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Yo, Zuby! Welcome to the Bitcoin Infinity Show. Nice to have you here.

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Thank you for inviting me. Thank you for inviting me. I'm happy to be here.

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Yeah, cool to have you here. We met in El Salvador. I think that's the first time we met, right? Back in November.

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Yeah, we had an interesting time there for sure. Interesting dinners and stuff.

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Yeah, and I said, yo, Zuby, is that the correct way to address a rapper?

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I don't know, like it was back in the 80s.

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I don't know, man.

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You can address me however you wish.

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You know, I'm a human first and a rapper after that.

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Yeah, and you have many other titles as well.

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Tweet Poet, for instance, that's one I really like.

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But since you haven't been on before,

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can you give our listeners a little TLDR on Zuby

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and what it is you do and yeah, your journey

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and what your connection to Bitcoin is and so on and so forth?

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Yeah, sure thing.

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I will run through the brief version of my life story.

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So I was born in England to parents who are originally from Nigeria.

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I grew up in Saudi Arabia, moved there when I was a one-year-old baby.

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And I lived there and I went to school there until I was 11 years old,

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at which point I went to the UK for boarding school.

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So from the age of 11, I was traveling internationally by myself between Saudi Arabia and the UK multiple times a year.

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I went to boarding school for seven years and then I did well in school and I got into Oxford University, which I went to when I was 18 years old and I studied computer science.

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When I was in Oxford, I started rapping, as most Oxford University students do, of course.

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And I actually released my first album when I was in my second year of university. It was an

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independent album called Commercial Underground. And I ended up selling a few thousand copies of

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it completely independently. So that was when my music career initially started. That's when it had

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its spark. After I graduated in 2007, I took a year out and I did my music full-time for one year.

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And I released a second album called The Unknown Celebrity. And then I moved to London. I already

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had a job offer to work with a big management consulting company. And I moved to London and I

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started living this dual life where by day I was a management consultant and by night and on

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weekends, I was a professional rapper. And I did this for a few years until both careers were

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sort of progressing to the point that they started to clash more and more with one another.

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and in late 2011 I made a huge decision which changed my life trajectory and that was to leave

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the corporate world and to pursue my music full-time. So I have now been self-employed

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since October 2011 and over the course of that time I have released several more albums, done

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multiple tours, lots of gigs. I have also started a podcast as of 2019 so I've been running my

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podcast, Real Talk with Zuby for over seven years now. I have released two books. The first one was

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a fitness book called Strong Advice, Zuby's Guide to Fitness for Everybody. And the second one was a

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children's book called The Candy Calamity. I'm currently in the process of writing my third book.

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And gosh, what else do I do? I'm a public speaker. I am a Bitcoiner. I've been in the Bitcoin world

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since 2017. And I've spoken at lots of Bitcoin conferences, and I'm known in lots of different

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circles by different people for different reasons. I'm at the intersection of a lot of different

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worlds. So some people know me more for my music. Other people know me more for my social and

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cultural commentary or just various things I post on social media. Some people know me through my

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podcast. Some people know me because of my books. Other people know me through the world of Bitcoin

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and everything that that entails.

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And ultimately, my main goal has never changed

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from when I was 18 or 19 years old,

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which is to positively impact as many millions of people

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as I can through my words.

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And I thought all of that was just going to happen

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through my music.

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But as I've mentioned, it's expanded just beyond music now.

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Wow, that's quite the story.

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And we were both on a panel at Bitcoin Historico

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in San Salvador back in November called

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you can just do things. And I think we were both on that for sort of the same reason. I call myself

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an international village idiot these days because I don't really know what it is I do, but I do a

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lot of it. And it's a lot of different things. I mean, writing books and music, it's part of my

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background too. And even Nigeria plays a role in my background. My dad used to work there when I

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was a teen. So I visited Lagos when I was 18. So yeah, but you have some banger tweets as well,

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like pointing out the flaws of clown world. I remember a particular story when we were in a car

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and you told us the story of your most viral tweet, the one that Donald Trump retweeted,

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if I'm not mistaken. What was that one? Which one is that? Is that the deadlift?

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I think, yeah, it's the deadlift one.

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Oh, okay.

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Yeah.

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Okay.

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So yeah, gosh, we're actually coming up to the seven year anniversary of that tweet.

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I posted it on February 26, 2019.

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I very specifically remember it because my life has never been the same since that moment.

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So on this fateful day in February 2019, I posted a single tweet with a nine second video

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of me doing a 230 kilo deadlift.

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quite easily. And I said, I keep hearing about how biological men have no strength advantage

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over women in 2019. So watch me destroy the British women's deadlift record without trying.

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P.S. I identified as a woman whilst lifting the weight. Don't be a bigot. So I put this out to my

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19,000 followers at the time, which I had accumulated over the past 10 years.

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And I thought it was going to get a couple of LOLs, a couple of likes and reactions.

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And lo and behold, this tweet just went insanely viral. The video on Twitter alone ended up getting over 4 million views, and it was reposted by influential people all around the world.

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It made the news in the UK, in the USA, in Canada, Australia, lots of different places.

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It led to a huge multitude of interviews with everyone from Tucker Carlson to Joe Rogan

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to Ben Shapiro to, I don't know, just podcasters, mainstream media.

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A lot of people just discovered me through this single silly tweet of me doing the deadlift.

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And that kind of thrust me into this whole world where a lot of people just wanted to get my opinions on various things that were going on in the world at the time.

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And so I like to say that the tweet itself went viral, but I also went viral in a way.

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So oftentimes, you know, there will be a social media post which catches a lot of attention for a short time.

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And then within a couple of days, it's fizzled out and nobody talks about it anymore.

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But in my case, it created this catalyst where I think because of all the other things that I was doing, everything I'd created with my music and with my podcast at the time and all the things that I had already built, I already had like a whole library, a catalog of material.

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and then when I was given all of these opportunities to speak to different people in the media

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I guess I came across well and had interesting things to say in my interviews so it created

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this snowball effect where you know my followers just grew from 19,000 to 30,000 40,000 50,000

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100,000 and it just it just kept on going and then it rolled into the next year of 2020 and

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We all know what happened in 2020 with the international pandemic or scammdemic, depending on somebody's view of it.

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And I was actually one of the few people who had a large social media following at the time.

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We're talking like March 2020, who was kind of ringing the alarm bell early on what I, you know, back when they were talking about two weeks to slow the spread, 15 days to flatten the curve,

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all of that type of thing. And I was warning people that I think this is going to be go on

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for a lot longer than just a couple of weeks. And I was very much opposed to the lockdowns and to

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the mandates and everything that came with it, because I believe that people should be able to

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make those choices for themselves and their families and do what they think is best. I also

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thought the whole thing was largely overblown, not that it didn't exist, but that it was overblown.

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And that made me very unpopular with a chunk of the population at the time, but very popular with other people who were a bit skeptical about the whole COVID narrative and the idea that every single country and city and person needs to just lock down and stay at home and never go outside and that this and this and this should be forced upon people.

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That's not how I see the world.

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And so my following continued to kind of grow and accelerate all throughout those years, largely because of my pushback against that stuff.

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A lot of people say that I'm someone who they can kind of come to for common sense.

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So when the world is kind of going crazy and people are feeling like they're living in clown world or upside down world,

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I like to think that I can tend to think quite rationally and critically and not necessarily

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just go with the herd on various things.

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And I'm just honest and perhaps courageous enough to just say what I think, even if it

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may not necessarily be popular at the time or it may get pushback, whether that's saying

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that, you know, men can't turn into women and women can't turn into men or saying that

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it's not a good idea to shut down the entire world for months or years on end because

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of a virus that has a, you know, less than 1% chance of killing somebody that infects.

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And it's not right to force masks and force injections into the population.

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These are just, I don't think these are super controversial viewpoints, but at the time

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they certainly were.

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So these are just like a couple of the things that have led to, you know, I don't know why,

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I don't always know why so many people follow me and like what I say and take interest and

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want to have conversations like this with me, but there must be something that I'm doing,

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which people find interesting and compelling and valuable. And I try to do it across different

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mediums and just help people think a bit more clearly, move the world closer towards truth

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and encourage people to be the best they can be across everything I do. That's kind of the

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common message and focus. Yeah. I mean, I guess that's what I'm trying to do to a certain extent

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So speaking of COVID, I haven't talked about COVID on the pod for a while, but I guess it's as good a time as any.

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The aftermath of it, when we look back at it, I don't know what the scariest part is.

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I sort of expected people to convert to anarcho-capitalism in droves when they realized that no government was on their side.

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because it's so obvious to me that that was the case during COVID.

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They all wanted to decide over other people's lives on massive scales.

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And it was obviously theater in so many cases

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because you can't just shut down all the infrastructure.

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So you saw like symphony orchestras with masks on

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and then a hole in the mask to play the saxophone or something,

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like ridiculous stuff like that.

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So the whole thing seemed so like a Python sketch,

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It's like too bonkers to be taken seriously.

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And I don't know what the scariest part is.

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Probably that people are that gullible.

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And like getting a confirmation that most of the population didn't wake up.

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Like maybe we doubled the number of anarcho-capitalists around the world,

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but we're still like a super small minority.

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I don't know if you identify as one yourself, but at least skeptical of government.

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I mean, in general.

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So what's your take?

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Yeah, I mean, well, I don't consider myself an anarcho-capitalist, but I'm certainly skeptical of governments, and I'm surprised not everybody is.

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I think everybody claims to be, but when push comes to shove, you see just how compliant people can be.

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What was the scariest part of it?

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It was certainly something to do with the mass compliance.

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I think that what was most scary was how quickly authoritarianism was activated and the authoritarian instinct that people have that normally sits dormant during normal times.

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It just came online.

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And I think you quickly found that perhaps 20 to 30 percent of the population is not just compliant but is extremely authoritarian when given a chance Willing to rat on their neighbor Yes exactly Like Stasi style Yeah I think that the scariest part because look we can go deep here because look we all grow up and we read about history to some degree

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We can just go back to the previous century, to the 20th century, and we've all seen the horrors of what happened in Nazi Germany and in various communist regimes, whether that is in the Soviet Union or in Cambodia or in China.

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And we see the millions and millions of people who died.

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And we see the ridiculousness of some of the narratives.

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And we ponder how so many seemingly normal people went along with a gigantic falsehood.

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We wonder how people became so divisive against their neighbor that they were willing for them to be discriminated against or put in prison or to be killed just for who they are or for some basic decisions that they're making.

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and everyone likes to look back at history and think, oh, I would have been the good guy,

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right? No one wants to read history and think, oh yeah, I would have been one of the perpetrators

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or if not one of the perpetrators, I would have been like cheering them on from the side

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or I would have just like sat back quietly and not done anything as they're committing these

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atrocities. And I don't want to directly compare the government's response to COVID with the

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horrors of the 20th century, but from a psychological perspective, if you were paying attention,

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you can see the same psychology at play. You can see the divide and conquer. You can see

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labeling a certain demographic, aka the unvaccinated, as the reason why all of these bad things are

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happening. You can see the dehumanization of that demographic, trying to strip away basic rights

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from people and people just falling into this idea that the government has the right and the

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authority to tell you literally when you can, if you can go outside or not, if you can see your

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friends or not, if you can see your own family or not, right? In any part of the West in particular,

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where people have always prided themselves on concepts like freedom and liberty and civil

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rights and human rights, it was absolutely shocking to see that all of that goes out of

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the window if you scare people enough, right? So all you have to do is make enough people afraid

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and all of a sudden your rights are now suspended, right? Because people are scared. So because other

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people are scared and the TV is saying this and the politicians are saying this, you can no longer

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go outside. You now have to walk around with a diaper on your face. You now have to take this

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injection. You now have to stand in this square and walk on this arrow and do this and do that.

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every country was a little bit different, right? Like different places had different rules,

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but so much of it was just absurd. And if you think that the whole idea about this supposedly

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is to keep people safe and to take care of people's health and their wellbeing, then why is it that in

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so many places, you know, you shut down the gyms, you shut down the parks, you stop people. By the

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way, everyone knows the virus didn't spread outside, but you're going to shut down, stop

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people going outside, but you're going to close down the gyms. You're going to close down the

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churches. You're going to close down the recreational parks, all of these things,

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even if they're outdoors. But you're going to keep open, I don't know, the strip clubs,

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or you're going to keep open. The schools, in many parts of the world, say the schools open

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and like kids in masks and kids weren't even affected, but they still had to wear masks and

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still had to go to school. Yeah. We're just going to ignore all the statistics, right? We're going

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ignore the demographics that are most affected. So it was just silly. And as you said, it just

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became theater. It became political theater and it just moved so quickly. I mean, you remember

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when they were like giving people incentives for, you know, to get the shots and stuff,

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giving people everything from free cheeseburgers to a free night with a hooker. I mean, it would

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be comedic if it weren't so dark. So I think that was the scariest part for me. It was seeing the

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veil kind of fall on entire nations that throughout my life have said, hey, we are the bastions of

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freedom. People have rights. People can make choices and decisions. And it wasn't just that

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the government's pushed for that. It was how happy people, how happy millions of people were

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about it and how they like took glee in this authoritarian moment, as you said, whether that's

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snitching on their neighbors or discriminating against their own friends and family. You know,

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there are millions, if not billions of strange stories from that two to three year period.

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And I think, and I'll tell you one more thing that's scary about it is the lesson

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that some people came away with is that we should give the government even more power.

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If you talk to some people about the whole 2020 to 2022 period, their perspective is that we should have locked down harder for longer. And, you know, the government just should be given even more power so that those, you know, anti-maskers or anti-vaxxers or whatever label they like to throw could not have been able to get away with their stuff.

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You know, we should have censored social media even more to stop people spreading so-called misinformation or disinformation.

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So there are people who learn the right lessons from that.

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And there are people who learn the complete opposite lesson and would like even more authoritarianism if something like that were to ever happen again.

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yeah yeah it's scary and and speaking of these dichotomies um i think that if you're if you're

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looking at it from a completely rationalist like how do we reduce as much harm as possible

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perspective there are two solutions right one is to actually have the entire world in lockdown for

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two weeks if you could do that and everyone was like locked up completely for two weeks at the

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exact same time, that would have stopped the virus. The problem is that it's impossible,

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because not everyone is going to comply. Not all countries are going to do the same thing.

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Like, it is literally impossible. And the other version is to do what Belarus did, or

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partially what Sweden did, which is just let the thing play out the way it wants to play out,

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and the virus evolves. And, you know, it's not very evolutionary good for the virus if people

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die all over the place. So pandemics get milder and milder in time, right? So the two extremes

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actually work if you want to minimize, except one of them don't, because you can't lock down

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everyone for two weeks. It doesn't work. So the better thing to do would have been to just let

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the thing run its course. But instead, we got this half measures everywhere, which just made

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everything worse and made the next year's flu worse because no one had built up the natural

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immunity that you're supposed to have and like all sorts of crazy side effects and and that's

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just baffling to me and equally yeah i'm a rant on here for a bit equally um hopeful to how scary

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the um the the swiftness of the lockdowns were and how how quickly everything became

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authoritarian, as you say, that was super scary, just to see how we could flip for such a seemingly

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small risk, and everyone was still like, okay, we're in DEFCON 5 mode all of a sudden, right?

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But the hopeful part was how quickly it ended, because as soon as you got a bit of snowball

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effect because of people disobeying and stopping using their masks in airports and stuff,

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then the politicians just had to cave in had to give into that it became ridiculous after a while

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so ridicule is the way out of it and that that made me very hopeful that yeah shit can get very

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bad very quickly but they can also turn very turn the other way very quickly and uh yeah

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yeah i think you can only i think you can only maintain a life for so long you can maintain a

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life for a very long time and you can maintain a tyrannical regime for a long time. But I think

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that anything that is based on a falsehood ultimately will crumble on a long enough timescale.

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So, for example, I would say that in the entire world, there remains one country which is like

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truly, truly like totalitarian, North Korea. Maybe, you know, there are other examples that

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are more authoritarian, but I'd say there's one country which is like so totalitarian to the point

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that like you've probably never even communicated with somebody from there because they don't have

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access and you don't have access. Like even with all the social media and smartphones and internet,

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there is one country that's like completely locked out of all of it. Yeah. I don't know

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when that regime will fall, but I know that it will.

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Right. I don't because it's based on the human spirit, I believe, like desires a level of

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liberty and freedom. And you can only it's the same way like censorship can only work for a

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certain amount of time. Right. You can censor things, you can keep things away from people.

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But on a long enough time frame, like the truth just has a way of cracking through and overcoming

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lies and falsehoods. And if an entire structure is built on a falsehood, then at some point,

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I think it's going to collapse. So sometimes it doesn't mean it's going to be within our lifetimes.

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Sometimes lies can go on for a long time. But I knew with that whole scandemic narrative,

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there were too many holes in the narrative for it to go on forever. So I know there were some

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people at the time who were very worried that, oh my gosh, this is going to go on for like

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five years or 10 years or like this authoritarian moment is just, this is just kind of the new world

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order. And I was never blackpilled to that degree because I was like, nah, like they're,

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they're lying too much. And people can, people can see it. Even if people who don't want to admit

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it, right. There's so many things you're just like, wait, this doesn't make sense. That doesn't

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make sense. They're, they're contradicting each other. The politicians, the bureaucrats,

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the so-called public health officials, they're saying this, and then they're saying this,

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And then they're saying it's like there's just too much hypocrisy.

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And so, yeah, they managed to keep it going for up to three years in some places.

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But I knew that it would eventually crumble.

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It has.

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And I would like to think that it would not be easy for them to pull the same trick anytime soon.

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Maybe if they wait a couple of generations and that generational memory has faded, then they could like repeat it and do something very similar.

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but I think if they tried to do it again, in fact, I don't know if you remember this. Do you remember

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they actually did try to do it again? They did try to freak people out again with another pandemic,

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but it was no idea. Yeah, there was something about the virus, but people didn't give shit.

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Yeah, I remember monkeypox. Monkeypox, that's what that was. Monkeypox, right? Remember,

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they tried for like one or two weeks. They really, really tried to like terrify people again and,

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you know, say, oh, we need to have another lockdown because of monkeypox and this and this.

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And yeah, it just, it didn't work.

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I have a friend that thinks that paper straws was a test to like the first like primer to

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see how far you could push people, like how moronic people were.

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So like, all right, we're going to save the planet by using paper straws instead of plastic

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straws.

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Like, how could we get the infrastructure for that in place so quickly if it wasn't a

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test?

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Like that's his thesis that this is just a test of how far you can push.

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And yeah, I just remembered another crazy thing during COVID from Dubai.

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I saw someone in a full hazmat suit spraying the tarmac on an airport with something.

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Like there are jumbo jets all over and gold and marble and all the shit they have in Dubai, right?

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And he's there alone on the tarmac with some spray.

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It's such a theater, right?

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Dude, I have so many stories because I had a strange experience because I actually went to nine different countries during it and over a dozen different cities.

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And so I have quite a different experience and perspective than a lot of people had because, you know, most people were kind of like stuck in place.

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And me, I was there like trying to dodge lockdowns and stuff.

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So I spent time, you know, in the UK, Portugal, Romania, UAE, multiple U.S. states, Mexico, Greece, like Turkey.

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I was all over the place.

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And, you know, I wish I could say that the stupidity and the insanity was restricted to just a small portion of the world.

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But it was not.

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Places were different at different times.

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But yeah, the general brainwashing and the general nonsense, it was the same across the board.

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And there were very few places who, you know, approached it in a way that at least tried to make sense.

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You know, I'm from Sweden and Sweden is known for having a very loose policy during the COVID years.

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And everyone saw that as like, oh, they didn't have a mask.

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We'd never had a mask mandate, for instance.

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Unfortunately, I had already moved to Spain at that point.

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But anyway but the thing is that the thing that people don know is it because we had an actual retard as a prime minister Like I think he has like a very low IQ person like and they didn act There such a slow like

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just dim-witted government that everyone else started doing shit and they were sort of late

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to the ball. And that's sort of what saved us. And also there's a high trust in institutions in

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the nordics and sweden in particular and we had a the the equivalent of a surgeon general who was

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quite quite a clever guy and who didn't buy most of the nonsense and just said no masks don't do

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anything and so so they trusted him and he was it was a good advisor to trust but that was sort of a

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fluke that we had a good guy in that position at that time there's no guarantee for that for sure

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but yeah it's interesting when you when you when you think about it in hindsight what what and also

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with the social distancing when they said you have to stand two meters uh away from another

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person and everyone in sweden is like why do we have to stand that close that's super awkward

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i want my regular 20 meters like when i'm in a line for the bus or something

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so there was no problem with that that's funny well god god bless sweden i'll tell you what um

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my my sort of view of sweden went up significantly during those years um for for why

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they did handled it the way they did rightly or wrongly. If someone had asked me, okay,

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if someone had told me in 2019, look in 2020, 2021, like this is going to happen,

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which country in Europe do you think is going to like not go along with this PSYOP? Sweden would

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not have been my guess. So, you know, I was like, okay, good. You know, Sweden half rhymes with

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freedom. And I've now been to Sweden as well. I went to Stockholm. I went there for my birthday.

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in 2024. I felt like I had to

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pay a visit to the country

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after my respect for it went up.

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I liked it as well. It was a nice city.

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I went to Uppsala as well. Very nice city.

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Nice.

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Sweden was cool.

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Both Uppsala

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and Stockholm are very beautiful.

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Beautiful cities.

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They kept a lot of the old

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beautiful architecture there.

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Beautiful cities.

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However, I wouldn't trust Sweden with the

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freedom stuff.

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it's just as as well and retarded as anywhere else i know i know the biggest disappointments

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for me during the the um the novid era was of course australia and canada which i've always

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viewed as bastions of freedom like some of the last bastions of freedom in the world i grew up

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with in the 80s the crocodile dundee was what we knew about australia and there's this guy not

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giving a fuck about anyone else or anything else going on in the world. And that's like

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refreshing even back then. But Australia was like some of the worst COVID policies of all

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countries. They were crazy. They were absolutely crazy, you know, and it's a strange thing because,

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I mean, I understand it psychologically why most people at this stage in 2026 don't want to,

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don't really like to talk about this subject because most people, the majority went along

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with it and they didn't question it. And a lot of people did stupid things and they said stupid

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things. And a lot of people discriminated against even their own loved ones and so on.

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And it's in human nature to kind of not want to, to want to save face and to not want to

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acknowledge that, which is why I think it's like very rare to even have people who have public

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platforms who have said, like actually said, I'm sorry, you know, I'm sorry for some of the things

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that I said. And I, you know, I shouldn't have said this. I shouldn't, I've seen a couple of

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people do it, but I could probably count them on one hand and you know, this is across the entire

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world. I could count them on one hand and, um, you know, and it's, it's a shame because

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if you don't learn from things, then they're quite destined to repeat. And yeah, I don't know,

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00:31:47,070 --> 00:31:50,989
man. It was a very, very weird time, but I learned a lot about humanity. Most of it,

343
00:31:50,989 --> 00:31:54,850
not positive, but either way, I think it's better to be closer to the truth.

344
00:31:54,850 --> 00:31:59,109
Welcome to Knut's super awesome Bitcoin school.

345
00:31:59,369 --> 00:32:01,169
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346
00:32:01,449 --> 00:32:02,129
Of course not.

347
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It's fake.

348
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It's counterfeited by the state.

349
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350
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How do you buy Bitcoin?

351
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Well, you can buy them off a friend or you can go to an exchange.

352
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We recommend you go to bullbitcoin.com and buy them over there.

353
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They also got an awesome mobile wallet if you should ever want to use your Bitcoin.

354
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So go to bullbitcoin.com and use code infinity for a discount.

355
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If you don't want to sell your Bitcoin, but you want to keep them for a long time,

356
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you should put them in some kind of cold storage.

357
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For that, we recommend BitVault.

358
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and they put your Bitcoin in a multi-sig time lock clever solution.

360
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So you should check them out at bitvault.sv and use code infinity for a discount.

361
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To put your Bitcoin in cold storage, you also need a hardware wallet.

362
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We recommend the Bitbox.

363
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Bitbox is a great hardware wallet that has been around since forever.

364
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365
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366
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If you need further advice on how to do any of all of this, you should go to thebitcoinadvisor.com.

367
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368
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369
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So go to thebitcoinadvisor.com and use code INFINITY for a discount.

370
00:33:29,509 --> 00:33:38,889
So to recap, get rid of the fiat and remember bullbitcoin.com, bitvolt.sv, bitbox.swiss and thebitcoinadvisor.com.

371
00:33:38,889 --> 00:33:40,449
Use code INFINITY everywhere.

372
00:33:41,109 --> 00:33:42,669
And don't forget to brush your teeth.

373
00:33:42,929 --> 00:33:43,449
Over and out.

374
00:33:43,449 --> 00:33:50,429
Yeah, on to less depressing topics. Was this your first time in El Salvador in November?

375
00:33:51,590 --> 00:33:52,409
No, second.

376
00:33:52,830 --> 00:33:54,350
Second? Yeah, same for me.

377
00:33:54,350 --> 00:33:56,749
Yeah, I went for Bukele's inauguration.

378
00:33:57,549 --> 00:34:07,189
Oh, cool. And what was your takeaway from the last trip? A lot has happened since Bukele's inauguration, I guess, because a lot has happened like just in a year.

379
00:34:07,189 --> 00:34:20,490
I was there for the first time in January and then in November, and it had completely changed. So very, very, very positive vibe. So what was your main takeaway? So what were your main takeaways?

380
00:34:21,329 --> 00:34:21,929
Yeah, sure thing.

381
00:34:22,049 --> 00:34:26,510
Well, first there's that, you know, we're both talking about not trusting politicians and not trusting governments.

382
00:34:26,510 --> 00:34:35,349
But I think I can say hands down that of all the world leaders that exist today, Nayib Bukele is the one that I like and respect the most.

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00:34:35,349 --> 00:34:40,669
of all the presidents and prime ministers across the world. He's one of the only ones who genuinely,

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00:34:41,149 --> 00:34:50,209
truly seems to care about his people and care about his nation and have the courage to actually

385
00:34:50,209 --> 00:34:57,049
do things that will make the place better. It's very strange across the West. I'm from the UK

386
00:34:57,049 --> 00:35:03,729
and it's very weird to see like in all these nations just implementing policies and doing

387
00:35:03,729 --> 00:35:12,369
things which are very clearly against the good of the general population. And whether this is

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00:35:12,369 --> 00:35:18,629
soft on crime policies, whether this is enabling mass migration, especially of the illegal variety,

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00:35:19,470 --> 00:35:25,569
whether this is implementing like insane tax policies. You've just seen this thing that passed

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00:35:25,569 --> 00:35:32,129
in the Netherlands of them wanting to put a 30% plus tax on unrealized, unrealized capital gains.

391
00:35:32,129 --> 00:35:34,889
It's not only wanting, they clubbed it through.

392
00:35:35,369 --> 00:35:39,810
Yeah, I think they pushed it through, but it's not yet implemented, right?

393
00:35:40,290 --> 00:35:41,510
Yeah, there's still hope.

394
00:35:42,129 --> 00:35:42,990
This is bizarre.

395
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We could go on.

396
00:35:44,049 --> 00:35:54,189
In Canada, they keep expanding this national suicide program, which they call MAID, which they've already killed 100,000 of their own citizens with.

397
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And they now want to extend to minors and they now want to extend to people who just have like certain mental health problems.

398
00:36:02,470 --> 00:36:11,669
Like, it's insane. Right. It's insane. And, you know, they're doing this under the banner of compassion and say and but really, you know, they want to save money and they want to.

399
00:36:11,669 --> 00:36:13,329
It's just, it's very dark.

400
00:36:13,609 --> 00:36:14,189
It's very dark.

401
00:36:14,269 --> 00:36:26,310
Like, I have a basic view that it shouldn't be controversial, but the government of a country should serve its citizens, right?

402
00:36:26,310 --> 00:36:47,249
Like if you are the German government, its goal should be to make things good for the citizens and residents of Germany in terms of safety, in terms of economics, in terms of education, in terms of health care, in terms of policies, like whatever the government is going to be like.

403
00:36:47,249 --> 00:36:56,389
We can have a whole debates and conversations about to what degree, what the scope of government should even be, right?

404
00:36:56,450 --> 00:36:59,729
To what degree the government should exist and what its scope should be.

405
00:36:59,729 --> 00:37:24,290
But given the world we currently live in and the size and scope of governments currently and the fact that almost all of them are already taxing their citizens to the tunes of trillions of dollars or euros or pounds, if you're going to do all that, it should, at a minimum, be to the benefit of the people.

406
00:37:24,290 --> 00:37:46,609
All right. If you're going to if you're going to be paying 30, 40, 50, 60 percent of everything that you earn to an entity called the state, then I don't think it's too much to ask that the streets should be clean and relatively crime free and you feel safe walking around the city at different times of the day.

407
00:37:46,609 --> 00:38:14,869
I don't think it's too much to ask that you have like decent infrastructure. I don't think it's too much to ask that you actually like have a border around your country and there's some type of system to stop people from taking advantage of it and so on. And they're just letting their people down at scale. So when I look at El Salvador, I see the opposite. What was the throughout my entire life? The most pressing issue in El Salvador has always been the gangs and the violence and the crime. Right.

408
00:38:14,869 --> 00:38:19,569
That's what the country, sadly, was famous for.

409
00:38:19,749 --> 00:38:25,049
Like in the 90s, in the 2000s, even in the early 2010s, like if someone said El Salvador,

410
00:38:25,470 --> 00:38:29,709
what came to your mind was generally not like something good and positive.

411
00:38:30,089 --> 00:38:33,589
It wasn't somewhere where you'd want to go and take your family on holiday.

412
00:38:34,609 --> 00:38:39,249
And they recognized, look, this is the number one problem that we have.

413
00:38:39,569 --> 00:38:43,349
If we don't fix this problem, we can't really fix the other ones.

414
00:38:43,349 --> 00:38:50,629
How can you fix the economy if people are afraid to go outside or afraid to send their kids to school or, you know, you can't.

415
00:38:50,669 --> 00:39:01,470
And so they tackled that head on, despite the pushback, despite the media attacks, despite all of the so-called controversy and all of it.

416
00:39:01,490 --> 00:39:02,549
You know, he just did it.

417
00:39:02,629 --> 00:39:03,950
He did the thing that needed to be done.

418
00:39:03,990 --> 00:39:12,470
And it's like, look, maybe there's going to be 5% of people who don't like this, but 95% do and will.

419
00:39:12,470 --> 00:39:32,510
And so, you know, we're going to do this because it's the right and moral thing to do. And now, in terms of what they're doing, in terms of trying to invest in health care, in terms of trying to improve the infrastructure, improve the economy, the country still has a long way to go. It's still a relatively poor country by by certainly by Western standards, but even by global standards.

420
00:39:32,510 --> 00:39:36,950
It's one of the poorest countries in Central America, but it is now the safest.

421
00:39:37,869 --> 00:39:39,089
And in the true sense, right?

422
00:39:39,189 --> 00:39:43,849
We're not talking the fake COVID type safety that, you know, wear a mask on your face when

423
00:39:43,849 --> 00:39:46,349
you go outside so that you can make people feel safe.

424
00:39:46,349 --> 00:39:50,450
We're talking true, actual safety, the type of safety that exists where I live in Dubai,

425
00:39:51,069 --> 00:39:54,069
where you can actually, yes, you are actually safe, right?

426
00:39:54,069 --> 00:39:54,810
It's not a myth.

427
00:39:54,889 --> 00:39:58,909
You can go around day and night, whatever, man, woman, young, old.

428
00:39:58,909 --> 00:40:02,749
the probability that like something bad happens to you is exceedingly low.

429
00:40:02,909 --> 00:40:04,089
And that's just how it should be.

430
00:40:04,249 --> 00:40:07,349
So I hope that they are able to stay on track.

431
00:40:07,490 --> 00:40:11,889
I think it's the thing that strikes me about El Salvador is just it's one of the most optimistic

432
00:40:11,889 --> 00:40:12,950
countries I've been to.

433
00:40:13,689 --> 00:40:18,810
In lots of places, people feel like things are getting worse rather than getting better.

434
00:40:19,490 --> 00:40:23,629
And something that strikes me with El Salvador is the sensation is the is the opposite.

435
00:40:23,629 --> 00:40:33,629
When you talk to local Salvadorans, they all have stories of how bad it used to be and how much better things are now and how hopeful they are towards the future.

436
00:40:34,369 --> 00:40:45,010
And that's really important because it's not just what matters isn't simply where a city or a state or a nation is right now, but the direction it's heading.

437
00:40:46,229 --> 00:40:52,950
There are many places where they used to be great, but people have this feeling like they're declining.

438
00:40:52,950 --> 00:40:55,169
and that things are consistently getting worse.

439
00:40:55,689 --> 00:40:57,129
The opportunities are fewer.

440
00:40:57,629 --> 00:40:58,849
The streets are not as safe.

441
00:40:59,429 --> 00:41:02,669
People are not as united as they used to be.

442
00:41:03,049 --> 00:41:05,209
Division is increasing, all these types of things.

443
00:41:05,790 --> 00:41:08,249
And over there, it's the opposite.

444
00:41:08,970 --> 00:41:10,389
So it's good to be somewhere

445
00:41:10,389 --> 00:41:12,749
where there's that genuine optimism in the air

446
00:41:12,749 --> 00:41:14,010
and people feel hopeful.

447
00:41:14,749 --> 00:41:17,349
It's actually nice to be somewhere

448
00:41:17,349 --> 00:41:18,629
where people have like a,

449
00:41:19,510 --> 00:41:22,089
not a trust in the government that is,

450
00:41:22,089 --> 00:41:29,129
not, how would I put it, a trust that's actually been earned, right? Not a trust that is assumed

451
00:41:29,129 --> 00:41:33,909
just because it's the government, but because, oh, okay, like they're actually doing things that are

452
00:41:33,909 --> 00:41:47,444
beneficial and things that are in line with people democratic choices So I rooting for that I rooting for that country man I would love to see El Salvador become like I don know the Switzerland of the Central

453
00:41:47,444 --> 00:41:49,644
America or the UAE of Central America.

454
00:41:49,824 --> 00:41:50,984
Like, I would love to see that happen.

455
00:41:51,084 --> 00:41:54,404
And so I'm rooting for them and I hope they can do it.

456
00:41:55,864 --> 00:41:58,084
Yeah, I can just echo most of that.

457
00:41:58,084 --> 00:42:05,964
I mean, the fact that we in most Western countries pay, as you say, between 30 and 60 percent in taxes.

458
00:42:06,504 --> 00:42:11,804
And if you add the inflation and all other things like exponential growth, we never get to see.

459
00:42:11,924 --> 00:42:15,284
And if you add all that in, it's probably more like 80 percent everywhere.

460
00:42:15,824 --> 00:42:22,024
And like the fact that we don't we don't have clean street and we still have crime and we still have all sorts of crap.

461
00:42:22,364 --> 00:42:24,364
It's sort of what radicalized me.

462
00:42:24,364 --> 00:42:29,824
I see all of these countries just go in the wrong direction.

463
00:42:30,204 --> 00:42:33,124
And it's like the government grows like a cancer over time.

464
00:42:33,304 --> 00:42:35,084
And you can't stop it.

465
00:42:35,744 --> 00:42:46,304
In El Salvador, in contrast, then, I'd say there's a Churchill quote, you know, the democracy is the worst form of government, except all others that have been tried.

466
00:42:46,304 --> 00:42:55,244
And I saw somewhere someone calling, I think it was Greg Maxwell, who called Bitcoin a system of distributed authoritarianism.

467
00:42:55,524 --> 00:43:04,384
And I'd like to paraphrase Churchill and say distributed authoritarianism is the best form of government, except all others that have been tried.

468
00:43:04,784 --> 00:43:10,344
And I think Bukele might fall into that camp because it is sort of distributed authoritarianism.

469
00:43:10,344 --> 00:43:15,424
he even called himself like a dictator at one point

470
00:43:15,424 --> 00:43:17,504
mostly to troll the other countries

471
00:43:17,504 --> 00:43:20,684
like El Mas Popular Dictator del Mundo

472
00:43:20,684 --> 00:43:21,804
or whatever he called himself

473
00:43:21,804 --> 00:43:26,784
and he has like more than 90% approval from

474
00:43:26,784 --> 00:43:30,784
like you say like 95% of the population like him

475
00:43:30,784 --> 00:43:33,784
so in that case it functions sort of like

476
00:43:33,784 --> 00:43:35,504
the consensus rules of Bitcoin

477
00:43:35,504 --> 00:43:38,584
if everybody likes it like why change it

478
00:43:38,584 --> 00:43:59,584
So it's sort of like that. If we can't live in a utopia where, I mean, the best thing for everyone would be if no one ever aggressed against anyone else ever again. Like if we didn't have aggression, and then by definition, we wouldn't need any governments because no one would take anything from anyone else ever again.

479
00:43:59,584 --> 00:44:21,544
But that's a utopia. That will never happen. So on our way to that or in approaching that, I think it's better with a Bukele-type character definitely than a coalition of eight parties in some 100-year-old democracy that just keeps growing into a bureaucracy rather than a meritocracy.

480
00:44:21,544 --> 00:44:24,864
and everything just costlier and costlier every year.

481
00:44:25,084 --> 00:44:28,464
And every institution screams for more and more money

482
00:44:28,464 --> 00:44:29,844
and higher and higher budgets

483
00:44:29,844 --> 00:44:33,024
because that's how they make money.

484
00:44:33,024 --> 00:44:37,284
They fail their old budget.

485
00:44:37,644 --> 00:44:40,744
So that's their only way to get more money next year, right?

486
00:44:41,144 --> 00:44:44,284
So no, the incentives are all skewed.

487
00:44:44,924 --> 00:44:46,824
Yeah, you know, on this subject,

488
00:44:47,604 --> 00:44:48,584
I mean, the thing with me,

489
00:44:48,644 --> 00:44:50,184
and there are people who criticize me

490
00:44:50,184 --> 00:44:57,684
for sort of seeing the world this way or having this opinion is I care far less about the

491
00:44:57,684 --> 00:45:06,544
structure and supposed form of government than I care about actual results on the ground.

492
00:45:07,044 --> 00:45:15,264
Okay. So I do not live in a democracy. I moved from a democracy to a monarchy, right? I live in

493
00:45:15,264 --> 00:45:19,344
the United Arab Emirates. And I grew up in Saudi Arabia. I've spent a lot of my life

494
00:45:19,344 --> 00:45:25,244
living in non-democracies. I'm from the UK. I've spent a good amount of time in the USA. I've

495
00:45:25,244 --> 00:45:30,644
traveled to about 50 different countries. So I've seen all sorts of things. And there would be people

496
00:45:30,644 --> 00:45:36,464
who are confused as to, oh, like, why would you want to live in the UAE? It's not a democracy.

497
00:45:36,704 --> 00:45:39,884
You don't get a say. You don't get a vote. You don't get a say. And I'm like, well,

498
00:45:40,664 --> 00:45:44,664
because the results on the ground and the policies, generally speaking,

499
00:45:44,664 --> 00:45:51,384
are things that are very much aligned with me and with other sane, decent people.

500
00:45:51,384 --> 00:45:53,144
So the results on the ground are good.

501
00:45:53,244 --> 00:45:58,284
So I don't care about like the label of the system.

502
00:45:58,604 --> 00:45:59,204
Do you see what I mean?

503
00:45:59,264 --> 00:45:59,404
Right.

504
00:45:59,504 --> 00:46:01,984
So it could be a constitutional republic.

505
00:46:01,984 --> 00:46:03,604
It could be a democracy.

506
00:46:03,864 --> 00:46:04,564
It could be this.

507
00:46:04,644 --> 00:46:08,224
There's lots of different, I don't even know all the names of the different, even with

508
00:46:08,224 --> 00:46:12,544
monarchies, like there's different types because the UK obviously has a monarchy as well, but

509
00:46:12,544 --> 00:46:17,664
you know, the real power isn't necessarily with the king. And I'm just like, like, I care about

510
00:46:17,664 --> 00:46:22,764
the results on the ground. You can have a, you can have a tyranny in a supposed democracy, right?

511
00:46:22,784 --> 00:46:28,304
Like you were just talking about Canada and Australia during the whole scandemic period.

512
00:46:28,544 --> 00:46:34,044
Those places are on paper. These are supposed to be democracy. It's supposed to be, you know,

513
00:46:34,264 --> 00:46:41,104
everybody gets a say and we're going to do right by the people. And, you know, we have freedom and

514
00:46:41,104 --> 00:46:46,944
liberties and all these things. Yay. And then you just see that it's BS, right? They can just

515
00:46:46,944 --> 00:46:54,384
declare an emergency and all of these things go out the window. Look at all these democracies in

516
00:46:54,384 --> 00:47:02,304
the West and look at the things the government is doing versus the things people actually want,

517
00:47:02,304 --> 00:47:11,404
right who voted for mass illegal migration who voted for soft on crime policies where you can

518
00:47:11,404 --> 00:47:16,744
let someone out for violent offenses dozens and dozens and dozens of times until they do something

519
00:47:16,744 --> 00:47:22,484
that is truly horrific who voted for that who voted for um you know did the people in this

520
00:47:22,484 --> 00:47:29,944
who voted for this for those of you listening and not watching this is a eu bottle water bottle and

521
00:47:29,944 --> 00:47:35,424
I can't unscrew the cork like because that's forbidden. Yes. Yeah. Who voted for that? Who

522
00:47:35,424 --> 00:47:41,464
voted for these net zero policies? There's a lot of stuff where it's just like, yeah, sure. On paper,

523
00:47:41,464 --> 00:47:46,924
it's democratic as in you get to choose normally like one of two parties who are going to just kind

524
00:47:46,924 --> 00:47:50,924
of end up pulling the country in the same direction either way, maybe one more quickly than the other.

525
00:47:51,164 --> 00:47:55,584
But when it comes to the stuff that's genuinely significant, it's actually very undemocratic and

526
00:47:55,584 --> 00:48:00,064
it's not in line with what the people on the ground want and what will benefit them.

527
00:48:00,284 --> 00:48:08,084
So I'm at the stage where I just don't really, I don't know, I'm not against democracy per

528
00:48:08,084 --> 00:48:10,364
se, and I'm not pro-monarchy even.

529
00:48:10,544 --> 00:48:12,404
I'm just like, I'm pro-results.

530
00:48:12,744 --> 00:48:17,304
I'm pro-doing what works and what actually works for people and implementing sane policies

531
00:48:17,304 --> 00:48:18,884
for individuals and families.

532
00:48:19,464 --> 00:48:23,524
Are you aware of a Hans Hermann Hoppe book called Democracy, the God that Failed?

533
00:48:24,204 --> 00:48:25,464
Yes, but I have not read it.

534
00:48:25,584 --> 00:48:49,064
It's a great book where he points out that the lesser of two evils in comparing monarchies to democracies is the monarchy because a king at least has an incentive to have a low time preference, whereas a democratically elected leader is incentivized to loot as much as he can the next four years.

535
00:48:49,064 --> 00:49:15,764
So the analogy Hoppe puts in the book is sort of like, who is more likely to take care of a house? The owner of the house or a temporary tenant? And I think that's a very good analogy. I mean, if you have a monarchy, of course, you can get a real asshole as a monarch. If you're unlucky, you'll get Geoffrey Baratheon from Game of Thrones who just wants to kill people, right?

536
00:49:15,764 --> 00:49:33,424
But for the most part, in a democracy, you sort of always get that. You get people who are incentivized to lie, to get into positions of power, and then loot as much as possible for four years and then get out of there and get a top paying job at some bureaucratic institution somewhere.

537
00:49:33,424 --> 00:49:44,644
A monarch wants the people to like him because otherwise they will start a revolution and they will want democracy.

538
00:49:44,884 --> 00:49:49,204
So especially nowadays, he sort of needs to have popular support.

539
00:49:49,924 --> 00:49:50,684
And how do you do that?

540
00:49:50,684 --> 00:50:04,704
Well, strong property rights is the answer, and that's Dubai is sort of a proof that people care more about strong property rights than about freedom of speech.

541
00:50:04,864 --> 00:50:11,804
Because this is from another part of libertarian literature, like in a book called The Ethics of Liberty by Rothbard.

542
00:50:12,124 --> 00:50:18,444
He points out that everyone forgets the follow-up question, like freedom of speech, where?

543
00:50:19,144 --> 00:50:25,784
And as he points out, freedom of speech laws are only applicable to public places.

544
00:50:26,084 --> 00:50:28,924
And if everything was private, you wouldn't need them at all.

545
00:50:29,024 --> 00:50:36,784
Because I get to decide who gets to say what in my house, on my property, or on my social media platform, for that matter.

546
00:50:37,264 --> 00:50:40,884
And you don't really need these things because it's all an illusion.

547
00:50:40,884 --> 00:50:43,004
There is no freedom of speech.

548
00:50:43,104 --> 00:50:44,904
It's always censored in some way.

549
00:50:44,904 --> 00:50:48,064
you can't yell fire in a theater

550
00:50:48,064 --> 00:50:49,964
and you can't say exactly what you want

551
00:50:49,964 --> 00:50:51,884
and nor should you be able to

552
00:50:51,884 --> 00:50:53,284
like if you say something

553
00:50:53,284 --> 00:50:55,604
that violates someone else's right

554
00:50:55,604 --> 00:50:56,664
One thing I do want to say is

555
00:50:56,664 --> 00:51:00,224
people always say that you can't yell fire

556
00:51:00,224 --> 00:51:01,824
in a crowded theater. Actually you can

557
00:51:01,824 --> 00:51:03,824
as long as you believe that there actually is one

558
00:51:03,824 --> 00:51:06,464
Yeah, that's a good point

559
00:51:06,464 --> 00:51:08,024
Because people always use that example

560
00:51:08,024 --> 00:51:09,304
and I'm like actually no, you can

561
00:51:09,304 --> 00:51:10,624
it's not prohibited

562
00:51:10,624 --> 00:51:13,784
You're even supposed to if there is an actual fire

563
00:51:13,784 --> 00:51:14,424
Yeah, yeah.

564
00:51:14,464 --> 00:51:17,164
Or you have decent reason to believe that there is, yeah.

565
00:51:17,824 --> 00:51:18,164
Yeah.

566
00:51:18,484 --> 00:51:20,804
So over to the Bitcoin stuff.

567
00:51:20,864 --> 00:51:22,904
We haven't talked about any Bitcoin stuff at all.

568
00:51:23,144 --> 00:51:29,364
So what are your 2026 thoughts about Bitcoin?

569
00:51:29,864 --> 00:51:37,864
Are you in any way, shape, or form involved in the current internal fight of Core V30 and BIP110 and that?

570
00:51:37,864 --> 00:51:44,304
Or do you have any views on, you know, the whole paper Bitcoin summer and these strategic reserve companies?

571
00:51:44,384 --> 00:51:46,984
And like, what's your general feel for the thing?

572
00:51:48,224 --> 00:51:51,004
I'm a very high level Bitcoin investor.

573
00:51:51,584 --> 00:52:02,084
So I don't get involved in the nitty gritty of the tech stuff or of the politics that is downstream of it or any of that.

574
00:52:02,184 --> 00:52:04,584
I just continue to stack sets and stay humble.

575
00:52:04,924 --> 00:52:07,764
And I like the fact that they're on a discount right now.

576
00:52:07,864 --> 00:52:14,144
and I will continue to stack through 2026, and I think that it'll pay off massively.

577
00:52:14,944 --> 00:52:19,944
So I practice something which is called tactical aloofness.

578
00:52:19,944 --> 00:52:26,964
I've kind of coined this term, which is when it comes to drama, drama and fighting in general,

579
00:52:27,104 --> 00:52:32,044
whether that is political, it's cultural, it's social, it's even in the world of Bitcoin

580
00:52:32,044 --> 00:52:35,804
or some other interest or hobby that I have,

581
00:52:36,204 --> 00:52:38,104
I tend to like float above it all.

582
00:52:38,744 --> 00:52:41,024
And I'll observe it a little bit from a distance,

583
00:52:41,024 --> 00:52:42,364
but I don't get involved.

584
00:52:43,124 --> 00:52:45,524
And I call that tactical aloofness

585
00:52:45,524 --> 00:52:48,004
because I've been involved in,

586
00:52:48,344 --> 00:52:51,424
I've been in this crazy world of culture war

587
00:52:51,424 --> 00:52:52,904
and social commentary and stuff

588
00:52:52,904 --> 00:52:55,724
for about seven years at this point to some degree.

589
00:52:56,404 --> 00:52:58,164
And the fighting never stops.

590
00:52:58,324 --> 00:53:00,264
And in social media, it just gets bonkers.

591
00:53:00,424 --> 00:53:01,664
You get a certain amount of followers

592
00:53:01,664 --> 00:53:17,064
And there's just so much noise. There's so much drama. There's so much interconnectivity. It's the same reason I don't like watch the news and keep up with what's going on in the news every day and know everything that's happening in this country and overseas and every single drama.

593
00:53:17,064 --> 00:53:22,004
I'm aware that things are going on and I get like a high level overview of it.

594
00:53:22,084 --> 00:53:25,224
And if something is particularly pertinent, I'll pay attention.

595
00:53:26,184 --> 00:53:31,764
But ultimately, I think it all I think a lot of it's also in terms of Bitcoin specifically.

596
00:53:33,084 --> 00:53:38,364
In terms of people's psychology, it largely serves as a form of FUD, right?

597
00:53:38,364 --> 00:53:50,924
Like if you get too obsessed with all this stuff, it's easy to lose your conviction to some degree or to get thrown off your strategy because you're kind of like listening to too many voices.

598
00:53:51,244 --> 00:53:52,784
And people like fear narratives.

599
00:53:53,164 --> 00:53:54,404
Like this is something I've really learned.

600
00:53:54,524 --> 00:53:55,644
People like to be afraid.

601
00:53:56,204 --> 00:54:01,004
There's a type of personality where people, you know, to some people, the world is always ending.

602
00:54:01,684 --> 00:54:01,884
Right.

603
00:54:02,684 --> 00:54:06,344
And whether it's, you know, it's why people love the pandemic.

604
00:54:06,344 --> 00:54:06,704
Right.

605
00:54:06,704 --> 00:54:08,344
Like people like the fear narrative.

606
00:54:08,584 --> 00:54:11,744
People want to believe that, you know, there's a climate emergency.

607
00:54:11,944 --> 00:54:16,204
And if we don't do something, then like, you know, the world is going to melt in 10 years time.

608
00:54:16,764 --> 00:54:23,304
Or like this, you know, I don't know, Trump is going to become a dictator and usher in some like, like people, people like to be scared.

609
00:54:23,464 --> 00:54:25,544
It sounds weird, but people like to be scared.

610
00:54:25,684 --> 00:54:32,444
No, but we're hardwired to be scared or to pay more attention to negative stuff than positive stuff.

611
00:54:32,444 --> 00:54:39,404
because sure but you're more when if someone uh shouts birthday cake no one cares but if someone

612
00:54:39,404 --> 00:54:44,464
shouts tiger everyone cares and there's a very good evolutionary reason for that so there is

613
00:54:44,464 --> 00:54:51,864
yeah but it's being abused of course no yes and we've never been surrounded by so many voices and

614
00:54:51,864 --> 00:54:59,244
so many opinions and so much news and stuff that's you know 99 of it is not even like in your vicinity

615
00:54:59,244 --> 00:55:04,164
and there's only so much benefit in being aware of it all.

616
00:55:04,324 --> 00:55:06,864
So yeah, when it comes to all those things you mentioned,

617
00:55:07,104 --> 00:55:08,764
I don't have an opinion.

618
00:55:08,984 --> 00:55:12,384
I don't have a strong knowledge of it.

619
00:55:12,504 --> 00:55:15,204
I don't even know what some of the debates

620
00:55:15,204 --> 00:55:16,464
and arguments exactly are.

621
00:55:16,544 --> 00:55:17,764
There are people who are far more technical

622
00:55:17,764 --> 00:55:20,344
and far more interested in all of it than I am.

623
00:55:21,064 --> 00:55:23,324
I just stack sets and I stay humble

624
00:55:23,324 --> 00:55:24,764
and I believe in Bitcoin

625
00:55:24,764 --> 00:55:28,944
and I believe that if more people get involved in it

626
00:55:28,944 --> 00:55:32,824
and more people adopt it, then humanity will be better off. People will be better

627
00:55:32,859 --> 00:55:37,919
off individually. And I think we'll be better off as a species. Like the current monetary system

628
00:55:37,919 --> 00:55:44,139
is a giant scam and it has been for longer than either of us have been alive. And I recognize

629
00:55:44,139 --> 00:55:50,619
that. And I think that Bitcoin for the first time, we have like a real escape hatch from this all,

630
00:55:50,619 --> 00:55:57,499
if people choose to use it. And, you know, I encourage people to use it, but even on that

631
00:55:57,499 --> 00:56:02,819
sense, like I'm not a, I don't know. I don't, I don't kind of like, you know, I've been in Bitcoin

632
00:56:02,819 --> 00:56:09,879
for, gosh, approaching, you know, over eight years at this point. And to this day, of course,

633
00:56:09,939 --> 00:56:14,379
especially at times like this, you've got all the naysayers, you've got all that, it's going to zero.

634
00:56:14,599 --> 00:56:18,819
You've, I've told you so, you've got people who've been tweeting from since 2012 about how Bitcoin is

635
00:56:18,819 --> 00:56:24,799
going to zero, right. And celebrating every time it takes a dump in terms of dollar terms. And

636
00:56:24,799 --> 00:56:29,219
it's all just FUD. It's all just noise. Like by listening to these people, you're doing yourself

637
00:56:29,219 --> 00:56:33,439
a disservice because they never change their tune. They never update their beliefs. Same thing.

638
00:56:33,439 --> 00:56:37,699
Remember what I said about wanting to save face. So this is how you have people who for 13 years

639
00:56:37,699 --> 00:56:42,959
straight, they've been saying that Bitcoin is terrible and they've just completely missed the

640
00:56:42,959 --> 00:56:49,159
boat. And I don't know, I pay attention to like a small number of people who have like proved that

641
00:56:49,159 --> 00:56:53,819
they're worth paying attention to. And outside of that, I mostly tune out the noise and I've got a

642
00:56:53,819 --> 00:56:58,279
family to take care of. I've got a little son to take care of and raise. And I just generally have

643
00:56:58,279 --> 00:57:04,639
better things to do. That sounds like a very good position to be in, like psychologically. No,

644
00:57:04,639 --> 00:57:11,999
I'm not kidding. It's like coming to these philosophical insights. One thing that I try

645
00:57:11,999 --> 00:57:16,619
to live by, like my grandfather had a saying, I never met my grandfather on my dad's side,

646
00:57:16,679 --> 00:57:23,199
but he used to say that which you can do without your own. And it's taken me decades to actually

647
00:57:23,199 --> 00:57:28,859
grasp the foundness of that thing, because it means like it's like the flip side of the

648
00:57:28,859 --> 00:57:43,533
things you own end up owning you So like if you can minimize your material desires you own everything like because you completely in charge of your of your urges and if you win that like then

649
00:57:43,533 --> 00:57:50,473
you're by definition rich without without even needing money like uh it's it's such a and and

650
00:57:50,473 --> 00:57:55,713
especially when you find bitcoin and you have this thing that goes up in value over time so you're

651
00:57:55,713 --> 00:58:02,753
no longer incentivized to over consume or anything like that but you're rather incentivized to just

652
00:58:02,753 --> 00:58:10,133
as you say stay humble and stack sets and i think my hope for bitcoin long term is that it it it

653
00:58:10,133 --> 00:58:17,653
shows people this way that we can actually just fucking get along and not spend our money on

654
00:58:17,653 --> 00:58:23,193
frivolous shit we don't need yeah you know i'll tell you something else can it is like um you

655
00:58:23,193 --> 00:58:28,373
You know, something I've just accepted in life as well is just that it's really hard to change people's minds.

656
00:58:29,113 --> 00:58:30,693
And most of the time.

657
00:58:31,753 --> 00:58:32,633
No, it's not.

658
00:58:35,793 --> 00:58:42,853
You know, there are times, especially on a one on one basis and with people you care about and love, there's a time where it's very much worth the effort to try to.

659
00:58:42,853 --> 00:58:50,453
But especially in this age of just like, you know, billions of people being on social media and everyone having an opinion and everyone making noise.

660
00:58:50,453 --> 00:58:55,013
there's a lot of peace in just like, just kind of shrugging your shoulders and being like, okay,

661
00:58:55,073 --> 00:58:59,053
you know, like, like when someone now tells me, oh, you know, like if five years ago,

662
00:58:59,053 --> 00:59:04,333
if someone was like fighting with me on Twitter about Bitcoin or whatever, telling me that it's

663
00:59:04,333 --> 00:59:09,473
a scam or it's a tulip bubble, you know, I would like take time to explain to them why it's not,

664
00:59:09,553 --> 00:59:13,573
I would try to, you know, they'd never listen, but I would try. And now I'm just like, okay,

665
00:59:13,993 --> 00:59:18,233
like if I reply, I'll just say, yeah, you're right. Or I'll say, okay. Or I'll say then short

666
00:59:18,233 --> 00:59:25,533
If I even reply, most of the time I won't, but I'm just like, okay, we're going to see

667
00:59:25,533 --> 00:59:26,533
who's right.

668
00:59:26,533 --> 00:59:29,533
You never reply, have fun staying poor?

669
00:59:29,533 --> 00:59:41,767
No I actually don I actually don Sometimes I think it but I don say it out loud No that probably smart

670
00:59:42,287 --> 00:59:45,587
On a long enough timeframe, we are going to see who's correct.

671
00:59:46,247 --> 00:59:46,447
Yeah.

672
00:59:46,867 --> 00:59:47,187
Okay.

673
00:59:47,347 --> 00:59:48,387
So we are what?

674
00:59:49,027 --> 00:59:51,707
How many years are we into the Bitcoin experiment?

675
00:59:51,707 --> 00:59:54,207
Something like 18, 17, 18 years?

676
00:59:54,547 --> 00:59:55,247
17 years, yeah.

677
00:59:55,727 --> 00:59:56,267
17 years.

678
00:59:56,667 --> 00:59:59,867
In terms of human history, that's literally nothing, right?

679
00:59:59,907 --> 01:00:00,887
Like that's one second.

680
01:00:01,007 --> 01:00:21,367
So we're going to see. I mean, thus far, it looks like the Bitcoiners are pretty correct. 10 years from now, 2036, you know, we can come back and we'll see. 2046, we can come back and we can see, right? Are the people who are screaming, oh my gosh, it's going to zero. This thing's going to fail, da, da, da, like all their narratives. Like we're just going to find out.

681
01:00:21,367 --> 01:00:33,067
So I recommend to people, hey, at a minimum, I'm like, you should do some serious, like take some time out of your day and really, really research Bitcoin and its value proposition and what it is.

682
01:00:33,127 --> 01:00:34,367
That's what I urge to people.

683
01:00:35,007 --> 01:00:36,787
Like, just don't be ignorant.

684
01:00:37,147 --> 01:00:37,887
Don't remain ignorant.

685
01:00:38,007 --> 01:00:40,387
Like, this is too important for you to remain ignorant.

686
01:00:41,007 --> 01:00:42,327
And then I kind of just leave it at that.

687
01:00:42,327 --> 01:00:48,227
You know, if someone is genuinely humble and they're curious and they're open learning, I'm happy to explain things as much as I can explain things.

688
01:00:48,227 --> 01:01:18,207
But if it's just someone who's already coming in with like a very, very strong opinion of like how it's, you know, whatever they think it is, and they have an update, they can't be bothered to even do like, like they're already on the internet, right? And they can't even be bothered to do like some very basic research. Like it's, that's not my job. That's not my job. So I'm just like, okay, cool. Like you do you, you know, you do you and we'll see, you know, if in 10 years time, like in 10 years time, maybe, you know, the whole experiment fails and, you know, it genuinely goes to your job.

689
01:01:18,347 --> 01:01:18,687
Oh, wow.

690
01:01:18,747 --> 01:01:18,947
Okay.

691
01:01:18,967 --> 01:01:22,707
Like, darn, you know, I don't know how that's possible.

692
01:01:22,787 --> 01:01:24,367
It can happen, but you know, I'll be like, okay, cool.

693
01:01:24,407 --> 01:01:24,707
You know what?

694
01:01:25,327 --> 01:01:25,947
I was wrong.

695
01:01:26,147 --> 01:01:28,707
You know, I was wrong, but you know, the other way around that won't happen.

696
01:01:28,707 --> 01:01:28,867
Right.

697
01:01:28,907 --> 01:01:42,800
Bitcoin in 10 years time could be like million and they still think that it a scam and they still think it a tool But like they just watched it run from like to million And they still there like screaming about how it going to zero

698
01:01:42,960 --> 01:01:45,380
And I'm just like, I don't know, man.

699
01:01:45,780 --> 01:01:49,460
The Bible talks a lot about pride and it's for this very reason, right?

700
01:01:49,580 --> 01:01:53,560
Pride really comes before the fall and people need to just like be able to accept, hey,

701
01:01:53,600 --> 01:01:54,640
you know, I could be wrong.

702
01:01:55,080 --> 01:01:56,660
Maybe I have some things I still have to learn.

703
01:01:56,900 --> 01:01:58,720
And yeah, it's how I try to approach life.

704
01:01:59,820 --> 01:02:01,480
It sounds like a sound approach.

705
01:02:01,480 --> 01:02:08,080
And I probably have a little, a lot to learn from you there on that front, because I still

706
01:02:08,080 --> 01:02:12,180
get the urge to point out when someone's wrong on the internet and maybe I should do it a

707
01:02:12,180 --> 01:02:12,560
little less.

708
01:02:13,120 --> 01:02:17,540
But so before we wrap this up, we're coming up on a little more than an hour here.

709
01:02:17,620 --> 01:02:21,440
Is there anything we haven't talked about that you wanted to talk about?

710
01:02:21,620 --> 01:02:22,560
Anything that comes to mind?

711
01:02:23,700 --> 01:02:24,860
No, not specifically, man.

712
01:02:24,920 --> 01:02:28,760
I hope that people who have been listening have been able to, you know, get some value

713
01:02:28,760 --> 01:02:33,800
out of this in terms of information or entertainment or perspective, whatever it may be.

714
01:02:33,800 --> 01:02:35,400
I think they definitely are.

715
01:02:36,300 --> 01:02:38,880
Hopefully I've said something that's of interest.

716
01:02:39,680 --> 01:02:43,580
And yeah, people can find and follow me online on all social media platforms

717
01:02:43,580 --> 01:02:46,920
at Zuby Music, that is Z-U-B-Y Music.

718
01:02:47,700 --> 01:02:51,340
And yeah, if you want to check out my music or my podcast,

719
01:02:51,940 --> 01:02:55,260
you can just search my name on whatever platform you use.

720
01:02:55,600 --> 01:02:57,620
Very easy to find, Zuby, Z-U-B-Y.

721
01:02:57,620 --> 01:03:05,640
Fantastic. Zuby, it's been an absolute pleasure. It's always good to see you. How do you say farewell in hip hop?

722
01:03:08,100 --> 01:03:08,620
Peace.

723
01:03:10,080 --> 01:03:22,220
Peace. And yeah, don't forget to like, subscribe and brush your teeth. This has been the Bitcoin Infinity Show and cheerio. Peace. I mean, thank you, Zuby.

724
01:03:22,220 --> 01:03:22,760
Thanks, man. I appreciate it.

725
01:03:27,620 --> 01:03:57,600
Thank you.