Welcome in to This Week in Bitcoin, episode 111.
My name is Chris, chrislas.com, jupiterbroadcasting.com.
Well, it seems I have to be the bearer of bad news this week.
Pack it up, everybody.
Bitcoin's historic, meteoric rise over the last decade.
Just a blip.
Just an anomaly.
The debasement trade was wrong all along.
The gold bugs, they've had it wrong all along.
The dollar is back and the dollar is king.
Woo!
Okay, what am I talking about?
Well, I guess everyone watched a different FOMC meeting with Kevin Warsh when he first came out and said hello to the world.
Because I saw a new Fed chair who wouldn't commit to anything and then kind of signed off with a nod that the Fed wouldn't be getting in the way of any growth.
Everyone else, they saw a fiscal hawk, somebody who's going to be tough with rates.
Someone who's going to hike them over the next year and someone who's going to save the value of the dollar.
Now, I don't know about any of that, but what all that comes from is these big old fancy, intelligent, rich investors.
They are looking at all of this and they've decided, well, the debasement trade is dead.
It's the hard assets are no longer needed.
And I'm not making this up.
This probably sounds like I'm making it up.
They're saying inflation is licked and they're the ones saying the king dollar is back.
The economy is so strong.
You don't need a hard asset.
Yeah, well, the markets are telling us that inflation is going to come way, way down. I mean,
not only are oil prices way down, Larry, but we also look at gold. I mean, gold has fallen sharply.
If you look at cryptos, they've fallen sharply. This is the era of king dollar. And I'm really
very serious. And the reason for all of this happening, I think, is we do have a good economy,
but we have a really, really great Fed chairman who's going to be in that position for a long,
long time and you're going to get stable prices. Just imagine, Larry, if you knew that the dollar
was going to be worth the exact same amount it is today, two years, five years, 10 years, 20 years
from now. That is laughable. I mean, even five years is ludicrous. 20 years? That's worth the
exact same amount it is today. Two years, five years, 10 years, 20 years from now. What do you
think would happen to the stock market, to interest rates, all of that. I think we're in a position now
for a really very strong anti-inflation environment with strong growth and great capital markets.
Have you heard Kevin Warsh on the dollar? Has he said much on the dollar?
Not since he got into office, but in the past, he's been very strong on the idea that he thinks
we should preserve dollar leadership in the world. And I think that's absolutely what he's going to
do. I do think we're going to get price stability. I think actually what we're going to see is a lot
of the inflation that we've had in the last two or three months get completely reversed and we're
going to see deflation, we may actually see the CPI go negative for a month or two because gas
prices are coming down so rapidly. All right. So there you have it. I mean, King dollar,
inflation is licked. We're going to have negative CPI. Now, what are they basing this on? Well,
Well, I mean, Kevin Warsh has been in the job for like, what, two weeks, three weeks.
M2 money supply is actually at an all time high, i.e. all of the Western governments are printing money aggressively.
The truth is the dollar has been getting stronger recently.
So I think that's making them feel a little bullish.
And Wall Street suspects it might stay that way for a while.
They're betting the dollar is going to keep dominating for a while.
And I guess I can understand why.
I mean, if they're turning on CNBC and they see your buddy, Treasury Secretary Scott Besant, and he's up there saying the Trump administration, we're going to take that deal we made with the Saudis back in the 70s and we're going to take that whole thing on world tour.
Dollar dominance is essential in everything President Trump is doing here.
If you look, the new Venezuela is going to is invoicing in dollars.
They're coming back on to the dollar system.
They've been sanctioned.
They were not allowed to translate or to transact in dollars.
And now the dollar is going to be the centerpiece of their trade.
They were selling discounted oil to China and not getting dollars.
We're seeing in the Iranian negotiations, the Iranians will be invoicing in dollars.
So everything we are doing is pushing the dollar back.
It's never left as the centerpiece for the global currency system, but we're reinforcing it.
I would anticipate when the Russia-Ukraine conflict ends that Russia will want to come back in the dollar system because, again, the dollar, it's our liquidity.
It's our capital markets.
It's the depth and breadth.
Everyone wants to be here.
And I think many times the great, great thing about the United States is we we course correct when we go too far one way or the other.
And I think we should not be shy about flexing where we have advantages and where we have advantages, share with our allies and push back on those who are not aligned with us.
Hoorah. Hoorah. Now, I guess I should give these guys some credit.
I mean, they're rich. They sit at a position of privilege where they can kind of see where things are going. But, I mean, it really comes down to they're looking at what Besant is saying. They're looking at recent dollar dominance and they're overanalyzing dots on a plot. So here's your buddy, Stephen Moran. He's now out of the Fed. And he kind of explains where this is coming from, why the market has decided that the Fed's going to hike rates three times, why they have decided that inflation is licked.
Iron Stephen, first of all, congratulations on the transition. So all the headlines that Worsed
as a hawk and, you know, it's in, you know, all of the experts said he was hawkish. And
I thought it was mostly, you know, maybe the economic projections, you know, the inflation
adjustments, and maybe that was hawkish, but I didn't think he was hawkish. In fact, on the
contrary, I thought he was setting himself up to maybe be more accommodative next year after they
remake the Fed. Sure. So first of all, thank you for having me back. It's great to see you again.
I think that Chairman Warsh went out of his way to say as little as possible. You know,
I think he went out of his way to say, I'm not going to give you any guidance. I'm not going to
tell you what I'm going to do. I'm not going to tell you what I'm thinking. I think at the end of
the day, what's going to happen is he's going to do what he thinks the data and critically the
forecast require for achieving the Fed's mandates. Now, I think maybe what happened is that in the
absence of the chairman giving his own view or the committee's view about what's going to happen in
the future, the market and a lot of the narratives ran with the dots. They ran with the projections
the Fed put down. I think it's important to understand, in my view, those dots were already
stale before the ink was dry in June. And the reason is that as someone who's written down
projections, who's written on my own dots, you're not a day trader on geopolitical headlines.
And those dots were stale in March when the war had just broken out because we didn't know,
is the war going to be over in a week? Is it going to be over in two weeks? Is oil going to
be back to, you know, $60 a barrel like that. We didn't know it was going to take, you know,
several months to wrap this thing up. And so you don't want to respond to a geopolitical headline
until you have an idea about what the length of time is. It's not like, you know, jobs.
You can't put a dot with an asterisk next to it?
You can't put a dot with, no, you can't. And so the dots in March were stale. And I think the dots
in June were stale for the exact same reason, but in the other direction.
And the market is over-indexing on those dots, which, I mean, that's not new.
We'll get to that, but I want to first bring this back to Bitcoin before we explain why that's an issue.
So why does this impact Bitcoin?
And why does when the dollar go up, does Bitcoin always seem to suffer?
Well the answer is it depends a bit But here Jeff Ross explaining how it does impact Bitcoin on a recent BTC Sessions podcast I think the tell for everything has been the price action of the dollar since Wors started speaking it right
I think when he started, it was below 100, sitting at like 99.60 something.
Now it's up to the Dixie is up to 101.63 as we record.
That's a big move for the dollar.
Like currencies rarely move like that, especially the dollar.
So the markets are taking seriously what's going on.
This is a typical risk-off day where all risk assets, they reach a correlation of one, as we like to say.
This only happens in these kind of deflationary busts.
Now, this is just a one-day sample.
I'm not saying we're starting a massive deflationary bust, but this is what happens.
People crowd into the dollar, and they sell everything.
They sell their stocks.
They sell their Bitcoin.
They sell their gold.
They sell their silver. They sell everything else. And so we're seeing a lot of that happen right now.
So that's very interesting. So I agree with Joe. I'm very much looking forward to seeing how the world changes here.
And it's always interesting. Every day there's some new interesting news piece.
I also agree that, you know, we've gone from the saying that was popular after the GFC was don't fight the Fed.
I think that's no longer the case. It's now don't fight the fiscal stimulus or don't fight the federal government.
And that's just how it is. People are like, well, why isn't Bitcoin going up? Why are AI stocks going up and Bitcoin's going down, blah, blah, blah? It's because there's a limited amount of dollars, right? And those dollars are being shunted in very specific places. They're being shunted into AI and into energy and into rare earth type things, which means that there's a posity of capital for these other things like Bitcoin. And so Bitcoin's just kind of left on the sidelines right now.
Now, Jeff said something there that I think we need to zoom in on.
So I believe that everyone is running back an old playbook.
They're being misled isn't really the right word.
They just they haven't adapted to the new reality.
They see that Kevin Warsh is kind of playing hard to get.
They see the dots on the plot suggest there might be more rate hikes, not cuts, but hikes this year.
so investors are doing what they have done for 56 years there's that market phrase he just said
don't fight the fed that's been rolling for 56 years now it was coined in 1970 it was shorthand
uh for just wisdom that was hard learned in the market you end up losing if you fight the fed and
that has been true until recently thanks to a process that started in 2008 during the great
financial crisis started, and we've all seen it, and it accelerated significantly during
the COVID-19 pandemic.
And it changed the dynamics of who's in charge of the market.
I think Lynn's kind of famous.
She's always said there's no stopping this train.
Here's Lynn Alden.
I think the market still doesn't fully appreciate because the market is so trained to think
that the solution to inflation is always higher rates.
That's kind of the main lesson from the 70s,
or at least that's the biggest takeaway
from the 70s, early 80s.
But that was in an era
where most of that money creation was from bank lending.
And interest rates are a very powerful tool
for curtailing and sometimes accelerating bank lending.
But when you're in fiscal dominance,
when fiscal deficits in a given year
are bigger than net new bank loan creation,
interest rates don't do quite as much for that.
Because every time they raise interest rates,
while they could put some downward pressure on bank lending,
they actually blow out the fiscal deficit even more.
And so they're in a very,
it's a challenging position to be in if you're the Fed.
Because as the chairman pointed out,
their current level is already restrictive on housing.
And yet we still have above target inflation.
and it's because it's not really bank lending.
Yeah, so I'm not so convinced
inflation is solved in the long term.
First, it's not obvious to me
that we're done fighting Iran.
So energy prices could shoot back up again.
Second, we're so overcooked on debt.
Over the next 12 months,
about 8 trillion in treasuries has to roll over.
The average coupon on that debt is around 3.3%.
I looked this up this morning.
The one-year treasury is sitting at 4%-ish.
So it sounds like small numbers, right?
Yeah, it's small numbers.
But you have to apply it to $8 trillion.
$8 trillion has to roll over.
So rolling that stack at today's one-year rate adds roughly, you ready for this?
$49 billion additional dollars in annual interest payments.
If they don't even, not a hike, if they just keep the rates.
we're going to pay an additional 50 bill on that eight trill that we have to roll over in a year.
That's that's massive. And that's before the interest burden from all the ongoing
two trillion annual deficit that we just seem to be stacking up routinely. That's just adding up
every single year. So that's why I think this multiple rate hikes theory kind of breaks down
because they just really can't. But, you know, they're stuck in this 56 year pattern. Like in
the 80s, Volcker was famous for crushing inflation by going with double digit rates.
But the debt to GDP ratio had been inflated down from roughly 100 percent to 30 percent.
So they were dealing with a much different debt scenario back then.
They could inflate away the debt. There's so much debt to inflate away now and just can't
get to it fast enough. It's going to take them forever. And right now, the narrative around
artificial intelligence is that it's going to be a productivity boom and that it's going to be
deflationary as a result of that. However, they're also trying to come in with a new narrative that
it's not going to take jobs. So it's hard to really measure where the productivity is exactly
going to come from other than just perhaps increased efficiency of individuals in the
corporate workplace. But right now it's a deflationary narrative around AI. But I could
easily see that switching to an inflationary narrative around AI. I mean, we've been seeing
the impact on memory prices and memories in everything that's built these days, especially
a lot of the things that are coming onto market. So there's that. There's also it is raising base
power costs for a lot of people. Here's Cleveland Fed's president talking about this very issue.
When I'm out in the district talking to businesses, what I hear are inflation pressures,
yes, coming from energy and coming from some of the supply chain disruptions with the closed
straight-up-form moves, but I also hear about pressures coming more broadly from the AI data
center build-up. I'm hearing about pressures from insurance. I'm hearing about electricity pressures.
And so to me, what I see is a more broad-based picture of inflation pressure.
That, to me, sounds like maybe something's brewing in the background that could cause
inflationary pressures. So I believe a few things to be true. The market is buying the same old
Fed stick that we've always seen my entire lifetime from them. I don't think inflation
is licked because I think it's baked into the system with the level of debt that we have.
I think you can have temporary ebbs and flows, but I think it's systematically just baked
into the pie, as they say, or the cake, i.e. the debasement trade continues because the
math says it will.
Now, perhaps it's running at a discount right now and it doesn't look like a great trade
at the moment, but the math says it is a good trade.
Larry Lippard, he's seen some things.
You know, he wrote that recent book about the big print, and he kind of brings all of
this together for us their whole job is to inflate the economy but make everybody think they're not
inflating the economy i mean it's like i say to be a good chairman you got to be a professional liar
and so um so they want everybody's inflation expectations to be anchored but in turn they
want to inflate because they know that inflation is what leads to growth and it's also what allows
them to service the debt and so so what happened is he came in and he decided in the first meeting
do a couple of interesting things one he changed the rules of the game he decided okay we're going
to skip all this forward guidance i'm not going to tell you what i'm going to do um the the press
release was amazing or press conference was amazing in terms of lack of content i mean he said i have no idea what i going to do and i not going to tell even if i did i not going to tell you i you I mean he refused to offer a dot plot for future Fed rates himself He let everyone else do it but he wouldn do it
Then he said that he was going to form a five task force,
and the two that I thought were most important were the one that was going to address the Fed communication policy going forward.
But really the most important was he's going to form a task force on how they measure inflation.
I thought, oh, that's interesting.
so what he's going to now be able to do is say look i got all these people together and we've
decided the inflation measures are overstated inflation is actually much lower than we think
and therefore it's not just me i've got a task force that backs me up and we can cut inflation
you know we can cut rates and so so i think that's where they're headed but but you know i'm getting
ahead of myself here but but that said some things on the tape this morning that would support that
he's at several instances said you know he thinks that we could have a lower interest rates and a
strong dollar well why would even say something about lower interest rates if that's not where
they're going uh he just said that this morning so um so i think what's going on is is they're
kind of doing a rope-a-dope they're trying to you know beat the sound money trade up as much as
possible which is why you know since since the press conference last week you know precious
metals have gotten hit hard and bitcoin has gotten hit hard it's now below 60 000 as we speak it's
I think in the 58, 59 area.
And so my view is they could both go a bit lower
until the market becomes aware of the fact that he's bluffing.
And that he really, there's,
I think the odds of the Fed raising the rates this year is zero.
And the market thinks the odds of them raising rates this year is 100%.
So one of us is right and one of us is wrong.
Now, if they do raise rates,
then it is possible that what I'm talking about,
sound money and debasement insurance, won't be as valuable.
but my view is i don't think they can raise rates i just don't think they can i think that
with the interest rates where they are today we've got 1.3 trillion in government interest expense
they've been protecting the long end of the bond market by selling bills in order to buy bonds so
to hold the 10 year below five it's squirted up to four seven it's now back into the four four
four five range um and so they're they're basically trying to rope a dope us and get us to believe
that those of us who are in this debasement trade are wrong.
And I think we're not wrong.
We're wrong short term, obviously, because our stuff's not working.
But in the longer scheme, we're not wrong at all because this goes back to what I talked
about in my book, and I've talked about many other times, what I call Stein's Law, that
something can't go on forever, it will have to end.
And the thing which cannot go on forever is that debt cannot grow faster than GDP.
And Basant has thought, well, we're going to have real great growth.
and it's going to be non-inflationary, but that's going to be extremely hard to do.
Productivity will help. Don't get me wrong. AI is a good thing, and it will add productivity to
the economy. But we're so far gone on this whole debt curve that I don't see how we can possibly
have a productivity boom that gets us out of this trap that we're in. I think that we're in the trap,
and ultimately, they're going to have to grow the money supply to support the debt.
All right. Well, besides the greatly exaggerated death of the debasement trade, the other thing that's putting a lot of pressure on Bitcoin is the situation with Michael Saylor and strategy.
And boy, are the knives out. This has been going on for a few weeks, and I haven't really felt the need to cover it in the show until it's kind of become newsworthy.
It's become newsworthy now because not only are the plebs that bought the stock instead of buying the spot, they're absolutely pissed off.
I mean, you should see sailors replies on social media.
But some of sailors biggest haters in the industry are also coming out kind of pouncing right now.
And Peter Schiff is a great example of one of these.
He says it's a matter of time before strategy blows up.
It's officially now in the death spiral, and it's only going to get worse because Bitcoin
is going to blow up.
This was the week where the death spiral kicked into a much higher gear.
The more Bitcoin goes down, the more stretch goes down, the more strategy goes down, the
more losses investors have, which means the more investors who file lawsuits and the lawsuits
are for more and more money.
you're going to have tens of billions of dollars that strategy is going to owe investors in these
class action lawsuits. I mean, you get crickets now at CNBC. I think they got some liability.
I think they're going to get sued. I think the financial journalists that enabled this,
that should have known better, they legitimized this scam. They're probably going to get sued too.
I'm not sure why Schiff doesn't have some responsibility for pumping gold right into
a slide and then continuing to pump into that slide. But whatever. I guess it's a bit different.
But, you know, I do think there's something here that strategy has to respond to. So we're seeing
them do that this week. And here's the news. The whole will they won't they collapse has really
been the main topic on Bitcoin social media and kind of in the Bloomberg and CNBC circles,
despite what Schiff says. And I think quietly. Some large buyers are actually waiting to see
what happens here. You know, they don't really know the mechanics, but they've heard the rumors
that perhaps strategy is about to blow up or they've heard Schiff say that it's a death spiral
and they have the patience. So while stretch has been under par for weeks and the Bitcoin
holdings for strategy are underwater by tens of billions of dollars, you know, a standard bear
market, it seems that strategy has decided to make it official that they will have a program to sell
1.2 billion or depending on how you read it, $2 billion worth of Bitcoin.
So Monique, there's really a lot to digest here, but maybe we can start with strategy.
What is the biggest shift in their, well, strategy?
Yes, so strategy, they are doing quite a pivot.
The company had always been focused since it changed to becoming a Bitcoin treasury company in 2020 to buying Bitcoin and holding it.
That was their main goal.
But now we're seeing that they're saying that they're going to look more into selling Bitcoin.
We saw earlier this month they made their first Bitcoin sales in years and now they're expected to do more.
They're saying they could sell up to over a billion dollars of Bitcoin to fund their reserves.
They're also going to be looking at buying back some of their preferred shares as well as some of their common shares.
And this is largely due to the fact of those pressures that we have seen on their share price recently, as well as the pressures in the broader crypto space that have been weighing on Bitcoin.
Strategy is a leveraged play on the cryptocurrency.
So when Bitcoin performs well, strategy outperforms.
When Bitcoin declines, strategy underperforms.
You don't say.
You know, this is interesting, and it would be downward pressure on price, blah, blah, blah, short term.
I think it's notable, just mentioning maybe here, that nobody's really observed that there's an upside to sailor selling.
I mean, just 10 minutes ago, everybody was freaking out about he had too much supply.
OK, well, here we go. We're seeing a free market dynamic play out. A whale is going to sell some coins. Those coins are going to get distributed to the rest of the market. Is that is that not a good thing for Bitcoin long term? Doesn't that address some of the concerns? If he has to peel off one percent eventually, I mean, even he's not going to, but I think that actually be a good thing.
um in the one area where there's some question especially you know by people that don't really
follow too closely is there's a belief that if sailors backing off on bitcoin purchases and even
going into some sales well that's going to hurt because during the bear market micro strategy has
been a large buyer somebody been stepping in and buying a lot of bitcoin when there's not been a
lot of other buyers. The plebs are sitting it out, you know, and Saylor's been buying more than
it's been getting mined so far. I mean, I suspect strategy is going to be just fine.
And I don't think them not buying for a bit is going to to really tank the price necessarily,
because I don't suspect we're going to see a massive collapse. If if what Saylor says is true.
Take a listen to Saylor This is from a couple of days ago He says they have like 30 years to figure this out Like if Bitcoin stalls for like a serious period of time and you are required to pay out the dividends on a monthly basis or now by monthly basis
by weekly basis actually what is the risk for for you with strc and like at some point the
bitcoin is not providing the yield that you're looking for if it stays sideways for a long
period of time and what is the purpose for like an average microsoft let me break that down yeah
go ahead if bitcoin stalls for the next 40 years like for for the rest of your life then somewhere
30 35 years from now yeah we'll run out of money so we have about 30 30 to 40 years of dividend
coverage. So if Bitcoin stalls, which means goes up 0% a year for 40 years, then sometime in 35
years or something, by the way, if we do nothing, if we do nothing for 35 years and a Bitcoin stalls,
then in 35 years, we wouldn't be able to pay the dividend. We wouldn't do nothing, right? We would
refinance or adjust. And so practically speaking, probably we have 40 to 50 years of Bitcoin stalls.
We have on our web, by the way, we publish that number, the years of dividends, right?
And the cash and the Bitcoin coverage.
We also calculate Bitcoin break-even AR.
If Bitcoin appreciates about 3% a year, and this number is updated every 15 seconds on
the website, if it appreciates 3% a year, we can pay the dividends forever without selling
a single share of common stock.
So the machine finances itself forever, indefinitely at 3%.
It finances itself for the rest of your life, or about 35 or 40 years, at 0%.
If Bitcoin appreciates at our stochastic cost of capital, like our probabilistic cost of capital over the next 20 or 30 years, call that somewhere between 8% and 10%, then the equity outperforms Bitcoin.
So the equity is actually a screaming home run.
If Bitcoin is 10, our equity will probably be 15 or something.
And if Bitcoin goes to 15%, our equity would be 20, 25 because we're amplified.
He seems pretty confident to me.
I don't know if it's true or not.
So the question is, does the price maintain without sailor buying for a while?
My gut says it could.
The ETFs, however, the ETFs are another story that Bitcoiners just don't really talk about much.
So, James, Bitcoin ETFs are seeing record outflows.
Strategy is pulling back.
What do you make of that combo and how dangerous is that?
Yeah, I mean, these are the two things that were the buyers over the preceding months from April through October, at least the biggest known buyers.
But you've got to also realize when they were buying, if you look at the on-chain data, we saw a lot of what people refer to whales, the real big holders, private holders of Bitcoin.
you can see that a wallet's on chain and they were selling. So obviously, it's something to
pay attention to. This month is pretty bad. We're actually at $4.3 billion with the outflows that
we saw yesterday that weren't included in that report yet. So it's not looking good. But again,
you got to take a step back and look at what this is, right? At the peak through October,
these things have taken about $63 billion. They took in $30 billion from last April through
October. So they took in a ton of money. Yes, they're seeing outflows, but it's not like
everything is running for the exits. It doesn't look good right now, but time will tell.
Yeah. So I looked at the latest data here and latest data shows cumulative net inflows into U.S. spot Bitcoin ETFs still exceed 52 billion since the 2024 launch with a AUM around 82 billion.
So that's their total, even after this year's outflows and June rebalancing pressures, which was a thing that we just went through.
But, you know, it kind of makes sense to me because the ETFs are the one of the easiest cells in the Bitcoin space.
If you're already in a brokerage account or whatnot, it's pretty easy to sell an ETF and buy some SpaceX stock or something like that.
So I'm not surprised to see a fair amount of outflows there.
I think the ETFs will always be prone to that in bear markets because it's easy to swap in.
And then when Bitcoin starts ripping again, you're going to see people just swap into the ETF.
They're trading.
They're doing the degen thing.
So watching to see what happens to Sailor and to see if there's a related Bitcoin sale, you know, the smart money will use this time to wait.
to let these things play out.
They're in no rush.
And they can get the plumbing set up in the meantime
while these things sort of work themselves out
either through some sort of blow up
or through just time capitulation.
And I'm not just making this up.
This seems to be the implication
from Coinbase's John D'Agostino.
He's in charge of keeping the nation-sized customers happy.
And he says they're still seeing strong demand.
We've seen over 40 countries commit to buying Bitcoin in some fashion for their national balance sheets or other.
So I'm seeing every day a deluge of new institutional investors that are interested in the asset class.
So I appreciate for folks who don't have that perspective.
They're looking for some grand gesture or grand event.
But for those of us who have the luxury of being on the inside, all we're seeing is steady growth, even if the headlines don't match that.
all right so here's my question for the week um can you follow what sailor's saying
i i mean i'll be honest sometimes he tends to lose me but i would wager that he built whatever he has
with the idea that a bear market could be a thing or three right so what do you think do you think
sailor is going to blow up um it could the per could the person that has been helping bitcoin
grow to new heights become the disease?
It could be possible.
I mean, when I hear him talk,
I sometimes think it just sounds like
a bunch of gibberish.
And it's some of the same gibberish
that sounded like he was saying
during the dot-com boom.
So there is that nervousness to it.
At the same time,
when things were going good,
there seemed to be a clear market fit
for the product he was creating.
So let me know what you think.
Send a boost on the sailor stuff
and all of that.
And we'll talk about it next week.
Well, there's still a lot coming up on the show.
Lots of updates, final clips and all of that.
So I just want to mention you can support the show by doing what you do.
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If you want to spend some of your sats and go from Lightning to gift card in just moments,
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That's the only thing they do is Bitcoin, and you can log in with the Lightning Network.
If you want to passively stack sats while you're paying your bills
and doing your everyday purchases,
that's where the Fold Card comes in.
A lot of happy customers in the community,
including myself.
The Fold Card is pretty neat.
Link to that in the show notes.
Last but not least,
if you want to get access to some liquidity
without having to sell your Bitcoin,
you should check out Salt Lending.
Great, great rates.
They help you with liquidations,
prevent that, all that kind of stuff.
I think it's pretty good.
And they don't get enough attention these days.
They've been around for a while.
They've survived multiple bear markets.
So that's Salt Lending.
All of those links are in the show notes, and you can just support the show by doing what you do.
Boost and great.
Well, it is time for some boost.
You can support the show with the boost.
And producer Jeff comes in with a row of McDuck's 22,222 Satoshis.
This old duck still got it.
When the price was at its peak, we were all wishing for a sale.
I, for one, am taking advantage of the extended SAT sale.
There is a summer of SAT sale or a SAT sale summer for the past tense, I suppose.
Also, why are all the BIP 110 folk trying to rehash the block size war?
Network is strong. Keep stacking.
You know, we're going to get into BIP 110 more here in the booth, so maybe I should save it, PJ.
but I would like to know
why we're not just letting
the economics play out.
Why aren't we just trusting
the economic incentive system
that Satoshi created?
That would be a question I'd have.
Thank you, PJ.
OB's here with 21,000 sats.
The Simply Sessions guys are great.
It was the Doombard clip
I was referring to,
the green chicken.
That guy's very smart.
Good sub-stack subscription.
Oh, is it?
OB, I've been wondering about that.
Good to know.
Thank you very much.
Appreciate hearing from you.
Sats over bits.
I like it.
He's here with 8,000 satoshis.
Well, I couldn't agree more with your take on Bip 110.
The number one thing that would make me question my Bitcoin thesis is if a minority group could
force its will on the majority.
Core messed up big time.
But I'll take JPEGs on chain over setting the precedent that a small, angry minority can
push through a massive consensus change.
yeah that's where i'm at man that's where i'm at i'm like let's just i'll take the jpegs maybe we
can circle back on that issue you know but let's not just have a small group completely change
consensus nailed it thank you sir i appreciate the boost gene bean's here with erodics sending
that value to our artists as he loves the song thank you very much gene bean appreciate you
nice to hear from you too oppie 1984 is here with 4 000 satoshers i don't understand what the heck
is going on here.
I installed Notts on my Start9
when core issues started
as a bit of a protest.
I uninstalled Notts
due to the BIP-110 proposal
once I understood
the issues around it.
Not crazy about the Start9
dev stance on Notts,
but I'll wait and see.
By the way,
thanks for the web boost.
This is really handy.
Oh, I'm glad you like it, Oppie.
Nice to hear from you.
Thanks for boosting in.
Let's hear it, good buddy.
Well, Mike Newman's here
with 7,777 sats.
if bip 110 succeeds does it change my fundamental trust in bitcoin sadly yes if core uh if core
weathers a bit hopefully we'll have learns it'll learn something and others won't go down that path
again so what does that mean mike if it's going to change your thesis and trust in bitcoin what
does that mean? Do you stop stacking? Do you just kind of tune out from Bitcoin and see where it goes?
Or do we try to get active? Like, where does that, that's what I've been wondering, Mike.
I'd like to hear your thoughts on that. Philip is back with 9,000 Satoshers.
Hi, Chris. Thanks for the show and your reliability. A five-year bear market for me
would mean a change in my time preference. My basic strategy doesn't change, only how long it
takes to enact with gender uh and which generate which generation benefits more uh if it is a
fascinating question in general though i how long to hodl and when to spend just how long do you want
to defer your general your gratification at the end of the day seems to be a balance between your
own personal financial situation and survival i think and then it got cut off i agree that's what
makes it so personal like sometimes it's worth selling even in a in a bad market um but you know
for me, the number that's always been in my head is eight to 10 years. And I think that should work
out okay. But we'll see. Philip, it's always really good. Always really good to hear from you.
Thanks for boosting it. Shugsy's here with a Spaceballs boost. That's one, two, three,
four, five Satoshis. So the combination is one, two, three, four, five. All right. The name rhymes
with Bugsy. I love your insights. Your state of the network toward the end of each episode has
always been strong so far but from your perspective uh would a neutral just okay or even a poor
decline bad state of the network actually look like it's that's my little joke at the end because
it's always strong you know you got me you got me it's just a little joke between me and you what
would it take um a sustained probably fundamental collapse in hash rate and or a massive drop in
nodes, I think, would be a concern.
But even a temporary
drop in hash rate, to me, would just seem like a
redistribution of hash rate. It wouldn't actually be that
bad long-term.
But short-term. Yeah, I
suppose. Maybe. Thanks, Shugsy.
Appreciate the boost.
That's a good question.
Debitcoiners is here, .eu, with
7,500 sats.
The heck? With just the thumbs.
I like it. Thank you, sir. Appreciate
the value.
Yep. Yep.
Mm-hmm.
Our next boost comes from Paranoid Coder.
Those in a nickel will get you a cup of coffee.
2,000 sets.
I invest an equal amount into equities as I do into Bitcoin,
and I don't see that ever changing.
I could probably have a lot more money if I was all in on Bitcoin,
but it makes weathering the bear markets a breeze
and never had me second-guessing my life savings.
Yeah, I suppose Paranoid Coder,
especially if you can be in something that's going up,
like an AI stock or an energy stock,
at least you feel a little bit better that that's going up
while the Bitcoin's going down and vice versa.
However, the maxi in me thinks, plan for the long term and just put as much into Bitcoin as you can.
So, two different paths there, Paranoid.
But I like it.
And, you know, different strokes.
Thanks for the value.
Love down baby long.
I think I got that right.
Comes in with 2,000 sats.
You know what the most valuable asset you have or ever have?
Your time.
It's the hardest money that was ever made or will be.
You're guaranteed to have a finite amount.
Tomorrow is not guaranteed, and you have no way to know your balance.
Attention is how we spend it.
I find you, Chris and Twib, and the Bitcoin Dad, and so many other Jupiter shows over the
year have brought me so much value for my time.
I have drastically reduced consumption across the board.
Twib is one of my very few shows I listen to.
Wow, love, thank you very much, and I'm glad I could bring you some value.
We're all in on that.
Oh, I'm in.
Yeah, appreciate that.
Ed Broughton's back with AroaDux, 2,200 Satoshis.
Thanks for the BIP coverage.
I migrated my node back to core after learning about knots through the podcast.
And the web boost is cool.
Keep up the good work.
Thank you.
Appreciate it very much, Ed.
Ace Alkerman's here with AroaDux.
BTC bummer boost.
This is my third bear market and maybe the worst one yet.
Sentiment is extremely low with no clear reason for hope in sight.
We need some good news fast.
You never know, Ace.
That's one of the fun things about Bitcoin.
Suppose if the four-year cycle is true, we could be bottoming out soon.
if the four-year cycle is true.
So there's a little hope for you.
Hey, Kiwi Bitcoin guides here with 4,567 sats.
Yeah, I got answers and I want some questions.
How do you handle the updates on your nodes?
I often have updates to run on Ubuntu
and many of my other services on my Bitcoin and L&D nodes.
I know you're running agents for a lot of things.
You gave them access to your nodes for full updates.
Sounds risky, especially on an L&D node.
So I wanted to hear how you approach managing your updates.
Kiwi, this is going to be a disappointing answer.
uh the reality is is that uh i do let my agents do updates often um even on my lnd node and they
are particularly good at it but i am using nix os which is not like ubuntu in such that
if the agent makes a mistake with the update or a mistake with the configuration or there's a
dependency issue or something like that, Nix will not build. So the Nix OS system acts as like a
safety check against the agent's work. And Nix fails to build sort of like, you know, a compiler
fails to compile when there's a mistake in the code. And so then the agent gets a clear response,
well, clear to it, on what the issue is, and then can resolve the config issue, resolve the
dependency issue, resolve whatever it might be, and attempt another build. And then when that build
is successful, I do what's called a boot switch. So then I create a new boot image and I continue
to run the old image until I'm ready. And, you know, maybe it's good timing. And then I reboot
into that new image. And if there's any problems that have been created, I just reboot back into
the old image. I would never do that on an Ubuntu or a straight up Fedora system or Red Hat system
because I have seen agents wreck those systems because they don't have that safety level,
this build process and so unfortunately
economy I mean you could deploy with Nix on a bunch of you don't have to switch to Nix OS and
that might be worth looking at actually because unfortunately without that it's a bit riskier
and so I don have great advice for you and I do think that people that spent the time learning and investing in Nix OS are now stacking that with AI because the two because NixOS provides the deterministic system level software management level So you have an
undeterministic LLM executing the work and a deterministic system is verifying the work.
It's just a great combination. And so that's why I like it. And then I also have a series of
wrappers and whatnot to make sure it can only do safe stuff, but you could check out the Clanker
therapy stream for more on that. Thank you, Kiwi. Appreciate it. Orange Mart's here with 5,000 sats.
The traders love the vol. No message, just value. Appreciate that. And J-Cube,
I believe they are our baller booster with $50 in fiat fun coupons.
Right now, the only thing that would make me lose faith in Bitcoin would be BIP 110.
Feels like a violation. Definitely triggers strong emotions when I think about it. I know,
right shake cube it's interesting it does feel and it feels also because they're doing them and
they they're doing the feel good story emotional play and they're kind of making it political and
they're kind of making it about statements and virtue signaling um and it's the irony is there
is apparently can't confirm or deny but apparently a couple of different groups that are preparing to
just spam the hell out of the BIP-110 network once it goes live in August, because there's still
lots of ways to spam the network, even after BIP-110. And they're assembling their systems
right now, is what I have been informed of. I don't know if it's true or not, but, you know,
it gets just the whole thing from top to bottom when you think it's not even going to stop the
spam and how it consolidates power with such a small group of people. It's absolutely crazy.
Like I had no problem with knots as just an alternative to core. But if knots was the only
implementation, that's a really, really scary world for Bitcoin. And I just do not know how
the BIP1 tenors are not wrapping their head around the centralization that creates. Above everything
else, the consensus changes and a minority group making changes, all of that. If knots became the
primary node implementation, Bitcoin is effectively centralized at the node layer. And I just don't
know how the bippers live with that. It seems absolutely so risky to me. Thank you, JQ. Appreciate
the boost. You know how I like to get on that topic, apparently, I guess. Silk Anders here with
$5 in Fiat Fund coupons. Bip 110 is a waste of energy. It makes no sense at all. The eCash fork,
on the other hand, is going to be pretty interesting to follow. Finally getting to test some sidechains
on Bitcoin, and I think that's exciting. All right. OK. Well, keep us posted, sir. You can be our,
if you don't mind, our correspondent.
Gene Bean's here with $2 in fiat
bond coupons.
Great show. To answer your question, I think
BIP110 getting rammed
through might make me reconsider
the hardness of Bitcoin.
It's a relief that things are looking like that's not going to be
the case. Yeah, it is a relief.
Yeah, Gene Bean, there's going to be
some soul searching, I think, if it
does manage to work out.
Mechanic and Luke are still very, very,
very confident on social media
that it will work out.
ah we got a member boost from your inner child oh my god this drawer is filled with fruit lobes
as long as people continue to accept sats for interactions be it on podcast music or frisco
melts it's take and shake bitcoin won't die even at three cents a bitcoin is more valuable than
fiat or gold a sat equivalent of a tom of an atom of gold i like that thinking and i felt that way
for a long time it either goes to zero or it's it's success it's a peer-to-peer open source
technology. Right. So I love it. I love the sentiment. I have a similar sentiment that we're
going to get to later in the show, but that's it for this week for everybody that boosted in above
the 2000 set cutoff for the free member boost. We also had 26 of you stream sats. Thank you very,
very much, everybody. And collectively, you stacked 33,227 sats.
that's not too bad at all so bringing it all together including our fiat fun coupons converted
to sats at the current market rate the total for this week's episode of this week in bitcoin our
total support is 282,090 satoshis not too bad at all of course a current rate that's not a great
hourly for about 18 or so hours of work but it may be in the future and we're stacking for the future
So thank you, everybody who supported us.
You can boost for free as a member or go to boost.jupiterbroadcasting.com and boost with fiat or sats.
Lots of ways to do it.
And of course, those podcasting to-do apps like Fountain, still a great way to support via membership or a boost.
And with that, it's time for something special.
All right. I got a story I want to share with you. I'm going to leave it towards the end of the show.
I think it's a nice thing to wrap up on because we have a little bit of news we need to update on first.
So let's eat our veggies and then we'll get to the steak.
And I want to start, yes, with a quick update on the Clarity Act because things are not looking good.
Polymarket odds of the act being signed into law have dropped to 39 percent this week after news of Trump's profit in crypto went public.
So here's the story. The Office of the Government Ethics released President Trump's annual financial disclosure report yesterday.
It revealed that the president pulled in at least two billion dollars in 2025.
His crypto related income in 2025 included about five hundred fifteen million dollars from the sale of tokens from the World Liberty,
from World Liberty Financial and another sixty five million from sales of equity in World Liberty's holding company.
He also received $635 million in royalties from Celebration Coins.
It wasn't immediately clear what those coins are, though Bloomberg is reporting that the royalties are related to Mr. Trump's meme coin business.
Now, he earned more than $86 million in legal settlements as well.
Those included the $24.5 million from Meta, $16 million apiece from Paramount and Disney.
and President Trump's biggest stock holdings
include Amazon, Meta, NVIDIA, and Tesla.
Man, whoever's doing the trading for the president,
they're killing it.
There's something like extra salty in the woundy
about my bag being 50-something percent down
and Trump just cashing out like crazy.
And make no mistake about this.
This is being framed as a crypto story.
Around the world,
Just do a search for Trump crypto. They're not talking about politicians doing certain kinds of trades. It's a Trump crypto story. The media is laser focused on the crypto aspect of the story. And that is really bad timing for the Clarity Act.
You learned some new information about President Trump's finances yesterday in his 2025 financial disclosure.
And it was a good year for the president's cryptocurrency ventures.
Take a look at this. He made more than $1.4 billion from crypto last year.
It includes $635 million in royalties from a meme coin launched days before he took office and more than $500 million in token sales from his family's company, World Liberty Financial.
Now, note he made more than $2 billion, but they laser focus on the crypto aspect. And I can kind of understand it probably sells some headlines. The issue is, is that the timing of that. I mean, the timing of that is is absolutely crazy.
It could not have been worse because the sticky issue with the Clarity Act that they still have yet to resolve hasn't got as much attention.
But it's the ethics issues, i.e., the Democrats have a problem with the Trump family making money on crypto.
I grabbed this clip I'm about to play for you before Trump's income came out and things were already looking dicey.
Yeah, without a doubt, it was great to speak with Mike Schwab's managing director of legislative and regulatory affairs.
He told me that the desire from Congress is still there.
There really is a push, but there are issues that remain.
Particularly, there are some ethics concerns related to the Trump family and their crypto holdings.
And the July 4th to the August recess, that time period is essentially now or never.
If we don get something done then I don think we going to see any progress until I mean 2028 or 2029 And right now the White House may have other legislative priorities
So never, never is what the answer is there.
Anyways, I can't believe it, but Mike Novogratz seems to be making sense this week.
So moving right along.
Two weeks in a row.
Have you wondered how it's possible?
I mean, you know, he once had a Luna tattoo.
OK, I mean, he bought Bitcoin early, so I got to give credit there.
He was early on Bitcoin, but he got a Luna tattoo.
But yet he seems to have had clarity of a different kind.
And I love this because you probably noticed a lot of people, most of us are struggling
in the middle class.
It's been really tough over the last five years.
Things only gotten more expensive.
And at the same time, premium brands and experiences like cruises and Disney and whatnot, they
seem to be doing better than ever after having an initial hit. The premium experiences of cars and
all of this are doing better. There's a jewelry store that opened by the studio, and I thought
there's no way it's going to get any business. They have boomers there every single day buying
jewelry, every single day. Well, why is it? How is it that so many people can be struggling,
that credit card delinquencies can be at nearly an all-time historical high because people can't
pay their credit card bills and that car payment delinquencies are at a historical all-time high.
People can't pay their car payment bills, and yet premium brands continue to exist.
Well, old Mike here, he breaks down the math on that.
So the top third is 115 or, yeah, 116 million Americans. So let's even go to the top 20%,
right? 75 million Americans. That's a lot of wealthy people. It's bigger than any other
country's wealth, just our 75. And so if it's a Taylor Swift concert, there are not enough tickets
to go around, even in that 75 million seats at Disney, seats at good restaurants in New York.
And so while it always feels okay at that real top, very few of us talk to people,
if you're a Wall Streeter, that are in that bottom third regularly. And so like Disneyland,
what are you talking about Disneyland? And that's, I think, why America keeps lurching for some
solution, you know, populist left, populist right, is that American dream of, of course,
I get to take my kids. Every parent wants to take their kids to Disneyland for a weekend.
Every parent in America, I mean, maybe after they do it, they won't say that they wanted to, but,
and so we've got to get back to a place where part of the American package is, you know,
you get a good two week, you know, you had to go two different one week vacations. You got to go to
take your kids to dinner every once in a while. You get a kid, just send your kids to a decent
school like that. What's available to the bulk, that other 65%. And I think partly because we have
so many people doing okay. And so many people doing super well, it can easily always feel okay.
Right?
Disneyland felt great.
Wrong baron.
I guess my lesson I learned is it's the wrong baron.
I think this is probably true not just in the States.
I think it's true all over the world right now, especially in the West.
And I just thought, you know, because there's enough of them, even just here in the States.
There's about 75 million of them that are doing great.
And that's all it really takes.
I mean, there's only so many seats at the Taylor Swift concert.
All right.
So there's a trend that I've been keeping an eye on this last year.
We've been talking about it here.
It's these public Bitcoin mining companies that have pivoted to AI compute hosting.
So we've seen a decline in the hash rate as a result of this.
Like your core scientific, Iron and others, that have been pivoting away from pivoting, as they say.
They love to pivot from Bitcoin mining.
So Alex Thorne, he's a managing director and head of firmware research at Galaxy Digital, also a company that's pivoted to AI.
And he talks about the recent pivot and the economics behind it.
I guess, you know, if our miners are all going to become AI data centers, then, you know, like ours has. We are a big data center firm now and no longer a Bitcoin miner to my chagrin, you know, because it's dear to my heart. Although there's a lot of fascinating research. And of course, those in the business know this, but the per dollar like revenue from compute is substantially higher than the per dollar revenue from Bitcoin mining, even down at these, you know, even down at this hash rate.
And Bitcoin miners having a there's a big story this year, by the way, that no one's really covering a lot.
But like, go look at Bitcoin hash rate.
It's down substantially from the top.
The downward difficulty adjustment that we recently had, I think, last week was, I think, the 10th biggest single downward difficulty adjustment in Bitcoin history.
Miners down at these prices getting squeezed for sure.
That was on the Wolf of Wall Street's channel.
So the economics may be about to shift back on that there, Alex.
things have changed as of today.
Meta announced that they are getting in on the AI compute game.
Meantime, Meta shares are jumping today on news.
It'll build out a new cloud business.
Let's get back to Julia Boorstin, who has more.
Hey, Julia.
That's right.
Sources close the situation confirmed to CNBC that Meta is working on building a cloud
infrastructure business to sell AI compute.
Now, this shouldn't be a surprise to anyone because Mark Zuckerberg first talked about
this last October and then again at the company's annual shareholder meeting in May. Then he said,
quote, it's definitely on the table almost every week. There are different companies that come to
us from outside asking us to both stand up an API service or asking if we have compute that they
could buy at us at some premium to what we've bought it at. Now, if we get to a point where we
feel that we have overbuilt, then that is an option that we have. And that is partially what
gives us confidence in investing and building this out. I'm not sure how much I buy that they're
having people knock on their door all the time and that they have overcapacity since they were
just buying capacity from other companies. But it's an interesting story because
Iron is down about 5% as of right now in the news. They took it harder earlier. Core Scientific is
down 7.35% as of now. CleanSpark is down 4%, and Galaxy Digital was down 5.6% on the news as
recovering some. Meta, however, up 10% on the news. So the public Bitcoin mining companies that have
pivoted to AI compute are all down. Some of them were down massively, like 10% at some point,
while Meta rocketing up. And Meta is one of the first quote-unquote AI players that is signaling
to the market that they're going for value.
I talked about what that could mean last week,
so make sure you check that out.
So now you have XAI and Meta
that are in this game of selling extra compute.
And the narrative that they're pushing
is that they're building AWS 2.0.
So something tells me that the industry
will happily turn their nose up at these Bitcoin miners
once their buddies over at Meta and XAI
and others have built their AWS 2.0.
I don't know.
Maybe Galaxy Digital and others can pick up their ASICs for cheap now.
So maybe there's a positive side.
Speaking of mining, a few weeks ago, I told you about a short documentary that I watched.
I liked a lot.
It was about a test farm that was using Bitcoin and mining Bitcoin to generate heat and whatnot for their greenhouses and other uses on the farm.
And this is the kind of Bitcoin mining that gets me personally excited.
Not the irons and the Galaxy Digitals, but you and me using Bitcoin to heat our homes, to heat a garden, these types of things.
I think that's just brilliant.
If you're already going to be using the power, why not mine a little Bitcoin?
Now, at first, I didn't bother clipping this documentary because I figured it was pretty good and it would make the rounds without my help.
But I really haven't seen it get as much attention as I thought it should over the last couple of weeks.
So I wanted to highlight a few moments that I like that I think you're going to like, too.
And I'll link to the entire thing. It's not that long in the show notes.
So to set it up, this is a family farm that's 400 meters or just over 1300 feet up on a mountain.
So they're trying to farm produce on a mountain.
So obviously they need greenhouses and they need to keep things warm and comfortable for the plants Welcome to the world Do you know that daddy mining Bitcoin He will This is the smallest greenhouse that Fred and Daniela manage The larger Bitcoin miner greenhouse
was recently damaged by a storm. We'll come to that later. They grow and sell succulents,
herbs, aloe vera, and what they refer to as the organic treasures of Madeira. For that,
they've got to keep the greenhouse warm. We've had to take off our coats because it's so warm
here yeah do you know what the temperature is right now uh 25 25 yeah and that's because of
the sun or the sun helps but it's not enough to keep the heat okay at this time of the year so we
also have the miner down here oh i hear that sound i know that's yeah it's down there oh no way so
this entire greenhouse this gorgeous greenhouse with all of this different vegetation it's heated
by a bitcoin miner it's just behind me there get a couple of bitcoin miners in the greenhouse
and away you go so i'm currently holding the microphone to my mouth just here and what i'm
going to do is i'm going to then hold it over the miners so you get a sense of how it sounds
how do you control it how do you control the power i have the schedule on my phone so i can
basically shut it down just like that just like that and now i can turn it off again and now you
can hear it going. It's still warm air. So how many miners are in this greenhouse? In this one,
we have one. On the bottom one, we had two. And we're trying to move to the second stage of the
project, which is increasing our solar panel because we don't have enough solar production
to cover the three or four miners. So what's really surprising about this is that it's just
a pilot project. There's only two miners heating this gigantic greenhouse. But in the future,
Fred wants five warehouses, five greenhouses just like this, which means Bitcoin miners in all of them, which means more energy demand.
Yeah. And since he's powering the entire thing by solar, that means he's going to need more solar, which is how cool is this?
Fred's next move is a 45 meter solar carport that will take him from four kilowatts to 100 kilowatts of solar production.
That powers more miners, which heats more greenhouses, which grows more herbs.
and the real unlock is using that same minor heat to dehydrate those herbs.
So what's this space?
This is currently the warehouse where we're storing the stuff for the rebuild.
So Bitcoin mining for herbs?
This here is going to be the dehydrator.
Yeah, so like herbs are going to come in,
they're going to leave dehydrated and ready to be eaten or cooked with.
Herbs arrive, they are washed, then they go to the cold room
and then they go to the dehydrator where they are dehydrated and then packaged.
Okay, and the dehydration is done by Bitcoin miners.
Yeah, exactly.
Which is possible.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
We already did that with chilies, with herbs.
Nice.
How come I never thought of dehydrating with a Bitcoin miner?
What a great use case for that.
So I'm loving this.
I'll play you the last couple of clips to wrap it up
because I think one of the neat things that they're able to do as a farm,
because their energy is covered by solar,
is they're able to stack what they mine.
So basically, while they're growing succulents and vegetation, while they're farming those things, they're also farming Bitcoin.
And what do you do with the Bitcoin that you mine? How long have you been mining first, just on this project?
On this project since 2019, because we don't sell the Bitcoin.
Oh, you model all the Bitcoin that you mine?
Yeah, yeah, all of it.
You look quite happy.
Yeah, yeah, all of it, all of it. We haven't sold a penny, a satoshi of the miners.
Wow. So we pay the electricity from the revenue of the business and keep the Bitcoin instead of selling the Bitcoin for the electricity and keeping the euros.
So this nursery has a Bitcoin treasury.
Yeah, it's basically that.
Yeah, I think that's great.
The documentary also quickly touches on Fred's philosophy about holding Bitcoin through the ebbs and the downs and the ups and all of that.
And I think what we should call this is the farmer's approach to hodling.
We keep it, as you were saying, like a treasury.
And if you compare the savings you made in Bitcoin to the savings you made with Euros,
would it have been better to save in Euros or in Bitcoin?
Oh, in Bitcoin.
But what about the Bitcoin price volatility?
Well, Fred compares it to farming.
In nature and in agriculture, you're kind of used to it.
You have the seasons.
You have good years, you have bad years, and you just have to deal with it.
Nothing is assured, nothing is certain, it's not like a factor.
In farming, you might have a thousand units and the next day, due to a storm, due to something,
you don't have them anymore.
And Bitcoin is a bit like that.
You can have a lot of euros in terms of comparison and then the next day it can crash and you
don't have those euros.
And we got used to it with the fiat system of having like a steady, which is not steady,
it's just a steady decline.
It's not a natural, but farming is a natural cycle with the seasons, with everything.
Okay, Bitcoin mining and farming are quite similar in that regard.
Yeah.
You have these different cycles and you have the ups and the downs and it's outside of your control.
Yeah.
We all want to go to the moon, but if you want to ride the rocket, you got to be prepared to pull the G's.
All right, let's check in on the state of the network.
I'm wrapping up at block height 956,251.
Current price to U.S. dollar is 60,100 Bitcoin.
100, you know, 61,100 dollars to one Bitcoin.
That's what I'm trying to say.
That puts our sats per U.S. dollar at 1,664.
Price is actually kind of tipping up right now.
Just a little bit.
Our decline from our all-time high is sitting at 52.4%, 267 days ago.
The estimated difficulty adjustment is a minor downward adjustment of 1.1%,
and the reachable nodes on the network is a strong and healthy 26,685.
We're up 2.9% in the last 24 hours, and we are at 0.6% for the last seven days since the last episode.
0.6% up, though. I mean, at least it's up.
I'll take it, I guess.
You know, like I always say, and it's true, the state of the network is strong.
If you made it this far, why not check out the links this week in Bitcoin.show.
More information there.
My goal is to get a show for you that doesn't get too distracted by the emotions or the politics,
but focuses on the signal from those events, the second order effects, the stuff that you can plan on,
For yourself, your friends, your family, your future, whatever it might be.
So let me know how I did with a boost.
What you think about sailors, latest claims, about 30 years of runway.
Your BIP 110 thoughts, all of it.
Boost it in.
Support the show, boost.jupiterbroadcasting.com.
You know I want to hear it.
Now, I am going to wrap up with a value for value clip like I do.
So if you boost in while the music's playing, 95% of the sats will go to the artist.
Now, this track is described as a cacophony of contrasting genres, voices and instruments headed by a fiery songwriter, Mishkin Fitzgerald.
So here you go. Here is Legs Broken by Mishkin Fitzgerald.
Go, go, Mishkin. Mishkin, go.
This one goes out to the thief and all that bloody drew
Every night I make a score, I named it after you
I'm sharpening these knives with raspies, arrows of my hate
I'm carving up my convictions, the fate was never shaken
I lie awake upon these nails imagining a rose
Wrap it tight around the neck and twist them to be judged
My friends all know that I was taught to turn the other cheek
But even Christ led Judas to his faithful ring and king
How you gonna get there in the dark, my friend?
How you gonna walk there?
With your legs broken, how are you gonna walk this train a night and a day?
When everyone in town knows that you're poison.
Son of Cain, your veins are filled with anger and distrust.
A petty child, you held your rock and left me in the dust.
My able heart is crawling from the grave up through the soil.
This river floods to red as burn, I'll make these oceans boil.
I'll follow you through deserts dry and far as eyes can see.
With vengeance as my mistress, she gives nothing for you, please
You leave your trailer boys to pray for all your green mites
Well, I don't need a snake to pull you from your paradise
How you gonna get there in the dark, my friend?
How you gonna walk there with your neck broken?
How you gonna walk the streets at night again?
When everyone in town knows that you're poison
Now your silver's all been spent
Your fortress turns to dust
You're seeking out some shelter
But there no one you can trust The path behind is jaded From the bridges set aflame Or even your own shadow casts the colour of your shame As the sun is setting on your empire of defeat
The moon is rising up to make my ritual complete
As day is drawing to and close and I draw back my ball
I strike you back to where you came nine circles down below
Are you gonna get there in the dark my friend?
How you gonna walk there with your legs broken?
How you gonna walk the streets at night again?
When everyone in town knows that you're poisoned
How you gonna get there in the dark, my friend?
How you gonna walk there with your legs broken?
The devil wouldn't even bother to spill your blood
But everyone in town knows that I would
Hefty is the weight that you have cast upon this stone
I find it hard to carry it but I am not alone
I've always found forgiveness is the pathway back to sight
But seeing your depravity has left me dull and blind
One day I'll take a hammer to your coffin where I'll cry
I'll open up your secrets to the world from which you hide
And though I know that I should leave your life up to the fate
The only thing your heart needs is a steak.