Live from Fled Lab in Austin, Texas, this is Stacker News Live!
Hello, ladies and gentlemen. Welcome back to another exciting episode of Stacker News Live.
My name's Carb with Kiot and Topher Scott.
You guys have a camera.
You'll just hear his voice.
Yeah.
Just the ghost in the corner of the room.
How was your last week?
My week was pretty good.
Went to BitDevs last night.
How was it?
It was good.
I saw Jimmy Song talk on Monday at the Builders Club.
What else did I do?
Oh, I finally put my PR up for review.
I've been working on it forever.
What is that?
It's like a unified ledger for Stacker News.
Posts the non-custodial switch, which is really nice once it gets reviewed.
That's it, though.
What did you do, Topher?
I think I did the same things you did.
Oh, okay.
I also went to see Jimmy Song speak at the meetup.
the Bitcoin builders meetup and then also went to BitDevs.
Yeah.
It was a fun BitDevs.
Too much knots on core versus core talk for me, but it was fun.
Yeah.
Got to talk about it maybe.
Got to talk about some exploits, supply chain attack, all that good stuff.
Yeah.
So.
That's a good BitDevs.
Awesome.
Sounds great.
How was your week, Har?
It was super busy.
We got a lot of stuff going on.
Startup school, startup day.
What else happened?
Bitcoin builders meet up.
What else do we have going on?
Yeah, a lot of stuff.
I saw it 28 years later.
I was telling you before the show.
It's really good, dude.
It's the third one, right?
Or the fourth one?
So apparently I found out they're making a trilogy of these movies.
So it's going to be a trilogy.
and they basically
the second movie that happened
so it was 28 days later
then it was 28 weeks
weeks later
and then it was 28 years later
so the 28 weeks later
is
doesn't exist
oh they think
they're going
they retro
how do you say that
they retconned it
why
it's like literally
in the beginning of the movie
it's not a spoiler
because it just comes up
it's like the title card
But it's retconned.
Well, it's like 28 years later, so they could just ignore it.
I think it's because Alex Garland, the writer, and Danny Boyle, the director, were just like,
no, bro, we're not doing that.
We're not taking that.
Because it was not done by them.
Oh, now I get it.
Okay.
That's fair.
Yeah.
It's a good movie.
I didn't mind that movie at all.
It's a really good movie.
Yeah.
That's my memory of it.
I would definitely recommend it.
I guess maybe they just didn't like the trajectory it took the story on.
Yeah, it's on Apple TV.
It's like $4.99 to rent.
All right.
Wait, the new one is $4.99?
Yeah.
Oh.
That's cheaper than I thought I was expecting.
Because usually they're like $20 this early.
Yeah, I've noticed Sony does really good movies lately.
They're like the only one that doesn't do the woke stuff I've noticed.
Everybody else is doing that kind of stuff.
They're just trying to make good banger movies.
Anyways, if you've never seen this crazy show before,
we talk about Bitcoin news on the front page of Bitcoin every week
called Stacker.News.
Turns out this crazy little website right here called Stacker.News is growing.
Turns out.
I keep seeing it more in search results.
Keep seeing it in LLMs.
don't see it talked about in media,
at least not yet,
but who knows?
Maybe we'll see it on CNBC.
Maybe we'll see Coob on CNBC one day.
We'll see.
I won't be there.
I'm not going on CNBC.
Maybe you can send somebody else.
Anyways,
but we have all these clips.
Check them out.
They're a lot of fun.
We have some really cool stuff.
We're live now.
Oh,
that's us.
You can check out all these popular videos,
full link videos,
some debates.
You know, the usual stuff.
We even talk about Jack and Noster.
That's a good thing.
I remember that.
That was a long time ago.
Yeah, a long time ago.
We've been doing this for a long time.
I guess so.
Yeah, you have any anniversaries coming up?
Oh, we're going to talk about that later in the show.
It's great that you brought that up.
I actually don't know.
Anyways, but let's jump into the top five stories of the week
here on Stacker News Live.
the number five top story this week is Clara and the sun book review.
This is from simple stacker,
eight comments,
19,
well,
1848 sets.
Keon.
What's this?
Yeah.
This is a new,
I guess this is one of the later books from Kazuo.
I don't know how you say that name.
Kazuo Ishiguro.
They wrote never let me go.
and they've written a lot of fiction novels.
They kind of specialize in this kind of, I don't know,
it's like sort of surreal sci-fi,
like very deep and emotional type of sci-fi.
And this is no different.
This one's about cloning.
It has themes in it that are similar to Gattaca,
if you've seen the movie Gattaca,
where some people are getting cloned
and they get higher station in society
and some people aren't cloned and they get lower station
or genetically modified, I mean.
Yeah, they get the designer genetics.
Yeah, designer genetics, that's the word.
And yeah, I guess one of the book is told
from the perspective of the family's robot
that is a companion to a sickly child
who is sickly because of genetic modifications.
The parents were wealthy and got her the genetic modifications,
but she ended up sick, as sometimes happens.
And so it's all in the respect of this robot,
and the robot is tasked by the mother to learn as much about the daughter as possible
so that when she dies, the robot can replace her.
And that's the telling of the story that I learned from this review.
Yeah, I want to check it out.
I didn't know it was the same person that made Never Let Me Go.
They've written a lot of books.
Scoresby mentions them in the comments.
I think there's like five that Scoresby has read.
So it's interesting.
It's funny that we're talking about Alex Garland.
He's like friends with that guy.
Oh, this is a guy?
I always thought it was a woman.
No.
So if it's the same author that wrote Never Let Me Go,
he's actually friends with Alex Garland,
the guy who wrote 28 Days Later.
oh well now he's a filmmaker now too but like um there was a post that i posted a long time ago
talking about never let me go and the themes in that movie or the theme yeah themes in that movie
because i never read the novel but um but uh yeah they're like they're like friends in that area of
like i guess the uk or whatever but um dude that movie is so good never let me go like mark romaneck
i think was the director or the filmmaker and he was known for making these amazing music videos in
90s in the late in the early 2000s and then he made that movie and it was just like the pinnacle
of because that book was such such a profound book never let me go apparently and then like
when he made it they got mark mark romenick to direct it or to to make the to do the to do the
film and it was just like it was like whoa that like i remember read the book when i was a teenager
i remember it being really good i refused to watch the movie that's how much i like the book
I mean
the movies
like it's still
like I just saw it
recently like a month
ago again
because it was like
it's so good
it just takes you
it just transports
you to another
time
even though it's
the future
well that's another
time the future
no but like in the movie
the whole point
of the movie
I don't know how it is
in the book
but in the movie
like these kids
they're trying to find out
like the whole point
of the movie is like
they were just trying
to find out
if they had souls
or not
that they had a human soul.
Okay.
It's kind of sad.
It's really sad.
Have you seen the movie, Topher, or read the book?
Which movie?
Never Let Me Go.
No, I haven't.
I've seen Gattaca.
Okay.
Yeah, Gattaca is one of my favorites.
Yeah, one of the best.
Cool.
So, Kazuo Ishiguro.
Okay.
Is very much a dude Okay thank you Yeah he was born in Nagasaki Yeah 1950s I usually got to check the genitals That how I know
Google search suffices
to. Cool.
Great stuff.
The next top, number
four top story of the week is how safe
do you feel in America? This is from
StackHarder, 83 comments, 1,239
cents.
Do you feel safe in America?
I do for the most part.
I mean, I've never lived anywhere else or spent a lot of time anywhere else.
But most other places I've spent time in, I also felt pretty safe there.
It might differ depending on the way you show up in the world.
But I try to stay invisible most places.
Yeah, I feel relatively safe,
even though I guess maybe less safe than I have in the past,
given that I spend a lot more time around people
that seem to be having a bad time on the streets.
But yeah, I feel pretty safe.
Do you feel?
I don't know.
I feel like, oh, I want to hear from Topher.
Topher, do you feel safe in America?
Depends.
Depends where you're living.
Austin has gotten increasingly less safe.
uh,
LA has very many unsafe places.
Um,
but then there's other places that are incredibly safe.
So I don't know.
America is a very big country and there's so many cities are very different.
So I would say for the most part,
America feels safe,
but there's like some places that you got to look out for.
Yeah.
I've,
to be honest,
There was a time where I didn't feel safe, probably when I was growing up, but that was maybe because I was a young kid and I was like, you know, when you're young, you kind of fear everything.
And then, you know, then you're in your 20s, you kind of go out there and you kind of just become this like fearless young man.
You're just not, you don't really.
You're like, I made it to adulthood.
I can die.
Well, you don't really, you don't really think of consequences, I guess, when you're a young man, I guess you don't really.
That tracks.
Yeah.
I guess maybe you don't think, or at least I didn't.
I don't know.
I guess it was more fearless back then.
And then there does get a time.
I think when I got married is when I started getting more fearful.
I think because I started a family.
And then once I found Christ or when I went back to Christ,
now I'm back to not fearing anything.
So I think it just kind of goes back to individual,
how safe do they feel.
But I don't know.
It just really just depends on the person, I think.
Less so than the place?
Yeah, I think so.
So you think you could be like in Ukraine
and feel safe or...
Yeah, but...
Depending on your...
Did you ever read that?
What's the name?
It's the notorious book.
I haven't read the book,
but people have told me about it.
It's the one where the guy
who was in the Nazi camps
and what's that one?
Auschwitz?
Yeah.
The Gulag Archivago.
It's like Vikur, Vikur, Dosh, whatever.
It's like a famous book.
He's like one of the guys that was in the concentration cab.
So he got to a point where he saw so many people dying.
And at a certain point, he just realized that he was,
he's already like, I don't know.
I forget how it's summed up in the book.
maybe one of the stackers can put in the comments or put on the thing,
but it was basically, it just basically just,
he just basically summed up and said something like to the likes of like,
once you realize like basically memento mori,
like once you realize like death comes for everybody,
you just don't fear it.
And then you just move on with life and you accept it.
And I think that's where he had gotten to at a certain point,
once he was in the concentration camps, he had seen death. He was closed.
He was closed with death because all the ashes and just got to a certain
point where in his mind he was
already free so it didn't matter
yeah
it's an interesting challenge
it's like a human challenge
to get past that fear it's like the mind
is the biggest mountain to climb
it's interesting because it's introduced to you
because kids don't have a fear of
death
and I've noticed that even with things becoming
increasingly unsafe
in society, society becoming a little more
unstable to keep releasing
criminals out into the streets
what I notice from kids is that they still seem just as fearless
from physical harm
they have the same fearlessness as I had
when I was a kid
so it's like for physical harm kids are fearless
but then social harm is different
that's an interesting one
kids are still fearful of experiencing a social death
like if they're ostracized
or if like, yeah, their reputation is ruined.
Like that's worse.
Like social harm, it seems like for kids,
like social harm is even worse than physical harm.
Yeah, I could see that.
It's kind of crazy.
I don't know.
Was it like that for you when you were a kid?
I think it goes out for everybody, right?
Like in high school when people are like make fun of you.
Like I remember this guy who like,
he pooped in his pants and then everybody made fun of him.
And then he like, he transferred schools too.
He had to transfer schools.
Just because he pooped in his pants.
you're done
no
but I
we were still friends with him
like we went to his birthday party
and everything
we're like hey what happened
he's like oh
we moved or whatever
I was like
no we couldn't do that
I had like
I had like three brothers
and one sister
there's no way my mom would move
just because I pooped my pants
that's funny
wow
yeah I definitely think
I definitely think
I definitely think it does.
I think at the end of the day,
it does come down to the man though,
like to protect his family.
And if he's fearful,
then the rest of his family is going to be fearful.
So it really is up to the man to like conquer his mind
and make sure that his family's safe.
So if, yeah, you know what I mean?
Yeah.
So do you feel safe in America?
I do.
Don't feel like anything's going to happen to me.
To be honest.
But the other day I was walking.
I remember I was telling you when I was going to 7-Eleven over here.
Like some guy was like trying to step up to me.
And I was just like, wow.
That hasn't happened in a long time.
And then I…
Oh, he's an F word.
A guy.
No, he was just like saying that he was going to punch me in the face.
And I was just like, yeah, that's not going to happen.
And then I just kept walking right through him.
But I think honestly, I don't take offense to that.
Because if it would have been somebody else behind me,
it probably would have been that person anyway.
I think he was just on one and he wanted to go to jail.
so
yeah I wonder if
because I kind of look at it more like
like okay cool then we're gonna get into
a fight like I don't see it
as like but you pick up you picked up
on like he was looking to start
something and so all you
like you didn't take it personally all you really
had to do is just not I just gotta defend myself
like but I don't I think
I've been in enough like
squabs or whatever like I don't
I'm not gonna like not defend myself
if that makes any sense
but also I'm not going to go look for a fight either
but I'm also not going to back down either
does that make sense? I'm just going to hold my ground
yeah but they're looking
to like trigger you
people that are like that they're on something
and they're looking to start a fight
they're looking to trigger you
sure
but that doesn't work though with me
because I have God on my side
so
yeah there's a lot of people
that are very on edge
yeah I think it's because they see people like that
and they get fearful
because they say something like that to them.
But to me, I'm kind of like,
cool, I'll see you when I get out of the 7-Eleven.
So I have to say,
so I came back from Europe recently
and I've been to Europe a couple of times
and there's way more screaming,
crazy people on the streets in the US
than the places I've been in Europe.
And so, I don't know,
it's like generally felt...
more safe in Europe versus U.S.
But it's more complicated than that.
Because I don't walk around carrying.
It's not yet.
In Europe?
No, in Europe.
You can't carry.
But in the U.S., I don't walk around carrying.
I guess if I did, I would feel more safe.
In Texas, you absolutely can.
This is why you don't do that to people.
This is why you don't come up to somebody and say,
I'm gonna punch you in the face because you might get shot.
So why you don't do that in Texas?
So it's interesting.
Like I would feel, so if I was carrying, I would feel more safe,
but I'm not carrying.
So I feel less safe but at least I know that I can do something about it if I wanted to whereas in Europe it like I generally felt more safe but like if something did happen like what was I going to do It like you you don really you don have the ability to take your own destiny into your hands You kind of just
you know, if the guy has like a knife or something, you know, it's like, you're not
allowed to have a knife. He's not allowed to have a knife, but he has a knife and you don't.
And that's the reality.
But generally, I felt like they keep crazy people off the streets.
Yeah.
More than they do here.
Well, there was some guy that somebody was...
They were telling me there was some guy that has a clipboard
and he's checking in on all the homeless people to see what they need.
Yeah, they have people here that are checking in on the homeless.
Hopefully, they get them the help they need.
That doesn't make them less crazy.
Oh.
anyways
so that's
everything
Keon anything else on this or
no I think we've covered it we've all answered the question
okay
number three top story is
NBA star Kevin Durant can't unlock
his Coinbase Bitcoin account this is from
Wumble 31 comments
1042 sats
Keon
why
it's hard to tell exactly what's going on
here if they're just this is like sort of a headline thing and their stuff is taken out of
context but uh kevin durant lost access to his coinbase account he might have done that
intentionally where he like threw away his password so he couldn't get access to it to
sell his bitcoin apparent as like as a claim or uh or he did it accidentally and it's like a happy
accident where he kind of forgot that he had bought a bunch of bitcoin and left it on coinbase
all these years.
Yeah.
Pleb Spidey Senses.
None of this is true.
This is all just a PR campaign.
That's my Pleb Spidey Senses.
Okay.
It's a good,
it's a nice headline.
I mean, it did.
Oh yeah.
It's a great,
anytime you can say
somebody got hacked
or locked out,
that's always a good headline.
Lead with that.
And then shimmy in
what you're really trying to do there,
which they do
at the end of the article.
I'll scroll down to it.
For me,
I,
I find it hard to imagine someone coming up with a story like that,
but maybe that's someone's career is to come up with a story like that.
Kleinman said he and Durant are also investors in Coinbase Global
and that the company has been a valuable resource in growing our business.
We're also launching 35, or they didn't say we're also launching.
In 2021, 35 ventures struck a multi-year deal with Coinbase
to promote the trading platform,
which includes creating content about digital assets
for Durant's sports entertainment website.
And I think they're just trying to promote the 35 Ventures cool thing that Durant's doing.
That's how I see it.
It's just kind of, plus Coinbase too.
It doesn't hurt.
Everybody wants money, Keon.
Oh, yeah.
But I suspect this, even if it didn't happen to Kevin Durant, I suspect this has happened to other people.
I know of one case in particular where someone had, back in the day, bought Bitcoin on Coinbase and forgot about it for years.
Until, until the best thing you can do.
Yeah.
Until there was a huge bull run and then they're like, Oh wait.
And then, you know, then they were rich or so this stuff does happen.
It might've happened to Kevin Durant or it might all be a fake story.
I don't, I don't know.
But you know, these kinds of, these, this is a happy accident.
Coinbase in the meantime, hasn't like their assets haven't been seized and he
can still get us, he can still get his Bitcoin out.
So you know, it's a happy accident.
I think I said one earlier.
I was like, we should do one for Stacker News
where we have Stacker News.
Kevin Durant loses Stacker News login.
Was it his L&D node?
Question mark, question mark.
And I said, we've already been working directly
with Stacker News crew on Kevin's accounts recovery,
which is why it was easy for me
to make a joke about it on stage, Kleinman said.
Turns out he tried logging with his Nostra
and a queso emoji.
Classic Kevin.
Yeah.
See, that's how that works.
Also, should be mentioned,
Kevin is directly invested into
Stacker News. This is how that works.
It's just like a one
boom. It's just like it doesn't need to be true
Keon. It just needs to be relevant.
I mean I take your point that they could be lying.
I just yeah.
I think they also could be telling the truth
and it's like a nice coincidence.
Slap Spidey sense baby.
Cool. You got anything tougher?
I just
think that they
brought on Kevin Durant
for a name.
and then they're like,
hey, we have this portfolio.
We're going to put some Bitcoin in there.
Do you have any anecdotes about Bitcoin?
And I think Kevin said,
oh, I think I bought Bitcoin on Coinbase once.
Probably like a hundred bucks.
And he forgot his password.
Yeah.
And they're like,
ooh, we could spin that into something.
Yeah, I think that's...
This is probably like a big nothing burger.
Like it's nothing.
If you really want it,
like they,
for you to set up a Coinbase account,
like they have all of your personally
identifiable information and bank account.
So, like, they could totally store his account if they wanted to.
Topher knows.
Yeah, that's what I'm saying.
Come on.
Oh, come on.
Got to generate that news story, Carr.
Come on.
Got to hook the people in.
Keon's too honest.
That's why he doesn't see this.
Maybe Durant is Satoshi.
Kevin Durant's Satoshi.
Yeah, maybe we can correlate his commits with, like, the NBA season.
All right. We got a hedging sanctions risk, Bitcoin and central bank reserves.
This is from SimpleStacker. 11,100 sats, nine comments.
Kian, what is all this stuff?
Yeah. So there was a paper, I think the scores we shared about central banks potentially hedging sanctions risk using Bitcoin.
And so SimpleStacker went and read it and then summarized it for us here.
they also compared
the same
they also did the same thing for gold
like to use the same model
and use gold
they had a bunch of other things
in the footnotes
I guess they showed like mining
but they have a
SimpleStackers conclusion
is they do understand Bitcoin at least
and then like the headline
of this I would say
is that if a country
even if a country is risk averse
but if they have a high risk of sanctions,
they should use Bitcoin in their portfolio
to hedge against those sanction risks.
It will help them because Bitcoin is borderless, et cetera.
And they'll still be able to gain access
to a liquid market that allows them
to preserve their reserve value.
Or even if a country does not have sanctions risk
but it has a low risk aversion,
meaning they are okay with taking some risk in their portfolio.
They should also add Bitcoin
because it'll improve the returns on their reserves.
So in general, this is a good study for Bitcoin
or it's favorable.
It paints Bitcoin in a favorable perspective.
Like even governments can use Bitcoin in their portfolio
to fight other governments' overreach.
So I say, cool.
And I think the main flaw,
like Simple Stacker also points out flaws
that they found in it.
The main one being that it's like a simulation
of the circumstances that a country,
like the model is a simulation
of what would happen to a country
should they suffer sanctions.
And so, and I guess that model assumes that
the Federal Reserve in that country is not already engaging in other hedging activities
as the sanctioned risks increase.
And so that might be painting a rosier picture than would otherwise be the case.
But still, cool to see academics looking at Bitcoin, in my opinion.
Yeah, it looks like they also bring up...
Second, we apply a price discovery mythology and framework,
which was designed to handle sparse and asynchronous data
and analyze your big white markets,
covering spot markets with quotes of USD and USDT.
Yeah, that's a long paper.
So you read through all this?
Yeah, well, he's an academic economist, and so...
it's kind of
what were they grabbing all this from
the development of Bitcoin future exploring the interactions
where are these coming from
I mean this is one you're on one
journal's website right now
yeah I'm just looking at their references
my frequency
interesting
it fascinating to see them do their own research in this stuff and like where they grabbing it from I might take a look at this later Yeah it seems to be mostly other academic papers It be cool to see like a Satoshi Nakamoto Institute reference or something
But yeah, they're not going to do that.
Fascinating.
Wow, good stuff.
Topher, you got anything on this?
I haven't read the paper.
I don't understand the model.
So yeah, I don't have anything to say about the paper.
I don't know if you can really,
I don't even know how you'd begin to model Bitcoin
as a reserve asset for the world
to avoid sanctions risk.
I know that
there was use of Bitcoin
in the Russia-Ukraine war on both sides.
So there's precedent of Bitcoin being used to evade sanctions.
But for a nation state to make it a part of their strategy,
I don't know.
Because most nations don't accept Bitcoin.
And so much of the price of Bitcoin is based on US dollar denominated debt
that the US indirectly controls the price of Bitcoin.
So, you know, evade sanctions from who?
From the U.S.?
Like, I don't know.
Like, this is something that hasn't been tested
and I don't understand the model.
And I think it's just all pure speculation,
which I think is what Scoresby's saying too.
I mean, it is a simulation and Simple Sacker says
it's a simple model,
but I think it is specifically looking at sanctions
from the U.S. and or Europe.
And what, if they're holding U.S. treasuries
or they're holding European treasuries.
I don't know what they're called.
European bank treasuries.
And they get sanctioned like Russia did
where those go to zero
or have some fraction of the value they once had.
If Bitcoin were in that portfolio too,
what would happen?
That's more or less what they're looking at.
So yeah, they probably do not model properly.
And SimpleStacker points this out,
a state-sponsored attack on Bitcoin
affecting its price.
Yeah, I don't think it actually,
I don't actually think like Bitcoin fits in that model,
to be honest, because it's not,
like maybe it fits in this like fiat error,
but I feel like it should have its own model.
Yeah, it's fiat thinking.
Because if you want to hedge yourself,
like you wouldn't just invest in Bitcoin,
you invest in hash power.
Because even if you hold the Bitcoin,
they could still attack,
like the US could still decide to attack you
through hash power.
If they really wanted to,
they could do that.
I think that's why.
As far as like,
if you're in a nation state level,
like you have to think about it.
I like where you're going with this
because I like how Simple Stacker even brings,
I like why Simple Stacker brings this up too
where he says,
yeah, he brings up the mining per country.
So he does bring that up, Topher.
Yeah, you'd have to do both.
You'd have to hedge your bets
with Bitcoin and hash power.
Yeah, that's what I'm thinking.
That's why I was wondering
where the references is coming.
It doesn't add up.
Like, I don't think they're actually thinking
through like a Bitcoin lens.
I think they're thinking through a fiat lens
trying to understand Bitcoin,
but I don't think they're understanding it
by the models that they're applying it.
This is where they really have to
spend time in the ecosystem.
I would love to see this modeled.
I just don't know if we really have
an accurate way to model this.
What would you recommend
a person like this Reed's car?
Maybe probably what...
maybe probably what,
who would be probably the best companies to talk to?
To talk to a company.
Not like an author of one of the Bitcoin books.
Yeah.
I don't know.
I don't know if we've really even talked about this.
I'm sure somebody has.
Yeah, trying to game theory it out.
Well, it hasn't even happened yet.
Like honestly, Bitcoin has had the smoothest sailing fucking ride.
As far as like technologies that have threatened the establishment, like Bitcoin's had a smooth ride.
Like we haven't really had a nation state attack against Bitcoin.
I think it's just because they're like slowly turning on the, like they're just like pulling a frog kind of thing.
That's why I think it looks up here so that way, at least in the United States.
I just think it's not, it hasn't posed much of a threat to the establishment yet.
And they perceive themselves, and to a large extent they are, as being successful in kind of like quelching any peer-to-peer Bitcoin usage, at scale at least.
Again, most of the Kevin Durant of the world, which is probably 95% of Bitcoin users, are all KYC'd into some application or exchange.
so what risk do they pose
if they can call up Coinbase
and ask them to freeze their assets
yeah like the gloves
haven't come off yet
so I don't know how we would model
what is your risk
when we haven't really seen like what that
looks like in practice
we haven't really
there hasn't been like a real war
or attack against Bitcoin
so to speak like China
even China like they
banned Bitcoin mining, but they allowed
all the miners to take their equipment
and leave China
and then come to the US.
They could have seized all the equipment
and just assumed all mining operations.
But they didn't do that. Good point.
So it's like we haven't seen like a real
attack where like a nation state takes
over the hash power. They try to control
block production. Yeah, good point.
Look at how much hash China had.
I didn't realize that, but in 2019
they had almost 80% of hash.
That's so wild to me.
They gave it up.
Wow.
Idiots.
I think they're still mining though.
Oh, I'm sure they are.
But like, I mean, the government's a bunch of idiots over there.
But I think I was reading something recently that said Bitmain, when they overproduce miners, they actually end up mining themselves with them.
So it's like they're constantly producing whether there's buyers or not.
Because in the worst case, they can just mine themselves.
Yeah, they got a good racket going over there, didn't they?
Hopefully that ends soon.
It's crazy.
They gave it all to America.
Look at that.
Yeah, it all came here.
Texas, baby.
Woo, doggy.
And Kazakhstan.
And Kazakhstan?
Gotta go to Kazakhstan to start mining.
Isn't that where...
Borat got it?
It's a real country.
Fucking Borat.
It's a real country with real people.
They all like Borat.
I met a woman from Kazakhstan once.
We had her watch Borat.
She did not like it.
Oh, she did not?
from my country.
Cool stuff.
Isn't that one guy from Vlad?
Isn't Vlad from Kazakhstan?
Romania.
Oh, he's from Romania?
I'm sorry.
People in either Romania or Kazakhstan.
I don't know the countries.
No, I think he's told everybody he's from Romania.
Cool.
A lot of Bitcoiners in Romania.
They don't mind.
The number one top story of the week
is a brief history of the Satoshi.
This is Scoresby.
seven comments, 5,701 cents.
Keon, what's this?
Yeah, Scoresby tells us,
or like charts the history
of using the word Satoshi
to represent the smallest unit of Bitcoin,
one 100 millionth of a Bitcoin.
And apparently there was no,
there was like no consensus on it.
It just kind of emerged naturally
from the depths of the Bitcoin talk forums.
And he goes through all the kind of,
like the posts where it was like first mentioned.
And I guess it's by this guy Rybuck and he's trying to use it for some higher denomination of Bitcoin than a single Bitcoin.
And then a bunch of other people mention it over the years, too, in other contexts.
Luke Dasher even comments in a thread involving these denominations praising the imperial measuring system.
Sort of just a fun fact in there.
But I think the first usage of it appearing to be one hundred millionth of a Bitcoin is somewhere down in there after the Luke Dasher tweet.
Well, it was Rybuck.
Well, Rybuck first mentions it, but he doesn't mention it for one hundred millionth of a Bitcoin.
Oh, yeah, it was a millionth.
Okay.
Yeah.
Which we now call a bit, I believe.
This guy.
This guy did it.
Marcus of Augustus?
Marcus of Augustus is...
Yeah.
He's good at naming things, perhaps.
Because he has his own pseudonym.
Oh, so he's the one that named it?
Pretty funny.
yeah oh cool i didn't know that that's yeah that's where it came up and this was what year
2011 so we had the name in 2011 beautiful i love that that's where we began using it i love that
and then so we started using it then what's this then he uh scores be charts like other
encounters where people are mentioning it as if it had always existed had always been named that
way basically dude i feel like for me like if i would have never known satoshi's existed i would
have never bought my first Bitcoin. I think that was like why I thought I could buy a Bitcoin,
a whole Bitcoin one day was because I heard of Satoshi's. To be honest, that's how I was able
to convince myself that I could afford one Bitcoin one day. Yeah. I hope to get over your unit bias.
Yeah. It says it in here. There's, I think one, I think it might've been Marcus, whatever,
Marcus Augustus
but he said
you don't need to
look after your Bitcoin
you just need to worry about
or worry about your Satoshis
and your Bitcoin
will look after itself
it's up there in bolds
yeah
big bolds
what is it here
yeah look after your Satoshis
and the Bitcoins
will look after themselves
which is a great quote
I'm surprised we don't have
cool
that isn't repeated
because it's a
it's
it fights the unis
the unibias
good stuff
yeah
with Sagrish Day
I got top comment from
Um,
Darth coin.
Oh,
was it from Darth coin?
He said,
I have a simple rule.
When I deal with on-chain transactions,
all my wallet apps are set for BTC.
When I deal with lighting payments,
all my water steps to sets.
So you'll never get confused,
mislead or scam to do mistakes that cost you.
Exactly.
That's what I do.
Topher,
what do you think about all this stuff?
Satoshi's or what's the other one they're trying to do?
What's the European version they're trying to do?
Uh,
no,
well,
John,
Carvalho. The European version.
Oh, John Carvalho is the European version.
He's trying to rename Satoshi's
Bitcoin. Cool. Keep that in your...
That's what I think. Oh, what about you, Topher?
Do you have... Oh, Satoshi's all the
way. Okay. I think
I've realized there's like the Satoshi's
America and then there's like the European...
This is
like the... I think this is more millimeters.
What is that? The inches? Yeah,
meters versus the... I think this is...
I think this has more to do with that than
it does have to do with actual like...
Anything else?
I think it's just people
trying to middle manage
Bitcoin to death.
No, I actually think
it has more to do
with like a European
versus like a
American
Southern Hemisphere.
Wait, not Southern Hemisphere.
Western Hemisphere.
So we'll have like
a kilobitcoin
and a millibitcoin.
I actually think so.
Like I wouldn't be surprised
it has more to do
with that kind of logic
than anything else.
This is where my
spidey sense is.
Yeah, there may be like
there may be overthinking
units.
Because I think it probably
makes more sense for them because they're Europeans
and they think in
kilometers and shit.
And we're Americans, we think in miles.
If you really believe...
Because what's longer, a mile or a kilometer? I don't know.
Does it matter?
We're winning.
This is where I feel like Satoshi's
feel much more, so of course we want
much more. Why would we want anything
less?
If he really wanted to change it, he could change it in the
source code.
Because a coin is still a hundred million
Satoshi. I do. I will say one thing.
I do like the little B that the
logo B or whatever. So I
don't mind that as the logo, but
I think you should let it. Oh, yeah. You were flip-flopping
last night. Well, I do.
I do like the B. I do like the B
logo. Like, I don't mind
that. I think that was like, if there's anything,
I like the B logo. I just don't
like it not being called Satoshi's.
Does that make sense?
But why not? It's like a lightning bolt.
I like that too.
because the cool thing about sats
is you have satoshis
it emerged organically
you have the name of the creator in there
you can shorten it
sats it rolls off the tongue
it does roll off the tongue
sling me some sats
and we have the little lightning bolt
which is an emoji
so we don't need to wait for some organizational body
to approve a currency emoji
for bitcoin
we already have an emoji
I think we should use the dollar sign personally
but for Bitcoin.
Yeah.
For Satoshi's.
I don't know.
Just the dollars.
You have it up here at the top.
I can't.
That's confusing.
I know.
But that's fucking good.
Austin wants to say something.
Come here.
Austin, you want to say something?
Give him the mic.
I don't know.
I don't know what you're talking about.
I thought you were talking about the denomination.
Yeah, we're talking about the denomination.
Yeah.
This is what I want to talk about.
Fuck Op return.
Let's talk about this.
I mean, honestly, this is.
Give him the mic.
You know, Bitcoin developers need something to do.
Might as well change the units, change the filters, right?
We got to stay employed.
I mean, that's my only point.
Okay.
Dang, coming in hot.
Coming in hot.
He was in the pleb dev's office.
Now he's coming out of the hot box.
It's true.
There's nothing going on in Bitcoin except dumb debates like this.
I mean, like, when was the last, like, so I think of like full RBF.
That was like a meaningful kind of change that we argued about in a similar manner.
So there's still going to be those.
But in maybe this, I don't know if the Satoshis are it.
Maybe in the future, maybe when Bitcoin is at such a high price
or we start to actually struggle with the units as we're hitting mass adoption.
But right now we're like, I don't know, bike shedding?
Is that the, or grasping for straws?
I don't know. Jack Dorsey thought it was important. Maybe he has a hand on the pulse.
Yeah. And so there, maybe I would like to see a really good argument from like, hey, we've got all this data. We did all these user tests. We're deploying Bitcoin payments at scale larger than anyone. Here's a sound argument for why these units are better or this better conversion rate.
It's true. It looks like it was kind of top-down and not researched based on what they were talking about.
Yeah.
This post isn't really about that.
It's just about the history of the Satoshi naming, but we started to talk about it.
See, Satoshis actually have a history, whereas just renaming it to Bitcoin just erases all that history.
Yeah. My plebs by since tells me that they're trying to remove Satoshi from the name Bitcoin.
so there's no kind of cypherpunk movement
anymore attached to Bitcoin.
It becomes more palatable to the masses.
We should just cut up.
I'm going to, we should get one vote of cut up
every time you say Spidey Sense
and just all the stuff that comes after.
Car Spidey Sense.
Club Spidey Sense.
This is Club Spidey Sense.
And so like, this is where I think this is more of like,
it's trying to appear more to the masses
and global mass adoption, which is fine.
But let's just be honest about these things.
Like, that's all I'm saying.
because that's why I think
it's really going on.
It's like we need to talk,
we need to call them bits
so that way it's more palatable
to the masses.
Let's call it bits.
Cool, let's have that conversation now
instead of having the conversation
of like,
oh, this is better because of this.
It's like, no, it's not, dude.
I am remembering
Andreas on Joe Rogan
like the first time in 2014.
He's talking bits.
He's saying like,
oh, this is actually bits and millibits,
which I think is documented
in Mastering Bitcoin as well.
He's like, oh, I sent you
you know,
I'm sending you a hundred bits and,
Oh no,
no,
that's a hundred millibits or something like that.
So that's kind of a,
Andre's also a shit coiner now.
So it's kind of interesting.
Andre's is the original shit.
I think,
I think Jimmy song is also interest.
Also likes the name bits.
He's a,
he's pro pro bits.
I think,
I think it's a period of time that you were in Bitcoin.
Not Jimmy.
Don't tell me Jimmy.
And 2013,
I think he's in favor of bits.
I think he wanted to rename Satoshi.
Until I see a vlog post by him.
But I think with some really sound arguments around it,
then I'll listen.
Why not just say sats?
Why is it so hard?
Yeah, what's so wrong with sats?
Well, we're like in it, I think is the argument.
We have dollars and cents.
So why can't we have Bitcoin and sats?
I'll tell you another reason why it doesn't make any sense.
All these guys that we're talking about,
they don't even use Lightning.
So I don't think they get a vote,
like personally, if I'm being completely honest.
Like we at least use Lightning.
Well, we talked to Dorsey,
and our company uses Lightning.
Bitcoin. Okay, Dorsey does.
Airlog, Bitcoin Airlog, John Carvalho,
his company is building a lightning wallet.
Sure. So we're just going to have like
2.1 quadrillion Bitcoins?
Is that like what we're moving to?
That's what they want, yeah.
I just feel like it defaces
the bits. It totally does.
It makes it look like other bits
on the internet. Like there's history here.
You should embrace that history.
You should try to fucking erase it.
Look at all the history. Sanitize it.
This is all corporate bullshit. You have to educate people
on the history and that's maybe inconvenient if you're like, look at this history.
You're running an exchange and you want people to feel like they're getting a lot of something.
Yeah.
Rather than a fraction of something.
I'm saying Sats, baby.
Nope.
Are you moving?
When are you moving to Bits?
It sounds like you're about to.
Yeah.
It says Stacker News Are we going to call it Stacker Bits Are we calling it Stacker Bits I proud advocate I like stats obviously We should call them cowboy credits Cowboy Bits There we go Cowboy Bits now
Are we, this is what we're doing?
I'd be in support of that.
I should make.
Bits are cool.
That doesn't even sound right.
I want to go back to my point of like, okay, where's the data, right?
Because there's lots of arguments.
Exactly.
Let's bring some data into the picture.
And then also just as a principle, the burden of proof, the burden of you should do something
should be on the person trying to make a change.
So it's like, come with data.
Not with seniority.
Right?
But then also probably come with a,
first of all, a spec that considers
that is like backwards compatible.
Well, he has a spec.
Allow exchanges to opt in to this other.
To Corrales credit, he does have a spec,
but he doesn't actually.
And to be fair, I haven't fully read the spec.
So maybe he considers like backwards compatibility.
We've talked about that.
I've had him on the podcast.
We've talked about this before.
That's not the problem.
I'm just saying like he doesn't actually have
what you're talking about, the data.
He just has a spec.
Fair enough.
And like, hey, maybe he just doesn't have access
to the data, like, you know, whatever.
They have their BitKit wallet data,
but, you know, this is where Jack could step in.
And it's like, look,
if there was a backwards compatible spec
and exchanges decide they want to opt into it.
Dude, Cash App is making like $4 billion a year.
No, they're fine.
I mean, that's like, hey, that's just my devil's advocate position.
That's for me where it'd be like acceptable.
I'm agreeing with you.
I'm saying if they have 4 billion,
they make $4 billion a year.
They have the data.
They could put that together.
They could make a river thing like river does.
So yeah,
I agree with you.
They could do that.
Send all your feedback to,
to Bitcoin error log at gmail.com.
Club dev at club.com.
There you go.
Fuck bits.
Fuck the bib.
Fuck focus groups.
I don't care what a focus group says about it.
I know you're playing devil's advocate.
Bring it.
Yeah, bring it to Bitcoin.
Talk if you want to change the name.
I think Saylor was right.
Saylor was right.
If you find, like,
funding people trying to do the best thing for Bitcoin
will probably kill Bitcoin.
Because, like, now we just have all this
middle manager bullshit happening.
It's like nothing real is being developed right now.
It's just all middle manager bullshit.
Arguing about Operaturn.
Arguing about, are we going to call it stats or bits?
Or Bitcoin?
Fuck all of this shit.
We need like a Steve Jobs to come into Bitcoin.
Just like, fuck what the user thinks.
They don't know what they want.
I know what the user wants.
Like, you need that kind of alpha to just like put shit out there.
Dude, like, Sats is like, you got the culture.
You got the sex appeal.
Like, it's already established.
All the builders use it.
Like, why would you want to rip that out?
Do some middle manager shit and just like rip it out.
We're going to change it to Bitcoin because our focus group said.
They're trying to make it.
That's scary.
My pleb Spidey sense tells me
we're trying to make it palatable to the masses.
That's why it's not buttoned up, Topher.
Can you imagine what Bitcoin would be like
if we tried to make it palatable to the masses?
We need to scale to 8 billion people.
Since the beginning.
Did you not get the memo?
We need to scale to 8 billion people.
Fuck that memo.
Anyways.
Dude, 8 billion people can use it now.
We have 2.1 quadrillion Satoshis.
Satoshis. There's plenty of Satoshis to go around.
But if they were called Bitcoins, there'd be more to go around.
Right? That's the argument. I don't know.
Yes. We need to rename Benjamins to dollars.
So now if I have a dollar, I feel like I have a Benjamin now.
Because dollars is just not enough in this economy.
It's just not enough to have a dollar.
So we rename it to Benjamins
And now I feel like I have a stack of Benjamins in my wallet
Just call a dollar a hundred dollars
Yeah why not
You got to keep up with inflation
So you're saying this is like the pizza argument
About Bitcoin
Yeah this actually is the whole pizza
It's similar
This is what they used to give Vitalik shit about
Didn't they
About the pizza thing where they would say
Oh you can just cut it into slices remember
They used to give Vitalik shit about that
Oh man, dude.
Oh man.
This is a disappointing cycle
for a lot of reasons.
Anyways,
that's all the top stories this week.
The number...
What's...
That's not the number one.
Yeah, that's all the top stories this week.
We're going to jump into
AI Bitcoin segment.
This is This Week in AI.
Optimism posted This Week in AI
for September 8th through the 14th.
scores be sure to interesting posts.
I don't know if you saw this one about the 5,000 podcast.
Apparently there's some interesting data from the Hollywood reporter that
shows that the use of AI to mass produce podcasts,
reduce costs per episode to a dollar,
turn successful podcasts into influencers and profit.
So basically they're just like putting out all these shows with AI and
they're just like kind of dumping them on people.
And then they're just sourcing these advertising fiat dollars.
And people are listening and they're making money from them.
Yeah.
Really interesting stuff.
I wanted to bring up a couple, which was this one.
This was interesting.
The one that you posted about OpenAIDS version one.
I don't know if you saw this.
Did you see this?
I shared the story.
It's called Alter Ego.
You'll love this, Topher.
It allows you to…
Haven't you seen this?
You want to explain it, Kian?
Yeah.
It's where it reads your thoughts.
Or you have sub-vocalizations, and it can measure.
Yeah, I've been waiting for this.
Yeah.
I've been waiting for this.
So without talking, you're communicating with a chatbot, basically.
And it can communicate with other people having the same wearable.
So this technology was prophesied in Metal Gear Solid 2.
Or Metal Gear Solid 1.
One of the Metal Gears.
I think it was Metal Gear Solid 2.
But yeah, they would have something that reads their vocal cords.
Because when you're thinking about speech,
you're still activating your vocal cords.
Yeah.
So you just need to tap into that
and then convert that into something
that you can actually communicate and transmit electronically.
So I've just been waiting for this.
So what's the technology, Topher?
Well, I don't know how they're doing it.
I think they're measuring something in a certain region of the brain
and possibly like facial muscles,
like activity and facial muscles.
Okay, because when I saw this earlier today,
because I was going to put this in,
we're going to talk about it.
I call somewhat BS to this.
Hear me out.
Also plebs body sense.
Oh, cut it.
Now hear me out.
So when you watch him talk,
I feel like this is a ventriloquist trick.
So look at his throat.
I feel like he's still doing the facial muscle trick
where he's like saying, he's like,
where do you want to go for lunch?
But he's not actually speaking it.
And the other guy's talking with this thing.
And I think that's where they're actually
getting the data from.
And it's probably not 100% correct.
And then if you see that little thin wire
that's coming from him
and it goes underneath the chair,
it's probably hooked up to a big ass computer.
You can see the wire go underneath.
All that to say like,
it's not telepathic.
It's not even near telepathic.
And I think this is just more fluff than hype.
Just so people don't think like we're at freaking looper yet
where you can like spin a quarter and shit.
That's all I'm saying.
Yeah, I don't-
I mean, not telekinesis, but you know what I'm trying to say.
It depends how you define telepathic.
I can read your mind from here.
Like, what do you mean by reading my mind?
Or I can send you a message from here.
Because my mind controls all my muscles.
so can you read my mind if my mind controls my mouth to say things like how how silly do you
want to get let's try let's try this right now what number am i thinking of five no now let me
guess for you you pick a number right now okay one through ten okay you got one seven yeah see
doesn't work now that's what i'm saying but with this this this head but but the thing is is like
so if you asked me what number was I thinking and then I were to speak it,
but without sound,
like I'm just sort of using my vocal cords,
but not actually making speech like,
and then you had some device that would pick up on that wherever,
whether it's picking it up on my throat or picking up in my brain connected to
my throat.
Like,
is that still telepathy?
Like you're just hijacking the vocal cords to read out like what a person
would be saying.
but it is coming from your mind
but is it telepathy?
Is it what you would consider telepathy
versus you're reading the muscle
movements to a person's
vocal cords? I do think you can
get to telepathy already
just by knowing somebody over
a course of time.
I don know if you can read your wife mind but I would say after you spend time with an individual for long enough you could probably have a conversation with them where you could probably know what they thinking
Yeah, like theory of mind.
You can actually model somebody else's mind
because you just know them well enough
that you know what they would think.
You still couldn't guess the number that's in their head.
Probably, yeah.
Maybe, yeah.
If they had a favorite number.
Anyways, I thought it was an interesting post.
Kiyo, did you have anything else on this?
No, but I do think you're right
that it is probably overhyped
because they're pursuing
probably a large fundraising round.
You can heavily produce video.
They're probably trying to go
to like a very large VCs
and get a bunch of money.
Just lots of it.
Cool.
The next AI wave or telepathy.
Maybe we'll see more telepathy startups.
I think there was another one
I think it's mostly in the phase right now
where we're going to mock it for 10 years
and then everyone's going to be using it
just like AI
we're all going to lose the ability to speak
and then 100,000 years from now
none of us will have mouths
because we don't need them
we're just using these devices
no one talks
there's no need anymore
because we're just communicating
it's just a bunch of tizzards
yeah, no full tizzards
that'll be the only one that survives, dude
Yeah, you won't need Tiz Whispers anymore.
It'll just be full Tizered.
Oh, no, you still need Tiz Whispers.
No, because they need to be told what to do.
Oh, so it'll be more...
Tiz Whispers just won't be whispering.
What's the other one between a Tiz and a...
What's the other one?
There's Riz.
Yeah, so maybe the Tiz, it'll be a Riz Whisperer.
So the Tiz will become the Riz Whisperer, right?
Oh, yeah, but that'll be terrible.
Yeah, so the Tizzards will be Riz whispering.
You don't want either of those guys in control.
You kind of need, you want the main characters.
Because they're like, they're like not,
they're not oriented too far one way or another.
They got the right amount of Riz, the right amount of Tiz.
And they're going to keep the world balanced.
It's like the Force.
It's like Star Wars.
People who are watching this show for the first time,
they're like, what the hell are they talking about?
Riz is like the dark side.
Then Tiz is, are like Jedi.
Riz is the dark side.
I think Riz is the dark side.
That's where all the con people were in the Riz versus Tiz thing.
They're all full Riz, no Tiz.
You add a little Tiz and they become good.
Go back a couple episodes and you'll see what we're talking about.
This is a great...
I think it's actually clipped in the thing.
You think these guys are Tizards?
Definitely.
I would guess they got a blend.
He looks like a...
He's more Rizzy.
I think he's more Rizzy.
The other guy's more Tizzy for sure.
How about that soy face?
Come on.
you don't think he's that rizzy
which one
the one on the right
well the guy from before
the white guy
this guy
the Indian
I didn't catch him
I don't know if this guy's Indian
but
he very well could be
maybe they have that like
weird zoomer fro
hairstyle going on
so
he looks full tiz
on the right
this guy right here
oh no he's not full tiz though
he's got a little riz
look at him
he's got his head
his hair is like
perfectly to show
your hair looks like that
he just woke up
no he made it look like that
though. He has like hair wax.
That's how you know when people are full tizzards
is because their hair is like messed up.
Because Topher doesn't have a mohawk.
He might be Riz.
No.
I think, no, I think
he's not, he's mostly Tiz
but he's got some Riz to him. So he's probably
I would guess he's high Tiz
and like medium
Riz. So he's probably around
cracked somewhere.
Okay.
Anyway, I wanted to bring that up.
And then the other one was the Apple latest bid to purchase Perplexity.
Did you see this?
I imagine.
So, you know, this is what these companies do with these large treasuries.
Yeah.
They haven't said that they're going to buy it yet,
but they did talk about how one of their AI people has left.
I don't think it's in this post.
To go to Perplexity?
No.
So one of the top like AI people of Apple has left recently.
Very recently.
Like last Friday, recently.
And so they're like in scramble mode apparently.
Anyways, and then they're just unable to like execute yet.
And then they just released the new iPhone this week or was it last week?
Last week.
And so they're just like, they're behind.
A friend of mine was friends with one of the children of the person who made Siri.
Like, Siri was an acquisition for Apple.
Yeah.
And I think they paid hundreds of millions of dollars.
Yeah.
I think he said he went to their house, and it was just retarded.
It was just like big and rich.
Just like retarded big.
It's like when Microsoft bought Minecraft.
And then so Notch bought like an $80 million house.
And I think he sold it to like P. Diddy and Beyonce.
Yeah.
Or something.
Or no, was it Jay-Z and Beyonce?
Like, yeah.
He just like sold it to some like famous rap couple.
But like, so he just bought it and then sold it.
He just bought an $80 million freaking compound.
For no reason.
Notch.
Oh, he bought it from them.
Because Minecraft was bought for like $2 billion.
or something ridiculous.
Yeah.
So he was just like,
and he,
it was created by him.
Like he was the developer
of that game
and then Microsoft
just fucking bought it.
I don't understand
why you would have
all that money
and then just buy it on stuff.
That never really
made sense to me.
Well, it's not,
he didn't spend all the money.
He only spent $80 million.
Yeah.
That was like 5% of his money,
which is less
than most people's net worth
that they spend on their,
their own.
I feel like I would just
use that money
to change the world.
That's not what I would do.
I think it's harder
to change the world
even with a lot of money
than most people think.
Look at all the rich people who don't do anything, right?
Is that not a sign to you that maybe changing the world?
I think because they're trying to change the world for bad.
I think that's why.
I mean, look at Bill Gates.
So they got the money despite them being evil?
I think they got the money because they were evil.
I see.
I think Bill Gates is a perfect example of that, right?
No, I don't think Bill Gates is evil.
I think we have a different view of...
So I think Bill Gates is evil.
Do you think Bill Gates is evil?
I feel like he's pretty, his wife left him because he was evil.
I mean, it's pretty much.
Did she say that?
Yeah, dude.
She went on like record and like, she left out a lot of stuff about the Epstein stuff,
but she went on like this whole thing and it was pretty, it was pretty, yeah, it's pretty
bad.
I don't know, man, but he, he, he did some very horrible things in India and, and just
for the stuff he did in India alone, I would say.
He's definitely not a good person.
Maybe he's not evil, but he's definitely not a good person.
Yeah.
I would say he's extremely ambitious and self-centered.
I don't know about evil.
Evil is like,
I think something like someone I associate with like sadism where he's like
trying to harm people for his own pleasure.
Yeah.
I don't know.
I don't know if he's tried to harm people.
I don't know if he's a lizard person.
Yeah.
I just don't,
I haven't looked enough into him.
Maybe he's not that anymore.
He definitely was that in 2020 and 2021 though,
for sure.
Yeah.
The vaccine stuff's very creepy.
Even the stuff that Steve Jobs would say about him too was kind of refreshing.
Sometimes.
I don't know if you remember the comments that he would say about Bill Gates.
He would be like, you know, this is what it's like when you have,
or using apples is refreshing to people like Bill because he's in hell or something like that.
Yeah, but he meant like aesthetically.
Did he?
I don't know.
Also, Steve is high-res,
So he's going to spin a narrative in his favor rather than maybe saying the literal truth like a Tiz would.
Yeah.
Okay.
Yeah.
All right.
Anyway, that's all the AI stuff.
Let's jump into Wumble's Picks.
Wumble's Picks.
Wumble Picks.
Keon.
Yeah.
Yeah, so Wombo wants us to talk a little bit about simple taproot channels
because Supratic wrote a little guide.
They pulled out OperaTurn, which has a page on simple taproot channels.
But simple taproot channels shipped, I believe, in V0.17 of LND,
and they allow you to create an unannounced simple taproot channel.
As of yet, you cannot create a public taproot channel
because Lightning's gossip does not support it.
I think they're still working on that along with some of the other proposals.
The main benefit you get from simple taproot channels over your normal Lightning channels,
despite the obvious disadvantages of them having to be unannounced,
is primarily privacy and on-chain footprint based.
And so if you if you open a unannounced simple taproot channel you in all of your you and your channel partner do everything cooperatively For anyone observing um your lightning channel on chain it looks like a normal Bitcoin spend
It doesn't look like the, it's like not the explicit multi-sig that current lightning channels
or normal lightning channels are.
And so you wouldn't know that it's a lightning channel.
And then because it's aggregating signatures, two signatures into one, it looks like just a single SIG on chain.
And so that is the main advantage is you save on on chain fees and you get better privacy because you have a bigger anonymity set.
Because it looks like a normal Bitcoin spend and not a lightning channel.
Because currently, if you go to something like a blockchain explorer, like mempool.space, you can tell they will say when a Bitcoin transaction includes a lightning channel open or close or anything.
But they cannot do the same for taproot channels, as far as I understand.
Do you have anything more to say about that, Topher?
I'm not the on-chain wizard that you are.
What, for simple taproot channels?
Yeah.
What was the question?
Yeah, well, it's just, I guess I don't have a question exactly,
but they're using Moosig2, which uses Schnorr's signature aggregation
to make a multisig look like a single sig.
Yep.
Okay.
And that, yeah.
That's about it.
That's about it, right?
There's nothing more than that.
It's pretty simple.
Yeah, but you can go around.
That's the main advantage.
So if you are running a Lightning node,
and you're just like a normal pleb lightning node runner.
And you plan on only,
and you care about your privacy
and you plan on only opening unannounced,
like private channels.
There's no need,
you have no need to have a public channel.
You're not planning on routing,
basically is the reason why
you would only open private channels.
You're just planning on sending
and accepting Bitcoin payments.
You can only do private.
You can choose to only do private channels.
You might want to use simple taproot channels,
which I believe only L&D supports
because you get these on-chain savings benefits
and then you also get this privacy benefit as well.
I think there might also be other benefits to it.
I think given that it's using Taproot,
I think that you don't have to have a channel reserve
and there are some other advantages like that.
But usage isn't like, we don't know about usage
because these channels are unannounced
and the other implementations haven't launched them yet.
But these are all, everyone, I think there is like a spec that is evolving
and other implementations will get them soon.
And then we get a bunch of other enormous benefits from taproot channels
when they're widely deployed.
But taproot channels widely deployed will require a very large adoption
because they are incompatible.
I think they're fully incompatible with an HDLC network.
Yeah, it looks like Bitcoin Optech has a...
Is this an article on it, Keon?
It's a short summary and then a link to a bunch of dev-related things,
like the PR for the Bolt, talking to Claire about it.
But still, as far as I know, the spec is evolving.
I think they're actively amending the spec to support different use cases.
But I think the main reason L&D came out with simple taproot channels first is because they were required to support taproot assets.
So is ECLARE the only other implementation that's going to implement this?
No, I think all of them are, they're all working on the spec together.
And so they all plan on doing this because this will unlock this thing called PTLCs, which are being talked about a lot in Lightning.
And they offer a lot more diversity of primarily privacy.
But I believe also they unlock a bunch of scripting capabilities around Lightning that will allow for Lightning to be used in more diverse use cases.
Because right now it's like a very, we have a relatively dumb locking mechanism that you can't do interesting things with.
And I think when we get PTLCs, we'll be able to do cooler things.
In addition to the privacy benefit of like, basically you have everyone on a lightning route sharing the same secret, which is bad.
And PTLCs will avoid that.
But everyone wants the PTLC future for the lightning network.
So we'll eventually get there.
Do you have any news on PTLCs that I don't, at my surface level?
I mean, they're very well understood, like how it's going to work.
So it's just a matter of adoption.
It's getting it out there.
Yeah.
I don't think they've even specced out PTLCs yet,
was my understanding from a recent delving post.
So how long will that take?
It's like, this is going to be like another three years or something?
Yeah, it'll be a long time.
Oh, okay.
So this is like splicing, what splicing was in 21, basically?
Yeah, but even a lot of implementation, I'm slicing at everyone.
I mean, I think most implementations are probably mostly working on...
Bolt 12.
Bolt 12 stuff and getting Bolt 12 ready.
And then we have Lightning Labs,
which has the most widely adopted Lightning implementation.
They're primarily focused on the taproot asset side.
So I don't...
And then I think a lot of people are avoiding the PTLC thing
because it requires a whole network upgrade.
Oh, okay.
It's sort of a consensus change.
The closest analogy maybe we have to consensus and Lightning Network
are basically the things that we share across channels,
which are right now HTLCs, and in the future we hope to use PTLCs.
It would be a bifurcation of the Lightning Network
because PTLC channels are fundamentally different than HTLC channels.
They're incompatible.
I guess maybe someone could come up with a way to make them somehow compatible.
but well you could I mean you could have htlcs and ptlcs inside of a channel but
that's I mean that's complicated I don't know I I think it's just you need a champion to champion
this like dusty yeah it was a champion splicing and so that's or I feel like he's the reason why
splicing exists I used to make fun of him in the beginning if I remember but he kept at it
and it was funny
because Core Lightning
wasn't even the first
implementation
to do splicing
we need somebody
to get made fun of
for PTLCs
but he
like he was the champion
for splicing
and he made it happen
who was making fun of him?
dude
I don't know
still the beans car
I think that's
besides the point
I think
I think it just tells you
that sometimes you need
that one person
to go out there
and say PTLCs
and then carry that flag
I think that's what
Topher was saying
yeah you need someone
to champion it
to get everyone to adopt it.
You'll get ridiculed first.
Yeah, I think it's just a low priority
for most of the Lightning implementations right now
is what it appears.
It appears they think investing
in other areas of development is more important.
Anyway, that is Simple Taproot Channels.
And I am Keon with...
Your wizard!
The Wombos Pizz.
He said he wanted this segment to be like,
the more you know.
We should come up with our own name for it.
The Wombos Pizz.
And it's the same animation.
It doesn't communicate what's happening to the person.
Wombles, picks.
I could do that instead.
Wombles, picks.
Yeah, we want the shooting star.
I can make a shooting star.
Okay.
Speaking of shooting stars, we're about to jump into 6102.
What happened?
Uh-oh.
So, Club Poets coming over here giving us shots.
Is that what you're doing?
I'll take a shot.
Yeah, I'll take one.
It's been a while.
We're about to get into it.
So, I found this 6102 Bitcoin post on Stacker News.
So, I've been doing the SNL DVD.
All right, you're going back.
So, I have to go back to some of these things.
And where is it at?
Oh, it's over here.
So I've had to go back and like look at some of these old clips and,
and we'll get into the DVD later.
But what's interesting about this particular post is when I went back and
looked at the SNL DVD and I was watching it,
I've got to fix two edits on it.
But the interesting thing is like this post came up because we were covering
this, like whatever year this was.
Yeah.
And when I went to go click on it, it doesn't exist anymore.
The website doesn't exist anymore.
The Twitter account doesn't exist anymore.
Even the podcast that it's attached to doesn't exist anymore.
You had a podcast?
Yeah.
Wow.
So it just kind of shows that like Stacker News has a lot of old, really valuable posts.
And this just goes back to what Car was saying for the longest time.
on this podcast, we should have like a section on Stacker News.
Maybe it's a territory that's just like a treasure trove post.
We do the daily post, like this day on Stacker News,
which covers like the top posts every four years.
Yeah, but I think there should be like a discovery page.
Yeah, just like of like the very high quality,
like stuff that, but just like a high quality post.
This should be in one of them.
But at this point, the site's down.
anyway I was able to pull the
way back machine but that's I think
after today it's probably going to be pulled
so get it while you still can
you think it was pulled by the government
but Spice Sense tells me
it's going to be pulled because this kind of just
shows everything of what's going on
okay
anyway
it's about to give us some shots but
before I should
mention this is
6102 Topher do you want to explain what a 6102
and where that comes from in Bitcoin?
6102 is the famous executive order
that was issued by Richard Nixon
to seize all of the gold.
All of the Bitcoin?
Oh, well, not yet.
You think it'll be the same number?
6121, maybe.
Yeah, they need to do it like Noster does.
Like you get maybe 6103 or...
Oh, they'll just increment it?
Yeah, 26102.
Yeah, then I get another one.
You can see there's a history.
That's kind of good.
6102 squared.
So what's interesting about this,
what's interesting about this is like everything that has been on this page
has come exactly true, basically.
And so for the past three, four years since,
I think this came out in 2020, to be honest with you.
And since 2020, for the past five years,
this has come exactly to fruition.
And the more you dive deeper into it,
the more you realize that we're, we're boiling the frog here.
And so the reason I want to bring this up is because it's important to
everything that's going on with two 30,
what's going on with the USDT,
what's going on with all the stuff that we're seeing that's happening in the
white house,
what's going on with all the other stuff that's happening in the world.
And it's just a timely post. And I think,
I think definitely Charlie Kirk stuff is really fascinating.
That's going on with that. So it's just,
I think it's just people that listen to Snacker news,
people that listen to Snacker news live,
people that are the stackers. I'm sharing this today because I think it's very valuable that you
know this exists. And so it's for y'all. It's not for anybody else. No one else cares because they
listen to other podcasts and they listen to other stuff. And so it's not for them. Anyways,
with all that being said, the first point is how could a 6102 attack on Bitcoin look like?
The first one is capture Bitcoin on and off ramps. So they're going to increase regulatory
requirements, you're going to see that. And that's already, I would say they've done that.
They've done that. That's done. They're going to increase KYC verification. Complete.
Awesome. Complete. I wish I could just go there with a check mark. Complete. Complete.
They're going to increase use of chain surveillance. So this one, Topher, what do you think?
Is that complete yet? Or do you think that's still ongoing?
So I don't know because they have like companies like Chainalysis, but they're
they're terrible at their jobs.
And people think of Chainalysis
as like reading the blockchain.
Yeah.
But I think it's more than that.
I think like you have to,
you can't just read the blockchain.
You kind of have to be
at where the payment processing is happening.
So you want to be an exchange.
You want to maybe be a lightning node
that's processing a lot of payments.
incestuous with the
Lightning Network, basically, or with the
Bitcoin exchanges. I think you
have to run an actual Bitcoin
exchange service.
You're at the source. Or if an exchange is
using your service, you are collecting that data
like a social media company
collects a bunch of data on its users
and it's just like, that data's mine.
That's kind of what they're...
I think it's safe
to say, SpideySense here
are saying this, is that
it's safe to say there's probably companies
amongst other Bitcoin companies
that are doing some type of chain surveillance.
Oh, yeah.
They're all doing it.
This is just wargaming.
This is just car wargaming it out.
Any regulated exchanges to exchange surveillance.
This is just car wargaming it out.
Don't get offended.
Increasing ISP surveillance.
So identify Bitcoiners based on internet usage,
likely ongoing globally.
What do you guys think about that?
Increasing ISP surveillance?
Oh, yeah.
We've talked about several posts
about that have been covered by 0x1 BTC, I think,
or something like that.
But he does, he run, he, it's called Linking Lion
if you want to look into it.
But it's like someone who on the Bitcoin peer-to-peer network
is just like connecting to like people and then disconnecting.
He's basically just trying to probe kind of the network
and get a view of it.
But that's definitely happening too.
Yeah, so I think this is another one where it's checkbox, checkbox.
The next one is uncover peer-to-peer exchange surveillance.
What do you guys think about that one?
Do you think that's happening?
Or do you think that's right back in 2020,
this was possibly ongoing?
I believe so.
I'd do it if I were.
Define peer-to-peer exchange.
BISC, RoboSats, Peach.
So they're basically saying there's probably already
these services amongst us that are doing
peer-to-peer exchange surveillance for basically
the state
that are posing as these kind of honeypots, basically.
Well, man, that's tough
because first there's the capability.
Do they have the capability to surveil?
And then there's, are they actually surveilling?
Yeah.
So it's undercover peer-to-peer exchange surveillance.
I think this is possibly ongoing.
My split-up spy sense tells me this is possibly ongoing.
Obviously, I'm not going to point any fingers
or anything like that.
I'm just going to say,
I think it's ongoing based off of my vibes.
So I know that,
I know that RoboSats has like the arbitration service.
I don't know enough about it to know if they have like what their surveillance
capabilities are.
No, it's not them monitoring.
It's that,
it's that people are joining these,
these peer to peer exchanges and posing as traders,
but they're mostly just trying to gather data.
So it's not, it doesn't even involve RoboSats or Vaxill or Peach, like in the loop necessarily.
It's primarily just the, just you, you join as a average customer or user, but you're,
you're mostly there to just like get as much information as you possibly can in your trades.
Do you know?
Yeah.
But when you're developing these platforms, you know, like what information is public and
what information is not.
And so there's already the expectation, anybody using a platform that all of their
offers are going to be public and that anybody can scrape those offers.
Yeah.
The question is, is like, can they actually monitor the trades?
And so if you are monitoring the trades because you're a part of the trade,
that's not scalable.
I mean, you can only do one at a time.
If you're the trader and that's how you're monitoring.
So like you want to get in on the platform and monitor it from a platform level.
For sure.
Which I don't know.
And I think RoboStats could do it because they're like a partner in every trade
because of the arbitration they have.
But then maybe they structured it in a way
where they don't know.
Well, they're federated now too.
So that's another,
at least it's somewhat fractured, whatever.
But it's the thing like with Phoenix,
if I use Phoenix for all my liquidity
and I pay everybody through Phoenix
and then everybody else uses Phoenix
and Phoenix is everything that's going on.
If the services themselves are compromised,
that's like another issue.
But I think this is speaking to
just being a buyer or a seller,
being a market participant,
monitoring that way.
This is possibly ongoing.
I'm just going to leave it as possibly ongoing.
Mining regulation.
So this was another one.
Mandatory KYC licenses, whitelists.
I don't think this has happened yet, right?
No, this hasn't happened yet.
Yeah, so we haven't gotten this yet.
Not mandatory.
Yeah.
Well, actually,
a lot of miners do opt in.
Didn't we have a story not too long ago
where A,
so many mining pools
were using the template from Antpool.
They were using the same template.
And then B, like somebody did some research
where they saw like that there were certain transactions
that were on an OFAC list.
They were looking at like which miners included those
in their block templates and Antpool did not.
And so then by extension,
people that used Antpool's templates did not include these.
Now, it's not effective
because Bitcoin mining is still decentralized enough that, you know, just one play, even a large
player can like prevent you from getting your transaction on chain But like I don know it not overt but it there is something going on with like OFAC behind the scenes and it is overt with Ethereum Like Ethereum has like OFAC compliance
Oh yeah.
It's a glorious thing.
Yeah.
So,
so this is maybe hypothetical.
Yeah.
I would be worried about it.
I'd be worried about this
more than anything else.
I feel like somebody should redo this website
and then like do like a slider.
Next one is restrict access to Bitcoin.
So this is number two.
Decreasing withdrawal limits.
So dramatically increased time.
Taking withdrawal from exchange.
We've already seen this.
I think this is complete checkbox, I would say,
unless you guys disagree.
We see so many Stacker News posts all the time from,
oh, I can't withdraw.
Yeah.
So I think this is checkbox.
Yeah.
I don't know about the globe.
I mean, in the United States,
if you're on a custodial exchange,
you need to view our KYC.
That's going to change soon
once we get stable coins rolled out.
You're going to see that globally now next.
So you're not going to be able to withdraw to a stablecoin?
Certainly most places in the globe, as far as I understand, require KYC.
There's a global body that kind of sets standards.
I believe it's called...
This is why stablecoins won't scale, personally.
It's because of this kind of stuff.
They're just going to turn off your wallet.
I think it's FATF.
There's a global body that sets these kind of financial standards.
and if any country is following those financial standards,
which is what you need to do to participate in a global financial economy,
then you are KYC-ing anyone in a custodial context.
So the other one is closing accounts,
boot users who are suspected of using Bitcoin for products,
services that are not mainstream.
Do we see that yet?
I don't know if we see that yet.
Boot users who are suspected of using.
I mean, I think we get-
It's on a case-by-case basis, I feel like.
You get that a little bit with like a tainted address,
somehow you being in a custody chain with a tainted address.
Okay.
So maybe that's maybe, maybe there.
No withdrawal option.
We haven't seen that yet.
But we do see that with Robinhood, Revolut, and PayPal.
You can't withdraw yet, right?
You can't, no.
Or can you withdraw?
I think Robinhood allows you to withdraw Bitcoin.
Okay, so this has changed.
So maybe it's just revolutionary.
Possibly even PayPal, too.
I think most of that was like technical lag
or they weren't prioritizing it.
So withdraw options there.
User confirmed addresses.
So require users to confirm withdrawals
are to their own addresses.
Yeah, that definitely happened.
That might have been,
this might have been written around the time
that that law emerged,
the travel rule law in Europe emerged
where you have to basically dox your...
Address.
Yeah, your off-chain or your off-exchange wallet.
User verified addresses.
There you go there.
And then let's go on to bans on self-custody.
We're seeing them try this now.
I don't know if you guys remember that,
but we're seeing them try to ban self-custody.
But I don't think that's going to go through.
Yeah, that'd be hard.
That'd be hard.
So this is where it gets to number three.
So basically, number one, all of it has been done.
Number two, some of it has been done.
They're not quite complete with number two.
Because basically what I'm saying is like this whole war game, 6102,
it's already complete number one.
Number two hasn't been fully complete yet.
And number three, we're not there yet, thank God.
But maybe by the end of the decade.
So number three is these could be automatically taken from custodial wallets.
So basically this is where it comes back to
Bitcoin already held by Bitcoiners.
Users of self-custody would be told to disclose
all XPUBs and manually send the coins each year.
Topher, you ready to send back your Bitcoin?
Possibly rewards for anonymous tip-offs,
which lead to recovery of Bitcoin
from non-compliant individuals.
Ready to be compliant, Topher?
A yearly tax for your Bitcoin holdings.
Unrealized capital gains.
They actually tried this already.
I think it was on all assets, but yeah.
Bitcoin wealth tax.
I think this is definitely going to happen.
These are all kind of the same.
They're kind of using the same word.
There is like different terms for the same thing.
And then a full 6102 government decrees
that you have to surrender a percentage of all your Bitcoin,
similar to the gold's executive order.
So the conclusion is to all this, stackers,
if you're still listening.
Get your coins off the exchange, no KYC,
user privacy improving tools.
And yeah, once they put a gold,
gun to you i don't think um and they use that uh what's that that they use that thought what is
that that thought police app that you were talking about earlier once they do that we're done for
keon what do you think about this um i think yeah this i think this war game
is i don't like it i mean i like the i like the you know the layout is it is i think helpful
that you can kind of get through the full escalation.
And it all seems pretty common sense to me.
And so that's pretty cool.
I don't like the fact that it might happen.
That's my high-level thoughts on it.
Hopefully that's satisfactory.
Topher, what do you think about all this?
War gaming?
I mean, you should be thinking about this all the time.
It's a BitConer.
This is all you think about day one.
Oh, yeah.
You wake up in the morning,
this is like your homepage on your computer.
Yeah.
And you just read through it.
And then you read through it.
Well, this is no longer on the internet anymore, so.
Yeah, but you go through your own.
You've downloaded it already as a Bitcoiner.
You wrote your own version,
how it's going to happen to you.
Well, a lot of this is just dealing with exchanges.
So you just don't deal with exchanges,
and a lot of this doesn't apply to you.
Anyways, stackers, you've been warned.
stay away from exchanges.
We're going to jump into
some happy stuff now.
Stacker News take over
TabConf 7.
This was from Blockchain Boog.
This is Meta.
Keon, what's going on here?
Yeah.
So Blockchain Boog submitted,
I think we talked about this a while ago.
Blockchain Boog submitted to TabConf
to have space for Stacker News.
And he has been elected
to have space for Stacker News
at TabConf 7 in Atlanta,
I believe October 13th through the 16th.
And yeah, so we are going to do that.
Scoresby and I have been planning some things.
Blockchain Boog has been planning some things.
Oh, we're getting a circular table.
And we're going to try to make it fun.
We're going to try to make it not just a table that has like merch on it.
We're going to try to make it fun.
We'll see what we can do.
but that's what's up.
That's what's up.
Yeah, it's going to be fun.
I think we're going to have the SNL DVD,
so I'm working on that now.
Almost have it complete.
Playpoet's going to have some zines and some,
what else are you going to have?
Some other stuff.
Should like rent out a movie theater.
Oh, you're not coming?
Oh.
She's not coming, but blockchain book web, all the zines.
What else?
I think that's about it.
Cool.
The other thing I wanted to bring up was this one.
So I need help with the DVD menu.
This is not what it looks like.
Oh, why not?
Oh, you like that one?
That's funny.
I think it's pretty awesome, actually.
This is the default one.
Yeah, why not?
I mean, it's not like someone has seen this a hundred times.
It's been like 30 years before.
maybe I'll leave it this one
I was going to do this one because I thought it'd be funny
to put like Stacker News on a DVD
like when you see it in your DVD player
it would be kind of
funny like oh wow I have Stacker News live
on my DVD player
I changed the thing with the DVD stuff
some Easter eggs
anyways if anybody has any ideas
let me know
yeah
other thing is
Pleb Poet Zine came out
what is going on
here it is
yeah
hello
here it is
I just finished it
so this is hot
it's burning my hand right now
it's so hot off the press
you know we got classifieds back there on the back
car didn't want to buy another classified
so there's three empty spaces
you got too many customers
I think we should have done a monthly thing I said.
We're doing weekly.
And then there's a new crossword puzzle in there.
I give you one of the clues right now Let see if you can come up with the answer Okay Okay so this is an asset I guess
No, I'm just going to read the clue.
The clue is firmly fixed, pegged, and regulated.
Wow.
Any ideas?
Stablecoin?
That could be right.
Sounds like a dating profile.
That could be right.
Firmly fixed, pegged, and what was the other one?
Regulated.
But anyway, thanks, everybody, and check it out.
And yep.
Two.
Thank you.
How do we get the zine?
Right there.
Purchase it.
Click on the zine.
There's a web version.
but it takes time to load.
Hey, there's Teddy.
Oh, wow.
Look at this.
Oh, look at you.
Yeah.
The world's most costly newsletter.
These ads.
I like Simple Stacker's ads.
Help a brother out.
Lost both hard drives during block size fours.
Anything help.
That's awesome.
You know, it'd be funny if you did like the,
like traveling to the future.
That's what I was hoping for.
Yeah, like a funny, like fun classifier.
I'm from the future.
Send help, please.
I will totally do this next time.
This is fun.
You get to see it in print.
This is good.
You got trips.
We don't want to give it all away, so you got to buy it.
You got to buy this.
Yeah, it's so hot.
You can also print it yourself at home if you want.
Or you can just buy it.
What is that number for?
The hashtag number.
Which one?
That one.
It's probably like a secret code
Oh maybe they're
It's probably like a drop
Like a drop location
It's like GPS coordinates encoded in there
I'm not sure what it is
But I imagine that it is a Stacker News post
So that
They want to direct you to that post
That makes a lot more sense actually
Do you want to try it?
See what post it is?
Let's try it
I'm kind of curious now
Okay
you have over a million posts
712
cool Darth coin
did we get the number right though?
I don't know did we get the number right?
we can't tell
but
1-2-2-7-1-2
I guess that means
1-2-2-2
3-2's
1-2-2-2
Shout out to Darth Coyne.
I think half the post is there.
KBI probably has more comments than any one.
Oh wow. Dang.
Okay here we go.
Wow.
Oh.
Shit.
I didn't see this post.
I'm going to have to read this.
This is why you get the zine.
More alpha.
That we can't talk about on the show because it's…
How did they do it back in the day with the sense?
Well, I don't know.
That seemed pretty spicy.
American Revolution, how they do it when they shared the sense pamphlet.
Yeah, this is somebody on a horse sharing the zine stuff.
You can only...
But we're in a video.
This is what the British would be doing.
Or this is what the Americans would be doing.
I mean, this is technically kind of...
Having a podcast.
This is technically the same thing.
Maybe we're Paul Revere.
Maybe this is what that is.
Maybe you have a podcast and you release like a paper version
and to actually get the alpha, the real alpha is the paper version.
The Federalist Papers.
Yeah.
This is kind of smart, Keon.
I see what you're doing here.
Yeah, yeah.
Federalist Papers.
They were just circulating them.
Interesting.
Yeah.
It's funny how history is repeating itself.
Cool stuff.
the other stuff is
yeah and then we just got
the top cowboys
baby
let's go to the top cowboys
this is the most popular
segment in Bitcoin turns out that
it's so popular that they're
showing up on pretext to make bets
now so we might see some
actual stuff
a sailor reached out to me and was like
how do I get on this segment I'm like sorry buddy
you can't afford it
Actually, he could afford it.
You don't know what it costs.
Wait, how did Siggy dethrone you?
He's always been ahead of me.
Maybe I just had two teclulas.
Yeah, you might be mixing it up.
You know, like they're blurring over each other.
We've got Undiscipline number three,
Warchin Boo, Grey Ruby.
I think someone might have dropped out.
I don't know who, though.
No, I don't think so.
I think they might have.
Yeah, looks the same.
I think there was one that dropped out.
I thought they were talking about it.
Well, that looks the same.
All right.
That's smooth.
Where'd you get that from, the tequila?
Bochel?
Oh, nice.
On Brazos?
Is that that place?
There's one by and by.
It's really good.
It's really smooth.
You know, strangely, I feel like eating fajitas.
I feel like going to go get some fajitas and a margarita.
Anyways, Piel Curve, Real Bitcoin Doggy, Simple Snacker, EK, FreeTX, Mega Dreamer,
Solomon's, Toshi, ZeroXBitcoin, Justin ShockNet coming out with all the shocking comments
on Stacker News.
Gotta love it.
Oh, even I'm moving up.
36 now.
What else do we got?
Kian, you see anything you can see here?
Even Cascader's back.
Oh, yeah.
They've been calling out Chadbot.
Oh, nice.
We got Ben the Carmen's back, 51.
He's been going up slowly.
I think he's trying to get back in here.
Yeah, we'll see what happens.
You always thought you were always calling out Ben to be a dark horse.
I love Ben.
He's like one of my favorite.
He's trying to be a light horse.
Ben Carmen's like one of my favorite Bitcoin developers.
Okay.
Besides you guys.
I feel like that was like you were just doing charity.
work there.
Yeah, I love you guys.
Are you kidding me?
Max Webster.
We got It's Real Fake,
Byzantine,
TN Snacker,
R.D. Clark,
Tima Club.
Bounty Hunter's there.
Bounty Hunter.
Yeah, what's that?
Cheaper.
We got Sooks.
And more exploitive.
Sooks, Sooks, Sooks, Sooks, Sooks, Sooks.
And that's it
Oh you were
I don't know I didn't see you actually
Did you not show up this week
You should have got it back
Yeah I don't see her
Oh right there
What did you post this week
Just a zine
Dang he doesn't even zap you
Look at that
She just posts all her work stuff
No I posted her this one
Carter doesn't want his
I mean I wish you'd post
Let's go look
Oh no it looks like
You can see that
Boom boom boom
Those are
Yeah it's like 1 in 20
I posted that one
Okay
I posted that one
Look
Oh he zaps you not smoking weed
Look I post
He zapped you all the time.
He did give you a thousand sats a couple times.
Boom.
Boom, boom, boom.
That's way back.
Yeah, I definitely zap you all the time.
It's just whenever there's something really good.
You're welcome.
I keep it real.
Should we go to yours, Coop?
Should we log in with your second?
Oh, you'll just see.
Probably zaps on everything.
Okay.
I'm probably that's the biggest thing.
Maybe next week,
Staggers will log in with Kubz login and see.
At least I keep it real.
What else?
I think that's it.
I think that's all we got.
Where's the meta thing here?
I feel like this podcast is going off the rails now
because I took a couple shots of tequila.
All right.
We're going to have the Fountain Boost.
Blockchain Boost said stay in school, kids.
Oh, that's good.
That's also what Bake said.
Gray Ruby just zapped us.
And then Discipline says,
you don't have to move energy from space to Earth
if you move energy to space.
Ted I ask you is that true or not It a very concise way of saying what Ted explained to us during the last podcast About getting energy back to Earth Yeah I moving it
It's very hard to commercialize space.
I don't think we have a great way to commercialize space right now.
But I think moving, I mean, you can send heavy objects down the gravity well.
So some aspects of industry could presumably be in space.
But if you look at the math, even if it's like palladium
or like the most amazing thing you could possibly imagine,
it's still not currently economical to go fetch it from space.
But maybe in the future, and there's certainly things that you get in space
that you don't care elsewhere.
Like, for example, in the Van Allen belts,
you get all this antimatter that's like trapped in space.
You go scoop up some antimatter if you had a good use for it.
But I don't know about moving energy, like energy and heavy industry,
specifically like chips and things that require specialty.
I think it's going to be very difficult to do that more economically in space and service Earth than vice versa.
So I think it will always be chips and computers coming from Earth.
And then in space, it's probably space is just funding itself.
At least for the near future.
I don't know.
Maybe he's talking about long term.
Well, no, he's just saying.
He's an economist.
well he's saying if we don't uh we don't have to move energy from space back to earth if we
can relocate industry in space where the energy is abundant that's what he said
like rather than because we were because i think on the podcast we were talking about taking energy
that we're gathering from elsewhere and moving it back to earth but then you mentioned that
it's one of the benefits of commercializing on mars is because the energy is already there
and abundant and it'd be,
or the energy expenses are cheaper
because we're already out in space
that we could do a lot of industrial things
from the moon that we couldn't do on earth.
Yeah.
And even the moon, even Mars,
like even Mars,
it's like kind of a great jumping off point
for in the solar system,
much lower gravity well,
so it's easier to get off Mars.
Yeah.
I think the big thing that I find
that's really genius about Elon Musk
is that he kind of merges the physics
and the economics
and so you have to think about things like not just necessarily like for example like an engineer
solar radiation in a unit of space than there is on earth just because there's no atmosphere
yeah but from economics perspective like there's so much value that comes from being around other
human beings and other industries so that you can trade like yeah it's like i don't know you know
what the exact number is but i'm sure it's like you know trillions of percents like things that
are way easier to do when you can specialize.
So it's a difficult prospect,
but the hope is that we find something super valuable in space
that can kind of bootstrap everything.
And maybe it's helium-3.
So if we get fusion going, helium-3 is a good example
of something that could make it worthwhile.
Okay.
And people can't see, but Ted has new facial hair
that makes him,
I feel like makes him way more credible.
He didn't have facial hair before, right?
Did he really?
This is not very much facial hair.
Oh.
No, no.
When you start talking about space, though,
what happens is that you just,
it just sprouts.
Yeah, I mean, he was telling us last week
about how all the graybeards are the ones
that really know their physics stuff
or their astrophysics stuff.
He's always had facial hair.
Has he?
You haven't, right?
I feel like he has.
don't trust him
that's what I took away
but he used to work with the space people
that's what I mean he's coming into it
it doesn't come on all at once
did you have facial hair recently
like this
okay maybe you did
he's always had facial hair
no he hasn't always had
okay
what is that meme
where it goes like
you
like you don't know I went all in on Bitcoin,
but there will be signs.
Something like that.
There will be signs.
Well, no, the sign is Ted looks like he's like ready for the market.
Yeah.
Are you ready for the market, Ted?
What are you looking at?
For the market.
The only market that matters.
Oh, the data market, bro.
Oh.
I think it's a great shirt
His swag is increasing
I have to agree
He already was on the camp
We got an eligible bachelor here
For the two people that are watching
Very eligible
Car sister might be single
She's married
Oh man
This show has gone off the rails
It was so strong
It started off so strong
and
anyway
YouTube comments
we got YouTube comments
from Vake
because he's the only one
that comments
stay sober
oh you commented too
what did you say
last week
yeah
are you Vake
wait are you
no Vake
I know Vake
he's
I'll see him at TEPCOM
okay cool
he just said
stay sober
didn't do that today
stay in your brain
and stay in school
he also said
stay in school
Keon
that's what I was saying
I think we all said that
okay
really
no he didn't say that
tell us the story
because it's probably
going to be awkward
so
shout out to Vake
I met Vake
at Bitcoin Vegas
just randomly
he just walked into
the Airbnb
that I was staying at
whoa
because we were having
a party
he was there
Topher was there
where are you there
Topher was this
recently
Bitcoin Vegas
I don't remember
it's so long ago
aren't they
it was just
a long day
Vake came in
And he was like, oh, you're a plot poet.
And I was like, oh, yeah.
Oh, wow.
That was cool.
You weren't creeped out?
He said he just watches Stacker News live, though.
He doesn't read Stacker News, which is kind of funny.
Damn, Keon.
That's what Carl, you told me that already.
No, I never said that.
You don't need to laugh like you're in a mariachi band.
Hey, I had three of these tequila shots, bro.
It was so funny.
You'd be great in a mariachi band.
I joined.
I almost joined.
I have a picture.
I have a picture up with you guys.
Would you guys let me in?
I do have a picture with me of a mariachi band.
What instrument would you play?
I was this close.
Probably like the tuba.
Dude.
Yeah.
That's kind of…
With the Stacker News hat?
Oh, absolutely.
Dude, crushing it.
We need to get tassels on it.
You know what?
Startup date, you can't.
I'm totally singing with the mariachis this time around.
Oh, you should.
Yeah, we are.
Yeah.
I think that's all we got.
Let's see here.
Optimists say, wait, y'all don't use KSAT, MSAT in Austin.
What are you using your Imperial base?
Oh.
Oh, what's that?
What does that mean, Keon?
Oh, well, because we were talking about...
That's a chism joke.
I don't get it.
No, because you were talking about how the imperial system is better
and miles are better and stuff.
Okay.
And he's like, well, we use Kilosat and Millisat
outside of the United States.
Do they?
Do they seriously use Kilosat?
It would make sense.
Millisats aren't real.
Yeah, but they're useful in context where you have consensus.
I mean, if you want to play with make-believe money, I guess.
Yeah, with like a channel partner, you have consensus on them existing
so they can accumulate into real money.
Can they though?
Yeah.
But the most they could ever accumulate into is one set.
Yeah, but you accumulate one set.
Even then, you've got to get past the dust limit.
There's a lot of barriers you have to get past.
Yeah, but if you have a channel open for so long,
you can imagine how many millisats you accumulate.
And eventually you're past the dust limit.
And the dust limit is decreasing over time.
So you're saying we can get rid of the dust limit if we go to millisats?
Well, on-chain fees have been dropped.
The limit on on-chain fees has been dropped even below a sat per V byte.
So who knows?
Maybe the dust limit will be a millisat.
No, it can't ever be a millisat.
But maybe it will be...
This is how they pull you back.
Yeah.
This is how they pull you back, Ted.
Unbelievable.
Wait, no, we have...
Yeah, we're already using subset units on,
at least for transactions.
So, because we just have miners or...
Yeah, but, you know, I have...
Wait, how does that even work?
I have this rule.
What, subset?
Yeah, how do we have subset per V by on on-chain fees?
Yeah, but I have this rule and I release stats on the table.
Because you have to pay at least one sat.
You have to at least pay one SAT per transaction.
You don't have to.
It's either zero or one.
That's all you can do is zero or one.
You have to choose between zero or one.
But for DOS protection.
Okay.
Anyway, we're getting...
You guys are getting full tizzered.
I'm sorry.
Yeah.
Can someone whisper to me so I can come back?
You need like an Inception where you got to have the memento in your hands.
I'm still laughing about Big's comment.
Like the chess piece.
Big really said that?
Spinner top.
He doesn't go to Stegger News.
It's terrible.
He told you that.
And you told me that already.
So terrible.
Hey, come to Stacker News, bro.
Stacker.news.
Don't feel obligated.
I enjoy having someone that just watched the podcast.
I'm telling him.
Maybe he's just a visual learner.
Wait, what?
The zines?
Fake.
You're on a computer all day.
Just go to Stacker.
Because I know we talked.
Oh, they're doxing now.
Anyways.
I'll see my tab.
I'll convince them to make an account.
Anyways.
Yeah, go for it.
I have an idea for your DVD menu.
Yeah, what was it?
Just superimpose you and Kion
into a mariachi band
and just do a little song.
That's great.
Yeah.
Yeah, we can do a little dance and a song.
Yeah, and like a terrible looping animation.
I want to do the
Easter egg menus where they have
Easter eggs in them
I want to do that too
Okay
Alright we got to end the show
Because yeah
Time's run out
Zap