1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:02,580 (upbeat music) 2 00:00:02,580 --> 00:00:15,840 Hey everybody, welcome back to the Phantom Power Artist Hour. 3 00:00:15,840 --> 00:00:18,160 Today is, what is today? 4 00:00:18,160 --> 00:00:23,320 Today is Sunday, the 17th, Happy Saint Patrick's Day, 5 00:00:23,320 --> 00:00:25,080 to all of you. 6 00:00:25,080 --> 00:00:28,080 And what better way to celebrate Saint Patrick's Day 7 00:00:28,080 --> 00:00:31,160 than talk to a guy from Finland who's currently 8 00:00:31,160 --> 00:00:32,560 living in Saudi Arabia? 9 00:00:32,560 --> 00:00:38,840 Today's guest is the Higher Low. 10 00:00:38,840 --> 00:00:41,440 And it's a really fun conversation. 11 00:00:41,440 --> 00:00:43,840 Like I'm sure you guys have seen his music, 12 00:00:43,840 --> 00:00:45,680 or heard his music over on Wayblake, 13 00:00:45,680 --> 00:00:47,520 and seen him on Noster, 14 00:00:47,520 --> 00:00:49,720 and he was just at Bitcoin Atlanta, 15 00:00:49,720 --> 00:00:51,080 and played the gig there. 16 00:00:51,080 --> 00:00:55,360 He's going down to El Salvador to play a gig at the halving. 17 00:00:55,360 --> 00:00:59,400 He was in Charleston for Charleston Bitcoin Meetups, 18 00:00:59,400 --> 00:01:00,920 Big Halloween Party. 19 00:01:00,920 --> 00:01:06,680 This is a really cool dude with a great punk rock attitude, 20 00:01:06,680 --> 00:01:09,680 who is getting the most out of life, 21 00:01:09,680 --> 00:01:13,240 not only with Bitcoin, but with his music as well. 22 00:01:13,240 --> 00:01:17,680 And we have a great conversation about punk bands in Finland, 23 00:01:17,680 --> 00:01:21,080 and the Finnish language, and songwriting, 24 00:01:21,080 --> 00:01:22,160 and Bitcoin and all of it. 25 00:01:22,160 --> 00:01:24,000 It was a lot of fun, 26 00:01:24,000 --> 00:01:26,560 and I hope you guys really enjoy this conversation. 27 00:01:26,560 --> 00:01:28,720 So you know how we do it? 28 00:01:28,720 --> 00:01:30,080 I'm going to play one of his songs, 29 00:01:30,080 --> 00:01:33,160 and then we will bring him on the show. 30 00:01:33,160 --> 00:01:38,160 So we're going to kick it off with his song, Truth Seekers, 31 00:01:38,160 --> 00:01:40,880 here on the Phantom Power Artist Hour, 32 00:01:40,880 --> 00:01:43,320 and this is the Higher Low. 33 00:01:43,320 --> 00:01:45,900 (upbeat music) 34 00:01:45,900 --> 00:01:50,900 ♪ Oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh ♪ 35 00:01:50,900 --> 00:01:59,260 ♪ We won't do nothing to find it for ♪ 36 00:01:59,260 --> 00:02:07,900 ♪ We won't have culture of America and now ♪ 37 00:02:07,900 --> 00:02:13,580 ♪ Grinding to the mass of rocks ♪ 38 00:02:14,220 --> 00:02:18,100 ♪ There's no map in front of us seek ♪ 39 00:02:18,100 --> 00:02:22,420 ♪ For truth until we're old ♪ 40 00:02:22,420 --> 00:02:27,420 ♪ We're ridden of this a growing boat ♪ 41 00:02:27,420 --> 00:02:31,220 ♪ We're not out of fight ♪ 42 00:02:31,220 --> 00:02:33,900 ♪ We're pleased to make it right ♪ 43 00:02:33,900 --> 00:02:38,900 ♪ Continent acts will try to hope inside ♪ 44 00:02:38,900 --> 00:02:42,500 ♪ Coming on the Alexa Gerts' ship ♪ 45 00:02:42,500 --> 00:02:45,220 ♪ And they play this right ♪ 46 00:02:45,220 --> 00:02:49,540 ♪ The sea plays top to the pit of die ♪ 47 00:02:49,540 --> 00:02:52,540 ♪ Play my guitar ♪ 48 00:02:52,540 --> 00:03:07,060 ♪ The world in need will have a beat ♪ 49 00:03:07,060 --> 00:03:10,740 ♪ Drums of change ♪ 50 00:03:10,740 --> 00:03:14,140 ♪ They can get an instant to their worst ♪ 51 00:03:14,140 --> 00:03:18,500 ♪ I swear that there was a care ♪ 52 00:03:18,500 --> 00:03:21,980 ♪ About the world that's out ♪ 53 00:03:21,980 --> 00:03:25,980 ♪ We're building funding in the tea we found ♪ 54 00:03:25,980 --> 00:03:29,260 ♪ It got just to our old ♪ 55 00:03:29,260 --> 00:03:35,260 ♪ We're ridden of this a growing boat ♪ 56 00:03:35,260 --> 00:03:39,060 ♪ We're not out of fight ♪ 57 00:03:39,060 --> 00:03:41,900 ♪ We're pleased to make it right ♪ 58 00:03:41,900 --> 00:03:45,660 ♪ Continent acts will try to hope inside ♪ 59 00:03:45,660 --> 00:03:50,580 ♪ Coming on the Alexa Gerts' ship ♪ 60 00:03:50,580 --> 00:03:52,980 ♪ And they play this right ♪ 61 00:03:52,980 --> 00:03:57,580 ♪ The sea plays top to the pit of die ♪ 62 00:03:57,580 --> 00:04:00,100 ♪ Play my guitar ♪ 63 00:04:00,100 --> 00:04:07,100 ♪ Think it's which the core is ♪ 64 00:04:08,740 --> 00:04:10,740 ♪ The core is ♪ 65 00:04:10,740 --> 00:04:13,740 ♪ The core is ♪ 66 00:04:13,740 --> 00:04:17,740 ♪ The way it comes apart ♪ 67 00:04:17,740 --> 00:04:23,740 ♪ We're not out of fight ♪ 68 00:04:23,740 --> 00:04:26,740 ♪ We're pleased to make it right ♪ 69 00:04:26,740 --> 00:04:30,740 ♪ Continent acts will try to hope inside ♪ 70 00:04:30,740 --> 00:04:35,740 ♪ Coming on the Alexa Gerts' ship ♪ 71 00:04:35,740 --> 00:04:37,740 ♪ And they play this right ♪ 72 00:04:37,740 --> 00:04:42,740 ♪ The sea plays top to the pit of die ♪ 73 00:04:42,740 --> 00:04:45,740 ♪ Play my guitar ♪ 74 00:04:45,740 --> 00:04:52,260 - All right, welcome to Phantom Power Artist Hour 75 00:04:52,260 --> 00:04:57,260 and that was True Seekers by the Higher Low, 76 00:04:57,260 --> 00:05:01,580 who is nice enough to join me on the line 77 00:05:01,580 --> 00:05:04,540 from halfway around the world 78 00:05:04,540 --> 00:05:09,340 after his performance in Rousing Couple of Days 79 00:05:09,340 --> 00:05:12,660 over at Atlas Music Festival in Bitcoin, 80 00:05:12,660 --> 00:05:13,580 Atlantis. 81 00:05:13,580 --> 00:05:18,580 Welcome to Rami or otherwise known as The Higher Low. 82 00:05:18,580 --> 00:05:20,140 What's up buddy? How are you? 83 00:05:20,140 --> 00:05:22,580 - Hey James, thanks so much for having me 84 00:05:22,580 --> 00:05:25,100 super stoked to be here today to chat with you. 85 00:05:25,100 --> 00:05:26,420 So. 86 00:05:26,420 --> 00:05:27,540 - Yeah, it's my pleasure. 87 00:05:27,540 --> 00:05:30,260 It's been a lot of fun to see you. 88 00:05:30,260 --> 00:05:31,580 Yeah, you're a globe, dude. 89 00:05:31,580 --> 00:05:33,780 I'll tell you two things. 90 00:05:33,780 --> 00:05:35,140 One, you're a globe trotter. 91 00:05:35,140 --> 00:05:38,660 You're always running around. 92 00:05:38,660 --> 00:05:41,140 And number two, it's impressive, man. 93 00:05:41,140 --> 00:05:45,860 You are all in on value for value in Bitcoin music 94 00:05:45,860 --> 00:05:48,460 and the whole value verse and getting out on podcasts 95 00:05:48,460 --> 00:05:49,300 and everything like that. 96 00:05:49,300 --> 00:05:55,100 So you are a great ambassador for value for value in music 97 00:05:55,100 --> 00:05:57,740 and it's a pleasure to have you on the show 98 00:05:57,740 --> 00:05:59,180 and get to know you a little bit. 99 00:05:59,180 --> 00:06:01,980 To tell us about your musical beginnings 100 00:06:01,980 --> 00:06:04,420 and how you got started playing in bands. 101 00:06:04,420 --> 00:06:07,460 - Okay, so everything started with my, 102 00:06:07,460 --> 00:06:12,460 I was born in S-po, which is like a suburb 103 00:06:12,460 --> 00:06:16,020 of Helsinki, the capital city of Finland. 104 00:06:16,020 --> 00:06:20,500 And I grew up as a kind of a skateboard kid. 105 00:06:20,500 --> 00:06:22,900 Back in the day, we didn't have internet or anything like that. 106 00:06:22,900 --> 00:06:26,780 So we were kind of relying on like VHS tapes for Promo. 107 00:06:26,780 --> 00:06:29,620 Somebody's dad lived in the US, so we kind of got those tapes 108 00:06:29,620 --> 00:06:33,260 and watching like a streets of fire and all these great movies. 109 00:06:33,260 --> 00:06:35,620 And we were so inspired about the music 110 00:06:35,620 --> 00:06:37,980 that we just had to create our own band. 111 00:06:37,980 --> 00:06:43,460 And we, '92, I'm an old pro, so '92, we created a band called Fumble 112 00:06:43,460 --> 00:06:49,140 as somebody making a mistake in football in the States. 113 00:06:49,140 --> 00:06:53,620 And we just started playing in youth centers, 114 00:06:53,620 --> 00:06:57,380 then like rock clubs and festivals and stuff. 115 00:06:57,380 --> 00:07:01,940 And we kind of were perfectly timed to do everything 116 00:07:01,940 --> 00:07:04,180 right before PopPunk became big. 117 00:07:04,180 --> 00:07:07,340 So we had a good time, but then in '93, 118 00:07:07,340 --> 00:07:10,540 we basically disbanded the band, so we had to, 119 00:07:10,540 --> 00:07:12,700 we were young kids and we were moving to different parts 120 00:07:12,700 --> 00:07:15,500 of Finland, going to military service and stuff like that. 121 00:07:15,500 --> 00:07:17,780 So we basically would have stopped the band 122 00:07:17,780 --> 00:07:20,860 like literally like one year before, like basketball case, 123 00:07:20,860 --> 00:07:22,780 became like the biggest hit in the world. 124 00:07:22,780 --> 00:07:25,780 (laughing) 125 00:07:25,780 --> 00:07:27,180 - Okay. 126 00:07:27,180 --> 00:07:29,060 But anyways, we had a lot of fun. 127 00:07:29,060 --> 00:07:31,180 We played with the US bands like Coffee and Break, 128 00:07:31,180 --> 00:07:34,260 was American band played in, in, in, 129 00:07:34,260 --> 00:07:37,740 we played with them, our biggest heroes were the descendants 130 00:07:37,740 --> 00:07:41,020 and at the time they were operating under the name all. 131 00:07:41,020 --> 00:07:43,340 So they played in Finland, so we supported them and stuff. 132 00:07:43,340 --> 00:07:47,060 So we got really nice like introduction to kind of, 133 00:07:47,060 --> 00:07:50,900 you know, the international conxying when we were young kids. 134 00:07:50,900 --> 00:07:53,180 And then we had like a 10 year break. 135 00:07:53,180 --> 00:07:54,100 I did some other stuff. 136 00:07:54,100 --> 00:07:56,500 I even have like a Brit Pop band at one point, 137 00:07:56,500 --> 00:07:59,220 like in early 2000s, late 90s, early 2000s. 138 00:07:59,220 --> 00:08:04,020 And then around 2006 we decided to put the band back together. 139 00:08:04,020 --> 00:08:05,740 That was the my space era. 140 00:08:05,740 --> 00:08:09,620 And at the time it was like a revelation for us 141 00:08:09,620 --> 00:08:11,780 that we could actually get fans by just being active 142 00:08:11,780 --> 00:08:14,980 with the laptop, you know, back in the day. 143 00:08:14,980 --> 00:08:15,820 Yeah. 144 00:08:15,820 --> 00:08:16,940 - Everything we did was pre-inter that. 145 00:08:16,940 --> 00:08:18,180 So it was just like, you know, 146 00:08:18,180 --> 00:08:21,180 if you were lucky to get some ad in the newspaper 147 00:08:21,180 --> 00:08:24,740 and for the most part they even spelled our name wrong. 148 00:08:24,740 --> 00:08:29,100 So anyways, it was a revelation that we could just hang out online 149 00:08:29,100 --> 00:08:33,500 and get fans and then we were touring in Europe, Spain, 150 00:08:33,500 --> 00:08:35,980 Germany, Netherlands, all over the place. 151 00:08:35,980 --> 00:08:37,460 We'd do it yourself style. 152 00:08:37,460 --> 00:08:38,300 - Oh. 153 00:08:38,300 --> 00:08:39,140 - Rued of fun. 154 00:08:39,140 --> 00:08:40,300 - That's cool. 155 00:08:40,300 --> 00:08:42,340 - So I was a singer and we, I mean, 156 00:08:42,340 --> 00:08:44,860 the greatest thing we could accomplish with Fumble so far 157 00:08:44,860 --> 00:08:47,580 was band is still on is that we, 158 00:08:47,580 --> 00:08:50,780 I went to South by Southwest to promote the band 159 00:08:50,780 --> 00:08:54,700 like early 2000s and I met a company called AudioSocket. 160 00:08:55,460 --> 00:08:57,660 And we put our music there in the database 161 00:08:57,660 --> 00:08:59,340 and then like 10 years after, 162 00:08:59,340 --> 00:09:02,220 which has got an email that our song is, 163 00:09:02,220 --> 00:09:05,180 one of the songs in the special, sorry, 164 00:09:05,180 --> 00:09:07,140 "Law and Order" special victims unit 165 00:09:07,140 --> 00:09:10,100 in one of the episodes that used our songs. 166 00:09:10,100 --> 00:09:12,860 Like in the, like literally like the first, 167 00:09:12,860 --> 00:09:16,540 like before the end of the intro starts, 168 00:09:16,540 --> 00:09:19,580 like over a minute they have our song in the background. 169 00:09:19,580 --> 00:09:20,420 - That's cool. 170 00:09:20,420 --> 00:09:22,260 - That's cool. 171 00:09:22,260 --> 00:09:23,260 - That's cool. 172 00:09:23,260 --> 00:09:24,860 - That was pretty cool. 173 00:09:24,860 --> 00:09:27,500 So anyway, that's my main project Fumble still going on. 174 00:09:27,500 --> 00:09:29,460 Now I live abroad, I live in the Middle East for work, 175 00:09:29,460 --> 00:09:32,980 but my friends from Fumble are still in Finland 176 00:09:32,980 --> 00:09:35,900 and whenever I go to Finland we do play together. 177 00:09:35,900 --> 00:09:38,860 And then this higher low started a couple of years ago. 178 00:09:38,860 --> 00:09:43,860 I was increasingly traveling for business in the Middle East 179 00:09:43,860 --> 00:09:46,460 and then I had like time in my hands during the weekends 180 00:09:46,460 --> 00:09:48,660 and you know, I could either do like a Netflix binge 181 00:09:48,660 --> 00:09:51,820 or read a book or I could pick up acoustic guitar 182 00:09:51,820 --> 00:09:56,460 and start writing songs and I decided to do the last option 183 00:09:56,460 --> 00:09:59,900 of this and I just got the idea that okay, 184 00:09:59,900 --> 00:10:02,740 I got into Bitcoin 2017, so I had already been 185 00:10:02,740 --> 00:10:05,140 like pretty heavily orange spill at the time. 186 00:10:05,140 --> 00:10:08,940 So I was like could I, you know, turn my kind of, 187 00:10:08,940 --> 00:10:11,700 some kind of skills of making these short snappy, 188 00:10:11,700 --> 00:10:14,580 you know, puppet punk songs into acoustic songs 189 00:10:14,580 --> 00:10:17,580 about the Bitcoin culture without being too obvious about it, 190 00:10:17,580 --> 00:10:19,060 like never saying the word Bitcoin, 191 00:10:19,060 --> 00:10:21,500 but like, you know, having the cultural elements 192 00:10:21,500 --> 00:10:23,620 in the songs and see if I could make it work. 193 00:10:23,620 --> 00:10:26,100 And yeah, so I just started writing songs 194 00:10:26,100 --> 00:10:28,900 and I was very shy about them like a year, 195 00:10:28,900 --> 00:10:31,940 just kept them in my, in my desk drawer and then finally, 196 00:10:31,940 --> 00:10:36,340 you made it two years ago exactly when I started recording them 197 00:10:36,340 --> 00:10:39,020 with the same laptop that I'm using now to make this goal. 198 00:10:39,020 --> 00:10:41,380 So very, very low key because I didn't, 199 00:10:41,380 --> 00:10:43,900 I didn't want to involve everybody else in the project 200 00:10:43,900 --> 00:10:46,940 because you know, I wasn't sure if it's gonna go anywhere. 201 00:10:46,940 --> 00:10:47,940 (laughs) 202 00:10:47,940 --> 00:10:50,860 So I did it everything myself and then finally like a year, 203 00:10:50,860 --> 00:10:53,460 a year ago some people started to notice. 204 00:10:53,460 --> 00:10:56,900 I got to invite it to the Bitcoin beats, 205 00:10:56,900 --> 00:11:00,180 not the beach as you bat bathe and take the sun 206 00:11:00,180 --> 00:11:03,740 about the beats like Bitcoin beats, podcast. 207 00:11:03,740 --> 00:11:06,460 And then during that interview, 208 00:11:06,460 --> 00:11:10,220 they actually said that we're gonna have a festival in Boston 209 00:11:10,220 --> 00:11:13,100 in June last year and would you like to come to play? 210 00:11:13,100 --> 00:11:16,100 And I just said, I'll be there and that's how kind of, 211 00:11:16,100 --> 00:11:16,940 (laughs) 212 00:11:16,940 --> 00:11:19,180 things started this novel ever since. 213 00:11:19,180 --> 00:11:21,540 Well, you know, it's funny because I was, 214 00:11:21,540 --> 00:11:25,940 I had a call last week with some folks at the Charlotte 215 00:11:25,940 --> 00:11:27,620 Bitcoin meetup. 216 00:11:27,620 --> 00:11:28,460 Yeah. 217 00:11:28,460 --> 00:11:31,020 And did you come, did you come over here and play 218 00:11:31,020 --> 00:11:32,540 Hottle Ween at the Charlotte? 219 00:11:32,540 --> 00:11:33,380 Yeah. 220 00:11:33,380 --> 00:11:34,700 Did you really, that's cool. 221 00:11:34,700 --> 00:11:37,260 I did, I did, was amazing. 222 00:11:37,260 --> 00:11:38,500 That's a great part of it. 223 00:11:38,500 --> 00:11:41,260 Dude, that is really impressive. 224 00:11:41,260 --> 00:11:43,660 That is really impressive that you've gone from, 225 00:11:43,660 --> 00:11:45,220 and I know where Espo is. 226 00:11:45,220 --> 00:11:48,420 I know it's on the west side of Helsinki. 227 00:11:48,420 --> 00:11:53,340 I think I've got two friends who are there. 228 00:11:53,340 --> 00:11:57,860 One of them is involved in the Finnish ballet, by the way. 229 00:11:57,860 --> 00:11:59,180 Okay. 230 00:11:59,180 --> 00:12:03,220 But yeah, man, let me just say first of all, 231 00:12:03,220 --> 00:12:06,420 I think Fumble is a great name for a band, 232 00:12:06,420 --> 00:12:08,420 especially a punk band. 233 00:12:08,420 --> 00:12:10,740 Like you nailed it on that one. 234 00:12:10,740 --> 00:12:15,460 And it's really cool that you guys are still doing it, 235 00:12:15,460 --> 00:12:16,500 that you guys are still together. 236 00:12:16,500 --> 00:12:19,740 I mean, I know you're all spread out now, but like, 237 00:12:19,740 --> 00:12:22,980 when was the last time Fumble played a gig? 238 00:12:22,980 --> 00:12:29,340 It was last, last year we had like our 30 years 239 00:12:29,340 --> 00:12:30,340 anniversary. 240 00:12:30,340 --> 00:12:31,340 Yeah. 241 00:12:31,340 --> 00:12:32,340 Yeah. 242 00:12:32,340 --> 00:12:33,340 Sorry, sorry. 243 00:12:33,340 --> 00:12:35,620 Little over a year ago, yeah, one and a half years ago. 244 00:12:35,620 --> 00:12:36,460 Cool. 245 00:12:36,460 --> 00:12:38,300 Do you guys have any plans of like, 246 00:12:38,300 --> 00:12:40,580 hey, I'm going to be back in Helsinki in six months. 247 00:12:40,580 --> 00:12:44,380 Let's do a gig, do you like the, or is it, yeah? 248 00:12:44,380 --> 00:12:45,660 100%, 100%. 249 00:12:45,660 --> 00:12:49,500 So I was there in January and we had like such a wonderful evening 250 00:12:49,500 --> 00:12:50,420 playing like all the way. 251 00:12:50,420 --> 00:12:52,740 And I think I left the practice place like 4 a.m. 252 00:12:52,740 --> 00:12:53,700 or something like that. 253 00:12:53,700 --> 00:12:55,140 So it's a good time. 254 00:12:55,140 --> 00:12:55,660 Good time. 255 00:12:55,660 --> 00:12:57,260 And yeah. 256 00:12:57,260 --> 00:12:58,260 Yeah. 257 00:12:58,260 --> 00:13:02,260 So how's the energy, like, compared to like 30 years ago, 258 00:13:02,260 --> 00:13:06,460 you know, when you guys were 15, 16, 17 and playing, 259 00:13:06,460 --> 00:13:10,740 and now you're 30 years older and your ears are ringing, 260 00:13:10,740 --> 00:13:13,540 and you've got arthritis and, you know, 261 00:13:13,540 --> 00:13:17,380 how's the energy level when the guys get to, when y'all get together? 262 00:13:17,380 --> 00:13:18,620 Is it heavier? 263 00:13:18,620 --> 00:13:21,740 Is it, I mean, I'm, you know, I'm sure everybody gets a little rusty 264 00:13:21,740 --> 00:13:26,260 on their instruments, but what's the vibe when you guys get together in jam? 265 00:13:26,260 --> 00:13:27,300 That's a great question. 266 00:13:27,300 --> 00:13:32,580 I have to have to tell a little story because when we put the band together, 267 00:13:32,580 --> 00:13:36,700 to the fumble together, back together, like, 2006 ish, 268 00:13:36,700 --> 00:13:39,940 I actually said to my best friend from the band, 269 00:13:39,940 --> 00:13:44,180 only that guitarist, that hardly beat old, 270 00:13:44,180 --> 00:13:47,460 to gonna go hard on this, at this age. 271 00:13:47,460 --> 00:13:52,260 And he just looked me in the IS, like, dude, like, 272 00:13:52,260 --> 00:13:55,340 the longer you do it, the better you get at it. 273 00:13:55,340 --> 00:13:57,700 You keep doing it, you'll get better. 274 00:13:57,700 --> 00:14:00,340 And I was like, okay, and I just switched my attitude, 275 00:14:00,340 --> 00:14:02,980 like, age is nothing, we just keep doing it, 276 00:14:02,980 --> 00:14:06,900 and just keep getting better and rocking harder as we go along. 277 00:14:06,900 --> 00:14:10,780 And I have to say my answer is that we are better 278 00:14:10,780 --> 00:14:15,220 and I'd rock at least as hard as we did back in the day. 279 00:14:15,220 --> 00:14:18,540 >> You know what I'm really looking forward to in about, 280 00:14:18,540 --> 00:14:24,420 because I think I'm probably about five or six years older than you. 281 00:14:24,420 --> 00:14:28,060 But yet, you know what I'm really looking forward to? 282 00:14:28,060 --> 00:14:33,540 In about 20 years, when all of us are in our 70s and 80s, 283 00:14:35,020 --> 00:14:39,020 I'm looking forward to going and seeing a kickass punk band 284 00:14:39,020 --> 00:14:41,500 who never got signed, who's like in their 70s, 285 00:14:41,500 --> 00:14:43,180 and they're still fucking shredding. 286 00:14:43,180 --> 00:14:45,580 Like, I can't wait to see that, you know? 287 00:14:45,580 --> 00:14:49,460 >> Yeah, we're gonna show all these young punks 288 00:14:49,460 --> 00:14:52,540 how to play God damn song, you know? 289 00:14:52,540 --> 00:14:56,940 >> 100%, I think Fumble is a good candidate to be that band 290 00:14:56,940 --> 00:14:59,940 because we are very unknown and we are very, 291 00:14:59,940 --> 00:15:01,460 very kind of energetic still. 292 00:15:01,460 --> 00:15:05,180 And we just refuse to die. 293 00:15:05,180 --> 00:15:09,220 >> And you guys got on lawn order, that is so cool. 294 00:15:09,220 --> 00:15:10,860 >> Yeah. 295 00:15:10,860 --> 00:15:14,860 >> Who is your, who's your, your PRO? 296 00:15:14,860 --> 00:15:17,420 Is it ASCAP or CSAC or BMI? 297 00:15:17,420 --> 00:15:18,940 What is it? 298 00:15:18,940 --> 00:15:21,820 >> So it's a, it's the finish one, buddy. 299 00:15:21,820 --> 00:15:23,300 >> Yeah, the finish one, yeah. 300 00:15:23,300 --> 00:15:26,820 >> It's a feeling, it's a feeling I think with ASCAP or BMI 301 00:15:26,820 --> 00:15:28,380 or something like that, yeah? 302 00:15:28,380 --> 00:15:31,340 >> How long did it take for? 303 00:15:31,340 --> 00:15:35,300 Like, the show, for the song to get in the show, 304 00:15:35,300 --> 00:15:37,980 you said it took like 10 years, right? 305 00:15:37,980 --> 00:15:39,300 >> But something like that, yeah. 306 00:15:39,300 --> 00:15:42,500 >> When the show first aired, when did you, 307 00:15:42,500 --> 00:15:44,420 when did the check come in the mail? 308 00:15:44,420 --> 00:15:45,820 Was it like a year? 309 00:15:45,820 --> 00:15:47,860 >> Yeah, a year, what was it? 310 00:15:47,860 --> 00:15:50,540 >> Well, actually, this one, it came like early 311 00:15:50,540 --> 00:15:53,100 because all these other, that's idea was that 312 00:15:53,100 --> 00:15:54,900 we kind of gave the rights to the song 313 00:15:54,900 --> 00:15:58,380 that they can just sell it with like one-time payment. 314 00:15:58,380 --> 00:15:59,300 >> Yeah, yeah, okay. 315 00:15:59,300 --> 00:16:00,820 >> So we could have checked, 316 00:16:00,820 --> 00:16:02,420 that's how the whole thing started. 317 00:16:02,420 --> 00:16:05,580 I just got an email from audio socket that says a check 318 00:16:05,580 --> 00:16:08,420 for the placement of your song and I was like, okay, 319 00:16:08,420 --> 00:16:13,420 and then it just set like, like, L and O-S-V-U. 320 00:16:13,420 --> 00:16:16,780 And I was like, okay, I didn't think about it too much. 321 00:16:16,780 --> 00:16:20,100 And then later I was like, okay, this actually is low 322 00:16:20,100 --> 00:16:21,900 and order, especially with big things here. 323 00:16:21,900 --> 00:16:24,940 It really took me a while to realize the impact. 324 00:16:24,940 --> 00:16:28,460 And it was so funny because the song read out 325 00:16:28,460 --> 00:16:31,900 was like a filler song on our album, "Rise" 326 00:16:31,900 --> 00:16:33,580 that we made, "Two, This is Seven." 327 00:16:33,580 --> 00:16:36,060 And we never played it live. 328 00:16:36,060 --> 00:16:38,140 It was just a song, okay, we didn't have another song, 329 00:16:38,140 --> 00:16:40,660 so let's play something like this, let's put it there. 330 00:16:40,660 --> 00:16:42,460 And that was the song that ended up there. 331 00:16:42,460 --> 00:16:45,380 And before that, I was looking at our Spotify statistics 332 00:16:45,380 --> 00:16:49,020 and stuff like, why is this song the most played song? 333 00:16:49,020 --> 00:16:51,820 Like, we never played it live, it's never made a video, 334 00:16:51,820 --> 00:16:53,580 it's like a filler song. 335 00:16:53,580 --> 00:16:55,940 >> Oh, that is the most popular song 336 00:16:55,940 --> 00:16:58,860 that you've just bought the five for us. 337 00:16:58,860 --> 00:17:00,940 >> That's funny, yeah, I'm gonna go check out-- 338 00:17:00,940 --> 00:17:02,340 >> Yeah. >> I'm gonna go check out 339 00:17:02,340 --> 00:17:04,460 "Fumble Spotify" page right now. 340 00:17:04,460 --> 00:17:05,460 >> That's funny. 341 00:17:05,460 --> 00:17:09,220 >> So like, I mean, you guys, and basically, 342 00:17:09,220 --> 00:17:14,220 I mean, you know, finish the performing rights organizations 343 00:17:14,220 --> 00:17:18,420 in Europe are stronger than they are here in the States. 344 00:17:18,420 --> 00:17:22,940 So we used to joke here, like, if you would get something 345 00:17:22,940 --> 00:17:25,380 in sync for a TV show or something like that, 346 00:17:25,380 --> 00:17:27,540 like, you probably couldn't pay the rent with it 347 00:17:27,540 --> 00:17:29,620 unless it kept on happening, right? 348 00:17:29,620 --> 00:17:33,540 Like, you know, for us, it was beer money, right? 349 00:17:33,540 --> 00:17:38,540 So hopefully you got more than beer money out of the deal. 350 00:17:38,540 --> 00:17:40,500 That's really cool, man. 351 00:17:40,500 --> 00:17:47,100 Let me ask you real quick too about writing lyrics in English. 352 00:17:47,100 --> 00:17:53,700 'Cause I always love talking to multilingual artists 353 00:17:53,700 --> 00:17:54,980 such as yourself. 354 00:17:54,980 --> 00:18:00,420 One of my best friends, most talented musician I know 355 00:18:00,420 --> 00:18:02,540 is from Gothenburg, Sweden. 356 00:18:02,540 --> 00:18:07,140 And he's got like three or four languages under his belt, right? 357 00:18:07,140 --> 00:18:11,940 And I'm always fascinated by how he writes lyrics in English 358 00:18:11,940 --> 00:18:15,060 and his word choice and his rhyme. 359 00:18:15,060 --> 00:18:21,100 He puts things together that I wouldn't think to do. 360 00:18:21,100 --> 00:18:25,660 And I think a lot of that has to do with that everything starts 361 00:18:25,660 --> 00:18:28,060 in Swedish and is brain and then it comes out in English. 362 00:18:28,060 --> 00:18:31,980 Like, do you find it's difficult? 363 00:18:31,980 --> 00:18:34,060 Do you find it's interesting? 364 00:18:34,060 --> 00:18:36,660 Like, what are your thoughts about writing in English? 365 00:18:36,660 --> 00:18:39,420 - That's a great question. 366 00:18:39,420 --> 00:18:44,140 I personally got like, really indoctrinated 367 00:18:44,140 --> 00:18:48,140 with the kind of American culture very, very early on. 368 00:18:48,140 --> 00:18:50,140 Like, one of the things in Finland is that 369 00:18:50,140 --> 00:18:52,260 when I was watching my favorite songs as a kid, 370 00:18:52,260 --> 00:18:55,460 like "Petal Staggalactic" and these kind of things, 371 00:18:55,460 --> 00:18:59,460 we didn't have any, any, what do you call dubbing. 372 00:18:59,460 --> 00:19:02,340 So like, it's always the original speaking 373 00:19:02,340 --> 00:19:04,020 and then just subtitles. 374 00:19:04,020 --> 00:19:07,940 So we were like, let's say people in Germany or Spain, 375 00:19:07,940 --> 00:19:11,140 they don't get in touch with English language so early on 376 00:19:11,140 --> 00:19:13,260 because most of those TV shows are dubbed. 377 00:19:13,260 --> 00:19:15,780 So even though it's American TV show, 378 00:19:15,780 --> 00:19:18,700 when they see it, it's been dubbed into their own language. 379 00:19:18,700 --> 00:19:19,780 So that was one thing. 380 00:19:19,780 --> 00:19:23,420 Second thing, I was obsessed with super hero comic books 381 00:19:23,420 --> 00:19:27,300 and at the time, only a few of them were like released in Finland 382 00:19:27,300 --> 00:19:28,940 so there were a couple of comic stores, 383 00:19:28,940 --> 00:19:30,940 comic book stores in Helsinki. 384 00:19:30,940 --> 00:19:33,620 I went there, spent all my pocket money by those 385 00:19:33,620 --> 00:19:35,580 and then I was, because I wanted to read them, 386 00:19:35,580 --> 00:19:38,420 I just kept reading them and, you know, 387 00:19:38,420 --> 00:19:40,660 there's a picture and there's a speech bubble 388 00:19:40,660 --> 00:19:41,740 with English language. 389 00:19:41,740 --> 00:19:43,740 I kind of learned English language by myself 390 00:19:43,740 --> 00:19:45,700 like when I was six or something like that, 391 00:19:45,700 --> 00:19:47,860 even before I started learning in school. 392 00:19:47,860 --> 00:19:50,140 So English language became very natural for me. 393 00:19:50,140 --> 00:19:52,700 So when I went to school, I basically didn't have 394 00:19:52,700 --> 00:19:54,020 to study English at all. 395 00:19:54,020 --> 00:19:56,580 I just kind of take the tests and got like good grace 396 00:19:56,580 --> 00:19:58,100 every single time. 397 00:19:58,100 --> 00:20:01,140 So in that sense, it was very natural for me 398 00:20:01,140 --> 00:20:02,700 to start making songs in English. 399 00:20:02,700 --> 00:20:06,580 I actually never even considered making songs in Finnish language. 400 00:20:06,580 --> 00:20:09,620 - Really? - And, yeah. 401 00:20:09,620 --> 00:20:11,540 - What did you, like, yeah. 402 00:20:11,540 --> 00:20:15,900 - Is fumble, that's all in English, right? 403 00:20:15,900 --> 00:20:18,140 - All in English, all in English. 404 00:20:18,140 --> 00:20:19,220 - Okay. 405 00:20:19,220 --> 00:20:23,340 Well, how, like, I mean, because finishes is interesting. 406 00:20:23,340 --> 00:20:25,980 It's not, it's not a Slavic language. 407 00:20:25,980 --> 00:20:27,500 It's Euralic, right? 408 00:20:27,500 --> 00:20:30,660 U-A, or U-R-A-L-I-C-S. 409 00:20:30,660 --> 00:20:33,420 - Yes. - It's not, it's not Slavic. 410 00:20:33,420 --> 00:20:35,180 It's not Germanic. 411 00:20:35,180 --> 00:20:38,820 You know, I mean, it's, you guys in the Estonians 412 00:20:38,820 --> 00:20:43,540 and I was in Finland in 91 in Estonia in 91. 413 00:20:43,540 --> 00:20:46,860 I mean, you guys have a different breed of language, man. 414 00:20:46,860 --> 00:20:48,740 You guys are, you guys are sometimes-- 415 00:20:48,740 --> 00:20:51,300 - It's how we are. - Right, it's weird. 416 00:20:51,300 --> 00:20:52,140 It's weird. 417 00:20:52,140 --> 00:20:53,900 They even had, like, in the second World War, 418 00:20:53,900 --> 00:20:56,660 they were using Finnish guys as, like, you know, 419 00:20:56,660 --> 00:20:59,740 on one side of the kind of radio signal 420 00:20:59,740 --> 00:21:01,220 and the other side of the radio signal, 421 00:21:01,220 --> 00:21:03,100 they just talking in Finnish, so that German 422 00:21:03,100 --> 00:21:05,820 could crack the code, so that was like that. 423 00:21:05,820 --> 00:21:08,500 Early verse enough, "Cryptography" in, like, 424 00:21:08,500 --> 00:21:09,780 with the Finnish twist. 425 00:21:09,780 --> 00:21:11,260 - Really? - That's cool. 426 00:21:11,260 --> 00:21:12,260 - Yeah, yeah. - Yeah. 427 00:21:12,260 --> 00:21:16,580 Have you heard the story about the American Indians 428 00:21:16,580 --> 00:21:21,580 who were code talkers for the US Army in the Pacific? 429 00:21:21,580 --> 00:21:24,900 Did you ever hear about that? 430 00:21:24,900 --> 00:21:27,700 - I've heard the story, and I think it's a quite similar 431 00:21:27,700 --> 00:21:30,300 kind of story, kind of, a rions with that one, yeah. 432 00:21:30,300 --> 00:21:31,500 - Yeah, that's cool. 433 00:21:31,500 --> 00:21:33,180 It's a very unique language. 434 00:21:33,180 --> 00:21:35,060 It's Estonia is the closest one. 435 00:21:35,060 --> 00:21:40,060 It's kind of a structural level related to Hungarian as well, 436 00:21:40,740 --> 00:21:43,340 but, yeah, Hungary and people, 437 00:21:43,340 --> 00:21:45,100 and Finnish people can't understand each other. 438 00:21:45,100 --> 00:21:46,940 Couple of words I'll say in the lore, but. 439 00:21:46,940 --> 00:21:48,940 - Yeah, Estonia is quite, you know, 440 00:21:48,940 --> 00:21:51,460 you can kind of understand what they're saying. 441 00:21:51,460 --> 00:21:54,500 - Well, your command of the language is excellent, 442 00:21:54,500 --> 00:21:58,100 and everything comes out clean in the songs, 443 00:21:58,100 --> 00:21:59,660 so kudos to you. 444 00:21:59,660 --> 00:22:02,500 I mean, you got more brain power than I do, man. 445 00:22:02,500 --> 00:22:07,180 Damn, I could, I mean, my German is really bad, 446 00:22:07,180 --> 00:22:08,420 and I can barely do English, 447 00:22:08,420 --> 00:22:12,540 so you're better man than I, as they say. 448 00:22:12,540 --> 00:22:13,780 - Well, well, well. 449 00:22:13,780 --> 00:22:17,260 Yeah, I mean, just been doing for such a long time, 450 00:22:17,260 --> 00:22:19,220 also lived in the States for a couple of years, 451 00:22:19,220 --> 00:22:22,300 and, you know, I'm married to American, 452 00:22:22,300 --> 00:22:25,300 so, and kids speak English almost once, so, yeah. 453 00:22:25,300 --> 00:22:28,340 - Yeah, where in the States did you live? 454 00:22:28,340 --> 00:22:31,340 I lived in New York for a while, like six months, 455 00:22:31,340 --> 00:22:35,220 and then, a little over a year in San Francisco. 456 00:22:35,220 --> 00:22:36,300 - Oh, okay, good. 457 00:22:36,300 --> 00:22:38,380 Well, you got both coasts. 458 00:22:38,380 --> 00:22:39,740 - Yeah, you got both coasts. 459 00:22:39,740 --> 00:22:40,980 Yeah, okay. 460 00:22:40,980 --> 00:22:44,340 So, all right, so let's go down the rabbit hole a little bit, 461 00:22:44,340 --> 00:22:47,660 like how did you, how'd you find Bitcoin? 462 00:22:47,660 --> 00:22:50,220 When did that all start? 463 00:22:50,220 --> 00:22:55,220 - Yeah, so it's kind of, not super atypical story. 464 00:22:55,220 --> 00:22:59,860 I mean, I've been working in tech ever since university days, 465 00:22:59,860 --> 00:23:01,980 so like my life has been kind of a combination 466 00:23:01,980 --> 00:23:03,580 of being a tech entrepreneur, 467 00:23:03,580 --> 00:23:07,100 and then, then, like, punk musician on all my free time. 468 00:23:08,340 --> 00:23:13,340 - Nice. - So, so, so, so, so, I started hearing about Bitcoin, 469 00:23:13,340 --> 00:23:17,900 you know, maybe a couple of years after it was launched, 470 00:23:17,900 --> 00:23:21,500 and I was actually living in the US 2011 to 2013, 471 00:23:21,500 --> 00:23:25,700 so I was kind of there when things started to happen with it, 472 00:23:25,700 --> 00:23:28,980 but for me, you know, Finland was pretty advanced 473 00:23:28,980 --> 00:23:31,980 with different kinds of digital services, 474 00:23:31,980 --> 00:23:35,980 so you could use, you know, text message to order a taxi 475 00:23:35,980 --> 00:23:40,060 already in like 1997, 1998, so like, you were quite-- 476 00:23:40,060 --> 00:23:41,660 - Yeah, quite Nokia. 477 00:23:41,660 --> 00:23:43,740 - Exactly, because Nokia. 478 00:23:43,740 --> 00:23:45,980 So, so, so another thing I missed completely, 479 00:23:45,980 --> 00:23:49,820 when was when Uber, Uber was just starting to happen at the time, 480 00:23:49,820 --> 00:23:52,580 and I was like, well, I've been able to order a taxi 481 00:23:52,580 --> 00:23:54,820 with my phone for like, you know, eight years, so, 482 00:23:54,820 --> 00:23:57,060 what's, what's the special thing here? 483 00:23:57,060 --> 00:23:59,940 Anyways, I kind of didn't see that, 484 00:23:59,940 --> 00:24:02,460 see that the user experience and all the map, 485 00:24:02,460 --> 00:24:04,660 and everything, it's, and your credit card there, 486 00:24:04,660 --> 00:24:08,260 not having to pay cash, all that kind of stuff was that real thing, 487 00:24:08,260 --> 00:24:12,340 but, you know, my early, early impression was that there's nothing here, 488 00:24:12,340 --> 00:24:14,900 but the same thing with Bitcoin, I kind of got into that, 489 00:24:14,900 --> 00:24:18,100 like, heard about it, that, okay, it's been used in Silk Road, 490 00:24:18,100 --> 00:24:20,740 Silk Road, and it's been used by Vigiliks, 491 00:24:20,740 --> 00:24:24,140 and all this kind of thing, so, I thought it's some kind of a fringe, 492 00:24:24,140 --> 00:24:27,900 fringe thing, and not kind of a relevant for me in my life, 493 00:24:27,900 --> 00:24:30,620 but then I had come back to Finland, 494 00:24:30,620 --> 00:24:34,100 was working in another tech company at the time, 495 00:24:34,100 --> 00:24:41,100 and we acquired a small, really talented developer team in 2016, 496 00:24:41,100 --> 00:24:42,700 and then it turned out that these, 497 00:24:42,700 --> 00:24:44,860 these guys were like hardcore Bitcoiners. 498 00:24:44,860 --> 00:24:45,860 (laughs) 499 00:24:45,860 --> 00:24:46,860 - Oh, okay. 500 00:24:46,860 --> 00:24:51,380 - And they had actually built a Bitcoin service already in 2013, 501 00:24:51,380 --> 00:24:54,260 and then they had sold it, I think, around 2015, 502 00:24:54,260 --> 00:24:57,300 when things were like, you know, it was like a bear market, 503 00:24:57,300 --> 00:25:00,820 so they sold it away, but they still had the kind of passion 504 00:25:00,820 --> 00:25:04,740 and the skills, and then took me a year, basically, 505 00:25:04,740 --> 00:25:08,260 to kind of talk with them and see how interested they were, 506 00:25:08,260 --> 00:25:09,900 like, looking at the price chart every time, 507 00:25:09,900 --> 00:25:12,580 they were coding, like, one screen was always the Bitcoin price chart, 508 00:25:12,580 --> 00:25:14,420 so, like, there must be something here, 509 00:25:14,420 --> 00:25:17,820 and then 2017, when the price started going up, 510 00:25:17,820 --> 00:25:20,820 when it reached the top in December, like, 511 00:25:20,820 --> 00:25:23,060 20,000, and dropped to 15 or something, 512 00:25:23,060 --> 00:25:26,420 then I was like, okay, fine, I'll just buy a little bit, 513 00:25:26,420 --> 00:25:29,700 like, a piece of a Bitcoin, just to kind of have some skin in the game, 514 00:25:29,700 --> 00:25:32,660 so that's what I did, and then I started learning. 515 00:25:32,660 --> 00:25:35,380 After, you know, the usual thing, when you have some skin in the game, 516 00:25:35,380 --> 00:25:38,740 you start learning, always really focused on Bitcoin, 517 00:25:38,740 --> 00:25:43,300 but I did have my little detour in the, in the Bitcoin arena, 518 00:25:43,300 --> 00:25:46,500 so, I'm used to being a tech-ed entrepreneur, 519 00:25:46,500 --> 00:25:50,660 and being involved in many startups, and tech innovations, 520 00:25:50,660 --> 00:25:52,100 and building, like, all kinds of stuff, 521 00:25:52,100 --> 00:25:54,580 so, obviously, I was like, Bitcoin is like the, 522 00:25:54,580 --> 00:25:59,300 it's like the, like, the solid rock behind this, 523 00:25:59,300 --> 00:26:03,300 all of this, but, but what are these kind of nice little, you know, 524 00:26:03,300 --> 00:26:07,700 things around it? And I spent maybe two years exploring, 525 00:26:07,700 --> 00:26:11,860 like, blockchain for X type of things, our company was doing lots of digital services 526 00:26:11,860 --> 00:26:16,260 for, like, real estate stuff, so, what could blockchain be used for real estate, 527 00:26:16,260 --> 00:26:20,820 and all the other kind of stuff? But then, the more I went to these blockchain events, 528 00:26:20,820 --> 00:26:25,380 I went in Dubai, and I'm out at these kind of a generic blockchain events, 529 00:26:25,380 --> 00:26:27,620 when I spoke with those people, like, face-to-face, 530 00:26:27,620 --> 00:26:31,780 like, those altcoin people, I started feeling like, really slimy, 531 00:26:31,780 --> 00:26:35,060 like, somehow, I didn't feel like that they were in it for, like, 532 00:26:35,060 --> 00:26:37,620 anything, like, long-term, they were more like, 533 00:26:37,620 --> 00:26:41,380 yeah, let's, I have this, at the time, they were talking about those, 534 00:26:41,380 --> 00:26:45,540 ICO boom had died, so now they were talking about the SD, or something like that, 535 00:26:45,540 --> 00:26:47,220 whatever, they always find some new, 536 00:26:47,220 --> 00:26:51,620 accurate, and, like, kind of market, so, so, then, I started to gravitate to those, 537 00:26:51,620 --> 00:26:54,100 couple of Bitcoiners who were at the events, and, like, 538 00:26:54,100 --> 00:26:57,620 found that I've actually actually had much more, like, meaningful discussions, 539 00:26:57,620 --> 00:27:01,380 also, maybe to add in the mix, like, my tech background, my punker background, 540 00:27:01,380 --> 00:27:06,980 and also, my university studies were around sociology, and, like, social sciences, 541 00:27:06,980 --> 00:27:10,980 so, these three things started to, kind of, finally, like, 542 00:27:10,980 --> 00:27:14,740 I started to realize that Bitcoin is, like, sits in the middle of all of this, 543 00:27:14,740 --> 00:27:17,940 it's tech, it's punk rock, and it's also, like, social science, 544 00:27:17,940 --> 00:27:20,340 economics, and things, and then, 545 00:27:20,340 --> 00:27:25,140 - Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, finally, in, like, let's say, 2020, 546 00:27:25,140 --> 00:27:29,220 I kind of completely got out of everything else, just, Bitcoin only, 547 00:27:29,220 --> 00:27:35,140 here we go, and, and I remember it was that time, literally, like, a week before COVID started, 548 00:27:35,140 --> 00:27:39,380 like, shutting everything down, February, 2020, or something, 549 00:27:39,380 --> 00:27:41,460 I was reading, uh, 550 00:27:41,460 --> 00:27:45,620 Safedin's book in Egypt, where family holiday, and, like, 551 00:27:45,620 --> 00:27:48,180 there was this one graph, there was, like, uh, 552 00:27:48,180 --> 00:27:52,180 when, when to use blockchain, and it was, like, you know, 553 00:27:52,180 --> 00:27:54,820 do you need to have, you have a decentralized digital money? 554 00:27:54,820 --> 00:27:58,660 Yes, you speedcode, no, don't use blockchain, and that's it. 555 00:27:58,660 --> 00:28:00,980 I was like, actually, it makes a lot of sense. 556 00:28:00,980 --> 00:28:03,700 After everything he had explained in the book beforehand, 557 00:28:03,700 --> 00:28:06,100 all the way money comes from what is his purpose, 558 00:28:06,100 --> 00:28:07,460 what is the idea of hardness in money? 559 00:28:07,460 --> 00:28:09,700 All these kind of things just came to me in that one thing. 560 00:28:09,700 --> 00:28:12,340 I was like, okay, at least in my personal life, 561 00:28:12,340 --> 00:28:14,980 I'm gonna be fully focused on Bitcoin, forget everything else. 562 00:28:14,980 --> 00:28:18,420 I was always like 90, something percent on Bitcoin, but still, I just 563 00:28:18,420 --> 00:28:22,660 let everything else go, and then life was so much easier afterwards. 564 00:28:22,660 --> 00:28:23,780 I think, yeah. 565 00:28:23,780 --> 00:28:25,780 I could just focus on one thing, yeah. 566 00:28:25,780 --> 00:28:31,540 You know, when you talked about Nokia and 567 00:28:31,540 --> 00:28:36,580 getting taxis on your phone way back in the 90s, um, 568 00:28:36,580 --> 00:28:41,940 I'm, I'm always kind of, I don't want to spend a lot of time on this. 569 00:28:41,940 --> 00:28:44,420 I just want to say, like, it blows me away. 570 00:28:44,580 --> 00:28:50,740 How many, how so many people in tech and so many people in business don't realize, 571 00:28:50,740 --> 00:28:56,740 um, the contribution that Finland and Estonia have made to tech. 572 00:28:56,740 --> 00:29:00,660 Like, they, like, there's a little tech bubble up there, man. 573 00:29:00,660 --> 00:29:07,380 Like Nokia, zoom, you know, there's a, there's a lot of great stuff 574 00:29:07,380 --> 00:29:10,580 that has come out of Helsinki and, and Tallinn. 575 00:29:10,580 --> 00:29:15,460 And for whatever, I'm, I guess, geography and being on the other side of the world, right? 576 00:29:15,460 --> 00:29:22,020 But, um, anyways, shout out to Finland and, and Estonia for their, for their tech advances. 577 00:29:22,020 --> 00:29:23,780 So, 100 percent, 100 percent. 578 00:29:23,780 --> 00:29:29,060 Lots of, lots of, lots of engineers, lots of nerds, lots of cold dark weather, where, where, like, 579 00:29:29,060 --> 00:29:33,540 you don't feel guilty about, like, sitting in front of your screen for like 12 hours in a straight. 580 00:29:33,540 --> 00:29:37,140 So, there are a lot of, a lot of things that kind of help with that, but, yeah, definitely, 581 00:29:37,140 --> 00:29:41,940 we can be proud, proud about what Finland has accomplished, even in the open source arena, 582 00:29:41,940 --> 00:29:47,700 like Linux, obviously, as a face example. And then, you know, we even had the one of the first, 583 00:29:47,700 --> 00:29:53,140 first people to work on Bitcoin together with Satoshi, this, Marty, Marty is like, uh, 584 00:29:53,140 --> 00:29:59,300 Finnish guy, so like, yeah, we've, we've, we've had a, we've had a, it's an outsized impact in the 585 00:29:59,300 --> 00:30:03,300 world of tech, uh, being a small nation of only five or so million people. 586 00:30:03,300 --> 00:30:05,700 Yeah, it's really stunning. It's really stunning. 587 00:30:05,700 --> 00:30:10,820 So, all right, so we've got your musical background and, and we got your education 588 00:30:10,820 --> 00:30:16,180 background. And I love the, the, the sociology and I can see it all coming together, 589 00:30:16,180 --> 00:30:26,180 right? So, what was the first song that you wrote about, um, that, that you, that you kind of packaged 590 00:30:26,180 --> 00:30:33,460 under this higher low persona? What was the first Bitcoin song that you wrote about? And how did you 591 00:30:33,460 --> 00:30:42,740 get it up into the value verse? Yeah. So, I think the first song I ever wrote was LFG. Uh, and that's, 592 00:30:42,740 --> 00:30:47,700 that was the time around the China ban situation, all that kind of stuff and, and all that 593 00:30:47,700 --> 00:30:52,580 thought about like Bitcoin, boiling the oceans and stuff like that. So I put everything there, 594 00:30:52,580 --> 00:31:00,740 and also was very inspired by like the podcasts from, from Matt O'Dell and, uh, and Marty Bane, 595 00:31:00,740 --> 00:31:07,220 and, uh, all that kind of stuff. So this was very inspirational for me. So that, that was LFG. 596 00:31:07,220 --> 00:31:14,260 And the second one I remember vividly was when, uh, Christian Lagarde and ECB was 597 00:31:14,260 --> 00:31:19,940 giving their like, uh, speeches about how Bitcoin is in like an escape hatch and we need to close 598 00:31:19,940 --> 00:31:27,860 it down. Yeah. And then, then I wrote the song, Let Me Escape, uh, with, uh, Let Me Escape, uh, 599 00:31:29,700 --> 00:31:36,500 through the hatch that Satoshi made. Yeah. Because, uh, of course, I needed to take the inspiration and 600 00:31:36,500 --> 00:31:41,620 use it to our advantage as Bitcoiners. So then when did you first start putting it, 601 00:31:41,620 --> 00:31:46,420 now did, did you self-host any of the stuff before or, or how did you find a way, Blake? 602 00:31:46,420 --> 00:31:54,420 Yeah. Yeah. So, so it is silly then, uh, I had these songs then or so that I had just be like, 603 00:31:54,420 --> 00:32:01,220 a writing, uh, and, and you had them in my like notes app or something. And then it was the summer, 604 00:32:01,220 --> 00:32:07,140 December 2020. We were in Finland with the family and we're supposed to go to Estonia for a 605 00:32:07,140 --> 00:32:12,340 family trip. And then I got sick. So like, coffings, sneezing, all that kind of stuff. It was still 606 00:32:12,340 --> 00:32:16,980 the COVID time. So I was like, I can't go like, I can't be in a, in a boat like this. So, 607 00:32:16,980 --> 00:32:24,180 family went and I was by myself wake up next morning, totally fine. So I went, uh, this practice place, 608 00:32:24,180 --> 00:32:28,820 and then okay, now I take my laptop and I just started recording and learning as I go. I've never 609 00:32:28,820 --> 00:32:34,180 been like, much of a sound engineer myself. So I started making those songs. Then I had maybe 610 00:32:34,180 --> 00:32:40,260 ten of them recorded and then came back to Saudi for, for a work trip and then I just decided, 611 00:32:40,260 --> 00:32:46,420 okay, now it's the time. Just went to the balcony of the, of the place where I was living and took a 612 00:32:46,420 --> 00:32:52,660 laundry like, you know, where you hang your laundry, put a trash can on top of it and my cold pronged 613 00:32:52,660 --> 00:32:58,180 up of it and then press play and then just like pretend it to be singing and waving my hands like 614 00:32:58,180 --> 00:33:03,380 this. And then I just put it to YouTube immediately and just post it. Now it is my first song bank. 615 00:33:03,380 --> 00:33:09,060 So that's what I started to do. And then eventually like every month or so I put one song out, 616 00:33:09,060 --> 00:33:13,780 slowly made some kind of video and maybe a little bit good better. I started making videos with two 617 00:33:13,780 --> 00:33:22,580 cameras instead of one. Very, very low key. And then, yeah, about year after that was when things 618 00:33:22,580 --> 00:33:28,580 started to really happen. So last year's January when I was in the podcast with Bitcoin Beats guys 619 00:33:28,580 --> 00:33:36,340 for invited to mass adoption and then I got this inspiration to see if I could play elsewhere. 620 00:33:36,340 --> 00:33:42,660 My work is in a way kind of supportive of this because we already have offices in five countries 621 00:33:42,660 --> 00:33:48,500 with the company. And so I get the travel to these offices to meet the team. So I could all see that 622 00:33:48,500 --> 00:33:53,940 I'm gonna be I'm gonna be in Bangkok at this week. Is there anything happening? Oh, there's a bit 623 00:33:53,940 --> 00:33:58,020 of a talent conference happening during the weekend when I'm already there. So then I just send 624 00:33:58,020 --> 00:34:04,340 email to them, hey, I'm coming, I'm a guitar. If you want a free show, you know, I'm available and 625 00:34:04,340 --> 00:34:09,620 I'd say eight out of ten of these times it has kind of worked out. So it's been really nice and then 626 00:34:09,620 --> 00:34:14,660 every time I play somewhere, if it goes well, then I can get a nice quote from the organizer that, 627 00:34:14,660 --> 00:34:19,380 hey, there are a lot of played here and everybody liked it was cool. And then I can just make 628 00:34:19,380 --> 00:34:24,260 when I make my next email to the next event, I can just like list those quotes there. You know, 629 00:34:24,260 --> 00:34:32,820 marketing, maybe, very, very, very, very low key to do it yourself style, but I love it, man. I love it. 630 00:34:32,820 --> 00:34:40,100 It's such a great, in my day job, I'm a CEO of a, you know, not not not not so small company. So 631 00:34:40,100 --> 00:34:45,700 so to do this like very, very kind of just myself and like trying to learn things as I go along, 632 00:34:45,700 --> 00:34:48,820 it's it's a really nice like, you know, it's a nice hobby to have. 633 00:34:48,820 --> 00:34:54,660 That's a nice balance. That's that's a really cool story, man. That's really cool. So all right, so let's 634 00:34:55,300 --> 00:35:03,220 so a couple of weeks ago, you were over at Bitcoin Atlantis and the Atlas Music Festival and I'm 635 00:35:03,220 --> 00:35:10,340 sure you ran into Joe Martin. So tell us, tell us about that whole event, what you learned and playing 636 00:35:10,340 --> 00:35:15,380 music there and all that fun stuff, man. I'm jealous. That's a beautiful part of the world. I was 637 00:35:15,380 --> 00:35:23,940 bummed I didn't get to go. Yeah, it was a totally outstanding experience. First of all, the 638 00:35:23,940 --> 00:35:29,140 the Bitcoin Atlantis people were so nice. Like they were they were so friendly and so nice and 639 00:35:29,140 --> 00:35:34,580 organized everything like perfectly. So so big kudos for them. But yeah, I mean, the island is 640 00:35:34,580 --> 00:35:40,260 beautiful. I had no idea how beautiful the island actually is. It has like similar features like 641 00:35:40,260 --> 00:35:44,340 that I've seen in Iceland or something, but then it has like this complete tropical paradise 642 00:35:44,340 --> 00:35:48,500 stuff that I've seen maybe in Puget or something. So it's completely amazing. And then the the main 643 00:35:48,500 --> 00:35:53,620 city Funchal is built on this hill. So it kind of when I went there to maybe have a couple of 644 00:35:53,620 --> 00:35:58,900 beers in the sunlight, it reminded me a little bit about like San Francisco or something like that. 645 00:35:58,900 --> 00:36:06,020 So it's amazing combination of really really cool things. And yeah, so the event itself, the conference, 646 00:36:06,020 --> 00:36:10,660 I don't know how they pulled it off. They had like all the biggest names you can ever think of like 647 00:36:10,660 --> 00:36:16,180 from the Bitcoin space, all the all the greatest thinkers and also giving like very original 648 00:36:16,180 --> 00:36:20,500 presentations. So it was not just like here in the same things that these people say in the 649 00:36:20,500 --> 00:36:25,940 in the podcast like every week, but adding something new thing. So the program was perfect. And the 650 00:36:25,940 --> 00:36:32,820 festival itself, it happened on the Saturday. So on the second day of the conference, 651 00:36:32,820 --> 00:36:38,580 it was in this absolutely gorgeous park. You know, normally when you go to music festivals, either 652 00:36:38,580 --> 00:36:45,460 some kind of a field somewhere or a parking lot or something like that, this was beautiful like a garden 653 00:36:45,460 --> 00:36:52,260 like totally amazing place. I mean, like how did they get permission to organize a rock festival 654 00:36:52,260 --> 00:36:58,180 there? I have no idea. Anyway, it's amazing. And then I was the first one to play. I played quite early. 655 00:36:58,180 --> 00:37:03,300 So so a lot of people were probably still having dinner or something. So turn out wasn't like 656 00:37:03,300 --> 00:37:08,580 it was not full capacity when I played. I don't care. I was still at a lot of fun. The organization 657 00:37:08,580 --> 00:37:13,060 was great. The stage sound was great. Everything was perfect. I had so much fun and I'm so grateful I 658 00:37:13,060 --> 00:37:21,140 could do it. And then there were Joe Martin. I played with him in Bristol in the UK last July. So I 659 00:37:21,140 --> 00:37:26,420 already kind of knew him. And he was so wonderful to see him playing with the real band. So in the 660 00:37:26,420 --> 00:37:31,940 Bristol, we both played a fully acoustic, just man and guitar. And I did man and guitar also in 661 00:37:31,940 --> 00:37:39,060 Madera, but he had his full band there and it was gorgeous. Like so good. Perfect sounds, perfect 662 00:37:39,060 --> 00:37:45,380 arrangements, perfect play. Everything was just sounded massive and awesome. Totally, totally great. 663 00:37:45,380 --> 00:37:53,300 And then they had a local band called Napa, which was a really cool in the in the rock band, but 664 00:37:53,300 --> 00:38:00,580 super talented musicians, you know, beat progressive in a way. And really, really sounded really great. 665 00:38:00,580 --> 00:38:05,380 Didn't understand the lyrics, but I'm sure that they were great lyrics. 666 00:38:06,900 --> 00:38:13,540 Portuguese. Portuguese. Yeah. Yeah. Come on. You know, you got finished. You got English. I'm sure you've 667 00:38:13,540 --> 00:38:19,300 got a bit of, you know, Arabic in you know, like you just can't, you know, a little bit, you know, 668 00:38:19,300 --> 00:38:25,620 I mean, it's not like you got a lot of, you know, yeah, come on. You got time on your hands. Do you 669 00:38:25,620 --> 00:38:32,740 learn Portuguese? You know, learn port. I mean, you can play in Brazil, you know. It's on my list, 670 00:38:32,740 --> 00:38:39,540 on my list, 100%. And then there was this completely totally amazing new kind of a 671 00:38:39,540 --> 00:38:48,100 new thing for me, this guy, Tiel Katzman, who is currently from a band called Wolfpeck, 672 00:38:48,100 --> 00:38:54,980 like this modern funk band. Yeah. And I, I, I, I mean, I had kind of completely missed 673 00:38:54,980 --> 00:39:01,460 that wolfpeck thing. So again, good thing for me, because I had like, had the possibility to be 674 00:39:01,460 --> 00:39:07,300 very, very positively surprised. But anyway, he had his solo stuff there and I'm totally 675 00:39:07,300 --> 00:39:12,340 amazing musicians. It's like such talented musicians and really great songs. His new album, 676 00:39:12,340 --> 00:39:17,860 Be the Wheel, I believe, is in the nonstop after the show. Great, great stuff. So, 677 00:39:17,860 --> 00:39:25,380 yeah, I mean, for me, it was a highlight, you know, to, let's say, the current, all time high of, 678 00:39:25,380 --> 00:39:32,420 of the high a low was the, was the Madera show. So obviously I've had so much fun at the 679 00:39:32,420 --> 00:39:39,300 Balticundi Batcher and Bitcoin Amsterdam and Bitcoin Thailand, Hordovian, Mass Adaptual Freedom 680 00:39:39,300 --> 00:39:46,260 Festival. All these places have been amazing, equal amazing, but the kind of being on a big stage 681 00:39:46,260 --> 00:39:50,420 with, you know, small machines and like good lighting and all that kind of stuff, it's just, you know, 682 00:39:51,060 --> 00:39:57,700 it's special. That's great for the experience. You know, that's, that's really cool that you have, 683 00:39:57,700 --> 00:40:05,380 you know, for lack of a better term, like really stuck around, hung in there. And when a lot of 684 00:40:05,380 --> 00:40:11,300 guys would, would never get these types of experiences in their musical career, here you are in your 685 00:40:11,300 --> 00:40:17,300 forties and you're getting it, you know, and you're able to combine your day job and your passion 686 00:40:18,420 --> 00:40:24,500 in, in, in such a great fashion. That's cool, man. Yeah, like being up on stage with good sound, 687 00:40:24,500 --> 00:40:32,500 good lights, fog, that's pretty, that's amazing. Yeah, I'm super happy. And also like very nice 688 00:40:32,500 --> 00:40:39,700 that I found this special way to kind of be part of the Bitcoin community, not just like, you know, 689 00:40:39,700 --> 00:40:44,580 listening to podcasts and enjoying stuff that other people do, which I do all the time, but to give, 690 00:40:44,580 --> 00:40:49,300 you know, a little bit back, you know, maybe some, somebody, some clip gets a smile on their face when 691 00:40:49,300 --> 00:40:54,660 they hear my song and then I feel like I've done my job. So it feels, it feels really great. 692 00:40:54,660 --> 00:41:01,140 You walk around the conference, you get your higher low shirt on. Yeah, you're just, you know, 693 00:41:01,140 --> 00:41:06,740 you're just minding, you're just minding your own business and somebody goes, dude, true seekers. 694 00:41:06,740 --> 00:41:13,700 That's huge. I haven't happened yet, but maybe one day, again, I just do it for the fun of it and, 695 00:41:14,180 --> 00:41:19,700 and you know, get the opportunities to meet great people like yourself. So it's the blessing. 696 00:41:19,700 --> 00:41:27,700 Well, you know, when you think about what Bitcoin is and what Bitcoin can do and you've, 697 00:41:27,700 --> 00:41:35,060 like, yeah, you've probably been the more trade shows and conventions than most Bitcoin holders 698 00:41:35,060 --> 00:41:40,340 than most Maxis, like what, you know, I mean, you've been in this for a long time. As you said, 699 00:41:41,860 --> 00:41:47,220 you kind of got orange pilled a couple years in when it first started with those guys, those, 700 00:41:47,220 --> 00:41:58,660 that dev team. What surprises you the most about Bitcoin? What is it like the, and maybe it's 701 00:41:58,660 --> 00:42:06,740 something that you learned in Portugal a couple weeks ago, but like as it, as it merges with art and, 702 00:42:06,740 --> 00:42:13,620 and it's starting to cast its web around the world and bring people together, like what, what, 703 00:42:13,620 --> 00:42:19,380 what's the, you know, you're 10 years into this, probably, like, what surprises you the most about it? 704 00:42:19,380 --> 00:42:28,260 I think something that I didn't see up until last couple of years when I really, really 705 00:42:28,260 --> 00:42:34,180 gone to these events and especially now when I do my creative stuff on the site as well is that 706 00:42:36,180 --> 00:42:41,380 I really viewed Bitcoin first as like a totally speculative thing that maybe if I invest in the right 707 00:42:41,380 --> 00:42:46,660 time and sell it at the right time, I might like make some, make some euros or something like that. 708 00:42:46,660 --> 00:42:52,420 But then I would into that, hey, this can actually solve a huge problem for the world, 709 00:42:52,420 --> 00:42:59,780 which is the broken money, especially in Alden has put, put, put very well. But what I didn't realize 710 00:42:59,780 --> 00:43:05,220 that, you know, once people do that kind of personal proof of work and, and really kind of a 711 00:43:05,220 --> 00:43:12,340 reevaluate everything that they've learned through the lens of Bitcoin, people get a little bit 712 00:43:12,340 --> 00:43:17,380 kind of transformed in a way. They get transformed in a way that they are starting to think 713 00:43:17,380 --> 00:43:24,340 on things like longer perspective, they're starting to doubt, you know, things that like, you know, 714 00:43:24,340 --> 00:43:30,660 the mainstream media is, or like the commercial media is kind of putting out there as the kind of a, 715 00:43:30,660 --> 00:43:38,100 this is the truth and nothing else, they start, you know, becoming more, you know, family oriented, 716 00:43:38,100 --> 00:43:43,460 more like, hey, let's do something that is actually good for the, you know, future generations, 717 00:43:43,460 --> 00:43:48,820 not like just for the next hour, which has typically been like the American European lifestyle for 718 00:43:48,820 --> 00:43:54,900 a long time. Yeah. So, so, so, so the kind of change, change of like people's attitudes and how 719 00:43:54,900 --> 00:44:00,260 then when we, these people come together, these events, people come from all different cultures, 720 00:44:00,260 --> 00:44:04,420 different parts of the world, different backgrounds, some was, some, some is a doctor, some is a 721 00:44:04,420 --> 00:44:12,660 fireman, some is a punk rocker, some is a, uh, uh, economist, some is a, uh, I don't know, you know, 722 00:44:12,660 --> 00:44:18,180 but then once everybody has gone through this kind of a personal transformation of becoming more like 723 00:44:18,180 --> 00:44:24,180 a long-term thinker and, and seeing the world, trying to find the truth, hence the song truth, 724 00:44:24,180 --> 00:44:30,580 speakers, trying to, you know, see the truth from behind the, you know, smoke screen, then even if we 725 00:44:30,580 --> 00:44:37,380 are like so different, we get along so well. So, normally we don't talk about, you know, Bitcoin 726 00:44:37,380 --> 00:44:43,460 too much and, and, and definitely not about the price. We just talk about like life and stuff and, 727 00:44:43,460 --> 00:44:48,980 and, and, and for some reason, it kind of feels like we know these people before we actually met. 728 00:44:48,980 --> 00:44:53,060 And it's, it's a really great, that I didn't understand when I started kind of 729 00:44:53,060 --> 00:44:56,660 diving into Bitcoin, that it can actually be also like a social revolution. 730 00:44:56,660 --> 00:45:05,860 Yeah. Yeah, those are some really marvelous points, like how it just, how it, like once you dive in 731 00:45:05,860 --> 00:45:11,860 and do the proof of work, how it changes your thought process and starts to move everything 732 00:45:11,860 --> 00:45:22,180 towards a low time preference, you know? Exactly. Yeah. So, all right, so let's say you and I are 733 00:45:23,140 --> 00:45:29,300 let's say you and I are having some beers down by the Skywheel in Helsinki. And, 734 00:45:29,300 --> 00:45:38,820 we see a band and we're like, oh, we got to get these dudes to get their music into value for value. 735 00:45:38,820 --> 00:45:45,940 Like how, how, how would you explain it? How would you explain what value for value can do 736 00:45:45,940 --> 00:45:55,300 for musicians to some band we just saw down by the Skywheel in Helsinki? That's a great question. I would 737 00:45:55,300 --> 00:46:04,100 really, I'm really, really kind of a writing on the great advice that, that, that my friend, 738 00:46:04,100 --> 00:46:10,500 Joe Martin, gave during their panel that they had in, in Madera, he had a really good point, 739 00:46:10,500 --> 00:46:19,460 which I fully agree with is that the way to market value for value or no-coyneur musicians is to say 740 00:46:19,460 --> 00:46:26,260 that it's, it's an additive. It adds on what you're already doing. It's not like, it's not gonna, 741 00:46:26,260 --> 00:46:31,860 not gonna solve the thing that, you know, you get like 10,000 listens in Spotify and then you get 742 00:46:31,860 --> 00:46:39,620 like a cent of money for it. It's not gonna solve that problem now. But what it can do is that when 743 00:46:39,620 --> 00:46:45,300 you put your music to wave like, you might get, you know, new, new people from the Bitcoin community 744 00:46:45,300 --> 00:46:51,300 that, that like your song and they immediately start sending money, tipping you in Bitcoin. So now you 745 00:46:51,300 --> 00:46:57,940 get this new revenue stream that comes straight from the fan, straight to you, no middleman. And it's 746 00:46:57,940 --> 00:47:04,900 very punk rock. It's very like, you know, that should be like the ethos of, of any kind of in the artist 747 00:47:04,900 --> 00:47:12,340 that, you know, go straight to the fan, right? And no middleman. So I would definitely say that 748 00:47:12,340 --> 00:47:19,220 looking to these tools like wave like, found in others, see if they can, if you can with the minimum 749 00:47:19,220 --> 00:47:24,660 effort, like, you know, put your profile up there, put your music there and then kind of promote it 750 00:47:24,660 --> 00:47:30,260 a little bit to your fans and see how it feels like. You know, you're not, you're not gonna lose anything. 751 00:47:30,260 --> 00:47:36,100 Like, yeah, the option was that you were not there. Now you're there and you might get some stats. 752 00:47:36,100 --> 00:47:41,060 And you know, people, when they like something, they could send you like 10,000 sacks or 50,000 sats. 753 00:47:41,060 --> 00:47:44,260 That's actually, it's real money. And then you would have to get like, uh, 754 00:47:44,260 --> 00:47:49,860 100,000 or million listens is Spotify to get the same money. So like, even if you, 755 00:47:49,860 --> 00:47:55,700 the actual numbers are small, but, you know, the quality of those kind of listens, 756 00:47:55,700 --> 00:48:00,180 a quality of the, the, the audience is so much higher because like one happy, 757 00:48:00,180 --> 00:48:06,500 blood can give you more money than Spotify can give you a bowl like two million listens. So that's 758 00:48:06,500 --> 00:48:12,260 something that I would tell to these people. Yeah, I tell people something similar, but I really 759 00:48:12,260 --> 00:48:21,300 love the use of the word additive. You know, as if it's like another ingredient in your food type of 760 00:48:21,300 --> 00:48:27,460 thing. I mean, because I tell, I tell musicians all the time. And as a matter of fact, like, 761 00:48:27,460 --> 00:48:34,420 right before you, you and I got on this call, I was talking to salty crayon and in telegram. 762 00:48:34,420 --> 00:48:41,380 A salty's got updates, right? And he's down in Texas. And, um, and I, and I, I was saying, you know, 763 00:48:41,380 --> 00:48:47,060 everybody's got to, you know, just keep doing everything that you're doing. But just, and I tell people, 764 00:48:47,620 --> 00:48:53,700 add this into your business mix, add this into your, your business plan, your revenue stream, because I, 765 00:48:53,700 --> 00:49:02,420 I kind of look at, at, um, independent musicians like bands like Fumble or Joe Martin, Sarah Jade, 766 00:49:02,420 --> 00:49:10,900 you guys are all small business owners. So you got to do whatever you can't to increase your revenue 767 00:49:10,900 --> 00:49:18,900 stream. Um, but the, the use of the word additive, I think is really smart. I'm going to steal that from 768 00:49:18,900 --> 00:49:26,020 Joe. Thanks, Joe. I'm going to steal that from you, buddy. Yeah. That's, that's great. Let me ask you, 769 00:49:26,020 --> 00:49:34,820 you know, there's a, I'm, there's a, uh, an anti-spotify backlash, um, or an anti-spotify 770 00:49:36,580 --> 00:49:43,300 sentiment, um, with artists here in the States, with respect to, you know, point zero, zero, three 771 00:49:43,300 --> 00:49:53,540 cents per stream. Um, is that, um, and now I know that in Scandinavia, the payouts are higher. 772 00:49:53,540 --> 00:50:03,860 Um, is, is there a, um, an anti-spotify sentiment with, uh, musicians in Finland and, and in Europe as 773 00:50:03,860 --> 00:50:10,100 well, or is it not as prevalent as it is here in the States? I'd say that, uh, again, I've been 774 00:50:10,100 --> 00:50:15,540 now living outside of Finland for some time, but, uh, I remember at, at least maybe five, six 775 00:50:15,540 --> 00:50:19,940 years ago, years ago, there was a big backlash. I remember there was a Facebook group of Finnish 776 00:50:19,940 --> 00:50:26,740 musicians that were very upset about the Spotify payouts and, and these kind of things. But I have to 777 00:50:26,740 --> 00:50:32,500 say, again, I'm not defending Spotify in any way, but I used to have a music tech business, uh, 778 00:50:32,500 --> 00:50:36,980 back in the day. That was the reason why I was living in the US and, and one of our, like, biggest 779 00:50:36,980 --> 00:50:42,100 distribution channels for our app was the Spotify app store. So we were quite familiar with the Spotify 780 00:50:42,100 --> 00:50:49,060 business model and stuff. They actually pay so much for the labels. They pay like 70% or something 781 00:50:49,060 --> 00:50:54,740 like that of their revenue to the labels. So in a way, you could say that maybe the artists go to the 782 00:50:54,740 --> 00:51:00,420 labels and get better data from the labels. Yeah. That's like, there's very little that Spotify can do 783 00:51:00,420 --> 00:51:06,980 when they, they already paid 70% to the labels. Do you think I'm not defending them in any way, but 784 00:51:06,980 --> 00:51:13,700 fair, but fair. I mean, could you could remember? Yeah. I mean, let's be honest, it's really easy to, 785 00:51:13,700 --> 00:51:19,620 to, to, to, to, to shit on the big kid on the, on the block, right? I mean, it's real easy for us to 786 00:51:19,620 --> 00:51:25,540 shake our fists at them when we don't really know the full breakdown of everything that goes on 787 00:51:25,540 --> 00:51:31,300 behind the scenes. And I've heard just last week I had a meeting with a guy here in Nashville who is, 788 00:51:31,300 --> 00:51:36,020 you know, deep in the industry. Let's just put it that way. And he's like, you know, I don't, he said 789 00:51:36,020 --> 00:51:43,300 to me and I hadn't heard anybody else say this before. He's like, you know, 70%, 76% of their revenue, 790 00:51:43,300 --> 00:51:48,740 they have to pay out to other people to other companies. He said, I personally, I wouldn't be surprised 791 00:51:48,740 --> 00:51:54,740 and I see you nodding your head in agreement. I, I, he said, I wouldn't be surprised if they are out 792 00:51:54,740 --> 00:52:00,900 of business in three years. And I'm like, holy shit. I don't even think about that. I don't even think. 793 00:52:00,900 --> 00:52:07,220 Yeah. I, I, I mean, I mean, I don't know. I haven't looked into their finances lately, but there was 794 00:52:07,220 --> 00:52:12,260 a time, at least, when they do a heavy, heavy crowd, he was pretty much like having a business model of 795 00:52:12,260 --> 00:52:19,140 going to the store and buying beers for like one, one dollar each and then outside having a stand 796 00:52:19,140 --> 00:52:24,980 and selling them for like eight, eight cents each to get users. So yeah, you can get users, but you're 797 00:52:24,980 --> 00:52:30,580 making a loss every time you get the user. But at least they were able to, you know, go to the stock 798 00:52:30,580 --> 00:52:36,740 market and all these, these things at the right time. Yeah. So I guess, I guess the investors at least 799 00:52:36,740 --> 00:52:42,820 are happy, happy with the results. You know what's interesting is that I've, now I've, I've been in 800 00:52:42,820 --> 00:52:47,860 sales over here in the States in several different industries, obviously in entertainment. 801 00:52:48,820 --> 00:52:56,500 But also as a general contractor, also in wholesale produce, you know, like selling 802 00:52:56,500 --> 00:53:04,660 ballots of, you know, romaine lettuce and bananas to, you know, pop to the grocery stores. I did that 803 00:53:04,660 --> 00:53:13,380 for five years. I also sold engineered products. And my current day job here in the States is I'm in 804 00:53:13,380 --> 00:53:21,300 finance. I do mortgages and it, it, it, when you talk about goods and services, like in my experience, 805 00:53:21,300 --> 00:53:29,700 like the bottom margin that I have seen in so many different industries, hovers right around like 806 00:53:29,700 --> 00:53:38,260 30, 31, 32%. You know, and I, it's been fascinating for me having worked in so many industries to see 807 00:53:38,260 --> 00:53:42,660 that margin kind of like, you know, when it was in construction, there were times when my margin was 808 00:53:42,660 --> 00:53:49,380 higher, but in produce, my margin was around 32% in engineered services. My margin was 30 to 35. And 809 00:53:49,380 --> 00:53:55,140 I'm like, wow, that's, you know, it's two different industries, but the margin's the same. I see that 810 00:53:55,140 --> 00:54:01,220 number in so many different industries around the economy that when I hear somebody say, hey, 811 00:54:01,220 --> 00:54:07,140 Spotify is paying out 76%. I don't think they're going to be around in three years. My, my, my mind 812 00:54:07,140 --> 00:54:15,140 immediately goes to, to that 32% margin. And I'm like, yeah, that makes sense, right? Like, you'll 813 00:54:15,140 --> 00:54:20,340 be interesting to see what happens. Be interesting to see what happens. It will be, it will be, they do have 814 00:54:20,340 --> 00:54:27,140 though a big brand and, you know, yeah. So I think that person, I think that they have a future, but we'll 815 00:54:27,140 --> 00:54:33,780 see somebody will buy them and buy up all the debt and whatever. Yeah. We'll see, we'll see. But again, 816 00:54:33,780 --> 00:54:42,020 like I'm more, Spotify is kind of like, you know, way like, you know, part of our world already. So not 817 00:54:42,020 --> 00:54:47,460 so interesting anymore. Wave Lake, these kind of services, that's where the future is. I'm so excited 818 00:54:47,460 --> 00:54:53,700 about them. Like some of the guys are doing amazing job there. I mean, it's very early, but all it takes 819 00:54:53,700 --> 00:54:59,540 is to have some big artists to start like maybe putting not all of their stuff there, but like one 820 00:54:59,540 --> 00:55:06,180 or so, like that to kind of throw the eyes of the world there. I think there's a lot of potential there. 821 00:55:06,180 --> 00:55:11,700 That's why I'm really happy. Every time I release something, I put it first in the way. Like, yeah, I think 822 00:55:11,700 --> 00:55:18,740 somebody, I've said it publicly many, many times. I think somebody is going to break from this space 823 00:55:18,740 --> 00:55:23,780 within the next year or two. I am, and most people that I talk to that are in value for value, they're 824 00:55:23,780 --> 00:55:28,180 like, I'm thinking three to five years. I'm like, I don't know. I think it'll be quicker than that. You 825 00:55:28,180 --> 00:55:33,940 know, everything is moving faster now than it did when we were kids. You know, when we were coming 826 00:55:33,940 --> 00:55:41,940 out of the industry, you know, my wife and I actually met at a.com in Santa Monica in 1999. 827 00:55:41,940 --> 00:55:52,900 And if you think about how technology was moving then and how much quicker it's moving now, 828 00:55:54,020 --> 00:55:59,940 I think it'll happen sooner than later. That's my personal feeling. Well, 829 00:55:59,940 --> 00:56:06,180 that's my hope. Yeah. Now tell us about what you got coming up or are you going to 830 00:56:06,180 --> 00:56:14,100 you have a gig in El Salvador coming up? Yep. So they had the howling party. I always did it 831 00:56:14,100 --> 00:56:21,780 and excuse to go to the Bitcoin country and I got it. And obviously, at least who was one of 832 00:56:21,780 --> 00:56:28,180 the organizers of well, the organizer of how do we in Charlotte played a big role in giving me 833 00:56:28,180 --> 00:56:33,380 the getting me the opportunity to play there. So I am so stoked to go there in a few weeks. 834 00:56:33,380 --> 00:56:37,380 See the see the place where Bitcoin adoption is like, let's say, further, 835 00:56:37,380 --> 00:56:43,140 the long nations state level, but also to be able to take part in this amazing event and play 836 00:56:43,140 --> 00:56:48,500 with, with create artists like Roger 9000 and other other favorite people from the Bitcoin scene. 837 00:56:48,500 --> 00:56:52,740 So I'm going to be super amazing. That'll be cool. And I see you have 838 00:56:52,740 --> 00:56:58,260 and you're and you keep posting stuff up on YouTube. You got a YouTube channel. 839 00:56:58,260 --> 00:57:02,260 Yeah. What's the latest one you put up there? 840 00:57:02,260 --> 00:57:08,100 The latest one is the song, welcome to the dawn. All right. Right. Right. Yeah. 841 00:57:08,100 --> 00:57:15,700 You did more like an unrare song maybe if it's a, but yeah, that was the first time I write green screen. 842 00:57:15,700 --> 00:57:22,180 And you know, every time I make a video, I try to learn some new trick and maybe maybe in 10 843 00:57:22,180 --> 00:57:29,460 years, they start like looking good. Oh, I think it's great, man. I have a lot of, I really love your story. 844 00:57:29,460 --> 00:57:38,900 Just the whole, the whole intersection of punk bands as a kid, technology, sociology, world travel, 845 00:57:38,900 --> 00:57:44,660 Bitcoin, like, man, you're doing it. You're, you're, you're really living the life and you are a great 846 00:57:44,660 --> 00:57:51,460 ambassador for this, for this movement and it's, it's a pleasure talking to you. Let me, 847 00:57:51,460 --> 00:57:58,740 but before we, we wrap it up with the song, let me ask you two fun questions. 848 00:57:58,740 --> 00:58:08,500 Number one, top five albums of all time. And, and, and remember, remember, your answers are probably 849 00:58:08,500 --> 00:58:12,020 wrong, but that's, that's okay. 850 00:58:13,700 --> 00:58:22,900 Okay, so, okay, albums that have really influenced me. Okay, well, I'll just listen, listen, so 851 00:58:22,900 --> 00:58:34,340 born to run by Bruce Springsteen. Amazing. The Black love from African weeks. That's amazing. Yeah. 852 00:58:34,340 --> 00:58:41,380 Then all of the chore-breaker albums, maybe Biobak, something like that, super amazing. 853 00:58:42,500 --> 00:58:51,860 Samaya, I'm sore. And then some of the first albums of Frank Turner, maybe those ones, 854 00:58:51,860 --> 00:58:57,140 I'll, I'll put those, those are the albums that have like kind of, wouldn't be like when I've been 855 00:58:57,140 --> 00:59:02,740 certain direction, then after taking heavy dose of those, those albums, like, I've kind of changed 856 00:59:02,740 --> 00:59:10,900 direction somewhat and it's, it's been really amazing. Wow, that's a cool, that's a cool mix. And I always 857 00:59:10,900 --> 00:59:18,180 love it when, you know, when somebody from, quote unquote, the other side of the world starts, you know, 858 00:59:18,180 --> 00:59:23,460 I'm always curious, like, how the hell did Afghan Wigs make it into Finland, right? Like that type of thing, 859 00:59:23,460 --> 00:59:29,700 right? Like, that's, that's, that's so cool. That's one of the beautiful things about music and art, 860 00:59:29,700 --> 00:59:36,420 right? Yeah, yeah. So I have to get out just a little quick story. So we had a pattern practice, 91, 861 00:59:37,140 --> 00:59:44,580 and then our bass player at the time was part of the sub-pok, like, singles of the club, some, 862 00:59:44,580 --> 00:59:50,020 singles of the month club or something like that. So he got like records sent from, from Seattle to, 863 00:59:50,020 --> 00:59:55,860 to him every month. And so one band practice, he said, "Rami, you have to listen to this. This, 864 00:59:55,860 --> 01:00:00,740 there's only two copies in Finland. This is one of them. Go home and listen to this. I'll go, 865 01:00:00,740 --> 01:00:05,300 go home, take the album, put it on my vinyl player 866 01:00:05,300 --> 01:00:07,980 and put my headphones on and put it on 867 01:00:07,980 --> 01:00:10,980 and then like, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, 868 01:00:10,980 --> 01:00:13,740 the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, it was like, the, never mind. 869 01:00:13,740 --> 01:00:17,860 Yeah, and I was like maybe, one or two months before the, 870 01:00:17,860 --> 01:00:19,940 the video, like, cable to MTV, 871 01:00:19,940 --> 01:00:24,140 and like, exploded the whole thing, but he was laughing. 872 01:00:24,140 --> 01:00:25,820 And when I listened to the whole album, I was like, 873 01:00:25,820 --> 01:00:28,140 this is something new now, something new, 874 01:00:28,140 --> 01:00:31,300 which is going to happen with this album. And yeah, I was kind of, 875 01:00:31,300 --> 01:00:32,660 kind of right. 876 01:00:32,660 --> 01:00:35,340 I even had tickets, tickets to see Nirvana, 877 01:00:35,340 --> 01:00:39,380 that, that same fall in, in a, in a squad, hot, literally like, 878 01:00:39,380 --> 01:00:42,740 an old squad house that was in Helsinki, 879 01:00:42,740 --> 01:00:46,660 they had like, punk shows, so they were scheduled to play there. 880 01:00:46,660 --> 01:00:49,820 Obviously, they canceled, 'cause they moved into Arriness and stuff like that, 881 01:00:49,820 --> 01:00:53,180 but I, I, I, I, I, I, I may still have the tickets somewhere, like, 882 01:00:53,180 --> 01:00:55,380 seeing Nirvana, a full of two, 883 01:00:55,380 --> 01:01:11,700 Yeah Yeah, that is cool, but I did see them on the summer of 92 in a festival. 884 01:01:11,700 --> 01:01:12,700 Then how was it? 885 01:01:12,700 --> 01:01:13,700 That's my next question. 886 01:01:13,700 --> 01:01:14,700 Top five concerts. 887 01:01:14,700 --> 01:01:15,700 Go. 888 01:01:15,700 --> 01:01:16,700 OK. 889 01:01:16,700 --> 01:01:23,500 Well, Ray took us to machine 1994 in roastедa, that was totally amazing. 890 01:01:23,500 --> 01:01:26,860 Well, obviously, seeing Nirvana was great. 891 01:01:26,860 --> 01:01:28,420 The show was kind of chaotic. 892 01:01:28,420 --> 01:01:33,060 I also played a part because I was in the most fit and maybe not focusing on the musical output 893 01:01:33,060 --> 01:01:37,820 so much, but it was like, you know, well, worth it. 894 01:01:37,820 --> 01:01:45,060 I have to say one show that was really impactful for me, because there was this huge break 895 01:01:45,060 --> 01:01:47,300 when COVID was happening, not to see anything. 896 01:01:47,300 --> 01:01:55,740 So I was in Austin last year and I was just two days there and I was looking at my, like, 897 01:01:55,740 --> 01:01:56,740 what's going on? 898 01:01:56,740 --> 01:02:03,540 And then this American, like, kind of a rock slash emo band called "Christ" had a show 899 01:02:03,540 --> 01:02:04,540 there. 900 01:02:04,540 --> 01:02:08,300 And they were one of my, like, all-time favorite bands from back in the day. 901 01:02:08,300 --> 01:02:13,340 So I went to see them and to see, like, a really, really talented rock band, like a pool 902 01:02:13,340 --> 01:02:18,220 on show after the craziness of three years, not seeing anything like big during the COVID 903 01:02:18,220 --> 01:02:20,660 times, it was just mind blowing. 904 01:02:20,660 --> 01:02:25,100 So definitely cause it very high on my list, but partially because it was such a big, like, 905 01:02:25,100 --> 01:02:30,100 emotional, like, breakthrough after the COVID fog. 906 01:02:30,100 --> 01:02:37,380 But then other ones, I've seen, obviously, Bruce Springsteen, played in Finland, amazing 907 01:02:37,380 --> 01:02:42,500 show, like, over three hours and played all the hits with the history band, totally great 908 01:02:42,500 --> 01:02:43,500 stuff. 909 01:02:43,500 --> 01:02:45,340 And then maybe one more. 910 01:02:45,340 --> 01:02:53,900 Well, I have to say, okay, this is great one. 911 01:02:53,900 --> 01:03:00,580 1992, the lemon heads in the same squad house where Nerva and I was supposed to be playing 912 01:03:00,580 --> 01:03:04,380 and they were promoting the album with the same about Ray. 913 01:03:04,380 --> 01:03:05,380 Complete. 914 01:03:05,380 --> 01:03:11,020 It's the first time in my life when I go see a show, I haven't heard the album yet. 915 01:03:11,020 --> 01:03:13,940 And after the one show, I remember every song. 916 01:03:13,940 --> 01:03:18,580 I could basically, when I heard the album afterwards, I could sing along with every, every 917 01:03:18,580 --> 01:03:21,540 song in the album just after that one show. 918 01:03:21,540 --> 01:03:26,340 So that, that, that, yeah, definitely, that actually might be the best so I've ever seen. 919 01:03:26,340 --> 01:03:28,060 That is awesome. 920 01:03:28,060 --> 01:03:32,900 And I'm sitting here with my jaw open and I'm like, you know, maybe I had, maybe I had 921 01:03:32,900 --> 01:03:38,180 to include the video for these podcasts because I'm like, damn, you saw the lemon heads 922 01:03:38,180 --> 01:03:39,180 in 92. 923 01:03:39,180 --> 01:03:44,140 Man, you know, that just sounds so punk rock, right? 924 01:03:44,140 --> 01:03:46,300 It's like, you know, it's like you're 80 years old. 925 01:03:46,300 --> 01:03:48,020 You got a cigarette hanging out of your mouth. 926 01:03:48,020 --> 01:03:52,780 You're like, I saw the lemon heads in 92 and the flop house in Helsinki. 927 01:03:52,780 --> 01:03:55,900 And then, you know, that's awesome. 928 01:03:55,900 --> 01:03:56,900 Oh, I love those. 929 01:03:56,900 --> 01:03:59,260 I love those types of stories, man. 930 01:03:59,260 --> 01:04:01,260 That's so cool. 931 01:04:01,260 --> 01:04:05,900 I always love asking other musicians those types of questions because, you know, their 932 01:04:05,900 --> 01:04:07,460 light, their eyes might have. 933 01:04:07,460 --> 01:04:10,900 That's a great question because like, it's just put me down a huge memory lane. 934 01:04:10,900 --> 01:04:14,420 So, you can really see their eyes light up, right? 935 01:04:14,420 --> 01:04:18,140 When they start talking about like that, their favorite concepts and things like that. 936 01:04:18,140 --> 01:04:22,140 You know, I had a similar experience too coming out of COVID, like, you know, because we 937 01:04:22,140 --> 01:04:28,340 moved here to Nashville literally about six weeks before COVID hit, right? 938 01:04:28,340 --> 01:04:34,020 So we got here and we're excited and we start to get a feel for the town and then you're 939 01:04:34,020 --> 01:04:35,020 never think shuts down. 940 01:04:35,020 --> 01:04:37,020 It's like, crap, right? 941 01:04:37,020 --> 01:04:44,780 So, like, the first concert that we saw actually, we actually went to the opera house. 942 01:04:44,780 --> 01:04:47,820 My parents were coming in town to visit us after everything. 943 01:04:47,820 --> 01:04:50,740 It finally started to settle down. 944 01:04:50,740 --> 01:04:57,380 And we went to the opera, Grand Old Opera, just for their regular Friday night show, which 945 01:04:57,380 --> 01:05:02,700 is like a, you know, it's like a cablecade of stars type of thing. 946 01:05:02,700 --> 01:05:03,700 And it was just marvelous. 947 01:05:03,700 --> 01:05:06,580 Like, you know, I mean, I'm not a huge country fan. 948 01:05:06,580 --> 01:05:11,780 I'm not your music guy, but just to be able to see live music again and just to experience 949 01:05:11,780 --> 01:05:15,540 it again, like there, I mean, I'm not kidding, man, there was a lot of people who were crying. 950 01:05:15,540 --> 01:05:17,620 They were like, thank God it's back, right? 951 01:05:17,620 --> 01:05:19,860 Like, you know, thank God music was back. 952 01:05:19,860 --> 01:05:22,300 So, well, listen to the promise. 953 01:05:22,300 --> 01:05:25,060 I, yeah, listen, man, this has been a lot of fun. 954 01:05:25,060 --> 01:05:27,500 I really appreciate you coming on the show. 955 01:05:27,500 --> 01:05:30,900 We're going to, we're going to wrap up the show with your song, Greatest Teacher. 956 01:05:30,900 --> 01:05:32,500 Tell us a little bit about it. 957 01:05:32,500 --> 01:05:33,500 Oh, yeah. 958 01:05:33,500 --> 01:05:36,620 So, this song was, first of all, thank you for having me. 959 01:05:36,620 --> 01:05:40,580 It's been a great conversation and really, said to me down the memory lane and, you know, 960 01:05:40,580 --> 01:05:43,180 we'll be smiling for a couple of hours after this. 961 01:05:43,180 --> 01:05:44,180 Right on. 962 01:05:44,180 --> 01:05:50,020 So, yeah, so the, so the, the, the greatest teacher is kind of a song that I wrote in the depths 963 01:05:50,020 --> 01:05:51,020 of the bear market. 964 01:05:51,020 --> 01:05:56,620 That was probably the time when, when FDX was blowing up, all these kind of things, you 965 01:05:56,620 --> 01:06:02,460 know, 15,000-bit going and, yeah, I was just like, you know, I would learn to huddle, you 966 01:06:02,460 --> 01:06:07,420 know, I've been those, those times, you know, I remember the night when the COVID crash, then 967 01:06:07,420 --> 01:06:11,380 we went from 8,000 to like 4,000 in, in, in, in, in, in like a couple of hours. 968 01:06:11,380 --> 01:06:12,820 And it was the middle of the night in Finland. 969 01:06:12,820 --> 01:06:17,660 And I was just, you know, doing something like waking up and, and going to get a glass of water 970 01:06:17,660 --> 01:06:21,260 or something like that and just looking at my phone like, oh my goodness, like, we're really 971 01:06:21,260 --> 01:06:22,420 going down. 972 01:06:22,420 --> 01:06:26,940 And then I was like, well, I'm just going to go back to sleep, slept like a baby. 973 01:06:26,940 --> 01:06:30,420 And then in the morning, like, okay, we're up a little bit and started, let's just buy 974 01:06:30,420 --> 01:06:31,420 more. 975 01:06:31,420 --> 01:06:35,500 And I realized that I've really chosen to become like a long-term huddleer and not like panic 976 01:06:35,500 --> 01:06:37,220 selling when, when, when things are happening. 977 01:06:37,220 --> 01:06:42,780 So anyways, this song is about the feeling that, uh, that you get when you kind of, you experience 978 01:06:42,780 --> 01:06:48,740 this pain of seeing your like, let's say, fiat value of your portfolio, or down like 80% 979 01:06:48,740 --> 01:06:53,500 but you still just, you know, see that the world is actually, like, these are actually 980 01:06:53,500 --> 01:06:57,900 happening faster than you think that, you know, the, the prophecies that the Bitcoin 981 01:06:57,900 --> 01:07:03,500 theorists have made over the years are actually coming through much faster than, than we, we 982 01:07:03,500 --> 01:07:04,500 all realized. 983 01:07:04,500 --> 01:07:10,660 So all we need to do is just to kind of take the pain, smile, huddle, stay humble and just 984 01:07:10,660 --> 01:07:13,620 move forward and, and like, take the world with us. 985 01:07:13,620 --> 01:07:14,620 Staxum sats. 986 01:07:14,620 --> 01:07:15,620 Yeah, right on. 987 01:07:15,620 --> 01:07:25,300 Rami, otherwise known as the higher low, otherwise known as the finish Bitcoin global 988 01:07:25,300 --> 01:07:30,740 gig traveling dude, like man, you're like, where's Waldo, man? 989 01:07:30,740 --> 01:07:31,900 It's like, where the hell is he? 990 01:07:31,900 --> 01:07:32,900 Is he in Saudi Arabia? 991 01:07:32,900 --> 01:07:34,140 No, he's in El Salvador. 992 01:07:34,140 --> 01:07:35,140 No, he's in Thailand. 993 01:07:35,140 --> 01:07:40,540 No, it like, you'll probably be like the first Bitcoin musician to play a gig in like an 994 01:07:40,540 --> 01:07:43,580 article or some shit like that. 995 01:07:43,580 --> 01:07:47,180 At least I'm used to the call coming from Finland. 996 01:07:47,180 --> 01:07:48,180 That's true. 997 01:07:48,180 --> 01:07:49,180 That's true. 998 01:07:49,180 --> 01:07:50,180 You got it in your blood, buddy. 999 01:07:50,180 --> 01:07:51,180 You got it in your blood. 1000 01:07:51,180 --> 01:07:52,180 Well, cheers, man. 1001 01:07:52,180 --> 01:07:57,620 So stick around, we'll talk a little bit afterwards, but really appreciate you. 1002 01:07:57,620 --> 01:08:02,700 Yeah, really appreciate you coming on the show and here is greatest teacher on the Phantom 1003 01:08:02,700 --> 01:08:03,900 Power artist hour. 1004 01:08:03,900 --> 01:08:22,900 So down, focus on the task, hear yourselves, where I direct die, without theories come 1005 01:08:22,900 --> 01:08:26,900 down, dead out. 1006 01:08:26,900 --> 01:08:38,900 Well, come on out and soul on, world's falling big, now I'm the first one falling, but I'm the first one. 1007 01:08:38,900 --> 01:08:49,900 Because pain is the greatest teacher. 1008 01:08:49,900 --> 01:09:07,900 Love to kill, I have no, love to kill, I know. 1009 01:09:07,900 --> 01:09:24,900 Breathe out, appreciate the time, tank down, against runner and off-my, we're bound, 1010 01:09:24,900 --> 01:09:31,000 filled with scum, tank down 1011 01:09:31,000 --> 01:10:00,000 Welcome on, mad at summer, welcome in bed, numbers to fall in, mad at, went back to sleep, those pain as the greatest teacher, pain as the greatest teacher, pain as the greatest teacher, 1012 01:10:00,000 --> 01:10:23,000 [Music] 1013 01:10:23,000 --> 01:10:32,600 Oh, to see the lemon heads in 1992, let alone rage and Nirvana in 1992 in Europe. 1014 01:10:32,600 --> 01:10:39,600 Like where the vibe is different. Like I was fortunate enough to live in Europe and go to a couple of concerts and the concert vibe is different over there. 1015 01:10:39,600 --> 01:10:48,600 So, jealous! Hey, Rami, thanks dude. That was a lot of fun. And he of course is the higher low. 1016 01:10:48,600 --> 01:10:58,200 And you can check out all of his tracks over on Wayblake. You can also find him on Instagram and YouTube. 1017 01:10:58,200 --> 01:11:03,200 So that'll do it for today's Phantom Power Artist Hour. 1018 01:11:03,200 --> 01:11:12,600 Thank you guys so much for the boost in the sats. We typically review those on Friday when we do the Phantom Power Music review. 1019 01:11:12,600 --> 01:11:25,200 You can always find us on Telegram and on Noster of course. And if you guys know any musicians who are interested in getting into this space, please send them our way. 1020 01:11:25,200 --> 01:11:30,200 You can check out our website at phantompowermusic.io. 1021 01:11:30,200 --> 01:11:36,200 Of course the sats for today's show are being split with the higher low. 1022 01:11:36,200 --> 01:11:41,200 And we hope you guys were sending some sats his way. 1023 01:11:41,200 --> 01:11:47,000 If you find value in this podcast, thank you very much for contributing to it. 1024 01:11:47,000 --> 01:11:50,100 This has been a lot of fun and we're going to keep going. 1025 01:11:50,100 --> 01:11:53,600 So that'll do it. Enjoy your Sunday, St. Patrick's Day. 1026 01:11:53,600 --> 01:11:56,400 Go out and get some bangers and mash. 1027 01:11:56,400 --> 01:11:59,400 Couple Guinness. Have a couple Guinness for me, will you? 1028 01:11:59,400 --> 01:12:02,400 I had to quit a long time ago. 1029 01:12:02,400 --> 01:12:06,400 That's a different story. Alright, I'll shut up. See you guys! 1030 01:12:07,400 --> 01:12:15,400 [Music]