tries to be the best solution to you, 532 00:41:33,676 --> 00:41:36,556 which is not actually. 533 00:41:38,556 --> 00:41:44,476 Flag theory, I think, is the thing if you want to have the best of the two worlds, 534 00:41:44,476 --> 00:41:48,116 especially for the educational topics. 535 00:41:48,116 --> 00:41:51,996 because the chances are so much higher. 536 00:41:52,216 --> 00:41:56,756 I mean, as I say, I don't want to demonize the German school system. 537 00:41:57,036 --> 00:42:02,456 I think it's quite bad, but at the end, it may fit to some people. 538 00:42:02,816 --> 00:42:03,976 Yeah, completely fine. 539 00:42:03,976 --> 00:42:06,336 But I think the chances are just so much higher 540 00:42:06,336 --> 00:42:09,256 that you find your personal best setup 541 00:42:09,256 --> 00:42:13,256 where your child not only learns but actually blooms, you know, 542 00:42:13,256 --> 00:42:18,276 is when you go outside and find something that is beyond one country, 543 00:42:18,456 --> 00:42:19,736 that is beyond one system. 544 00:42:20,536 --> 00:42:26,496 And yeah, just go on the lookout, go on the hunt and see what is possible. 545 00:42:26,616 --> 00:42:28,796 And this is what the flag theory does, not only in education, 546 00:42:28,796 --> 00:42:33,456 but also in your residency, your citizenship, your banking, 547 00:42:34,116 --> 00:42:36,616 your business and all these things. 548 00:42:37,196 --> 00:42:40,136 So yeah, it's always finding the best solution for yourself. 549 00:42:40,136 --> 00:42:45,596 and at the end giving you more freedom for yourself and for your life. 550 00:42:46,496 --> 00:42:47,776 Yeah, that's true. 551 00:42:47,936 --> 00:42:51,656 I mean, we are living beings too. 552 00:42:52,156 --> 00:42:56,336 And sometimes when I hear families talking about what's the best for their kids, 553 00:42:56,916 --> 00:43:00,496 I'm like, dude, do I have a right to enjoy life as well? 554 00:43:00,556 --> 00:43:03,196 Because flag theory is not only about the kids. 555 00:43:03,196 --> 00:43:05,636 It's also about enjoying your life as a parent. 556 00:43:05,636 --> 00:43:11,536 because it makes it much easier to parent if your kid is happy and in a safe environment. 557 00:43:12,456 --> 00:43:17,796 So you do offer also like flexible learning plans for kids. 558 00:43:17,796 --> 00:43:20,496 And what is your thought behind this? 559 00:43:20,556 --> 00:43:22,736 Because, I mean, I'm a radical unschooler. 560 00:43:22,796 --> 00:43:26,176 We don't have to discuss that any plan for me is complete bullshit. 561 00:43:26,176 --> 00:43:34,096 But I do believe that a lot of people out there need plans because it makes them feel safe. 562 00:43:34,096 --> 00:43:36,016 and that is perfectly fine. 563 00:43:36,156 --> 00:43:38,996 So I would like to know more about how you do this 564 00:43:38,996 --> 00:43:40,896 and why you do this and what your approach is. 565 00:43:40,976 --> 00:43:44,836 As a teacher, I'm listening closely because I love plans. 566 00:43:46,716 --> 00:43:51,876 Yeah, the approach is actually exactly what you already said. 567 00:43:52,316 --> 00:43:54,916 It's to give people some sort of scaffold, 568 00:43:55,276 --> 00:43:59,256 some sort of structure that they can hang on, 569 00:43:59,556 --> 00:44:01,336 that they can rely on more or less 570 00:44:01,336 --> 00:44:04,096 and where you can just, how you said it, 571 00:44:04,156 --> 00:44:06,636 tick box your achievements. 572 00:44:07,636 --> 00:44:09,976 And some people just need that. 573 00:44:10,136 --> 00:44:11,756 And it's completely fine, as you say. 574 00:44:12,076 --> 00:44:16,136 I think it's also possible to do without these kind of plans. 575 00:44:16,356 --> 00:44:17,136 I mean, they are also, 576 00:44:17,776 --> 00:44:22,336 sometimes they're very close to existing curricula, actually. 577 00:44:22,916 --> 00:44:27,096 So they more or less function like a curriculum. 578 00:44:27,476 --> 00:44:29,036 They give you the structure. 579 00:44:29,036 --> 00:44:33,216 They give you visibility about what you have achieved already. 580 00:44:33,736 --> 00:44:39,176 And then you just hang tight to that plan and go step by step. 581 00:44:39,716 --> 00:44:45,416 And sometimes it's much easier to, there's a plan behind all of this. 582 00:44:45,556 --> 00:44:48,776 And sometimes you feel like, is my kid actually learning something? 583 00:44:48,876 --> 00:44:52,796 And then you can just check your list and you see your own curriculum. 584 00:44:53,536 --> 00:44:55,736 And you see, well, yes, it does. 585 00:44:55,736 --> 00:44:59,336 So we started with this and now we are at this point. 586 00:44:59,476 --> 00:45:04,776 And I can also ask my child about this and that topic and it understands it, it knows it already. 587 00:45:04,956 --> 00:45:14,856 And then you have some sort of relief also for yourself, knowing that what you do is the right way and that you can actually see the achievements that you have. 588 00:45:14,856 --> 00:45:26,796 So I think sometimes, especially when you're not a teacher and you want to have a very free learning environment, can be good to have some sort of orientation. 589 00:45:26,796 --> 00:45:43,936 And also it depends on your goals. I mean, if you want to have your kids have a degree at some point, it also makes sense to learn what they test at some point when you want to make some degree. 590 00:45:43,936 --> 00:45:46,176 wherever you do it. 591 00:45:46,176 --> 00:45:50,276 So it's good to have some sort of preparation for that. 592 00:45:50,276 --> 00:45:52,196 Not only a year before the accident, 593 00:45:52,235 --> 00:45:57,755 exam or the test but in general that you have this in mind that something might come at some 594 00:45:57,755 --> 00:46:03,835 point where you have to prepare for so you can do this with these plans it just gives you as i said 595 00:46:03,835 --> 00:46:11,835 some sort of scaffold you have something to to rely on yeah this is the main the main reason why 596 00:46:11,835 --> 00:46:18,075 we do it it doesn't fit every plan of course not every life plan not every plan for how people want 597 00:46:18,075 --> 00:46:23,675 to educate their children but in many cases it does in my opinion and this is why we do it 598 00:46:25,595 --> 00:46:31,595 nice let's talk about qualifications because um you already mentioned it and that is the number 599 00:46:31,595 --> 00:46:37,835 one thing my family is afraid of that he will never have any kind of qualification to go to 600 00:46:39,195 --> 00:46:46,155 university college whatever you may call it and i think that's that's just i don't know fake news 601 00:46:46,155 --> 00:46:52,995 because sorry the dog is really annoying and he's finding things to throw around all the time 602 00:46:52,995 --> 00:47:00,775 and there are so many universities that do accept unschoolers and homeschoolers without 603 00:47:00,775 --> 00:47:05,175 any kind of qualification because you have to write an essay you have to prove this or that 604 00:47:05,175 --> 00:47:12,355 and the landscape out there it's wild but from a german perspective of course it is quite difficult 605 00:47:12,355 --> 00:47:17,515 Maybe you can share your experience because I think you are quite, I don't know, you are 606 00:47:17,515 --> 00:47:19,815 obviously more into this than me. 607 00:47:19,815 --> 00:47:23,855 So I'm learning something to tell my family. 608 00:47:23,855 --> 00:47:37,361 I mean what we really need to do is ease the Germans mind you know to bring them in peace And you can bring them in peace usually with a clear solution 609 00:47:37,721 --> 00:47:42,621 And what I usually say is Germany has, and this you can easily Google also, 610 00:47:43,301 --> 00:47:47,301 they have something that is called external examination. 611 00:47:47,821 --> 00:47:54,341 So you can make any degree that you want in Germany by making some examinations. 612 00:47:54,341 --> 00:47:55,761 It's not that easy. 613 00:47:55,761 --> 00:48:00,641 you have to apply for that and you have to give some sort of proof that you are that you are a 614 00:48:01,201 --> 00:48:07,201 proper candidate for this for this exam but at the end it means if you are unregistered from 615 00:48:07,201 --> 00:48:12,961 from germany if you don't live in germany anymore you actually have the chance to make exams by 616 00:48:12,961 --> 00:48:20,001 going to these usually it's a couple of days exams where you just give proof of what they do at 617 00:48:20,001 --> 00:48:28,221 the final exams in the schools and then you can then you can get a complete normal German degree 618 00:48:28,221 --> 00:48:34,341 at the end which with which you can go to to the university you can study and you don't have to 619 00:48:34,341 --> 00:48:40,541 attend any regular school for it the most important thing is that you are coming from outside this is 620 00:48:40,541 --> 00:48:44,441 why it's called external examination that you're coming from outside of Germany that you lived 621 00:48:44,441 --> 00:48:51,341 outside of Germany and now want to make this this exam so and yeah and if you pass you receive the 622 00:48:51,341 --> 00:48:58,641 same degree certificate as someone who went to the traditional school system and I think this is a 623 00:48:58,641 --> 00:49:06,121 great option to ease the minds of German families and I think it's also great options for for families 624 00:49:06,121 --> 00:49:22,127 who live abroad you know or for kids who are learning outside of the standard system and at at some point realize they want to become a doctor or a lawyer or whatever something that is controlled by the German government then you need to have this sort of degree So I think this 625 00:49:22,127 --> 00:49:26,567 is also something that you always have to keep in mind, that your kid may develop at some point 626 00:49:26,567 --> 00:49:34,747 the wish to get a job that is controlled by the government. And yeah, I think this is the easiest 627 00:49:34,747 --> 00:49:41,947 way to open the minds of people when they tell you, but your kid won't have any degree. What can 628 00:49:41,947 --> 00:49:48,687 we do at the end of, I don't know, secondary school, for example? And you say, yeah, we may go to the 629 00:49:48,687 --> 00:49:54,567 exams or we may not. Depends on what the future goal is. And then you have a lot more to offer 630 00:49:54,567 --> 00:50:01,187 in your argumentation with German people than just saying, yeah, we'll work out or something like this. 631 00:50:01,187 --> 00:50:07,107 Or there are a lot of people who did this route already. 632 00:50:07,447 --> 00:50:09,247 So I think this is the easiest way. 633 00:50:10,067 --> 00:50:10,907 That's beautiful. 634 00:50:11,447 --> 00:50:14,347 And the world is a big place. 635 00:50:14,347 --> 00:50:18,407 I think there are so many options to just go somewhere else 636 00:50:18,407 --> 00:50:19,787 if you can't make it in Germany. 637 00:50:21,307 --> 00:50:25,167 And I think a lot of Germans I met on the way, 638 00:50:26,027 --> 00:50:31,047 the kids never went back to Germany when they grew up. 639 00:50:31,187 --> 00:50:33,827 you have to think about this as well. 640 00:50:33,827 --> 00:50:35,907 Maybe the kids don't wanna go back 641 00:50:35,907 --> 00:50:37,867 because they wanna raise their kids 642 00:50:37,867 --> 00:50:40,327 as free as they have been raised maybe. 643 00:50:40,327 --> 00:50:41,167 Yeah. 644 00:50:41,167 --> 00:50:42,327 Could happen. 645 00:50:42,327 --> 00:50:43,867 Yeah, it's likely to happen actually 646 00:50:45,067 --> 00:50:57,153 because there are more options out there than Germany I don wanna say it too loud but there is a lot more to explore and experience out there than Germany 647 00:50:57,613 --> 00:50:59,513 I don't want to speak too bad about Germany, 648 00:50:59,513 --> 00:51:04,293 but I'm just saying that there is a lot of things out there 649 00:51:04,293 --> 00:51:10,033 that you should take freedom in your own hands, 650 00:51:10,213 --> 00:51:13,613 that you just explore and go outside and see what's out there 651 00:51:13,613 --> 00:51:15,813 and find the best solution for yourself. 652 00:51:15,873 --> 00:51:19,433 and for your kids, of course, in terms of education. 653 00:51:19,813 --> 00:51:23,673 But it all crops down to go out and explore. 654 00:51:24,533 --> 00:51:24,973 Oh, yes. 655 00:51:25,253 --> 00:51:26,793 Find yourself, explore yourself. 656 00:51:27,273 --> 00:51:27,533 Exactly. 657 00:51:28,193 --> 00:51:29,073 I love it. 658 00:51:29,153 --> 00:51:30,713 I wanted to say exactly the same. 659 00:51:31,253 --> 00:51:31,833 Very good. 660 00:51:32,413 --> 00:51:35,733 It's all about exploring and not only for the kids, 661 00:51:36,313 --> 00:51:37,093 adults as well. 662 00:51:37,573 --> 00:51:39,513 I mean, the world is a nice place 663 00:51:39,513 --> 00:51:41,573 and there's so much more to explore 664 00:51:41,573 --> 00:51:44,833 than just staying put in one country. 665 00:51:44,833 --> 00:51:53,153 so yes chris thank you so much for all the information you shared uh i really think it 666 00:51:53,153 --> 00:52:01,053 was a refreshing take on what options are out there and i don't know we are not bashing the 667 00:52:01,053 --> 00:52:06,233 german school system enough i think but we did it a little bit so i'm happy with that part of 668 00:52:06,233 --> 00:52:12,913 yeah and yeah we try to behave here yes really but especially from a teacher's perspective i think 669 00:52:12,913 --> 00:52:13,913 I agree. 670 00:52:13,913 --> 00:52:14,913 I agree. 671 00:52:14,913 --> 00:52:15,913 We did really good stuff. 672 00:52:15,913 --> 00:52:16,913 Well, yeah. 673 00:52:16,913 --> 00:52:17,913 Thanks for having me too. 674 00:52:17,913 --> 00:52:20,913 Thanks for having me too to the show. 675 00:52:20,913 --> 00:52:24,913 And I hope things got a bit clearer for people who are listening to this. 676 00:52:24,913 --> 00:52:25,913 So, yeah. 677 00:52:25,913 --> 00:52:26,913 Thanks again. 678 00:52:26,913 --> 00:52:27,913 I hope so too. 679 00:52:27,913 --> 00:52:28,913 Nice. 680 00:52:28,913 --> 00:52:29,913 Okay. 681 00:52:29,913 --> 00:52:30,913 Let's see.