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Zeno Systems. This is Nick Land's book. And reading Nick Land is a joy, a treat. It's something that will challenge you. I spent most of my time while reading this book, copying and pasting entire paragraphs or multiple paragraphs and putting them into Grok with the prompt, WTF is Nick Land trying to say here.

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and then it unpacks it. Land is one of the most dense writers that I've ever had the pleasure of

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reading and this book is an absolute joy. It's not, I won't say it's like an easy read

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because he does write so dense. However, it's the kind of read that you want to chew on for a long

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time. And you want to really think about the things that he's saying because land is not fighting in

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the trenches that everyone else is. He's not arguing the merits of Democrats versus Republicans

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or democracy versus communism. He is far zoomed out and talking about things at a higher level,

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a higher dimension than we're typically used to.

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And Bitcoin is such a core part of the things that he talks about.

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Yeah.

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So he's in the trenches.

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What I would say is like a concentric circle of trenches

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that's far back from the front, further back from the front lines.

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So Xenosystems is a collection of,

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a curated collection of entries from his blog of the same name,

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I believe from 2012 to 2017, it's kind of roughly centered around this idea of neo-reaction.

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So you're right that neo-reaction as like a political philosophy is kind of, we'll talk

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about this, a meta-politics.

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So it's beyond the front lines.

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If you're in the trenches, Democrat, Republican, even conservative, liberal, there's a row

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behind that of increasing abstraction about what it even means to have a political view.

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And that's kind of where neo-reaction situates it.

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as a framework for views.

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And I want to say it's the concentric circle of trenches

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because when he was writing this blog,

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it was a time of 2012, 2017,

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hashing out this idea of neo-reaction.

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Now it's kind of in the air.

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You hear Nick Land mentioned in the same breath

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as a lot of modern politics with,

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you would say, the rise of the alt-right.

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But this is prefiguring a lot of that.

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This comes before Trump,

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but a lot of people use it to explain

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a lot of what Trump was able to piggyback on.

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But this is not basically...

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And he exclusively distances himself from the alt-right.

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Yes, he does.

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Yes, yeah.

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Very, very vehemently.

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Explicitly, yeah.

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In those terms, a distancing, definitely.

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It's a populist movement to neo-reaction,

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which is like an anti-populist movement.

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It's against, we're going to see a critique of democracy here

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because it is anti-populist.

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Yeah, like alt-right could be a populist expression

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may be of some of the same sources of discontent that motivate neoreaction,

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but they're divergent stances.

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Yeah.

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No, it is.

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You're totally right.

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There's a density to it that he's a philosopher by training, continental philosophy.

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So that's like a certain trend, a certain school of philosophy that within the realm

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of philosophy, we might say there's analytic and continental.

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And analytic is the type that maybe a lot of people are used to where it's all about, like, be as clear as you can and proceed through, like, to clarify a concept, kind of through a, like, maybe a Socratic ring of, like, increasing movement towards a notion where you subtract away all the inessential.

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Whereas he's going to talk about his view of philosophy here, which is more of a stimulus to thought as a way to get us thinking.

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and and i just wanted to also know that this is his most accessible work too that he was writing

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for the blog he was writing for somewhat of a popular audience at least trying to have dialogue

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with people who were incredibly intelligent um curtis yarvin michael anisimov these other people

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but they weren't um you know like they weren't in the same strand of philosophy that he was he kind

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of pulls back i think this is very if you want to get into nick land this is where you start i think

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Xena systems.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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So you're going to start.

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Are there terms that we should, I mean, because like reading through like cybernetic and the

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cathedral and these things.

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So cybernetics, I wasn't, as far as terms though, I think that's how we're going to

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structure this conversation.

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This is again, kind of a curation of blog entries.

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Lomaz, the editor through Passage Press does a fantastic job of, it's not pure, it's not

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pure chronology of blog entries.

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There's a cumulative nature where you learn concepts as you go along that are employed in later blog entries.

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And Lomez has taken the effort to kind of put in the forefront, kind of at the beginning essays that if you read through it chronologically, if you read the book chronologically, you're going to learn vocab that's going to help out.

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And this whole thing, land creates a vocabulary because you're going to talk about a new thing and you use the old words.

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You're going to be captured in a sense by old ways of thinking.

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And so land is going to rebuild up a vocabulary and not just him, the people he's in dialogue with.

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We'll talk about the cathedral, what that means.

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This was a notion that Curtis Yarvin, as Menchus Boldbug, created, and it's one that land employs.

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He addresses that very explicitly, the language, in that language is not sufficient to convey ideas that are – I mean, like there are – the English language lacks the ability to communicate certain types of things and other languages lack those abilities.

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And he mentions that like, you know, mathematics quickly gets rid of language and devolves into symbols that are, I guess, more universal or something.

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But like, I remember having a discussion with somebody, a Chinese person who was saying like in Chinese, there's like, I don't know, there's like 15 different ways to say love.

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And each of them means like a different thing, you know.

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Um, and there's like, I mean, you can have like love for an object, love for a family member, romantic love, all this stuff. And so, um, it's from that place that we're starting this conversation, which is that we're using language to describe something that language is not sufficient for. And so we're, we're fighting against the current to begin with, I think.

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Yeah. And trying to. The more I read this, the more it is just constantly reminding yourself to remove yourself from the box. You're in a system. You need to be outside of the system to analyze the system.

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So here's a couple of quotes on language. I sent you one over on Twitter as we were discussing this. That one is language is not a neutral conveyor of infinite communicative possibility, but an intelligence box. It is to be counted among the traps to be escaped.

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and then in that vein

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language is good

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only for language games

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and among these trust games

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are the most irredeemably stupid

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so it's like language is going to put us

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it's going to be an intelligence box

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it's going to box us into a place

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and we're not going to be able to go further

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and we need to go further toward the outside

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which we're going to talk about too

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as a place of possibility

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and darkness

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a place beyond language

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but a place that also is going to be an ultimate refuge from a lot of the traps that we're going

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to find you mentioned the word cybernetics i didn't have that as a separate topic he kind of

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that's one of the words he uses as presumed knowledge and cybernetics was this study i take

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it of like a feedback system so cybernetics is the way that a system maintains itself in stability

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like imagine a stable system all of the flows within that system that regulate each other so

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the system stays the same or there's two ways that a system breaks down he says it either becomes an

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explosion or a trap the cybernetic system either has some sort of reinforcement feedback mechanism

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that causes it to accelerate out of control or it gets caught in a sort of stagnant stability and

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degenerates. Key to this is that it's positive feedback, right? Because I think he makes the

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distinction that there's a difference between negative and positive feedback and that cybernetics

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is a positive feedback system. And that I feel like I read, and maybe I'm imagining it, but I

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feel like I read this in one of the blogs that was like cybernetics specifically deals with

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positive feedback, which is basically that you are basically like you do something and you get

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an empirical result. And that result is either, oh, this is good. I do more of it, or this is bad.

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I do something else. And so the only outcome is positive. Either you move further in the

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direction that you want to go, or you start moving in the direction that you want to go,

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because the thing that you were doing was moving you in a different direction.

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And so I don't really know. I was kind of hoping you could explain that to me.

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Let's just jump in with the first concept, because it is a,

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I think cybernetic dynamic. And again, if you characterize these things as positive or negative,

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you're already building in a value judgment. And I think that's one of the things that land

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philosophy does is a lot of the reason why people will say that land is nihilist is because

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they think that there's an endorsement in certain parts of it rather than simply a description of

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reality. I think what land is doing a lot of times is using a very kind of brilliant and

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distinctive prose style to describe reality in a new sort of way to make it apparent because

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reality is always everywhere about us we become inured to it it becomes invisible

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if you don't re-describe it in a way that makes it salient then it just it it fades into the

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background and i think a lot of what he's doing is just describing dynamics in a way that that

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makes them notable to us again that reality is incredibly strange what's going on is incredibly

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strange if we tend to reality as it is the dynamics and don't turn away from certain kind

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of fearful truths then you're going to see things operating at a level that may be concerning some

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will call it nihilist again others are simply going to call it like looking reality straight

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in the jaws but so this first one of the first concepts we get is the degenerative ratchet

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and so what's a ratchet ratchet is a tool that gives you leverage to uh turn something i guess

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To like tighten or loosen.

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Yeah.

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But the nature of a ratchet, though, is it clicks easily in one direction.

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You turn a ratchet.

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It only goes one direction.

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It only goes one direction.

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You try to flip it.

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It's like it catches then.

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Each time you move forward, it's a click.

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You try to move it back.

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It doesn't go further.

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But it moves easily forward to the next click.

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And so a degenerative ratchet then, so reversal becomes impossible.

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It's going to be the state through democratic institutions becomes a degenerative ratchet in which you only have the growth of the state.

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state. You can always move forward easily to another click in the growth of Leviathan. You

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can never move backwards. Things like the expansive franchise. Once you extend the vote, you can't

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then rescind the vote to a new population. They're going to keep on voting. If we move the vote down

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to the 16-year-olds have it, it would be tough to then disenfranchise 16-year-olds. Whether it was

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good or bad to enfranchise them in the first place, you know, that's beside the point. It's just a

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ratchet. It moves forward easily, but doesn't move backwards. The welfare state is that same

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way. You extend an entitlement, it becomes very difficult to resend an entitlement. People expect

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it becomes the thing that if you take away an entitlement, it's to a like, you cruel,

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incompassionate person, what are you doing taking away this thing that we're owed?

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Yeah, there's nothing more temporary, nothing more permanent than a temporary government program.

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Exactly. It's a degenerative ratchet. Makes backward movement impossible. Keep going forward

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until the system breaks.

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That's maybe that cybernetic explosion,

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that dynamic of a feedback

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where you always can easily go in one direction,

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you can't go backwards.

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Progressivism, then, writ large,

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is a degenerative ratchet.

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Democratization, again, once you democratize,

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you can't go back.

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Welfare systems, immigration.

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Once you have a bunch of mass immigration,

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it becomes, as we're seeing,

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very difficult politically, socially,

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to then deport a bunch of people.

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You can't go backward. You can only slow immigration flows or maybe stop them periodically.

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You can never really go backwards once you've had an explosive immigration flow.

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It's a degenerative ratchet.

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One that Bitcoiners will be familiar with, macroeconomic politicized money to, quote, land.

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Easing is easy. Tightening is terrifying.

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Rollback unattempted since Jackson in the mid-19th century.

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So quantitative easing is easy. Everybody loves the new money.

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tightening the periods of austerity. Nobody wants that, right? And so all neoreactionary

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problems are going to go back in a sense to this degenerative ratchet. It is the problem where

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progressivism is the easiest thing to do in the world through increased immigration flows,

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increased entitlement programs, increased and more loose democratization, increase of the money

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supply. All these things are very easy to do, but to try to pull that ratchet backwards,

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you can't do it yeah so that's the first concept it's going to be at the core of a lot of this

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the negative or just the way that neoreaction is looking at the world it's going to look at a lot

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of systems as degenerative ratchets degenerative ratchets okay so basically you start moving in a

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direction you can never go back if that yeah that direction um being the progressive expansion

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of the state yeah so this again like all of this is a dialogue that nick land is having with other

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blogs at the time about new reaction it's fun because there's not a lot of like political

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philosophy maybe is something that happens in the ivory halls of academia or it's something that

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happened in the distant past. We read like Thomas Hobbes and John Locke and about our forefathers

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in the Federalist paper having these dialogues. The cool thing about ZenoSystems is this was a

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public dialogue happening about political philosophy. Anybody could contribute and help

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in developing this idea. It's kind of similar to when we read one of the Natalie Smolenski's

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essay on the

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towards an anthropological theory of money.

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She has that Twitter exchange

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between David Graeber and

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Nick Szabo

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and some others. And we saw the same

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thing, you know, due to the

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decentralized nature of our communication

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systems now, public

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philosophizing happens in

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public. You know, this thinking happens in public.

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Anybody can contribute and it becomes

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a record of accumulated

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thought. And in real time.

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In real time.

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You don't have to wait for somebody to publish a book and stuff like that.

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Yeah, yeah, definitely.

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There's no peer review interposing itself between what is said.

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Someone has a thought and they say it.

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There's no intermediating institution.

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So the next idea then is the trichotomy.

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This is really cool because so we're going to I haven't just given a neat definition of what new reaction is.

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We're not going to give a neat definition throughout XenoSystems.

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a system was we're going to get again land is thinking in public at this time trying to build

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up what is neo reaction it's like you have a name for an idea you have an idea but you don't yet know

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the parameters or boundaries of your idea and as he's talking he's kind of the way i see it

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you know it reflecting on this reading his blog entries is he has kind of the intellectual

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discipline to see from a distance even the debate that's happening in the moment to begin to

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categorize it and to say, okay, we have this school of thought within Neo-Reaction saying

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this thing, we have this school of thought saying this other thing, what's the unifying

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thread, how do they stand in relation to each other?

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And so there were three dominant threads that he found.

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He calls it the trichotomy, three branches of Neo-Reaction.

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Religious traditionalist is the first one, ethnic nationalist is the second one, and

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then capitalist.

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So theonomists.

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Theonomists.

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Nazis and money grubbers.

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You can give negative appellations to all of them.

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Yeah.

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The theonomists, ethno-nationalists, and then techno-commercialists, which Land really counts himself in that third strand, techno-commercialists.

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As a techno-commercialist.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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One of the things that I think was interesting, you framed this really well, is that he's not, because he was doing this in real time, he doesn't just come out and say, this is what neoreactionary is.

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It's more like it's almost like we're watching somebody create a sculpture in front of us with a hammer and a chisel and chip away and go, I don't know what it is, but I know it's not this.

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And I know it's not this.

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And I know it's not this.

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And he's just moving around and really addressing all of these edge cases that pop up as the discussion takes place in real time.

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And seeing what's essential as you take away a chip from the sculpture, you've taken away something that's not essential and you've revealed something that you can't take away.

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Okay, now the face is emerging, the brow is here.

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That's essential to the sculpture.

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And one of the things that is essential in these three branches, every one of them is a form of spontaneous order.

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And every one of them also has a relationship to fate.

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It's a sort of deterministic, fatalistic strand or way of thinking.

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For example, theonomists, those that believe in God and have an order around God as the principle of operation, providence within that, that's a spontaneous ordering outside of your control.

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God's will, people can have this passivity to them.

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It's all unfolding according to God's will.

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It's also fatalist.

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No matter what happens, the truly religious person in most traditions is going to say, that's fine.

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The bigger picture is we're moving towards a future that I know is ordained by a principle of faith that I call providence, the will of God, something like that.

259
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For ethno-nationalists, that's genetics and heredity.

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Evolution, in a word, is like a way of spontaneously ordering.

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We start as disorganized matter and we become these organisms, humans, right?

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We've evolved through time, increasing order, derived simply through the operation of the laws of evolution, selection and fitness, these types of things have generated an order through a certain sort of providence or fate.

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There were like laws or rules that led to an outcome that nobody controlled.

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So you have a spontaneous order arising through evolution in the same way that the religious person says spontaneous order happens due to the will of God, something like that.

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And then third, technocommercialists. There's a word here that's kind of jargony, but catalaxy. And that's just the spontaneous order that happens from free market choices. Within a free market, you have spontaneous orders emerge. I mean, that's how free market systems organize.

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Nobody says the price of this good is going to be this certain price.

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That price is converged upon through all of these different free agents, free market actors, wheeling and dealing in the market.

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That's how corporations arise.

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That's how products are made.

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There is some design that happens, you know, by the corporation.

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But the larger market structure is just this thing of creative destruction where whole industries are destroyed.

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New ones arise outside of anyone's conscious choosing.

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And catalaxy is a more accurate term for what we commonly, where we commonly say economy, right? I think he makes that.

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We can say that, yeah.

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He says that, which is like economy is derived more from the idea of responsible household management or responsible economics is like derived from like this idea of responsible household management.

276
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Yeah.

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But catalaxy is truly what we're thinking of when we think of the economy or we think of like the global market or something like that.

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It is that – it's just a better word to use, I guess, for that.

279
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It's more descriptive of what's actually happening.

280
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Yeah, and more focusing on – when you think of an economy, you might – some people's idea might be that the government controls the economy.

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They minister it.

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And they set the price of goods.

283
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And if there wasn't for the government to structure it, nothing would happen or something like that.

284
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But Cadillacs is really the idea that that's not necessary, that, again, markets are self-ordering.

285
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And so the government needs to step aside to truly allow the flourishing of whatever is to come through the market, whatever is to arise because of it.

286
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The term techno-commercialism I think is interesting because – not because – but I heard Jack Mallers on an interview.

287
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when I was driving back here, I heard him say that humans are basically like tool makers who

288
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have figured out how to commercialize sunshine. Like, because everything, literally everything

289
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we have derived somehow of either an asteroid impacting, which is a very small, but everything

290
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else is like sun, sun derived, all of the, like, even like, you know, an animal is, is

291
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derived from the sun because without the sun, the animal wouldn't exist.

292
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It's really interesting, I think, to think like, again, this is just going back to how,

293
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how land is just, he's just so zoomed out.

294
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He's just so, like you say, he's, he's in one of the more, he's in the outside, outside

295
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circle of all these concentric circles, I guess.

296
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Yeah.

297
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Or maybe he's in the inside.

298
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No.

299
00:22:57,700 --> 00:23:06,300
So his Twitter handle at the time was called Outsideness and the Outside, capital O, we're going to talk about what that is.

300
00:23:06,380 --> 00:23:18,004
But it like it not just one of the concentric circles It once you get out of the circles and there are no circles it a place of I would say like chaos But it funny that you say the sun

301
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like everything dries from the sun. Is that what Mahler was saying?

302
00:23:21,604 --> 00:23:23,104
Yeah. Or sunlight.

303
00:23:23,104 --> 00:23:31,104
Sunlight. One of Land's earlier books was called The Thirst for Annihilation on Virulent Nihilism,

304
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something like that. It was a monograph on George Bataille, who's a philosopher,

305
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And his idea was that preceding the real economy or the economy that we have was the solar economy based on absolute excess.

306
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Like the sun is always splashing down on us, this energy which we can only use a fraction of, and that that's the true economy.

307
00:23:50,884 --> 00:23:58,724
So it's all of the, like, Land's intellectual genealogy is incredibly interesting.

308
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We're talking about Neoreaction.

309
00:24:00,484 --> 00:24:07,824
reaction, it's maybe coming out as if we're talking about like a right wing view. Wing is not

310
00:24:07,824 --> 00:24:13,424
the right word. You know, I don't think he rejected the phrase right accelerationism,

311
00:24:13,544 --> 00:24:20,744
which is what some people kind of situated it as. But again, right only to the extent that that

312
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is one of the ways you're going to capture a certain set of views that are about the description

313
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of reality rather than the subjugation of reality to our view of what reality should be,

314
00:24:33,084 --> 00:24:34,444
which is what progressivism is.

315
00:24:34,644 --> 00:24:40,364
It's like our belief of the way things should be predominates over the way that things are.

316
00:24:40,764 --> 00:24:41,664
We live in that fantasy.

317
00:24:41,664 --> 00:24:46,544
He talks about it as like imposing morals over intelligence, I think.

318
00:24:46,844 --> 00:24:47,504
Yeah, that type of thing.

319
00:24:47,664 --> 00:24:48,204
Yeah, for sure.

320
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Where it's like, you know, if we were to do the thing that is the smart thing or we would

321
00:24:55,864 --> 00:25:02,984
let just catalaxy have its way yeah um then we would just let it be but because we're moral

322
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and we have you know subjectively defined this is the fairness that we want fairness and that's

323
00:25:11,544 --> 00:25:17,444
like such a now you now you have to think about what that means yeah like fairness really the way

324
00:25:17,444 --> 00:25:26,624
that it's used is meant to, um, say redistribution. Like we're gonna, we're gonna take either

325
00:25:26,624 --> 00:25:35,524
resources or wealth or opportunity or, um, you know, something from someone who in the

326
00:25:35,524 --> 00:25:41,144
catalaxy, in the order that we have has reached it and we're going to take it and we're going to

327
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give it to somebody else. So we're going to make it harder for them to get it and easier for somebody

328
00:25:44,264 --> 00:25:49,644
else get it so um yeah that's uh it's really interesting because we we end up getting to this

329
00:25:49,644 --> 00:25:58,524
idea of how um the morals like all of this stuff is a break on capitalism which is this like

330
00:25:58,524 --> 00:26:09,424
alien system that is just marching towards this inevitable um inevitable place where it leaves

331
00:26:09,424 --> 00:26:19,264
humanity behind and becomes artificial, intelligent, robotic, autonomous capital, and we're pets.

332
00:26:19,624 --> 00:26:19,784
Yeah.

333
00:26:19,884 --> 00:26:20,404
Stuff like that.

334
00:26:20,484 --> 00:26:24,904
So, sorry, I apologize if I, like, walked over some of the things that you're going to talk about.

335
00:26:25,044 --> 00:26:25,064
No, no.

336
00:26:25,064 --> 00:26:28,844
I mean, it's a good summary of what we've already talked about.

337
00:26:28,844 --> 00:26:33,744
But, again, each of the three strands, the trichotomy of neoreaction, these three subcurrents

338
00:26:33,744 --> 00:26:36,164
within theonomy, ethno-nationalism,

339
00:26:36,284 --> 00:26:37,204
techno-commercialism,

340
00:26:37,644 --> 00:26:40,404
each built on an idea of fate or destiny.

341
00:26:41,124 --> 00:26:43,064
And underlying all of that is the idea

342
00:26:43,064 --> 00:26:45,344
that capital is autonomous

343
00:26:45,344 --> 00:26:46,724
and seeking its own expression,

344
00:26:46,724 --> 00:26:48,324
and we are a break on it,

345
00:26:48,384 --> 00:26:51,004
and we are a monkey that it is feeding

346
00:26:51,004 --> 00:26:53,204
to get us to do what it wants.

347
00:26:53,764 --> 00:26:54,524
To get, like,

348
00:26:55,044 --> 00:26:57,164
he has a whole essay called Monkey Business

349
00:26:57,164 --> 00:26:58,784
that talks about this that we'll get to,

350
00:26:58,864 --> 00:27:00,544
but the idea is that, you know,

351
00:27:00,744 --> 00:27:02,764
capital is some sort of thing

352
00:27:02,764 --> 00:27:06,624
that we don't truly understand a dynamic all its own,

353
00:27:06,624 --> 00:27:09,324
and it's giving the monkeys a banana so that we'll build it.

354
00:27:10,084 --> 00:27:10,484
Yeah.

355
00:27:10,624 --> 00:27:11,284
I mean, that's, yeah.

356
00:27:11,744 --> 00:27:14,184
Yeah, capitalism, it's fascinating the way you talk.

357
00:27:14,264 --> 00:27:20,644
Like, I've never heard of the term capital be described the way he is

358
00:27:20,644 --> 00:27:22,544
because he's not talking about it as a term.

359
00:27:22,984 --> 00:27:27,804
He's like, we think of capital as like, oh, it's a bank account

360
00:27:27,804 --> 00:27:31,484
or it's a building or, you know, something like that.

361
00:27:31,484 --> 00:27:40,664
And he's like, no, no, no, like capital, like you say, it's this it's it's its own like intelligence that is that is seeking expression.

362
00:27:41,284 --> 00:27:53,564
And all of the things that we are doing as humanity, where we are imposing our morals is that we are just slowing capitalism from reaching its expression.

363
00:27:53,564 --> 00:28:00,544
Slowing, but also unnecessary bootstrap, like the monkeys were needed to birth the thing that goes beyond the monkeys.

364
00:28:00,544 --> 00:28:24,684
Yeah. So we talked about neoreaction as a critique of democracy. And so let's pull that together here. Democracy is supposedly like a positive feedback mechanism where the populace observes the government functioning and then evaluates them and say, I like the way that this administration is working.

365
00:28:24,684 --> 00:28:37,724
They're efficiently doing things. They're getting done what needs to be done. And so then people render a vote on the system as it is to either say, keep going, guys, you're doing great, or to pull back and get new leaders.

366
00:28:37,804 --> 00:28:45,924
So that's like the positive vision of democracy, where people evaluate the results of the administration and then say yay or nay to readjust the system as needed.

367
00:28:45,924 --> 00:29:00,504
But Land's point is that the feedback mechanism is corrupted. Instead of measuring public opinion, it modifies or creates that which it seeks to measure. That's how democracy actually functions.

368
00:29:00,504 --> 00:29:07,844
once you begin once you design a system to achieve a result you begin then to corrupt it so that the

369
00:29:07,844 --> 00:29:15,524
result um the system doesn't it's kind of like if you have a thermostat that's trying to measure

370
00:29:15,524 --> 00:29:21,724
how warm the environment is but instead of um actually measuring it it just becomes it just

371
00:29:21,724 --> 00:29:28,364
perverts or corrupts that it begins to convince you that it's warm or it's cold instead of actually

372
00:29:28,364 --> 00:29:34,024
measuring what it is it like just the number changes but the temperature doesn't yeah kind

373
00:29:34,024 --> 00:29:39,324
of thing it ceases to be it ceases to be a reality sensor and becomes a reality creator yeah it

374
00:29:39,324 --> 00:29:46,644
becomes within democracy um public opinion is a reality that is formed and managed not something

375
00:29:46,644 --> 00:29:54,224
that is measured yeah yeah he talks about how the word propaganda was taken um and just changed to

376
00:29:54,224 --> 00:30:01,424
public relations and that like we think of propaganda as oh that's something other people

377
00:30:01,424 --> 00:30:07,824
do or like now i think we kind of like recognize that it's actively happening within within our

378
00:30:07,824 --> 00:30:15,084
sphere but everybody's also so into their own corner that they believe most times they believe

379
00:30:15,084 --> 00:30:21,104
their propaganda over the other side's propaganda and then if you can take the time to move into the

380
00:30:21,104 --> 00:30:25,664
middle you look to both and you're like this is absolutely ridiculous but he like so democracy

381
00:30:25,664 --> 00:30:34,324
it's doomed to fail because it matures by distancing itself from feedback as it continues

382
00:30:34,324 --> 00:30:40,944
to refine its ability to do public relations or do propaganda so the to create the feedback it

383
00:30:40,944 --> 00:30:46,364
wants yeah the party that achieves success is the one that most effectively tells the people

384
00:30:46,364 --> 00:30:51,804
it is doing their wishes after defining for them the wishes it wants done.

385
00:30:52,604 --> 00:30:53,804
And there was another.

386
00:30:54,144 --> 00:30:58,784
Land says, if you want the government to listen to you, then you have to expect to tell you what to say.

387
00:30:59,044 --> 00:31:02,184
That's it. Yeah, that's exactly. Yeah. That was the one that I was going to find.

388
00:31:02,584 --> 00:31:07,004
If you want the government to listen to you, then you have to expect it to tell you what to say.

389
00:31:07,004 --> 00:31:07,424
Yeah.

390
00:31:07,624 --> 00:31:15,164
That's like. And so so this is where, you know, again, just reading this book, I had so many times where I just stopped.

391
00:31:15,164 --> 00:31:34,524
And I was like, I want to keep reading because I wanted to get through it. But then I was like, I have to think about this for a while because this is the point where he's starting to help us understand that democracy and communism, socialism, like they are not two sides.

392
00:31:34,524 --> 00:31:35,804
They're not different.

393
00:31:36,164 --> 00:31:40,464
They are just different on the spectrum.

394
00:31:41,064 --> 00:31:48,624
They are, they're not, they're just kind of like different versions of each other.

395
00:31:48,884 --> 00:31:54,564
It's not like one or the other are, that they're completely separate.

396
00:31:54,564 --> 00:32:01,124
Like they're just breaks upon capitalism and they're ways of achieving those breaks in different ways.

397
00:32:01,484 --> 00:32:01,564
Yeah.

398
00:32:01,924 --> 00:32:02,204
Yeah.

399
00:32:02,384 --> 00:32:02,624
Yeah.

400
00:32:03,084 --> 00:32:03,364
Yep.

401
00:32:03,364 --> 00:32:07,744
democracy

402
00:32:07,744 --> 00:32:12,284
as you begin to

403
00:32:12,284 --> 00:32:14,764
so if you corrupt the feedback mechanism

404
00:32:14,764 --> 00:32:16,564
if you go from being a reality

405
00:32:16,564 --> 00:32:18,304
censor to a reality creator

406
00:32:18,304 --> 00:32:20,724
and it's not difficult to imagine

407
00:32:20,724 --> 00:32:21,724
why this happens right

408
00:32:21,724 --> 00:32:24,864
if in a democracy a party comes to power

409
00:32:24,864 --> 00:32:27,064
they see that their power

410
00:32:27,064 --> 00:32:28,924
depends on getting a positive vote

411
00:32:28,924 --> 00:32:30,924
in the polls so they have like two options

412
00:32:30,924 --> 00:32:32,444
they can do a really good job

413
00:32:32,444 --> 00:32:33,624
and get people to vote for them,

414
00:32:33,704 --> 00:32:35,684
or they can just make people think

415
00:32:35,684 --> 00:32:36,824
that they're doing a good job

416
00:32:36,824 --> 00:32:39,384
or define the result that they achieve,

417
00:32:39,464 --> 00:32:41,324
whatever it is, as a good job,

418
00:32:41,404 --> 00:32:42,564
create a new reality.

419
00:32:42,844 --> 00:32:44,344
So it's like the feedback mechanism,

420
00:32:44,524 --> 00:32:45,764
the sensor becomes the thing

421
00:32:45,764 --> 00:32:48,264
that creates the reality that it senses

422
00:32:48,264 --> 00:32:50,804
because it determines that's an easier thing to do

423
00:32:50,804 --> 00:32:53,464
than trying to actually do a good job

424
00:32:53,464 --> 00:32:56,004
is to create the perception of a good job

425
00:32:56,004 --> 00:32:57,564
to mold everybody's reality

426
00:32:57,564 --> 00:32:58,304
so that they're like,

427
00:32:58,384 --> 00:32:59,844
this is how things should be.

428
00:32:59,924 --> 00:33:00,604
I feel good.

429
00:33:00,664 --> 00:33:01,224
I feel good.

430
00:33:01,224 --> 00:33:06,464
I, you know, I'm going to be a renter in my house and tell them in my 60s I'm not going to have a family.

431
00:33:06,664 --> 00:33:10,044
But things seem pretty good because they're telling me things seem pretty good.

432
00:33:10,044 --> 00:33:15,024
I'm going to eat poison food and I'm going to wear poison clothing and I'm not going to go into the sun.

433
00:33:15,184 --> 00:33:17,824
And I'm going to. Yeah. There's another one.

434
00:33:18,164 --> 00:33:25,364
Democracy is thus, strictly speaking, a production of collective insanity or disassociation from reality.

435
00:33:25,364 --> 00:33:38,484
And this is another where some people are going to, you could, if you came into this with like emotions, you could like get upset at this or take offense to this or whatever.

436
00:33:38,604 --> 00:33:51,424
But what Land is trying to do is he's trying to say, this is actually like, you know, like I hand you a plate and I tell you that it's a plate, but you don't speak my language.

437
00:33:51,424 --> 00:34:05,924
And so I have to describe what that thing does. And so he is, even though we speak the same language, he is describing to us what democracy does because we don't understand it.

438
00:34:05,924 --> 00:34:14,064
Like what democracy really does is it doesn't take the will of the people and put it into power and create this representative government.

439
00:34:14,064 --> 00:34:24,244
What it takes is it takes this giving of power to people who then trade resources for popularity.

440
00:34:25,124 --> 00:34:27,144
They then trade wealth for popularity.

441
00:34:27,284 --> 00:34:31,204
Oftentimes, most of the time they trade other people's wealth for popularity.

442
00:34:31,484 --> 00:34:31,604
Right.

443
00:34:31,884 --> 00:34:32,184
Yeah.

444
00:34:32,504 --> 00:34:32,724
Yeah.

445
00:34:32,724 --> 00:35:01,544
Yeah, there's a really good documentary called Century of the Self by the name escapes me right now. It's free on Twitter. It's about Edward Bernays and the rise after World War II of public relations as a field of study, a science, a practice, whatever. And it's all about that, about how opinion is consensus is manufactured and how the reality, again, that the system says that it's trying to measure something it's actually creating.

446
00:35:01,544 --> 00:35:05,644
Yeah, Edward Bernays is the reason why women smoke Virginia Slims.

447
00:35:05,684 --> 00:35:06,504
Freedom torches.

448
00:35:06,644 --> 00:35:08,164
And freedom, yeah, torches of freedom.

449
00:35:08,204 --> 00:35:09,084
Torches of freedom, yeah.

450
00:35:09,104 --> 00:35:12,564
And I can't remember what else, but yeah, I heard.

451
00:35:12,564 --> 00:35:14,644
So what are some of the consequences of this?

452
00:35:14,764 --> 00:35:16,904
So one is that quality of government suffers.

453
00:35:17,344 --> 00:35:23,544
To quote Land, lacking feedback from anything but its own experiments in mind control, quality of government collapses.

454
00:35:24,224 --> 00:35:27,404
Again, the government's not trying to measure if it's actually doing a good job.

455
00:35:27,424 --> 00:35:29,664
It's trying to convince everybody that it is.

456
00:35:29,664 --> 00:35:53,844
And so you have a degenerative ratchet that occurs. You have a degeneration of good politics and governance into bad. Also, culture is corrupted. Everything is now politicized. Everything is something that the government, if you want to stay in power in a democracy, you have to control public opinions. Everything is a parameter that needs to be controlled. Art becomes politicized. Culture becomes politicized.

457
00:35:53,844 --> 00:36:00,324
to quote land any thought is now dissent if it is not positively aligned with society's leading

458
00:36:00,324 --> 00:36:06,804
political direction to think outside the propaganda apparatus the cathedral we're going to talk about

459
00:36:06,804 --> 00:36:13,444
that next to think outside of that is to attack the government culture is then destroyed all

460
00:36:13,444 --> 00:36:18,464
thoughts have to be in line with how the government is defining reality their picture their definition

461
00:36:18,464 --> 00:36:22,684
of reality has to be complete and total if you have a thought that is different than that is

462
00:36:22,684 --> 00:36:25,524
inherently dissent and something that needs to be controlled and managed.

463
00:36:25,524 --> 00:36:34,824
This is something that I understand. I can feel it. But I was trying to, I was struggling to

464
00:36:34,824 --> 00:36:44,804
connect the dots between how government or democracy destroys culture. But I think you've

465
00:36:44,804 --> 00:36:49,644
done a good job of spelling it out, which is basically that, and we're getting into this with

466
00:36:49,644 --> 00:36:55,584
the cathedral where we're starting to kind of understand this as in almost like a religious

467
00:36:55,584 --> 00:37:04,764
type of sense and that anything that does not align with the religion yeah um is therefore

468
00:37:04,764 --> 00:37:15,124
sacrilege yeah and cannot be included and so um you know america used to be chevys and apple pie

469
00:37:15,124 --> 00:37:25,064
and baseball. And now those things I feel like are treated as part of like this nostalgic

470
00:37:25,064 --> 00:37:34,044
past that we are supposed to feel apologetic for in, in, in some way. Um, because, you know,

471
00:37:34,084 --> 00:37:40,904
during that time there were injustices, uh, that, that, uh, and so anytime that there's any sort of

472
00:37:40,904 --> 00:37:46,304
injustice that's going on. It like kind of like invalidates whatever was being believed in at that

473
00:37:46,304 --> 00:37:53,384
time. And so now the only thing that you can believe in is whatever is on the whatever here

474
00:37:53,384 --> 00:37:59,024
at the present. And because it is because it is part of that degenerative racket, ratchet. Yeah.

475
00:37:59,324 --> 00:38:05,424
It's a racket, too. For sure. You never get it back. So you can only move further in the direction

476
00:38:05,424 --> 00:38:11,304
of this religiosity, which means that more and more things, and now I'm starting to relate this

477
00:38:11,304 --> 00:38:16,684
to Marc Andreessen's definition of the woke agenda, which is that it just like hates its way

478
00:38:16,684 --> 00:38:25,244
out of existence. Like more and more things are disincluded because fewer and fewer things can

479
00:38:25,244 --> 00:38:31,444
be included. So I don't know if I'm getting that right. Yeah, but I definitely, and this quote,

480
00:38:31,444 --> 00:38:36,144
I have a quote here, in fact, that ties it all together about democracy as provided over by a state religion.

481
00:38:36,244 --> 00:38:44,104
But before I read it, though, I just want to say even that America of apple pies, though, I think that falls within the age of control of public opinion.

482
00:38:44,384 --> 00:38:46,544
That in itself is another picture.

483
00:38:46,904 --> 00:38:47,344
I would assume.

484
00:38:47,344 --> 00:38:54,484
Yeah, and the creation of the mass consumer as this thing we now needed to have in order to drive the economy after World War II.

485
00:38:54,604 --> 00:38:55,784
We needed people to consume.

486
00:38:56,064 --> 00:38:58,944
You have all of the engines of war shut down.

487
00:38:59,024 --> 00:39:01,004
You have all this excess productive capacity.

488
00:39:01,004 --> 00:39:04,664
We need to supply it to someone so we create the mass consumer.

489
00:39:05,564 --> 00:39:11,284
Everybody needs to have the house, the apple pies, and this picture of the car in the garage and everything.

490
00:39:11,804 --> 00:39:14,904
This quote, though, I think summarizes what we've been talking about very well.

491
00:39:15,444 --> 00:39:28,264
Democracy is a ratchet mechanism that successively distances the political realm from feedback sensitivity due to its character as a closed loop or state church sensitive only to a public opinion it has itself manufactured.

492
00:39:28,264 --> 00:39:29,824
Which we've been talking about.

493
00:39:29,824 --> 00:39:39,064
So, yeah, this up to this point, though, it's not to say that it's a critique of democracy, but it's not to say yet there's something better than democracy.

494
00:39:39,364 --> 00:39:43,744
Again, we're describing what land is doing in a lot of things is describing reality.

495
00:39:43,744 --> 00:39:48,224
It could be that this is the best thing we could have hoped for, too.

496
00:39:48,504 --> 00:39:48,804
The cleanest.

497
00:39:49,024 --> 00:39:53,484
And as we will say, like, democracy is the best system, except for every or what is it?

498
00:39:53,504 --> 00:39:54,264
It's the worst system.

499
00:39:54,524 --> 00:39:55,744
It's the worst system, except for all the other ones.

500
00:39:55,764 --> 00:39:56,564
Except for all the other ones.

501
00:39:56,564 --> 00:40:00,604
Or like the, I've heard the quote, like money is a terrible way to measure a man's worth.

502
00:40:00,704 --> 00:40:01,564
It's just better than all.

503
00:40:01,644 --> 00:40:02,764
It's the only one we have.

504
00:40:02,884 --> 00:40:03,084
Yeah.

505
00:40:03,184 --> 00:40:08,524
So this critique of democracy, if you feel like disgusted, if you've been, we've all

506
00:40:08,524 --> 00:40:10,804
been indoctrinated into the faith of democracy.

507
00:40:11,644 --> 00:40:16,704
I mean, take this critique as what it is, which is just a good faith description of one

508
00:40:16,704 --> 00:40:19,304
person's perception of how things have been operating.

509
00:40:19,764 --> 00:40:21,964
But I mentioned the cathedral, this state church.

510
00:40:21,964 --> 00:40:29,824
The cathedral is a term that land gets from Menchus Moldbug or Curtis Yarvin.

511
00:40:30,904 --> 00:40:46,584
And the idea is the cathedral is the opinion creation apparatus that is what is creating or manufacturing that reality within a democratic system so that the system is then measuring a reality that it creates.

512
00:40:46,584 --> 00:40:48,664
The cathedral is what creates that reality.

513
00:40:48,664 --> 00:41:01,044
It is the identification, as we've been talking about, of government governance with public relations. The political response to the crisis, the public perception of the crisis is now the crisis itself.

514
00:41:01,044 --> 00:41:30,624
If you've ever, you know, you get the sense sometimes that when something bad happens, the government is scrambling not to address the underlying causes, but to cover it up or to describe it to us in terms to misdirect our angst away from our anger away from the causes of it into something that they can control or that, you know, is going to re-describe the crisis in another way for those in power to keep and maintain their power.

515
00:41:30,624 --> 00:41:48,144
The crisis is not the crisis. The crisis is that people notice. And that's what they manage is that they manage that people are perceiving a crisis and the solution is not to resolve the crisis. The solution is to change the perception.

516
00:41:48,144 --> 00:42:17,104
How dare you notice? Exactly. That type of thing, too. And even sometimes it's in as vulgar as that, like political correctness is a way to, oh, you're using the wrong terms to talk about something. You're noticing a dynamic that makes you a racist, a sexist, a bigot or an anti-democratic fascist. If you just describe a critique of democracy and you become a fascist, right? You can close down the whole debate through the public relations of calling something by a bad name.

517
00:42:17,104 --> 00:42:24,084
It's Walter in The Big Lebowski. You're not wrong. You're just an asshole. It's like, hold on. The important part here is that you're not wrong.

518
00:42:24,084 --> 00:42:44,624
Yeah. So it's called the cathedral because it is the state church promoting the state religion, the state faith, which is democracy in the West, which is certain progressive values. It operates primarily through the media. We've all seen the way that mainstream media operates. That's not a critique that needs to be elaborated, I don't think.

519
00:42:44,624 --> 00:42:51,284
academia the way that and even just education more broadly speaking the way that it is designed

520
00:42:51,284 --> 00:42:56,404
to inculcate people in the state faith i mean we even talk about it nakedly as such a civic

521
00:42:56,404 --> 00:43:01,244
education right we want people to believe and feel certain things so we design our curricula

522
00:43:01,244 --> 00:43:06,904
to make them have certain faith principles held as unquestionable because why else would you die

523
00:43:06,904 --> 00:43:15,064
for the country yeah why else would you fight for it yeah yeah um so i already mentioned this

524
00:43:15,064 --> 00:43:19,664
the cathedral works in part through things like political correctness fascist and racist race

525
00:43:19,664 --> 00:43:25,484
fascist and racist then become terms designated as kind of path blockers to get people from going

526
00:43:25,484 --> 00:43:30,564
down a certain following a certain light of inquiry developing certain notions or policies

527
00:43:30,564 --> 00:43:31,644
How dare you notice.

528
00:43:31,824 --> 00:43:50,664
Yeah, they mark, Land puts it, they mark unthinkable wastes. They're invocations of the sacred in its negative or limiting sense. I thought that was an interesting even reflection on the sacred. When you call something sacred, you're also saying you can't do certain things in relation to it, that it's heresy or sacrilege, right?

529
00:43:51,104 --> 00:43:51,324
Yeah.

530
00:43:51,324 --> 00:44:00,104
And so if you define something as sacred, then it becomes something that you can't do certain things in relation to without being burnt at the stake.

531
00:44:00,564 --> 00:44:03,224
Yeah. Yeah. Because it would be sacrilege.

532
00:44:03,524 --> 00:44:03,724
Yes.

533
00:44:04,304 --> 00:44:17,664
I want to read the cathedral is an information system, even an intelligence system, that is characterized through supreme irony by a structural inability to learn.

534
00:44:18,464 --> 00:44:20,764
So that's what the cathedral is.

535
00:44:20,864 --> 00:44:23,324
It's an information system that cannot learn.

536
00:44:23,324 --> 00:44:31,504
The minimal requirement is that it displays a radical deficiency of significant feedback links to the control core.

537
00:44:32,184 --> 00:44:40,184
Every apparatus of information gathering occupies a strictly subordinate position relative to the cathedral layer.

538
00:44:41,304 --> 00:44:44,884
The cathedral is a structure of read-only memory.

539
00:44:45,164 --> 00:44:47,044
It is essentially write-protected.

540
00:44:47,304 --> 00:44:52,684
The whole of its power and also its vulnerability is inextricable from this feature.

541
00:44:52,684 --> 00:44:57,124
It is pure cultural genetics and zero pragmatics.

542
00:44:57,204 --> 00:44:58,924
I just thought that was a cool.

543
00:44:58,944 --> 00:44:59,764
Read that last part again.

544
00:44:59,964 --> 00:45:16,444
The last line is, or the last two, the whole of its power and also its vulnerability is inextricable from its feature, the feature of being right protected, that it's read only, that you cannot put new ideas into it, that it does not take feedback.

545
00:45:17,344 --> 00:45:21,044
And the last line is, it is pure cultural genetics.

546
00:45:21,224 --> 00:45:21,404
Yeah.

547
00:45:21,404 --> 00:45:23,504
And zero pragmatics.

548
00:45:23,504 --> 00:45:36,564
Right. And so, like, again, that's what this all boils down to for me. Zero pragmatics, zero focus on the reality of the situation and all focus on culture, something that humans can create, ideology, religion, all these things.

549
00:45:36,564 --> 00:45:54,964
We focus on what we can control and mold instead of the thing that we're terrified of, which is reality itself, which is imbued with certain principles of spontaneous generation of orders that might not be amenable to what we want or what certain people in power may want.

550
00:45:54,964 --> 00:46:08,904
For example, like, again, the trichotomy, you have principles either of providence, genetics, and evolution, or Cadillac. So you have these generative principles which are going to pragmatically cause a reality.

551
00:46:08,904 --> 00:46:31,747
And so the only thing that the cathedral can do is scramble and work with kind of the medium it has which is the generation of culture to shame us out of certain outcomes or by certain mental control just like make us unable to perceive them as such

552
00:46:31,807 --> 00:46:32,167
I guess.

553
00:46:32,407 --> 00:46:34,987
To put them just completely off limits where you just like,

554
00:46:35,647 --> 00:46:38,947
it knows that these are the things that will kill it.

555
00:46:38,947 --> 00:46:43,327
And therefore it precludes you from accessing them.

556
00:46:43,627 --> 00:46:48,967
You can't talk about one race being more intelligent than the other,

557
00:46:48,967 --> 00:46:53,487
even though it's like that's measurable.

558
00:46:54,247 --> 00:46:57,527
Like, and we also like we have no problem like,

559
00:46:57,647 --> 00:47:00,967
oh, this one race is more, this one race is taller.

560
00:47:01,107 --> 00:47:02,387
This one race has bigger penises.

561
00:47:02,567 --> 00:47:04,047
This one race is better athletes.

562
00:47:04,247 --> 00:47:05,407
And so, but it's like you just,

563
00:47:05,547 --> 00:47:06,687
there's one thing you can't apply.

564
00:47:06,687 --> 00:47:11,687
And so like that thing or like the, you know,

565
00:47:11,767 --> 00:47:17,347
the idea that one religion may be better than the others

566
00:47:17,347 --> 00:47:19,027
or that maybe no religion is better.

567
00:47:19,307 --> 00:47:20,247
And it's not even like better.

568
00:47:20,347 --> 00:47:23,267
It's just like more suited to certain outcomes.

569
00:47:23,587 --> 00:47:25,467
For example, some religions are going to be,

570
00:47:25,847 --> 00:47:28,647
have different relationships to science, for example.

571
00:47:28,867 --> 00:47:30,747
Like maybe it might be the case

572
00:47:30,747 --> 00:47:32,627
that we have our modern notion of science

573
00:47:32,627 --> 00:47:34,867
due to certain cultural or religious traits

574
00:47:34,867 --> 00:47:38,127
that allowed a relationship to the truth

575
00:47:38,127 --> 00:47:41,327
to flourish in a certain geographic place at a certain time

576
00:47:41,327 --> 00:47:43,127
and then generates modern science.

577
00:47:43,807 --> 00:47:43,867
Yeah.

578
00:47:44,307 --> 00:47:45,827
We're in a plane going down

579
00:47:45,827 --> 00:47:50,107
and there are parachutes that we're not allowed to access.

580
00:47:50,327 --> 00:47:51,687
And the reason we're not allowed to access,

581
00:47:51,867 --> 00:47:53,047
and he talks about this,

582
00:47:53,087 --> 00:47:56,607
is that the only way to escape this is through exit.

583
00:47:57,087 --> 00:48:00,587
That voice doesn't work because of the degenerative.

584
00:48:00,747 --> 00:48:00,887
Yeah.

585
00:48:01,187 --> 00:48:04,087
And, you know, and Lucas, you mentioned race.

586
00:48:04,227 --> 00:48:05,767
As soon as you begin to talk about that,

587
00:48:06,047 --> 00:48:09,207
you know, you begin, like, the word racist is the path blocker.

588
00:48:09,427 --> 00:48:10,327
When we say race,

589
00:48:10,347 --> 00:48:12,947
if we say certain races tend to have certain characteristics,

590
00:48:12,947 --> 00:48:14,947
again, this is over like a bell curve distribution.

591
00:48:14,947 --> 00:48:19,587
distribution. It's not to say one person, if you are of this race, you are therefore smarter than

592
00:48:19,587 --> 00:48:25,007
everybody of another race. It's to say, no, maybe we can, again, over a bell curve distribution

593
00:48:25,007 --> 00:48:29,327
measure that certain have like a standard deviation or whatever, you know. And it's not

594
00:48:29,327 --> 00:48:33,747
something like, I mean, of course, now we have to qualify, but it's like, it's not something I

595
00:48:33,747 --> 00:48:38,787
believe. Like, I truly believe that we all came from probably the first two people. And so we're

596
00:48:38,787 --> 00:48:45,567
all related we're all from the same cloth and so even though there are differences it's it's like

597
00:48:45,567 --> 00:48:50,087
environmental yeah you know it's environmental and cultural differences has nothing to do with

598
00:48:50,087 --> 00:48:54,947
your genes and in fact it's just environment you know it's like these these places have valued

599
00:48:54,947 --> 00:49:01,267
things differently we're all bony fish in land's terms he talks about this in cladistics where

600
00:49:01,267 --> 00:49:05,927
evolution proceeds like you have a trunk and then it branches out you can also trace us all back to

601
00:49:05,927 --> 00:49:12,567
that same trunk yeah and we're all still holding within us our evolutionary heritage we're all we

602
00:49:12,567 --> 00:49:18,647
all came from bony fish ugly bags of water i heard humans described as today bags of water yeah i like

603
00:49:18,647 --> 00:49:26,487
that um so the cathedral then is about deceit which is something that we saw in samson's book

604
00:49:26,487 --> 00:49:32,487
our tribal future and also in soft war the humans really aren't evolved to deal with deceit um

605
00:49:32,487 --> 00:49:51,107
There's one of the problems guiding, one of the things guiding human evolution was the problem of who we can trust, that once we get beyond our family, out to friends, and then out to tribes, we have to find ways to trust people who have reason to deceive us and manipulate us.

606
00:49:51,107 --> 00:49:56,347
And so we're really not built for the society where we live in, where we can simply be lied to.

607
00:49:56,347 --> 00:50:08,347
To quote, land, there is no precedent for an intolerant, precisely coded system of belief trending to a totalitarian form while presenting itself as inevitable progress towards general disillusionment.

608
00:50:08,347 --> 00:50:14,907
disillusionment this cathedral the state religion it's not something that we evolved to imagine to

609
00:50:14,907 --> 00:50:21,047
like be able to resist right that there could be something that we are downstream of as far as

610
00:50:21,047 --> 00:50:27,227
eating the culture that it creates in living within the kind of the reality that it generates

611
00:50:27,227 --> 00:50:34,747
what it does is it divorces getting what you want from the feeling of getting what you want

612
00:50:34,747 --> 00:50:40,907
so if you can create the feeling create in people the feeling that they got what they want then they

613
00:50:40,907 --> 00:50:45,627
don't actually have to get what they want and the analogy or the he uses the phrase wireheading

614
00:50:45,627 --> 00:50:51,347
wireheading is this philosophical experiment that it's like being in the matrix if you can put a

615
00:50:51,347 --> 00:50:56,487
wire into someone's head and generate all the sensations they would have um you can just give

616
00:50:56,487 --> 00:51:00,747
them the sensation that they want without giving them the thing you don't have to be eating a real

617
00:51:00,747 --> 00:51:05,647
delicious steak, you can just wire head into somebody the sensation that they're eating

618
00:51:05,647 --> 00:51:06,647
the delicious steak.

619
00:51:06,727 --> 00:51:09,447
And that's kind of what the cathedral does as a form of mind control.

620
00:51:09,527 --> 00:51:13,547
It wire heads into you the perception that you're getting what you want.

621
00:51:13,627 --> 00:51:16,727
It's that the deceit is that kind of essential and foundational.

622
00:51:17,527 --> 00:51:21,787
And he, I mean, to bring this back to Bitcoin realm to something we understand from that

623
00:51:21,787 --> 00:51:28,967
perspective, he, the, one of the initial points of this was the demetalization of money, a

624
00:51:28,967 --> 00:51:33,827
pure signal of wealth entirely disconnected from the extravagance of physical reality.

625
00:51:33,827 --> 00:51:38,867
Once you can remove the underlying gold that backs something, then you can just have pure

626
00:51:38,867 --> 00:51:39,767
signal of wealth.

627
00:51:40,087 --> 00:51:41,107
Which can be wireheaded wealth.

628
00:51:41,207 --> 00:51:42,267
We can be wireheaded wealth.

629
00:51:42,407 --> 00:51:43,547
Like that's what fiat is.

630
00:51:43,667 --> 00:51:49,047
It wireheads into us credit, like credit expansion, wireheads into us the feeling that we're getting

631
00:51:49,047 --> 00:51:55,127
wealthier without the underlying reality that we're actually generating, you know, underlying

632
00:51:55,127 --> 00:51:56,587
productivity or something like that.

633
00:51:56,587 --> 00:52:08,467
So, yeah, Keynesianism or Keynesianism, however you pronounce it, in its essence is wirehead economics, to quote Land, focusing on the policy question, how do we best deliver the stim?

634
00:52:09,387 --> 00:52:10,727
Best the stimulation.

635
00:52:10,927 --> 00:52:11,327
The stim.

636
00:52:11,427 --> 00:52:16,707
He says the stim, but like stimulus and that's like also the stim is you imagine it kind of as like a stimulant.

637
00:52:16,887 --> 00:52:17,047
Yeah.

638
00:52:17,207 --> 00:52:19,207
That's kind of how Keynesians think, right?

639
00:52:19,307 --> 00:52:19,507
Okay.

640
00:52:19,507 --> 00:52:19,947
Yeah.

641
00:52:20,027 --> 00:52:20,827
So then you mentioned this.

642
00:52:20,907 --> 00:52:23,007
The next point then, exit over voice.

643
00:52:23,007 --> 00:52:30,587
so public opinion we've seen the democracy utilizes the cathedral to manage and create

644
00:52:30,587 --> 00:52:39,067
a reality rather than to respond to reality as it is public opinion in this way doesn't provide

645
00:52:39,067 --> 00:52:44,727
feedback in a democracy because it is modifiable exit then is what matters if we imagine that

646
00:52:44,727 --> 00:52:50,067
there's exit voice and loyalty i think this is the framework of albert hirschman at least as

647
00:52:50,067 --> 00:52:53,967
describe a Bology. I was going to say, I only know it from Bology. And I was going to ask you.

648
00:52:53,967 --> 00:52:59,807
So to say, and I say, I think it's exit voice and loyalty is the Hirschman framework. It might

649
00:52:59,807 --> 00:53:03,787
have been, he might've had a more, he certainly did a more complex framework. But since then,

650
00:53:03,807 --> 00:53:09,927
I think it's kind of been bastardized down into one of those within a political system,

651
00:53:10,127 --> 00:53:15,487
you can either exercise voice. You can like speak up and try to change things.

652
00:53:15,667 --> 00:53:18,927
You can exercise loyalty. You can just be loyal to the system regardless,

653
00:53:18,927 --> 00:53:22,307
or you can exercise exit and just leave the system.

654
00:53:22,787 --> 00:53:26,367
And so Neo reaction is about exit over voice.

655
00:53:27,187 --> 00:53:29,467
And Land doesn't mention loyalty,

656
00:53:29,667 --> 00:53:31,827
but I think that actually the framework works better

657
00:53:31,827 --> 00:53:33,667
if you say exit voice or loyalty.

658
00:53:33,967 --> 00:53:35,607
Because sometimes people do say,

659
00:53:35,747 --> 00:53:37,967
I know my voice doesn't matter.

660
00:53:38,167 --> 00:53:39,407
I'm not going to leave though.

661
00:53:39,567 --> 00:53:43,147
I have a sense of patriotism or a sense of fealty.

662
00:53:43,527 --> 00:53:45,347
And this can be a very pure sentiment too.

663
00:53:45,427 --> 00:53:46,847
I don't discount this as bad

664
00:53:46,847 --> 00:53:48,907
because I feel this way about like where I'm from.

665
00:53:48,927 --> 00:53:54,967
Yeah, you would feel that way, but you don't know that you would feel that way devoid of your civic programming, do you?

666
00:53:55,667 --> 00:53:57,267
No, and you can't ever consider—

667
00:53:57,267 --> 00:53:59,207
Like, there's not—it's not testable.

668
00:53:59,207 --> 00:54:03,067
I wouldn't even be a human without civic programming.

669
00:54:03,327 --> 00:54:03,567
Yeah.

670
00:54:03,567 --> 00:54:12,387
Like, the narratives that we're a part of constitute our world, and you're never going to have an absence of a narrative that you didn't choose.

671
00:54:12,387 --> 00:54:20,327
I mean, this is Alistair MacIntyre's, Nick Land and Alistair MacIntyre are kind of the two poles of philosophy that I really draw from.

672
00:54:22,287 --> 00:54:31,567
MacIntyre is more an explicit ethicist, and Nick Land just kind of goes around ethics to describe, more broadly speaking, how reality is and embraces the consequences.

673
00:54:32,007 --> 00:54:32,967
Coldness be my God.

674
00:54:33,087 --> 00:54:35,467
Like, he's just going to say, this is the way the world is.

675
00:54:35,507 --> 00:54:37,487
These are dynamics under which we operate.

676
00:54:37,487 --> 00:54:51,967
And so within that, so Alistair McIntyre, just to summarize his philosophy in a sentence, if you want to know what you should do in life, you need to ask yourself, what stories am I a part of?

677
00:54:51,967 --> 00:55:07,847
The stories always precede who we are, and we don't generate our own stories. We can participate in their authorship, but you always are in the world in media res. You always enter a system that was already there, and you have to operate within that.

678
00:55:07,847 --> 00:55:17,367
And I like loyalty, the notion of loyalty, because, you know, at a certain self-reflective level, you begin to look at your narratives and sort amongst them.

679
00:55:17,447 --> 00:55:21,147
And certain of them you have to decide are worthy of loyalty.

680
00:55:21,627 --> 00:55:27,567
Certain of your stories are stories you're like, I didn't choose to be a protagonist in this particular story.

681
00:55:27,847 --> 00:55:35,227
I didn't choose to be like maybe a son or, you know, these like familiar relations with these specific people.

682
00:55:35,227 --> 00:55:42,187
I didn't choose to have these coworkers or these people I grew up with who are now kind of people I know really well.

683
00:55:42,307 --> 00:55:45,307
But you still have to determine your relationship to your past.

684
00:55:45,967 --> 00:55:50,007
And loyalty, I think, is a response, a valid response that people can have.

685
00:55:50,167 --> 00:55:57,407
Or you can exit voice, try to change things, especially with thinking about political systems, that story, or exit and leave those things.

686
00:55:57,607 --> 00:56:00,247
But just to get back to your reaction then, exit over voice.

687
00:56:00,247 --> 00:56:10,567
the land is really dismissive of all activism and protest to quote land angry antagonism has

688
00:56:10,567 --> 00:56:18,087
no useful place on the largest scale evil is best punished by abandonment so again if the system is

689
00:56:18,087 --> 00:56:22,567
bad enough you don't try to engage with it because what you're engaging with is something that's

690
00:56:22,567 --> 00:56:27,687
creating opinion not listening it's not a feedback mechanism you can argue with and give your feedback

691
00:56:27,687 --> 00:56:32,567
too, it is telling you what feedback it wants. And if you don't give it that feedback, it doesn't

692
00:56:32,567 --> 00:56:36,567
matter to it. That's the way the cathedral operates. That's the way that democracy as a

693
00:56:36,567 --> 00:56:43,427
degenerative ratchet operates. It kind of makes the point that all activism, that like activism

694
00:56:43,427 --> 00:56:50,167
is only allowed if it's within the box of what the cathedral wants to hear. If it's a performance

695
00:56:50,167 --> 00:56:56,287
of the feedback that it wants. Yeah, absolutely. Activism is a form of dependence. It depends on

696
00:56:56,287 --> 00:57:00,727
sympathetic political toleration in order to exist and for change to occur.

697
00:57:00,927 --> 00:57:04,867
If you're thinking that your protest led to a political change, that's the change that

698
00:57:04,867 --> 00:57:09,587
was preordained, that the system already wanted, and the protest was allowed to blossom or

699
00:57:09,587 --> 00:57:10,087
created.

700
00:57:10,687 --> 00:57:15,227
Think about what happened after the summer of Floyd and the summer of love there, all

701
00:57:15,227 --> 00:57:17,827
those protests and the burning and the rioting and whatnot.

702
00:57:17,827 --> 00:57:24,587
That was allowed to happen because the cathedral wanted the result that that would lead to.

703
00:57:24,587 --> 00:57:39,787
Yeah. So the protest wasn't an organic thing. It was only organic in the sense that it was allowed to grow. People kind of set loose and, you know, we want the result this is going to lead to. So here's the theater. Now go act it out. Here's your script.

704
00:57:39,787 --> 00:57:53,667
Yeah, there's more than enough evidence, I think, to point to that that was not necessarily a, it was certainly not organic. Maybe it started organically, but the proliferation of it was definitely not.

705
00:57:53,667 --> 00:58:02,207
I have a friend who has video showing the riots in New York City.

706
00:58:02,887 --> 00:58:12,947
And he said, like, it was just so organized, like big box trucks driving up, guys in charge standing in the back.

707
00:58:13,967 --> 00:58:16,967
You know, like they brought the people there.

708
00:58:17,527 --> 00:58:20,867
And they had, like, certain stores that they would go to.

709
00:58:20,867 --> 00:58:24,927
Like, you know, it was just like it was not this utter chaos.

710
00:58:25,247 --> 00:58:28,987
And I'm sure that there were instances that it was.

711
00:58:29,127 --> 00:58:37,607
But, like, within that, there were either people driving it or they maybe were just opportunists that were really prepared.

712
00:58:38,227 --> 00:58:40,767
But that had, you know, they had a map and a game plan.

713
00:58:40,987 --> 00:58:41,207
Yeah.

714
00:58:41,327 --> 00:58:41,807
You know, so.

715
00:58:42,067 --> 00:58:42,187
Yeah.

716
00:58:42,267 --> 00:58:49,607
And it just doesn't even have, maybe it was that program that controlled, but it doesn't even have to be that controlled.

717
00:58:49,607 --> 00:59:00,827
It can just be that we know that people are going to act in a certain way, and so we're going to let them act in a certain way because we want this result that we know the way that they act is going to lead to.

718
00:59:01,447 --> 00:59:03,827
So exit, though, then is anti-dialectical.

719
00:59:03,987 --> 00:59:05,827
It is an option against argument.

720
00:59:05,987 --> 00:59:11,027
So if you can't argue with the cathedral, then what you have to do is leave.

721
00:59:11,127 --> 00:59:18,267
And so to quote Land, let's spatialize our disagreement is an alternative to resolution in time.

722
00:59:18,267 --> 00:59:36,367
If you can't solve an argument dialectically, then you spatialize your disagreement. One side goes to one place, the other side goes to another place, and then the disagreement then is embodied in reality as a thing existing and another thing existing instead of the two things trying to resolve themselves into a conclusion that they're never going to come to.

723
00:59:36,367 --> 01:00:06,347
Yeah. Yeah.

724
01:00:06,367 --> 01:00:22,367
And he – it helps like he gives this – like we think of progressivism. We think of this idea of progressivism as like, oh, this is the thing that makes things better. This is the thing that –

725
01:00:22,367 --> 01:00:23,087
Progress, right.

726
01:00:23,087 --> 01:00:41,367
It's progress. Yeah. Progressivism is escalators over stairs and stuff like that. But he defines it as progressivism is placing morals above intelligence, above intelligence, virtues over facts. It really emphasizes victimhood.

727
01:00:41,367 --> 01:00:54,587
And this is not a direct quote. This is something that I paraphrase. But guilt is like just guilt. Think about guilt. Guilt is basically like a white people thing.

728
01:00:54,587 --> 01:01:15,547
It's it. He kind of defined like the way that we think about this in terms of like victimhood. It's ethnomasochism. You know, like I hate myself. And the more I hate the more I hate myself, the better of a person I am. This Puritan cleansing of all of the sins of, you know, of my forefathers and stuff.

729
01:01:15,547 --> 01:01:41,467
But it was there because he brings up the Hajinal line west of the Hajinal. I think I'm saying that right. Hajinal line in Europe. That's where this progressivism came out of. And it was in that region that feudalism arose, feudal agriculture, manorial manor agriculture, where things are spread out and you had to take care of the other people around you.

730
01:01:41,467 --> 01:01:51,607
And so there's developed this like developed this like kind of like obligation to take care of other people that is not like it.

731
01:01:51,787 --> 01:01:58,347
It's great. We think it's great. We think it's a great thing to be like, oh, I feel obliged to help other people.

732
01:01:58,347 --> 01:02:11,307
But when you instantiate that into your government, that becomes it becomes victimhood and it becomes taking from one from one and giving to the other.

733
01:02:11,467 --> 01:02:18,087
Um, and, and it had all of these interesting, especially to like what, uh, David Sampson

734
01:02:18,087 --> 01:02:24,887
talked about, like, um, with like kind of the de-evolution of our culture is that people

735
01:02:24,887 --> 01:02:30,127
in these systems, they, they marry later, they had fewer kinship connections, they have

736
01:02:30,127 --> 01:02:34,987
fewer children, and they were more likely to have the, the nuclear family, which again

737
01:02:34,987 --> 01:02:40,187
is something that we, I think have been maybe programmed to think of as good.

738
01:02:40,187 --> 01:02:48,167
But the way Samson describes it is that nuclear is like it's too small to live.

739
01:02:48,347 --> 01:02:51,027
Like the nuclear family cannot live.

740
01:02:51,187 --> 01:02:53,247
You have to have, you know, your camp.

741
01:02:53,347 --> 01:03:00,987
You have to have your 17 people or whatever it is minimum in order to push about the world and move forward.

742
01:03:00,987 --> 01:03:01,247
Yeah.

743
01:03:01,567 --> 01:03:05,967
An interesting thing on that, what you're saying about the Hashnall line or whatever.

744
01:03:06,347 --> 01:03:08,287
There's a very funny essay in here.

745
01:03:08,287 --> 01:03:15,427
you know it's like with a lot of land um it's half tongue-in-cheek i think and half really

746
01:03:15,427 --> 01:03:21,727
trying to say something important and he kind of imagines critical whiteness studies he's like why

747
01:03:21,727 --> 01:03:26,887
they're so if you're scared of white nationalism just realize a white nationalism is a contradiction

748
01:03:26,887 --> 01:03:33,427
because white privilege is a white idea right yeah like that's ethnomasochism is an expression

749
01:03:33,427 --> 01:03:39,347
of whiteness in a sense like philosophically and he has he has a quote from alice and bailey who is a

750
01:03:39,347 --> 01:03:46,527
like a feminist leftist philosopher discussing how western philosophy is permeated by universalism

751
01:03:46,527 --> 01:03:52,667
and but that universalism is the kind of exactly the set the thing that generates

752
01:03:52,667 --> 01:03:58,407
like the the whiteness that she associates or the universalism that she associates with whiteness

753
01:03:58,407 --> 01:04:09,447
It's exactly the thing that generates white ethelmasochism, like white privilege, like the universalization of white guilt as this thing over the whole white race or whatever.

754
01:04:09,447 --> 01:04:17,227
So, like, white nationalism is a contradiction because it is whiteness that has led to the hatred of whiteness as a thing.

755
01:04:17,567 --> 01:04:18,587
Kind of this, like, weird.

756
01:04:19,447 --> 01:04:22,527
Hating white people is pretty much of an exclusively white thing.

757
01:04:22,587 --> 01:04:23,207
Yeah, exactly.

758
01:04:23,607 --> 01:04:23,767
Yeah.

759
01:04:23,967 --> 01:04:24,267
Yeah.

760
01:04:24,467 --> 01:04:24,667
Yeah.

761
01:04:25,047 --> 01:04:25,807
That's funny.

762
01:04:26,107 --> 01:04:26,407
Yeah.

763
01:04:26,787 --> 01:04:27,787
And not wrong.

764
01:04:27,787 --> 01:04:34,527
So, you know, we don't expect any other race to become self-hating in the way, you know, you have someone said, I forget who says this.

765
01:04:34,607 --> 01:04:36,067
You have like Chicano studies.

766
01:04:36,387 --> 01:04:36,987
What's that about?

767
01:04:37,127 --> 01:04:40,887
You know, like about the good things that the Hispanic people have done or black study.

768
01:04:41,007 --> 01:04:43,747
It's about the good things that black people have done or whatever.

769
01:04:44,207 --> 01:04:44,747
White studies.

770
01:04:44,887 --> 01:04:46,327
Is that all about slavery?

771
01:04:46,627 --> 01:04:47,647
All about slavery.

772
01:04:47,967 --> 01:04:48,867
Feeding wives.

773
01:04:49,067 --> 01:04:50,767
The list of things, the list of horrors that white people have done.

774
01:04:50,767 --> 01:04:51,447
Grabbing asses.

775
01:04:51,707 --> 01:04:52,587
Yeah, that type of thing.

776
01:04:52,707 --> 01:04:52,907
Yep.

777
01:04:53,247 --> 01:04:55,907
So basic tenets that have neo-reaction.

778
01:04:55,907 --> 01:04:57,647
This is kind of where we've got so far, I think.

779
01:04:57,787 --> 01:05:08,167
So first, democracy is unable to control government. It's not a feedback reading mechanism, but a feedback creating mechanism. It leads to degenerative ratchets.

780
01:05:09,367 --> 01:05:13,047
Egalitarianism is incompatible with liberty is another thing that he mentions.

781
01:05:13,267 --> 01:05:22,587
Define egalitarianism because I know it, but I know a lot of people don't. So basically, it's just like the opportunity for everybody to have the same result.

782
01:05:22,667 --> 01:05:24,447
It's just the belief that everybody's equal.

783
01:05:24,727 --> 01:05:24,807
Yeah.

784
01:05:24,807 --> 01:05:37,747
And so if you hear that, you're like, well, of course everybody's equal. I mean, obviously everybody's not equal. That's the most, if you can't just see that in reality, and there's in a sense nothing more that can be said to you.

785
01:05:37,747 --> 01:05:49,027
If you don't just automatically see that we're not the same height, we're not the same inherent ability to do everything, to play a musical instrument, to play a sport.

786
01:05:49,507 --> 01:05:52,187
You know, we're not the same level of attractiveness physically.

787
01:05:52,407 --> 01:05:56,107
We don't have the same dulcet tone to our voice.

788
01:05:56,267 --> 01:05:59,047
People, humans are inherently unequal.

789
01:05:59,047 --> 01:06:11,727
And egalitarianism, to the extent that it's just the statement that we are all equal, that becomes incompatible with liberty because you then have to get rid of liberty in order to make sure that people are equal.

790
01:06:12,007 --> 01:06:18,307
Like you have to get rid of the expressions of inequality that comes from letting people act freely in a free market.

791
01:06:18,467 --> 01:06:19,227
You got to say, yeah.

792
01:06:19,227 --> 01:06:28,507
There's two examples of this I think people can relate to, or at least they're the ones that are most prominent in my life, which is there are good looking people.

793
01:06:28,707 --> 01:06:34,467
And then there are people that when they're in public, other people stare and they're like, are you?

794
01:06:34,467 --> 01:06:41,287
I mean, you're like, you know, it's like, oh, you know, everybody's like, oh, there's zeros to tens.

795
01:06:41,587 --> 01:06:44,827
And they're like, and then there's whatever this is, you know.

796
01:06:44,967 --> 01:06:48,967
And then the other thing is athletes.

797
01:06:49,227 --> 01:06:53,967
Like I played sports, you played sports, reasonably fit, you're reasonably fit.

798
01:06:55,067 --> 01:06:57,087
I've been around athletes.

799
01:06:57,367 --> 01:06:57,447
Right.

800
01:06:57,847 --> 01:07:01,467
And when I'm around an athlete, I'm like, oh, you're a different breed.

801
01:07:01,627 --> 01:07:02,667
You're something else.

802
01:07:02,827 --> 01:07:04,067
You're not me.

803
01:07:04,407 --> 01:07:04,527
Yeah.

804
01:07:04,827 --> 01:07:17,487
It's so, it's so, I tried out for a minor league baseball team or like an independent league baseball team, which would be like the lowest, lowest rung of minor leagues.

805
01:07:17,487 --> 01:07:20,427
and I was like a decent high school athlete.

806
01:07:20,627 --> 01:07:22,787
I was not great, but I was decent.

807
01:07:22,887 --> 01:07:23,327
I was better.

808
01:07:23,447 --> 01:07:26,327
I was the best baseball player in a couple counties,

809
01:07:26,427 --> 01:07:28,247
probably small counties.

810
01:07:28,687 --> 01:07:31,267
And I got up there and I started throwing

811
01:07:31,267 --> 01:07:33,427
and then this other guy steps up.

812
01:07:33,927 --> 01:07:38,427
And remember, like we're both trying to get a job

813
01:07:38,427 --> 01:07:40,767
that probably pays as much as bagging groceries.

814
01:07:40,767 --> 01:07:43,187
Like this is literally the lowest rung, right?

815
01:07:43,187 --> 01:07:49,527
and he's 6'5", 230 pounds and just rocketing the ball.

816
01:07:49,667 --> 01:07:50,227
I'm like, oh.

817
01:07:50,747 --> 01:07:53,947
I saw him throw one pitch and I was like, I'm going home.

818
01:07:54,347 --> 01:07:55,767
What's the point of me being here?

819
01:07:55,767 --> 01:08:00,607
Until you put yourself up against truly different him.

820
01:08:00,707 --> 01:08:02,027
And intelligence is the same way.

821
01:08:02,147 --> 01:08:04,887
Sitting next to Bology and talking with Bology,

822
01:08:05,327 --> 01:08:10,387
it's so clear how much smarter this person is than me.

823
01:08:10,707 --> 01:08:12,507
Yeah, maybe they got more RAM, more throughput,

824
01:08:12,507 --> 01:08:14,327
whatever parameter mentally they have.

825
01:08:14,387 --> 01:08:14,967
It's just different.

826
01:08:15,087 --> 01:08:15,347
Yeah.

827
01:08:15,467 --> 01:08:19,427
And you're like, ah, it's kind of like, you know, kind of like I, where I don't want to

828
01:08:19,427 --> 01:08:22,367
play games with Michael, you know, I don't want to play basketball with Michael Jordan.

829
01:08:22,447 --> 01:08:23,807
It's like, you don't want to have a debate with Bology.

830
01:08:24,047 --> 01:08:27,847
Like, you know, you don't want to be in a beauty contest with Shakira or whoever.

831
01:08:28,247 --> 01:08:28,487
Yeah.

832
01:08:28,747 --> 01:08:29,607
So anyway, sorry.

833
01:08:29,727 --> 01:08:30,207
That's a digression.

834
01:08:30,567 --> 01:08:34,887
I mean, that's a good explanation of why egalitarianism is a religious sentiment.

835
01:08:35,207 --> 01:08:36,947
And it's explicitly a religious sentiment.

836
01:08:37,107 --> 01:08:40,987
I mean, that's, there's, and there's, in a sense, there's nothing quote unquote wrong

837
01:08:40,987 --> 01:08:45,627
with it if you understand it as a religious sentiment like christian is a full christianity

838
01:08:45,627 --> 01:08:49,987
is a form of egalitarianism we each have a soul we're each possessed of an inherent moral dignity

839
01:08:49,987 --> 01:08:55,027
and worth everyone's deserving of love something like that yeah and so it's just you need to

840
01:08:55,027 --> 01:09:00,227
understand it as a religious sentiment and in our modern world we tend not to we tend to be both

841
01:09:00,227 --> 01:09:06,207
atheist and egalitarian which is i mean that's just not compatible like atheism is not compatible

842
01:09:06,207 --> 01:09:11,447
with egalitarianism you have to accept it on religious faith that we're equal or you you're

843
01:09:11,447 --> 01:09:16,487
just making up or you're trying to again control that equality or dictate it by removing liberty

844
01:09:16,487 --> 01:09:23,727
or there's the what does equity mean that that famous image of like the three people watching the

845
01:09:23,727 --> 01:09:29,747
the um baseball game of different heights you know and if you want to have the same outcome

846
01:09:29,747 --> 01:09:53,551
you really need to re reality right yeah um give take from the people because it always the case that if you want egalitarianism you can not only bring up the people that are at the bottom you can pull down the people that are at the top right And you can make people feel ashamed for excelling even or prevent them from excelling So democracy is unable to control government Egalitarian is incompatible with liberty

847
01:09:53,551 --> 01:10:05,871
And then the third principle or basic tentative neoreaction is neoreaction is the socio-political solutions offered by it are ultimately based on exit.

848
01:10:06,011 --> 01:10:07,031
Again, we just talked about that.

849
01:10:07,091 --> 01:10:10,771
Not about engagement with the system, but spatializing your disagreement.

850
01:10:11,031 --> 01:10:14,111
If you're in disagreement with the system, you leave the system.

851
01:10:14,211 --> 01:10:22,011
To quote Land, it is the outside working through fragmentation that rules and no other authority has any standing.

852
01:10:22,011 --> 01:10:29,011
Yeah, change is not possible within the cathedral of democracy. The only solution is secession slash exit.

853
01:10:29,791 --> 01:10:41,451
You can't because of the – like we keep – it's great. I think it's great how you've structured this because we're able to keep drawing lines back to the degenerative ratchet and giving examples.

854
01:10:41,451 --> 01:10:59,491
Yeah. And again, this is all playing with the idea of neoreaction in different ways to playing with it as based on different strands around what spontaneous or different principles of spontaneous order or different names we give to spontaneous order.

855
01:10:59,931 --> 01:11:07,411
Again, is it God? Is it evolution? Is it catalaxy? I'm talking about it as an exit from a system rather than engagement with a system.

856
01:11:07,411 --> 01:11:13,751
another way is kind of just looking at the word itself land at one point breaks down neo reaction

857
01:11:13,751 --> 01:11:21,331
neo and reaction so you have like neo new towards the future reaction some sort of response to the

858
01:11:21,331 --> 01:11:28,151
past a focus on the past and he breaks down reaction progressivism and conservatism so

859
01:11:28,151 --> 01:11:36,591
reaction then is the future in the past aligned against the present you're looking at the past

860
01:11:36,591 --> 01:11:42,331
as a way that things maybe were before they degenerated into the present and the future

861
01:11:42,331 --> 01:11:47,371
as a way that things could be if principles of spontaneous order were allowed to generate

862
01:11:47,371 --> 01:11:49,611
reality instead of us trying to mold reality.

863
01:11:50,151 --> 01:11:50,931
That's reaction.

864
01:11:51,211 --> 01:11:55,411
Progressivism is the present and the future against the past.

865
01:11:55,551 --> 01:12:01,071
The progressives want to say the past was ruin and racism, bigotry, all these horrible

866
01:12:01,071 --> 01:12:02,151
things were in the past.

867
01:12:02,151 --> 01:12:07,471
The present is good to the extent that it's oriented towards the future, towards an idea of progress.

868
01:12:08,051 --> 01:12:11,411
And then conservatism is the present and the past against the future.

869
01:12:11,651 --> 01:12:18,331
To quote Buckley, he has a famous quote, the conservative stands athwart history and says stop, something like that.

870
01:12:18,391 --> 01:12:19,791
They're kind of romantic, nostalgic.

871
01:12:20,011 --> 01:12:23,731
They're looking towards the past, towards make America great again, that type of sentiment.

872
01:12:23,731 --> 01:12:43,591
But again, how it's different conservatism than neo-reaction is the neo-reactionary, so to speak, is looking at the past and seeing that, you know, if before you have these different types of degenerative ratchets, things were better in that sense.

873
01:12:43,591 --> 01:12:50,451
But also looking towards the future, not trying to be like the conservative and saying, no, we can turn back the ratchet.

874
01:12:51,131 --> 01:12:55,291
The neo-reactionary says the nature of the ratchet is that you can't turn it backwards.

875
01:12:55,531 --> 01:12:56,951
We can't reverse history.

876
01:12:57,051 --> 01:12:58,231
We can only go towards the future.

877
01:12:58,531 --> 01:13:07,691
And that becomes a task of understanding the strands of faith that are going to lead us there, whether providence, catalaxy, or evolution, heredity, something like that.

878
01:13:07,691 --> 01:13:13,091
So the main difference between conservatism and conservatism, I guess, writ large.

879
01:13:13,091 --> 01:13:21,451
Yeah. And neo-reactionism is that conservatism believes that they can change the system and neo-reactionism.

880
01:13:21,571 --> 01:13:24,771
Change it to bring it towards the past, to realign with what was good in the past.

881
01:13:24,831 --> 01:13:25,651
Yeah. And lost.

882
01:13:25,771 --> 01:13:33,791
Yeah. And neo-reactionism says that change cannot occur, that you must start anew.

883
01:13:33,791 --> 01:13:56,571
I would say it's that we need to understand that change will occur regardless of what we do. And we need to understand the dynamics, the underlying principles of spontaneous generation that will lead to the future. I almost see Neo Reaction again, not as a normative view about what the future should be. It's Land saying this is what the future is going to be.

884
01:13:56,571 --> 01:13:59,851
Correct. Yeah, this is very nothing stops this train is.

885
01:14:00,031 --> 01:14:15,171
Exactly. That's the thing. And on all of this, I have no idea. It's just me thinking through ZenoSystems. I don't want to say that I'm representing Land's view as if it is Land's view, right? It's this whole book is an exercise in the stimulation of thought and read it, get your own ideas. It will give you many.

886
01:14:15,171 --> 01:14:20,231
It will give you nightmares.

887
01:14:20,611 --> 01:14:21,311
Yeah, right.

888
01:14:21,471 --> 01:14:22,671
Yeah, last night I laid in.

889
01:14:22,671 --> 01:14:23,991
To the extent you understand that it should.

890
01:14:24,191 --> 01:14:31,811
Yeah, last night I laid in bed and I started uploading a bunch of stuff to Grok and then I turned it on to voice mode.

891
01:14:32,251 --> 01:14:34,131
And I just started having a conversation with it.

892
01:14:34,151 --> 01:14:34,451
Yeah.

893
01:14:34,671 --> 01:14:44,431
You know, and it was hilarious because I just kept like, it's basically like trying to convince me that things are going to be okay, even though things are not going to be okay.

894
01:14:44,431 --> 01:14:44,751
Yeah.

895
01:14:44,751 --> 01:14:46,411
It's like, oh, come on, man.

896
01:14:46,791 --> 01:14:50,931
You know, it'll, I mean, it might not work out that way.

897
01:14:50,991 --> 01:14:51,871
I was like, what are the odds?

898
01:14:52,131 --> 01:14:54,171
And it's like, ah, 5% maybe.

899
01:14:55,251 --> 01:14:55,691
Shit.

900
01:14:56,011 --> 01:15:00,851
That's the most Landian way to engage with this essay is to do it with an AI partner talking to them.

901
01:15:00,951 --> 01:15:01,751
Nice, I did it right.

902
01:15:01,771 --> 01:15:02,651
And see the comfort from them, yeah.

903
01:15:02,651 --> 01:15:03,231
I did it right.

904
01:15:03,351 --> 01:15:05,811
No, man, when I first read Land 2012.

905
01:15:05,911 --> 01:15:08,871
Did you go into like a depressive funk for six months?

906
01:15:08,871 --> 01:15:16,671
In a sense, because I actually, at the time, I had dropped out of the practice of law and I was teaching philosophy.

907
01:15:16,671 --> 01:15:24,971
So I went really deep into just different thought tunnels, Warrens, like the rabbit hole and the broad sense of like, no, I'm going to rethink things.

908
01:15:25,171 --> 01:15:38,071
And land at the time represented a form of nihilism that was like, it was difficult to see how it was not going to pan out according to the vision that he laid out.

909
01:15:38,071 --> 01:16:01,431
And I spent probably two to three years plotting my own reaction to land. And I wrote an essay called Insideness. His handle was Outsideness. And the whole idea was like, if the outside is this reservoir of kind of uncontained chaos that we're spinning towards, it's reality unmediated by human perception.

910
01:16:01,431 --> 01:16:09,211
And that reality is grotesque and only mediated in its abstraction by our ideas of horror, as we're going to talk about later.

911
01:16:09,651 --> 01:16:12,031
Like, what resources do we have against that?

912
01:16:12,031 --> 01:16:28,351
And I was pulling from, at the time, a lot of young and, like, things that were about movements inward and about how you can find through different types of practices, meaning within a purely human framework.

913
01:16:28,971 --> 01:16:41,031
But again, yeah, I think anybody reading Land, if you read it diligently and kind of open yourself up to it, you're going to have a reaction and you're going to try to find a way to insulate yourself from the conclusions.

914
01:16:41,651 --> 01:16:44,131
Because he's not he's actually not nihilist.

915
01:16:44,131 --> 01:16:45,251
He is right.

916
01:16:45,411 --> 01:16:47,291
I mean, he's not necessarily nihilist.

917
01:16:47,391 --> 01:16:49,791
He's just trying to say, look, this is what is.

918
01:16:49,791 --> 01:17:00,471
Yes. And and I'm not going to impose my thoughts on that or I'm just going to try to show you what the clearest look of this is.

919
01:17:00,471 --> 01:17:28,191
Yeah. And anyway, yeah, to jump to the end, it's like the idea that AI with robotics is going to pair with Bitcoin and reach and capitalism is going to reach escape velocity velocity when it achieves autonomous capital, which means that we just don't need to be involved in the system anymore.

920
01:17:28,191 --> 01:17:36,691
And he's pointing out that we are the ghosts in the machine, that we are the errors that need removed and need corrected.

921
01:17:36,871 --> 01:17:47,171
And by the way, I think a perfect example of this is you could not find a person less nihilistic than Jeff Booth, who we just interviewed.

922
01:17:47,591 --> 01:17:49,971
And this is what Jeff says.

923
01:17:50,331 --> 01:17:52,931
Like, look, humans are the errors in the system.

924
01:17:53,091 --> 01:17:54,671
They will be removed from the system.

925
01:17:54,671 --> 01:18:00,471
and out of that will be something that he believes is beautiful and wonderful and, you know,

926
01:18:00,511 --> 01:18:08,791
and abundance and everything. And so, um, yeah, I just like, I got stuck on it, um, for a little

927
01:18:08,791 --> 01:18:12,091
bit because I was like, oh, I'm bummed out. Like, I don't know if humans are going to be pets or

928
01:18:12,091 --> 01:18:15,111
we're just not going to be around. Everybody's going to mold with computers. We're going to have

929
01:18:15,111 --> 01:18:20,591
Neuralinks. I don't know. Maybe that's better. Maybe it's not. I have no, no idea. Like we're

930
01:18:20,591 --> 01:18:26,911
just so trained as humans to believe that whatever we are now is the best we could be.

931
01:18:27,571 --> 01:18:29,671
And that's just truly not the case.

932
01:18:29,791 --> 01:18:29,971
Yeah.

933
01:18:30,151 --> 01:18:30,371
Right?

934
01:18:30,951 --> 01:18:31,271
Yeah.

935
01:18:31,891 --> 01:18:41,351
I mean, it's trying to stand in the middle of the river that is time, that is evolution,

936
01:18:41,751 --> 01:18:45,951
that is whatever principle of spontaneous order and trying to say, stop, this is the

937
01:18:45,951 --> 01:18:46,611
end of history.

938
01:18:46,831 --> 01:18:48,411
Like, that's what we want to do as humans.

939
01:18:48,411 --> 01:18:53,671
We want to be safe and say, we've arrived at a point, I want no further change.

940
01:18:53,951 --> 01:18:56,311
And, like, that's what the cathedral is kind of designed to do.

941
01:18:56,391 --> 01:19:00,551
You'll only get changed, but it's going to be in the form of, like, cool shit you can buy.

942
01:19:00,911 --> 01:19:07,911
It's not going to be something that will change you and maybe get rid of you or show that you're not necessary in your current form in a certain sense.

943
01:19:07,911 --> 01:19:27,911
And we also have this thing we do as humans, which is to assume that wherever we are in the present moment, that we're dealing with the sum total of all the knowledge that we'll ever be and that the best theories that we have now are the best theories that we'll ever be.

944
01:19:27,911 --> 01:19:40,911
Yeah. And and so that's why if you can remember that, you know, we used to bleed people with leeches and we used to drill holes in people's heads and, you know.

945
01:19:41,911 --> 01:19:48,431
Maybe we burned some witches or who knows, maybe we checked if they floated, all this other stuff that.

946
01:19:49,231 --> 01:19:53,211
We're probably not at the end of understanding things.

947
01:19:53,211 --> 01:20:03,411
And so just like a just like, I guess, like a caveat or a warning to anybody who who gets into this and they like I do, got a little bummed out for a bit.

948
01:20:03,851 --> 01:20:08,391
That's how I got myself out of it was I realized that, oh, we're not at the end of human anything.

949
01:20:09,131 --> 01:20:13,091
And that this actually may be the best that we have right now.

950
01:20:13,171 --> 01:20:13,831
Maybe it's not.

951
01:20:14,651 --> 01:20:17,071
But we're moving somewhere.

952
01:20:17,071 --> 01:20:26,171
And I think one thing we've realized as humans is that we do have the capacity for change and we can always change it.

953
01:20:26,251 --> 01:20:28,551
Maybe this says that we don't, but who knows?

954
01:20:29,091 --> 01:20:29,211
Yeah.

955
01:20:29,411 --> 01:20:34,311
And one positive thing in Neoreaction I'll say is he makes this point, which I had not thought about before.

956
01:20:35,831 --> 01:20:38,951
So Neoreaction believes in.

957
01:20:39,011 --> 01:20:45,311
Neoreaction describes a reality that is based on spontaneous ordering, which we can describe as fate or destiny.

958
01:20:45,311 --> 01:20:50,731
and which can be a negative thing because once you take away human agency from the picture like

959
01:20:50,731 --> 01:20:55,211
what world do we serve we can't change the future it's preordained by either providence evolution

960
01:20:55,211 --> 01:21:01,191
or catalaxy right it's out of our the keys are not in our hands but then like that also once the

961
01:21:01,191 --> 01:21:05,851
keys are not in our hands that takes away political violence from the picture because terrorism is a

962
01:21:05,851 --> 01:21:13,491
resort to violence by people whose ideas are losing traction and the neo-reactionary doesn't

963
01:21:13,491 --> 01:21:20,471
seek popular support they're not trying to put policies into place in any way they're anti-democratic

964
01:21:20,471 --> 01:21:26,651
right and so they have no reason to become violent or terrorists um they're not trying to get the

965
01:21:26,651 --> 01:21:32,231
populace to believe a certain thing it's almost a way you can say if somebody descends into violence

966
01:21:32,231 --> 01:21:37,171
based on reading something like this then you can almost be assured that they've misunderstood it

967
01:21:37,171 --> 01:21:42,811
correct and that they're not um neo-reactionaries or whatever other word you might give to describe

968
01:21:42,811 --> 01:21:47,411
somebody who pulls to a consummation all the strands of Nick Glantz thought.

969
01:21:47,971 --> 01:21:51,451
Yeah, he's just saying, this party sucks, I'm leaving.

970
01:21:51,811 --> 01:21:52,591
Yeah, that's right.

971
01:21:52,671 --> 01:21:53,951
X over voice, leave the party.

972
01:21:55,411 --> 01:21:56,451
Neoreactionary, here's another strand.

973
01:21:57,291 --> 01:22:01,351
Neoreaction is social Darwinism.

974
01:22:02,151 --> 01:22:05,591
It's an insistence that Darwinism has no limits.

975
01:22:05,771 --> 01:22:07,091
It is something we are inside.

976
01:22:07,211 --> 01:22:11,571
To quote Landz, no part of what it is to be human can ever judge its Darwinian inheritance

977
01:22:11,571 --> 01:22:13,631
from a position of transcendent leverage

978
01:22:13,631 --> 01:22:15,831
as if accessing principles of estimation

979
01:22:15,831 --> 01:22:19,131
with some alternative genesis or criterion.

980
01:22:19,711 --> 01:22:20,971
The implication of this, he says,

981
01:22:21,011 --> 01:22:22,531
is that everything of value,

982
01:22:22,931 --> 01:22:25,151
and this is the way that Land talks and writes,

983
01:22:25,291 --> 01:22:27,611
everything of value has been built in hell.

984
01:22:27,991 --> 01:22:31,131
Nature uses incredible cruelty to create.

985
01:22:31,671 --> 01:22:33,411
I mean, imagine the way that evolution works.

986
01:22:33,411 --> 01:22:36,531
It works by, I'll just quote Land,

987
01:22:36,671 --> 01:22:38,951
all health, beauty, intelligence, and social grace

988
01:22:38,951 --> 01:22:45,091
has been teased from a vast butcher's yard of unbounded carnage requiring incalculable

989
01:22:45,091 --> 01:22:51,231
eons of massacre to draw forth even the subtlest advantages. That's the way that evolution works,

990
01:22:51,291 --> 01:22:55,771
right? Like the stuff that doesn't survive goes in the trash in the history. It's extinct, right?

991
01:22:55,771 --> 01:22:56,551
It's extinct. It's no longer here.

992
01:22:56,611 --> 01:23:01,231
And the reason that we're healthy right now is because that health has been forged

993
01:23:01,231 --> 01:23:04,771
through a process of selection over many thousands of years to make us

994
01:23:04,771 --> 01:23:09,091
best suited for our environment. All of our virtues are owed to people who

995
01:23:09,091 --> 01:23:14,231
survived because they had those virtues and those that died off because they did not and did not

996
01:23:14,231 --> 01:23:20,831
reproduce. Therefore, yeah, this is an interesting one because conservatism is the one that says we

997
01:23:20,831 --> 01:23:26,651
should try to go back to the way that things were. But the progressive would be the one that is

998
01:23:26,651 --> 01:23:32,251
trying to resurrect dinosaurs to go back to the way that things are. I would think I think that's

999
01:23:32,251 --> 01:23:33,231
I think that's how I'm thinking.

1000
01:23:33,351 --> 01:23:33,651
I don't know.

1001
01:23:33,751 --> 01:23:38,711
In my head, this seems like a contradiction or it seems like something that's.

1002
01:23:38,931 --> 01:23:39,051
Yeah.

1003
01:23:39,051 --> 01:23:40,171
Which part seems contradictory?

1004
01:23:41,291 --> 01:23:46,811
Because the position of the conservative is to go back to the way the things were.

1005
01:23:47,191 --> 01:23:55,151
But with the specifics of like protecting endangered species and resurrecting extinct

1006
01:23:55,151 --> 01:24:01,271
species um these are like i feel like these are like primarily liberal progressive um things which

1007
01:24:01,271 --> 01:24:06,731
is uh returns the way that things work um so anyways i'm just i don't know why that was probably

1008
01:24:06,731 --> 01:24:11,431
i think you know i think you're right and like one of the strands of progressivism is it that um

1009
01:24:11,431 --> 01:24:17,171
wanting to freeze in place certain things about the way that reality are rather than letting

1010
01:24:17,171 --> 01:24:24,371
unleashing forms of spontaneously generated order like the progressive does want to freeze reality

1011
01:24:24,371 --> 01:24:25,371
in a certain sense,

1012
01:24:25,651 --> 01:24:26,531
the parts of reality

1013
01:24:26,531 --> 01:24:28,491
that are not comfortable to it.

1014
01:24:28,571 --> 01:24:29,551
Like the cathedral, again,

1015
01:24:29,651 --> 01:24:31,851
wants to just re-describe reality

1016
01:24:31,851 --> 01:24:32,651
in a certain way

1017
01:24:32,651 --> 01:24:34,411
and live in that re-described reality

1018
01:24:34,411 --> 01:24:35,791
because it's too uncomfortable

1019
01:24:35,791 --> 01:24:37,611
to think of capitalism

1020
01:24:37,611 --> 01:24:39,131
achieving escape velocity

1021
01:24:39,131 --> 01:24:40,031
and what that might mean.

1022
01:24:40,231 --> 01:24:40,391
Yeah, yeah.

1023
01:24:41,171 --> 01:24:42,671
We're just like a,

1024
01:24:42,871 --> 01:24:43,831
kind of a quick note.

1025
01:24:43,971 --> 01:24:45,091
We're probably about halfway

1026
01:24:45,091 --> 01:24:46,051
through your notes, right?

1027
01:24:46,871 --> 01:24:48,931
Eight of 25, so, yeah.

1028
01:24:49,931 --> 01:24:52,731
Can we, can we do a summary

1029
01:24:52,731 --> 01:24:53,991
and, you know,

1030
01:24:54,371 --> 01:24:56,051
then start a second episode?

1031
01:24:56,711 --> 01:24:57,611
We sure can.

1032
01:24:57,651 --> 01:25:00,791
We kind of hit the most political aspects of Neo Reaction,

1033
01:25:01,031 --> 01:25:04,691
talking about what the notion of a degenerative ratchet

1034
01:25:04,691 --> 01:25:09,591
as a sort of feedback or a sort of reversal being impossible,

1035
01:25:09,791 --> 01:25:12,251
like a ratchet moves forward, clicks, but it can't move backwards.

1036
01:25:12,391 --> 01:25:13,831
We just talked about what those were.

1037
01:25:14,371 --> 01:25:17,331
The welfare state, immigration, expansive franchise,

1038
01:25:17,331 --> 01:25:19,451
these are forms of degenerative ratchets.

1039
01:25:19,891 --> 01:25:22,651
We learned about the different three strands of Neo Reaction,

1040
01:25:22,651 --> 01:25:33,151
The theonomist, the religious strand, the ethno-nationalist, kind of the ethnic genetic strand, and then the techno-commercial strand.

1041
01:25:34,331 --> 01:25:37,511
Clarify, techno-commercial is different from capitalist, how?

1042
01:25:37,731 --> 01:25:38,251
No, they're not.

1043
01:25:38,351 --> 01:25:38,551
It's not.

1044
01:25:38,691 --> 01:25:39,931
So it's the capitalist strand.

1045
01:25:40,071 --> 01:25:41,151
Okay, it's the capitalist strand.

1046
01:25:41,231 --> 01:25:41,411
Right.

1047
01:25:41,471 --> 01:25:44,191
There's a religious, the ethnic, and the capitalist strand of neoreaction.

1048
01:25:44,191 --> 01:25:51,431
um we got the critique of democracy as something whose feedback mechanism is corrupted and the

1049
01:25:51,431 --> 01:25:55,951
cathedral is the thing that corrupts that feedback mechanism it generates the reality that it wants

1050
01:25:55,951 --> 01:26:00,571
to measure rather than measuring the reality as it actually is it creates the feedback it desires

1051
01:26:00,571 --> 01:26:07,511
yeah yeah um we talked about exit over voice new reaction is about spatializing disagreement

1052
01:26:07,511 --> 01:26:14,011
leaving a system instead of pulling yourself into a dialectical engagement with a cathedral

1053
01:26:14,011 --> 01:26:19,191
that's not interested in any sort of feedback other than what it's preordained and created.

1054
01:26:19,351 --> 01:26:23,371
It's not interested in what you have to say, because if it was interested in what you have

1055
01:26:23,371 --> 01:26:25,451
to say, it would tell you what you had to say.

1056
01:26:25,771 --> 01:26:28,411
You got to love that honesty, that directness right there.

1057
01:26:30,751 --> 01:26:33,511
Yeah, those are the main strands.

1058
01:26:33,511 --> 01:26:38,511
And something we've been teasing out, too, that I really like about this is that each

1059
01:26:39,091 --> 01:26:40,631
of the three strands has an idea.

1060
01:26:40,631 --> 01:26:49,791
Each of the trichotomy, the three strands of new reaction, embeds an idea of fate, which is also an idea of spontaneous generation of order.

1061
01:26:51,611 --> 01:26:54,571
For the religious people, it's providence, the will of God.

1062
01:26:55,171 --> 01:27:01,471
For nationalists, ethnic nationalists, people like that, it's evolution, heredity generates the future.

1063
01:27:01,911 --> 01:27:05,891
And for capitalists, it's catalaxy or self-organizing market systems, something like that.

1064
01:27:06,531 --> 01:27:07,951
So nothing stops this train.

1065
01:27:08,131 --> 01:27:08,391
Yeah.

1066
01:27:08,391 --> 01:27:18,691
This train either kills us all or it takes us to a place where life is not recognizable from what we think it is now, from what we feel like it is now.

1067
01:27:19,191 --> 01:27:20,411
That's where we haven't gotten yet.

1068
01:27:20,491 --> 01:27:30,331
We haven't gotten to accelerate neoreaction and accelerationism and kind of intelligence optimization and, you know, artificial intelligence as super intelligence.

1069
01:27:30,451 --> 01:27:30,971
That's where we're going.

1070
01:27:30,971 --> 01:27:32,151
So I jumped again a little bit.

1071
01:27:32,151 --> 01:27:47,231
But there are there's three strands of people that want to get off that want to leave this party because this party sucks. It's religious people, racist people and money people, capitalists.

1072
01:27:47,231 --> 01:27:47,751
Yeah, yeah.

1073
01:27:47,991 --> 01:27:48,331
Yeah, yeah.

1074
01:27:50,171 --> 01:27:58,511
People who are prevented from speaking essentially within the cathedral because forms of political correctness serve as path blockers.

1075
01:27:58,731 --> 01:28:01,611
If you're a religious person, you're a theocrat, you're irrational.

1076
01:28:01,931 --> 01:28:08,151
You want to just, you know, use the will of God as some surrogate for your own desire to control other people.

1077
01:28:08,551 --> 01:28:11,591
If you're an ethno-nationalist, you're a racist, as you said.

1078
01:28:11,811 --> 01:28:13,931
And if you're a capitalist, technoporationalist.

1079
01:28:13,931 --> 01:28:14,831
Which, by the way, is half of the world.

1080
01:28:14,851 --> 01:28:15,511
I looked this up.

1081
01:28:15,511 --> 01:28:24,431
Over half of the population of the world lives in a country that is 85% or more one ethnicity.

1082
01:28:25,011 --> 01:28:25,031
Yeah.

1083
01:28:25,151 --> 01:28:34,731
So, yeah, it's one of those things that it's like you can only be racist in play.

1084
01:28:34,731 --> 01:28:41,591
Yeah, this is Andrew Huberman once said that you can't be an alcoholic on an island that has no alcohol.

1085
01:28:42,071 --> 01:28:43,671
Like you have to have access to the thing.

1086
01:28:43,671 --> 01:28:48,331
and uh by the same token like you can't be a racist in a place that has no other races

1087
01:28:48,331 --> 01:28:55,371
you know so if you're chinese like you're just chinese dude you know like it's funny that you

1088
01:28:55,371 --> 01:29:01,291
can only be in a you can only be racist in places that have other races um it's exclusively reserved

1089
01:29:01,291 --> 01:29:06,231
to those places by the way so luckily you can still if you're a bigot be inegalitarian you can

1090
01:29:06,231 --> 01:29:09,891
still even amongst the chinese someone's going to be taller than someone else someone's going to be

1091
01:29:09,891 --> 01:29:16,551
better singer so yeah that's true that's true that's good okay um uh and then uh yeah and so

1092
01:29:16,551 --> 01:29:22,911
and then the cathedral and the cathedral is the cathedral is the matrix and because like he refers

1093
01:29:22,911 --> 01:29:29,131
to it especially as when you think about the movie the matrix um he says that the cathedral is read

1094
01:29:29,131 --> 01:29:36,871
only it's right protected and the people that are living in the matrix until they take the um until

1095
01:29:36,871 --> 01:29:38,931
they take the pill. Is it the red pill or the blue pill?

1096
01:29:38,931 --> 01:29:40,771
Red pill is the one that exposes you to

1097
01:29:40,771 --> 01:29:42,931
all of reality. Yeah, the red pill gets you out.

1098
01:29:43,051 --> 01:29:44,431
The red pill exposes you to reality.

1099
01:29:44,751 --> 01:29:46,731
So until you, like, being red-pilled

1100
01:29:46,731 --> 01:29:48,971
gives you access to write

1101
01:29:48,971 --> 01:29:50,931
or at least access

1102
01:29:50,931 --> 01:29:53,051
to go to a different program, I guess.

1103
01:29:53,151 --> 01:29:54,711
But being within the matrix,

1104
01:29:55,411 --> 01:29:56,591
you're in

1105
01:29:56,591 --> 01:29:59,011
read-only. So cathedral, matrix,

1106
01:29:59,331 --> 01:30:00,331
same thing, basically.

1107
01:30:01,251 --> 01:30:01,651
Yeah.

1108
01:30:01,651 --> 01:30:02,051
Yeah.

1109
01:30:02,811 --> 01:30:04,191
Nice. All right. Cool.

1110
01:30:05,331 --> 01:30:05,411
Yeah.

1111
01:30:06,871 --> 01:30:16,271
That's good. We will continue this right away. But I just want to have like a good place to split the episode because I think we did a really good job of laying the groundwork here.

1112
01:30:16,271 --> 01:30:46,251
And I want to, like, I truly want to give justice to this book. Like, this is, these are deep thoughts. These are things that are not easy to think about. And it takes courage to consider these things because a lot of these things that we are talking about are within the realm of those which are designated as verboten by the cathedral. And therefore, we're not supposed to talk about that.

1113
01:30:46,271 --> 01:30:57,891
And it is a act of terrorism or it is a act of courage to even brave your way into the idea of not participating in it.

1114
01:30:57,891 --> 01:31:07,231
Yeah. Even having a minor fourth tier podcast to talk about race in any sense on it's terrifying because, you know, I mean, we're kind of.

1115
01:31:07,231 --> 01:31:10,751
Fourth tier. Who are we? We have made leaps, my friend.

1116
01:31:10,951 --> 01:31:15,831
I know. There's like how many tiers of how many circles of hell are there?

1117
01:31:15,831 --> 01:31:16,871
I was thinking we were double digits.

1118
01:31:16,871 --> 01:31:17,751
Dante's Inferno.

1119
01:31:18,071 --> 01:31:21,211
Like, it's all a hellish landscape out there if you do it.

1120
01:31:21,211 --> 01:31:27,611
So, but no, even to talk about race in any sense, it's even kind of pseudo-public.

1121
01:31:27,791 --> 01:31:32,251
We kind of escaped the worst of cancel culture for the point being.

1122
01:31:32,971 --> 01:31:42,511
But you just have to have, like, a level of precision in your language, a number of asterisks and qualifications that you feel you need to get out to say anything.

1123
01:31:42,511 --> 01:31:49,151
and we trip over ourselves and we just stay quiet because we're afraid that we might say something in the wrong way

1124
01:31:49,151 --> 01:31:54,891
where we haven't expressed the correct qualification about statistical probabilities and stuff like that.

1125
01:31:54,891 --> 01:32:01,031
Yeah, you know, it's like you're being – there was this experiment done with people in a lobby

1126
01:32:01,031 --> 01:32:07,751
and they put people in a lobby and they start pumping smoke and the smell of like something burning into the room.

1127
01:32:07,991 --> 01:32:12,411
And they find that the more people are in the room, the longer it takes anybody to stand up and say something.

1128
01:32:12,511 --> 01:32:16,171
You know, to the point where it's like people are like keeling over.

1129
01:32:16,371 --> 01:32:17,631
You can't see across the room.

1130
01:32:18,051 --> 01:32:21,211
And nobody has yet said, hey, something's wrong.

1131
01:32:21,391 --> 01:32:22,671
Like we should do something.

1132
01:32:22,811 --> 01:32:25,091
It takes a hero to yell fire in a crowded theater.

1133
01:32:25,211 --> 01:32:25,751
It really does.

1134
01:32:26,071 --> 01:32:26,251
Yeah.

1135
01:32:26,431 --> 01:32:34,211
And so that's the thing is like we've been so bred to be like, again, like the crisis is not the crisis.

1136
01:32:34,331 --> 01:32:37,771
The crisis is noticing the crisis and it takes courage to notice the crisis.

1137
01:32:38,131 --> 01:32:38,511
So, yeah.

1138
01:32:39,171 --> 01:32:39,791
All right.

1139
01:32:39,891 --> 01:32:41,111
We're going to press pause.

1140
01:32:41,111 --> 01:32:42,811
We're going to get back and we're going to start another one.

1141
01:32:42,931 --> 01:32:46,771
Thank you for joining us for the first round of our talk on Nick Land's Zeno Systems.

1142
01:32:47,371 --> 01:32:49,471
Grant, you look handsome today.

1143
01:32:49,631 --> 01:32:50,051
Thank you, sir.

1144
01:32:50,051 --> 01:32:50,211
Nice work.

1145
01:32:50,611 --> 01:32:50,851
All right.

1146
01:32:51,491 --> 01:32:52,031
I'm going to piss.