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Jacob, welcome to the Freedom Footprint show.

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Thank you for joining us.

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Thanks for having me.

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Yeah, good to see you again, Jacob.

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We, last time we met was on Madeira, if I, if I'm not wrong, and I think I'm not.

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Uh, yeah, uh, and, uh, you're a big Bitcoin walker, so, uh, how

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was the Bitcoin walks on Madeira?

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I missed out on most of them, I'm ashamed to say.

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I had plans on walking Levadas and stuff, but in the Didn't get to this this time.

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Madeira is such a great place for that, you know, it's such a beautiful island

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and it has plenty of labyrinths, you know, in the Levada, so it's easy to,

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very easy to get lost in nature there.

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Um, but, um, you know, I, I had a bit of a challenge over there because I

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wanted to make sure that when we, when we do the Bitcoin walkover there, it

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would be safe, you know, for everybody who comes around and I wanted it to

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be, easy and wide enough so that people can mingle and, you know, change groups

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and have different conversations.

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So, uh, luckily with the, you know, great team from, um, Primavera and the Atlantis

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conference, they, they helped me find.

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The right, um, right circular route.

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So, uh, uh, that was, that was a really good one.

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it was tough to organize it in the sense that, you know, uh, levadas are a bit

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further up, so you have to, you know, get on the bus to get there basically.

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So I had to, you know, I had some constraints around the, um, the

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limit of the seats on the bus.

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So I had to put up like a little registration form where people

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would sign up and say, okay, you know, I need two places.

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So.

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And, uh, yeah, basically I had a cap of 55 seats on the bus.

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Short anecdotes is that basically, you know, I put up a type form

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registration kind of thing.

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And because it was a free event and a side event and people wanted to do that anyway,

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I kind of ignored, you know, the, the, I announced that on, on, on Twitter and, um,

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kind of ignored, you know, the results.

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I didn't check it for a couple of days.

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So a few days later, I, uh, I log in back and there's like 65 people who

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signed, signed, signed up already.

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So, um, you know, basically I, I've only got 55 seats on the bus

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and it's still like two, more than two months until the conference

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happens, so I expect that there'll be more people who'd want to come.

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And so, I reached out to the organizers and said, look, is there any chance we

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could do two walks by, you know, because this would probably be, you know, enough.

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And they said, yeah, we can do, you know, a morning, a morning walk and then the

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afternoon walk and this would be fine.

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So, um, I was like kind of relieved and left it and forgot about it, had different

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things, um, related to family and stuff.

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And, um, like two weeks before the conference, I kind of logged in again

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and there's 220 people signed up.

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Uh, so it's a good problem to have.

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Uh, I closed the registration by then and, uh, and decided to, that

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we would do, you know, free walks.

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Um, so there was a nine o'clock at 12 o'clock and a two o'clock, uh, walk.

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Um, physically I couldn't do it myself.

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Like the middle one was tricky because, uh, I just couldn't be there in, you know,

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in the location to, to pick those guys up.

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But, uh, I, uh, quickly assembled, you know, a team of Bitcoin friends who were,

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who ended before, and they met, they, they agreed to, to lead the work in the middle.

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So I covered the one at 9 o'clock and one at 2 o'clock, and my

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friends covered the one at 12, and uh, yeah, everybody was happy.

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So before, before you got all this sorted out, did you wake up in the middle of the

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night and, uh, from having a nightmare of sailor saying there is no second bus?

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Like, or

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There is no second best.

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Yeah, I mean, it was, um, it was quite an experience.

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So first of all, I was quite overwhelmed, as you can imagine, trying to, you

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know, make sure that everything is, you know, Organized nicely.

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So, you know, when I saw the bus in front of the stadium, I kind of

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just went and say hello to everybody and wanted to greet everybody.

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And I did a massive, massive faux pas.

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I didn't say hello to the driver.

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Uh, I didn't basically, you know, have, build the interaction with him.

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So I just said, hello, hello, everything.

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Okay.

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Okay.

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We didn't have, you know, any sort of small chat, small, small talk.

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And, um, and yeah, and basically, you know, we, we started going to the place,

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uh, he took us to the wrong place.

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Then we had to kind of, you know, call, call the company.

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and the guy was a bit funny, like he refused to speak in English with me.

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Uh, like pretend he does not, doesn't speak English.

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Uh, then somebody who actually spoke Portuguese stepped in and, uh, it turned

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out that the guy actually speaks fluent English, probably better than mine.

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and we, you know, we, we expressed what we had to say, and he said, like,

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you know, you don't tell us where we go, you don't tell us, and I was like,

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well, I called the company yesterday, and they confirmed that you know the

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details, and you know everything.

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Um, so, you know, in the end they took us, he took us to the right, right place.

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Uh, I bought him a coffee and, you know, uh, we had a chat and, and we

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made, we made friends, so to speak, uh, from, from the position we first met.

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So, but it was, you know, an, an experience as well.

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is he orange pill now then?

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I don't think so.

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Um, I, I think, uh, I think, you know, we had definitely planted some seeds

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because literally when we were on the bus, Bitcoin hit all time high and, you

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know, there was like getting, getting, getting to the, to the newest heights

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and so we celebrated like, okay guys, Bitcoin is now 40, like 64 or 65.

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and, uh, yeah, it was really a fun ride and something special about it as well.

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Um, but, uh, yeah, you know, we, we had, uh, we had a, a, a chat with

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all the Bitcoiners and him in the end and, uh, He told us basically his

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life story, that he worked for like 10 years in the UK, was a bus driver here.

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Then he came over to Madeira, where he's from, and basically shared his story.

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We tried to orange pill him, but he wasn't interested in getting sats,

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so I think he'll come around, he'll come around at some point, I'm sure.

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I

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Yeah.

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I've, I've taken bus rides on Madeira before and they can be scary.

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They can be pretty, yeah, it's a, you know, everyday edge

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or whatever you may call it.

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So, yeah, uh, we're, we're.

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Getting ahead of ourselves here, uh, can you give our listeners a TLDR on

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who you are, Jakob, and how this whole Bitcoin walk became such a big part

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of your life, and, uh, yeah, I mean, I love walking with Bitcoiners myself,

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so, so, yeah, please tell us the story.

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So yeah, I'm Jacob, you know, I'm humble plebs.

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I just, you know, I just go for a walk and talk about Bitcoin with

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anybody who wants to come along.

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And it started like two years ago.

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I'm based in Edinburgh in Scotland right now.

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I started going out because, uh, like I, uh, me and my partner,

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we had our second child here.

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And, uh, I wanted to find some time for myself when we were like, a

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little one was like three months old.

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Um, so we said like, okay, you know, I'm going to go for a walk just, you know,

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a couple of hours and then I'm back.

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and, uh, I would listen to podcasts.

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I would listen to audiobooks, uh, and go, you know, getting deeper,

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deeper down the rabbit hole.

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and, uh, at some point I got so overwhelmed and said like, look, you know,

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I don't have much time to, to commit.

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Myself to more than, than, than the two couple of hours a week, but, um,

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I'm so overwhelmed that I really want to, you know, to talk to someone.

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I want to make sure that I'm not insane because it sounds like, you

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know, this, this thing is going to, to change the whole world and, uh, and,

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uh, fix a lot of things in the world.

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Um, so I put up, you know, a meetup page, uh, and people started coming.

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Um, first it was, like, you know, a couple of guys, uh, one guy, two guys,

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you know, and I would always go, always have a conversation, see, like, what

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they think and, like, how they feel.

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You know, discuss anything that I heard, uh, and I noticed that there's a certain

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pattern and those Bitcoin walks and the way you, um, well, the way I started,

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you know, understanding it and talking about that works a little bit like,

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you know, like going to the gym where, you know, first you, you go to the gym

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and it's, it's not really comfortable.

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It's not your thing.

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Like you're, you feel awkward maybe.

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Um, and, you know, The more you build up that muscle of kind of, you know,

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repetition, going through this whole thing, uh, over and over again and meeting

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those people and, um, you know, I was always sticking to three things, right?

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So, um, if I didn't know what to talk about, I was just saying, so, you know,

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self custody, that's an invention, right?

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And like, starting discussing things from that point on, or, or like finance

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scarcity, or the third thing was privacy.

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And, you know, these are the three most, most kind of.

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Anchoring topics that would take us to very different places.

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and in the, you know, in the process, I noticed that, um, it is much easier

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to talk to people when you're walking, when you're next to someone, because

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then there is, you're not stationary.

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So, you know, you're, you're moving, you've got better blood

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circulation, you've got fresh air, and also there is no judgment.

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So like, you know, If we sit in the bar and we're having a conversation,

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it's usually me telling you, you telling me kind of conversation.

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So there's always this kind of power struggle where, you know, I'm trying

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to find it out, you know, figure out like, what, what is your angle?

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Like what are you trying to tell me or sell me, sell to me?

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Uh, whereas when, when we were walking, it's, um, you just focus on the road

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ahead, you focus on your horizon.

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On your next step, and you're completely different, like you, you're way more

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open minded in this, in this setup.

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So it becomes easier to, um, to have a meaningful conversation.

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And actually, the way I learned most is by not talking at all, it's

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just by listening other people talk.

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people were prompting questions and you would just be there and kind of analyze

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in your own pace what this thing is.

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And, you know, I've been in many conversations where, um,

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like they were way too advanced for me or too technical for me.

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So I would have to catch up later on and do my lessons, but they kind

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of put, you know, the basics in my understanding of Bitcoin and how it works.

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So that I can then do my, do my homework and then come back again

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and maybe ask some more questions, you know, so it's a really nice cycle

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to it to, to get on boarded because.

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You know, Bitcoin is, it's a beast as there's so many layers

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to it, um, and it means something different potentially to everybody.

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So to find my, uh, meaning, I had to kind of go through it over and over again,

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discover it, um, in my own ways and, and, you know, share my experiences as well.

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So, I found that extremely useful in me being, getting more confident

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about what I'm doing, how I'm allocating my time and my energy.

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and, uh, yeah, and I make lots of friends, like, like, um, you know, I've

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been living in the UK for 15 years.

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Um, more than that now, I'm originally from Poland and we, you know, we

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tend to socialize and, uh, and visit each other a lot in Poland.

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So, you know, it's normal to, to come to, to, to my house or to your house.

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Cause that's what people do.

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Um, we have guests in UK, you go to a pub, you don't have, you don't, you

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don't come to each other's houses at all.

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and, uh, I noticed that, you know, whenever I tried to go and go into any

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meetups in UK, um, you know, I'm, I'm considering myself a cheerful guy and

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being open minded, but those meetups, like usual meetups, they were usually,

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there was something wrong with them.

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Like I couldn't, I couldn't force myself to, You know, to, to, um, to connect

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with those people and, uh, to follow up and to build lasting relationships

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with anyone they met until Bitcoin, uh, and, and Bitcoin works specifically.

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Uh, cause at this point, you know, I started making really,

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really great friendships.

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I think I found, you know, a couple of people I can call my mentors as

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well, um, who basically, you know, it's like explained a lot of things

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to me, uh, both from technical, um, as well as spiritual, uh, way.

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So, um, I find, you know, I think that there's some special thing about this.

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Going for a walk and having a, you know, a casual talk away from the

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screen, away from, you know, from, um, from a pub, from, from, you

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know, sitting and drinking beer.

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It's, it's just different.

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Absolutely, so, uh, natural follow up question, what does

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Bitcoin mean to you, Jakob?

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Well, you know, it means hope to me.

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It absolutely means hope.

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You know, I, I live right now in, uh, in, uh, soggy Scotland.

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Uh, it's, uh, it's raining quite a lot here.

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And, you know, when it gets cold, uh, the winter is, you know, it's not

219
00:12:43,732 --> 00:12:46,412
extreme cold as, you know, we would have it in Poland or in Scandinavia,

220
00:12:46,582 --> 00:12:48,522
but it's just miserable for a long time.

221
00:12:48,902 --> 00:12:53,122
And, uh, I, you know, I, I met a couple of guys and I expressed who,

222
00:12:53,142 --> 00:12:54,982
who, who felt the same as I did.

223
00:12:55,697 --> 00:12:58,717
I just get naturally depressed here, you know, because of lack of sound, because

224
00:12:58,717 --> 00:13:01,847
of lack of, um, vitamin D and stuff.

225
00:13:01,847 --> 00:13:07,505
So, I noticed that, you know, in the last couple of, well, last couple

226
00:13:07,505 --> 00:13:11,115
of weeks, we went for the Bitcoin walk on the day of the halving.

227
00:13:11,844 --> 00:13:15,964
And, uh, we kind of wrapped it up to say, wait, okay, so how was it?

228
00:13:16,294 --> 00:13:18,604
And a friend of mine who's like a long time Bitcoin, he said like, do

229
00:13:18,604 --> 00:13:21,664
you know what, this one was actually, this, this cycle was much easier.

230
00:13:21,664 --> 00:13:25,114
The bear market was much easier because of Bitcoin walk, because we could

231
00:13:25,114 --> 00:13:28,704
actually not have each other as a support network to, you know, to come

232
00:13:28,704 --> 00:13:30,504
and have our group therapy kind of thing.

233
00:13:31,044 --> 00:13:34,404
Uh, and I, and I, you know, I, this has resonated very, very highly with me.

234
00:13:34,404 --> 00:13:40,044
So I, I think that's, Uh, to me, this is, um, well, Bitcoin will help me find my,

235
00:13:40,074 --> 00:13:44,450
my, my family, uh, help me find, you know, people that, I have a common denominator,

236
00:13:44,500 --> 00:13:46,250
uh, with, you know, the 21 million.

237
00:13:46,710 --> 00:13:52,550
Uh, so, uh, so in this sense, uh, it's, it's, um, it's life changing for sure.

238
00:13:53,230 --> 00:13:57,660
I feel that, you know, some values that I had deeply kind of rooted in my,

239
00:13:58,270 --> 00:14:02,760
uh, upbringing, um, as a child, which I thought I disconnected from, and

240
00:14:02,760 --> 00:14:04,440
maybe I lost at some point in my life.

241
00:14:04,780 --> 00:14:10,340
You know, pursuing career, chasing the fiat money that is kind of, you

242
00:14:10,340 --> 00:14:12,410
know, basically never ending game.

243
00:14:13,105 --> 00:14:21,355
And I felt myself, you know, at peace because I know that I'm part of the game

244
00:14:21,385 --> 00:14:26,095
that is, you know, has a fixed supply and I have my little, tiny little share in it.

245
00:14:27,420 --> 00:14:29,200
Nobody's nobody can take it away from me.

246
00:14:29,480 --> 00:14:32,020
So that to me, this is, this is like, it gives me so much peace of

247
00:14:32,030 --> 00:14:38,270
mind and so much, um, uh, calm, uh, calmness and, you know, um, positive,

248
00:14:38,630 --> 00:14:42,640
um, attitude and hope for the future that, you know, I, I, I stick to that.

249
00:14:42,680 --> 00:14:45,440
And so I kind of cherish this feeling and try to spread it around.

250
00:14:46,581 --> 00:14:47,261
Fantastic.

251
00:14:47,291 --> 00:14:49,461
It sounds a bit like one of those

252
00:14:51,691 --> 00:14:55,471
alcoholics anonymous groups, like I'm Jacob and I'm a bitcoholic.

253
00:14:56,171 --> 00:14:56,541
Like,

254
00:14:58,526 --> 00:14:59,816
Yeah, it does.

255
00:14:59,886 --> 00:15:00,296
It does.

256
00:15:00,326 --> 00:15:04,731
And, you know, it's, um, It's interesting because I went to a meetup yesterday,

257
00:15:05,128 --> 00:15:10,870
in, uh, in the University of Edinburgh, uh, that was related to, Ayn Rand's,

258
00:15:10,880 --> 00:15:15,560
um, organization and, uh, you know, basically they were discussing how

259
00:15:15,590 --> 00:15:19,335
the government is, uh, You know, creating money, how it's stealing from,

260
00:15:19,465 --> 00:15:22,325
it's, you know, from, from the people for inflation and then other stuff.

261
00:15:22,805 --> 00:15:26,195
And, um, and I felt like, okay, well, that's, you know, like, these

262
00:15:26,195 --> 00:15:29,115
guys should really dig Bitcoin and they should, should get that.

263
00:15:29,715 --> 00:15:32,975
So I started interacting with those people and they were like, oh, no, but

264
00:15:32,975 --> 00:15:34,675
cryptocurrency, this is speculation.

265
00:15:34,695 --> 00:15:37,385
And I'm like, well, first of all, you need to learn your lesson.

266
00:15:38,040 --> 00:15:41,810
Differentiate between Bitcoin and crypto, and maybe, you know, it's better to

267
00:15:41,810 --> 00:15:46,110
actually experience that, to try doing that and learn some more rather than just

268
00:15:46,800 --> 00:15:50,990
doing, you know, a witchery and, and, you know, Uh, and burning witches on,

269
00:15:51,020 --> 00:15:55,100
you know, uh, when, when you don't, when you're not sure what you're dealing with.

270
00:15:55,110 --> 00:16:01,089
So, yeah, in this sense, you know, I think that, uh, maybe, I took things for granted

271
00:16:01,109 --> 00:16:03,939
going out there as in, this is natural.

272
00:16:03,959 --> 00:16:06,619
Like this conversation is definitely going into Bitcoin.

273
00:16:07,749 --> 00:16:08,749
To me, that was natural.

274
00:16:08,809 --> 00:16:09,629
For them, it wasn't.

275
00:16:10,524 --> 00:16:14,284
Um, but at least I think I maybe put some, you know, seeds in their brains as well.

276
00:16:14,284 --> 00:16:16,504
So maybe they can research that.

277
00:16:17,042 --> 00:16:17,782
Fantastic.

278
00:16:17,782 --> 00:16:22,222
Well, so, uh, I think, I think, uh, this, this concept is, is really

279
00:16:22,222 --> 00:16:26,272
interesting and it's, it's always nice to see community development here with,

280
00:16:26,950 --> 00:16:28,980
within the, the Bitcoin ecosystem.

281
00:16:28,980 --> 00:16:32,800
And so, uh, can you maybe go into a little more detail about sort of

282
00:16:32,920 --> 00:16:35,810
the organization of all of this?

283
00:16:35,810 --> 00:16:39,020
Like what, what exactly is the Bitcoin walk?

284
00:16:40,425 --> 00:16:43,165
Organization and what you're working on specifically with that.

285
00:16:43,165 --> 00:16:48,145
And what is sort of more of a community development type of thing?

286
00:16:48,295 --> 00:16:49,975
Like, how can, how can others get involved?

287
00:16:50,420 --> 00:16:50,890
Of course.

288
00:16:50,970 --> 00:16:54,310
So the easiest way to get involved, you know, this is, this is really simple.

289
00:16:54,340 --> 00:16:58,360
Um, you just create your Bitcoin world chapter, wherever you are, we've

290
00:16:58,390 --> 00:17:02,370
now got over 15 cities around the world where people meet up, you know,

291
00:17:02,500 --> 00:17:05,000
every sat, every sat, every Saturday.

292
00:17:05,468 --> 00:17:10,034
and they go for a walk, and you know, it's, it's a free format and I always

293
00:17:10,034 --> 00:17:14,024
encourage people to basically be open minded and start with those three things,

294
00:17:14,024 --> 00:17:18,894
you know, discuss the impact of self custody, uh, finance scarcity and privacy

295
00:17:19,124 --> 00:17:21,414
and how this, uh, how this is important.

296
00:17:21,854 --> 00:17:26,614
And believe me, like people who understands roughly those three things.

297
00:17:27,204 --> 00:17:31,654
They can wander to many, many different, um, uh, paths in,

298
00:17:31,664 --> 00:17:32,594
in, in their discussions.

299
00:17:32,994 --> 00:17:35,724
Uh, and, uh, yeah, you know, the, the easiest way is to either,

300
00:17:35,754 --> 00:17:36,824
you know, to go to bitcoinwalk.

301
00:17:36,834 --> 00:17:37,614
org website.

302
00:17:37,654 --> 00:17:42,294
Um, see if there's any, uh, probably there won't be any, any chapter in your city.

303
00:17:42,294 --> 00:17:45,464
I mean, there are, there are, there's like 15 or 16 chapters right now.

304
00:17:45,944 --> 00:17:48,334
Um, but there's also a link to set up a new chapter.

305
00:17:48,334 --> 00:17:53,104
So, you know, what, what, what this will do is it will take you to a very short,

306
00:17:53,284 --> 00:17:57,604
like, small form where, you know, I would get the location of your walk, maybe

307
00:17:57,604 --> 00:18:01,544
some information, um, and your, your telegram username, and I would set up a

308
00:18:01,584 --> 00:18:03,304
page and a telegram group for yourself.

309
00:18:03,324 --> 00:18:06,784
Um, so you can actually announce it and, uh, be the one who starts the walk.

310
00:18:08,289 --> 00:18:11,619
And, um, you know, people struggle with the idea that

311
00:18:11,709 --> 00:18:14,109
it's like, who's going to come?

312
00:18:14,109 --> 00:18:15,869
Maybe I don't know how to manage that.

313
00:18:15,999 --> 00:18:17,219
It's, it's really simple.

314
00:18:17,219 --> 00:18:20,659
Like, if you, if you just trust your, your, your instincts, as you did with

315
00:18:20,699 --> 00:18:24,219
getting into Bitcoin, and you take for granted that the other person will also

316
00:18:24,219 --> 00:18:25,989
share this common denominator with you.

317
00:18:26,314 --> 00:18:29,534
You will already have things to talk about and you'll have a great time and,

318
00:18:29,964 --> 00:18:33,604
uh, potentially, you know, meet someone that will change your life as well.

319
00:18:35,489 --> 00:18:36,819
Bitcoin is a walkie talkie.

320
00:18:37,319 --> 00:18:43,889
And I know for a fact that there are Bitcoin walks happening in more than 15

321
00:18:43,899 --> 00:18:47,704
cities every Saturday though, because Bitcoin Not all Bitcoiners, believe

322
00:18:47,704 --> 00:18:53,474
it or not, but not all Bitcoiners are, are, uh, have, you know, filling out

323
00:18:53,554 --> 00:18:56,274
online forms as their favorite hobby.

324
00:18:56,734 --> 00:19:01,444
So, so these things are happening, uh, yeah, off band also.

325
00:19:01,634 --> 00:19:06,694
And I think like, um, in Germany, the German community is fantastic

326
00:19:06,714 --> 00:19:11,534
with the Einundzwanzig thing that has like spread to every major, uh,

327
00:19:11,594 --> 00:19:13,404
city in the country at this point.

328
00:19:13,874 --> 00:19:17,064
And there are a lot of Bitcoin walks happening over there, uh, I

329
00:19:17,064 --> 00:19:18,744
know for a fact, yeah, pleb walks.

330
00:19:18,774 --> 00:19:19,064
Yeah.

331
00:19:19,324 --> 00:19:24,364
So, so, so how connected are you to the pleb walk community in, uh, in Germany?

332
00:19:24,514 --> 00:19:26,334
Like, is this an international thing?

333
00:19:26,687 --> 00:19:30,697
Yeah, we've got, uh, you know, three or four, uh, chapters in Germany.

334
00:19:30,957 --> 00:19:34,937
Uh, I think the Cologne one is, the one in Cologne is the biggest one.

335
00:19:35,372 --> 00:19:39,362
Um, there's one, there's a big one that are happening, uh, not every Saturday,

336
00:19:39,362 --> 00:19:41,642
I think that's once a month in Berlin.

337
00:19:42,092 --> 00:19:45,172
Uh, they go to Grunwald and they walk over there, beautiful place.

338
00:19:45,622 --> 00:19:50,312
Um, so, you know, and again, you know, I'm not, like, the idea is to kind

339
00:19:50,312 --> 00:19:51,972
of help people maybe organize that.

340
00:19:51,972 --> 00:19:55,252
I don't necessarily consider this, you know, to be the only right way to do that.

341
00:19:55,682 --> 00:19:59,652
Uh, just find your way and I'm here to kind of help you maybe with, uh, Getting

342
00:19:59,652 --> 00:20:03,732
the word out and, uh, and yeah, do a little bit of marketing, whatever you

343
00:20:03,732 --> 00:20:07,362
want to call that, to encourage people and to get the word out, um, to, to be

344
00:20:07,362 --> 00:20:08,942
aware and to find your Bitcoin walk.

345
00:20:09,637 --> 00:20:11,937
Yeah, are you familiar with the orange pill app?

346
00:20:12,282 --> 00:20:12,592
Of course.

347
00:20:12,592 --> 00:20:12,822
Yeah,

348
00:20:13,147 --> 00:20:18,816
Yeah, um, because I, I think that's probably a good place to, to, um to do

349
00:20:18,816 --> 00:20:23,306
events like this and Bitcoin walks and whatnot, because, um, it's all about

350
00:20:23,316 --> 00:20:25,706
finding other Bitcoiners in real life.

351
00:20:25,706 --> 00:20:26,056
Right.

352
00:20:26,176 --> 00:20:30,656
And I think regardless if we are using that or using anything else, like, uh,

353
00:20:30,676 --> 00:20:36,176
the, uh, the real world connections are, are so much more important than we think.

354
00:20:36,391 --> 00:20:42,301
Because like, um, whenever I've experienced, uh, a time or a place

355
00:20:42,341 --> 00:20:47,301
or both where, where there is, uh, uh, a Bitcoin community in one

356
00:20:47,421 --> 00:20:53,071
single location at the same time, then all the problems just vanish.

357
00:20:53,081 --> 00:20:54,391
They just go away.

358
00:20:54,451 --> 00:20:57,231
And, and you can just talk about whatever you want.

359
00:20:57,811 --> 00:21:01,221
You can find that little percentage of stuff you disagree about.

360
00:21:01,311 --> 00:21:05,561
And that's where the interesting conversation happens instead of just, uh,

361
00:21:06,090 --> 00:21:10,160
automatically thinking that the other guy is a bad guy because he disagrees on this

362
00:21:10,160 --> 00:21:16,880
or that and, uh, and, and Bitcoin itself just removes all the barriers and removes

363
00:21:16,880 --> 00:21:22,240
all the financial problems that one or more of the participants in this group

364
00:21:22,250 --> 00:21:27,590
may or may not have, but it's just better, better living through cryptography.

365
00:21:28,130 --> 00:21:28,740
absolutely.

366
00:21:29,270 --> 00:21:31,940
And, and, you know, you're, you're, you're right in saying that, you know, the, the,

367
00:21:31,970 --> 00:21:37,550
the meat space, you know, uh, meeting in real life is, um, is very different.

368
00:21:37,560 --> 00:21:40,750
And I think it's going to have a big comeback with, you know, with, um,

369
00:21:40,780 --> 00:21:44,330
all the information, all the noise coming from, you know, social media.

370
00:21:44,695 --> 00:21:48,865
Uh, all the mainstream propaganda and, you know, now we're getting into

371
00:21:48,865 --> 00:21:55,885
like AI fake news, uh, so, you know, we're going to see, uh, influencers or

372
00:21:55,885 --> 00:22:00,345
politicians saying crazy stuff and you will never know, like, is that for real?

373
00:22:00,345 --> 00:22:01,815
Like, is this true?

374
00:22:01,815 --> 00:22:06,095
Or is this being manipulated because things are getting so abstract.

375
00:22:06,643 --> 00:22:09,753
then it's really, yeah, it's really, um, becoming weird.

376
00:22:09,793 --> 00:22:13,243
So getting this validation from your peers is going to be very, very meaningful.

377
00:22:13,503 --> 00:22:18,342
You know, one thing that kind of comes back to me about this, this, this, Truman

378
00:22:18,342 --> 00:22:22,812
show we're living in is that, you know, the fact that, um, you know, on, on, on,

379
00:22:22,812 --> 00:22:27,812
in, uh, in the newspaper, the Times from the 3rd of January, 2009, you've got,

380
00:22:27,812 --> 00:22:31,342
you know, the, the, the headline, um, that Satoshi put in the Genesis blog,

381
00:22:31,887 --> 00:22:36,767
and also you have the main picture, uh, with saying that, you know, Israel

382
00:22:36,847 --> 00:22:39,177
prepares, like IDF prepares to enter Gaza.

383
00:22:39,815 --> 00:22:43,665
And to me, this is like, okay, we're 15 years later and this headline

384
00:22:43,665 --> 00:22:45,665
could, both of those headlines, right?

385
00:22:46,175 --> 00:22:49,765
Chancellor on the brink of second bailout, third or fourth or whatever the number is.

386
00:22:50,285 --> 00:22:54,875
And the, you know, the, the, the analogy to, to the situation, uh, in, in the

387
00:22:54,875 --> 00:22:56,945
Middle East, um, they, they still stand.

388
00:22:56,945 --> 00:22:57,545
So I can't.

389
00:22:58,125 --> 00:23:00,625
Comprehend like how did how this is just surreal.

390
00:23:00,635 --> 00:23:01,315
It's getting absurd.

391
00:23:02,535 --> 00:23:09,932
Yeah, it's like time stopped and the time chain sort of took over.

392
00:23:11,472 --> 00:23:11,902
Indeed.

393
00:23:12,102 --> 00:23:12,462
Indeed.

394
00:26:28,553 --> 00:26:32,223
So maybe you can tell us a little bit about kind of how you're seeing

395
00:26:32,333 --> 00:26:38,383
the Bitcoin ecosystem right now, like the state of the world we're

396
00:26:38,383 --> 00:26:40,573
just, we're just post having here.

397
00:26:40,933 --> 00:26:45,873
What are you hoping to see come out of the near future with Bitcoin?

398
00:26:46,633 --> 00:26:51,403
Well, you know, this year is, uh, is interesting because we have, uh, I

399
00:26:51,463 --> 00:26:55,683
can't remember, but a lot of elections happening in different countries.

400
00:26:56,583 --> 00:27:00,453
Um, and I think is going to be like, it's going to be a weird year in the

401
00:27:00,453 --> 00:27:05,893
sense that people don't want to make, you know, um, too radical or crazy things.

402
00:27:06,669 --> 00:27:08,359
as they campaign for the elections.

403
00:27:09,094 --> 00:27:12,794
Um, you know, you can already see like every single candidate for US president's

404
00:27:13,734 --> 00:27:18,484
seat is already, you know, has Bitcoin on their political agenda one way or another.

405
00:27:18,924 --> 00:27:22,274
Um, of course, you know, these are politicians, so they will never, you

406
00:27:22,274 --> 00:27:24,534
know, follow through everything they say.

407
00:27:25,024 --> 00:27:29,644
But, uh, it's, it's getting interesting and I think, um, you know, uh, the,

408
00:27:29,704 --> 00:27:34,534
until probably around, you know, next half a year, I don't see much changing

409
00:27:34,574 --> 00:27:37,844
and then probably, you know, there's going to be some, some bigger movements

410
00:27:37,844 --> 00:27:43,066
and things will start escalating, you know, um, from sort of institutional

411
00:27:43,066 --> 00:27:46,516
adoption, we've got the ETFs, of course, and they're, you know, getting

412
00:27:46,516 --> 00:27:51,836
into Bitcoin like crazy, uh, we've got now the ETFs in, uh, in Hong Kong, so

413
00:27:51,836 --> 00:27:54,266
effectively Probably just say China.

414
00:27:54,816 --> 00:28:00,626
Um, we've got, um, I think South Korea coming to, uh, into the game as well.

415
00:28:00,626 --> 00:28:03,706
The ETF game, I think Australia announced something.

416
00:28:03,986 --> 00:28:08,136
So, you know, uh, those big institutions, they will, they will start, you know, uh,

417
00:28:08,176 --> 00:28:09,606
putting Bitcoin on their balance sheet.

418
00:28:10,356 --> 00:28:14,916
And the supply is, you know, it's just shrinking with, you know, the current

419
00:28:14,966 --> 00:28:19,426
epoch, um, so there's going to be a lot of demands and, uh, and I think,

420
00:28:20,106 --> 00:28:25,556
unfortunately for, for plebs, for people, um, it will only become, this is my

421
00:28:25,556 --> 00:28:31,146
opinion, maybe you disagree, but I think, um, but I think the, uh, the adoption

422
00:28:31,146 --> 00:28:32,916
of Bitcoin can happen through pain.

423
00:28:33,926 --> 00:28:39,126
So if there is no pain, like, you know, in, in, in the UK, which is completely,

424
00:28:39,156 --> 00:28:44,676
completely ignorant of how massively, you know, this technology and this,

425
00:28:44,706 --> 00:28:48,886
this thing will change humanity, they don't have, like, people in UK

426
00:28:48,986 --> 00:28:51,216
don't have the need to adopt Bitcoin.

427
00:28:51,236 --> 00:28:53,206
They, you know, they rely on Pound Sterling.

428
00:28:53,951 --> 00:28:55,811
They don't feel like change is needed.

429
00:28:56,791 --> 00:29:00,031
So, uh, I think, you know, unless you get into the situation like, you know,

430
00:29:00,051 --> 00:29:04,571
Turkey or Argentina or Venezuela and you actually see that by, you know,

431
00:29:04,721 --> 00:29:10,411
uh, your, your hyperinflation or just very high inflation, your, your savings

432
00:29:10,411 --> 00:29:11,781
and your money is being diluted.

433
00:29:12,406 --> 00:29:14,896
Then you get, you start looking for escape.

434
00:29:15,446 --> 00:29:19,116
Unless you experience that, people are complacent and just

435
00:29:19,116 --> 00:29:20,316
living, you know, a happy life.

436
00:29:20,496 --> 00:29:21,236
Shakuna

437
00:29:21,491 --> 00:29:26,541
Well, don't you think that wherever there's inflation, there is pain or

438
00:29:26,891 --> 00:29:29,171
there will be pain at some point?

439
00:29:29,396 --> 00:29:29,996
Absolutely.

440
00:29:30,506 --> 00:29:33,776
And, and that inflation, like the way I see it, the, the,

441
00:29:33,776 --> 00:29:36,206
the istic curve meme is real.

442
00:29:36,211 --> 00:29:40,196
Like the, uh, the inflation is not getting any better anytime soon.

443
00:29:40,251 --> 00:29:45,796
The the like, uh, normal inflation is just hyperinflation in slowmo.

444
00:29:46,743 --> 00:29:51,633
So, so, so there will be pain, like different people will, different, will

445
00:29:51,633 --> 00:29:57,613
experience it differently and at different times and to different magnitudes,

446
00:29:58,233 --> 00:30:00,603
but it's still pain, it's somewhere.

447
00:30:01,073 --> 00:30:03,163
And, and it does create bitcoiners, I believe.

448
00:30:03,427 --> 00:30:04,107
It does, yeah.

449
00:30:04,107 --> 00:30:07,927
And I just wish that, you know, people were smarter before they get hurt, before

450
00:30:07,927 --> 00:30:09,447
they, you know, they get into pain.

451
00:30:09,817 --> 00:30:14,327
Um, I got really good friends, uh, who are, like, super, you know, super smart,

452
00:30:14,327 --> 00:30:18,667
well educated, have PhDs and stuff, and, uh, I'm trying to orange pill them and,

453
00:30:18,717 --> 00:30:22,247
you know, tell them about Bitcoin, and they're just fed up with it, they don't

454
00:30:22,247 --> 00:30:25,227
want to listen to me anymore, like, don't, just stop talking about Bitcoin, let's

455
00:30:25,417 --> 00:30:30,827
just talk about your music or something else, um, so they're just, And, and

456
00:30:30,902 --> 00:30:35,482
this friend of mine, um, he's telling me that basically, um, there are two

457
00:30:35,482 --> 00:30:40,322
kinds of people, people who, who, um, who are into Bitcoin and who are not.

458
00:30:40,352 --> 00:30:41,972
And I say, I, I don't agree with that.

459
00:30:41,972 --> 00:30:45,272
I think that there are people who, you know, who, who are, who understand how

460
00:30:45,272 --> 00:30:48,362
Bitcoin changes the world, and people who are sailors as intellectually

461
00:30:48,362 --> 00:30:53,472
lazy to do their homework and to, you know, um, to, to understand

462
00:30:53,472 --> 00:30:54,822
the potential it brings together.

463
00:30:55,491 --> 00:30:58,511
You said something there, uh, like, your music?

464
00:30:59,041 --> 00:31:00,111
You make music?

465
00:31:01,136 --> 00:31:03,356
no, I'm, I'm, I'm a, I'm a, I'm a vivid listener,

466
00:31:04,281 --> 00:31:04,841
Oh, okay.

467
00:31:06,301 --> 00:31:08,161
That's another, another, another thing.

468
00:31:08,211 --> 00:31:13,681
Um, like, um, I recently got, uh, got an invite, um, to, to come to BTC Prague.

469
00:31:13,681 --> 00:31:18,611
And, uh, and, uh, unfortunately I, I mean, I already booked this

470
00:31:18,611 --> 00:31:20,111
weekend for download festival.

471
00:31:20,151 --> 00:31:22,971
So we'll be going to Donington and, uh, I'm taking my friend

472
00:31:22,971 --> 00:31:25,601
for, for, for his birthday.

473
00:31:25,601 --> 00:31:26,781
So, um, yeah.

474
00:31:26,781 --> 00:31:30,031
And I will miss Prague, but, um, yeah, we'll, we'll have a good time anyway.

475
00:31:30,441 --> 00:31:32,461
Donington, there's a lot of metal there, right?

476
00:31:33,341 --> 00:31:33,671
Yeah.

477
00:31:34,631 --> 00:31:35,121
Yeah.

478
00:31:35,291 --> 00:31:36,051
Yeah.

479
00:31:39,521 --> 00:31:44,351
Well, we're, uh, we're metalheads over here as well.

480
00:31:44,361 --> 00:31:45,151
So yeah, yeah,

481
00:31:45,971 --> 00:31:46,481
I saw it.

482
00:31:46,831 --> 00:31:48,991
Uh, look, I think you're, you're a Meshuggah fan, right?

483
00:31:49,321 --> 00:31:51,601
yeah, I am a big Meshuggah fan.

484
00:31:52,311 --> 00:31:52,941
Uh, yeah.

485
00:31:53,041 --> 00:31:54,401
Are they coming to Donington?

486
00:31:55,071 --> 00:31:57,431
Uh, I don't think they are now, but I mean, this year

487
00:31:57,431 --> 00:31:58,791
is, the lineup is a bit weird.

488
00:31:58,841 --> 00:32:02,881
Um, I, um, I mean, there's going to be Offspring, for example, which I,

489
00:32:02,891 --> 00:32:05,401
you know, I'd love to see them, but that's, that's my teenage years.

490
00:32:05,801 --> 00:32:11,181
Uh, so not metal so much, but, um, yeah, that would be, that'd be some cool band.

491
00:32:11,201 --> 00:32:14,301
Well, there'll be Pantera as well, you know, uh, coming, making comebacks.

492
00:32:14,301 --> 00:32:14,611
So,

493
00:32:14,651 --> 00:32:15,031
Oh, yeah.

494
00:32:15,031 --> 00:32:15,261
Yeah.

495
00:32:15,271 --> 00:32:17,271
We saw that me and Luke went to that.

496
00:32:17,551 --> 00:32:18,641
It's like the first concert.

497
00:32:18,851 --> 00:32:21,131
It's the only concert we've ever been to Luke, right?

498
00:32:21,131 --> 00:32:24,311
Oh, we've been to the Satoshi Rakamoto things, I guess.

499
00:32:24,311 --> 00:32:28,761
But in Prague last year, we went to see Pantera after the conference.

500
00:32:29,471 --> 00:32:30,661
It's fucking amazing.

501
00:32:30,761 --> 00:32:35,651
Uh, even though it's just half of Pantera, but with two very competent

502
00:32:35,661 --> 00:32:37,451
other musicians doing their thing.

503
00:32:37,501 --> 00:32:39,071
And yeah, it was great.

504
00:32:40,161 --> 00:32:41,541
yeah, I always love to look into it.

505
00:32:42,281 --> 00:32:48,436
The, uh, Yeah, you said the world exists, the world is made up of two

506
00:32:48,436 --> 00:32:54,306
types of people, the ones who can extrapolate from incomplete data sets.

507
00:33:00,073 --> 00:33:01,033
That was the joke.

508
00:33:04,351 --> 00:33:05,111
Got it, got it.

509
00:33:05,506 --> 00:33:06,046
All right.

510
00:33:07,046 --> 00:33:10,246
Well, you're going to have a bit of editing to do here, Luke.

511
00:33:10,246 --> 00:33:11,646
Yeah.

512
00:33:11,731 --> 00:33:13,461
we'll have to leave that pause in a little bit.

513
00:33:14,671 --> 00:33:15,801
Otherwise, it doesn't land.

514
00:33:16,171 --> 00:33:16,981
And the ones who don't.

515
00:33:17,131 --> 00:33:17,491
Yeah,

516
00:33:18,991 --> 00:33:19,771
No, great stuff.

517
00:33:19,791 --> 00:33:20,321
Great stuff.

518
00:33:20,321 --> 00:33:25,151
So, uh, yeah, you've given us a little bit of, um, uh, I guess, perspective

519
00:33:25,151 --> 00:33:27,251
on the, the situation in the UK.

520
00:33:27,971 --> 00:33:33,206
How much, uh, how much are you, uh, also involved in, in, uh, Uh, the community

521
00:33:33,216 --> 00:33:37,476
in, in Poland, like, like I've, I've, I've moved from Canada to Finland.

522
00:33:37,476 --> 00:33:41,896
I've got sort of feet in both, both countries and keep an eye, uh, on, on

523
00:33:41,896 --> 00:33:43,476
both and everywhere at the same time.

524
00:33:43,476 --> 00:33:46,596
So yeah, how much are you involved with, uh, with the community in Poland?

525
00:33:47,411 --> 00:33:52,271
to be fair, I only met, uh, the guys from Den from, you know, from the

526
00:33:52,391 --> 00:33:55,301
21, uh, community, uh, in Madera.

527
00:33:55,361 --> 00:33:58,841
Um, I, I haven't been, you know, I haven't lived, been living in Poland for a while,

528
00:33:58,841 --> 00:34:00,791
so I, I'm not, I'm not there too often.

529
00:34:01,231 --> 00:34:03,601
Um, but we had, we had a great connection.

530
00:34:03,601 --> 00:34:06,271
I, I didn't really realize that, you know, that they were there,

531
00:34:06,271 --> 00:34:07,621
there were so many Bitcoiners there.

532
00:34:07,921 --> 00:34:12,031
Uh, I had a massive like, uh, surprise moment when I found out that peer Pier

533
00:34:12,211 --> 00:34:13,022
Cober is actually, you know, hiss.

534
00:34:14,601 --> 00:34:18,641
Polish technically, or speaks Polish better than me probably, so I always

535
00:34:18,881 --> 00:34:22,411
talk to him in English, and then it says like, okay, actually, I just

536
00:34:22,411 --> 00:34:24,939
witnessed him speaking Polish, so why do I talk to you in English if

537
00:34:24,939 --> 00:34:26,951
you're speaking Polish fluently?

538
00:34:28,061 --> 00:34:32,371
So yeah, we had a good chat, and unfortunately I missed

539
00:34:32,371 --> 00:34:36,491
the European halving party in Warsaw, I couldn't make it.

540
00:34:37,056 --> 00:34:42,156
Family reasons, but, um, yeah, you know, I have a lot of, a lot of sympathy for,

541
00:34:42,156 --> 00:34:46,686
uh, for everybody, you know, who's, who's into Bitcoin in Poland, because again,

542
00:34:46,696 --> 00:34:51,596
you know, the, the consciousness and the open mindedness in general public in

543
00:34:51,596 --> 00:34:55,846
Poland, that's going to be very tough to overcome, like people live in, you know,

544
00:34:55,846 --> 00:35:00,286
in, in, in, in the past pretty much, and, um, I'm super, super happy to see that

545
00:35:00,286 --> 00:35:04,856
there are so many prominent and bright guys, uh, and girls in Bitcoin already.

546
00:35:05,826 --> 00:35:06,156
Yeah.

547
00:35:06,156 --> 00:35:10,306
I went to the halving party in Warsaw and it was great.

548
00:35:10,356 --> 00:35:16,146
And, uh, like I got the feeling like that, uh, Warsaw, and, and, and Poland,

549
00:35:16,186 --> 00:35:22,301
uh, like you guys, like Eastern Europe in general, uh, Eastern Europe is

550
00:35:22,301 --> 00:35:29,051
sort of a weird term, but all you poor countries that were invaded by the, uh,

551
00:35:31,641 --> 00:35:40,201
by the evil empire, uh, like, you know, where the end of the obedience

552
00:35:40,201 --> 00:35:44,281
road, you, you know, what doing what the government tells you lead to, or

553
00:35:44,281 --> 00:35:46,461
at least your parent does, parents do.

554
00:35:46,791 --> 00:35:49,311
So, so, uh, so that's the thing.

555
00:35:49,311 --> 00:35:54,842
I think, uh, people in Eastern Europe are more, Like they get Bitcoin

556
00:35:54,842 --> 00:35:56,852
earlier because they know the dangers.

557
00:35:56,962 --> 00:36:03,002
Uh, I, I, I really feel this discrepancy like, and this, uh, difference between

558
00:36:03,002 --> 00:36:05,362
East and the East and the West in Europe.

559
00:36:05,392 --> 00:36:06,032
Like, uh,

560
00:36:06,290 --> 00:36:09,500
I think what you're, what you're referring here is basically complacency, right?

561
00:36:09,530 --> 00:36:12,920
Like people are not so complacent, people would push back and try to

562
00:36:12,920 --> 00:36:19,380
find a way, um, yeah to, to, not to play on the accord of the government.

563
00:36:19,520 --> 00:36:19,750
Yeah.

564
00:36:20,342 --> 00:36:21,542
And see obedience thing.

565
00:36:22,276 --> 00:36:24,816
you know, if you're into history and you, you look into the how, like,

566
00:36:24,816 --> 00:36:28,106
you know, the, the end of, and, you know, the collapse of Soviet Union

567
00:36:28,136 --> 00:36:30,471
and, um, the role that, that, that.

568
00:36:30,471 --> 00:36:33,591
Two particular people played in it.

569
00:36:34,081 --> 00:36:36,731
I'm referring to Lech Wałęsa, you know, the first president of the

570
00:36:36,731 --> 00:36:40,011
Free Poland and the guy from the from the unions of the shipyard from

571
00:36:40,011 --> 00:36:43,221
Gdańsk, and the Pope, John Paul II.

572
00:36:44,141 --> 00:36:45,031
Um, you know,

573
00:36:45,051 --> 00:36:45,701
remember this.

574
00:36:45,731 --> 00:36:46,641
This is my childhood.

575
00:36:47,707 --> 00:36:51,747
so, so, um, so that was kind of, you know, great.

576
00:36:52,017 --> 00:36:55,777
And, uh, there was a lot of, um, you know, the solidarity

577
00:36:55,777 --> 00:36:57,457
and the spirit of solidarity.

578
00:36:58,097 --> 00:37:02,307
That's, uh, it has done a lot of good things, you know, for, for Poland.

579
00:37:02,607 --> 00:37:05,627
So the church played their role in the history of Poland.

580
00:37:05,997 --> 00:37:07,467
Today, not so much.

581
00:37:07,497 --> 00:37:13,657
Um, you know, they, like, I'm, I'm, I'm not, uh, very much, you

582
00:37:13,657 --> 00:37:14,937
know, a supporter of the church.

583
00:37:14,937 --> 00:37:18,564
I think they should basically be more servants, uh, to, to, you

584
00:37:18,564 --> 00:37:19,797
know, to people who are in need.

585
00:37:20,107 --> 00:37:24,677
Whereas in Poland, that's not how it works today, but what's interesting is

586
00:37:24,707 --> 00:37:29,457
that, you know, back in the days, back in the 70s and 80s, when, where, you know,

587
00:37:29,457 --> 00:37:36,657
Poland was under a communist regime, you had, um, you know, all the mainstream,

588
00:37:36,697 --> 00:37:41,507
well, the only media there was, so newspapers and, and, uh, And public

589
00:37:41,507 --> 00:37:46,277
TV, um, basically pumping propaganda for their, you know, for their tubes.

590
00:37:46,317 --> 00:37:48,187
And there was like, you couldn't listen to that.

591
00:37:48,187 --> 00:37:49,537
It was just disgusting.

592
00:37:50,037 --> 00:37:55,547
Uh, so basically, um, USSR was the good guys and the West was the

593
00:37:55,557 --> 00:37:57,677
filthy, you know, spoiled capitalists.

594
00:37:57,997 --> 00:37:59,917
That's, that's all we had to kind of pumped in.

595
00:38:00,292 --> 00:38:01,512
You know, all the time.

596
00:38:01,872 --> 00:38:05,822
And what was interesting is that actually the church, the catholic church, which was

597
00:38:05,832 --> 00:38:11,782
quite active in this time, they had their ritual on Sunday mass, so people would

598
00:38:11,782 --> 00:38:16,952
go to the church, and this would be the platform for people to find out the truth,

599
00:38:17,172 --> 00:38:21,042
to learn a little more about, you know, the geopolitical situation, like what is

600
00:38:21,052 --> 00:38:23,232
going on, like what's What are the risks?

601
00:38:23,472 --> 00:38:27,622
And Preece at that time played a significant role in fighting

602
00:38:27,622 --> 00:38:28,522
against the government.

603
00:38:29,462 --> 00:38:33,102
And I noticed that, you know, this kind of in real life meetup and the,

604
00:38:33,122 --> 00:38:36,772
you know, platform with the community that's united around one thing is

605
00:38:36,972 --> 00:38:41,762
somewhat similar to what we do with BitcoinWalk, where we, you know, we

606
00:38:41,772 --> 00:38:43,602
meet every Saturday, we discuss things.

607
00:38:43,942 --> 00:38:45,962
I hope that we'll never come to the point where, you know,

608
00:38:45,962 --> 00:38:47,282
there'll be a big crackdown.

609
00:38:47,432 --> 00:38:52,742
On such a big crackdown on Bitcoin that, you know, we would need to, um, you know,

610
00:38:52,772 --> 00:38:58,532
go in, in, in real life and try to, you know, whisper and, you know, discuss what,

611
00:38:58,542 --> 00:38:59,552
what's, what's, what's going to happen.

612
00:39:00,244 --> 00:39:02,674
So, how is that in Poland?

613
00:39:02,684 --> 00:39:06,024
Like, is the separation of church and state?

614
00:39:06,164 --> 00:39:09,554
Like, are the church and state separated, I guess?

615
00:39:09,554 --> 00:39:12,144
And have they been for how long?

616
00:39:12,144 --> 00:39:12,634
And like

617
00:39:13,027 --> 00:39:18,388
So, it's, it's a very tricky thing because the church in Poland is still

618
00:39:18,388 --> 00:39:23,697
financed by the state, and they've got, you know, the concordat law.

619
00:39:23,947 --> 00:39:26,317
I'm not sure if this is the translation, but basically they're

620
00:39:26,397 --> 00:39:27,827
still being subsidized by the state.

621
00:39:27,827 --> 00:39:28,172
Thanks for watching!

622
00:39:28,652 --> 00:39:35,102
Uh, they are always very, um, very, uh, active during, you know, any

623
00:39:35,102 --> 00:39:39,352
sort of elections, so it's become very corrupt in this sense, so

624
00:39:39,352 --> 00:39:40,862
that's why I don't support them.

625
00:39:41,422 --> 00:39:42,232
Polish church at all.

626
00:39:43,682 --> 00:39:47,442
Um, you've, you've got, you know, you've got priests and archbishops

627
00:39:47,442 --> 00:39:49,092
who are, uh, millionaires.

628
00:39:50,262 --> 00:39:51,642
Uh, it's just crazy.

629
00:39:52,002 --> 00:39:53,532
Uh, they, they don't help the poor.

630
00:39:53,532 --> 00:39:57,102
They, they, they're, they're literally benefiting from the can continu effect.

631
00:39:57,512 --> 00:40:01,172
Uh, there's one guy, uh, he's like, uh, the biggest fucking

632
00:40:01,172 --> 00:40:02,162
douchebag in the world.

633
00:40:02,192 --> 00:40:04,172
Uh, he's got, you know, uh, a big, uh.

634
00:40:04,712 --> 00:40:09,642
Uh, Empire built on the subsidies coming from, uh, from the government, you know,

635
00:40:09,642 --> 00:40:12,872
from like every single ministry, he can take some money, he will take it.

636
00:40:12,942 --> 00:40:16,642
And, uh, uh, there was a, you know, there was, there was some, some

637
00:40:16,642 --> 00:40:25,122
time when, um, he, um, he got given, uh, two, like, uh, limousines, like

638
00:40:25,122 --> 00:40:26,542
two cars were very expensive cars.

639
00:40:27,002 --> 00:40:29,522
And, uh, in, in a statement publicly, he said that.

640
00:40:29,937 --> 00:40:33,377
He got them from a homeless guy who gave it to them and died.

641
00:40:34,096 --> 00:40:37,726
This is the level of absurd that is going on over there.

642
00:40:37,766 --> 00:40:40,326
So you just, you know, it's just beyond any sort of

643
00:40:41,156 --> 00:40:43,116
decency that a man should have.

644
00:40:43,156 --> 00:40:43,766
You know, I

645
00:40:43,891 --> 00:40:44,411
Yeah, yeah.

646
00:40:45,001 --> 00:40:48,901
So, is the state just another organized religion?

647
00:40:49,621 --> 00:40:51,071
Or what's your opinion?

648
00:40:51,939 --> 00:40:57,479
think, you know, it's, um, it's different in different, um, different countries.

649
00:40:57,519 --> 00:41:02,559
Um, when you're, you know, when you're in Poland, uh, and you live between,

650
00:41:02,639 --> 00:41:08,934
you know, Germany and The eastern bloc, let's call it this way, your

651
00:41:08,944 --> 00:41:10,274
perspective is somewhat different.

652
00:41:10,304 --> 00:41:14,514
Like you, you know, we've gone through history many, many times where Poland

653
00:41:14,514 --> 00:41:17,484
was attacked from left and right, you know, and then center as well.

654
00:41:18,227 --> 00:41:22,737
so, in this sense, you know, I think, um, the state should, you know, should

655
00:41:22,777 --> 00:41:27,112
provide, like, minimal, amount of services where they actually secure the,

656
00:41:27,112 --> 00:41:29,332
you know, the basic needs of society.

657
00:41:29,882 --> 00:41:31,522
Um, but they shouldn't.

658
00:41:31,892 --> 00:41:32,932
They should be public servants.

659
00:41:32,972 --> 00:41:34,652
So, you know, this is a good thing that Bitcoin does.

660
00:41:34,652 --> 00:41:39,982
It defunds the state, like money that's being put out and, you know, saved

661
00:41:40,002 --> 00:41:43,872
in Bitcoin and spent in Bitcoin as well, you know, in the Bitcoin market.

662
00:41:44,192 --> 00:41:46,702
This money is not going to fund, you know, wars.

663
00:41:46,802 --> 00:41:49,722
It's not going to fund any church, for example.

664
00:41:49,732 --> 00:41:52,412
I don't want to be paying for the church, you know, for my taxes or whatever.

665
00:41:52,732 --> 00:41:53,422
I'm opting out.

666
00:41:53,892 --> 00:41:59,432
Um, and, uh, in, in many, I think, you know, I saw a tweet somewhere.

667
00:42:00,767 --> 00:42:03,807
Basically, Bitcoin kind of brings it back, uh, makes, you know, uh,

668
00:42:04,207 --> 00:42:06,397
public servant, public servant, makes them public servants.

669
00:42:06,407 --> 00:42:10,677
So they, they're, they're again, supposed to be serving the public in a way

670
00:42:10,707 --> 00:42:15,677
that's, uh, not benefit, not benefiting from the public, but just improving it.

671
00:42:15,677 --> 00:42:16,007
Right?

672
00:42:17,292 --> 00:42:25,432
Yeah, yeah, I feel the same, if not, like, um, I'm unsure whether that is

673
00:42:25,622 --> 00:42:30,362
even possible, though, like, uh, even on a Bitcoin standard, that the state

674
00:42:31,422 --> 00:42:37,507
will be completely, like, funded by voluntary payment, or like, uh, That

675
00:42:37,507 --> 00:42:44,887
they won't I struggle seeing a state of the world in which states are more good

676
00:42:44,897 --> 00:42:51,437
than bad, because I think that they're a net bad at the moment, and I can

677
00:42:51,437 --> 00:42:56,117
sort of logically reason myself to that position, like the more consensual people.

678
00:42:56,457 --> 00:43:01,207
Interactions there are between people and the fewer forceful ones, the

679
00:43:01,207 --> 00:43:03,427
flip side of that, like the better.

680
00:43:03,477 --> 00:43:08,327
So, so I never see like a state of the world where you wouldn't

681
00:43:08,347 --> 00:43:10,657
want to fight for a smaller state.

682
00:43:10,727 --> 00:43:15,927
It can always, I, I, Maybe it will always exist in some way, shape, or

683
00:43:15,927 --> 00:43:20,487
form, but you could always fight to make it smaller, like, uh, there's,

684
00:43:20,577 --> 00:43:24,137
there's no, it can always shrink.

685
00:43:25,952 --> 00:43:31,012
And you're right, you know, I think, um, with the transformation that needs

686
00:43:31,012 --> 00:43:34,632
to happen from where we are today, you know, the fiat system and the legacy

687
00:43:34,672 --> 00:43:37,802
governments, whatever you want to call them, to a Bitcoin standard and

688
00:43:37,802 --> 00:43:42,072
the future this can bring, I don't necessarily think that, you know, it's

689
00:43:42,072 --> 00:43:44,592
going to be a very smooth transition.

690
00:43:44,622 --> 00:43:47,572
I think that you basically need to cut that off and start living

691
00:43:47,572 --> 00:43:49,152
again on this new standard.

692
00:43:49,847 --> 00:43:53,747
Um, and basically, you know, you, you, the new stu, the old standard

693
00:43:53,747 --> 00:43:56,717
doesn't recognize the new one and the, the newest standard is kinda laughing

694
00:43:56,717 --> 00:44:02,207
at, you know, the, the old standard because it's just not efficient at all.

695
00:44:02,237 --> 00:44:05,987
Um, and, and if you're in the Bitcoin space and you've done your lesson and

696
00:44:05,987 --> 00:44:09,577
you, you've watched this space for, for a while, then you, you, you, you're,

697
00:44:09,577 --> 00:44:14,737
you know, that you, you, you're aware that, uh, the quality of everything.

698
00:44:15,227 --> 00:44:21,177
Um, education, healthcare, uh, services, um, is completely of, you

699
00:44:21,177 --> 00:44:23,427
know, different on, on both, right?

700
00:44:24,437 --> 00:44:27,827
it's so much better on a Bitcoin standard, like, if you just choose to

701
00:44:27,827 --> 00:44:31,917
live in that world, then you see it, and it's, it's absolutely clear, and

702
00:44:31,917 --> 00:44:34,237
the old world is obsolete already.

703
00:44:34,647 --> 00:44:39,097
Like, you can choose to live in the future now, and it's wonderful if, uh,

704
00:44:39,807 --> 00:44:41,747
all the problems are with the old world.

705
00:44:42,197 --> 00:44:44,647
So that's the thing, I totally agree.

706
00:46:23,229 --> 00:46:23,779
Awesome.

707
00:46:23,789 --> 00:46:27,769
Well, hey, so Jacob, uh, is there any, anything else coming up in

708
00:46:27,769 --> 00:46:31,739
the near future that you'd like to, uh, direct our listeners to?

709
00:46:31,739 --> 00:46:33,449
What are your plans in the near future?

710
00:46:34,115 --> 00:46:35,395
Uh, near future?

711
00:46:35,425 --> 00:46:39,275
Um, well, personally, I've, I'm, I'm doing a big jump.

712
00:46:39,395 --> 00:46:45,005
Um, you know, I'm, I've been brought up in a, in a sort of, A rather

713
00:46:45,005 --> 00:46:48,515
conservative Polish family living in a small town, going to school,

714
00:46:48,535 --> 00:46:51,885
going to high school, going to uni, kind of, you know, plowing through.

715
00:46:52,025 --> 00:46:54,945
I didn't, it didn't even take, you know, a year gap when I was

716
00:46:55,205 --> 00:46:56,445
at Warsaw School of Economics.

717
00:46:56,825 --> 00:47:01,305
So I kind of, you know, ticked off the boxes, then got out of

718
00:47:01,305 --> 00:47:04,355
the education system and I was like, yes, you know, I've done it.

719
00:47:04,395 --> 00:47:08,740
I don't have to learn or study those things that were, you know,

720
00:47:09,370 --> 00:47:16,215
Not necessarily fun for me, uh, and I can now go to work and, uh, You

721
00:47:16,215 --> 00:47:17,625
know, build my career, whatever.

722
00:47:18,105 --> 00:47:23,745
So, uh, brought up, being brought up in this mindset, uh, made me

723
00:47:23,835 --> 00:47:26,985
realize that, okay, you know, I'm, I'm now a father of two boys.

724
00:47:27,485 --> 00:47:30,545
And, um, we moved to Edinburgh 'cause we said like, okay,

725
00:47:30,545 --> 00:47:31,895
it's a nice, peaceful city.

726
00:47:32,135 --> 00:47:34,325
We live in a, you know, in the catchment where that has

727
00:47:34,325 --> 00:47:35,645
the best school in Edinburgh.

728
00:47:36,225 --> 00:47:39,555
And, uh, we said, okay, I'm gonna let my kids go to school.

729
00:47:39,645 --> 00:47:42,405
They're gonna get the, you know, best education I can provide them with.

730
00:47:42,945 --> 00:47:45,075
Um, that was my, my belief.

731
00:47:45,445 --> 00:47:50,635
System until I went to Madeira and until I bumped into a bunch of homeschooling kids

732
00:47:50,985 --> 00:47:55,025
or unschooling, uh, you know, parents, um, and until I saw the, you know,

733
00:47:55,035 --> 00:47:58,875
there were three stages, the main stage development stage and the kids stage.

734
00:47:59,440 --> 00:48:03,010
And when I saw that they're, you know, like, you get to realize that Bitcoin

735
00:48:03,010 --> 00:48:07,180
is 15 years old and you got, you know, 12 year olds, 13 year old, 14 year

736
00:48:07,180 --> 00:48:11,030
old presenting on the stage, building together, networking, you know, and

737
00:48:11,040 --> 00:48:14,951
being so confident in doing so, you just realize that these kids are going

738
00:48:14,951 --> 00:48:19,321
to be so much ahead of their peers, you know, compared to what's going to, what

739
00:48:19,321 --> 00:48:23,101
the future is going to look like in 10 years from now or 15 years from now when

740
00:48:23,101 --> 00:48:25,901
they'll be, you know, entering the, the, the, the labor market or job market.

741
00:48:25,901 --> 00:48:26,041
That's it.

742
00:48:26,473 --> 00:48:29,913
then you, you kinda, that triggered something inside of me, you know, I was

743
00:48:29,923 --> 00:48:35,223
talking to Daniel Prince, I was talking to other, other guys, um, I was talking to,

744
00:48:35,223 --> 00:48:42,743
um, to Rob and Sylvia from A Place to Be, uh, and, um, it was like no rocket science

745
00:48:42,743 --> 00:48:44,383
to me, because I work remotely anyway.

746
00:48:44,818 --> 00:48:47,838
Um, I, I made my decisions and I decided to take, you know,

747
00:48:47,838 --> 00:48:50,038
responsibility for, for my kids as well.

748
00:48:50,428 --> 00:48:52,878
And, uh, along with my family, we'll be moving to Madeira.

749
00:48:53,538 --> 00:48:56,568
So, uh, we'll be moving to Madeira to live with, uh, you know,

750
00:48:56,698 --> 00:48:58,818
close by to, to, to these guys.

751
00:48:58,818 --> 00:49:02,298
And hopefully, you know, uh, get to hang around together, um, let

752
00:49:02,298 --> 00:49:05,658
our kids be together and, and educate them together as parents.

753
00:49:05,668 --> 00:49:09,928
So, that's, that's the next big thing, um, that's, is in my life.

754
00:49:10,028 --> 00:49:15,833
But I also think that, you know, Um, it was un, unthinkable for me to even, you

755
00:49:15,833 --> 00:49:20,843
know, think about those things, uh, taking the kids out of the education system until

756
00:49:20,873 --> 00:49:23,293
I embraced and I saw that with my eyes.

757
00:49:23,583 --> 00:49:28,403
And I think I, it's very similar to people to, to making the jump from the

758
00:49:28,403 --> 00:49:33,923
fiat system to the Bitcoin system where you're, you know, so deeply embedded in

759
00:49:33,923 --> 00:49:38,323
that and everybody around you is so deeply embedded in that, that, you know, it

760
00:49:38,333 --> 00:49:40,153
feels like you're being crazy doing that.

761
00:49:41,688 --> 00:49:46,238
now I feel even more confident this is the right way, because with the development

762
00:49:46,238 --> 00:49:50,140
and technology, like, you know, two years, three years ago, we didn't have

763
00:49:50,140 --> 00:49:55,440
any sort of, uh, inklings of what AI will be doing, changing, like how it

764
00:49:55,440 --> 00:49:56,720
will be changing our lives today, right?

765
00:49:56,970 --> 00:49:58,270
And today, we're taking it for granted.

766
00:49:58,270 --> 00:50:00,690
Everybody's using AI almost on, you know, if you're working with a

767
00:50:00,690 --> 00:50:04,580
computer, chances are that you're using some chat GPT or mid journey or

768
00:50:04,580 --> 00:50:05,880
something like that on a daily basis.

769
00:50:06,780 --> 00:50:11,570
So 10 years from now, 15 years from now, I don't think this is going to slow down.

770
00:50:11,570 --> 00:50:15,490
This is going to grow exponentially and the education system that we

771
00:50:15,490 --> 00:50:18,650
have in traditional schooling, uh, is not going to keep up.

772
00:50:18,680 --> 00:50:19,730
It's already outdated.

773
00:50:20,010 --> 00:50:22,840
Um, so I, I really don't think that this will make, you

774
00:50:22,840 --> 00:50:24,800
know, a even linear progress.

775
00:50:25,920 --> 00:50:27,980
Jacob, this is so fantastic to hear.

776
00:50:28,030 --> 00:50:33,350
I mean, uh, and, and to be, to be a part of this and like all these aspects, this,

777
00:50:33,670 --> 00:50:37,900
these different aspects of Bitcoin and just hearing your story and, and, uh,

778
00:50:38,270 --> 00:50:42,370
you name dropping all of our friends here and, and the, the things they're

779
00:50:42,370 --> 00:50:44,300
doing on Madeira, just fantastic.

780
00:50:44,330 --> 00:50:48,718
I mean, And I completely agree the, the education system as

781
00:50:48,748 --> 00:50:51,098
is, is, is completely outdated.

782
00:50:51,128 --> 00:50:54,638
It's obsolete already, just like everything else.

783
00:50:55,188 --> 00:51:01,198
And we have no idea what we're preparing our kids for, what kind of reality they're

784
00:51:01,198 --> 00:51:03,798
going to live in, uh, 10 years from now.

785
00:51:03,798 --> 00:51:04,558
It's impossible.

786
00:51:05,058 --> 00:51:05,598
No, no.

787
00:51:05,598 --> 00:51:11,238
So, so like, we shouldn't teach them stuff that they can look up on the internet.

788
00:51:11,268 --> 00:51:12,468
We should teach them.

789
00:51:12,933 --> 00:51:18,913
If anything, like a sound mindset and how to take care of their mental

790
00:51:18,913 --> 00:51:24,953
health and how to, how to, how to grow and how to, how to be positive, stay

791
00:51:24,963 --> 00:51:30,253
positive and hopeful and stuff like this, how, how their focus and attention

792
00:51:30,263 --> 00:51:36,723
and enjoyment of life actually creates that enjoyable reality that they want.

793
00:51:37,243 --> 00:51:44,673
Uh, so, so yeah, there's so much there and, uh, yeah, uh, I'm, um, Looking

794
00:51:44,673 --> 00:51:50,663
forward to following up this with you in the future and see where this goes

795
00:51:50,763 --> 00:51:55,413
and follow up with Rob and Sylvia and their amazing project down there and

796
00:51:55,763 --> 00:52:00,093
Daniel and all that he does for the homeschooling community and as you

797
00:52:00,093 --> 00:52:03,953
say like you were seen as a complete nutcase if you even suggested like you.

798
00:52:04,798 --> 00:52:09,858
When I grew up, or even later than that, like if you rewind the clock

799
00:52:09,858 --> 00:52:15,858
ten years, only like crazy, uh, religious people were homeschooling.

800
00:52:16,028 --> 00:52:18,988
Like, that, that, that's the only option, like I need to homeschool

801
00:52:19,008 --> 00:52:22,688
because I have these ridiculous beliefs and I have to pump them into my kid.

802
00:52:22,818 --> 00:52:24,768
Like, that's the only reason you would homeschool.

803
00:52:25,058 --> 00:52:26,348
And now it's the other way around.

804
00:52:26,908 --> 00:52:32,078
Now it's the, the public system that are pumping insane ideas into the kids, and

805
00:52:32,078 --> 00:52:33,688
you homeschool to take them out of it.

806
00:52:33,808 --> 00:52:36,378
Like, it's, um No, it's fantastic.

807
00:52:36,688 --> 00:52:38,328
So, uh, good luck with everything.

808
00:52:39,278 --> 00:52:39,598
Thank you.

809
00:52:39,598 --> 00:52:42,908
Happy to follow up when we, I think we're going to meet in, uh, in Bulgaria, right?

810
00:52:43,868 --> 00:52:47,038
Uh, I'm, I'm sorry to say, but I'm not going to Bulgaria.

811
00:52:47,038 --> 00:52:49,918
I had to skip that one this year because my schedule is.

812
00:52:50,328 --> 00:52:50,948
Insane.

813
00:52:51,158 --> 00:52:53,378
So, but I will go to Prague.

814
00:52:53,379 --> 00:52:54,778
Are you coming to Prague?

815
00:52:55,148 --> 00:52:57,188
No, I'm taking my friend to Donington Festival.

816
00:52:57,798 --> 00:52:58,708
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

817
00:52:58,709 --> 00:53:02,708
Well, we'll be there in spirit.

818
00:53:03,409 --> 00:53:06,359
There's another conference, uh, I think.

819
00:53:06,529 --> 00:53:10,239
Um, well, I'm not sure about Riga because this will be in

820
00:53:10,239 --> 00:53:11,449
August when I'll be moving.

821
00:53:12,159 --> 00:53:13,249
You should come to Riga.

822
00:53:13,829 --> 00:53:16,959
Like, like, you can, you can always move later.

823
00:53:17,069 --> 00:53:17,739
Or earlier.

824
00:53:17,739 --> 00:53:18,009
I

825
00:53:18,849 --> 00:53:19,309
Okay.

826
00:53:19,359 --> 00:53:19,699
Riga.

827
00:53:20,269 --> 00:53:20,949
All right, cool.

828
00:53:20,979 --> 00:53:22,249
I'll work around that.

829
00:53:22,639 --> 00:53:26,549
And then, and then I got, uh, I got invited to come to a small conference in

830
00:53:26,569 --> 00:53:29,759
Hungary, uh, later in, in, uh, October.

831
00:53:29,789 --> 00:53:30,369
So, uh,

832
00:53:30,849 --> 00:53:33,809
Oh yeah, uh, am I invited to that one?

833
00:53:35,649 --> 00:53:37,109
I have to check my calendar.

834
00:53:38,369 --> 00:53:39,069
It just happened yesterday

835
00:53:39,189 --> 00:53:39,469
see.

836
00:53:39,509 --> 00:53:43,529
was very, very spontaneous, so uh, maybe you need to wait, I mean, I

837
00:53:43,779 --> 00:53:45,119
probably, you probably will, yeah.

838
00:53:46,129 --> 00:53:50,089
Well, we'll see each other, uh, eventually, I'm, I'm sure, if not, uh,

839
00:53:50,549 --> 00:53:55,029
not in this year's cycle, next year's, or the year's after, or et cetera, et cetera.

840
00:53:55,629 --> 00:53:59,519
Lots of opportunities, and, uh, one of these things in Bitcoin, um, you

841
00:53:59,519 --> 00:54:02,599
end up going to more conferences as time goes on for some reason.

842
00:54:02,739 --> 00:54:05,439
They're, they're addictive, uh, to a certain extent.

843
00:54:05,669 --> 00:54:09,729
Just like BitcoinWalk, you know, to me, uh, this is a weekly ritual that,

844
00:54:09,959 --> 00:54:13,369
you know, you kind of build up this muscle and you're looking for, you

845
00:54:13,389 --> 00:54:17,429
know, your, your, your clock is kind of, you know, ticking the blocks, uh,

846
00:54:17,469 --> 00:54:19,309
towards the next, the next Saturday.

847
00:54:20,154 --> 00:54:23,894
You know, it's every Saturday or every thousand blocks, uh, because

848
00:54:23,944 --> 00:54:25,024
that's kind of how it works.

849
00:54:25,654 --> 00:54:28,924
So, you know, in this way, in this sense, you know, stars align and, uh,

850
00:54:28,924 --> 00:54:32,324
we've got, we've got a really cool, cool community here in Edinburgh.

851
00:54:32,544 --> 00:54:35,124
We're going to miss them, but I'm sure, you know, we'll build equally

852
00:54:35,124 --> 00:54:37,364
cool community elsewhere in Maduro.

853
00:54:38,779 --> 00:54:41,739
it's every 1, 008 blocks, right?

854
00:54:42,064 --> 00:54:46,414
and we work for about two hours, so I'm kind of, you know, Nudging

855
00:54:46,414 --> 00:54:47,504
it a little bit, but you're right.

856
00:54:47,544 --> 00:54:47,794
Yes.

857
00:54:48,349 --> 00:54:48,709
All right.

858
00:54:48,709 --> 00:54:49,219
Fantastic.

859
00:54:49,219 --> 00:54:52,929
So, so people don't forget to brush your damn teeth and,

860
00:54:52,959 --> 00:54:54,779
and, uh, go to bitcoinwalk.

861
00:54:54,799 --> 00:54:58,469
org, either if you like walking or if you like filling in registration

862
00:54:58,469 --> 00:55:00,319
forms, it's a great page.

863
00:55:00,409 --> 00:55:07,219
And, uh, you, you make your own little chapter, um, just go walking and

864
00:55:07,529 --> 00:55:09,859
walking and talking about Bitcoin.

865
00:55:10,549 --> 00:55:13,529
I think what's, you know, what's, what's important is you get to, you get to

866
00:55:13,529 --> 00:55:17,899
experience that firsthand, you get other people's perspectives, uh, and there's

867
00:55:17,969 --> 00:55:19,469
tons of things you're going to learn.

868
00:55:19,529 --> 00:55:22,539
Um, you know, it's such a, also such a humbling experience.

869
00:55:22,579 --> 00:55:26,549
Like, I always, uh, recall one, one Bitcoin walk when,

870
00:55:26,549 --> 00:55:29,241
uh, I met a guy named Wabi.

871
00:55:29,271 --> 00:55:30,821
He was from Afghanistan.

872
00:55:30,871 --> 00:55:32,791
He was like a political refugee here.

873
00:55:33,261 --> 00:55:38,651
Um, and, um, he came, he's probably the age of my dad, and I could tell that he

874
00:55:38,651 --> 00:55:41,541
wasn't very, IT literate, so to speak.

875
00:55:41,951 --> 00:55:47,561
But, uh, um, he came to, to, um, to Bitcoin World because he heard that,

876
00:55:47,591 --> 00:55:50,511
you know, it's possible to send value.

877
00:55:51,141 --> 00:55:53,701
to Afghanistan from UK with Bitcoin.

878
00:55:53,831 --> 00:55:58,191
Try doing that with Barclays or, you know, with HSBC or any of those banks,

879
00:55:58,191 --> 00:56:01,731
you know, it's almost impossible or, and if you can't do it, you're going

880
00:56:01,731 --> 00:56:04,251
to pay hefty fee to make that happen.

881
00:56:04,301 --> 00:56:07,431
So, uh, those was one, you know, one of those kind of

882
00:56:07,481 --> 00:56:09,611
touching stories that I recall.

883
00:56:10,036 --> 00:56:13,986
And, uh, even though I am pretty sure he didn't, you know, he didn't send

884
00:56:14,406 --> 00:56:17,006
Bitcoin to his family, you know, when he came back from the Bitcoin walk.

885
00:56:17,516 --> 00:56:20,576
Uh, one thing he took away from that is, you know, he, he was kind of questioning,

886
00:56:20,616 --> 00:56:22,376
like, what can I do here to make money?

887
00:56:22,786 --> 00:56:25,946
Um, because he was only in UK for like two or three weeks, uh,

888
00:56:26,496 --> 00:56:28,626
you know, uh, since his arrival.

889
00:56:28,666 --> 00:56:31,326
Uh, and, uh, I asked him, can you drive a car?

890
00:56:31,336 --> 00:56:32,496
He's like, yeah, I can drive a car.

891
00:56:32,791 --> 00:56:35,891
Well, you can be, you know, Uber driver or, you know, uh, deliver some stuff.

892
00:56:35,891 --> 00:56:39,051
And he was so grateful for that, that, you know, I, I feel like

893
00:56:39,151 --> 00:56:40,511
this is, that's, that's great.

894
00:56:40,521 --> 00:56:43,201
You know, I love the fact that I could point him in this direction

895
00:56:43,201 --> 00:56:46,341
and maybe he, he took that, uh, and that could change his life.

896
00:56:47,015 --> 00:56:47,695
Fantastic.

897
00:56:48,347 --> 00:56:51,257
Yeah, stories like that are great, and, uh, connections you, you

898
00:56:51,257 --> 00:56:54,382
make in real life are, uh, Always what you make of them, right?

899
00:56:54,472 --> 00:56:56,602
Uh, they, they can turn into anything.

900
00:56:56,812 --> 00:56:58,952
So it's a great initiative.

901
00:56:59,102 --> 00:57:01,772
Uh, you've started Jacob and, uh, yeah.

902
00:57:01,862 --> 00:57:03,302
Great to, great to see.

903
00:57:03,302 --> 00:57:08,242
And so, uh, yeah, as, as Knut said, go to bitcoin walk.org.

904
00:57:08,242 --> 00:57:11,302
Is there anywhere else you'd like to direct our listeners too?

905
00:57:11,677 --> 00:57:13,597
sell your wheelchairs, go on a walk.

906
00:57:15,622 --> 00:57:15,982
Yeah.

907
00:57:16,102 --> 00:57:18,023
It might be a bit, uh, ableist Cano.

908
00:57:18,207 --> 00:57:19,147
Yeah, okay, okay,

909
00:57:19,572 --> 00:57:19,972
Too much.

910
00:57:20,762 --> 00:57:21,452
We'll cut it out.

911
00:57:21,492 --> 00:57:21,692
Yeah.

912
00:57:22,786 --> 00:57:23,006
No.

913
00:57:23,011 --> 00:57:25,741
Cano making a fool of himself stays in sometimes.

914
00:57:27,166 --> 00:57:31,146
Damn it, that's your job, Luke, cutting these things out.

915
00:57:31,386 --> 00:57:33,996
You do it too often for me to cut every single occurrence.

916
00:57:34,086 --> 00:57:34,276
Ha!

917
00:57:34,321 --> 00:57:35,051
Too much editing.

918
00:57:36,046 --> 00:57:40,766
Now, you know, I think, um, with, with, uh, with BitcoinWalk, you know, the forum

919
00:57:40,766 --> 00:57:46,326
is kind of free fall and, um, it's good to go out, you know, to, to touch grass,

920
00:57:46,386 --> 00:57:50,846
to basically talk to other people, um, because, you know, we are social animals

921
00:57:50,846 --> 00:57:56,036
and, uh, we're spending so much time in front of our computers today, um, we

922
00:57:56,036 --> 00:57:57,726
don't really get to know other people.

923
00:57:58,196 --> 00:58:00,516
Uh, outside of our circle, uh, that much.

924
00:58:00,516 --> 00:58:02,826
I mean, that, that's pretty much, I mean, conferences are great

925
00:58:02,826 --> 00:58:04,146
because this is where it happens.

926
00:58:04,196 --> 00:58:06,336
This is why we have so much energy when we go to those things.

927
00:58:06,696 --> 00:58:09,436
But BitcoinWalk could be your kinda, you know, your local

928
00:58:09,696 --> 00:58:11,146
weekly conference, if you like.

929
00:58:11,156 --> 00:58:15,951
You can, you know, meet those people pretty much, uh, Uh, every Saturday, if

930
00:58:15,961 --> 00:58:22,011
you want, or more irregularly, if you prefer, uh, you know, um, and, and, uh,

931
00:58:22,011 --> 00:58:26,131
I think that, you know, Bitcoin walk is, uh, there's, it's a very loose format.

932
00:58:26,131 --> 00:58:30,911
So I'm, you know, I'm, I'm trying to, uh, guide people, people, how, how

933
00:58:30,911 --> 00:58:32,491
we do that and share how we do that.

934
00:58:32,491 --> 00:58:35,791
You know, we go for, for the walk and we post something, we always take a

935
00:58:35,801 --> 00:58:38,381
picture, uh, called proof of walk.

936
00:58:38,876 --> 00:58:44,836
Uh, and, uh, I always, you know, try to get somebody who is bypassing by

937
00:58:44,856 --> 00:58:46,756
to take the picture on this picture.

938
00:58:46,756 --> 00:58:53,906
We always stay with a big flag, um, with, with the Bitcoin website address and, uh,

939
00:58:54,456 --> 00:58:57,726
and I'm now ordering another flag, the second version, which will, which will

940
00:58:57,756 --> 00:58:59,866
say on the top, don't own zero Bitcoin.

941
00:59:00,366 --> 00:59:03,156
So whoever is taking the picture, they will get the message as well.

942
00:59:04,856 --> 00:59:09,006
Uh, and, um, yeah, hopefully people will get inspired to maybe check it out.

943
00:59:09,735 --> 00:59:10,385
It's genius.

944
00:59:10,945 --> 00:59:12,005
Awesome work you're doing.

945
00:59:12,295 --> 00:59:16,875
So thanks a lot for, for coming on and, uh, yeah, if there isn't anything else,

946
00:59:16,955 --> 00:59:22,815
uh, yeah, thanks again and, uh, good luck with the move to Madeira and see

947
00:59:22,815 --> 00:59:25,205
you in real life one of these days.

948
00:59:25,775 --> 00:59:26,395
One of these days.

949
00:59:26,415 --> 00:59:26,925
Exactly.

950
00:59:27,045 --> 00:59:27,845
Thanks for having me guys.

951
00:59:27,935 --> 00:59:28,495
Enjoy the day.

952
00:59:29,035 --> 00:59:30,485
On a, on a walk somewhere.

953
00:59:30,890 --> 00:59:31,640
Fantastic.

954
00:59:31,790 --> 00:59:33,540
Uh, this has been the Freedom Footprint Show.

955
00:59:34,070 --> 00:59:34,840
Thanks for listening.