If you're watching this video, you're going to learn three big things.
Number one, what Bitcoin actually does for people in other countries.
Number two, why cryptocurrencies are dinos and what makes Bitcoin truly different from them.
And number three, why Bitcoin is even more important in a crisis.
Today's guest is Juan from the BitCorner podcast,
here to tell us the story of living in El Salvador when that nation first adopted a Bitcoin standard based.
So if you're brand new to Bitcoin, come on inside the world's biggest Bitcoin welcome center for today's show.
Yeah.
Welcome to Sat Chats. Bienvenidos.
A Sat Chats, the Bitcoin podcast where we chat about sats.
Sats are the smallest part of a Bitcoin the same way pennies are the smallest part of a dollar.
With Sat Chats, what are we doing?
We're building the world's biggest Bitcoin welcome center.
To serve as your gateway to generational wealth.
So if you are brand new to Bitcoin, we want to chat about sats contigo.
Head to satchats.com to grab your slot in the studio today.
I'm your host, Stuart.
And I'm your co-host, Anna Bevan.
And with us today in the virtual studio is 183 Juan.
Yes, 183 Juan.
Juan, talk to us about what it was like for you to be a brand new Bitcoiner.
Can you remember what that was like or even when it was?
Yeah, of course.
Actually, my Bitcoin story is quite similar because when you talk about Bitcoiners,
normally
you start us as a Bitcoiner
but then you realize that
when you start talking about this
with your friends and family
especially let's say with your family
you start orange peeling them
but the fact is what with me was
I didn't have to orange peel my closest circle
so
the story of Bitcoin
is that I'm an industrial engineer
so let's say that in the university
we start talking
about Bitcoin, especially more about blockchain,
because blockchain, for those who don't know,
it's a very, very old type of engineering
of processing data.
It's not new.
It's kind of new in Bitcoin, let's say.
But anyways, I studied that.
It was boring.
So I didn't pay much attention.
So I passed the class about blockchain,
another way to processing data.
I passed the class that was okay I graduated engineering so fast forward for those who don't
know I'm from El Salvador but I finished my career here in Barcelona so back then I had my sister in
Barcelona but when I came she ran away from me and she leaves she went to Australia so
So, no, just kidding.
It was just a coincidence, but she lived to Australia to do some stuff.
And when she came back, like a year later, she talked with me one day.
It was almost by the time of COVID, so 2020.
It was not COVID yet, but it was back then.
And she told me, hey, have you, one day just talking randomly, have you heard about Bitcoin?
I was like, I think, yeah, in high school.
in high school in university but but what and she told me no i think it's a very good investment
it's very famous in australia most of the friends use it i think it's interesting and
and that conversation was like that okay like because we always talk about try to talk about
investment like gold silver but i was surprised about bitcoin because
i thought it was just something related to engineering so i passed it there
So then normally we do like family video calls, FaceTime with my dad, with my parents.
And one day we were talking with my mom and dad, my dad and my sister.
And I don't remember how, but Bitcoin also came to the conversation.
And my dad says like, hey, I know about Bitcoin as well.
I think it's a good investment.
Actually, there's a great show.
The show that he's referring is the one that Max and Stacy had back then in RT.
So it was super good.
And he started sharing some clips with that.
But what amazed me is that I started thinking, okay, so I'm an engineer.
My sister comes from finance.
And my dad is a pediatrician.
So we all three come from different fields.
And we all three are interested in Bitcoin.
Right?
So we're like, I was more thinking about my dad, like why a pediatrician is interested in Bitcoin.
So when we talk about this, I just had like, you know, this thought in your mind that why the reason.
So then COVID happened.
And in Barcelona, we didn't have anything to do because we were locked down, even in El Salvador.
So I was like, OK, I don't have much to do.
So I will start studying.
And I think back then Saifuddin started releasing his first book or the second book, I don't
remind.
And I read the first one, the Bitcoin standard, and it was amazing.
So and I think that's the most common to several Bitcoiners, right?
But what amazed me, it was not the part that he talked about Bitcoin, it's the part that
he talked about the history of money.
So I was more surprised about that because first I was kind of angry because I thought, well, not angry, but I was amazed that in university, when you study finance, economics, or even engineering, you learn about economics.
But they don't teach you different types of economics.
They teach you Kinshain economics.
so but what about austrian why don't they don't even say anything about this why they don't say
that we used to use it so and there's several then just started realizing that there's more type of
economics right class of economics so i was amazed at that and i was
studying even more about economics and about history of money coincidentally then as you guys
know Bukele made this huge announcement that in El Salvador we're gonna adopt Bitcoin and not just
adopt it but do it legal tender so I was like okay I think I'm in the right path somehow because if
my country is adopting it it's gonna be something huge the reason why it's huge that's the thing that
I was digging into it because I was still learning a little bit about Bitcoin I was
more into cryptos and bitcoin you know but then as probably as many bitcoiners after
digging into it like listening a lot of podcasts what they're reading books I learned a lot so
and again it was during COVID so for me it was like a really exciting
road to learn about and it's also question yourself because you need to rethink about
your belief system right and I think that's part of your ego because you say okay I have believed
my whole life about something and there was a lie but I know but I want to know why it's a lie
So it's a journey, guys.
Yes, it is.
It is.
So what I heard just now, Juan, is that your family members almost were already somewhat on board with Bitcoin as an investment.
as you were moving into the pandemic
and finding yourself with enough time to study Bitcoin
and to research Bitcoin,
to approach it from a financial investment perspective,
also from like an engineering perspective,
because it is very technologically,
engineering-wise, super interesting.
you know i also heard about how this blockchain is an old style of processing things which was
kind of interesting for me to hear but that you basically found yourself in el salvador
and naib bukele was looking at this poor playa or beach that was next to a nicer one that
through Bitcoin became developed,
became more of a place for people to go,
started to create its own economy.
And he thought, I'm going to do this for all of El Salvador now.
And you're looking at that and saying,
I think I'm in the right place at the right time with Bitcoin.
So that was a really interesting brand new Bitcoiner moment.
And I'm curious out of all that or something else that you might've heard,
what stood out to you or what do you want to learn about more
as our most brand new Bitcoiner?
Yeah.
Juan, I am class of 2025.
We are coming up on one year
of me knowing anything about Bitcoin,
which is yay.
I think we should have a little party about that.
Yeah, we should.
We should celebrate that.
Along with like Hank and Lorraine,
who are also going to be our brand new Bitcoiners.
I was really interested in hearing
how moving
how Ecuador moving to Bitcoin
as the legal tender has
like you said that
made you feel like you were onto something
like you were
doing the right thing basically
El Salvador
what did I say? Ecuador
oh I'm sorry El Salvador
is Ecuador is that in South
that's in South America right?
yeah
anyways that one
We want the right one.
We're going with the right one, not the wrong one.
The one that Naive is in.
Yeah, that one.
Yeah, and just how that made you feel,
like how that transition,
how you realizing that like,
hey, I think I'm doing the right thing here.
And then did that strengthen your conviction
in Bitcoin over crypto?
Were you still, because you said around that time,
you were still dealing with some crypto.
So, yeah, I just want to explore your feelings around that season of your journey.
Okay.
Yeah.
So I was working, and the thing is that during COVID, I was in Barcelona.
I was not in El Salvador.
So because of that, I needed to find a way to find a job because to pay, you know,
everyone else our bills.
so because I was studying these things at first I started with cryptos I was in a crypto company I
was I used to be like like a content writer so that was my job with that crypto company
but then realized that that mostly what impressed me the most is that all cryptos are this are
dynos, which means decentralized in name only.
But you need to think about the reason why they are decentralized in name only.
And it's because Bitcoin has something unique that most of the cryptos never had.
And it's that when Satoshi started to develop Bitcoin and talk with Adam Back and Nick Savo
and the rest of the coiners, there was not a monetary value.
He just said, hey, we're nerdies.
We have this protocol.
I want to use it for this.
Are you in?
And the guy said, okay, let's do it.
So they started using it.
But there was not a monetary value.
So that's the reason why all cryptos are dynons,
because the moment, even Vitalik Buterin,
Just the moment that you copy the Bitcoin code and you want to replicate it and try to make a better Bitcoin, you expect something in return.
And Bitcoin was not like that because there was nothing in return.
There was no monetary value.
There was nothing in the market.
So the moment that it became decentralized, that's the moment that it started little by little increasing in its value, right?
Because in the end, it was in a free market, supply and demand.
so i'm trying to say this because that's that's what hit me in that moment i was like okay so
i was also fighting against my belief system if i if you remembered how to say that so i was like
okay so i think i'm in the in the wrong path and i think i need to pivot to bitcoin so i resigned
to that other company i was like okay i'm gonna be actually i was right i was content writer in
medium back then but what happened is that when you start learning when you have a family member
that knows about bitcoin just start talking about that thing and then with my friends we start
talking about it and my friends told me hey you know much about these things every time that we
hang out they have beers we play board games and whatever during covid and they say like you know
too much about these things we don't know much but we like i like to hear you but we cannot share
with you because we don't know much.
But with my family, we always had these talks
with my dad, with my sister.
And one day I was talking with my dad and my dad told me,
hey, you know that Max Keiser and Stacy
are moving to El Salvador.
And I don know exactly what they going to do but they going to do something and they going to help with the country And I was like and I think also back then the war started the Russian the Russian Ukrainian war started that conflict
So I think Max Stacey resigned to RT and that's the reason I think that why they moved to El Salvador.
But we don't know if they're going to do it anymore because they resigned to RT.
And my dad says, yeah, I don't know, but their show was good.
And I was like, I hope some Salvadorians should do this because, but, you know, like they're so good in the context of El Salvador.
And I said, yeah, it should be good.
And we waited like a few months and there was nobody doing it.
And then one day, well, several days, my friend says like, you know, you know too much things about this.
You should record yourself or you should record with your family.
And then when they talk with my parents, also with my friends, they several times told me like, you should record yourself about doing this.
But of course, now I'm fluent and I'm not shy anymore.
But, you know, when you start, you're shy with the camera.
You don't know how to speak.
You always say.
But now I'm fluent.
So I was like, OK, no, but I know, but I don't know much, but I know people that know a little bit.
and my journey started because for reason of life i was friend of julian linear shout out to julian
which he is the ceo of uh relay that is the broker here in europe uh of bitcoin and also lena sage
that she's now in el salvador and and she's helping the bitcoin office she has the little
hudler um so yeah and they were actually my first host so that's how the journey started
in in the podcast but yeah in the end what convinced me to to switch to bitcoin was what
i told you that i i realized why the reason why actually bitcoin is only decentralized and how i
connected with the salvador is because uh we come from a poor country and we have a lot of that
And I know that even nowadays, the things that we are struggling in El Salvador is that people connect Bitcoin with Bukele.
And I get it.
And I don't judge that.
Because in 2001, we pivoted to dollars.
We used to have colones.
And when that happened, our grandparents lost.
Think about like around nine.
And divide by nine their savings because $1 was 8.75 cologne.
So imagine saving all your life without a pension, without anything.
And suddenly you pivot to something else and it's divided by nine.
So, of course, the life is more expensive or whatever, right?
But because I have started Bitcoin and then I saw what Bukele was doing, okay, I was like, okay.
and and from what i knew back then now i know more about bukele but i know that he was a business
person uh he's that as well so i was like okay the president is a smart guy so he won't he won't do
it just because you know uh and he wants to do something different and probably if you want we
can talk a little bit about his background later but he has like a little proof of work let's say
about what he did when he started in politics.
So I was like, okay, this guy is smart.
So that's why what he's doing in El Sonte
and now a national level has to be a little bit bigger.
It's not just because fame or popularity
or to gain votes because he was already popular,
you know, so he didn't need votes.
He was truly because he wanted to do a change in the country.
Did that answer your question?
Yeah, absolutely.
I loved Dino.
I thought that is so good
Here in the states we use rhino
Republican in name only
We do?
We do use that?
Yeah in the states
I've never heard that before
Are you serious?
You've never heard of rhino?
I don't
You know
I'm not a political individual
So then I guess
Would dino also maybe mean
Democrat in name only?
Or you don't have those?
We only have rhinos
No
I think they're only rhinos
Okay
Alright
Yeah
I mean, Democrats are, they have progressive.
I was waiting for the H, like Republicans Hotel in name only.
I mean, they do actually spell it with an H.
Oh, they do?
Yeah, but it's Republican in name only.
The H just doesn't translate to the actual thing.
No, no, no, it's just there.
Seems good.
You skipped the H.
Yeah, skipped the H.
Yeah, so I loved how you made Dino decentralized in name only.
And I was like, oh, that's nice.
And it sounded like the reason why you felt like cryptocurrency was decentralized in name only is because many of them are either copying the foundational aspects of Bitcoin and tweaking it to try to make it maybe faster or maybe more transactions or maybe more private.
And other cryptocurrencies seem like they might spring from another code base altogether.
But no matter what, what your point was there is that since Satoshi built this without any real desire to profit from it.
And then, in fact, he left and just said, hey, here's this.
Here's this thing I made.
You know, you guys check it out.
It's truly decentralized.
It's truly unselfish or selfish in a way where everyone has all their incentives aligned to be unselfish in the end.
But for you, these other copycats were just powered by individuals who were trying to iterate on top of Bitcoin in a way that would bring them greater wealth than what we all should be doing, which is simply stacking sats, picking up as much of this neutral money network as we can, and doing hard work and putting value out there into the world, right?
Absolutely.
So, it was interesting for me to learn as well that El Salvador flipped to the U.S. dollar in 2001 and then basically broke its contract with all the Salvadorians who were saving in the Colone or what was the name of it?
Was it Colone?
Colones was in 2001.
Yeah.
Colones.
So if you had saved 900,000 colones,
then all of a sudden they flipped it dollars
and you can only buy $100,000 worth of stuff now.
Like that would be devastating if I were,
and I thought about the people in Lebanon as well,
you know, who saved up
and then basically it was chopped by one sixth.
It's like, dude, that is,
You would be devastated at the end of your life if your life savings that you had counted on being worth something was chopped into one six or one ninth.
I mean, yeah.
And for all of our listeners in America who think, all right, well, we aren't El Salvador.
You know, we are not Lebanon.
nobody's going to suddenly suddenly drop the value of our money that badly.
So why do I need Bitcoin?
America actually has, in fact, done this already.
So when the 6102 order made it illegal for Americans in the 1930s
or somewhere around there to hold on to large amounts of gold, right?
On pain of like a $10,000 fine in jail time.
Like it was a big deal.
They had to turn in their gold to the banks, okay?
And at the time, one ounce of gold was worth $20.
Once they collected all the gold as much as they could,
they revalued the gold just arbitrarily and said,
This is now, it now takes $35 to buy one ounce of gold,
which basically means you would need almost twice as much money
to buy the same amount of gold.
So it wasn't chopped in one-sixth like Lebanon.
It wasn't chopped one-ninth like El Salvador,
which is even more insane.
It was chopped in half.
But in the 30s, I think it was the 1930s,
America chopped the value of its citizen savings in half.
And guess what, folks?
if you're here in America, especially since the start of the pandemic and all of the money printing,
where they added 40% of the money supply back on top of what was already there,
they kind of basically did in that moment, make your savings worth half as much as it was.
It's been creeping out over the years, right? And they're like, oh, we're at 2% inflation,
3% inflation, when really we're at like 9%, 10%, 11%. And certain categories are just twice as
expensive period. Like they're doing it to us as well here in America. And what we're trying to
bring you all with stories like Juan's grandparents story here is that this can happen to you and it
has happened to your parents and grandparents and great grandparents. So you need to get into
something that is not a dino, right? You need to get yourself into Bitcoin, man. So one thing I
want to hear from you too, Juan, is to go back to this blockchain moment because I'm still stuck on
that. I think if I'm a brand new Bitcoiner, and I'm only two years into this journey myself,
so I'm pretty dang brand new as well. The blockchain to me was this incredible new thing
that allows each of us to send each other Bitcoin
without any funny business.
Because you're basically recording that traction,
that transaction in over 20,000 ledgers globally,
individually, right?
To where you just can't cheat that system.
It felt super newfangled.
I feel like it's a big part of what makes Bitcoin go.
But as an industrial engineer, you're saying the blockchain is old.
Can you tell us more about that?
Yeah.
That is good, man.
One thing I will say is that I haven't studied this much since back then, but I'll tell you what I remind.
So, okay.
So what I remind is that, okay, so there's different ways to process information.
So let's say the best thing about blockchain is that it's used with encryption.
But of course, now it's more popular because Bitcoin uses it.
But their origins, I think, is back in the 90s, if I'm not mistaken.
so
I don't
remind exactly the last name
I think it was
Stornetta, something like that
Scott Stornetta
that he
and another one that I don't remind his name
had designed like the first
system of blocks
which were secured by cryptography
and those ones
were used to
sign digital documents
so because you know
when you sign with cryptography,
sign documents,
you cannot alterate that.
It's like,
you know,
the most simple thing,
right,
nowadays,
that when you have a PDF
that you cannot alterate
unless you have,
you pay for a software
that you can alterate that,
right?
So,
that's one thing.
And the other one,
I think,
that I remind
is that
it was used
in
the tree of Merkle.
So,
So in the trial market, basically what it does is that it groups several documents into one single block.
So what it does nowadays that we know is that that makes more efficient the way that information is processed into a block.
So now you have several information, just take it to a block.
but then that information I think evolved into engineering and into some concepts that nowadays
we know in the 2000s but now remind that I was talking about the 19th 1999 now we're talking
about thousands so even proof of work now we are in 2026 so proof of work probably was used
the first day in the thousands 2004 or something like that and it was used with things
that were before bitcoin like hash cash uh or i don't remind the other name i think it was
reusable proof of work.
Yeah, our pal.
Hal Finney.
Hal Finney. Yes, yes, yes.
No, you're reminding me of
the Genesis book by Aaron Van Weirdam.
So this is, you know,
for a minute I was thinking that you were about to claim
that the blockchain was like
maybe something that some guys did with pencil and paper
in the 18th century.
like during the Industrial Revolution.
Yeah, also as well.
But it is really important to remember,
and I learned this reading the Genesis book that Bitcoin is an assembly of other things that have been around for a while
And to Juan's point, the blockchain was,
at least there's a moment in the book that I remember where
people were trying to figure out how to prove conclusively
that somebody signed a document online
at a specific day and time.
And I think it was to basically...
The sunrise.
I think you would take the document
and you would take the signature and all that
and you would hash it.
You would send it through that one-way process
that would create a value
that can only be created if this is exactly the same.
If you change even one element about it and send it back through,
you get a different value.
And so you can say, no, this document has been tampered with.
So, you know, hashing in order to say that something happened
and it's 100% true, that's been around.
But then using that hash, a number, using the hashing process many times in a row in order to achieve a specific value at the end, in order to say yes to something, was actually Adam Back's idea of limiting email spam.
right so they originally want to prove that a document has not been tampered with and then this
other guy says well if we just make a computer run this process an arbitrary number of times
until they find a specific number you basically can put a certain amount of work around
an activity to make sure that people can't abuse it and in a world where you can send
1 million emails per split second into every single person's inbox, if they need to do 60
seconds of work as a computer in order to gain the right to send an email, then sending a million
emails all at once becomes impossible for a spammer to achieve, right? It's just too costly.
And then you had the Merkel trees.
You have the economics you talked about where at university, they've been teaching you that Keynesian economics where governments are allowed to step in and kind of do whatever they feel is necessary to smooth things out.
But oops, guess what?
It actually makes each thing, each version of the bad thing even worse.
you know they're teaching you austrian economics or you have to teach yourself austrian economics
which is hey do i have this money or do i not have it it's literally so simple it's it's insane
that it's not the the standard but short story long one is reminding me that bitcoin just like
simple steve said it's like the wright brothers made an airplane out of spare lawnmower parts
and it flew beautifully the first time and then they disappeared okay so the the hashing time
stamp thing is that what docu-sign uses or do they use a like a different version of that because
like you can see different like time stamps and i'm saying docu-sign there are other like signing
yeah like technology pieces i don't know but they they must they must do something but i i think the
breakthrough on the bitcoin side was connecting it to money is doing it without a central authority
Like DocuSign itself probably has its own records.
And if you wanted to, you might be able to corrupt a human being inside DocuSign.
Well, it's owned by a company.
Like it's a person.
Yeah.
And maybe they could change the records on their end and say, no, that hasn't been tampered with.
I don't know.
The thing with Bitcoin is nobody can get in there and change that because mathematically, it would create a different number at the end of that process if it has been changed.
Yeah, dang.
It's crazy.
Now, let's bring this back down to earth, Juan, because that was a little technical for Hank and Lorraine.
But look, Hank, look Lorraine.
And Anna Bevan.
Let's not just let Hank and Lorraine have that moment.
My advice to the brand new big corner in a moment like this is don't turn your brain off, right? Don't look away from that. Stick with it and say, hey, it takes time to understand how technologies work. Quite frankly, many of us don't even understand how some of the technologies work that we use every single day.
I can't literally describe to you how my car works.
I just know that it does.
And it's been verified by a million humans on earth who do know exactly how it works.
And some robots.
Same is true for Bitcoin.
We have millions and millions and millions of Bitcoiners who have studied Bitcoin as much as they possibly can with their levels of expertise and said, okay, this does work, right?
And when we're here welcoming in the next million brand new Bitcoiners, some of it you're just going to have to trust us on for a little bit while you try to figure stuff like that.
But if you can stick with it, like reading that book, Juan, I can't really say it back to somebody what that book taught me.
But there were moments where I could glimpse cryptography.
Like I just could barely get a grasp on it and go, wow, this is insane technology.
And for Bitcoin to be like 12 breakthrough technologies all braided together artfully by some mysterious individual, it's just insane to sit down and think about Bitcoin sometimes.
Now, if we bring it back down to the real world here, let's talk to...
Now, you're in Barcelona and you're not living in El Salvador right now.
I split my time, like six months.
So have you been to El Sante?
Have you been to Bitcoin Beach?
What can Anna Bevin expect when it's time for her to fly down there and have a little, have some vacaciones?
I love that.
Bitcoin related or tourist related or Salvador related?
Ooh, dealer's choice.
However you take that.
Yeah.
Okay.
so I'll give a hint of everything
a mix of everything
so
yeah I think
what you can expect is that
you can go to El Sante
Bitcoin Beach and you will
find Bitcoin circular
economy which means
that probably anywhere that you
go even if it is
a small shop
like you know like
very family business
that small shop that they sell
like Coca-Cola
and chips or whatever
they will accept you Bitcoin
they will say yes
and
and yes
in El Salvador related
I think El Salvador is beautiful
so the beach
are awesome, the mountains are
awesome, the city
it's even beautiful
but there's a reality
that yes we did
Bitcoin legal tender
not anymore but it's still using it
but
I think that
people don't realize
that there are two efforts right now
happening in El Salvador
the grassroots efforts
and from the top to bottom
so the two are things
are happening simultaneously
the only difference in El Salvador
is that now we don't have it as a legal
tender but in the reality nothing has changed in the contrary i think the efforts have evolved even
more why is that because there are grassroots efforts like no nation and bitcoin berlin that
those are let's say independent projects that not related to the bitcoin office that for example
Bitcoin Berlin, they replicated the same thing that happened in El Sante, that it started orange
building people in Berlin, in the mountains. And when we say orange building is basically
teach about how to use Bitcoin in the most simple way. Why? I don't know. A grandma will say,
why would I accept Bitcoin instead of the dollar? And the reason is, hey, grandma, do you have
access to a bank account do you have a bank account and she will say no because actually
the bank is like i don't know like 50 miles away because i was living in a small city so i need to
take the bus it takes time whatever and then some people are so poor that they don't have even
the way to get an id and of course to open a bank account you need your id right
a reminder that we come now salvador is probably one of the safest if not the safest uh country
in latin america uh but we were the most dangerous country in the world in the world not in latin
america in the world so you need to have the context of that so not just the time that you
need to take to go to another city to open in a bank account um uh is what you need to take into
into account, but also the danger of the country, right?
So nowadays, as I said, in Bitcoin Berlin,
what they're trying to do is that in Berlin,
they have built a circular economy.
What now the grandma says, like, hey, why should I accept Bitcoin?
Okay, yeah, the country is safe, but still the bank is so far away.
Do you have any family members that probably help you in your economy
or, for example, your grandkids, your daughter, I don't know,
your son that helps you that live outside.
And they say, yes.
Okay, how do you receive money?
Okay, probably through Western Union.
Okay, how much time takes to go there?
But in the end, it's come to the same thing, the same problem, right?
Probably it's a grandma that I'm just using the example of the grandma
as one of the many examples.
She needs to go to the city, make the queue in this sort of things and spend time and spend money because, of course, they need to take a transfer station.
And then they will receive the money back.
But with Bitcoin, they say, OK, but let's do some tests.
I'm going to send you some stats right now.
and of course yes one thing that you need to know and probably you don't know is that people even if
you are in countries that are in conflicts or not you have a phone and i'm not saying an iphone i'm
not you imagine iphone xiaomi no i'm talking about a phone a phone that you can download something
that run bitcoin it's enough so yeah of course she has her phone so i'll say okay i'll send you
on SATs so they send SATs how it takes you know guys like seconds probably one two seconds so now
imagine your son is in the US and he wants to send you money we don't care how much uh and you do the
test you you call him hey uh do you know about bitcoin they say yes and they say okay now your
mom used bitcoin so send some SATs instantly so that's the things that they try to replicate in
bitcoin berlin uh that's one of the efforts but the other one that i think are more powerful
in elizabeth it's um some projects like no nations that no nation teach about kids
teach kids sorry about bitcoin and probably about everything related to bitcoin in the most simple
way like playing so and of course kids loves to play so i'm sharing all these stories because in
the end if you go to el sablo like el sante you will experience all these circular economies
but if you go to other places like bitcoin berlin you will see that there's another type of economy
evolving as much as El Sante.
And there are small grassroots efforts across all of El Salvador.
So if I were you and you tell me, hey, I'm going to El Salvador next month.
Yeah, do the things that Bitcoiners do that always go to El Sante, Bitcoin Berlin, but
explore the country because you will see grassroots efforts everywhere that it's happening.
And people are learning about Bitcoin.
And why?
Because there's a need.
And the need is one of the most simple ones that the most impactful and the most urgent one in El Salvador, now that it's safe, is that people still don't have access to bank account.
And through Bitcoin, they can have access to the bank services, let's say, without a bank, right?
So that's the more powerful thing that we can do.
Incredible. Incredible.
So, you know, what I'm hearing as an American is that not every person on earth has easy access to a bank account digitally or physically.
Right. You might not have access through the web.
You might have you might not have access because it's 50 miles away.
Maybe you have somebody that's working outside of your country
to earn more money and they're sending it back.
It's going through Western Union, slow, clunky.
There's fees.
Some countries even have rent seekers who hang out near the Western Union to kind of hit you up for some of your money as you coming out But in America you know we don often run into someone that doesn have a bank account or that can access
one. And usually most Americans who are born in America aren't sending money to family worldwide.
But, and so that plus many other things creates an environment where Americans just aren't that
interested in Bitcoin, but it's like, guys, Juan is describing a world where your grandma
in El Salvador with no practical access to a bank can become her own bank through Bitcoin
and receive transmissions from family members working in other countries
instantly on the lightning network or pretty dang quick on chain, right? And can go from someone
that really can't work very easily with money to someone who can stack sats and stay humble. I mean,
guys and girls, are people sending billions of dollars from developed countries back to their
families in less developed countries? Are they sending one or two trillion dollars per year?
I can't remember. But if Bitcoin's market capitalization is between one and two trillion right now, and eventually the whole world jumps on board and is sending one to two trillion more back to one another, what do you think is going to happen to the dollar price of Bitcoin?
I can give you, sorry to interrupt, I can give you actually an example that relies, I think, on people in America. Just like the grandma, I can escalate this even to right now, really quick, like what's going on with the conflict that we are now with Iran.
so actually I have a conversation with Alex Tansik
for guys that don't know he used to be a goldback
now he's a full bitcoiner
but he explains this that gold
let's say gold because as you mentioned
the story in 1971
we used to use gold right after the war too right
but he said he told me something that clicks on me
And I said, OK, I think here I can see a real value on Bitcoin for countries like the US or Russia or China.
That is that gold can work in peacetime, but now we are in wartime.
And I think the panorama is going to that direction.
So gold cannot work that way, but we can.
And I'm going to explain a really quick why.
why because he says that when you work with gold and you and you have your clients where we call
let's say nations or let's say powerful companies they say like uh well he was explaining he was
explaining his uh in his case right so let's use alex he says like hey alex i need to i i need that
you deliver this kind of gold this quantity of gold in this vault in x country uh but what happens
When you need to move gold to another country, you need the supply of gold, you need people to secure it, and you need, of course, the way to deliver.
So let's say that you can do that, you start doing it.
He used COVID time, but in this example, he used this time.
So imagine that you're crossing gold, I don't know, from United States to Europe.
And now we're in times of war.
So you move gold, the huge quantity of gold through ships, right?
But what can happen right now that the ship can be sink?
So because we're in wartime.
So what happens to gold?
It disappears.
And that is something that he told me that's called failure to deliver.
And that's the most critical thing that for gold boats can happen.
You cannot have a failure to deliver ever because the transactions are settled down, are closed.
You need to deliver those things.
So if you fail, that's really bad for your reputation.
Probably the worst thing that can happen for a gold box ever.
You need to deliver somehow.
But of course, there's a lot of things that could happen, right?
That, as I told you, you can lose the gold because the ship will be sinking.
So, and that your business is ruined.
But then he told me that in COVID, he thought that, okay, if he has gold in Switzerland, in the vaults, and he needs to move to the US or to another part of Europe, Switzerland, back then, he put all the planes down.
So nobody can take off, nobody can land, right?
So right now, let's say that it's kind of similar in some situations because we're in war.
But with Bitcoin, you can do that.
So a client can say, hey, I need to move this quantity, this amount of Bitcoin to this client, to this part of the world, this part of the world.
Bitcoin is not physical.
So you can send that amount of money instantly.
And you can do it even in wartime, because even if they try to do anything to steal your Bitcoin, how they're going to do it?
It's unstoppable.
When it's in the network, it's done.
When the transaction is done, you cannot do anything.
So it's instantly.
So that, I think, is the real case and one of the valuable things that you can do in Bitcoin nowadays.
100%.
You can send Bitcoin to anyone at any time for any reason, and no one can get in between you and that transaction.
It might be to take money out of a wartime zone.
It might be to send money to your abuela.
It might be to pay for a coffee at some shop that has a square terminal that's set up by Jack Dorsey and the folks at Block to accept Bitcoin.
But nobody can stop you, which is super important.
And there's so much more to Bitcoin that makes it super valuable.
We'll never fit it into a single chat about sats.
So we do ask each of our guests if they'd be willing to come back on in nueve meses
to give us an update on their Bitcoin baby.
Would you be willing to do that for us, Juan?
Of course.
Why not?
Okay, let's go.
Now we're going to take a break here for Ithaca Hummus
before we ask you to give us your two sats.
All right.
So we are tasting today from Ithaca Hummus,
our Buy the Dip moment sponsor,
reminding us to buy the dip.
Great time to buy the dip right now.
Absolutely.
68, 160 on the Clark Moody.
On the Clark Moody.
We are tasting the lemon dill.
So we are going to act as your taste buds in the studio today.
So cheers.
Cheers.
you need to need to make more noise guys
are you being sarcastic
no i love this man i forgot i'm like this was my first love
s-a-s-l-a-s-a-m-r right it's the a-s-m-r man the little crunch there
It tastes like, for me, like a fresh, cold dill pickle a little bit.
Yeah.
Just a little bit of that dill.
Because that dill flavoring kind of makes it feel a little bit like a pickle.
But it's creamy.
It's delicious.
It sort of reminds me of cucumber sandwiches.
I've been oddly craving cucumber sandwiches lately.
Mm-hmm.
I think it's got to be all the Regency era tea times I've been watching.
But Alfred, it's tea time.
Come to tea time, Alistair.
Exactly, all of those.
And that's sort of what it reminds me of.
It feels cozy, elegant.
Yeah.
And sort of delightful for a midday snack.
So, Juan, now we're going to try something new here
where you're going to offer us your two sats.
You got nine months between now and when you come back on.
So that's basically about November or Deciembre of this año.
What can a brand new Bitcoiner expect to experience over the next nine months?
You know, you talked about wartime.
We're in a dip right now.
There's some contention inside the Bitcoin community
around whether to take Bitcoin in this direction
or take Bitcoin in that direction.
Does any of that even matter?
What should a Bitcoiner who's brand new do over the next nine months?
And what do you think is going to happen over the next nine?
That's a really good question.
I was thinking about it.
I'm not good in predictions, but what I don't know is that Bitcoin comes or people discovered Bitcoin by nits.
That's what happened to us in Salvador.
So it would translate it because just even the war and this thing.
And so depending on what's going to happen and who are the countries implicated, probably they will find a need in Bitcoin.
For example, we don't need to go that far when the conflict between Ukraine and Russia happened.
Ukrainians actually discovered Bitcoin because the banks were closed once the war started.
so they couldn't withdraw their money, right?
So there was a need in that, and they discovered Bitcoin.
They used that that way.
So probably what I think is that if this is a scale that we are on uncertainty,
probably we'll see that there will be a need on money,
on how to transact money.
And as I explained to you, it can be two cases,
like normal regular people are us or a macro level like nations, right?
So it's very complex, this topic.
But if there's a need, probably we will see an increase on Bitcoin.
And of course, one of the beautiful things that happens on Bitcoin
is that there's no regulation, there's no control,
it's free market, it's Austrian economics, which is supply and demand.
So if there's more demand and we have a fixed supply, we know that even by the nature of Bitcoin that is deflationary, probably we will see an increase on price.
I don't know, probably because we're kind of a bear market, but these are uncertain times, right?
So probably we'll see that.
So in summary, I think we'll probably use, we will see more use cases of Bitcoin in certain regions.
And because of the demand, probably we'll see that the price will go up.
Let's go.
Yeah.
The more people realize they have a need to move money when they're ready to move money, no matter what's going on, good, bad, or neutral.
Yeah.
The more Bitcoin adoption will grow.
so Juan thank you for your time
where can our Satillionaires
go to spend time with you and your podcast
oh yeah
so probably
we focus
on Fontaine so now actually we have
people to show to Fontaine
so you can watch there
watch and listen there
just
search for BitConner podcast and now actually
we're expanding this so this is the breaking news
for you guys
yeah alpha drop
so now we're expanding
Bitcoin our podcast
normally we have the main show
and some monthly shows
with Bitcoin Felfast
where we do things related to culture
Hollywood exposing the broken systems
but now the guys of Bitcoin Berlin
that they're doing an amazing show
every single month
once a month
they show what they have been building
in Berlin
so now they're part of Bitcoin our podcast
and now they're coming to the show
directly from El Salvador.
So you can have BitCorners,
three shows right now.
My main show,
the collaboration with Bitcoin Film Fest
and the guys from Bitcoin Berlin.
And also you can find me in Noster
and Twitter by the handle of
D Juan SC.
So there you go.
Let's go.
All right, Abes.
All right, Satillionaires.
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Gosh, you're doing such a good job
at the Vanna White, Stuart.
I'm born for this.
I would be so good on QVC, by the way.
Definitely.
And Sat Chats is for educational purposes only
and should not be construed as financial advice.
Our guest views are their own.
And until next time, keep stacking them sats.
Farewell.